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Science"Women rate the strongest men as the most attractive, study finds" (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by fromdario

Original Article from Washington Post

Highlights From The Article:

  • "Women, when asked in a study to judge photos of men's bodies, rated the strongest men as the most attractive. Height and leanness were appealing attributes, too, but strength played an outsize role in the ratings of a man's torso, per a report published Tuesday in the Proceedings of the Royal Society B."

  • "There was no nuance to these results, he said. Zero of the 160 women surveyed showed a statistical preference for weaker men."

  • "The researchers also discovered a linear relationship between a man's rated strength and his attractiveness. “What really explains the lion’s share in attractiveness is how strong a man looks,” Lukaszewski said."

  • "The study authors described a strong body as a signal, one our ancient ancestors would have understood: This is a healthy individual with a hearty immune system, the ripped body suggests, someone who can devote calories to building muscle rather than fighting off germs. Strength was also an “indicator of one’s ability to provide material and social benefits,” Lukaszewski said. In this interpretation, a strong man has value as a potential protector of women and children and is desired by other men as an ally."

Body:

I know, as if we needed another post promoting the reasons to lift. The results are astoundingly clear. Women prefer stronger men, duh. Something we all know.

What's funny is the article brings in another person not involved with the study to critique it. Obviously, there are other factors involved in attractiveness but its hard to ignore how obvious strength is in the equation.

It is still surprising the number of BP guys who refute this, talk about game, etc as a substitute for hitting the gym. Really if you at all care about attracting women, you can't ignore this.

Conclusion: CONTINUE LIFTING.

EDIT: from u/corsega - Here is the fulltext: http://sci-hub.tw/10.1098/rspb.2017.1819


[–][deleted] 150 points151 points  (18 children)

The most illuminating part of the study was the correlation between perceived and actual strength.

The study was not subtle. These were all college girls. The important thing about lifting is not just you're "more attractive" but that you're also more appealing to women who are down to fuck.

[–]2comment 1 points1 points [recovered]

One thing that could be better explained in this study is the claim:

"The researchers also discovered a linear relationship between a man's rated strength and his attractiveness. “What really explains the lion’s share in attractiveness is how strong a man looks,” Lukaszewski said."

Is if there is a top end limit?

Like if those roid supersized bodies are as much a turn off to them as supersized silicon tits and lips are to me.

[–][deleted] 54 points55 points  (2 children)

There is definitely a limit, which is what the bloopies use to hamster away not working out at all.

Spitballing here......what's a similarity between supersized silicon tits and supersized roid bodies? Neither are natural, nor particularly healthy looking.

[–]antariusz 11 points12 points  (1 child)

The problem is, you can’t just “accidentally” get too big.

I’m currently at 5’8” 200 lbs, and I’m in the middle of my 4th prohormone cycle over the past few years (long breaks in-between. If I was completely natural I’d be closer to 180. I’m still not anywhere near “freakazoid” levels. The amount of work and dedication AND appropriate chemical enhancement is challenging and takes a toll.

[–]LordThunderbolt 10 points11 points  (1 child)

They're not talking about super roid warriorrs, they're talking about the natural Zyzz wannabes who are small and shredded vs powerlifter/linebacker types

[–]pussyaficianado 2 points3 points  (0 children)

There probably is, but the people recruited were 30 kids from the college gym, and 120 or 160 kids from a psychology class. No one probably met roof super sized body level. The authors (of the article maybe or maybe not the study authors) speculated as much that there would be an upper limit.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Think of it like this. Women like tall guys so the shorter you are the less massive you can be before it looks weird. Especially if you have a short torso. Generally there's even such a thing as 'to tall' for women so there certainly is something as to massive. But this will vary from bitch to bitch. The most low IQ bimbo whores will obviously desire some level of roided up bro's and/or basketball height dudes. But those should not be the women for you to aim LTR with. If you want to bang them don't worry, they will full normal proportioned guys to.

[–]Endorsed Contributorsadomasochrist 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Myth of the good girl, Rollo, read it.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I already did, what's your point?

[–]Endorsed Contributorsadomasochrist 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Your post is what that essay was trying to address.

You could rephrase it if you find those women less attractive, but they still operate the same.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My comment is about how women have varying tastes of masculine bodies. So long as they are masculine. As it was a reply to some guys wondering if there was such a thing as to big.

Guys have this to btw. We like big tits, wide hips, thick legs and full butts. But nothing to big or to small. So if I'm not misunderstanding you, I can't see the connections with TRM's original post.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Is if there is a top end limit?

I would theorise it is when you no longer look healthy.

Attractiveness is designed around genes, so once you start to look unnnatural your attractiveness would plummet.

[–]SuperCrazy07 98 points99 points  (1 child)

Oh my, you forgot to include some of the hamstering in the article. One of my favorites:

She pointed out that the results might not be universal. The raters were college-age women evaluating the appearance of college-age men. They might not “have much of an experience with what attractiveness means,” Dunsworth said.

That's right. A woman doesn't know what's attractive until she hits the wall LOL.

[–]fromdario[S] 23 points24 points  (0 children)

haha yea. I chuckled at all that, kept it out to keep the focus on the main point but it is pretty funny and incredibly stupid.

[–]OpossumManEater 336 points337 points  (75 children)

This has reached the top of the science subreddit, go take a look if you want to laugh at all the beta male hamstering. Lazy fucks want any excuse not to lift and improve themselves.

It's also turned into a comment graveyard.

[–]ISaidThatOnPurpose 120 points121 points  (7 children)

it's not that they don't want to lift,

It's that they see their inability to reach a victory goal, so instead they are trying to change the goal posts.

It's a devious tactic, but...

....I've said it before, i'll say it again....

YOU CAN BELIEVE WHATEVER YOU WANT IN YOUR BRAIN, BUT YOU CANNOT CONVINCE YOUR SEXUAL DESIRE TO CHOOSE SOMETHING ELSE. THE WEINER AND VAJEEN ARE BULLET-PROOF LIE DETECTORS

[–][deleted] 52 points53 points  (3 children)

YOU CAN BELIEVE WHATEVER YOU WANT IN YOUR BRAIN, BUT YOU CANNOT CONVINCE YOUR SEXUAL DESIRE TO CHOOSE SOMETHING ELSE. THE WEINER AND VAJEEN ARE BULLET-PROOF LIE DETECTORS

Please put this on my tombstone.

[–]wanderer779 19 points20 points  (1 child)

I think it should be changed to weiner and vajeener.

[–]Jfc_Manners 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Good point. Gotta get it right before setting it in stone.

[–]Redasshole 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the day my girlfriend started to need lube for me to be able to penetrate her vagina, I knew she wasn't attracted to me anymore and was giving me pity sex

[–]Hillarysdilddo_2016 25 points26 points  (2 children)

What do you expect from bloopers? It's like staring into the abyss.

[–]ryantheman2 17 points18 points  (1 child)

When I saw this on my homepage, I thought it was on TRP at first.

[–]Westernhagen 52 points53 points  (39 children)

On twitter the betas are clucking that women don't like it if you get too big and muscly.

[–]Jerk_McCock 90 points91 points  (27 children)

I always love when dyels talk about getting “too big,” as if that’ll happen by accident if you’re not careful or something.

[–]Lyonhurt 37 points38 points  (19 children)

I know a guy (on gear) who milked disability income for 2 years because his calves got so big from roids his legs would sieze if he was standing for extended periods. He took his disability income and just kept lifting

[–]fromdario[S] 16 points17 points  (0 children)

[–]Darkistco 1 points1 points [recovered]

holy shit thats golden.

always wondered if i could live life like that. collecting welfare/working minimum job. so you have massive free time to go to gym twice a day and be on the juice, workout, eat, sleep. travel to somewhere you'll be seen as an alien.

Never heard of someone getting on disability for that, thats amazing.

[–]1Zanford 19 points20 points  (6 children)

Ah yes, the stereotypical Jersey Shore lifestyle

That's not uncommon in the bodybuilding world actually. And sometimes they can do stuff like personal training but always take it in cash so it doesn't interfere with their disability claims or gov't gibs. Pretty smart and decent life style all around. The ones with the eating and lifting discipline are no doubt hanging more and better than your average cubicle beta who is wealthier on paper.

Also let's be real, that's kinda what most men on welfare are doing - they aren't lifting and aren't in good shape, but, they are using a lot of that free time to hang around on street corners and catcall or otherwise try to pick up chicks. So basically when you work half your day just to cover your income taxes, you are spending that time cramped in an office so some other dude can mack on chicks on your dime and time. And when he nails one and she shits out welfare babies, you get to pay for those too

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (4 children)

Yeah, no. There's virtually nothing worse than poverty and welfare that could happen to a man. Face it.

[–]1Zanford 6 points7 points  (3 children)

Paraphrasing Dave Chapelle, "if a man could get BJs with no effort, he'd be happy living in a cardboard box." A poor man who can pull hotties and is in good health will be much happier than a rich man who is lonely.

[–]Jfc_Manners 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Silence is golden, though. In the past, I was poor but had women. Now, I'm wealthy-ish, and basically ignore women. I'm much happier now -- I wake up every day with a smile.

Eventually I'll want kids, but for now...God, I love being alone.

[–]1Zanford 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Work on your relationship game, and teach chicks to spend less time blabbing and more time on their own self improvement, chores, etc. when they are around you. And/or set up FWB to you can get sex (you still have a sex drive yes?) without someone around all the time

[–]pussyaficianado 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is why we need more republicans in office, end the hand outs.

[–]TaylorWolf 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I work basically one long hard day a week. (The second day is usually just 2-4 hours.)

The rest of my time I spend training MMA with big successful names like Alan Jouban and Eddie Bravo. (and recovering which SUCKS)

If you really want this it's not hard to achieve... you just won't be making money for anything more than basic needs (especially if you eat clean) someone asked me once when I arrived at the gym late after working 12-16 hour days "do you want money or do you want to be a fighter" that question burned into my brain. I figure I can always make money into old age but you have to train while you are young if you want to succeed in competition.

One of my favorite pastimes on days off is taking the morning class at 10P HQ with Eddie Bravo and going to the movies and seeing 2-3 movies in a row then return for the night class. 2-a-days baybe

[–]Lyonhurt 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Needs to stand for work. Can't stand for periods of time. Enter disability payments. Only 2 years allowed (he's almost done his 2, waiting to see what happens)

[–]coco5440 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Being a useless bum (even a jacked one) is never a good idea. It will eventually catch up with you. Look at the middle age guys around you -- you'll see that the ones who have good careers or own businesses age the best. Being successful is good for your body not just your bank account.

[–]ChadThundercockII 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Look up people getting muscle seizures, especially the calves, it's really painful.

[–]celincelin 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Pretty smart and decent life style all around.

Explain what's "smart and decent" about being a semi-disabled broke idiot with no goals outside of your body you've yourself broken.

[–]pussyaficianado 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Like look for them just out on the street?

[–]ChadThundercockII 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I edited that shit out. I meant look up some vids on Youtube or some shit.

[–]LordThunderbolt 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lmao what? Pics or it didn't happen

[–]LordThunderbolt 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Trained for 3 weeks before I woke up one morning and realized my arms grew to 19 inches cold at 10% bodyfat. What have I done???

[–]VanRedPill 2 points3 points  (0 children)

TIL that I was a dyel for the longest time

[–]Rooibosisboss 1 point2 points  (1 child)

my brother worked at a Y for a long time and I used to hear this myself but the amount of people, men and women, who would come in and ask for some help/advice/training/etc, and would say something along the lines of "well i don't want to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger or anything" when he'd start talking about incorporating any type of lifting.

