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Rant/VentingI got cheated on. Don't be like me. (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by [deleted]

I'll try and keep this as short as I can, even though it'll be a fucking novel by the time I'm done.

I've been lurking/posting since 2012 with various accounts and have a pretty decent understanding of RP concepts. I've applied what I've learned here to my personal and professional relationships, with varying degrees of success. But all that stuff went out the window in December when my last relationship started.

When I met my ex, she pandered HARD to try and seem like a unicorn. We liked all the same things, had the same sense of humor, she'd find out what bands I was into and buy me their merch, every week she was buying me Pepe gear and Trump shirts and whatever else she could find, even though I never overtly admitted to being into those things. She knew I was into redpill manosphere stuff as well and was totally cool with it. And somehow I didn't see any of this as a red flag, despite the fact that her friends, family - her entire support network - all of them were John Oliver-watching mainstream liberals. I fell back into old beta goober habits thinking "she likes me for who I am, I don't have to put on some act". Mistake.

In February, her roommate bailed and left her stuck with the remainder of the lease. She called me one morning crying, saying she was gonna lose her apartment and didn't know what to do. She asked me to move in. And instead of stating the obvious, "We haven't been together long enough, can't you just put an ad on craigslist?", I jumped in to save the damsel in distress. I fucking moved in with her. Mistake.

Throughout the relationship, she told me about her ex, who she'd lived with for a year. She told me he was a manipulator, a sociopath, an "abuser", that he kicked her out on a whim and essentially put her out on the street. She made him out to be the biggest scumbag possible. Now, a lot of girls talk shit about their exes for sport, either out of immaturity, or deliberately to cover their tracks after a shady breakup. And they're easy to spot. But I ignored all the signs because I thought she was my unicorn and I believed her. Mistake.

So we moved in together. And immediately we started fighting. It became unavoidable. She sought out conflict. The more I tried to be a "good" boyfriend and treat her well, the more she would nitpick and find things to argue about. She would stage these huge emotional breakdowns every time she couldn't get her way during an argument, and then she'd move the goalpost and change the subject of the argument to "I'm crying and you're not even consoling me". Crazy, circular debates and gaslighting became more and more frequent to the point where it was the norm. A lot of nights we slept in separate rooms. Again, she had me wrapped around her finger and I thought she was the one, so I chalked it up to "well, we're going through a rough spot." I convinced myself that this was all normal somehow. Mistake.

I had an insane, shitty job (telecom firm where nepotism ruled and working hard immediately made you a scapegoat, think 16-30 hour shifts with an ass chewing at the end) and most days I was on the edge of my sanity with how stressed out I was. My ex knew this, she knew I had tons of money saved up, and for months had been telling me, "If you ever need to quit and find a better job, I support whatever will make you happy" So one day I did. Mistake.

I told her the next day, and she broke down crying. I didn't understand why. After all, she'd been encouraging me to quit. So why was she acting like it was the end of the world? She said it was because of her new cat. She adopted this crazy, poorly adjusted shelter cat who ran around the apartment all night yelping and knocking things over. I didn't like him. And she apparently thought that, because I quit my job and was about to be around him more, that I was gonna either start beating him or take him back to the pound. The logic sounded pretty convoluted to me, but I didn't know what to make of it, so I just ignored her and went to bed.

My unemployed period lasted 5 weeks total. Not a big deal at all, I didn't have to go into frugal mode and I didn't run out of money, or even come close. I paid my share of the bills and I spent my days going to job interviews, cleaning the apartment, running errands for her while she was at work, and when she got home I'd take her out and spend time with her. And boom, just like that, we stopped fighting. Things were good for a little while. I briefly felt like I'd stumbled on the secret to not fighting constantly: just do tons of stuff for her constantly like a spineless doormat! MISTAKE.

A week before my new job was supposed to start, she got a new phone and left her old one at home.

A few nights before, we were hanging out watching Netflix when she got a call from a contact named "Michael - MUTED". When the phone rang, she turned white as a ghost and answered with a nervous, shaky "Heyycanicallyoubacklater??". So that struck me as really fucking weird, and I wondered who "Michael" was. She never told me about a Michael. She had no friends or coworkers named Michael.

So now here I was, home alone, staring at her phone sitting on the coffee table. I said fuck it and turned the thing on. It had no passcode. Just like that, I was in. I opened her texts. At the top was a conversation with Michael. I opened it. It was her ex (who isn't a Michael).

The conversation went back months. I read the entire thing. She'd been cheating on me for the entire time we'd been living together. All the nights she'd been claiming to work late, she was going over to his house. Every night that she came home and wanted to go straight to bed, she was tired from getting railed . She was full of another guy's nut. This guy who she told me was a sociopathic piece of shit.

It gets better: most of the things she told me about him, she was telling him about me. She told him I was an animal abuser (because I swatted her cat on the butt when he destroyed our stuff?) that she regretted ever being with me, that I emotionally neglected her, that I was an annoying jobless loser, etc. She complained to him that I woke her up in the morning by getting ready for job interviews. This girl had been telling me, "I love you baby, can't wait to see you, be home soon" and in the same breath telling him, "ugh fuckin Nick still hasn't found a job". The deception went pretty deep.

I read the entire conversation, screenshotted everything, emailed it to myself, removed all traces of my snooping, turned the phone off, and instead of wasting one minute moping or feeling sorry for myself, I started planning my escape.

Three weeks after my new job started, I got a Friday off randomly. That morning she went to work, and I immediately began packing up my things. Moved it all to my new place. She came home to a half empty apartment, and I was waiting for her.

She walked in, noticed the tv and entertainment system were gone, sat down on the floor with a dazed look on her face, and asked me what was going on. I told her I was moving out and breaking up with her. She really didn't want to see me go, and there was a lot of crying. I didn't even bring up the cheating, I just left.

It wasn't until three days later when I came home to get the last of my things, and found her ex's stuff in the apartment, that I actually brought it up. She apologized profusely, and sent me three page-long texts saying she made a huge mistake, that her ex had weaseled his way back into her life, yada yada. I told her "good luck with everything", turned my keys in, and left it at that.

This was a couple months back. I've basically retreated into full monk mode to try and psychologically recoup. They're now back together, they live together, and they work together. Pretty insane, but that's how the cookie crumbles I guess.

To briefly recap, moving forward from this experience, here are some hard lessons I learned:

  1. AWALT
  2. Don't fall for a plate
  3. If a girl's pursuing you super hard, something is probably wrong with her
  4. If a girl has everything in common with you, she's pandering - there are no unicorns.
  5. Pay. Attention. To. Red. Flags.
  6. Don't let a woman's love make you think it's ok to stop working on yourself. Don't fall into old habits.
  7. Don't lose frame. Don't cave. Don't be a doormat.
  8. Never move in with someone you just started dating
  9. Quitting your job is poison to women. They will lose all attraction.
  10. Trust your gut if you think she's cheating - all women are capable of cheating
  11. If she badmouths her exes, she'll badmouth you
  12. Women are pragmatic - they will lie and deceive as long as it produces a net benefit. Even when caught in a giant lie, they will continue to lie, if the lie is to their benefit. Loyalty is not a component of the female psyche.

Edit: grammar


[–]mr-satan 192 points193 points  (7 children)

"She knew I was into redpill manosphere stuff as well"

Never ever speak to a woman about this. Never.

Do you talk to the deer about how you hunt them before you go out to the woods?

[–]AdamNJH 27 points28 points  (4 children)

Yep i think that was his biggest mistake made and OP does not recognise it.

[–]RealityTastesGreat 4 points5 points  (3 children)

how specifically do you think talking about redpill contributed to OP's downfall in this situation

[–]xeneize93 12 points13 points  (0 children)

If you find out a girl is an undercover slut, you'd start to treat her differently. Same with this

[–]Macheako[🍰] 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Talk about whatever the fuck you want. This is the stupidest thing Ive ever heard. DEER DONT FUCKIN TALK you morons.

Yea, dont sit around saying women are evil harpees, but even women are interested in female nature.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

why do people do this? WHat do you expect to gain from telling her you are into this? You think she will be impressed? Sad...

SHOW! DONT TELL.

[–]11006985 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's an apt way to put it

[–]blass_aster 1 points1 points [recovered]

You said you knew trp. How did all of your lessons go out the window like this? It seems so common for people to forget everything they learned. Did you just rationalize all the red flags?

[–]Endorsed ContributorThotwrecker 114 points115 points  (4 children)

If knowing TRP allowed you to apply it in real world situations, the world would be a different place. Many guys do understand this kind of shit conceptually, whether through TRP or through some masculine culture that tends to stray on the RP side. It doesn't help them, because the problem wasn't a lack of knowledge.

On the flip side, you have girls who have never intellectualized or logically grasped any of this shit. But they know it; it's a part of them, and they have been applying it to get what they want from the age of 13.

No wonder a 20 something is like OP's ho is going to wipe her ass with his beta self, and throw him to the curb. She is essentially Mayweather fighting a boxing nerd who knows all the stats. She can't read, she doesn't know theory, but she knows the game and she's had decades of practice.

Many tales of beta demise and divorce rape begin with this same kind of overconfidence. The "I read TRP so I can't be cucked" confidence.

[–]CQC3 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Experience itself is the actualization of knowledge. In meditation the concept of insight is much like that. You see something over, and over, and over and over again, until at one point it just clicks and something inside of you shifts what seems like permanently. You are changed. How you act now is in line with that change without you even trying, it is now part of your reality.

Reading TRP will never do this for you, only experience will. Words are like sign posts that can send you in the right direction, but they will never do the walking for you. Walking is wordless, thoughtless, empty. The action is what matters, not the concept.

Sounds like OP did a lot of walking in his post, and maybe he learned his lesson fully or partway I don't know, but he definitely didn't come out empty handed. He saw some shit first hand, which is way more effective than reading about it, though I don't recommend you seek his particular situation out.

Only by detaching yourself and your expectations from the thing you are observing can you really begin to see it for what it is. Women are like that, love em, hate em, whatever. In a situation like this, many guys are lost and still fight some part of them that tries to reinterpret the situation to save themselves from the realization that women CAN be like that. Sometimes they can be similar but less worse, or more, but it is there, along with other things.

[–]Ibanezguitarrocks 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I get the sentiment but I'm confused by the Mayweather analogy where you say he can't read and doesn't know theory but knows the game and has had plenty of practice. Many other boxers out there that fit this description and they're no where near his stature.

When I first heard him say the words I doubted it, but today I wouldn't have a problem calling him one of the best boxers in history. Not just his skill IN the ring but the culmination of all his decisions that shot him to the top in record setting earnings and promotion while maintaining his health.

He's much more then a lot of people give him credit for because they don't like him.

[–]Endorsed ContributorThotwrecker 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Mayweather = genetic monstronsity + decades of training and being reinforced mentally as being the highest value. Boxing nerd = tons of knowledge, perhaps more knowedge of physiological theory, exercise science, boxing statistics, technical terms.

Mayweather is the super hot girl. Boxing nerd is the beta. Boxing nerd is smarter and more knowledgable. Mayweather will thrash him in his environment. Boxing nerd could beat Mayweather on the SATs, but the ring is Mayweather's element. Manipulating men and using feminine wiles to get what she wants is the hot girl's element.

Do you really not see the analogy?

And how the fuck does it matter if other boxers don't fit his stature, any of them could knock out the boxing nerd. Why are you taking a point about knowledge versus instinct / practice and making it about "this boxer is better than that". Who gives a shit if he's the best boxer or not, I'm not arguing that, I'm saying he'll stomp a nerd in the ring as hard as a hot girl will stomp a beta. Which boxer I picked to make my point is completely irrelevant.

[–]Ibanezguitarrocks 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I happen to be a fan so it stuck out. If it were someone else I didn't care for or an unknown I probably wouldn't have taken it so literally.

I do understand it more after rereading it. I still have a bit of contention with it but it's not worth getting into. It served it's intended purpose I just misread it the first time over. I've been known to overthink the simple at times.

[–]resolutions316 263 points264 points  (10 children)

The more you feel you know a thing, the more you leave yourself open to ignoring the basics.

Everyone will have this moment. Multiple times. I saw my BJJ instructor - huge dude, been rolling his entire life - get caught in a rookies arm bar.

It happens. You nod, learn the lesson, smile, then choke that fucking kid out next round.

This has been one of the better posts I've read on TRP. Why? Lessons fucking learned, not theory. I appreciate it.

[–]imn0tg00d 111 points112 points  (5 children)

The number one swordsman in the world doesnt fear the number two swordsman. He fears the blade held by the untrained man.

[–]P4_Brotagonist 47 points48 points  (1 child)

Absolutely. When you know the best ways to do things, you know what to look for and expect in other skilled peers. The problem with untrained people or novices is that they act erratically in ways you wouldn't anticipate under the thought of "no one would be dumb enough to do x".

[–]beginner_ 28 points29 points  (0 children)

Applies to playing poker very well.

[–]le_wolfe 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Coz the untrained man doesn't give two shits about the god damned rules.

[–]Jkarl1 7 points8 points  (1 child)

That's why it is so hard to be with someone that has a personality disorder like BPD or NPD, because their neural programming pathways are in complete disarray and their actions becomes almost "alien" like. You can never seem to justify their actions because they don't reflect that of a normal human being. This is why many men get PTSD after a relationship like this. The thing to remember is it's not the mans fault of the woman's behavior and nothing he could have done would make her act differently.

[–]Martel_732_Tours 22 points23 points  (0 children)

There's a difference between being caught in a one off arm bar and being suckered into acting like a cuck for months on end.

[–]PeanutFlavor 3 points4 points  (2 children)

This. Too much theory, not enough field reporting.

[–]resolutions316 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Especially negative field reports, that show lessons learned.

"Smart people learn from their mistakes; geniuses learn from the mistakes of others."

[–]Flintblood 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We need a sticky post dedicated to "lessons learned" or "field reports: lessons learned"

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

Rationalization for sure, cognitive dissonance also. I hadn't had an LTR in 3 years and I wanted things to work with this chick because she seemed "different". There were many things I mentally tuned out.

[–]sigma272 69 points70 points  (2 children)

I know this feel, fam. The male hamster is real and spins up to warp speed at "different" girls.

[–]Invisible_Stud 13 points14 points  (1 child)

YES! that's what it's called! I've been looking for a way to describe how I was with my exs. My hamstering went full mach 5 on a few.

