MGTOWThe Sexodus in action: millennials are having less sex. (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by Endorsed Contributorgekkozorz

A new study has revealed that despite the hookup culture created by Tinder et al, young people are actually having less sex than the generation before them. A quick google search reveals journalists desperate to explain this phenomena in a sensible and politically correct manner.





I skimmed all of these articles. They blame various factors: they say we're too busy, they say it's because we're living at home, they say we're more aware of the dangers of STDs, and they even suggest that women are afraid of "slut shaming." None of these piss poor excuses come even remotely close to providing satisfying explanation for why an animal species would willfully abstain from spreading its genes to the next generation. I looked through all of these, seeking the elephant in the room. None of them used the "f" word. Page searches for "feminism" returned zero results.

Which brings us to the amusing truth. Milo Yiannopolous, always ahead of everyone else, predicted and explained this sexual exodus years ago.



The truth of the matter is incredibly simple. Feminism has ruined the Western woman.

Tumblr, the blogosphere, and the MSM tell men that in order to win a woman's affections, you must become a goony beta weenie with no self respect who does everything that women tells him to do. This creates a short supply of good men.

Meanwhile, these same sources tell women that men are a bunch of animals who want to savagely beat them and rape them. Bitter older women past the wall rant about how men are the enemy who must be hated, creating an anti-male circlejerk. In order to conform to the groupthink, as women so often do, younger women pile on and agree to their man-hating sentiments. In solidarity with their unfuckable foremothers, they cut their hair short, get fat, and become equally unfuckable, somehow convincing themselves that this is what they "want." This flies in the face of what women really want - to be protected and nurtured in the company of high-quality men. The Feminine Imperative has eaten its own tail. In trying to create a world where women have everything, it's created one where many of them have nothing.

Meanwhile, feminism has ruined things on the other side of the aisle, too. Men are looking at the product of this cultural virus and saying "yeah, these people aren't worth fucking," and sticking to their porn and video games. Here's the secret about us dudes; most of us really do want the company of women, just as much as they want ours. But a simple cost/benefit analysis of the dating market reveals a whole lot of the former, significantly overshadowing the latter. Maybe you'll really hit the anti-lottery and get a false rape claim and have your life ruined. Maybe you'll play the long game, get married, and lose everything in a divorce. Or, even on a smaller scale, maybe you'll just discover that these fucking cunts aren't any fun to be around.

The result of this loser's game is that lots of desperate young people are ending up alone. Men become unfuckable beta weenies. Women become unfuckable, neurotic cunts. Everyone loses.

TLDR: millennials are fucking less. Feminism is to blame. Don't be a beta weenie. Don't surrender your life to a neurotic cunt who doesn't appreciate you.

[–]∞ Mod | RP Vanguardbsutansalt[M] [score hidden] stickied comment (27 children)

Something these figures don't take into account is...

Alpha Fucks, Beta Bucks

The number of millennials having sex reportedly decreased by 9% as a whole, but that doesn't mean women aren't having the same amount of sex as before. I strongly suspect now they're just having it with a smaller concentration of Chads, which has been the trend from hookup culture's very beginning.

I bet if you look at the figures of who's reporting what by gender that guys are disproportionately reporting they're having less sex. The fact they haven't done so just supports my suspicions. I think we can all agree that IF it was the reverse and women were disproportionately having less sex, that they'd be putting that statistic front and center and framing it as a "woman's issue" with all kinds of calls for research to explain why, to build up women's confidence, blah blah blah sex positivity, blah blah blah it's the patriarchy's fault.

The only article I saw about this that touches on gender was this one, but it didn't do an apples to apples comparison for both genders, and was looking at a drop in sexual activity by girls in the 1960s to those of today.

On top of all this the obesity epidemic is playing havoc with the sexual market for both genders, and then there's the fact porn is giving a lot of men an outlet where they end up taking themselves out of the hunt.

[–]DatFeeler 614 points614 points [recovered]

Look at your statistics. It looks to me like it's only Millenial Men that are having considerably less sex. Millenial Women are having basically the same amount of sex as women of any generation.

80/20 in action.

[–]hamsterbator 189 points190 points  (139 children)

If it was 80/20 before, now it's closer to 90/10.