...yea don't worry, you won't

[–]Jerk_McCock 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That’s the part I find so hilarious about it. You could literally plan your life around trying to look like a body builder and still not accomplish it. Not to mention the time frame it would involve.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Depending on your height, torso size, arm length and legs there certainly is though. Lifting is about more than size and athleticism. You need to learn what the balance is for your body. I see so many gym bros with massive arms but tiny cores because the former is the easiest muscle to train. Meanwhile women like a strong torso. They also like bigger men which means a longer skeleton. So the smaller you are the bigger those muscles will look on your arms etc. This can have counter negative effects.

If you are above average height but not freakishly tall you should have no problem getting a balanced physique that speaks to a woman.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Some is grounded in reality, women like athletic kickboxer/mma/football/rugy type bodies. Lots of bodybuilders whom are to short yet to massive look ridiculous. The only women who find that appealing are supermassive black holes like Snookie from Jersey Shore.

[–]thechaosz 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I just can't anymore. Betas are clucking

[–]1Your_Coke_Dealer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I read that as "cucking". Still kinda works.

[–]1ozaku7 3 points4 points  (3 children)

Most of them with the build of a fishstick. LOL. As if you turn into a fucking mutant ape within a day. Granted, there are men out there who are not muscly like nature intended but just inflated monkeys.

There is a difference between this: https://www.menshealth.com/sites/menshealth.com/files/styles/listicle_slide_custom_user_phone_1x/public/images/slideshow2/1-triceps-intro_0.jpg?itok=aFvgDNHd

And this: https://pimg.mycdn.me/getImage?disableStub=true&type=VIDEO_S_720&url=http%3A%2F%2Fvdp.mycdn.me%2FgetImage%3Fid%3D263279281421%26idx%3D30%26thumbType%3D47%26f%3D1%26i%3D1&signatureToken=ckloqwVCEw2DIA-XowELSg

[–]1Zanford 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Terrible comparison. The first pic has a great tan and professional lighting; great use of shadows (and for all we know some digital postprocessing) to accent the musculature.

Whereas the second is a classic terrible amateur shot, and the guy looks frikking red. If he got a good (spray?) tan (like many bodybuilders) and had a pro photographer shoot him he'd look much better.

It's true he has a very obvious gear body (it's the weird tightness of the skin, whereas the first guy has skin that 'fits him' and doesn't look painfully tight despite his super low body fat %)

[–]1ozaku7 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I couldnt find really good pics, but some men looks like they are just blown up. No toning, no lines, juts big balls under his shirt. Others are much slimmer, but still well built and muscular.

[–]1Zanford 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Of course. I'm not saying your thesis is wrong, just that comparing a pro photographer to a terrible selfie doesn't isolate the effects of the subject's physique.

[–]QQMau5trap 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Some women prefer skinny guys, especially on the pill. But in general symmetry is the most important one

[–]sd4c 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Which one of these 160 women, constitutes "some"…?

[–]QQMau5trap 1 point2 points  (1 child)

The pill does that to women. It has been researched than in general women on the pill like less traditionally manly men.

[–]sd4c 1 point2 points  (0 children)

So none of these 160 were on the pill? Sure.

[–]VanRedPill 17 points18 points  (2 children)

Thank god not everybody is willing to improve... Weeds out some of the competition.

[–]PM_me_submissives 10 points11 points  (2 children)

It's also turned into a comment graveyard. That's not uncommon on science subreddit.

They certainly like to do a bit of censoring in general. You can see most deleted comment if you change the r of reddit into a c.

[–]Chachenhouser 6 points7 points  (1 child)

It's an absolute bloodbath. Every comment is deleted. I'm guessing only the most sanitized speech is remaining.

[–]thebrandedman 2 points3 points  (0 children)

2+2=5, Winston. Good God, that's a trainwreck.

[–]beginner_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

While sure true and their rationalizations are cheap, it's also a scientific fact that the normal range of being able to build muscle is huge (can't find the study but it was posted here once). Most men could not get the bodies shown in these pics even with full dedication. They would have to roid up. Of course whining about it while getting fat doen't help like whining about being short or Indian doesn't help.

[–]HobbesTheBrave 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Where do find that post? What’s the words to search for?

I want to read, vomit out of disgust, laugh at them. We need to know what we ought to abhor.

[–]celtiberian666 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This has reached the top of the science subreddit

There is some good criticism there, like this one: "I suspect that they did not include any (or enough) athletes who were training solely for maximal strength (i.e. linemen, sumo wrestlers, strongmen, etc.) to draw this conclusion."

The best study should would include powerlifters, football lineman and strongman.

Then we can see the results of attractiveness plotted against body fat and strenght.

Of course that the average redpiller who lift will be more attractive than the average soyboy. I just wonder where is the limit.

I may be curious, but in the end this doesn't matter. If you're large, lift for years and want to be a strongman or powerlifter, just be it. Pussy is not the end game - and if you focus in yourself there will be plenty.

[–]Celicni 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Spoke about this with a very BP roommate. I am fucking shocked at the intensity of his hamster. "Oh but that's women in America, women in Serbia are different" and "if that's true how come my girlfriend hasn't left me yet for someone more muscled" (gf in question is 16, and a 3/10 on a good day).

[–]fromdario[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

"women in Serbia are different" That's simply not true. I've spent some time in Belgrade. Both men and women care a LOT about aesthetics. Serbian men are generally very old school and masculine. If you watch their music videos, tv, etc the "idealized" man is often the strong hero. Serbian and most Eastern European women do NOT like weak men. For the curious, look up "silicone valley" in Belgrade, a nightspot area with lots of hot bimbo girls.

[–]Celicni 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I am aware my man. I'm from Serbia myself. But no point in trying to argue with someone so desperately clinging to the blue pill.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I remember when I started lifting and I took T boosting supplements (ZMA nothing fancy) and some manlet friends of mine started to attack/shame me for it (ironically one of them actually got me into lifting). It actually deterred me for a year to push further, thankfully I found better answers the following two years. But this is how they think, these guys don't get it but they do get the concept of male threat. And instinctively you become that when you gain the power to beat them up. It's all about power.

[–]Jfc_Manners 0 points1 point  (1 child)

They shamed you for -ZMA-? It's literally a vitamin supplement.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well in their eyes it was testosterone boosting, so my improvement was threatening to them. They said it would make you aggressive etc and labelled that as bad. Both were some of the most beta guys I've ever known. Suffice to say they aren't very happy in life right now. And thankfully I didn't hang out with them that much. Only now do I realize why their behavior was off putting for me.

[–]Rathadin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I love how the author of the study made an account and said the following:

"There were men who were strong and big, and they were rated at attractive (more than average at least). They wouldn't have the same correlation because if you truncate the range correlations always go down. But the regression analyses show the effect of each variable: being strong makes you more attractive in a very direct way (this is the most powerful effect). Being tall makes you more attractive. Losing body fat makes you more attractive.

Most analyses used how strong the person appeared based on their photograph; we literally showed the photographs to men and women and asked them how strong they looked. We also brought men to the gym and tested their strength on weight lifting machines: super long pull, bicep curl, chest press, and an ab crunch. We measured the most they could for 10 reps. Their actual strength predicted their attractiveness as well, but not as well as how strong they looked of course. I'm afraid I don't remember the exact numbers here. I think the bicep curl (modular machine, both hands used) was 65lbs, but I wouldn't bet much on my memory here."

[–]Utterberetacht 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lazy fucks want any excuse not to lift and improve themselves.

Meh, less competition for us.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]deadassfinna 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Dw found it. What's with all the deleted comments, why can't they leave the comment and just hide their name, so annoying

[–]pussyaficianado 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Cheange the URL from Reddit to ceddit, that'll show the deleted comments. The science subreddit kind of has thought police going over the comments.

[–]BobbyPeru 66 points67 points  (1 child)

This post reminds me of this one time a guy suggested lifting on here

[–]2Overkillengine 133 points134 points  (46 children)

"B-but a shredded physique is just a male power fantasy!!"

The inevitable refrain by some weakling in skinny jeans wishing to justify how they are "different" from "all those other guys".

[–]fromdario[S] 163 points164 points  (31 children)

Reminds me of a guy I know...

Him, his girlfriend and I were leaving a party at the same time and happened to be parked in the same lot a couple blocks away. Not the nicest area for sure.

His GF is walking closer to me. He notices and complains (yes he whined about it) that she isn't walking with him. Her response was ice cold and went something like: "This is a dangerous area and he's more of a man". I shit you not.

EDIT: I forgot what his verbal response was, but I do remember he just started doing some goofy "ninja moves" as a joke. She did laugh - at him.

[–]LORD-THUNDERCUNT 120 points121 points  (4 children)

I would've killed myself if that were me

[–]ThickDickWarrior89 20 points21 points  (2 children)

Are you related to lord thunderbolt?

[–]daringdeviljackass 28 points29 points  (1 child)

Good for you man. Continue lifting and tap that

[–]ThickDickWarrior89 31 points32 points  (8 children)

Lmfao nice I’d be embarrassed for him

[–]fromdario[S] 61 points62 points  (7 children)

I was. I don't she think she realized how much of an insult it was.

[–]TunedtoPerfection 36 points37 points  (1 child)

Yes she did, he invited a shit test by being a bitch. She served up a classic, not in anyway original, plain shit test. He did ninja moves, she lost more respect for him and probably denied him sex when they got back home.

[–]fromdario[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

The ninja moves were very cringe.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (4 children)

I would drop that bitch there and then.

[–]fromdario[S] 5 points6 points  (3 children)

Yea I mean, I was trying to think of how to recover from this if I were him. What on earth could you say as a response back to that.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Literally nothing, it's the meanest insult possible - mocking his masculinity. Situations like these make or break people.

[–]mummersfarce_is_done 11 points12 points  (0 children)

In chess, you can find yourself in situations that no matter how masterful you can be in your tactics right now you will still lose because you made a set of misplays 10 moves ago.

[–]ThePwnter 1 points1 points [recovered]

Come on, you can't leave us hanging like that. What happened after she said that?

[–]fromdario[S] 15 points16 points  (2 children)

Oh God, it was bad, I forgot what he said, but I do remember he just started doing some goofy "ninja moves" as a joke. She did laugh - at him.

[–]ThePwnter 1 points1 points [recovered]

So did you two ever hook up after?

[–]fromdario[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

No. I was not attracted to her and as a result didn't try anything. Thinking back, curious to see what she would have done had I made a move.

[–]mauritocarp90 1 points1 points [recovered]

lol I can relate. Women stand behind me when something scares them. Once upon a time in my late teens (I'm a naturally tall huskey guy) I went to Universal with a group of frienda and acquaintences and in the mummy maze (it used to be a maze) I looked like mother duck while the rest of the guys were visibly bothered by it. I remember feeling guilty but not knowing why, confused about the whole thing. Oh, innocent me.

[–]fromdario[S] 16 points17 points  (6 children)

Haha, nice! I went to Universal a couple years ago. GF wanted to do the Walking Dead thing where they jump out at you. To be honest all those things popping out put me on edge, I nearly clocked one of the guys in costume when he startled me.

[–]Jfc_Manners 1 point2 points  (0 children)

When I was a kid (maybe 8), my grandpa put on a buffalo skin costume with a cape and lept out at us on Halloween...I got him right in the jaw on reflex. I felt so bad afterwards.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex 4 points5 points  (4 children)

Hahaha. That reminds of a time when I went to Madame tousseads and I clocked a zombie on the nose that jumped out to close too me.

[–]LordThunderbolt 4 points5 points  (3 children)

sounds like u belong in the Foreverchest subreddit

[–]Chaddeus_Rex 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Foreverchest? Has the potential to be hilarious or stupid from the name.