[–]metalhead4 9 points10 points  (0 children)

The biological drive for access to easy pussy.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (0 children)

To follow up, did you feel like deep down the relationship not working would be a personal failure, and perhaps that allowed you to look past these signs?

[–]SaggyT 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I totally understand you man! I feel that I have an understanding of RP but I know that in practice it's a whole different thing. I know for a fact that this kind of situation that you just described in this post, is waiting to happen for me

Thank you for sharing your story, it shows the reality of the situation

[–]ECoast_Man 0 points1 point  (0 children)

and then she'd move the goalpost and change the subject of the argument to "I'm crying and you're not even consoling me".

Fuck, been there. I usually do the, "I'm going out to give you time to think about this" routine - like you would do to a teenager, plus I need to think things through myself and these types fucking hate it when you do that.

As for the rest, dude if you got out of that situation as you described with the stoic demeanor and just did it without throwing a shit fit then you are miles ahead of most dudes I know. Most guys I know would lose their fucking minds if they discovered this information rather than calmly and cooly ending it and moving out. Good for you.

[–]Radkin007 23 points24 points  (1 child)

"She likes me for who I am, I don't have to put on some act."

This is where you began to fail. She fell for who you were acting as but in reality that was the fake you. Turn that person into the real you and don't act it out. You were, "faking it till you make it." And you made it then stopped doing what you had to to keep it. Yes all those things are right about women however you need to look into you man.

[–]whuttupfoo 17 points18 points  (6 children)

There aren’t enough postings on here about BPD which this girl seems to have. The way she bought him merch from his favorite bands and Pepe shirts gave that one away. Seems like he fell for the manipulation all too easily.

This was a woman who knew what she was doing from the get go. This stuff doesn’t really get taught on this subreddit, you’ve gotta read the books if you want to protect yourself from manipulative behavior.

[–]un-supervised-savage 8 points9 points  (4 children)

NPD and BPD always put their SO interests on pedestals. It's called love bombing. It is not normal.

[–]Frdl 0 points1 point  (3 children)

There's also no shame in falling for their trap. It's what they do. Same thing happened to me - minus the cheating although likely given the personality disorder - and you learn from it. You can read all the theory you want here, but you need to experience some things to really learn.

[–]un-supervised-savage 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Seen it all. It's funny how exact their techniques are. It makes sense the techniques follow inline with the disorder. There's different levels of the disorder.

They'll love bomb you till you're hooked. Then when they see no challenge and you're not holding frame they'll try to walk all over you. Tons of shit tests. Then more shit tests beyond what you've ever seen before. If the shit tests don't work, Then they'll do everything in their power to destroy your self esteem to break you down to get what they want. They'll cleverly try to separate you from your friends and support system. Don't ever try to give any compromise, that won't work, the goal post will never stop moving backwards. As you have fights with them they will gaslight the shit out of you about how they never did anything wrong, that didn't happen, and your misremembering. Document all convo's phone calls and fights in person, for your own mental health. Massive projection will ensue, literally every BS thing they do to you they will accuse you of, usually before you accuse them. This is because they have showed you how unpleasant it is to question their character. Stand your ground. When you try to leave they'll hit you with the love triangle. Best way to handle that BS is to send her a pic of you making out with someone just as hot as her, like I did : p. You will eventually will decide the pussy isn't worth the drama and leave...Hold on, it gets worse! Then you're introduced to the flying monkeys. Hopefully you were smart enough to not give her any dirt overly personal stuff on you because she'll call your boss and tell them or tell all your friends. Remember sociopathy is a major part of NPD. She'll do everything to get your friends against you. They're very good at this because they're very beautiful and charming.

The hotter the woman the greater chance she's NPD. Beware! This isn't hyperbole in the least. It's real. They don't call them Lucifers daughters for no reason.

[–]Frdl 0 points1 point  (1 child)

It's not hyperbole. It's literally the same story repeated ad nauseam, as if everyone had dated my ex girlfriend at some point.

[–]un-supervised-savage 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It never ceases to amaze me how similar these types of women are.

[–]rossiFan 4 points5 points  (0 children)

By the same token: we're all fallible. Even you. It important to stay in a sort of red pill fellowship and not let your guard down.

[–]antihostile 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Love isn't just deaf, dumb and blind, it's also incredibly stupid.

[–]jackandjill22 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Interesting. Yea, good point.

[–]brinkleybuzz 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Anybody can know trp. It takes an iron frame and sometimes a cold heart to actually practice trp when faced with the emotional manipulations of a woman.

[–]washington_breadstix 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Others are giving you all kinds of metaphors about swordsmen and shit, but I think it's just because social interaction and human relationships are hard to capture in "theories." You can read all the RP posts you want, but interacting with real humans is always going to have that extra emotional/instinctual dimension that theory can't give you. He probably rationalized the red flags because something about the context made him think they were exceptional cases.

[–]alltrueism 85 points86 points  (4 children)

I commend you on your escape man. I didn't live with my ex, but about 6 months into our relationship, I caught her crossing boundaries with her previous ex via messanger. (she left her login on my tablet so I could read everything in real time)

I know I should have ghosted her then, but I ended up confronting her. Same situation, "he was on drugs and treated me like shit," "past me loved past him but I have you now," and "I was just suprised he was being so nice to me and I never got closure."

Long story, but after a full transparency trial I kind of started trusting her again. However, 3 months later she started acting shady and flaky. One morning she stayed over I wake up and check her phone to see she sent some guy, that she trickle truthed earlier that week, a picture of her ass. It was a modeling shot but I hadn't even seen it yet. I check a correspondence between her and a female friend, and it turns out she not only slept with her ex, the guy she swore to cut out of her life to maintain our relationship, but also slept with this new guy after being rejected by her ex again.

Needless to say, I was my own worse enemy through out this process. Checking our text correspondence and comparing them to all the screen shots of text that incriminated her.

It's been about 8 months now and I still remember everything, while she has rationalized everything and acts like I broke up with her. Worst of all I have to see her weekly at work. So yeah, never shit where you eat when it comes to LTR.

[–]askmrcia 14 points15 points  (1 child)

It truly amazes me with all the apps we have now that people will get caught because they leave their phones/tablets on.

You could easily mute and hide text messaging threads and never get caught with actual proof.

And that's the scary thing. If the girl you or op was with with had any ounce of intelligence you guys would never know. I mean I'm sure your gut would tell you something is up, but you would want actual proof.

[–]alltrueism 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That was my problem. I gave her a 2nd chance, so when she started acting shady, I made it my mission to know what my gut already told me. She was pretty dumb about it, and only changed her tactic when she got caught by switching to text and changing the name of her ex in her contacts. It was the exchange between her "poly" female friend that revealed all the lies and grit of the matter.

[–][deleted] 105 points106 points  (21 children)

Yea, every guy who cracks his girls Iphone is InstaRedPilled. If it isn't the cheating, its the orbiters and the way they freely discuss how they feel about you.

Best if they are referring to you as That Asshole

[–]TunedtoPerfection 48 points49 points  (14 children)

Honestly You don't even have to get into the phone. When women start cheating their attitude changes pretty drastically. It's usually when they start asking you to stop your mission because "your good enough." That is the hampster beginning to spin the wheel that it's your fault she cheated, not hers.

[–]RedPillHanSolo 22 points23 points  (0 children)

LMAO, just think about it. She tries make it your fault that she cheated in the past by telling you to stop your mission some time in the future. Hamster is so powerful, it shuffles time of events.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (3 children)

Biggest tell I see nowadays is nontransparency and shady shit with the phone. Even a consistent screen tilt away is enough to ping the spidey sense.

One of closest friends is living with a girl that does this shit. She also has a history of cheating she admits to. I hope if it is happening that he finds out sooner rather than later. I think he knows and purposefully doesn't look into anything or think very much. When I see her do this subtly obvious shit, it makes my blood boil for him.

[–]TunedtoPerfection 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Well the phone is the ultimate bait. If you stress over it, your considered "needy and overprotective." But, people do very shady shit with their phones. Now a days with fingerprint required access, etc it's very low risk to fuck around on a phone.

[–]kasper138 11 points12 points  (2 children)

It's even easier than that. All women cheat. All of them. You can either be the spider or the fly.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

As RP as your statement sounds, and as much as I recognize the vile nature of the female, it's simply untrue that all women cheat.

[–]kasper138 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's untrue that you will never be struck by lightening but I'll bet a large sum of money that you never will be.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 5 points6 points  (5 children)

Correct, though that attitude change already happens after the honeymoon phase. So hypothetically the cheating could start as soon as 2-3 months. You will find very few women who aren't fucked up, enabled and pissed off for some reason to pull shit like this.

I'm just curious what will happen when generations upon generations of guys learn to cope with this by not giving a shit. Where would women get their drama?

[–]jdxrs 2 points3 points  (4 children)

They vast majority of men will join in on the drama. It'll bleed over

[–]1PantsonFire1234 6 points7 points  (3 children)

Drama is only possible when both parties give a shit. When men figure out that women just fuck around and never commit, there can be no relationship. Without it there's no drama.

[–]Pope_Lucious 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Where there is pussy, there will always be thirsty simps. It is axiomatic.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 9 points10 points  (0 children)

The beta condition is reinforced by Hollywood romance, the normalization of needing a 'relationship' status and the lie that women are wonderful and don't cheat. When these pillars implode it will be significantly more difficult for Beta Billy to rationalize his undying love for his gangbanged princess.

[–]SovereignSoul76 22 points23 points  (3 children)

Bonus points if the guy she's banging only texts your princess things like "1:02 AM: Whatchu doin? Bring that pussy over here" and treats her like a fuck-doll.

Better than sipping a cup of Columbian dark roast coffee in an ice bath. Truth so strong, make you wanna slap yo momma!

[–]Jkarl1 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Yea, this is a good tactic with women who practice self hate...like women who have BPD. These women feel they are not deserving of a good man and love to be disciplined and shamed by an abusive person because it realigns with their childhood familiar feelings of being abused or neglected.

This is true with fatherless women or ones who experiences some type of early sexual trauma.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Fun fact I learned recently. Dark roasts actually contain less caffeine than regular coffee.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Since our society is producing more and more mentally fucked up women. Be prepared to get this in spades. I don't even mind orbitter and all that shit. But you will find plan B,C,D,E,F,G all on that phone and she'll be sexual with every single one of them. Because that's the only way she can keep their attention.

[–]Redpillandrew 4 points5 points  (0 children)

the orbiters at best - ALL THE TIME. So true

[–]Red_Faust 55 points56 points  (31 children)

Similar to a situation of mine, minus the cheating and badmouthing (that I know of).

Instead of that, I saw decreasing compliance, increasing nagging and above all a total and absolute lack of listening, understanding or action taking when discussing the points where I was dissatisfied with their behavior.

In fact, I'd change 8 to "Never move in with someone". For me, cohabitation has been the doom of two great relationships with two great girls.

Because when you have downs, and everybody has them, you can't go to your man-cave to lick your wounds, since she's there all the time. So she sees you at your weak spots and that decreases her attraction (one particularly introspective LTR was able to even verbalize this, which was rather cool as an alarm/warning so that I could get back on track).

Besides, if they're at your place you can't kick them out to de-escalate commitment. If you kick her out of your place they understand it as an immediate breakup (this is a good call on her part, as we should do the same if she de-escalated sex for instance, but it leaves you with no means of de-escalating commitment as a response to undesirable behavior).

For me, cohabitation turned two of the greatest girls I've been with (who apart from that never did anything evil to me or anyone else that I know of), into nagging, insufferable bitches.

Proof is that when the cohabitation (and the LTRs) ended, I have been able to stay friends with both of them, since deep down they're good people (AFAIK of course, but have seen plenty of evidence of it, and none to the contrary, neither before, during of after the LTRs).

As Chase Amante says, before the point of commitment girls feel fear, the fear of losing you. After the point of commitment they feel frustration, the feeling that you're not perfect and everything they may dream about a man.

So when you spend so much time with them, the frustration builds up way, way quicker, and when they step over your boundaries and you reassert them, it explodes big time.

So, no more cohabitation for me. It's on the list of the big no-nos just after marriage.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (6 children)

But you can de-escalate commitment in a cohabitation situation. It just involves being out of the house more with your own social life and hobbies and withdrawing attention when at home. Difficult to do in an apartment though when there really aren't projects to work on or more space to disappear into.

And you're right. When you you're living with a woman your freedom to be down is completely incapacitated otherwise you lose attraction points. You must keep that shit to yourself and always remain a rock in her presence.

[–]un-supervised-savage 2 points3 points  (2 children)

That's what the garage and project cars are for. Retreat to the garage when you feel down and accomplish something anything with your car or some other project. You'll feel better and return gloriously back to your house.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Like I said, difficult to do with an apartment.

[–]un-supervised-savage 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Usually you can rent a separate garage with apartments.

[–]Red_Faust 0 points1 point  (2 children)

This is good advice, and to some extent this is what I tried to do: spend some time outside the house, blowing some steam in other activities (mainly lifting), meeting friends and so on.

In the last LTR, as we both worked from home, and thus spent a lot of time here, it was just a little bit effective. But yes, it's useful advice.

Yes, you need to be a rock in the presence of your woman close to 100% of the time. It's much easier when you see her 2-4 days a week and the rest of the time you can relax.

The thing about cohabitation is that, apart from making this more difficult, I don't see many benefits to it (for me). As long as I can afford it, I'm way happier living on my own, and managing the LTR it's way easier.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Ouch. Working from home, together, yikes. I don't live with anyone but when I utilize my work from home days I still get out to a coffee shop. Bonus is you can meet women in trendy coffee joints and create dread.

I like not associating home with work unless I'm hungover. Is there a reason you physically had to be at home to do the job? All that time together for sure dries panties.

[–]Red_Faust 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm building my own business from scratch.

In hindsight, I should have gone to work elsewhere, like a coworking space, or a library, or any other place with wifi. As you've said going to a starbucks and meeting girls there would have been best :)

Oh well no use crying for the spilled milk.

Thanks for your insightful comments shinola_

[–]Endorsed ContributorJamesSkepp 10 points11 points  (3 children)

As Chase Amante says, before the point of commitment girls feel fear, the fear of losing you. After the point of commitment they feel frustration, the feeling that you're not perfect and everything they may dream about a man.

This is one of the reasons I'm against marriage. She knows that...

you're not perfect and everything they may dream about a man.

...and yet she decides to be with you. There are two explanations - the first on is that she's a realist/"in love"/"not bothered by small imperfections" etc., the second one is that she make's a deliberate sacrifice for the sake of gaining something else.