Unplugged men have more access to porn, video games, and less social skills. Women have their pick of hundreds of men within a 50 mile radius.

[–]_arch_lion_daemo_ 62 points63 points  (134 children)

A question for you trp guys(I am an occasional skeptical lurker). This 80/20 you quote every so often, I understand. But on the reasons behind, I have a question. How much of the imbalance is, in your opinion, women being more "picky", and how much is men just giving up/trying less to get female company?

[–]bowie747 370 points371 points  (78 children)

We're animals, primates. And only the top 10-20% of male primates pass on their genes. The fittest males have several women each, and the beta males get nothing.

We're smarter than that. We created societies where men and women would partner off 1:1, it's the best way to ensure maximum productivity from the beta males. This system doesn't really suit women because it means most of them get stuck with a beta, when what they really want is an alpha. However it did ensure sex for men and security for women. We then created societal shaming constructs and laws to prevent divorce. Everyone accepted this as being normal, despite the fact that it ignores our biological instincts.

Now, women are sexually liberated, slut and divorce-shaming is almost nonexistent and marriages always end in a woman's favour. Also most women are able to financially support themselves. Therefore marriage has become nonessential and women don't need to rely on men for anything. So we've reverted to a more primal state where women don't fuck betas (they don't need to for any reason), now they'll only fuck alphas. So now the top 20% of men have 80% of the sex, and the bottom 80% of men get the leftover scrappy 20%.

Many men in the bottom 80% are now realising this and "checking out" of society. TRP advocates self-improvement in order to reach the top 20%. That any man can be an alpha if he works on himself sufficiently. Nonetheless lots of men can't be fucked, or don't like women enough to put in the work and I can't blame them.

[–]_arch_lion_daemo_ 48 points49 points  (38 children)

Damn, when you phrase and think about it like that it does make you think... Specially if there is a good ending to this(good as in, not leading to society going to shit and all like you guys usually predict).

[–][deleted] 65 points66 points  (0 children)

Ha society is already shit for men(and women, few alphas give away their commitment to one woman and get married, why would they when they can have a new one by tomorrow night if they so chose), at TRP we make the best out of the situation and ensure we get what we want by any means.

I don't know why you're skeptical, analyze your surroundings with TRP and you'll for sure see that TRP philosophy is pretty much facts.

[–]Magnum256 44 points45 points  (8 children)

I think one of the ideologies around here is to not worry too much about the existential bullshit and instead just focus on the moment, and bettering yourself, sort of a hedonistic approach to life.

Reality is that the world is already going to shit. So many of our systems are either archaic or completely nonsensical. One of the big problems I think is that it's almost impossible to change because we cannot unite. There are too many conflicting opinions going back and forth, largely due to the accessibility of the internet, that the idea of rallying behind one idea of meaningful change gets attacked from ten different angles.

So what can one person do to "fix" the world? Nothing. Better to just enjoy life and have the most fun you can during your prime.

[–]p00pey 33 points34 points  (1 child)

This is how I sum up the world today. We're in a downward spiral, but the peons are kept in line with shit television and what not. 100s of millions tune into the kardashians while the world is burning around us. Over population, resources dwindling, it's all in decline.

Just do what makes you happy, but first find out what makes you happy. DOn't go chasing bitches because you want to compare n count with the bros like some dick measuring contest. Don't go chasing pokemons because everyone else is chasing them...

That's why meditation is key. Allows you to focus inwardly, and find what you want out of life, and then allows you to focus on attaining those goals while clearing out the noise...

[–]SavageStalker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Meditation gives clear clarity and pure vision for your goals. Distractions are merely fillers of time. It is sad...but what you have said is the reality. The world is sick, people have betrayed themselves thinking everything is fine about their lives. No... you can make those changes, and it must start at the original source...you. Soon the Earth is going to embroil yet again into an age of darkness until then, be your best self and look after those who you value the most. Focus on the now. Julian Assange is someone people should look up to as a hero, do not consume too much media. Read from varied sources and make your own conclusions. Stand your ground.

[–]xlptu 0 points1 point  (4 children)

What about stuff like the Amish people?

[–]CornyHoosier 1 point2 points  (3 children)

What about them?

They're a subset of society that America allows to exist. Does it seem like American ever gave a shit about wiping a people out they felt threatened by?