[–]LordThunderbolt 1 point2 points  (1 child)

With a name like yours, you'd be a great fit there.

[–]00Spartacus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Amazing that people actually believe you.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (3 children)

To be fair, it is about male power, it's just not a fantasy I doubt you'd disagree.

I picture a continuum from peacock to elk......peacock's strut for the good lady's attention, and elk beat the shit out of each other to settle the matter.....in both cases, the female is riding herd on male power dynamics.

[–]2Overkillengine 11 points12 points  (2 children)

Oh aye, it is just that the connotation being used in that phrase is a way to imply that it is an entirely self centered impulse on the part of the male in which the female bears no fault or responsibility for encouraging.

I mean, how dare those men notice what my precious snowflake likes and put in the effort to provide it? Misogyny! Patriarchy! /hipster

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Yep, I thought we were on the same page....I know my life improved once I just started focusing on self improvement. Damn, that sounded like a tautology, but I'll tell you what, it's an upward spiral. I get my ass handed to me more often than not on the mat, but everywhere else I'm a tough son of a bitch.

I recently went climbing and a friend of my climbing buddy came along...she was a hard core feminist, working on her PhD in Geography, very interested in the whole LBTG thing....I'll tell you what, though, she watched me struggle up that pitch past fear, right at the edge of my abilities...and I swear to FSM, she was wetter than May.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Those voluntarily remaining weak drive the bitches into my arms. I humbly thank you, whoever you are.

[–]Chachenhouser 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Is it bad that I wear skinny jeans to keep my legs insulated in 40 degree weather?

[–]MarvelousWhale 10 points11 points  (3 children)

If you could squat at least 2 plates then you'd have enough muscle to not need "insulation"

Sounds like an excuse to wear your sisters pants bro

[–]Chachenhouser 2 points3 points  (2 children)

They are my jeans. And they seen skin tight either, at all. I do skip leg exercises in favor of upper body workouts. I guess that's where the problem stems from.

[–]HillarysCell-mate 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Squat 3 plate for reps, and I still wear pretty skinny jeans. If you’re young you can pull it off

[–]Chachenhouser 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am oddly young. I'm only in early high school

[–]vwibrasivat 0 points1 point  (1 child)

The claim is that the stronger men are more attractive, not the men who are "shredded".

You should immediately know this is not scientific. Stronger men are olympic weightlifters. They are chubby, stalky, and look like a barrel chested lumberjack competing in the Strong Man Competition held in South Africa.

Indeed, the model who appears in the article itself has engaged in body building practices of ketosis. He reduced his subcautaneous bodyfat, giving him the "ripped" look. What you called "shredded".

An olympic weightlifter could grab the little "shredded" prettyboy by the hair and toss him across the room. Because weightlifters are significantly STRONGER. No way that roided weighylifters at the Strong Man contest with names "Olaf Rassmussen", are more attractive than apollonion guys like Zyzz.

[–]thisishowiwrite 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Dude do you even read? They did strength tests. Those men rated highly also tested highly for strength.

[–]LordThunderbolt -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The article clearly speaks against shredded physiques and more in favor of powerlifter physiques

[–]abenomix 1 points1 points [recovered]

My pre and post RP photos led me to the same result without wasting research funds. Attractiveness went up by orders of magnitude. PRE-POST RP

[–]fromdario[S] 20 points21 points  (1 child)

Serious "face gains" you look younger and healthier. Good for you!

[–]Arnoux 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Jesus this guy went from weak beta provider to Jason Statham face wise.

[–]StudntRdyTeachrApear 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Gj man. My gains are similar to yours, albeit a bit less atm. It has been amazing having girls who adore my chest and arms for the first time in my life.

[–]crezber 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Wonderful. I will this comment to motivate myself for that kind of change

[–]cantFindValidNam 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Post your numbers for squat deadlift and bench please?

[–]Aurien7 280 points281 points  (39 children)

This has been common knowledge for every person that ever lived

[–]nofilmynofucky 44 points45 points  (7 children)

Not if you listen to what women say they want.

Which I'm not suggesting you should ever do but if I had a dollar for every blue numale I've met you thinks that being a nice, virtue signaling, generous and politically modern 'gentleman' will get them laid I'd have enough money to fund a revolution and clean this shit up

[–]Forrix17 16 points17 points  (3 children)

There's a woman on my facebook who is constantly preaching the above and the #metoo stuff. She also talks a lot about her amazing boyfriend who stayed persistent when she told him she wasn't interested in him and eventually won her over.

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (1 child)

Did she tell you how many Chads she fucked while homeboy was pining for her?

[–]banjew 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They guy did fucked her at the end. So he won.

But then he had to play the boyfriend. Pyrrhic victory.

[–]LandoChronus 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Sounds like rape. I bet that's where she gets the "privilege" of using #metoo...

[–]fromdario[S] 8 points9 points  (2 children)

Had this this valuable lesson hammered home by accident years ago at a dinner party in mixed company.

Long story short, everyone was being polite and "nice" but I had a bit too much to drink and was more "real" than usual.

Some of the guys (and girls) were huffing and puffing at the shit I was saying, but most of the girls were very much digging it. You know that fake being offended "oh my god, you're so bad!" but with a smile on their face and the look in their eye.

[–]kemchik 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Because they found the clown at the party to make boring shit become a bit more interesting by laughing at the crazy clown?

[–]AlexDr0ps 103 points104 points  (6 children)

Something something, water is wet

[–]no_its_a_subaru 19 points20 points  (1 child)

In science news, women like men who are muscular, water is in fact wet, and the earth is round. Back to the studio for today’s weather forecast!

[–]ThePwnter 1 points1 points [recovered]

In related news the Sun is hot. Johnson, back to you...

[–]1Your_Coke_Dealer 2 points3 points  (0 children)

In related news, bears have been found to shit in the woods, and the Pope has confirmed he is in fact Catholic.

[–]Losingsteamfast 53 points54 points  (17 children)

I was surprised that they concluded that strength was a stronger determinant than height or leanness.

[–]yumyumgivemesome 33 points34 points  (2 children)

I am too. AFAIK the study didn't show the men in person so the women didn't have the chance to feel small or large in each man's presence. The women were probably told a height, which is basically just a number to them. Plus, they knew that they wouldn't actually be dating these guys.

My point is that, while this conclusion is surprising, I think there are a few explanations that caused the height factor to be somewhat discounted from reality.

[–]Losingsteamfast 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I didn't even consider that. That's a really good point.

[–]Forrix17 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I think wanting to feel like their boyfriend is stronger than them and able to protect them is where the height obsession with women comes from. Barring dedicated weightlifting regimes height is a pretty good indicator of a man's strength.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (10 children)

I think in terms of who women like seeing in movies and what not, they like a lean, dreamy Brad Pitt looking guy.

But in real life, they have an innate attraction to the big burly linebacker types with beards and shit.

[–]Losingsteamfast 17 points18 points  (4 children)

Somebody else made a point that looking at pictures doesn't really give you a true feel of a person's height. The same would be true for movies/tv not really portraying a person's size perfectly.

I've met shaq and you can see how big he is in pictures and on tv but holy shit it's an entirely different story when you're actually standing next to that monster. You just feel like a dwarf standing near him.

That's an extreme example but it kind of lines up you with what your saying. A handsome guy is a handsome guy, but it's harder to appreciate size until you're actually standing next to someone.

[–]yarmysmardarm 1 points1 points [recovered]

I’ve met Shaq too, I’m 5’3”. He’s the largest thing on the planet.

[–]facestab 6 points7 points  (2 children)

We can live in a boat made from his shoe.

[–]LordThunderbolt 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Both of you can be his shoes

[–]1scissor_me_timbers00 9 points10 points  (3 children)

Not entirely. I see plenty of hot women with lean Brad Pitt types

[–]mytrillosophy 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Well yeah lean brad Pitt types are still better than 80% of men

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I’m not even saying the big burly types are considered more attractive than the Brad Pitt types.

Just that the big burly types are more attractive to women in real life than they are on tv. No girl has a Ray Lewis poster up on her wall, but if she met him in real life, she’d be attractive to his stature and presence

[–]1scissor_me_timbers00 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Definitely true, but they also fall over themselves for slender fit guys if they have height and/or facial genetics.

[–]vwibrasivat 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The conclusion can't be scientific. the tests subjects were (Lliterally) 130 college girls. Male Cover models do not make their bodies look like olympic weightlifters. They are barrel chested, chubby, stocky with fat legs etc.

Models want a nice Apollonion "ripped" body.. often shaving off all their hair and tanning to round out the "male model" look.

[–]pfffft_comeon 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've been saying this forever: height is conflated with dominance, but that marker can be overridden as we see here.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've said so before in the comments but it pays to repeat. Height (arms, torso, legs) is a determinant of your physique. When women say they don't like men who are 'to big' they just mean they don't like short men who wear more muscle than they can. A taller man with the same lbs of muscle they adore. So when the study says strength and dominance trumps height alone that's true. But it's more tied together than you think.

[–]Joey_Lopez 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Maybe but it did inspire me to do one extra set

[–]Westernhagen 3 points4 points  (0 children)

But now, we know it WITH SCIENCE!!!

[–]chaseemall 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Most of what is discussed in this sub is common knowledge for every man that ever lived. However, a LOT of intergenerational knowledge, passed on both by explicit teaching and by observation and mimicry, has been lost due to the rash of fatherlessness in our society. Not to mention the plethora of 'spergs and shut-ins who find this place in an effort to make their lives better. Things which may seem obvious no longer are.

[–]TheStumblingWolf 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Sure but it's nice to have it on paper

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Except liberal 21st century scientists.

[–]JamzeNeu 70 points71 points  (14 children)

This is on the top of r science right now. The comment section is really salty. SJWs calling evolutionary psychology a pseudo science.lol Also, a lot of censorship of truth going on.

[–]fromdario[S] 53 points54 points  (5 children)

It’s the same people who say gender has nothing to do with biology... OK, by all means, go ahead and enjoy your girlfriend’s penis.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

And I hate when people misuse the term "gender" when what they really mean is "sex," which is the only term that really means something biologically.

[–]pussyaficianado 10 points11 points  (1 child)

The term gender started out as a polite way not to say the word sex, and then it was conscripted via social construct to mean something else.

[–]Jfc_Manners 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Remember when organic was a chemistry term?

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (7 children)

The problem I have with the pseudo science label is that just because something doesn't chalk up as 100% accurate all the time doesn't mean it's necessarily untrue.

Like women obviously prefer your typical chadly hunk to some string bean beta STEM nerd.. But once in a while you have a chick that prefers scrawny beta guys like a guy might prefer a BBW to a regular healthy sized woman or small tits over big tits.

But the vast majority of men still prefer a woman who's normal size with a nice rack.

Scientists can't agree on jack shit about anything. They're all always fighting and science results in more failures than "proving things".

Pseudoscience is just a hot word liberals and generally annoying people use to tune out anything that might hurt their feelings or cause them to question what they know.

[–]king_of_red_alphas 7 points8 points  (3 children)

I wouldn’t say liberals have the market cornered on science denial although they have come up with some of the more ridiculous ones lately.

[–]pussyaficianado 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Idk, I think vaccination leading to autism is the most ridiculous one and that seems to cross the political divide from the most natural conscious hippies to the weirdest religious nutbags.

[–]king_of_red_alphas 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Lol. True.dat.

The conspiracy theory shit also knows no political boundary.

[–]Augustuscrassus 2 points3 points  (1 child)

But once in a while you have a chick that prefers scrawny beta guy

Not likely. One of my plates is a huge nerd and a 6 at best. She gets wet when she feels my lats.