The first reason is purely BP fantasy. Hypergamy is always on, and will not be "turned off" act of marrying, so she's not doing it for you as she cannot control it. This leaves the second option as the answer - she's doing it for herself. Therefore you're being conned, even if not deliberately (she might even believe the BP stuff about "working it out" and so on), the end result is the same. She pretends to be the "good wife" while in fact making a strategic choice to exercise her hypergamy in a more hidden way (she must hide the "trickle truth" from others).

I can't believe she doesn't know or at least suspects that you will turn out not to be "the perfect man" and that she will desire other men just as she desires them now. Therefore I'm almost certain that from a woman's standpoint, by default (as in premeditated, conscious, deliberate, with full knowledge), marriage is based on lying to the man she marries.

I'm also pretty sure that this "good wife act" is proportional to time spent together and the disappointment she feels when she finds out how human and not superman are you. Small stuff first, perhaps even with good intentions, that slowly erodes the her honesty and creates more and more hamster rationalizations that she can cheat ("i did/sacrificed so much for marriage/him, now it's my time to have some reward").

[–]Red_Faust 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Very insightful reply JamesSkepp, here's my take on this:

I can't believe she doesn't know or at least suspects that you will turn out not to be "the perfect man" and that she will desire other men just as she desires them now. Therefore I'm almost certain that from a woman's standpoint, by default (as in premeditated, conscious, deliberate, with full knowledge), marriage is based on lying to the man she marries.

From what I have seen, there are many women who are actually deluded when they meet a new guy they like. They become absurdly infatuated with him, to the point of not seeing his faults.

This is highly irrational, but we all know that rationality is not their forte.

So they put the guy in a pedestal and when they see the chinks in the shining armor they become disappointed and start changing their behavior.

I think some girls masquerade this, but some of the girls are actually really infatuated with their almost-perfect man. Cohabitation, or spending a huge deal of time with them, only causes her to see your imperfections earlier.

Also think that when we are trained men (I've been more than a decade learning and applying seduction and female psychology, and I take care of my body), we literally shine among a crowd of subpar males (and even more so the older you are, since the majority of the 40+ crowd of men are basically out of the game). We are trained to say/do the right thing at the right time, to be unreactive and collected, and to give her the right mix of emotions and hardcore sex.

Now, each of us might do this better or worse, I don't claim to be the perfect lover at all. What I'm saying is that it's similar as if an expert escort tried to seduce you using all her feminine charms, it would be so different compared to the average entitled bratty girl that just because of that, even if she ain't perfect, you would immediately place her in another category.

So yes, I think some girls get really infatuated with some men, I don't think this is a farce in all cases. How do you tell which is which? For me one sign is their behavior when their attraction fades out. If they stay cold but polite, and try to remain friends, it's a sign that somehow they appreciate you but want to move to greener pastures. If they explode in fits of rage and leave a trail of destruction on their way out, it's a sign they had an agenda and they are wildly enraged because they didn't get what they wanted.

Of course it's better to calibrate it at the beginning. I am always on the lookout for little signs like their goals, expectations, how they treat me when I say/do something a little beta (this is a funny test to do if you don't care that much for them), and their behavior when they are out of control, like angry/sad for something external, or a little tipsy.

[–]Endorsed ContributorJamesSkepp 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think some girls get really infatuated with some men, I don't think this is a farce in all cases.

I agree, they do get infatuated. What I meant is that they get infatuated by his pre-"tied down" image. It's their own version of oneitis.

I am always on the lookout for little signs like their goals, expectations,

I do this also, as proactive search for "my Red Flags" (ask about goals in vague way, anything about any form of "stability" signals that I'm being tested for bf/provider material. Exception is - she's starting her own business or pro-careeer, but that has it's implications too). A word of caution tho: don't use this to obviously b/c you'll show your cards and she'll know what you look for. I met a few girls that we're even able to anticipate what answers I would want to hear, simply b/c I communicated a bit too much about who I am non-sexually.

[–]Redpillandrew 9 points10 points  (1 child)

no more cohabitation for you. Then how will you handle fatherhood? Are you interested in having children?

[–]Red_Faust 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I have no interest in having children. As I mentioned in another answer, as I am 40, this is unlikely to change in the future. If and when that happens, I'd try to set up a resilient family arrangement, or through a surrogate mother.

[–]arrayay 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Why have a man cave when you can have a castle?

[–]Red_Faust 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This. I won't invite another girl to move in so that she can occupy most of the space and I have to retreat to my safe zone in my own home.

I'm stealing it: "why have a man cave when I can have a castle?"

[–]TRebirthP 0 points1 point  (10 children)

How are you able to be friends with them after they put you through BS in the relationship? Don't you think it's a nasty sort of manipulation, even if it's subconscious, to treat you like crap in the relationship and then once they are out of the situation they don't want to be in to start being "nice" again?

[–]Red_Faust 1 point2 points  (9 children)

I don't blame women for being women. As I don't blame my cat for occasionally biting me when playing. It's in their nature and to a great extent they can't help it.

There's a difference between getting carried away by their instincts and having an agenda. Decades ago, when I was a young Average Frustrated Chump, I had a GF who moved in because she was thrown out of her parents'. She broke up with me not long after, and tried to stay there, living rent-free and going out many nights to meet other boys. She was absurdly nagging and even threatened me. Even blue pilled me saw the dangers of that situation and threw her out and haven't spoken to her even since.

Not every girl is a good-hearted compassionate person. And not every girl is a manipulative scheming machiavellian cold-hearted bitch. There's a whole spectrum and you can calibrate.

Finally, I try to make happy all the women in my life, and try my best to not stay bitter with them, both individually and their whole gender. The only two rules are 1) their happiness cannot come to my detriment and 2) the interaction shall be balanced, no way I'm gonna be a provider or - god forbid - an orbiter.

[–]xeneize93 4 points5 points  (3 children)

my sister who is a really nice person, extremely caring, raised by my dad as a single parent, and very beautiful has never cheated to my knowledge but will drop a guy very quickly once a better one comes along and it gets worse once the guy realizes that he's losing her and see all the needy and desperation to keep her around

[–]Red_Faust 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Exactly. Thanks for the comment, this is what I meant.

Our basic strategy as reality-enlightened men is to spark and maintain attraction from the girls we like (be them ONS, MLTRs or LTRs), and the easiest way is to accept this nature of theirs, and structure our life, thoughts and actions to our benefit, maximizing the chances of them staying attracted to us, and minimizing the chances of them seeing our weak spots which make their attraction fade out.

Every time you pass a commitment point - exclusivity, cohabitation, marriage - you make it harder on yourself. And that's why you have to set up a commitment limit, not only for your benefit, but also for hers too.

[–]xeneize93 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I learned alot from her alone and then found this subreddit. The most important thing for me is frame. Thats my golden rule, girls will come and go regardless and at the end there isn't much you can do but focus on yourself and keep your frame. I'm still a nice guy but I keep my frame cause being needy and stuff is fucking embarrassing and you can't control anyone. Girls respect that and some stay, some don't either way I try to not care and just focus on me

[–]TRebirthP 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Not every girl is a good-hearted compassionate person. And not every girl is a manipulative scheming machiavellian cold-hearted bitch. There's a whole spectrum and you can calibrate.

Why does this difference matter when, in the end, even the most compassionate women can wreck havoc on a man's life and even the most heartless bitch can do good? Shouldn't we always just look at the actions in the present? Also, how can you calibrate?

I don't blame women for being women. ... I try to make happy all the women in my life, and try my best to not stay bitter with them, both individually and their whole gender.

Do you think this instinct makes you give women more leeway than they deserve or more than you would give a man? To draw an analogy, if a man screwed you over in a business deal and stole or cost you $1,000 or $10,000 would you just go "Ah, it's in a man's competitive and providing nature to go after money" and be willing to be friends with them afterward?

[–]Red_Faust 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Why does this difference matter when, in the end, even the most compassionate women can wreck havoc on a man's life

It does matter a lot. Good natured people, when getting carried away by instincts, usually try to fix things afterwards.

Of course the proper course of action is to structure a life (a home, a business) unassailable by other people, be them good hearted or not. Thus, no more cohabitation (my original point).

if a man screwed you over in a business deal and stole or cost you $1,000 or $10,000 would you just go "Ah, it's in a man's competitive and providing nature to go after money" and be willing to be friends with them afterward?

This in an invalid analogy and I'm afraid you're using it to attack my points. I don't quarrel on the internet, so I will answer this one and nothing else if you insist on using rhetoric.

Men's instincts tend towards aggression. If some business partner cheats me on some money, this is not aggression instinct, this is a calculated manoeuver. This would not be forgivable.

If a friend of mine got into a fit of rage and almost physical, say yelling and pushing, over some issue important to him, for instance when drunk, then after he calms down or sobers up he says sorry and tries to amend things, that would be his instincts taking control. I would scold him for his lack of control but I would not instantly kick him out of my life (though I'd take care to not get into the same situation again).

Each person has to set up his own boundaries. Mine happen to be that when people get carried away I try to understand, as long as it doesn't harm me in any way or form. You set yours.

You can also view people as inherently evil, and women as machiavellian machines constantly plotting for your doom, and be bitter and not enjoy life. All of those are choices.

[–]TRebirthP 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Of course the proper course of action is to structure a life (a home, a business) unassailable by other people, be them good hearted or not. Thus, no more cohabitation (my original point).

I understand and agree with what you are saying here. There's no reason to take unnecessary risks and sometimes cohabitation can be just as risky legally as marriage in addition to the female tendency to get comfortable, complacent and ungrateful once they think they have you.

This in an invalid analogy and I'm afraid you're using it to attack my points. I don't quarrel on the internet, so I will answer this one and nothing else if you insist on using rhetoric.

It's fine if you think my reasoning is wrong, but I assure you my intentions are genuinely to get at the truth of the issue rather than being argumentative or confrontational. In fact, I think you'd agree I'm not using rhetoric since you later went on to define men's instincts as being aggression which means we have a difference in premises. I don't agree with your premise that a male's instinct is aggression. I think that's the stereotypical trait most associated with masculinity. I think male's also have paternal or provider instincts. These instincts are what create beta bux and what makes BP conditioning especially sticky to the male mind. It preys and exploits something inside all of us to different degrees.

As for your drunken anger analogy, I think that's an invalid analogy The most obvious reason is because you are using an external substance that literally changes brain functioning which puts it in a category quite distinct from how a person chooses to act under no influence. Beyond that though, you are talking about a singular moment of emotion. When it comes to the nagging and all the other behaviors that lead to that kind of break up, they are often daily or even hourly occurrences. That means there's a lot more willfulness and many more choices and thus room to NOT do the "bad" behavior. Lastly, there is an objective in mind subconsciously or consciously: A break up. That's why I believe my analogy works well. Just like how the woman wants to profit freedom or availability to a better mate via a break up so too does the man in my example employ bad behavior to profit monetarily. And both, if they are good people as you define it, will try and patch things up but only AFTER they've gotten the thing they want and they will try to make it up for it via niceness or friendship rather than the thing they were willing to do bad as in sex/relationships or money/business respectively.

Given all that, I struggle to see why it's forgivable or why friendship would be desirable. And while we can just chalk it up to us just drawing different boundaries I genuinely struggle with this issue and it causes me a lot of suffering. I'm interested in expanding my thinking when it comes to this problem and I'd like to get anew perspective on it that allows me to be happier and also have boundaries I am more secure in.

[–]Red_Faust 0 points1 point  (1 child)

It's fine if you think my reasoning is wrong, but I assure you my intentions are genuinely to get at the truth of the issue rather than being argumentative or confrontational.

Hey thanks TRebirthP. As of lately I see a lot of people in TRP with the only goal of out-alpha the guy before, so I am kind of wary when I see a barrage of questions. My mistake.

you are talking about a singular moment of emotion. When it comes to the nagging and all the other behaviors that lead to that kind of break up, they are often daily or even hourly occurrences. That means there's a lot more willfulness and many more choices and thus room to NOT do the "bad" behavior.

Yeah, I see your point. I've always said that it's way easier to stop doing something than to do something, e.g. it's way easier to not eat this chocolate bar right now than to go to the gym and do cardio.

From what I've seen, women in a highly emotional state are not like this. They simply can't refrain from acting on their impulses the way we men do (except, perhaps, our sexual impulses).

Yesterday I was talking to a friend of mine (no romantic feelings involved whatsoever) who dumps all her emotions on guys through whatsapp, which repels them. I was telling her to keep the messages short, to the point, devoid of bad vibes and, if possible, relating to stuff the guy likes. Impossible, they can't help themselves from acting on her emotions even when it's detrimental to them.

Just like how the woman wants to profit freedom or availability to a better mate via a break up so too does the man in my example employ bad behavior to profit monetarily.

This might be correct. I don't know if there were other better dudes in the picture, but the loss of attraction could make them think it was the case.

Other than that, in the most recent example, I fail to see what benefits could she reap from breaking up. But there must be, or else they wouldn't do it.

they will try to make it up for it via niceness or friendship rather than the thing they were willing to do bad as in sex/relationships

This hit home. I told my most recent LTR, in no unspecific terms, what boundaries had she crossed and what would be an acceptable behavior for me, and she had the choice either to change her behavior or leave.

She said she wanted to change her behavior. Her actions reflected the contrary. She preferred to leave and break up than to change her ways. Oh well.

I'm interested in expanding my thinking when it comes to this problem and I'd like to get anew perspective on it that allows me to be happier and also have boundaries I am more secure in.

I'm at this point as well. I do a lot of vetting and screening before any kind of LTR, or even MLTR, can take place. But some issues can slip through the cracks.

The thing is, you can't give feedback to a girl. Like, in "hey honey I would really love if you changed this". Even if it's an otherwise perfectly rational and legitimate request, and on paper she, and everyone else, would agree to that. They go and do whatever they are used to do, time and time again.

I think the only moment when she might fix her shit is between the sex conversion point and the commitment point. At the point when she is seeking your commitment, you are most attractive to her and she is more compliant to your demands. Even so, I'd only ask for small stuff, and not many of them. Big stuff must be screened beforehand.

After the commitment point, even if the request is reasonable, it's no longer a logical negotiation, it's a power struggle. And she ain't yielding no power. Therefore, dread game and consequences for breaking boundaries seem the way to go.

I'm very open to hear more ideas and tactics on that.