The Amish live a secluded life and ask very little of the society around them. They life by very strict gender and communal rules. They bring shaming to a new level in order to keep their families and neighbors in line.

[–]xlptu 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I was thinking more about joining them or something.

[–]CornyHoosier 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Ha. Think you can go without technology?

Seriously though, they won't let you in. They don't like outsiders.

[–]CornyHoosier 67 points68 points  (22 children)

(This is a thought that has been roaming around my head, so take it as you will)

Everything is cyclical. For about 500 years the Roman Empire ruled the known world, and eventually they fell. We see time and time again how great societies go up and down and it generally always reverts things back to a baser level.

Did you know that almost all the large empires at one point had to implement a bachelor tax (Roman, Ottoman, England)? Their men were no longer getting married. The betas weren't getting sex. Society had demands, but since the majority of men weren't participating, society began to break down. As much as we here at TRP strive to be the alpha, the beta is who keeps society operational. They're the guys who get work done. So if they're not happy and not working, then shit begins to fall apart.

Now look at the U.S. - Can anyone deny we're in a "hookup culture"? Divorces are common, marriage is declining and women (out of necessity) are given preferential treatment by the court and support structures of America. It's a raw deal for any man, so why would he want to participate?

Marriages and sex for beta men are plummeting, they're giving up. They're retreating to their distractions (excessive: sports, video games, hobbies & likely porn) ... and with their retreat, so goes our society. Neither sex seems to be happy about it either as American women are reaching seemingly-dangerously high levels of depression and American men are reaching seemingly-dangerously high levels of suicide.

[–][deleted] 14 points14 points

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We have been in an "Empire" since 1945

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (5 children)

would you even go as to say that this idea of a "universal income" is a variety of that bachelor tax?

Shit.. i guess things really are cyclical..

[–]TheGreatRedCascadian 8 points9 points  (4 children)

Ehh, I'm gonna disagree on that one. Universal Income is an effort to address the conflicts of capitalism, a centuries old economic idea, with automation technology the likes of which Adam Smith could never imagine. I don't see it having anything to do with gender or identity politics at all.

[–]yomo86 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This. Word. By. Word.

Improving oneself is paramount. You look better, you sleep better, you are more social.

Other than that, I go to bed just as well having had an escort performing her services or just stroke one out - sex is what it is after the attached mumbo jumbo is gone: An act.

As soon as you have satisfied the constant primal urge to fuck, you have a lot of spare time.

And thinking about gambling your hard earned personal and financial assets on the the goodwill of a fickle wall-approaching woman sounds somewhat ridiculous then.

[–]iseeyou1312 12 points13 points  (10 children)

We're animals, primates. And only the top 10-20% of male primates pass on their genes.

The ratio would perhaps be that low for primates such as gorillas that have a male dominated harem, but for chimpanzees, humans, bonobos, etc... it would be much higher. As a species becomes more intelligent, the beta males become much more dangerous, forcing the top men to share the women or be killed. IIRC roughly 40% of males have passed on their genes, and 80% of women.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Means of demonstrating value are much more far reaching than simply appearance, so I can definitely believe higher than 20%. I do agree, though, that only 10-20% are truly experiencing abundance.

[–]endertheend 1 point2 points  (2 children)

People always bring up the bonobos like they mean anything. . .

People who bring them up dont realize that bonobos ONLY survive because of man protecting their habitats(go go wikipedia) if man didnt protect the habitats of the bonobos then they would have died out years ago. when ever I see bonobo in a conversation I know that person has no idea wtf they're talking about

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The conversation implies bonobos in pre-historic times where they were uninfluenced by humans

[–]iseeyou1312 1 point2 points  (0 children)

People who bring them up dont realize that bonobos ONLY survive because of man protecting their habitats(go go wikipedia) if man didnt protect the habitats of the bonobos then they would have died out years ago

It's the same with gorillas who are sexually polar opposites of bonobos. The most successful primate species other than humans is chimpanzees, who are sexually very much like humans. They're also the most intelligent apart from ourselves.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"And only the top 10-20% of male primates pass on their genes. "

Totally not true. For primates and certianly not humans.