Praise broseidon for my easy back gains.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Let me rephrase that.. Once in a while you have a chick that tells herself she prefers a scrawny beta guy.

[–]Elatea 166 points167 points  (10 children)

study:"men find tits attractive"

[–]samenrofringslikeLBJ 1 points1 points [recovered]

The thing is tho, you'd find variance. Some men would prefer small/big/different nipples whatever. Some would say Ass is more important. Men are logical and so we care about details and form our own opinions. This study showed 0000000 deviation. All girls have the same taste. How about that for AWALT? Quite interesting find IMO.

[–]Augustuscrassus 3 points4 points  (0 children)

They have a preference for size. But all men like tits.

-Former ass man

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (2 children)

My man, you’re saying the same thing as the person brought in to critique the article. You’re connecting dots that aren’t there attempting to attribute them to men and denigrate women at the same time.

Attraction is a biological function and you backfill (hamster) any other qualities the person has as part of what makes them attractive. The cute guy is funny, the funny guy isn’t always cute.

Yes there are variations within specifics of attraction. The baselines are the same. T&A for dudes, strength for gals. These are the biological indicators that represent reproductive fitness. Anything else is icing on the cake.

PUA spikes emotional routines that bypass these biological filters because we are conscious animals. There’s no such thing as PUA in the animal kingdom. It’s straight biology there.

[–]TheyCallMeVinny 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lul, it’s my god given right to denigrate women.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I agree with your critique, if you are with a woman with great tits and a weak ass, then you are gonna say "I prefer tits" to hamster out the difference. No argument there. But, I am arguing that the 0 deviation found indicates AWALT while men from an evolutionary standpoint are much more varied in taste. It would be disastruous for the species if men all had the same objective beauty standard because our job is to fuck anything that lets us. That doesn't mean that a landwhale haggard catlady can be attractive to some people, beauty is UNIVERSAL, but not OBJECTIVE for men. For women, since they are the selection pressure on the species, beauty is both universal and objective or we would let some unwanted males reproduce.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMarsupian 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Nah man all dudes are attracted to nice round firm tits. If it signal health and firtility your dick wants to smash dat ass. That finer detail and personal taste talk is bullshit. Don't act like men are special and aren't driven by biological instinct.

[–]yomo86[🍰] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Makes sense. All male sexual fetishes are condensed and perversely exaggerated version of vanilla sex and attraction.

[–]blue_27 20 points21 points  (0 children)

I ... volunteer for the continuation of this study.

[–]Hjalmbere 40 points41 points  (9 children)

Hardly news, but we all have lives outside the gym where status, game, and grooming also play a part. But exercise is where it starts.

[–]Kgb725 5 points6 points  (6 children)

Doesn't it start with good social skills first ?

[–]Hjalmbere 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Lifting lowers body fat, increases testosterone, and (if done right) improves posture. Ask yourself if it’s easier to interact with people if you’re a low testosterone obese dweeb, or if you look and feel fit.

[–]RP085 16 points17 points  (2 children)

There was a book, I don't remember if it was Kezia Noble's, or Marni [Something]'s book called "Get Inside Her", but it was written by a woman so I think it was one of those two.

The author says an activity was done (can't remember if the author organized it or someone else) in which a group of women (can't remember how many; a workshop full of them?) were asked to write down a list of all the desirable attributes/qualities they would want in an ideal man.

Then they were asked to narrow that list down to 15 attributes. Then 10. Then 5, and so on, and finally narrow it down to 1.

The attribute chosen by them all was: Strength.

[–]Garathon 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Tbf strength can have multiple meanings. Mental strength, strength of frame etc.

[–]RP085 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Yes, I do agree with that and that's how I interpreted it.

It's the strength in general that moves a male up in rank/hierarchy, surpassing other males; the strength that makes the one at the top (the alpha) be there. The strength in your energy, and physically, frame, influence, status, etcetera.

[–]maplemaximus 76 points77 points  (46 children)

It would have been a better study if they showed strong men with under average faces, and pretty boys with weak or lean bodies. Then we'd know the real facts.

[–]yumyumgivemesome 32 points33 points  (9 children)

I've noticed this pattern when seeing a guy's progress pics on r_fitness and r_progresspics... The dude's face becomes multiple times more attractive. Why? Because a chiseled face is part of the classical definition of a handsome male face. Therefore, just by being in great shape, a man's face is far more likely to be classically handsome.

[–]fromdario[S] 16 points17 points  (7 children)

This.

From my own experience doing a wide range of diet/exercise programs to change body composition & fitness goals...

The most positive in terms of female response was when I did a big cut and dropped to like 8% BF. "Face gains" were noticeable, no longer the swollen jacked up powerlifter face.

Very obvious increase in attention/looks from females. Even though, I was much smaller looking in clothes. It has been so positive that I have been following a Lean Gains protocol ever since. I'd rather slowly bulk while keeping the BF low than bulk/cut and have to dead with a fatter head during the bulk phase.

[–]empty_moshpit 1 points1 points [recovered]

I also don't understand why more people don't go for the clean bulk or Lean Gains method. Maybe it's slower than pigging out on tons of calories, but your body fat will stay low while you build lean mass. It's a win/win. Why would you lower your aesthetics for even up to a year or more while bulking when you do not necessarily need to?

[–]nattyX 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I also don't understand why more people don't go for the clean bulk

Because different people have different goals? Are you lifting to become more "attractive" or are you lifting to get stronger or hit a 405 DL?

[–]coco5440 0 points1 point  (3 children)

This! The problem with bulking and cutting is that its a lot easier to bulk than it is to cut.

[–]empty_moshpit 1 points1 points [recovered]

Bulk for a year, and spend a year not looking optimal. Then spend another year cutting all the fat you gained. That's 2 prime years wasted. I just don't get people sometime. Yes, you'll still get some attention as someone who has 21% bodyfat and has lifted, but it's nowhere near optimal. It's just not good for you.

[–]fromdario[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yea, I have a bunch of friends who have been lifting for years.

They are all bulky but none of them look like they hit the gym, even though they are pretty strong.

At the beach, you can't tell they are putting in 4-5 days at the gym, because they have such a high BF% that any muscle definition is obscured.

I'm happy they are being active but to me it seems like a waste if you can't even see your results. Maybe that's just me tho.

[–]richpianoooo 4 points5 points  (0 children)

dude thats me i was 92kgs and im around 83 84kgs now and holy shit the difference between then and now in how woman look at me is night and day fml i should of done this sooner hahahah

[–]wracky272 37 points38 points  (14 children)

Does that mean pretty boys won't benefit from having strong bodies? To quote the great Mark Bell: "Strength is never a weakness."

[–]k-ma 10 points11 points  (6 children)

Yes. Look at male k-pop stars, they thrive off their skinny “cute” looks

[–]TaylorWolf 11 points12 points  (2 children)

That's a lot of young girl fans though... girls who would be into Justin Beiber over here (when he first blew up at least)

They grow out of that once they lose their innocence and realize what a scary place the world can be. Then they want a real man by their side.

[–]banjew 0 points1 point  (1 child)

You know Justin Beiber is ripped as fuck nowadays.

[–]TaylorWolf 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Of course that's why I said when he first blew up

[–]FractalNerve 7 points8 points  (1 child)

I don't know kpop, but this sounds like a false assumption. You don't find such "famous people" in your random bar next door. Fame can create the illusion of a strong frame to an audience of "believers" who don't know better. Also fame enhances collective herd behavior.

[–]freeman_c14 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You're right, i do follow the kpop scene and one of the problems with these "flower boys" is unless they are really really famous they struggle getting appearances on variety shows and etc because they are most of the time shy, subservient,etc and this makes them not shine on TV which in Korea is still the best place to build your fame/image.

And it's funny because on their movies and soap operas when they want to sell this feminine look the protagonist compensates that by being overly masculine.

[–]yomo86[🍰] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

These guys are still aesthetically pleasing. Plus herd mentality. A woman will challenge her own biology just to conform with the herd thus ensuring the support of the herd increasing her chance of survival back in the day.

[–]TheBloodEagleX 1 points1 points [recovered]

The person who was involved in the study talked about faces a bit and said that surprising women overall prefer a more "babyface" rather than "strong" face. So they prefer a strong body with a Justin Bieber type of face or something.

[–]pussyaficianado 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I believe that was a different study being referenced, for this one they blurred out the faces and only showed the upper body.

[–]wracky272 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I don't understand why this is relevant. Strong body is always a plus despite what one's face looks like. There is no reason to be weak-- just laziness and denial.

[–]cas_999 -1 points0 points  (1 child)

Strength can become a weakness, look at some bodybuilders

[–]pussyaficianado 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"Bro when you tack on mass, you sacrifice flexibility."

"Touch your toes."

"What am I, a gymnast?"

[–]Torabor64 18 points19 points  (17 children)

Why would they do that? Then you wouldn't know anything. You can only change one variable to draw a conclusion. Isn't this common sense?...

[–]clme 51 points52 points  (16 children)

Imagine a 2 by 2 matrix with four categories:

  • A) hideous face & strong body
  • B) hideous face & weak body
  • C) hot face & strong body
  • D) hot face & weak body

It's a no brainer that women would most prefer (C) and least prefer (B). But the interesting unanswered question is whom would they choose to fuck if the choice were between males from categories (A) versus (D) only.

[–]InstigatingDrunk 22 points23 points  (0 children)

this is a perfect illustration OP was making. A vs D is where things get interesting lol

[–][deleted] 18 points19 points  (10 children)

I think face & weak body would win lol

[–]ThePwnter 1 points1 points [recovered]

I've seen some really hot girls with jacked dudes that have the faces of a country retard. So from my life experiences, I'd definitely say they would go with bad face good body.

[–]StudntRdyTeachrApear 36 points37 points  (6 children)

Keep telling yourself that facelet

[–] points points

[permanently deleted]

[–]StudntRdyTeachrApear 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I lift all the time. Wtf are you even talking about?

[–]PaulAJK 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Every single guy who upvoted this comment doesn't lift.

[–]StudntRdyTeachrApear 3 points4 points  (2 children)

I made this comment and I lift more than you.

[–]PaulAJK 1 point2 points  (1 child)

OK, MOST guys who upvoted your comment don't lift.

[–]Jfc_Manners 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Or they thought it was funny

lighten up

[–]FractalNerve 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Same, I agree. Have seen ugly scarred and even childishly stupid, but huge steroid pumped guys blast 9s. Even though they were turned of from the bad grammar and language use, they still followed lead. I kid you not, that guy believed he could be a model. Well, whatever pushes his ego.. A and C are the only types who can get 9s without effort in general. Quit the hate.

[–]Torabor64 4 points5 points  (1 child)

You definitively aren't experienced in science, I see.

[–]All-DayErrDay 2 points3 points  (1 child)

So more stuff for you to whine about.

[–]maplemaximus 6 points7 points  (0 children)

No, to see if strength is what makes a man most attractive.

[–]TheBloodEagleX 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The person who was involved in the study talked about faces a bit and said that surprising women overall prefer a more "babyface" rather than "strong" face. So they prefer a strong body with a Justin Bieber type of face or something.

Found the bit:

here is also a more complicated story about face processing. For those who said that it is obvious that women find the strongest bodies attractive, shouldn't it also be obvious that women should find the strongest looking faces attractive? It's odd, because they don't. There's a sizeable research body showing some women like boyish faces, e.g. think Michael J. Fox or the Beetles or Justin Bieber or whoever.

[–]Essexal 40 points41 points  (14 children)

And some motherfuckers fell for ‘women love the dad bod’.