[–]TRebirthP 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hey thanks TRebirthP. As of lately I see a lot of people in TRP with the only goal of out-alpha the guy before, so I am kind of wary when I see a barrage of questions. My mistake.

I understand. I think a lot of it comes from people reading about frame on here and then they try to enact and practice it on TRP. Instead of going out and using it where it's intended they make they lower the quality of discourse and discovery on here lower by making every discussion a narcissism battle. It's stupid, pathetic and harmful.

From what I've seen, women in a highly emotional state are not like this. They simply can't refrain from acting on their impulses the way we men do (except, perhaps, our sexual impulses).

I agree and I think it goes deeper than just not being able to refrain. I think to most women (and most people, really) the only thing that matters is how they feel. There are no negative consequences outside of what makes them feel badly and there are no positive consequences aside from what makes them feel good. So when you tell your friend to not vent to guys she's torn between 2 fundamentally bads and chaos ensues. I don't know your friend so there could be many reasons why she can't help herself (she's depressed, has low impulse control, she's afraid of genuine dating success etc), but generally people do not appreciate the processes required to get the things they want, they don't see any inherent value in the pain and difficulty they encounter and they don't appreciate other people any where near as much as they appreciate their attempt to take the path of least resistance and most comfort. So the results are predictable.

This might be correct. I don't know if there were other better dudes in the picture, but the loss of attraction could make them think it was the case.

Other than that, in the most recent example, I fail to see what benefits could she reap from breaking up. But there must be, or else they wouldn't do it.

I think just the idea of someone else being better, of a truer love, of a happier relationship is enough to sow the seeds of doubt and thus, as you said before they can't contain their impulses, so they must pursue that growing, gnawing doubt. What they gain is the satisfaction of being available to hit the sexual and romantic lottery. That alone is enough to keep a lot of women satisfied with the decision to end a relationship even while they lament not being in one.

The thing is, you can't give feedback to a girl. Like, in "hey honey I would really love if you changed this". Even if it's an otherwise perfectly rational and legitimate request, and on paper she, and everyone else, would agree to that. They go and do whatever they are used to do, time and time again.

I think the only moment when she might fix her shit is between the sex conversion point and the commitment point. At the point when she is seeking your commitment, you are most attractive to her and she is more compliant to your demands. Even so, I'd only ask for small stuff, and not many of them. Big stuff must be screened beforehand.

After the commitment point, even if the request is reasonable, it's no longer a logical negotiation, it's a power struggle. And she ain't yielding no power. Therefore, dread game and consequences for breaking boundaries seem the way to go.

I'm very open to hear more ideas and tactics on that.

I'm something of an incel in the end of the day which means I don't have a lot of practical experience so you may want to take what I say with a grain of salt. Here's my most recent thinking on this genuine conundrum though.

I think the key to all the whole "women get bitchy once they have commitment" has less to do with labeled commitment, but rather are the underlying feelings. You can be married or in a ltr, but if she feels you care less and that you could walk away, you can largely retain the pliability in the sex to commitment phase. Power is an ego thing and if it's understood, even without words, that you care less, her ego will be tamed and she'll be compliant to try and get you to care. That's the first and last power play for all women.

In terms of tactics, I am undecided in the whole rational conversation vs withdrawing attention debate. I've had failures and successes with both. I think they are both good tools and there's no easy "one solution" for all power struggles. Sometimes, talking things out works a problem out because the issue is a genuine misunderstanding and the person wants to be with you and please you and telling them what you want helps show them how. Sometimes, you need to address the surface level, concious issue and ignore all the complex and subtle theories on attraction. Other times, the specific problem you are trying to solve is just a mask for an underlying lack of desire and respect and the only way to fix the root is with dread (or it's unfixable and you need to walk). TRP likes to advertise and talk about the more "alpha" way of dealing with women (withdrawal), but I think a good part of that is a bit of a circle jerk mentality, TRP thinking the worst thing a man can be is a beta bitch to a woman and because it's a bit necessary as a teaching mechanism since men are actively discouraged to withdraw in most BP society, but what I've found is the results both get are not black and white. Moreover, depending on your motivations either one can be you acting from a place of weakness or strength. A person can withdraw or not communicate cause they are scared, unaware and lazy. A person can talk things out cause they are brave, open and don't take shit. The effect each approach has and where it comes from is often contextual even if the it's more effective to err on the side of withdrawal. So, in the end, I think the best thing is to view them as tools that solve different problems. The tricky part is recognizing where the other person is actually coming from so that you can respond effectively.

[–]sd4c -3 points-2 points  (3 children)

So you don't want to have kids? Or, are planning to get a surrogate?

[–]Red_Faust 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I don't like children, and as I am 40 already, this is unlikely to change in the future. So, no children for me.

YMMV of course, but I have no clue how to have children in a redpill way.

Surrogate mothers, as you say, are a possibility, though they are banning it in many countries as we speak (the system can't give reproductive alternatives to men).

[–]sd4c 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think the key to having kids the "red pill" way, is to have enough of a surplus that you can jump ship to another craft if the first mate loses her mind. For example, raise a family in a third world country on a first-world income. Just a thought

[–]Pope_Lucious 48 points49 points  (5 children)

Anytime the girl complains about her "sociopath ex", the canary has died in the coal mine

[–]kasper138 19 points20 points  (2 children)

They are almost always projecting.

[–]Pope_Lucious 16 points17 points  (1 child)

Had a plate give me the sociopath ex spiel a few weeks back.

I thought to myself, "well this is only 50% of the story... at best".

[–]kasper138 6 points7 points  (0 children)

My rule is pretty simple, he who smelt it dealt it.

[–]cor3volution 16 points17 points  (0 children)

It's the same as applying for a job. Don't hire people who talk shit about their old bosses in the interview, and don't date girls who wont shut up about their psycho ex. even if it's true it means they're still thinking about them all the time, and then we have op's story

[–]Urishima 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Monty Python's dead parrot sketch comes to mind.

Michael Palin is you in denial and John Cleese is your subconscious trying get the truth through to you.

[–]drsherbert 31 points32 points  (12 children)

I know stories like this are all too common, but how are women so good at being deceptive? I would have to really focus my energy to pull something like this off. They can do it so effortlessly, almost like they're programmed to destroy us.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 60 points61 points  (7 children)

I spent the day with my 4 year old niece today. She got me to do so much shit for her, through smiles, laughs, lies, false inadequacies, changing the subject, requests for help, so much shit. And it was ALL fake; not a single thing was her genuine state of being at any time. It's some sort of biological trait. It's scary as shit.

[–]cashmoney_x 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Have an eight year old girl; can confirm. They are fake as FUCK. I cringe when I see other dads buy into obvious manipulation- sometimes I'll even catch the girl smirk with that "got 'em" look on her face.

My daughter actually admits to this since I am always up front about knowing she is full of shit (although admitting it is just more manipulation on her part) and once said "people think girls are nice because we're pretty but we have evil inside."

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Something about Hillary Clinton scared me infinitely more than any male candidate could ever hope to. The vagina seems to brings things to a whole new level of evil.

[–]TheRedSwordsman 7 points8 points  (0 children)

It's exactly like that. They see that doing X results in Y with person Z and whenever they need Y and Z is around they'll just spam X.

It's like, imagine you have a boxing match and you realize that your opponent can't block right hooks for shit. You're gonna use that to your advantage, right? Same goes with women. If it brings the desired results they're gonna use it, they'll make cute eyes and throw a smile to make you walk a mile to buy her a sandwich.

And the best part is, their hamster will never admit that it was intentionally sending you signals to make you go. No, the problem is that you were "good guy" enough to be convinced. It's you who decided to go buy the sandwich, not her putting all the effort to be convincing.

And also, the fundamental difference between boxing and making you go for a sandwich: In boxing both participants agreed to the rules of interaction, whereas in social interactions (in this case men with women) are left out in the dark. Which is also what gives birth to timeless non-internet memes such as "women are a mystery".

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

I don't think you can say it was fake. A 4 year old hasn't been conditioned by society as much as a 20 year-old or 40 year-old to be manipulative.

If you're going to be afraid, be scared that her behaviour is real, and this is how certain people (both men and women) are from the very beginning, and how many people inevitably turn out.

For some, this is their nature. For others, this is how they're nurtured.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I used to think 4 was too young. She's been like this since 2 (she was also able to navigate a Windows computer at 2. I took a video once). Incredibly manipulative. Manipulates everyone against me when I don't fall for her bullshit crying. Manipulates everyone against her 2 year older brother (who's an idiot) when they're both in trouble. I have a video of her at 1 fake crying and immediately stopping as I leave the room, regaining full composure. And once I re enter she enters full crying mode again. I play it to her all the time to tease her.

She honestly has seen enough and had enough social interactions to test out her skills. You can watch her learn new social skills all the time and add them to her arsenal. I'm not being a psycho and before I experienced this I would have agreed with you. She's just a natural as you say.

I'm basically her dad. Her dad doesn't have much interest in either of his kids and is a mega beta. She has no interest or preference in him but loves spending time with me when I'm around (or so she has convinced me).

[–]cashmoney_x 5 points6 points  (0 children)

No, it IS fake and they are biologically wired for this.

[–]teamjkforawhile 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's mostly nature, and has been very studied. You should read Steven Pinker's books/research. Or at least watch some of his youtubes where he explains it, and even gives a pretty good guess at the ratio.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 14 points15 points  (1 child)

If OP's story ain't bull then he's describing a mentally ill woman. In that case her behavior is her compulsion. When things are smooth they are boring. Women like that create drama to satisfy their unsatisfied empty soul.

When OP moved in with her the chase was done and he became her crutch. And she went on to find new kicks, which brought her back to her abusive ex. Who isn't really abusive, but simply reacts differently to her manipulations.

If OP hadn't moved in with her and kept his distance he would have been the abusive ex. She would have forced the relationship to explode, looking for a guy who is more controllable. Then when she finds one she might have visited OP again for some fun on the side.

It sounds a whole lot like AF/BB except that it's not driven by value or the personality of the guys per se. But rather her constantly shifting life experience. Whatever you do, she's gonna fuck someone else for some other reason.

[–]tallwheel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's especially easy for them because women naturally appear childlike and innocent. They use this to their advantage, and are even able to rationalize to themselves that they are innocent and doing nothing wrong when they are. Adult men do not have the luxury of always being assumed to be sweet and innocent.

/u/empatheticapathetic 's comment illustrates this exactly. It's important to realize that adult women can do this too.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's seriously bizarre. I actually have to sit and think to figure out what they're doing. And they just spit the shit out without a thought. Manipulation machines.

[–]Xoramung 37 points38 points  (6 children)

I got cheated on. Don't be like me.

More importantly girls if you are reading this, dont be like her.

At least she is goneskis.

[–]ciarao55 34 points35 points  (5 children)

This is the most sensible comment here. I don't get all this melodramatic they're "biologically programmed to destroy men". How about we teach our daughters not to be emotionally abusive, opportunistic scumbags? And for the women that are already steeped in their ways, how about we just tell them to fuck off? People like this girlfriend have surrounded themselves with enablers.. they haven't had important people in their lives tell them their garbage humans, so they continue on their merry way using others and believing their own fantasies.

Op, obviously you were right to leave and congratulations on having the balls to pack up and move on. But you should realize for a while you enabled this behavior, and you accepted trash treatment because you wanted to believe something that wasn't, and deep down you probably believed you couldn't get anything better. When it comes to people, you get what you put up with- and that goes for women, men, parents, cousins, kids. Next time, know your worth and draw a clearer line in the sand.

[–]Xoramung 19 points20 points  (0 children)

Unfortunately feminism has basically destroyed most women's thinking. you can read RP subs for women, they have to fight their feminist upbringing, the hamster, and all the other rubbish they got fed in their environments. Teach your daughters how to vet (not bang everyone essentially) and they are gatekeepers of sex (dont bang every one), and perhaps things can start going smoother for everyone.

[–]Pope_Lucious 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I'm with you in spirit but you should realize all of society is enabling this behavior in women. We can't just raise our daughters to be different. Women are actively encouraged and enabled by society to be manipulative.

[–]whuttupfoo 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s also important to realize OP showed major signs of weakness very early on. This woman saw a clear window of opportunity for manipulation and went for it with relative ease.

I’m sure she could give two shits about this guy packing up and leaving. She can easily reel another man in with the same manipulative scheme that was performed on OP. Rinse and repeat. Which she actually did with the other guy.

TRP has a huge focus on women’s behavior but it’s important to know that men are capable of this type of thing too. Be keen on manipulation, most people are ignorant to their cunning.

[–]cashmoney_x 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't get all this melodramatic they're "biologically programmed to destroy men". How about we teach our daughters not to be emotionally abusive, opportunistic scumbags?

Nice idea but not gonna happen. Biology wins in this instance.

[–]GOODLORD100 26 points27 points  (54 children)

I recently found out my girlfriend of 1.5 years has been cheating on me throughout the entire relationship with 6 guys. One guy sent me a sex tape from Valentine's Day, when she told me she was too sick to go out. And I stayed with her. And now I feel stuck.

[–]iBchyllen247365 43 points44 points  (21 children)

Wait what?

You're still with her?

Do you have respect for yourself?

You are stuck as long as you believe you are.

Recognize that you aren't, and start being logical.

Escape and stay away from people that don't respect you.

[–]cor3volution 14 points15 points  (0 children)

i almost choked when i read his last sentence.

[–]GOODLORD100 7 points8 points  (19 children)

Yea I am still with her. I wanted to break up with her a few months into the relationship because she started to seem shady. But she's a good-looking, yet kinda nerdy computer programmer so I stupidly assumed nothing happened. Until one of the guys reached out to me and apologized and told me everything. This lead to her admitting to having sex with 6 guys and she apparently lost count how many she made it with and said kissing isn't cheating. I am trying to break up with her but she recently moved in :( (before I found out)

[–]afishnsea 26 points27 points  (5 children)

Jesus dude, kick her out today and delete all contact info.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Trust me I want to. It's a bit more complicated.

Somehow I got tricked into opening up A joint bank account when we moved. Among other things that make it impossible for me to just cut and run :(

[–]Starter91 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Fuck man i feel so sorry for you, if there is not much money in the account then cut the losses , pack your things and run for your life.

[–]GOODLORD100 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thanks. This is what I plan on doing I'm just scared to actually act.