[–]1Soarinc 1 point2 points  (1 child)

This system doesn't really suit women because it means most of them get stuck with a beta

This perfectly summarizes the moral decline of America. Women want essentially a return to primate kingdom because they don't think things all the way through to the endgame.

These women in their late teens & early twenties have no understanding yet that they will ride the cock carousel until they become alpha-widowed so hard, you could melt cold-rolled steel off their dried-up, icy empty veins.

[–]bowie747 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I can't blame women for riding the CC like they do, it's just biology.

The reason the current situation angers young men is because they were led to believe that if they worked hard they would earn the love of a good woman. Now they know want women really want, and are realising that the were lied to.

I can't even really blame the governments for executing the lying and brainwashing. They have to ensure maximum productivity and keep their people placated somehow...

[–]netherlanddwarf 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This might be the TLDR TRP explanation ever.

[–]bigdickdaddyo 2 points3 points  (7 children)

This is right on. When I was younger I was beta, raised very sheltered. I had such a hard time getting laid. Once I stopped giving a fuck, I worked on my education and career. I'm not very attractive, and I'm fat, but I'm smart, successful, confident, and make six digits. And go figure... I get more pussy thrown at me than I can handle. I'm now in that 20%!

[–]indlife 9 points9 points [recovered]

You likely get down voted for being fat. The thing is, you don't have to be an Abercrombie model to be in the 20%. 80/20 only applies to certain groups, not all groups. I would say those who hang out in lower tier social scenes it is more like 60/40, and thus guys with great personalities but not so great looks have a much better shot with women. They might not be 8-10 tens look wise, but they can still be cute girls.

[–]bigdickdaddyo 1 point2 points  (1 child)

And for being in the 20%. I guess I need to be more specific for these neckbeards. I'm not fat, I'm in good shape healthwise. Just not a model body, more like a lumberjack body. And beauty really is in the eye of the beholder. I knock down really hot chicks.

[–]el_beso_negro 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No worries man, the only guys resenting your type of success that doesn't obsess over looks are those who don't have anything going for them in other areas in life.

That being said looks are very important (almost as important as status which seems is what you have), such that you can get away with being a handsome asshole but not get a way with being an unattractive nice guy.

[–]RedEyesBlueShades 41 points42 points  (2 children)

Reasons are really not important. Ignore "reasons" and start living your life based on how things are instead of why.

To answer your question, if you really wanna phrase it as you do, it's all because of women being "choosy" - They choose not to have you, or your friend, in favour of Chad. And guess what? Chad is desirable to many women, not just one. And they are happy to share him, actually prefer to share him over having a fully committed Billy Beta.

[–]_arch_lion_daemo_ 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I see, thanks for the explanation

[–]Thomaskingo 42 points43 points  (12 children)

How much of the imbalance is

Lets talk N-counts. I haven't got any har data to back this up, but this is what my hypothesis is: 5-10 % of all men account for at least 50 % of all women's N-counts.

This mean that if you have closed community with a 100 women and 100 men, then 5-10 men will represent half of the different guys, most of the ladies have had sex with. As you might see, this means most women are fucking the same small group of guys, and there will be a big overlap the smaller the society.

Edit. This is also why the average partner count for men is wildly misguiding because then top alphas are pulling up the statistics tremendously for men. Women don't notice this at all, btw. They don't see it. They assume incorrectly the sexual market place is the same way for men, but it isn't.

[–]marplaneit 30 points31 points  (0 children)

Yeah, around that. I mean. I'm a med student, 20yo 5'11 (In a country where the avg height is 5'8), 185 lbs 14% bf, own my own flat (It was a present), I have a cool side bussiness, and a little socially retard but getting better everyday. I fuck around 6 different plates a year that I pick up in bars.

My other friends who don't hit the gym, but stay slim cause diet and regular running, they get 1 or 2 fucks a year if lucky, and putting a lot of effort. My two best friend, one is a lead singer in a popular local band, the other one in med school, but also play semi-pro rugby they fuck as much as their free time allows them.

The difference IS SO BIG. I mean, I have a bunch of chubby regular john friends, and most of them are virgins, or fucking landwhales.