Good luck with your rolls motherfuckers. By the time I’m 40, ripped, with enough disposable time and income to do what I wish, it won’t even be a competition anymore.

[–][deleted] 34 points35 points  (8 children)

Wanna know a secret? 5-10 185 nearing 40. Not having a gut alone puts you in the top 25%. Having visible pecs and shoulders/traps bumps you into the top 15%. Now your only competition is those very few other guys in the gym at your age range.

I’m likely 18% bf. I still carry a bit of lovehandle and just a bit of bellybutton fat naked. I’m thin enough to see my abs lines, but not cut enough to see my abs definition. I look thin and strong in shirts. Obviously pick the shirts that are tight across the shoulders and chest.

It’s a fucking cakewalk man. Cougars eat me up. Young girls 18-21 (that are into older guys, maybe 25-40%) get all smiley and awkward around me. It’s fucking awesome. Hail to the king baby. I love life now.

The only people that complain about getting older are the ones that let themselves go to utter shit. Fuck your dadbod.

[–]empty_moshpit 1 points1 points [recovered]

You probably have two distinct advantages, 1. you age well due to genetics 2. you are disciplined and willing to work hard towards having a killer body even at age 40.

That being said, I'm not surprised. Think of men like Jason Statham. He is currently 50 and many women in their early 20s are genuinely attracted to him (not because he's in movies). That's what discipline and hard work can do. Oh, and he's gone bald a long time ago, by the way. Doesn't matter one bit.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

You’re not entirely wrong. I always had a babyface, now i don’t look almost 40. My face looks experienced, not old even with some graying patches in the beard. Got lucky there, I smoke and drink like a fish. Those two behaviors will fuck up most people.

I am disciplined now. Lost a ton of weight and look much better. Paid for that with stretch marks and persistent fat deposits in the handles and belly. Damn good but not killer is where I am especially given the competition these days.

My flaws are considerably less than everyone else. It works out for me well. Effort I put in getting here is worth every minute of it.

Shaved my head this year. You have the choice of rogaine or shaving if your hair thins. I was also lucky enough to have a good head for being bald. No quasimodo lumps or stupid shit like that. My look is a full short almost stubble beard and shaved head. Fits my vibe.

Genetics worked some in my favor. You young pups have the chance to set yourself up to age well by being fit now. You don’t get the past back, so set yourself up for success.

[–]pussyaficianado 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hair plugs are an option too, for thinning hair/balding.

[–]pussyaficianado 2 points3 points  (3 children)

A god skin care routine will help your face age well even if you don't have perfect genetics.

[–]empty_moshpit 1 points1 points [recovered]

Good point. Also avoiding alcohol, cigarettes, and eating healthy can easily shave 5-15 years off your look, that's how some celebrities can play teens on TV plausibly even though they're 35.

[–]Augustuscrassus 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Also avoiding alcohol

Honestly though how are you supposed to socialize then? I have a glass of whiskey at the end of the day same way someone drinks wine.

But you'll be that loser at the party not drinking.

[–]fromdario[S] 11 points12 points  (3 children)

Yup...

It's funny, lots of my married friends pushing for settling down.

I'm happy you enjoy your family but don't push that shit on me.

At a BBQ one day I just spoke my mind on this, "I'm in my 30s and regularly take women away from guys in their early 20s. When this stops being the norm maybe I'll start looking to settle down."

[–]Augustuscrassus 3 points4 points  (2 children)

I'm in my 30s and regularly take women away from guys in their early 20s. When this stops being the norm maybe I'll start looking to settle down.

And you were never invited out again.

[–]Jfc_Manners 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Not by the men in their 20s, or women in their 30s, anyway.

[–]Endorsed Contributorsadomasochrist 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Rule 38 "still looking for that special girl to spend forever with."

[–]Tachyon9 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The thing about the dad bod is that guys can be strong as fuck with extra meat on them. I've never seen a woman point out just a fat guy and call them attractive. But I know plenty of woman that are all about guys built like gorillas. They have a bit of a gut and aren't lean, but they could still pick up a refrigerator.

[–]ACmaster 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Women want masculine men, and men want feminine women.

How surprising!

[–]drkinferno72 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Cause strongest cavemen bring back meat to tribe and fight off saber tooth tiger

continue for generations as the weakest would simply die

[–]Redpillandrew 35 points36 points  (4 children)

Maybe I'm missing something but... ...how did they manage to make the women tell the truth?

[–]SuperCrazy07 27 points28 points  (2 children)

What incentive is there for them to lie?

This isn't "how many guys have you slept with" where you subtract 10 and divide by 3 before replying. It's "who's more attractive"...zero negative consequences for telling the truth.

[–]Redpillandrew 0 points1 point  (1 child)

-Virtue signaling ("i just like this picture because he seems so sweet/smart/interesting, i look for a very particular kind of man, i'm not into big muscles!!")

-Selling the lie, another cog in the wheel of bluepill estabilishment: true alphas won't buy this shit, sorting themselves out, and deluded bluepill betas will conform into more enthusiastic providers.

[–]Jfc_Manners 0 points1 point  (0 children)

1) These are college women. It's no longer a virtue to value beta males in that context.

2) Arrogance. They don't think that beta males can stop the gravy train, or don't understand that the beta males are the source of that gravy train.

[–]Kgb725 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Is there a good reason for them to lie about that ?

[–]Hillarysdilddo_2016 24 points25 points  (5 children)

"There was no nuance to these results, he said. Zero of the 160 women surveyed showed a statistical preference for weaker men."

Hahaha. Literally, not even once.

Of course they bring in someone to critique the results. It's the Washington compost... SJW CIA shill Jeff Bezos' personal blog.

[–]LordThunderbolt 10 points11 points  (4 children)

Jeff Bezos has been lifting and pinning HGH my guy. He looks like an Israeli gun runner now: http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/07/15/01/424C490A00000578-0-Swole_con_Valley_-a-15_1500079233545.jpg

[–]Hillarysdilddo_2016 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Haha. That's because he probably is now with that $600mm CIA contract money. Good for him turning the world into cucks.

[–]LazyA1 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Amazing how much more attractive $50 Billion makes a man.

https://pics.onsizzle.com/1998-2017-i-sell-books-versus-i-sell-whatever-the-25408490.png

[–]LordThunderbolt 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Shit son, talk about it. If I had a few billions I'd get wings surgically implanted in my back to fly, I'd then buy a large yacht and move to the moon.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

But definitely still get your cardio in.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

just lol if you still ain't bloatmaxxing

[–]BullshittingNonsense 5 points6 points  (1 child)

This is just like that recent study that found that women find older, wealthier men attractive.

[–]Bigjohnthug 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Quick aside, while I agree with the theme of the article there are some problems with this study:

The biggest is that it draws the conclusion "strength is the primary factor for determining male attractiveness" without investigating that at all. Rather, they've shown ripped guys are more attractive than unfit guys. That's obvious. To demonstrate what they've claimed to study however they'd need to measure several independent variables in tandem.

Another study did this using computer generated model humans with varying hip:shoulder ratios, heights and penis length. They found height was the largest determining factor. In this study, torsos were rated independent of the rest of the subject. Therefore, we don't know if the tall lanky guy is more or less attractive than the buff shorty. We also don't know if face or body matters more.

Another concern is their use of the word strength. The sample group was college men recruited from the college gym. Having been to my fair share of uni gyms, you aren't going to find powerlifters there. In other words, the strongest people would have been bodybuilders with fitness comp physiques in all likelihood. So the correlation could be any one or combination of the following (to attractiveness): lower BF%, broader shoulders, shoulder:waist ratio, hip:waist ratio, skin tone, etc etc. What they definitely didnt show is that strong=hot.

Basically, the claims of this study are divorced from the reality of their findings. The main takeaway is if you aren't ripped, getting ripped will make you more attractive. It might not make you more attractive than other attractive guys however and working on something else may be more worthwhile- for example if you have a mono brow, acne and buck teeth, you probably have bigger concerns.

[–]BoogieorBust 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Do you have a link to the second study you mentioned?

[–]Vaca_Sagrada 0 points1 point  (0 children)

First off, the study said the opposite: not that height was the most important, but that penis size and height were equally important, with shoulder-to-waist ratio being the most important of all three.

Second, please google before asking.

However, since I am familiar with this study, this is the link for anyone to see: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3637716/

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (2 children)

So bears do in fact shit in the woods?

[–]pussyaficianado 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Do you have a scientific study backing up your hypothesis?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I mean I could probably find one

[–]jtromo 9 points10 points  (14 children)

Surprising that everyone is saying this is super obvious when there was a fairly recent post on here that was well received saying that lean was more important than bulky builds.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Put it simple, lean does not mean what you think it does.

[–]fromdario[S] 5 points6 points  (11 children)

The article does talk about "lean" physique a bit as a preference, but its vague.

Curious to see what BF% vs Strength relationship there is.

I would assume there would be a balance somewhere. i.e. would women pick this guy because he is stronger than this guy?

[–]jtromo 1 point2 points  (10 children)

Yeah I was going off of "Height and leanness were appealing attributes, too, but strength played an outsize role in the ratings of a man's torso", but it's something I've often wondered myself. In my times of cutting and bulking it's seemed like despite having more defined abs while cutting, I got more results when I was at my heaviest.

[–]fromdario[S] 5 points6 points  (4 children)

Interesting, I found the opposite. My lower BF% got me more attention than when I was bulkier, noticeably so.

Face looks different at different BF% tho, maybe you pull off a heavier face and I don't.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I get different kinds of attention when I'm lean vs when I'm bulky. Back when I was 180 I looked decent and girls liked my body, but now that I'm 270 they won't fucking stop touching me when they're around. Always randomly hugging me, jumping on my back, holding my arm as we walk instead of my hand. Not saying you can't be big and strong at a lighter weight, but when you're 270 18-20% body fat, it's a whole fucking different ball game. Girls are either way more aggressive or way more submissive. At that point you're considered "exotic" because most muscular guys aren't even half as big as you, and probably only 30-40% as strong as you. Bitches love the bear-mode look.

[–]fromdario[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

270 shit... Good for you.

Biggest I ever got was 230 at around 10-12% bf and that was a fuck ton of work to maintain in terms of both training and eating.

[–]jtromo 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Fair point. I think it's definitely a body type thing too. Being 5'5" when I was cut and muscular I had more success at pool parties and general summer day game but had less in general situations/the winter with more clothes on (less unique features at a glance). I ended up doing better bulking after the summer and focusing on cardio and general fitness once spring came around.

[–]fromdario[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Makes perfect sense actually.

[–]Jerk_McCock 2 points3 points  (4 children)

I got more results when I was at my heaviest.

Well yeah, cause you’re giving your body the nutrition surplus it needs to improve on lifts. That’s what I hate about cutting, you just end up feeling like you’re spinning your wheels on lifts even though your core looks more toned.

What I kind of did to get a happy combination of the two is to just not cut out the food but put more time in at the gym. That way you’re getting body recomposition instead of losing both muscle and fat by just cutting food.

[–]fromdario[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I feel you.

My search for the happy medium was Lean Gains. I've been on that tip for a while, absolutely love it. Increase in strength/muscle while also staying pretty ripped. It does take dedication and some paying attention but its been the best thing I've found. Hard for me to put more time in the gym than I currently do.

[–]LordThunderbolt 2 points3 points  (1 child)

He meant results with women, not lifts.

[–]Jerk_McCock 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ah, perhaps he was. I’ve been spending a lot of time in the gym recently. It’s basically the only thing I enjoy anymore so it’s nearly all I think about.