[–]krotch_vilense 1 point2 points  (1 child)

If you honestly want to then you already would've.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't want to. I want to forget this ever happens and hope she won't do it again. But I think I have to. Every time she's out, I get stressed. I don't want to do it but I have to :(

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (12 children)

Take a Friday off from work. Fuck, don't even wait till this Friday, DO IT TODAY. Pick up all of her stuff. Put it in boxes. Put the boxes in the garage/by the front door of your apartment. When she comes home, break up with her and tell her she needs to move out by tomorrow. Don't think about her work schedule, let her take a day off from work too.

This girl has no respect for you. If she did, she wouldn't have fucked another person,let alone six other guys.

This is the simplest solution to your problem and I know it's not always that simple. Maybe she pays rent and you can't afford the place your staying without a roommate? Get a friend to live with you/Put an ad on craigslist/Run an AirBnB.

She can't fuck around on you and expect to have a place to stay. That’s an abuse of trust in any relationship, and I guarantee you that if the tables were turned, she would be doing the exact same shit. Hell, she prpbably wouldn't have been so nice about it and you would have come home and seen all your stuff thrown to the curb.

She's telling you how badly she fucked up and how it was a huge mistake, she'll actually learn a lesson when she's homeless.

Which she won't be because she has 6 other guys and I guarantee you at least one of them, or her female friends/family will give her a place to stay. If not, she can just put her stuff in storage and live in a motel for a while, but you shouldn't worry about that.

Don't worry about her,man. You ever seen any pretty homeless girls?

[–]GOODLORD100 4 points5 points  (7 children)

Definitely needed to hear this.

She is constantly telling me how guilty she feels and how bad she fucked it and keeps assuring me it won't happen again.

She said she did it because she thought I didn't care about her or the relationship so she's going to do whatever she wants and can have her cake and eat it too. And if I found out that we'd just break up.

But when I tried to break up with her when I found out, she cried and pleaded. I was in such shock I tried to make it work again but we constantly argue about what she did and she refuses to talk about it anymore but still apologizes.

We went on vacation a few weeks ago and I was planning on breaking up with her but couldn't get the words out of my mouth. I need to rip it off like a bandaid I guess.

[–]Psychocist 8 points9 points  (2 children)

She said she did it because she thought I didn't care about her or the relationship so she's going to do whatever she wants and can have her cake and eat it too. And if I found out that we'd just break up.

Yeh, because we are disposable. She can go find another beta within 10 steps of walking outside. You mean literally fuck all to her. Those pleas are because of the dread. Don't worry, she'll continue riding the CC with abandon the second you are out of her life.

She's on a path of self-destruction and you need to get the fuck out of the way before she ruins your life any further. Shit man, wake up. It's not going to get better.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I need to hear this. She's also bulimic and has trouble controlling her urges. She said men were harder to control her urges with but not she won't do that anymore once she realizes I actually cares.

Obviously I shouldn't believe her but I'm in too deep. Trying to learn everything I can from this sub.

[–]Psychocist 6 points7 points  (0 children)

She's just manipulating you by preying on your urges to save a damsel in distress. It's sickening and selfish, but it is simply the way they operate.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

6 guys? Don't listen to a thing this slut bitch says.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (2 children)

6 guys she slept with. She was exchanging nudes on Snapchat with one of those guys. The others were one night stands. I made her delete that guy off Snapchat and Facebook and she got angry at first but then did it.

Now she says she's determined to prove people can change and to be a good girlfriend. And that she didn't care about the relationship in the past but does now.

Currently I'm trying to set things up with this other girl who seems interested so I can forget about this skank!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Dude, don't wait until you set something up. Walk now. Seriously. This is fucking ridiculous and sounds codependent or that you are literally terrified to be alone or without pussy. If you are terrified of being alone/pussy-less, then the best thing you can do is be alone. Otherwise, you are gonna be jerked around by the emotions of others and yourself all the time.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Was reading about codependency. Damn. Hits the nail on the head..

[–]Psychocist 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Fuck that. Don't pack for her! Tell her to pack her own shit and GTFO otherwise it's going out the window. This bitch doesn't deserve a modicum of effort.

In fact, OP, just pretend you're not even in a relationship with her and start dating other chicks and inviting 'em back to your place. She'll get the message and be on her way pretty quickly.

[–]GOODLORD100 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Since I found out, I started talking to girls on every dating app and met two so far. But they always seek to fizzle out and are never as hot as this girl. It does help talking to them though.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

To be honest with you, my sexual history has girls between 3 and 9. There has only been one 9 so far (and I would honestly say she was almost a 10 in my eyes, she just had hair too short for my liking), so she is still the hottest person I have gone out with to date.

And she is also the human being I've had the worst experience with,too. She is the most infuriating human being in terms of the shit she did when she broke up with me and after we broke up.

We went on the best first date I've ever been on (though most others have been pretty great too) and she's one of the only two girls I didn't fuck on the first date, so it actually felt like dating because I had to wait 'till the third date and I met her best friend and we went on a double date or two. After that first date, she went back to her ex and I forgot about her when I went on my trip to Cuba. Came back and saw a text she sent saying she missed me.

The sex was incredible because up until that point, I had sex because I wanted to have sex,not because I was attracted to those girls. I would go for hours and my dick would stay rock hard the entire time. Pullout, cum, wipe it off, right back in it goes.

I just remember how great I felt thinking I had a hot girlfriend. Good sex, ego boosted both by her and just the fact I had a hot girlfriend and it felt like I could show off, so I felt great for the few weeks we saw eachother. The rest of my life was kind of shitty because I was between apartments and staying with my aunt,living out of boxes, but doesn't matter, had sex.

All this good stuff came to an end when I saw her one day and she shaved her head. Lost the attraction then because I'm not interested in fucking Amber Rose unless she has a wig. Had sex with my girl anyways, but with less gusto. She wanted to eat at Denny's afterwards, so I took her to one close by.

She told me she fucked some other dude and when I was calling her out on her shit, she told me we weren't a couple or anything, despite the fact we were "dating". Then I had to drive her 20 minutes home like a fucking cuck and she officially broke up with me through text later and didn't explain anything until I pressed her and she told me I was a terrible person and I hit her (slapped face during sex once and she cried, so never did it again).

It bothers me because I had a pretty high SMV back then and I felt invincible, being in good shape for the first time of my life and having just lost my virginity,my biggest burden, 2 months before and sleeping with 5 girls since, and it all just came out of the blue for me. Plus, I'm sure my SMV is higher than that other guy and my dick is bigger, but none of that matters because conventional Chad (though I was a lot more beta back then) like me isn't her thing, she wants a stream of beta Bills that know how to play the guitar because being artsy fartsy is what gets her tingly. She also never helped me get any closure. I had to come to terms with everything myself. The week before she ended it, we we're talking about her setting me up with one of her friends and we'll have a threesome.

It's only now I can look through the lens of TRP and see all the fucking traps I fell into and bullshit I out up with that I shouldn't have.

The entire point of this story is I know how hard it is to get over the hottest girl you've been with, and it personally took me a year to get over all the shit that happened with her even though we only went out for 5 weeks (never had an LTR last for 2 months). It sucks knowing you can pull in hotter chicks and you feel like you're trading down initially,but with some time and a few more notches on your belt, you'll move on a bit more and it gets easoer. I actually met her through Tinder, so there are hot girls on dating apps, even though you have to wade through a lot of shit first.

Either way, good luck man. You have it way harder than I ever had, so I wish you all the luck in getting through all this.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for this man. It is hard when it's the hottest girl and you know she can easily get 10 guys to 1 pretty girl I can get.

I'm in the slow process of breaking up with her because besides her looks and what she did, she's a cool, fun girls and promised she wouldn't do it again and only did it because she didn't think or relationship was serious. And neither did I

But I have to end it. I just told her to delete the last guy she was with from Snapchat and Facebook because they sent each other nudes. She tries to fight this at first but gave me her phone to do it.

[–]Starter91 26 points27 points  (15 children)

Jesus fucking christ dump that cum dumpster, are you fucking mad?

[–]GOODLORD100 6 points7 points  (14 children)

I've been in shock since I found out and saw the videos. I keep telling myself I will dump her but keep procrastinating.

I'm very close to 30 and I've never knowingly been cheated on, let alone with multiple guys and with sex tapes.

Thank God someone directed me to this sub...

[–]Starter91 9 points10 points  (13 children)

I am so fucking sorry for men like you , this is just , today i found out there is such website surviving infidelity . Feels like there is some kind of epidemic going on with men , just don't be a doormat , please please .

[–]GOODLORD100 4 points5 points  (12 children)

I agree. She never seemed the type to do this either but I guess they're all capable of it. I've avoided relationships for years because I tend to get too attached and this has been my longest relationship and look what happens.

I have actually been trying to meet girls, and have met a few, to try to get over her and this situation, but I just want time to focus on myself. But then when I'm alone I wonder when, how and all the details of what she did. It's pure torture.

[–]valdirtheblue 8 points9 points  (11 children)

You will never be free, never be able to respect or enjoy your life again if you don't drop this woman immediately. Delete her off every phone/media platform and block as well. You don't want mind games. You owe it to yourself brah.

Get a gym membership and blow off steam there. Luckily, half the battle is done. You've acknowledged the problem, now act!!!

[–]GOODLORD100 2 points3 points  (10 children)

That's the hard part, actually acting! I knew from the start I shouldn't be in this relationship and now I'm just too scared to act. I can't enjoy my life at all and have nightmares almost every single night since I found out what she did. She said her dad told her to just keep denying. I never would have found out if one guy didn't tell me.

Yea the thing I'm most scared about is I know she'd be fine if I broke up with her and I'd be crushed. Thanks for the gym membership tip, because I didn't even think about it. I've lost friends over her and she actually talks to those friend, and I worry that if I finally pull the plug, she'd revenge fuck them knowing it would crush me more than anything.

[–]SovereignSoul76 2 points3 points  (4 children)

"Yea the thing I'm most scared about is I know she'd be fine if I broke up with her and I'd be crushed."

Duuuuude, you need to leave that sense of desperation in a ditch somewhere. I've had a few girls leave me that I've said to myself "Well, I'll probably never bang another girl THAT hot again." And every fucking time I was wrong.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (3 children)

That is exactly what I think. She's the hottest girl I've ever been with and Eastern European.

I had something that most men I know wish they could get. I used to think she was special and glad only I got to be with her.

Until I saw pics of all the men. All but one were former friends or people she knew from college. The other was a neighbor she texted to come over. All these ugly guys got all the benefit of her without the negatives. I'm trying not to think like this anymore but it's hard!

[–]SovereignSoul76 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Yeah well it's a choice you make. Take it on its most basic level: some other meat appendages went into the same cavity yours went into. Big fucking deal. Some day relatively soon, you're gonna be decomposing in a hole in the ground. You'll prob get a few "freebies" from married/taken girls in the next couple years; who's to say you haven't already and don't know it.

It's called emotions, and they can dictate our thinking. You're sad/angry/confused right now, so you're choosing to think extremely pessimistically. Just recognize that statement is true. Rub some dirt on that ego; you'll be fine.

[–]valdirtheblue 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Then cut those friends. Once you are single you will enjoy your life and be utterly free. Embrace the sadness, even if she fucks your friends. Put the anger into gym, or better yet, let it go and move on. She is just one woman, you can meet loads more!

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (2 children)

The thought of being free without dealing with all this stress and worry is finally starting to outweigh the sense of loss I'll feel breaking up with her. I feel like I need a new identity and my memory erased.

[–]valdirtheblue 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Just think about it; why should a woman ever make you feel sad, miserable or trapped? This is wrong. Society tells us this is life, and that somehow it is honourable. It isn't.

Take control of your own happiness. Improve your mind and body, you will find true happiness in being your own and only critic.

My ex made me miserable, until I realised I had the power to stop that. Go for it! Fresh start mate.

[–]bigman1090 12 points13 points  (3 children)

Dude. Stop. Just stop. Ghost her and hard next. Find other things to do. Getting into a habbit of heroine seems a better idea than sticking around

[–]GOODLORD100 1 point2 points  (2 children)

With all the stress she is causing me daily, and the stress she is causing with my family and friends, I've actually thought about that idea... already picked up a few bad habits to cope, unfortunately.

[–]bigman1090 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I don't think you were here to listen in the first place. Good luck mate! I hope you find the power to rise from rock bottom

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I am here to listen and am initiating the process. Slowly, but surely. I'll get there.

[–]ChadThundercockII 7 points8 points  (2 children)

dude, your comments on here gave me a heartache and a hardcore disgusted look on my face. ROUGH SHIT AND TOUGH LOVE INCOMING: are you a weakling holding on to a woman who fucked SIX guys? do you have any self confidence, self respect or even a shred of honor? I cant be logical and stoic with someone who who lets people walk all over him. Are you some kind of cuckold? watching the girl you are with getting drilled and still welcoming her to your home? fucking goddamn it kid!Do you like getting fucked in the ass? is this why you wont let her go? Take her shit out of the house. Go spend a few days with a friend. Dont talk to her or meet her. I hope you make it out of your cuck weak ways buddy. I will pray for you.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I need tough love. I am not a cuckold but have heard that from all my friends. I always had low confidence and am usually very shy/awkward but I do have some experience with girls. Nothing like this though.

It's going to sound stupid, but being almost 30 and talking about marriage, I thought she was "the one". I'm just in shock. Even though I learned about it over two months ago. I keep trying to break it off. I just don't act on it. Your post is very helpful though!

[–]ChadThundercockII 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Bro I want you to make it out of these stronger. Dump her ass, there is no "one". Go through my post comment history. Im big on finding the right girl for a family. I understand where you coming from.

I am also awkward as fuk but it doesnt stop me from sticking my dick in random women. Act on your gut feeling now. You are torturing yourself like this. Today is the day where you gain your freedom. Your ancestors didnt survive wars, diseases and a whole lot of shit so you can get cukolded by a dumb slut who doesnt appreciate you for the good and bad in you. You got yourself in an abusive relationship. Unfuck yourself today. Slowly pack her stuff and put them in th front step with a note that say "thank you for the sex" and delete her from your existence.

Do the right thing buddy. Also lift, make money and have awesome hobbies. The world is yours. Dont stick your head in the sand so a dumb slut can peg your ass.

Courage, my man.

[–]general_armchair 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Why are you even here? I seriously hope you're trolling because that is pathetic.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not trolling. Wish I was. The relationship advice sub lead me here. I need the advice and I like what I read here.