[–]1Your_Coke_Dealer 12 points13 points  (1 child)

they assume incorrectly the sexual market place is the same way for men

This is always an interesting phenomenon to see when women are told that this is not the case. Some are hardened SJWs, and just say something along the lines of "deal with it" or "shut up you neckbeard", generally when this is explained on certain subreddits. In person, the response is usually more surprised. It's not unlike when a guy goes from being ugly/fat to attractive. Invisible to women to suddenly getting attention, and they wonder "where the hell were you?" Women do not see the suffering men undergo when they do not participate in the SMP

[–]Thomaskingo 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Invisible to women to suddenly getting attention, and they wonder "where the hell were you?"

This is spot on, and it's even funnier, that women also tend to rationalize the sudden attractiveness of reformed low SMV men, by thinking that they themselves have matured or the guy have "grown more up". The real explanation is almost always a physical transformation thru a year in the gym. His personality didn'tgrow half as much as his biceps, but them biceps though...

[–]HellHounded 2 points3 points  (7 children)

Well let's forget averages then. Accounting for the whole distribution of counts, the median count for a man who is 25 today is 6, and for women it's 4. So your hypothesis is numerically impossible.

And some guys attract no girls, but they're a very small percent. But I'd wager they're a very high percent of the people here, because the whole reducing the world to chads and stacys thing is kind of incompatible with being a tolerable human being that people want to be around.

[–]1Paid_Internet_Troll 2 points3 points  (1 child)

because the whole reducing the world to chads and stacys thing is kind of incompatible with being a tolerable human being that people want to be around.

Translation: Being brutally honest about the realities of the sexual marketplace will seriously anger any women or betas within earshot.

Yes, it is known.

[–]The_Red_Paw 61 points62 points  (23 children)

I would suggest it is mostly the former. There is no lack of men looking for ladies. Check out any online dating site to see a 20 to 1 ratio of men looking for women.

The women have no real need to find a husband since Uncle Sam will look after them when they are old.

The percentage of men that have gone MGTOW is almost negligible compared to the overall population. A rounding error compared to all the deluded heffers who are still holding out for a 6'2" millionaire with 6 pack abs.

[–]mgtown 51 points52 points  (1 child)

This isn't quite right.

Women seem to gain their self-worth from the number of orbiter males around them. But let's be honest. These orbiter males are a very specific demographic. Financially stable, but not stellar. Socially adequate, but not the social centre. Physically able but not with physical prowess. Yet, older, usually intellectually specialised, and emotionally invested.

Almost all of MGTOW is targeted towards the last part for these men. Without these men being emotionally invested, these women have no safety net. So yes, a lot of women hating on men and men still looking, but now the turn over is ridiculously high on the ask made by men between different women.

Women are just slow as usual to realize 1 guy being emotionally invested provides more self-worth than 1000 dating-site hits. Sort of like how 1000 Facebook friends are worth less than one real friend.

[–][deleted] 36 points37 points  (19 children)


What is this?

[–]CpCdouchebag 30 points30 points [recovered]

Japanese men in their 20s, to be more precise. It's ~71% for men in their 30s.

This is the place to be right now. Half the effort, with twice the return, both in terms of numbers of girls interested, and the perceived value each girl offers. Never looking back.

[–]yomo86 8 points9 points  (3 children)

I hate to burst your bubble. But Japanese women want a provider (I tried the AF method and only got make outs as a result). And slut shaming is rampant over there (as it should be).

[–]TheFishSeattle 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You think slut shaming is good? Some of you pussies are so short-sighted. lol.

[–]Iusethisforpornlol 2 points3 points  (7 children)

So if the Navy stations you in Okinawa, and you're on your a game, you'll get multiple times more pussy than here in the states?

[–]CpCdouchebag 9 points9 points [recovered]

Yeah, that's the case. Unless you are black, because many locals are actually afraid of black people due to a long history of rape and murder stretching all the way back to WWII.

Keep in mind, Okinawa has a much larger American population, so the social climate will be somewhat different from mainland Japan. If you can, get stationed in Yokosuka. Much easier to travel within the country (railway system, buses, etc) and you'll have access to a much larger pool of women in a larger area. A night in Roppongi, Tokyo is practically a guaranteed lay. Also keep in mind that many japanese women will also strongly desire a relationship and be more "motherly" (wanting to take care of you, hug, etc).