[–]1ozaku7 13 points14 points  (10 children)

"The study authors described a strong body as a signal, one our ancient ancestors would have understood: This is a healthy individual with a hearty immune system, the ripped body suggests, someone who can devote calories to building muscle rather than fighting off germs. Strength was also an “indicator of one’s ability to provide material and social benefits,” Lukaszewski said. In this interpretation, a strong man has value as a potential protector of women and children and is desired by other men as an ally."

That is some nice research but the written conclusion is totally bullshit. Visually speaking, a man is supposed to be muscly, a woman is supposed to be curvy. Curvier ass, bigger tits, more defined feminine face, everything is a female feature with a degree of intensity on a scale from 1 to 10. Small tits? 3. Huge tits? 10 on the feminine intensity scale.

A man is supposed to have muscles, facial hair growth, deep voice. Gender Attribute Intensity is where it's at. Are you attracted to a average fishstick type of woman with no curves, or one with a toned body from daily fitness and big tits? Obviously, women are not attracted to the male version of fishsticks, but men with big muscles that make them manly.

1+1=2, never have I ever heard a woman say "Oh my god, that guy looks so milky white and slim from being months locked up voluntarily in his basement playing WoW, my panties are so wet right now for him" and neither have any of you. We want tits, ass, fit body and pussy with a cute face, women want muscles, a big dick, a strong deep voice and a firm personality. End of story. Fucking politically correct published research.

[–]pfffft_comeon 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Gender Attribute Intensity is where it's at.

That's it. Also why balding (shave it) and a hairy back don't matter. Just lift.

[–]1ozaku7 1 point2 points  (1 child)

If you bald, own it. Shave your entire fucking head if you have to.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Yea what an idiotic conclusion to draw. Women aren't ripped - are their immune systems not working? Don't men want women with strong immune systems too? They just don't want the obvious answer, that being ripped made men better at war, hunting, and climbing their internal dominance hierarchy, to be true. Why don't they want it to be true? Because they are all likely physically weak males. Science is so corrupted by leftists.

[–]1ozaku7 1 point2 points  (1 child)

It has nothing to do with an immune system. It's just the most political correct conclusion to make. Males are muscles, women are curves. Big ass and big tits correlates to a man with big muscles and facial hair. Amplified gender differences are attractive, point. You can't say that because assless, titless, and muscleless facial hairless men will take offense and society will be in an uproar about the reality they are facing on a daily basis and are in permanent denial.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was agreeing with you, not arguing.

[–]SpottyDam 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I look milky white even when I've been out in the sun for an hour. Twats will never make me feel bad about my natural, god given skin color.

[–]1ozaku7 2 points3 points  (0 children)

A full hour, that's an achievement right there!

[–]JYandeau 7 points8 points  (1 child)

In other news; water is wet

[–]Jaang_Empire 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No, women looking at cut abs are wet.

[–]BthaGawd2 3 points4 points  (9 children)

I have a question..we're these guys who were strong but with higher body fat % to? Or just guys who were cut?

[–]fromdario[S] 2 points3 points  (4 children)

The article does talk about "lean" physique a bit as a preference, but its vague.

Curious to see what BF% vs Strength relationship there is.

I would assume there would be a balance somewhere. i.e. would women pick this guy because he is stronger than this guy?

[–]1rporion 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I have seen some that would.

[–]viral_left_stroke 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Maybe it would be related to how the women perceives herself...if she feels a little unhealthy but "overall attractive" maybe go for the guy who is kind of the same (obviously they don't understand the level of work to become strongman strong), or just regular fit girls want a regular fit dude? I don't know just a thought. Btw how did you find that photo of me.

[–]Ardekan 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Strongmen just look fat. The other guy looks strong.

[–]LordThunderbolt 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Yes, it's clear they reference to the "I'm shredded as fuark... Gymshark Brahh!" guys vs powerlifter/linebacker types.

[–]BthaGawd2 1 point2 points  (2 children)

So it's the cut ones not linebacker types like me ha

[–]LordThunderbolt 2 points3 points  (1 child)

No they're saying they prefer the linebacker types

[–]Ninokun 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Strength? more likely looks. i have abs and big chest and shoulders but im literally weak as fuck, i train in the 150lbs weight class, my looks are mostly due to Diet.

[–]LordThunderbolt 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If you have visible and, you definitely won't have a "strong" look as a natty. To have that strong look you need some fat on you and a certain dense look about your physique.

[–]CHIPPENDALESIXNINE 1 points1 points [recovered]

Keep in mind the Pic posted is likely similar to what the women were shown or thought of when referring to strength. Too many guys wanna be in bulking season all year long and never get lean. Also, if you're natural and want to keep abs, this is likely your genetic limit for size.

[–]fromdario[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yea if you are natural (i.e. not juicing, etc) there really is a limit and it takes a lot of work to hit it. This is a photo from the 50s Mr. Universe finalists, before steroid use. Pretty much the upper limit for natural.

[–]banjew 7 points8 points  (4 children)

I would think being a roided meat-head is not that attractive. I mean, a natural ripped body surely is attractive. But I would think, a heavy, wide, strong manlet (who I am, unfortunately) is less attractive than a tall, muscular guy.

[–]fromdario[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Study vaguely references height and leanness. I would imagine there is some balance between all of those that the majority of women find as their ideal.

[–]EsteraMC 1 points1 points [recovered]

Zyzz was roided to hell and back. You telling us he wasn't epitome of sex appeal?

[–]coco5440 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Cool study. Since women were just shown torso photos height may have been down played a bit.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

I remember a source a few years ago (sorry can't find link atm) that said low socio-economic women liked big muscles, higher status liked tall lanky guys (like William the prince except with hair). Old money usually isn't ripped. Not sure why but interesting results nevertheless. Probably because big muscles might be associated by them with lower socio-ec status guys. That said, not a bad place to be if you're big and can bounce around some poor poontang.

[–]fromdario[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Interesting. I think part of that comes from the type of work associated with those classes and how it shaped the men. Lower classes typically did more manual labor, so they were stronger. Upper classes, typically did less physically intense stuff.

My own theory is that those upper class women just got used to those types of men, but they would still definitely go with a more fit dude all things being equal.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The concept of fitness is also different, slim & fit for them means natty and their preferred balance in life. Hulking means too much time in gym, perhaps tied to gyms with weights even when traveling (lots of travel), possibly on gear.

[–]RedDespair 2 points3 points  (1 child)

My question is:

Just how strong are we talking about? Did they see strongman's fat bodies?

Cause these guys are the strongest motherfuckers

[–]fromdario[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The men selected were from a college gym, so I imagine not world's strongest man types.

[–]Gaullic 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm pretty sure we've known this since forever.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Women prefer stronger men, duh. Something we all know.

Strong is attractive.

But so is leanness. Women cannot gauge male strength very effectively if the muscles are covered in fat.

Don't take away from this that you can just lift and be strong and not have to lose any weight.

Bodyfat is beta.

[–]shadymcyoloswaggins 2 points3 points  (3 children)

The problem with this is that it is simplistic and within a vacuum. Yes, of course, we know that if the only difference is musculoskeletal structure then musculoskeletal structure is the deciding factor. Water is wet.

But; if you were to show a ripped guy lying on a bit of cardboard next to a bunch of used needles wearing shabby clothes and a junkie girlfriend Vs a skinny/fat guy next to a Lambo with a briefcase in hand with a couple gorgeous babes. Then what. We all know the answer would be.

Why? Well ask yourself this; which man would you do business with? Which man would you break bread with? Which man would you defer to? Which man would you want as a father?

Is it that women define male success based on male perception rather than their own. Is the only reason Hollywood degenerates and beta beibers so popular because of there vouching of dominance by other men (determined by other men's willingness to dedicate their own resources).

How does this impact men when men go around calling each other bitches, beta, geeks etc. What do we think of a female geek? Is that really projected as an insult? Why do men shit where they eat so much?

We know that divide and conquer has been used for millennia. Red pill Vs blue pill, Communism Vs capitalism, mods Vs rockers, hippies Vs the man, Nazi's Vs allies, Rome Vs the barbarians. This psychological tendency aides our survival at times. How could it be used against us?

Jesus Christ never worshipped anyone, Buddha never followed anyone, Chad doesn't copy Chad. TRP IS NOT 'the red pill', it is a Bible, it is part of the matrix, it is the apple, it is heaven and hell. It is not THE way. It is A way. What is YOUR way?

Hands up who knows someone blue pill. Hands up who respects them?

Now I know that starts on point and soon goes becomes galactic meta but I am fed up seeing what once was a great tool and resource for men yet again become a deified cult which only weakens men. Also if you masterbate you are a loser/s

*Pressed save to early

[–]Augustuscrassus 5 points6 points  (1 child)

But; if you were to show a ripped guy lying on a bit of cardboard next to a bunch of used needles wearing shabby clothes and a junkie girlfriend Vs a skinny/fat guy next to a Lambo with a briefcase in hand with a couple gorgeous babes. Then what. We all know the answer would be

It would be both. The ripped guy for the babies and the rich guy to pay for it. Sidebar son.

[–]shadymcyoloswaggins 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you read my whole post then you would realise you've proved my point; I never answered the question! Why did you answer it on my behalf? Why did you answer it in the negative? Does it make you feel good to imagine people to be inferior? When you call other girls ugly does it make you feel pretty? Do you think an alpha feels the need to do this? Can you objectively say that YOU have fully internalised the sidebar?

Did you even watch the link?

Also; you are incorrect with the sidebar suggestion as it clearly states in the rules that the sidebar should be read at least once before commenting. You should direct people to the rules if you believe they have not read and internalised the sidebar and are commenting.

Finally; I know what you implying when you say 'son' so I will leave it on this note "when the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser".

[–]TuscanNash 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This should shock nobody at all.

[–]DextroShade 2 points3 points  (0 children)

In other news, water is wet.

[–]3chazthundergut 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Biology cannot be denied. Thank you for sharing this further scientific proof of what we've already come to understand intuitively.

[–]chaosrunssociety 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I want to believe this, because this is the view I hold, but where is a real peer reviewed psychological paper that backs this claim up? Is the correlation statistically significant? If so, what's the p-value?

Quit making sweeping claims without empirical evidence - It makes us all look bad and perpetuates allegations of misogyny.

[–]RavelsBolero 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Just like the chinese and indians knew for thousands of years meditating is good for you (and now science is finding evidence it's true) we have also known all along women want strong men.

It's really that simple. As shown, the science is playing catch up.

[–]Nerian99 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This doesn't refute charm and personality as a major factor. It only shows that being strong is attractive. All things the same being lean and strong is better, but a woman is going to be judging you on a lot more than that in real life. It also is ambiguous about whether or not there's a point of diminishing returns. I know for a fact women aren't swapping photos of fat powerlifters on their girly forums. In sum, yes lift weights, but it's not everything. 3-5 hours a week is more than enough. That leaves a lot of time. Most of your time should be spent on other things, money, social status, game, if you want to maximize your attractiveness. A lot of guys erroneously get obsessed with lifting as the panacea. They will take this study as meaning the more they deadlift the more girls they'll get. So he'll spend his life in the gym surrounded by large sweaty men grunting. Meanwhile the skinny musician guy is actually talking to girls and making their panties wet with his voice. The way I see it, get your noob gains, go to the gym 2-3 times a week, and move on with your life. Better to have 10 factors at 80% than 1 at 150%. My arms are 'dyel' mode to bodybuilder cultists, but are described as 'nice' by girls. You don't need much for a girl to be eye balling your arm as you fuck her. We are men. We put on muscle easily. Don't compare yourself to other men who lift, compare yourself to the average, and to women. If your arm is no bigger than a random girl's arm then you look like a girl, which is not attractive to a woman who is attracted to men. But it's pretty easy to fix that. As a man, muscle is your birth right, it's only a modern lifestyle that robs you of it. This is what women's brains evolved to expect to see: https://imgur.com/6mpo6yB - This guy doesn't lift weights, he just lives his life.