[–]Brazilian_Slaughter 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Get how much of that account you think belongs to you, give her what you think belongs to her according to your calculations. Tell her to move and pack, or her things will go out from the windows. Cut all contact with her. Abort abort abort.

[–]GOODLORD100 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I am in the process of aborting after reading all these comments. I found about all this a little over two months and ago and still with her. Now all of a sudden I'm doing these things. Won't that look a little weird?

[–]Logic2014 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What's weird is you're still in this "relationship". I guarantee you, she is still cheating. 100% End. It.

[–]Rian_Stone 51 points52 points  (6 children)

I wouldn't be hard on yourself. you had a mission, you went for it.

you had a standard in your home, and you met it.

And like we all say 'when she cheats, you will probably never know' and you didn't at first. Once you found out, it's how you act that makes the difference. In your case, you deliberately set yourself up for success. You didn't make a scene, cry, or beg. you didn't pretend it didn't happen. you just took your shit and left.

The only, and this is a small nitpick, that you even bothered explaining any of this. Once you decided it was over, you could have just cut contact. She won't give closure, she doesn't deserve it either.

And your lessons are good lessons. Largely the reason why the new guys here are fucking horrible at following any part of TRP. It's one of those lessons that 'you have to learn for yourself, the hard way' aparently for about 90% of it.

Also why the guys who find their way to TRP/MRP have to have something fuck em over before they do. We are ego invested, and very stupid as a gender. We tend to avoid playing for blood, until we've lost a few games.

End of the day, you controlled the only thing you could... you.

:On a second read, when you were unemployed, a lot of guys have issue with being less busy, and make up for it with extra placation. Clean house, sure.... you're a guy who loves a clean house, it's your standard. The running errands for her? No reason to turn into a supplicating housewife.

[–]Kingofdeadbedroom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

She needs to be no more than a plate. She should gain no benefit from your time or money.

[–]Jkarl1 0 points1 point  (1 child)

It is a great lesson and according to Carl Jung these lessons are crucial for developing the Anima in our unconscious on the path to individuation. According to Jung the women that we are attracted to in this stage are signs of the lowest level of anima development. It's not a question of why woman act this way but why are "we" are attracted to them. Many men on this forum have a underdeveloped anima; The anima being the feminine piece of our unconscious that we project onto woman (i.e. My Unicorn)

The fact of the matter is, even with knowledge of TRP principles in our conscious mind, the unconscious part of the self is still trying to grow and only painful lessons of failure will help it do so.

We project this internal anima onto a real female in belief of a unicorn, but this is internal. Her actions only are reflected upon your projections. So by failing with these type of woman we "believe" something is wrong with them, and place blame on them, but the problem really is in our own unconscious projections of our anima, due to childhood development with the relationships to our mothers.

Jung believed anima development has four distinct levels, which he named Eve ( aka Femme fatale), Helen, Mary and Sophia. In broad terms, the entire process of anima development in a man is about the male subject opening up to emotionality, and in that way a broader spirituality, by creating a new conscious paradigm that includes intuitive processes, creativity and imagination, and psychic sensitivity towards himself and others where it might not have existed previously.

Many men have been burnt by "Eve" but never really learn the lesson and develop their anima to the higher levels of maturity. In the book "The Invisible Partners" it is said that the key to controlling one's anima/animus is to recognize it when it manifests and exercise our ability to discern the anima/animus from reality.

[–]Rian_Stone 0 points1 point  (0 children)

heres the thing. Jung, pretty smart, and this is most likely true.

Though the best way to fish isn't to learn about how fish biology works IMO. It's learning how to fish, and focusing on your rod, your boat, and dressing for the weather.

The hardest, and simplest way ahead in all this? Have your boundaries, have the options to walk away if things go sour, and simply enforce them.

If she hits a boundary through ignorance, deceipt, or maliciousness, doesn't matter. Meet my expectations, or I'll find someone else who will. It's a bull in a china shop, but it's worked remarkably well for me.

Adding onto that, it keeps you focused on the only thing you can control, yourself.

That's why I like ops post, and don't consider it a failure. He did what he did to get where he wanted to be (with a little 'mommy sais its OK guise!) and when life happened, he acted accordingly

Like I said earlier, a little refinement, and this FR would have been poetry.

[–]xeneize93 0 points1 point  (1 child)

If you aren't busy I don't see how it can be bad to help out your girl...that girl was a bitch from the beginning and she took advantage of him

[–]Rian_Stone 0 points1 point  (0 children)

She only did what he let get get away with.

Women are as shitty as you let them be.

[–]OGlancellannister 65 points66 points  (10 children)

Yes we all know the nature of women, but just so we don't poison the well here, this girl is without a doubt worse than most. Much worse than any girl I've dated, that's for sure. The bad talking behind your back is just heinous behaviour, while lying and cheating to your face. Definitely great point about the red flags as there were many; the craziness was high in this one.

Tough read and good on you for getting out brother, even better the way you did it — in a masculine, no nonsense way. It would be easy to look for revenge, or to bitch and moan about it, but why let her occupy any more space in your emotions and mind than she already has. Plus the best revenge in situations like this is no contact and no emotion. Women crave the emotions and drama breakups provide, because it will reaffirm how much she meant to you. Good luck in the future, it sucks, but it sounds like you've learned a lot. Better times lay on the horizon!

[–]Rian_Stone 32 points33 points  (8 children)

Replace 'most' with 'many' and you're catching on

[–]AwakenedSovereign 16 points17 points  (4 children)

More girls are like this than most men are comfortable believing. Even the guys here on TRP. I walk around these days seeing some BP fucks with hot girlfriends.. sometimes I feel a bit like Cipher. They might be ignorant fucks, but they are temporarily happy in their ignorance. I'm not yet fully into the acceptance phase so I still have some anger and hesitation.. I think.. what if I could forget? It would make talking to girls easier if I didn't see the demon behind their eyes.

But then I remember the tinder sluts repeating how they had a boyfriend while I railed them, because it turned them on. The three week long fuckfest with a girl whose BF was back at college. The married with children MILF. And I'm a lightweight. I've seen far more shit my higher value male friends partake of.. in ways and in places and with people you wouldn't even think of.

There is no going back. Some girls might be better than others.. but they are all like that. Sooner or later.

[–]sd4c 8 points9 points  (3 children)

Boyfriend is jack shit. Husband is jack shit.

Fucking is just a way for chicks to use their weaponized vagina on you. Vagina + Birth Control = Mind Control Tube.

Stop having feelings for someone who's giving you nothing of tangible value. In 2017, women hand out blowjobs like pencils. They'll hump on or let fuck, any guy they find interesting, cute, or funny.

If they're not the mother of at least one of your kids, you shouldn't bother having feelings for them. Even then, if she's not willing to keep humping you and raise your children selflessly, show her the door.

[–]enadelb 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Yeah you know what they say.. a ring doesn't plug a hole

[–]Psychocist 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Stop having feelings for someone who's giving you nothing of tangible value

Though I don't think there is anything wrong with developing feelings for someone (so long as you maintain an attitude of impermanence), we really do need to hammer it home that women provide very little value to your life once you've got your shit together.

Bit of feminine charm and a vagina. They're just a bit of fun and should not at all be involved in any serious life decisions such as long-term commitments and building families.

[–]sd4c 4 points5 points  (0 children)

and a vagina.

That's just it, a vagina is just a whack-off sleeve unless it can get pregnant. In that case, she's actually taking a huge risk on you, and should be rewarded.

But not too much. We can't hand over the keys to the kingdom, because someone gave us a clone. I believe Patrice O'Neal, said: "Always keep 10% for yourself."

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Yeah exactly this. I didn't find it THAT out of the ordinary, although it is on the more BPD side of things...

[–]SiulaGrande 0 points1 point  (0 children)

definitely the more BPD side

[–]Red_Faust 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Agreed. This chick leans heavily on the Cluster B / BPD side.

While most chicks will increase dissatisfaction, nagging and drama in cohabitation, the rampant cheating and badmouthing is not that common. Fortunately.

We don't know the ages of the parties involved. OP, would you care to tell us?

[–]Senior Endorsed Contributormax_peenor 17 points18 points  (6 children)

And she apparently thought that, because I quit my job and was about to be around him more, that I was gonna either start beating him or take him back to the pound.

All chicks are at least a 4 crazy, but this bitch was in triple digits.

[–]imn0tg00d 16 points17 points  (3 children)

I think she was making that up as a reason because the real reason she was angry is that it would be harder for her to cheat with him being home so much.

[–]cashmoney_x 2 points3 points  (1 child)

This is where guys go wrong. They chalk things up to girls being "crazy" when it's really basic human psychology. All she was doing there was looking for a reason to justify to him her feelings because the real reason was something she could not admit.

[–]Senior Endorsed Contributormax_peenor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This was a media reference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKWmFWRVLlU

Notice that the loudest laugh in the video was from a woman. Women aren't actually crazy. They are just women, which will seem crazy to men expecting them to act like men.

I actually got LCF in trouble with the military once because of this. Now I understand how I really fucked up, but not so much back then. I whined to another female in uniform about how she was "psycho." Yeah, from the perspective of a young male throwing a tantrum like a 3 year old over the choice of dinner seems pretty psycho. This other female then went and reported LCF to her chain of command and then the shit really blew up. LCF went atomic and to this day still insists I fucked her (did not, she was a hag) and this was a scheme to get rid of her and hook up with the hag instead. Frying pan/fire I assure you.

Meanwhile, an older male sergeant and a younger female captain put an end to it all very quickly. Why? Because they knew she wasn't psycho--she was just being female.

Ok, some women are actually crazy.

[–]RedditDogX 16 points17 points  (0 children)

"instead of wasting one minute moping or feeling sorry for myself, I started planning my escape."

This. You made a mistake. Realized it. And got the F out. Congrats on escaping.

[–]TheLaughingRhino 1 points1 points [recovered]

When a woman says, it's OK to do this ( to her detriment in some way) or she would not be angry if you did that ( again, to her detriment or perception of it in some way) you have to translate it.

Here's a good example, the roof is leaking. She says, No, no, I don't want you climbing up there to fix it, it's dangerous!

Translation - Fix it, right now, you motherfucker. It's your fault you didn't predict the weather in the first place and fix it before. IF you get up there and fall, I don't want to have to feel bad about it because I said something, or worse, look bad to others, because they might find out I nagged you about it and then you fell off the roof. I wish I had Chad/Tyrone's dick in my mouth right now. Fuck you. What's in it for me? Whats on NetFlix? Fuck you. It's been 5 minutes, why is the roof not fixed. I want you to fix it, say nothing, and have me say, it's OK not to climb up there, so I can get exactly what I want, when I want it and how I want it, without any accountability or responsibility whatsoever. Never mind trying to communicate to you like a functioning adult, why do that when I can starfish you and cut you off from sex since I'd rather be with Chad/Tyrone right now. Did I mention Fuck You?

P.S. How are you going to pay for all my presents, on Valentines Day, my birthday, mothers day, Xmas, anniversary, etc, etc so I can show off to my "friends" and coworkers and get validation and attention if you don't have a fucking job?

P.P.S. I resent you because there are not enough tall rich hung dudes with trust funds and the social life of Derek Jeter to fuck me hard over a pool table. But you are good enough right now to pay my bills and socially validate that I'm not so deficient that I have to be alone. Me...ME....ME....ME!

Base lesson - As long as you are doing what you think is "right" to your code, then ignore what women say and do what you want to do anyway.

Even in my youth, when I was painfully blue pill, I knew intuitive to never trust a single word coming out of a woman's mouth who has some kind of incentive to try to get something from you.

[–]Starter91 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Now i want to join the monastery , fuck this shit .

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Joining a monastery and avoiding women sounds more in line with MGTOW or Incel. I see TRP as the communication of the true nature of women, and those 2 groups as communities that choose to react a certain way to that truth.

Remember brother, she'll always want to fuck Chad, but whose to say you're not Chad? If you aren't, then you got some work to do.

[–]cashmoney_x 2 points3 points  (0 children)

5 years since I've dealt with this bullshit and I truly have never been better.

mgtow

[–]1empatheticapathetic 9 points10 points  (3 children)

What a story. And a great objective self analysis of the whole event. I want to buy you a beer for the way you handled that shit.

My takeaway from this story is the woman will never take responsibility for what she wants. She'll instead risk ruining people's lives in the process. She wants validation for her shitty ex. And then also her shitty bf. And then her shitty living situation issues. And whatever else she can muster. But it ends at validation. She doesn't actually want you to move in with her, although it solves the problem. Now she needs new problems, and the whole "living together" issues begin.

As you said, don't LTR a plate.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Spot on. It's about validation. Her life experience is boredom and depression. And this can only be elevated through constant emotional feedback in the form of male validation. Also pets, females and family but this gives her a lower hit if you will.

Living with the girl killed the chase and lowered his value in her eyes. He became more real and less intangible. So the attention and thus validation he gave her, made less of an impact. But asshole manipulator ex-boyfriend remained an option. This made her feel better about herself and less bored/empty/sad.

[–]kasper138 2 points3 points  (1 child)

How do we even know the ex-bf is anything that she said he was when she's clearly the ass hole manipulator? Why is everyone so quick to throw this other dude under the bus? He even says she was saying the same things about him to the ex.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 3 points4 points  (0 children)

We don't. I once had a girlfriend like that for a short duration. She made her ex out to be a huge jerk. But in pictures he didn't appear anything but your typical AFC. She however turend out to be one nasty can of worms. And just like OP's story it was constant push and pull. The guy was just reacting to her constant shifts in attitude.

Why is everyone so quick to throw this other dude under the bus?

I just use the name dubbed by her, there's not a single moment where I suspected this guy to be what she said he was. He's only reacting to her condition. She projects her manipulative nature unto others and those others in turn are forced to manipulate her in a vain attempt to keep her. The reality is that women like that can't be kept, not even for a short while.

I've run into tons of women like that and they remain fascinating. But it's a double edged sword. Very fun in the beginning, unpleasant in the end. Perfect little girls when you meet them but when the image starts to crack you see the nasty and the bad.

[–]dontgiveupcarib 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I'm sorry to hear this happened to you. Hypergamy will destroy socialism and society will return to its tribal nature.

[–]DarkSummit90 10 points11 points  (3 children)

She used you as her, scapegoat. It's a second option in case something goes wrong with Ex 1. Until, she patches things up. Her first boyfriend always wins because she's an abused individual that has succumb to that particular kind of treatment. In a way, it's like a drug that only intensifies with each reoccurring moment of abuse. The worse the pain, the stronger the relationship.