Have fun

[–]yomo86 2 points3 points  (2 children)

I just had some business to do in Japan. It was funny. They first ridiculed the guys, and to some extent we at TRP do sometimes the same; saying things like: You are a pussy for not chasing tail. Then they shamed them. Some ads do that like "do you want to be a herbivore or a carnivore buy X perfume" and in a recent news article they urged them to get married because they own it to the country. It is madness over there. In feminist utopia any girl could just have a baby by in vitro. But all of them want the attached slave to it.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)


What is this?

[–]Joshreece 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Perhaps you mean "Hikikimori"?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)


What is this?

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

The cost of human reproduction falls far harder on women.

For a women to reproduce, she has to become pregnant which takes 9 months. For a lot of these months, she can't fend for herself. There is also the issue of dying in childbirth.

For men, it can take 5 seconds to reproduce, and your only limiter to how many kids you have is how many different women you can fuck.

Also women have no issues about paternity, they know the kid is their's. Men on the other hand don't.

For those reasons, women are more picker and less likely to abandon their kids, and men are the inverse. Your minimal investment is 5 seconds of your time, her's is a year of reproductive life + lots of energy used to produce the child.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (5 children)

It's been proven, genetics helps a lot to know which percentage of men reproduce. Before civilization 17 Women Reproduced for Every One Man.

It's been observed in other primates (chimps etc...), women only fuck the top males.

Now the exact numbers vary depending on various parameters (male:female ratio, availability of resources, etc...). There was a great youtube video explaining this with data on humans and chimps I can't find it...

What seems to be the case is that in the current society it's harder low value male to get laid. Because females earn money so they don't have to be married (mariage is dying), apps like tinder etc... make it easier to find a top 5% male, birth control pill means hypergamy can go without constraints, etc... These reasons are making it more difficult for the average male.

[–]TheHipcrimeVocab 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Not before civilization, because of civilization. The article states as much in the first paragraph "4,000 to 8,000 years after humanity invented agriculture..." Agriculture == civilization. This was definitely the case after the rise of agrarian states with great disparities in wealth, power and land ownership.

In prehistory, the circumstances might have been very different different. Sex at Dawn posits a much more open and relaxed attitude to sexuality in primordial cultures, where competition was mainly sperm competition rather than sexual exclusivity. That is, they were having sex with a number of guys, but only one would get them pregnant (this drove the shape of the human penis, for example.

This was partly because getting what one needed to survive was much easier pre-agriculture, everything in the tribe was shared equally (no private property), and paternity was less of an issue if there was no property to pass down to one's heirs.

[–]Hakametal 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The video in question you refer to is called "Biology Culture Ideology".

[–]_arch_lion_daemo_ 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I see. I am not a skeptical as in, I don't agree with some things you guys say. Thankfully I was born smart enough to think for myself and hate things just cause the "hivemind" does. My problem with your philosophy is the lack of concern with the group/society. I get it that most of you have been disregarded by mainstream society in one way or another, and thus you feel you owe nothing to it. Looking out for yourself is fine, and I get it, but I am more of a Sheppard guy, I care too much about the coletive(and trying to save it from its autodestructive self-indulgence)

[–]Endorsed ContributorBluepillProfessor 6 points7 points  (0 children)

We owe nothing to a society that has abandoned us. Let it burn.

[–]iseeyou1312 13 points14 points  (0 children)

How much of the imbalance is, in your opinion, women being more "picky", and how much is men just giving up/trying less to get female company?

It's neither.

The Pareto principle is a rule of thumb for many aspects of life and nature. 20% of people own 80% of the land, 20% of pods contain 80% of the peas, 20% of soldiers kill 80% of the enemy, etc...

The SMP was previously restricted with monogamous bonds through the institution of marriage, and has largely been like that for the majority of people in the West for the past 1,500+ years or so. However, as religion has lost its influence, post-industrialised societies value male labour less making women more independent, invention of effective contraceptives, etc... it has merely returned to its natural state.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

On the male side I think it's due to ineffectiveness. There are definitely less men trying, but there are also more "can I kiss you" betas than ever before

[–]Theophagist 252 points253 points  (89 children)

And that's why the old bucks are cleaning up at the sororities. Gen X men are in their SMV prime right now and the young "can I kiss you" generation of men just can't compete.