[–]tibikush2012 3 points4 points  (5 children)

How do you measure strength in photos?

[–]fromdario[S] 5 points6 points  (3 children)

"The researchers quantified the students' physical abilities via weightlifting machines, grip strength tests and other measures.... were asked to judge how attractive or strong they thought the men were, on a scale of 1 to 7. It turns out we are good at guessing a stranger's strength. Perceptions of strength closely aligned with the men's actual strength."

[–]party_dragon 9 points10 points  (1 child)

"grip strength" - those forearms tho <3

[–]LordThunderbolt -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Compare a college linebacker physique to Zyzz. That's how. When the person has a healthy amount of bodyfat on them and their musculature looks dense and tight vs the pumped up bodybuilder look.

[–]BusterVadge 2 points3 points  (0 children)

In other news: The sky is blue, and water is wet.

[–]dontgiveupcarib 4 points5 points  (3 children)

So perma bulk >> lean aesthetics?

[–]LordThunderbolt 0 points1 point  (1 child)

das it mane >> Ain't nobody mirin your striated abs in the jungle

[–]dontgiveupcarib 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Now I feel less guilty about eating junior chicken burgers after leg day

[–]JedYorks 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I want to lift today very bad, i had to be convinced to not go to the gym today because I just got hit by a car.lol!

[–]MentalOnslaught 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sheesh, why is that Reddit so heavily moderated?

[–]TunedtoPerfection 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"There was no nuance to these results, he said. Zero of the 160 women surveyed showed a statistical preference for weaker men."

That's the best part, that shit never happens in science. But notice this is all based on how strong you LOOK. There is a key nuance in that. There is more to signaling strength then just lifting heavy weights. Train smart and hard to obtain a look that signals strength, it's not just big muscles it's being solid.

[–]wanderer779 1 point2 points  (2 children)

As far as I can tell they didn't put the guys up head to head. If they did I'm sure they would have found women prefer tall weak guys to short strong guys. And that's especially true if both are wearing clothes, which we usually are. Unfortunately this isn't much of a useful insight since there's no way to get any taller.

The comments from the anthropologist who was criticizing the story were hilarious. First she starts off with some SJWey comment about how it's nice to see men treated as pieces of meat. Then she really gets going, saying she thinks it may be a cultural thing, and that it needs to be studied in other cultures. Which is fine I guess, although I'd argue this is probably a waste of money, but I don't think you're going to find anywhere on earth where strong men aren't preferred. Then she says that these results might not apply to everyone because college girls don't “have much of an experience with what attractiveness means". I am guessing the next move is to point out that these women will eventually marry skinny computer programmers as they switch to a post-wall BB strategy, err, I mean, their mating preferences mature.

Then someone else comes in and argues that in the old days women would have preferred barrel chested dudes to lean gym rats. I guess they missed the point that attractiveness was directly related to strength in this study. The whole point is women can tell how strong you are by looking at you and they like strength.

This stuff is so typical with these studies. Why are academics so often such fucking dimwits? It drives me insane sometimes.

[–]fromdario[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Why are academics so often such fucking dimwits?

I've dealt with a fair amount of academics. It does depend heavily on the discipline, i.e. liberal arts.

"Those who can't do, teach" has some truth to it. The world of academia is generally a "safe space" where they do not have to deal with the realities of the world and they can live in theories.

Often they have an ideological motivation or narrative they are invested in (because they have studied it for years), so it kind of blinds them to any outside thought.

I remember having a convo with a female PHD student, who was arguing that gender roles are a societal construct. When I brought up biology and evolution, she didn't even know the first basic thing about those topics; tunnel vision and never looking outside your yard.

[–]Endorsed Contributorsadomasochrist 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It may be a safe space but there's less bullshittery outside of rule 38. Rule 38 alone won't get you anywhere in corporate land.

Only the truly amoral without lives make it in the corporate scene long term.

You can succeed in academia on merit and rule 38 without being shady and working 80 hours.

[–]tboyacending 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I knew that in the 8th grade.

[–]cafeitalia 1 point2 points  (1 child)

What sucks is such article and even posting it makes it as if the life of a man is lived for a woman. No! Do not lift to look good for some woman who already sucked tens of cocks and had hundreds of facials before you. Lift for yourself! Be fit for your own self! Look good for your own self! Feel good doing the good things for yourself! A man does not and should never try to impress some bimbo. When you do all of it for yourself the woman will be trying to impress you. You have one life to live so live it for yourself.

[–]Luckylancer96 1 point2 points  (0 children)

They made the research boys. This is now boht broscinence and actual science!

I would replace "strong" with "strong looking" because looks matter not strenght.

[–]Fedor_Gavnyukov 1 point2 points  (0 children)

[–]blkarcher77 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am Jack's complete lack of surprise

[–]muscleg33k 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Can confirm this.
My progress so far http://i.magaimg.net/img/23qr.jpg

[–]Augustuscrassus 1 point2 points  (1 child)

damn dude nice guns. I'm thinking about switching to working arms twice a week cause once just doesn't seem to be enough.

[–]muscleg33k 1 point2 points  (0 children)

go for it cuz that's what i did. Do different schemes twice a week: strength (low volume) and hypertrophy.

[–]3LiveAFTSOV 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The study says the guys who look the strongest are most attractive, and ripped guys "look" stronger than fat power lifters, yeah?

That part I dont get.

All I know is women like muscles, whether they're 60 lb curl hypertrophy or 500 lb dead lift raw power muscles

[–]irritus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

When in doubt, lift it out

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children)

I used to see these studies where they would say that sometimes women prefer men with effeminate faces and I'd just laugh.

[–]fromdario[S] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

I remember these, apparently it has to do with hormonal cycles.

Specifically, women on the pill vs not on the pill.

Women off the pill preferred more masculine faces, because they were fertile and ready to mate, so they wanted the strongest genes.

Women on the pill wanted more feminine faces because the pill tricks the women's body into thinking she is pregnant (or something like that) so she wanted someone more nurturing to take care of kid with.

The pill really really fucks with a chick's hormones. I have to say I prefer women who don't take it.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Well that's fucked up. From a personal point of view - I love the pill. From a broader point of view, the pill really messed up our society. It destroyed the traditional relation between the sexes and now it is making women prefer metros? Goddamn.

[–]fromdario[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yea it really did. I prefer women not on it simply because of my experience dating women who took it, much bigger mood swings, more emotional. Noticeably so. Only after a fair amount of dating experience did I start to put that together and realize the connection.

[–]DerekDiablo 1 point2 points  (6 children)

I'm good-looking, ripped, and jacked. Plenty of Guys down here in South Florida scraping the bottom of the barrel while dudes who are fat with no looks smash more, not always because of Money... But in general, yes. Women can't Intellectualize a bunch of hard Muscle in their face...

[–]00Spartacus 1 point2 points  (5 children)

Post a picture of your face with a time stamp.

99% of guys on here who claim to be good looking are at best, 5/10 material. Either that or your a manlet.

[–]DerekDiablo 1 points1 points [recovered]

I'm pretty famous, or well-known. I'm Diablo from ANTIFA, other Leftist groups. Recently kicked out of the Communist Party/CPUSA over "misogyny", ha. So there are a lot of things on the internet about me, pics, articles, videos, Music, my last Band is called ASYMMETRIC COMBAT, my last Band is COLORBLIND COLORBLIND CUTTHROATS, so you can see more than pics if you want... I'm not sure how to post pics on here, but I have a lot of real good ones. My Manager just had postcards of me printed up, in underwears on the beach in Miami, elsewhere... I'm glad to post pics if I can figure it out, glad to help any other Men out there with advice if any want it, not saying I'm Hottest Guy in the World, but likely Hotter and better Body than any of you, ha...

[–]00Spartacus 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Quite possibly the most desperate attempt at deflection i've ever seen.

So much for "good looking, ripped and jacked".

[–]DerekDiablo 1 points1 points [recovered]

I can't figure it out, but there are pics of me on my instagram that she made for me. I don't go on ig, but mine is instagram.com/diablosfla. I read the rules before I started posting here, and I think it is ok to post this kind of link as long as I am not selling anything?

[–]bob13bob 1 point2 points  (0 children)

there is flaws in any study. imo, standing side by side women like tall men more than buff. it's harder to tell that from invidual photos. It's the sam reason we get sex symbol men in movies who are shorties.

no social proof/status, no communication skills, no shit tests. this is straight physical attraction which is only one part of it.

[–]Cunari 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Then women should find muscles like back and legs more attractive and not biceps as that has more to do with overall body strength.

[–]Lefort9000 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lifting will pretty much always improve your attractiveness to girls (unless you get "too big", which is only gonna happen through heavy steroid use), but this study didn't take into account facial attractiveness. A more realistic study would've included the guys' faces to be rated.

[–]corsega 1 point2 points  (1 child)

[–]FaderOne 6 points7 points  (18 children)

I have the flu, but this post is going to make me go lift tonight and not miss my schedule… Thank you

Edit: well I’m restarted and that’s a bad idea. Thank you bros who called me out for that..I’ll stay in and recover until I get 100% then hit the gym (was also tarting bjj later this week but I’ll wait on that.)

Love this sub. Only place on the internet people actually care and share their honest opinions.

[–]blue_27 14 points15 points  (2 children)

Because the flu isn't contagious, and/or fuck e'ryone else? Get some dumbbells and a pullup bar, and don't be Typhoid Mary.

[–]BillSander 1 point2 points  (1 child)

He didn't say where he was going...

[–]FaderOne 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Oh I 100% was going to. But u/blue_27 and everyone who posted are right. I’ll recover first and not try to fuck/kill everyone else over at the gym.

[–]1rporion 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Good idea, maybe you will even get a myocarditis.

You shall be a case study for my new book "Dead men rarely get fucked"

[–]FaderOne 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Haha point taken. I’ll listen and rest.

[–]liberty1127 4 points5 points  (6 children)

Take some rest man. You'll stay sicker longer if you push it too much

[–]FaderOne 2 points3 points  (5 children)

Okay you are right. I’ll chill until I recover

[–]liberty1127 2 points3 points  (4 children)

I was just sick for 5 days and I work at a job doing manual labor so I took 3 days off the gym but all of my lifts went up when I went back.

Eat well and rest up

[–]FaderOne 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Rest days do wonders. You on a mon/wed/fri program?

[–]liberty1127 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Yes. Full body routine. Im 5'10" 190lbs about 11% BF.

I just do this routine to get the most out of my weeks because the labor takes a toll on me if I do a 4 day split

[–]FaderOne 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Oh I’m 5’10” and I’m doing SL to get a good form then I plan to move to something better next month.

Mind sharing what program you follow?

[–]liberty1127 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes no problem. I made it myself so I'll message it to you

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Yea bad idea. You could probably power through a common cold and still hit the gym but the flu is a different animal. Give your body the rest it needs to recover and hit the gym hard once you’re healthy. Also, like that other guy mentioned below, kind of a dick move to go and give everyone else at your gym the flu

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Yeah, your body needs to divert energy to the immune system, muscle building is secondary to staying alive.

[–]FaderOne 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You and u/milksteak24 are right. I’ll take it easy.

[–]CoronaTRP 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I would be careful about that. When you do sports while being sick, you can get dangerous diseases if the bacteria infect your heart muscles.

[–]FaderOne 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Very good point, I’ve changed my mind.