Those signs were all in your face and it's unfortunate you had to live through that. Believe me when I say, I encountered a very similar dilemma and never recognized the signs until it was too late. The love we have for someone always supersedes rational thought. However, it's must be a relief for you to have left. We tend to let our guard down to those who've seen us vulnerable and it's the hardest felt guilt when that betrayal hits home, coming from an loved one. It's most certainly the case when she badmouthed on ex in front of you. Unfortunately, you will be on the receiving end of that kind of smack talk once she reacquainted with her ex. The hardest felt lesson is to recognize the signs and instantly make haste while you're not as invested.

[–]NotMyBestEffort 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I hate to be this picky, but when you made ESCAPE GOAT bold letter, I feel it is important enough to correct you. The term is SCAPEGOAT not escape goat - which is what it has morphed into recently.

[–]SovereignSoul76 2 points3 points  (0 children)

John and Steve would not have gotten away from the bank robbery, had they not planned ahead and brought their escape goats with them.

[–]DarkSummit90 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Pardon me, I seem to have missed that. Thank you for pointing that out.

[–]SiulaGrande 11 points12 points  (0 children)

If a girl has everything in common with you, she's pandering - there are no unicorns.

this is a biiiiiig one. it's gotten me a couple times.

you will NEVER find a chick that has everything in common with you. EVER. when this happens, it is because she's trying to get you and is being manipulative to present a much more appealing image of her. beware. do NOT LTR girls like this. if a girl isn't genuine, that's a red flag for way more serious trustworthiness issues.

in life in general, if people agree with everything you say, they aren't being truthful. huuuge huge lesson in life. no one is 100% identical to you, and people who seem that way are not genuine and have an agenda. beware.

If a girl's pursuing you super hard, something is probably wrong with her

this is a good one too. girls can show lots of positive interest to your advances, but that's exactly it: positive interest to YOUR advances, not hers. if a girls is going out of her way and hardcore pursuing YOU, then beware. something is off with her. (your "conniving slut alarm" should be sounding off to this one).

I fell back into old beta goober habits thinking "she likes me for who I am, I don't have to put on some act". Mistake.

this i disagree with somewhat. i understand what you meant, but you don't have to "put on an act" with women, you just have to treat them like women. start treating them like guys (being too casual with them, talking about random boring shit, not being sexual or flirtatious, going and doing non-sexual activities with them too often) and they'll get turned the fuck off. because they're women. they don't want to be treated like a guy.

the key to this frame of mind is just evolving the part of you that interacts with women to understand what parts of you are appealing and what actions on your part are appealing. this way you are still being true to yourself while simply engaging with them and treating them like women. this is just the key difference. when you talk to your boss, you don't talk to them like your boys; but that's not putting on an act, that's just a different part of your social skills that you use to engage with people in professional situations. when you talk to your boys, you don't talk to them like their your bosses or coworkers or anything; and that's not putting on an act either, that's just using another facet of your social skills to engage with them on the proper basis. engaging with women is the same: you just need to find and hone the part of your social skills that engage with women, and this comes from understanding deeply, at your core, that women are sexual beings and your interactions should be on the basis of sex (sexual conversation, escalating towards sexual activity, flirting, etc etc). you talk to your boss and coworkers professionally, you talk to your boys casually, and you talk to your girls/women sexually.

many people don't understand this and find themselves in a moral dilemma where they think they're not being themselves by applying TRP and spitting game and "putting on a front", when in reality you aren't putting on a front, you're just presenting a side of your self that until now was undeveloped. I treat the women in my life very differently from the people with other roles in my life, but it is natural. it is genuine to who I am and congruent with my personality, my character, and my morals. it is the sexual side of me: the side of me that wants to grab a woman and fuck her, the side of me that wants to be cocky and tease women sexually, the romantic, sexual, adventurous side of me.

but i understand what you meant

[–]WISE_TURD 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I dated a girl like this a long time ago. There's a lot of talk about possessing dark triad traits, but i believe avoiding dark triad women is even more important.

These are the types of women that will falsely accuse someone of rape.

"The psychopath test" by Jon Ronson is a good resource for quickly spotting a psychopath.

[–]dcis27 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Bro. So much props for you. I'm glad you found an outlet to release this bundle of shit so that you don't have to carry it with you like a badge on your shoulder. The most important part of this story is that you can actually be proud of yourself for taking the high road. Yeah, you made mistakes, big fucking deal. We all have. But guess what? You learned so much about yourself. When out of Monk Mode, make a few close friends at a more social job that can give you a passage to a more healthy social group (not saying your social network isn't good, just mentioning the importance of a trustworthy few that you can be yourself around). Surround yourself with people who are committed to other people and their ideas for their own personal growth. Good luck man. Life is long and there are plenty of fish

[–]dontbedenied 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Pretty much the same thing happened to me, right down to the politics and "manipulative Ex". I My Ex came after me HARD, despite (or perhaps because of) the fact that she was a devout "feminist" (she turned out to be a huge hypocrite but whatever) and me being a big Trump fan. It didn't take long for our fun arguments about politics to turn into me being a confirmed white supremacist and woman-hater.

Oh yeah, and I had, according to her, pulled her out of a toxic relationship. I was constantly the nice guy, never rocking the boat, literally doing everything I could to make her happy. Which was retarded but in fairness, she was a lunatic and there was no salvaging the relationship. No woman wants a spineless doormat, ESPECIALLY women who are legitimately attracted to abusive men, and those women should be avoided anyway.

All of your points are spot on. Believe the red flags. There are no unicorns, and a walking, breathing red flag certainty isn't one.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

man. I feel you.

This basically happened to me for past 2 years. I've been used.

Recovering from this shit myself. stay strong man

[–]Bing400 1 points1 points [recovered]

You cucked yourself by signing that lease. You let go of your freedom and her pussy in one gesture of the hand

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

In my own defense, I was looking for a new place at the same time that her roommate moved out, because my house was falling apart and my landlord was a slum lord. So it's not like I dropped everything in some penultimate retarded nice guy gesture. At the time it felt like I was killing two birds with one stone.

BUT, you're 100% right, I cucked myself. Shouldn't have moved in with her.

[–]Bing400 1 points1 points [recovered]

No the main part of what I'm saying is LAW.

Legal stuff. You signed something unwisely.

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

Legal implications of what, taking over the remaining 3 months of a lease? My thought process went, "well, if this ends badly, at least it's only 90 days of bullshit"

I made it through the first 3 months no problem. When I left, I put in my 30 days with the apartment manager and made sure I was paid up. Not sure if I'm properly answeing your question.

[–]Bing400 1 points1 points [recovered]

Eh.. that ain't too bad really. I think it was worth it. I wonder how we can squeeze half as much knowledge from your post than you have through living this.

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

I guess the best way to avoid these situations is to be totally 100% rational all of the time. Which is easier said than done

[–]kasper138 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You reminded me of this for some reason...

[–]ZacCrowell 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You remind me of me last year brother. My ex always hit me with the "abusive ex" story and acted just like your cunt ex. Broke up with her the day after Christmas when she told me she still loves the guy. Fast forward to today and I'm in a different state making twice as much as I was when I was with her. And guess where she is? Back with what's his face. Hope life is treating you well. Your story opened my eyes to how much better I'm doing now that I'm not with her.

[–]beginner_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Moving in / living together is just a huge step you should never do lightly. In fact you should only and really only do it if you want kids and with that woman. Else, don't do it.

Why is it so hard:

** Tons of tiny seemingly irrelevant things you do differently **

But which annoy the shit out of her or you. hence fighting will happen and often especially early on after moving together. If sucks at conflicts and conflict resolution, forget it. Having had 3 major fights prior to moving in together is a minimum requirement.

Common stuff: - cleaning how often and how well - orderliness - cooking & groceries - laundry ...

Example that annoys me: Taking out the trash bag and not putting in a new one.

We can talk all along about frame and stuff but if you live together, you won't get around compromises. This is basically like a salary negotiation. OK, they don't want to give that much but maybe better benefits? If you compromise, ask for something in return that is more valuable than what you lose.

** Easier to comply than fight **

So you have been fighting a lot and now she asks you to bring out the trash. And when they ask the mean "Do it now or I get mad and angry". You are really not in the mood to do that right now. Also you will walk there in the morning anyway when going to work so what's the rush? But then you realize the drama that will ensue and your evening will be ruined so you still do it. The longer you take this easy way out, the harder it is to later change course. Also the evening will be ruined because you are either forced to leave so she can't bother you or stay but can't do whatever you wanted to do. If you don't live together you can just go home or kick her out.

And with all that fighting and drama it's hard to impossible to always keep frame and never get caught up in emotions and lose your stoic aspect.

These are the 3 main factors a lot of relationships go south when moving in together.

[–]Tokestra420 1 point2 points  (2 children)

It's amazing how so many people from this sub have bad experiences with women. It's almost like there's a common factor.....

[–]Jkarl1 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yea. According to Carl Jung it's an underdeveloped anima in our unconscious.

[–]Tokestra420 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's how people on this sub treat women

[–]pondhockeyguyrevived 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Man posts like this scare the shit out of me..Im in a nice relationship and the heirarchy is pretty clear and im 99% sure she's a good one.. but ya never know.

[–]RepostGhostCst2Cst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Reading this made my stomach turn. Sounds eerily like my story... Good luck brother

[–]redbeaux 1 points1 points [recovered]

I'm curious to know, did any RP wisdom go through your mind when signs began to appear? Do you still believe in unicorns after this?

I'm really asking for the guy that's reading and thinking (just like you used to) that he's somehow different and this won't happen to him.

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

One fight we got into, was over the tone of my voice when I asked her where the nearest ATM to our apartment was. Same shit, she cried when I wouldn't say sorry and then got angry when I wouldn't console her because she was crying. She said " if this is how you treat women then you'll NEVER be able to have a fucking daughter, she'll wind up being a stripper"

It was then that I thought, "hmm, maybe she's nuts"

[–]Red_Faust -1 points0 points  (1 child)

Weird that when you confront them over some unacceptable behavior, even if you don't insult or make any other judgement of value over her, and just keep to the facts...

They start complaining, pouting and crying over your tone of voice...

Which tends to make us even angrier because she's not even listening...

And thus she enters the victims role, where any misdeed on her part is balanced with your evil mansplaining...

So now that we're even, no reparation or behavior change is needed...

If you think about it, it's a damn good manipulation strategy to do whatever the fuck you want with no consequences.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Regular TRP lingo doesn't explain the experience of crazy girl anon. These girls hardly think in terms of AF/BB which is by all means a solid strategy. Which constitutes to either focus on getting the Alpha and if all fails a steady Beta.

Instead the girl looks for a new source of validation every single time the old one tires or pisses her off. There is no goal. Alpha, beta. It doesn't matter, it will never last. You could be superman for all I care and you won't maintain a relationship with a cluster B woman. And even if you did, it would be a rocky one full off cheating whenever you hurt her or bore her. Which will always happen eventually.

[–]evergonitenitenigga 3 points4 points  (5 children)

not to kick you while you're down but if im gona guess the ex gives it to her better than you. im sorry. but i bet my life the ex was more rough, was more kinky, was more creative, and much more abusive and dominant in the bedroom. its really not about dick size, im filipino go figure. im fucking 4 girls in my rotation atm 3 white, 1 latina. 1 (the latina) has a long time boyfriend (they live together), 1 is seeing someone, 2 are only seeing me. the two that are 'involved' keeps coming back. why? because i fulfill their fantasy. thats it. no emotional shit. not bc im a smooth talker and i got game. no. im kinky and dominant in the bedroom, thats it. yes i know im a shitbag for doing this but im just straight up assuming and this information could help you. now, do i get on beta mode and 'fall in love' sometimes? yes. fuck yes. we're only humans. we can't deny feelings. some days i think im in love with the one who has a live-in boyfriend but i have to keep myself in check and just play my role as a dominant alpha fuck that she doesn't get from home (this latina's bf is a redneck neckbeard white guy). good luck to you and i wish you well and thank you for sharing your story. i feel compelled to write you this long ass comment bc your 'unicorn' sounds like my number 1 (the latina who has a boyfriend). cheers.

[–]kasper138 3 points4 points  (2 children)

I figured the same thing about the ex but the rest of your post is just you patting yourself on the back.

[–]evergonitenitenigga 0 points1 point  (0 children)

re-typing my reply since bot removed my comment for mentioning r / fishing. anyways, well yeah of course im patting myself on the back. if this was r / fishing then i'd share my experience and give tips on why i keep catching fishes. but i bet no one there would be like 'yeah yeah you're good at fishing you're just patting yourself on the back', but why is it different here? is it because its women and getting laid? no, not for me. its the same. both require skills and experience to be good at. both for me is also not a big deal. im still happy go home empty-handed because i still enjoyed the experience. fish or no fish im good. women or no women im good. it doesn't matter.

[–]YuriJackoffski -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

do they like ass to mouth alpha bro?

[–]evergonitenitenigga 1 point2 points  (0 children)

two of them lmao. but ALL of them likes to get choked. to be fair they asked me at some point in the beginning.

[–]BlueCollarAsshole 3 points4 points  (3 children)

Why bring politics into this? Not every redpiller is a trump supporter who shits on john oliver and liberals. You'll find a lot of smart people on here who have evidence-based political views, which often lands on the left. You sounds like a whiny little girl

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Not really sure how anyone can reconcile leftism with a practical, RP worldview but OK.

[–]bgbusiness 1 points1 points [recovered]

Sorry to hear that and thanks for sharing this story when your memories are still vivid and pain is lingering.

On the other hand, I have some questions for you. What were some of the red flags that you have ignored that you might be open to sharing?

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

Other red flags... Hmm.. She smoked astronomical amounts of weed (10-15 bowls + 1g concentrates per day) and said it didn't get her high

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Never take a stoner seriously. If she smokes, she pokes. Pretty much all stoner chicks are sluts, lol

[–]1PantsonFire1234 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well I know two who are still virgins and they smoke. But their behavior is congruent with a future slut yes. So a more accurate description would be to state that women who engage in substance abuse are erratic and unstable. And this often leads to slutting around.

Now again, you will find that most girls are in today's world so you aren't filtering anything with these red flags. You have a higher chance finding a shiny in a Pokémon game.

[–]drsherbert 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That's gotta be doing some psychological damage. I don't care what anyone says.

[–]Enigma221 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Holy shit I smoke weed daily and I only blaze about 4-5 bowls per day and I'll get stoned this girl has problems good thing getting out of there.