[–]DarkuSchneider 38 points39 points  (8 children)

I'm 40 and the baby face has finally paid off as I get hit on by girls half my age now I am set in work and in descent shape. I consider myself average but in way better shape than my peers or these doughy or scrawny effeminate boys we have now. In HS/college I used to hate the older guys that came to the clubs and cleaned up. Working with bands in college helped but the rich kids and old guys could still get more action as I was still disney blinded but now I get it. I have money and many exciting stories and can offer instant fun now since I have no baggage to leech my resources and genuine confidence from life experience. For me what works is acting completely indifferent to their attempts at sex appeal then confidently using kino when I choose to engage. I have been complimented by more than one girl for having the balls to pull her into my arms or spank their ass playfully as I flirt with them. I was surprised spanking gets so many turned on. Daddy issues galore I imagine but the younger ones are often annoying except in small doses. Luckily most of them now days just want dial-up fuck buddies for the novelty of having an older man desiring them, whatever, its amusing letting them try to wear me out and seeing them have their first full-body orgasm after playing with boys. Learn how to work the human body and kino, women are all about the feels. They will stay with a broke POS that treats them like crap if they get fed the feels they desire.

[–]d0lphinsex 6 points7 points  (6 children)

  • Give Women Wild Screaming Orgasms by David Shade
  • Sex God Method by Daniel Rose

[–]DarkuSchneider 16 points17 points  (5 children)

Read SGM but not that first one, thanks. One key to understand with attraction and comfort is the understanding of biological stress. Men and women deal with stress differently mentally and chemically.

Men need to generate free Testosterone to lower the stress hormone Cortisol in their bodies. That is largely done by doing things including lifting, solving problems, learning/seeing new things, fulfilling your biological imperatives, etc. We can stop Cortisol production if we can relax and forget our problems for a few hours. Coritsol when it builds up too much will poison you organs so your body makes you flip out in anger to spend it in rapid blood sugar metabolism (another of the many uses of Cortisol int he body).

Women need Oxytocin to lower Cortisol and they have more of it than men as a tax for the baby bakery constantly cycling her hormones to grow/discard living tissue which is trauma on the body. Cortisol production is non stop 24/7 forever but lower after menopause. Women gets all kinds of triggers to produce Oxytocin to counter this issue that are traditionally girly stuff where they use mental comparisons (shopping for fun) and nurturing (growing things or watching kids) compliments and gifts actually touch them on a chemical level sometimes, pleasurable touch is also a trigger for some. This is why they are needy for such things, by easing insecurities the get their stress levels reduced. Oxytocin is a bonding hormone too for men and women alike. Research found women who are too stressed can't achieve orgasm as often and need a little kick start aka the mental/physical foreplay that gets them wet. Orgasms cause usually the largest single shot of Oxytocin over any other activity and the deep long orgasms make even more Oxy so her Cortisol levels get slammed down. You know when they get all kitten like and want to cling to you as they bond as well as the word love starts getting mentioned. Men just fall asleep usually from the Oxy spike and start bonding (seeds of oneitis) with her. If I had a nickel for every woman or man bitch about a bad partner to friends who tell them to break up to which they reply "But they are soooo good in bed."

The human body is an incredible chemically driven machine but remember nature programmed it to trick you into reproducing as much as possible (especially men) and has the ability to disconnect via those same hormones your reasoning centers that would stop you from saying no to someone normally. Nature made men weak against women biologically to make up for our physical advantages. Think about it if they did not hold the baby bakery we would have wiped them out eons ago. We were built for co-dependence on some levels to draw us together and mate. Research the chemical they found in crying women's tears and its ability to kill you TS levels by a couple hundred units within seconds of smelling them. This takes away your rocket fuel and you lose aggression and sex drive and frame unless you are strong, callous, or they are not real tears of fear/sadness as the experiment found the emotion has to be genuine. There's a reason the water-works work so well especially on low testosterone men.

So my point to all this i guess is learn to keep her stress low and give her the big O and she will be attracted and addicted as long as you can do that for her. Money, power, and looks are mostly gravy to make up for the bulk of men who cant 'do-it' for her from what I have seen.

[–]Azevse 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Very profound.

This needs it's own thread, would you mind writing it? Your writing style is very good and you get points across easily.