[–]lotikpotik 1 points1 points [recovered]

they should make a study of what happens when u step into water with your socks

[–]Starfuckingman 1 point2 points  (1 child)

This might be hamstering from my part, or perhaps not but the context of this post feels like its saying ''hey women like that, let's do it''. While I have no issue with that whatsoever nor any problem with the post but when it comes to lifting, especially lifting, I always want it to stem from a mad need for getting strong and disciplined and invincible. Its becoming one of my most self-healing things I've ever done in my entire life, it putted me on the equal grounds of real men and gave me a chance to be virtuous and kind out of strength. Its becoming a like a holy thing for me that I'd never for a second degrade it by the idea of doing it to get some pussy. But hey, don't let my overdramatizing get to you. Wanna dem muscle to get that ass, sure bro. Have a good day.

[–]fromdario[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Appreciate the input. You're not wrong. My orientation on the post was sexual strategy/selection. I agree that becoming disciplined and putting your health, strength and fitness first because it's good for you is a worthier motivation than just to get laid.

[–]mrBatata 1 points1 points [recovered]

Even though I predict something like that in real life this study is shit, don't let yourselves fall into the click bait ffs.

THIS STUDY IS HEAVILY BIASED!!!

160 women surveyed

Sixty of the shirtless men were recruited from the university gym; 130 were students enrolled in psychology courses

The raters were college-age women evaluating the appearance of college-age men

[–]Westernhagen 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The raters were college-age women evaluating the appearance of college-age men

The good news: the further in age you get from college, the fewer the number of strong men there are, and the easier it is to differentiate yourself from all the fat lazy slobs around you.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (7 children)

What’s your PRs man?

Anecdotally, women don’t grow up. Ran into a group over the weekend, got to talking to this late 40s cougar in it. She was aged yet still sexy and attractive. Somewhat recently divorced and going through a version of “finding herself”. Read that as letting her sexuality free after suppressing it for marriage. She was showing me pics of some of the guys she was banging, and they were all hot body men.

I helped her name her newest toy peppermint. It was pink and white. Being a guy that gets it opens up women to share their true deeds with you.

[–]mrBatata 1 point2 points  (6 children)

Pr?

[...] women don't grow up.

I believe so, that's why they get so pissed about their Low SMV.

I'm simply stating that although being buffed will most likely result in a sea of pussy, we as objective thinkers SHOULD NOT base our conclusions out of bad science even if it does support our view.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (5 children)

PR = personal record. What are your lifts?

What makes it bad science to ask 18-22 yr old woman to rate 18-22 yr old men?

[–]mrBatata 1 point2 points  (4 children)

50kg but I'm still new to trp and I haven't dedicated myself as much as I want to to better my physique mostly because I'm really not sure where to start.

The implied claim that [all] women prefer them that way. (i know. i know. water is wet)

And the shit pool of participants, not a random distribution at all. Some scrunny psychology fags against the gym chad is a no brainer.

I would much more like to see a study where they compraste traits like beauty and put them against height or physical structure. And preferably a study where they select more than 250 random people from all ages.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Where to start: StrongLifts 5x5 for your program and Mark Rippetoe form videos on YouTube. You can also hire a personal trainer to help you start if you have the cash flow. I assume college gyms would have access to personal trainers if you ask around if that’s your age.

My numbers are about 3x yours (my numbers are relatively low, less than a year in), and I have the mass to show that strength. I’m no Arnold in his heyday. I am obviously fit.

Do you realize that many studies are done on college age students by professors as that’s what they have easy access to? You’re looking to disqualify the results. You’re not looking to see where these results can be practically applied in your life.

The study answers what young women find attractive in young men based on a few different criteria. The conclusions drawn are not out of line with the results.

Anecdotally, I agree with the conclusions drawn. At the end of the day, women prefer strong men over weak men. End stop.

Give yourself 6-9 more months. You’ll see how different the world treats fit men vs everyone else.

[–]mrBatata 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Thanks for the great input and tips!

Well I did disqualify the results but I should have disqualified the article instead its not really about the conclusion but the way they tested and worded it. Thanks for bringing it up to my attention.

Btw beeing a 24 yo average male what is the best and worst case scenario gains/time? Just so I can manage my expectations and don't beat myself too hard.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

There are many different factors that depend on the foundation you’re building on.

Get your nutrition on point. That’s your foundation for everything.

It’s a marathon, not a sprint. Generally, you’ll see results in the mirror in a month. Your close family and friends will see changes in 2 months. The rest of the world will notice changes in 3 months.

[–]Baloo020 1 point2 points  (0 children)

And as we all know, we always have no shirts on. Even in winter!

[–]ageontargaryarn 1 point2 points  (0 children)

In another news, the Sun continues to rise in the East

[–]ThickDickWarrior89 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Women crazed a big bone til you jam it in em and damage their cervix- bigdickwarrior

[–]aaaasssaaa11 1 point2 points  (0 children)

In other news, water is wet.

[–]LadyofArrows1976 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It’s linear but it has a cap, as a female I know that there’s a point where muscle stops being attractive and starts making you look like a pile of bowling balls. Still, the findings are pretty accurate.

[–]ooo_something_shiny 1 point2 points  (7 children)

Washington post is as beta as you can get

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (6 children)

"Democracy dies in darkness"

So stop telling lies.

[–]ooo_something_shiny 1 point2 points  (0 children)

  1. America is a Republic not a democracy, it uses a democratic voting system. Well, technically it is republic with democratic nuances. My point is, their slogan is used poorly...

I.E.. According to the CIA world FactBook, “a Federal republic [is] a state in which the powers of the central government are restricted and in which the component parts (states, colonies, or provinces) retain a degree of self-government; ultimate sovereign power rests with the voters who chose their governmental representatives…” The page goes on to define the United States as a “Constitution-based federal republic [with a] strong democratic tradition.” In other words, this is the way in which the United States is both a Democracy and a Republic. Learn more about what it means to be a representative democracy at uscis.gov. sovereign power rests with the voters who chose their governmental representatives…” The page goes on to define the United States as a “Constitution-based federal republic [with a] strong democratic tradition.” In other words, this is the way in which the United States is both a Democracy and a Republic. Learn more about what it means to be a representative democracy at uscis.gov.

  1. Washing post uses a two-partly political view and is bias

  2. They spent years covering up for democratic presidents yet as soon as a republican comes they switch to pseudo-lies and bias reporting.

  3. Nothing promotes "darkness" (darkness used to imply that the media sheds light) more then bias reporting that blatantly picks a side politically and financially backs democratic business agenda.

Long story short. Your asking me to not spread lies without knowing what the facts are and using somebody else's opinion and slogan to make a point at the same time believing them blindly and calling me a liar?

Point and case to my first comment.

[–]ooo_something_shiny 1 point2 points  (3 children)

FACT: According to the CIA world FactBook, “a Federal republic [is] a state in which the powers of the central government are restricted and in which the component parts (states, colonies, or provinces) retain a degree of self-government; ultimate sovereign power rests with the voters who chose their governmental representatives…” The page goes on to define the United States as a “Constitution-based federal republic [with a] strong democratic tradition.” In other words, this is the way in which the United States is both a Democracy and a Republic. Learn more about what it means to be a representative democracy at uscis.gov.

The u.s. Is a republic with elements of democracy so even their slogan is a lie. 👍

You follow it blindly and attempted to use it as an argument without knowing facts...

Bringing me to my original comment and case and point made.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Lol dude, I was just saying that the Washington post tells lies and it is ironic that that is it's motto. I think your sarcasm switch was turned off.

But since you brought it up, democracy, as it is used in the present day vernacular, means the same thing as a republic to people a century or two ago, so it really makes no sense to freak out when people say that America is a democracy. What the founding fathers railed against when they spoke of democracy could be more correctly described today as "direct democracy" whereby people go directly to the polling station to vote for individual laws and policies. As we can see in California direct democracy usually lead to pretty poor outcomes.

[–]ooo_something_shiny 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Thank you for clarifying your intent. I was in doubt, I picked the wrong angle.

As far as the topic at hand, It may mean the same thing as a trend or a washed and watered down vernacular, I'll agree to that but we can't just bow down to current floppy cock trends that have been manipulated.

The "federalist papers" (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Federalist_Papers) are the base of our constitution and they use the form of a federalist country but adapt it to a republic. To enforce the concept and add the "for the people by the people" aspect, the democratic aspect was added.

I agree with you that currently it is believed we are a democracy true and true but it's a blended hybrid and not the same. It's a trend. The general public seems to have no concept that this country is based on a federalist system that has been rewritten as a public with democracy weaved in.

Back to the misunderstanding, I appreciate your acknowledgement.

[–]Cenki 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I find physically strong women more attractive too I think.

[–]SpottyDam 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This doesn't apply to manlets though. Manlets are never intimidating even when they are jacked and are a laughing stock to women.

[–]ThickDickWarrior89 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Bad news for the betas... all I can say is- get your lazy fucking ass in the gym!

[–]Guipbtt 0 points1 point  (4 children)

When did lifting become the only way to stay fit?

[–]fromdario[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Certainly not the only way to stay fit. However, it is probably the best way to increase pure strength.

[–] points points

[permanently deleted]

[–]Guipbtt 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Then, the aim is not to get fit...

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Water is wet, the sky is blue, & I'm shredded.

[–]sleepkeeping 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fuck, so much sperg overanalysis in here. Take the gist of it: go to the gym, eat well, and get into shape. You'll be more desirable. In other news, water is wet.

[–]cazzah123 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yeah, but I look strong as fuck too. And I get like 1/50 tinder matches.

Go make a tinder profile with a skinny model as the photo and you’ll get 1/5 matches

[–]fromdario[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Personally, I'd say having lean muscle is the best, strong with low BF.

Just my personal observation from going through a range of diet/workouts and body composition. Found I got way more attention when I was ripped, which I think is because the face looks better/different at lower body fat.

[–]Murbarron 0 points1 point  (2 children)

College aged girls rating college aged guys, what a surprise, who would have thought. The second I saw this badly done survey, I knew it'd end up on here, someone to boost their fragile ego.

[–]Augustuscrassus 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Are you retarded? Women of ALL ages want the same type of man. Ripped like the dudes in the pictures.

Go cry about your dadbod somewhere else

[–]Murbarron 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I rest my case, you're pretty much what's wrong with this sub.

[–]RichJuicer 0 points1 point  (1 child)

"Continue lifting" might not be right conclusion, though. Because loads of swole doesn't signal "strength" to women, it signals "narcissist douche". Women are more into the physiques of Olympic swimmers than those of bodybuilders.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Women are more into the physiques of Olympic swimmers than those of bodybuilders.

First of all, bodybuilders are freaks that no human would ever naturally look like, so it makes sense that women aren't attracted to that. We aren't talking about bodybuilders, we are talking about regular jacked guys. I've seen this "swimmer's body" preference before and I've always thought it was bullshit. If you compare a swimmer's body to a bodybuilder then the swimmer's body will probably win out. If you compare a swimmer's body to a 6'2" 215 pound baseball or football player, it's no contest. And this research supports that.

There was no nuance to these results, he said. Zero of the 160 women surveyed showed a statistical preference for weaker men.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So Eddie Hall must be drowning in pussy.

[–]meaningintragedy -1 points0 points  (4 children)

As a fat powerlifter I like this study. 😀

[–]ayefranco 16 points17 points  (3 children)

Most women don't want fat boys buddy 😂

[–]1rporion 5 points6 points  (2 children)

But the ones that do, really, really do.

Niche markets are underappreciated, you do not want to be someone most women do not dislike, you want to be someone who a few women like be