[–]Jyontaitaa 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think you handled yourself very well on the exit.

You just leave without anger and don't explain; she knows in her heart of hearts why you left and if she doesn't then she deserves to have her head spin for a bit anyway.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I think the main take away from this is proper vetting and not jumping in. If she cheated on you this quickly, then she is especially fucked in the head or alpha widowed. It takes a little longer than that for a woman to get bored and want new dick/attention and meet some dude at work that makes her feel special and alive again. She did this so quickly, and love bombed you, that I'm guessing she's strongly cluster b.

[–]askmrcia 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yea i think most of us agree that this woman was not normal at all and clearly fucked in the head

[–]ucfgavin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sounds like you dodged a bullet...nice work sir.

[–]Starter91 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nothing wrong with a monk mode, no stress no unpleasant situations, kinda not bad if you ask me .

[–]AnInstant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This wimyn was just crazy dude. You could spot giant red flag when she shared all interests with you. I may be not the best TRP example lately cuz TRP changed to misogynistic shit with anger phase flowing around but I do live with a girl in my apartament for more than a year and she doesn't do single shit your ex did. You just have to spot the girl early on if she's good to live with. I risked much but it's working. Maybe problem is i'm from eastern country so our women aren't so soaked with modern feminism etc.

[–]Starter91 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't get one thing, was it so hard for her to say i cheated i am breaking up pack your stuff and leave? Why did the guy have to leave? When he brought her in?

[–]Fedor_Gavnyukov 0 points1 point  (0 children)

damn son. had a similar experience, just not as bad as yours. fuck em. do your thing.

[–]martinger 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I somehow had a funny and satisfying feeling: that poor ex-guy. Hahahaha Be happy you got rid of her and learned a good lesson

[–]jgwould714 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just general advice that seems applicable here, if you don't like the way your being treated, stick up for yourself or gtfo.

[–]int3rsys 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Read everything. Take it as a lesson. You seem like a very strong guy though,I'm sure you will bounce back.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

tldr

You cant stop them from cheating even if you are james bond , what matters is how you react to their cheating . IMO one shouldnt even blink or get surprised , keep the frame and smirk .

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Women= sex & incubating children, Robots= sex & incubating children

It's not going to be a tough choice when the time comes!

Awalt!

[–]Alpha_Jedi 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sucks you had to go through that but in the end it sounds like you made it out the other side wiser, better and stronger. Thanks for sharing, it's not easy taking a critical look at these situations, but I'm sure this will help a lot of other guys out there.

[–]arlmwl 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"Pay. Attention. To. Red. Flags." - True words my friend.

[–]PeanutFlavor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"If a girl's pursuing you super hard, something is probably wrong with her"

Holy fuck is this correct. A plate of mine that I was about get into and LTR with was EXACTLY that. I got chased pretty hard. She had so many red flags waving around, but because of her acting like a unicorn, I let the guard down for a second. Luckily I snuffed it out (2 mornings ago) before any real damage could be done.

As the old saying goes: if it seems too good to be true, it probably is.

[–]vertilius 1 points1 points [recovered]

How is working late not a red flag? What kind of job does she work? Did she explain if she gets over time pay or any type of details? I would have known.

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

Won't go into specifics but she co-owns a wholesale type business. Wasn't out of the ordinary for her to work long hours dealing with vendors and money

[–]Starter91 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I guess vendors wasn't only thing she was dealing with. Sorry again bud.

[–]dropctuned 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Dude, you need to re learn everything you think you know about TRP. On the bright side, if this doesn't truly awaken you, nothing will.

[–]Zweihander747 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I never let a woman's love make me stop working on myself.

In fact, when a woman loves you thats when its time to start spinning plates and find a new challenge #DonDraper

[–]jooseygoosey 0 points1 point  (5 children)

What. The. Fuck. Did I just read.

That is the most beta shit I've read in a long time and sugar coated with Alpha sprinkles.

If those are your lessons learned, then you are probably 3/10ths of the way onto the Way. I'm being generous with that.

You been into TRP since 2012 and you whiteknighted her just in Feb 2017? You have certainly wasted a lot of time on this sub for 5 fucking years and basically learned nothing.

Now I understand how guys come here and just will "not get it".... for years or decades.

Your first mistakes go back to your first couple dates with her. Everything else flowed from there. You better be able to know what those mistakes were.

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

Haha. Can't say I disagree with you man. Beta would be an understatement. For some background - the first couple years after I discovered TRP, I basically used it to fuck my exes. I was also jacked as shit, so pulling random hb8's wasn't an issue. The problem is that deep down, on a core level, I'm a weirdo - that is, I'm a weird ass 4chan goober with a pitch black sense of humor. Not a normal guy by any stretch. And the girls I was seeing were normies, so I could never get close to them and would usually ghost after 3-4 weeks. So I had ZERO experience applying TRP to a serious relationship.

To my ex's credit, she is extremely smart, articulate, smart with money/self sufficient, owns a business, and...... Get ready for it..... A weird 4chan nerd with a dark as fuck sense of humor. When we first met, she'd flirt by sending triggered feminist memes and regurgitating my kek humor. So yeah. She saw through the facade and appealed to all my beta aspie sensibilities. When you think you just met the girl version of yourself, the male hamster mode tends to go into overdrive.

[–]jooseygoosey 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Fair enough.

But we need humor on a woman like we need a dick on her.

Also, someone that is a renter, let alone can barely pay her lease, is de facto NOT good with money/finances.

The person good with money is the one collecting the rent checks from their tenants. Unless tenant is aggressively saving for downpayment on own investment or needs flexibility of not being tied to a specific geography.

There's no way I could meet a girl version of myself. I'm too fucking awesome and not interested in dealing with a mirror image of my own bullshit.

If a chick feels comfortable to send memes "that hit home". Then you already broke the important rule of:

  • Barely texting her. Only texting to setup dates

Women will see you for MONTHS or almost a year without saying a PEEP about being GF/BF when you don't act like a BF (acting like a clown with jokes, "lol"ing to her attention seeking text/memes, seeing her more than once a week, etc)

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

In regards to the money stuff- she rents because she's 20 and has "young" credit. Her roommate was her high school best friend, and that's the only reason she even bothered having a roommate, probably. When she guilt tripped me into moving in, I knew she was full of shit about not being able to afford $1600/mo. rent. But I was a) trying to move anyway, and b) afraid she'd lose interest in me and not using my head. Pretty dumb and it doesn't justify it, but those were my reasons.

To break things down, she is the co-owner of a mmj dispensary that does ~$100,000 per month in sales. Right place/right time sort of thing. She got incredibly lucky. She typically kept about $25,000 in the bank, spread across 2 or 3 accounts. We also had a safe full of cash in our bedroom which she only let me peek into a handful of times.

[–]jooseygoosey 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Romeo and Juliet were fighting for each others' love at 14.

Many men are sent to war by age of 18.

I'm pretty sure a 20 year old adult women can buy herself some real estate to live for free by then (I did and the young men I mentor here)

1600/month?? Holy shit.

She's co-owner of a business that doesn't pay dividends or income? My fathers business also has 100k in sales. Margins are thin

[–]the99percent1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Dude. You pay her to leave.

And actually, you saved yourself a bullet here. I would be very fortunate. Imagine if you were married..

[–]IntravenousAsana 0 points1 point  (0 children)

She has borderline personality disorder, and Michael is a true dark triad. Psychologically, they were made for each other. They will be together until one or both dies/goes to jail. I went through pretty much the same thing with a bpd woman two years ago. They're talented at making you feel insane. Do some research and take your time to recoup

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

AWALT Don't fall for a plate If a girl's pursuing you super hard, something is probably wrong with her If a girl has everything in common with you, she's pandering - there are no unicorns. Pay. Attention. To. Red. Flags. Don't let a woman's love make you think it's ok to stop working on yourself. Don't fall into old habits. Don't lose frame. Don't cave. Don't be a doormat. Never move in with someone you just started dating Quitting your job is poison to women. They will lose all attraction. Trust your gut if you think she's cheating - all women are capable of cheating If she badmouths her exes, she'll badmouth you Women are pragmatic - they will lie and deceive as long as it produces a net benefit. Even when caught in a giant lie, they will continue to lie, if the lie is to their benefit. Loyalty is not a component of the female psyche.

so WTF is even point of dealing with females except sex??

[–]atraw 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Now you got the idea of trp.

[–]Maelshevek 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wow. That's some grade AAA prime foulness. I feel for you.

[–]harrylonglegs 1 points1 points [recovered]

I am so sorry about what happened. I know that it may seem like I'm just some random person on the internet lying about caring but this is such a heart shattering story. A lot of people in the comments are telling you "You should've done this you shouldn't have done that" and what has you but that's not really what you should be looking at. Don't look at what your mistakes are, this is not your fault! That girl tricked you, played with your emotions! EVEN if you DID "abuse a cat" (I don't believe you did this) or maybe didn't "console" her when she was crying, (I don't believe you did this either) in the end nobody deserves to be cheated on especially when in a monogamous relationship no matter what. One of the worst things I noticed towards the end is that you said all women are like that and lie and cheat and blah blah. Everyone lies no exceptions, so lying in a relationship is inevitable.. Another thing I noticed is that you really shouldn't group women together like that because even though there are a lot of women out there like her (sadly) there are a lot of women who aren't and would never even think of cheating on you! Don't let this women mess with your perceptions! Damaging your perspective on women to make them seem like conniving cheaters all the time (which is a common happening with men who've had their hearts broken or have been cheated on) will only make you filled with anger and hatred and from experience makes you a bald fat lonely misanthropist in the end.. I hope you read this and rethink some things (unless you already have) Have a good day! :)

[–]shabadiddlle-oo 1 points1 points [recovered]

I appreciate the input, but unfortunately because of the very specific social niche that I fall into, I'm inaccessible to women who have strong character: allow me to explain:

I'm physically attractive (maybe like an 8/10) but very quiet, and I have no "game" with women. I'm not socially awkward or shy, I just have zero interest in chatting anyone up. The idea of initiating small talk with strangers is extremely repugnant to me. Like, it'll never happen, ever. I have no shame and I'm not afraid of rejection, but idiosyncratic, meaningless, forced conversation is something that I will never endure for the sake of getting to know someone. Succinctly put - I'll fucking eat lead before I walk up to some girl at a bar.

SO, because of this, I have to wait for girls to come to me. Girls who have a strong attraction to me, who almost pester me to talk to them. AND they have to be attractive. And guess what? Those girls are fucked up, 100% of the time. Whether they have BPD, manic depressive personality disorder, issues with compulsive lying, self esteem problems, or just low emotional maturity, there is always something deeply wrong with them. Because if they weren't fucked up - if they were perfectly normal and sane - there would be no need for them to seek out and love-bomb random guys.

Bearing all of the above in mind, this is a relationship pattern that I will likely follow for the rest of my life. My personality would need to be fundamentally different in order for me to not follow that pattern over and over. My brain would need to physically rewire itself in order to make me capable of enjoying something that I deeply hate.

Have a good one.

[–]ezpzlife 1 point2 points  (2 children)

John oliver watching liberals? Bro whats wrong with that lol

[–]SovereignSoul76 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Nothing, if you enjoy collectivism & socialism.

[–]Ditario -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I think he is referencing how they are Liberals that do not know how to come to any conclusion and wait till Sunday before talking about a subject because John Oliver will tell them (literally) how to interpret an event and feel about it.

[–]malsatian 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Sorry to hear you went through that -- I've had a similar experience. Side note: are all TRP'ers anti-liberal/pro-Trump or something? Just looking for the reason behind the association there.

[–]YuriJackoffski 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I would guess most are but I think they should not be. Why be "sheep" to Chump or repugnicunts? That's no better than liberal/SJW sheep. Stick with unbiased facts, be intellectually honest and don't be a hypocrite. You don't need to limit yourself to stupid labels and their dogma.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If I got a dollar every time someone posts a BPD-Girlfriend field report and someone comments with "Had a similar experience" I'd be richer than Elon Musk.

[–]North_2345 1 points1 points [recovered]

Most people on red pill on weak ass reddit are not true red pill men. I can't stress this enough. Go lurk on things like mgtow for example or other precursor philosophies. A true red pill man doesn't get cheated on because they reject relationships , society and often live on the fringes, off the grid, nomadic or are living in the criminal underworld within society itself. All this crying over women and dating or getting cheated on etc is beta purple pill shit. Red pill men don't have these issues. Wtf

[–]YuriJackoffski 12 points13 points  (1 child)

then form TheTrueRedPill subreddit and fall asleep to the chirping crickets

[–]1PantsonFire1234 5 points6 points  (1 child)

And yet I read articles where hardcore criminals are detained for using domestic violence during an end-of-the relationship fight. What did you think that fight was about?

It's male nature to want to form harem and keep women as property. It's just that some fags call it relationships, love, marriage. Whatever it all comes down to "this my bitch". The problem is that modern society doesn't allow men to do this. You try to reinforce your territory with anything but manipulation and you get the full weight of the law on your ass.

Meanwhile women get to play their game uninterrupted. And, big shocker, they are unhappy for it. And society suffers for it. Who would have thunk.

[–]North_2345 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Women are shit creatures.. they love being mistreated whores they are

[–]SovereignSoul76 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's Asperger. You're describing someone with Asberger syndrome.

[–]Pope_Lucious 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Real Red Pill Men are 8 feet tall beasts who shower in vodka.

[–]FROST11254 -1 points0 points  (3 children)

If there was ever a reason to hit a girl... this is it

[–]Ditario 2 points3 points  (2 children)

And give her justification for her actions?

[–]FROST11254 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Justification would imply that she did what she did after being hit, the fact that she's already done it means we have the justification to hit her for hurting someone in one of the worst ways.

[–]Ditario 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's not how her hamster and how society will view it. I don't disagree with you in our judgement of her, but she will have "predicted" how bad it was with him and how bad he is and once he finally hits her now all of those assumptions are proven correct.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I don't understand one thing. Why do people here have a soft corner for Trump?

[–]TimmySatanicTurner -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

lmao, you deserved this shit

[–]BlackFallout -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

They are all the same man. They are all fucking whores. Its the fucking whore Olympics out here.

Where I'm at, all the pretty ones are taken. The only single girls are ugly as shit. If you want to fuck a pretty bitch, your taking from some other fuckstick.

Learn your lesson and move on. Enjoy life and be successful.