[–]DarkuSchneider 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I have been asked about that before when I have given the lengthy hormone explanation. I am working on a write up for it just struggling with some of the formatting commands in reddit. When I get it sorted and written up a little more concisely definitely will be dropping it on TRP, thanks.

[–]chadeusmaximus 27 points28 points  (1 child)

"Gen X-men". I'm a superhero!

[–]Theophagist 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Heh I'm more of a mutant but what I lack in preselection I have in charismatic masculinity.

[–][deleted] 106 points107 points  (23 children)

I'm almost 30. When I was 18-21, it seemed like women were much more interested in having sex with me, women may age and older, and they seemed more attractive. Somewhere over the years, this changed. Women seem to have gotten far less attractive, interesting, and more abusive and closed minded.

[–]Theophagist 68 points69 points  (10 children)

I started to say "Maybe you changed." But I really think women have changed, becoming less attractive and interesting. And now I have to ask myself, have women always been this ugly inside and out and I never noticed it?

[–]ThereAndBlackAgain 28 points29 points  (4 children)

Women have always been this ugly inside, it's the laxness of society that makes it come out. The women from any country 400 years ago would still have the capacity to be like these women, they were just curtailed by their societies.
The perfect woman really is the greatest thing men ever invented.

[–]TRP Vanguard: "Dark Triad Expert"IllimitableMan 43 points44 points  (3 children)

The perfect woman really is the greatest thing men ever invented.

"Feminine virtue is nothing but a convenient masculine invention." - Ninon de L'Enclos

And to quote myself from an unreleased article:

Man's most foolish visceralism is his propensity to conflate the beautiful with the virtuous, for in doing so, he invariably sees a woman for who he'd like her to be rather than for who she is. It is this flaw of instinct in which he perceives nobility as an attendent characteristic of beauty that man costs himself considerable self-detriment.

[–]Caucasian-African 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Your quote is right-on. When I come upon a beautiful woman, my instinct is to see her as virtuous, even "above" me. I've since learned that there is no correlation.

[–]TheInevitableHulk 27 points28 points  (2 children)

Yes and no

For example a dog would behave the same as a dog from 10k years ago without any society or other dogs telling him that is the correct way to act

[–]Rynolz 3 points4 points  (0 children)

An untrained dog is a pain in the ass. A well trained dog is a joy... A woman is a pain in the ass, and a feminist woman is almost untrainable.

[–][deleted] 3 points3 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]Modredpillschool 40 points41 points  (7 children)

Somewhere over the years, this changed. Women seem to have gotten far less attractive, interesting, and more abusive and closed minded.

I'm having a similar experience. I'm a bit older than you, but I've noticed the average attitudes of women go totally downhill over the past 15 years. And it's not me that's changing (At least not in a bad way, I'm in way better shape and lost a lot of weight since my early twenties).

Women have simply become less tolerable. There are few redeeming qualities to women any more.

[–]CQC3 7 points8 points  (4 children)

I have some ideas, but what do you think those redeeming qualities that they possessed in the past are?

I figure society has enabled the worst behavior with no consequences, effectively raising spoiled human beings. Spoiled human beings are the worst because they lack any sort of appreciation or understanding gained through hardship or humbling limitation. If they weren't spoiled so much, they'd turn out fairly level. Sure, hypergamy and AWALT would still exist, but to less intense degrees.

[–]Lola_L_O_L_A_Lola 19 points19 points [recovered]

The qualities of femininity are what's lacking in the average SJW, feminist-raised millennial female. You could say feminism killed femininity. Over at RedPillWomen we strive to cultivate a feminine frame that will appeal to a worthy alpha male. Beyond "being ladylike" we want to be Yielding, Receptive, Supportive, Poised, Empathetic and Pleasant.

[–]bowie747 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Reading RPW is basically the only reason I still care about dating.

[–]Endorsed ContributorBluepillProfessor 2 points3 points  (0 children)

what do you think those redeeming qualities that they possessed in the past are?

Feminine energy is receptive and warm and soft and kind. Does that describe ANY woman you know today? Women have become less feminine and less attractive. By a lot.

[–]Endorsed Contributoralways-be-closing 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Women have simply become less tolerable. There are few redeeming qualities to women any more.

It's important to note, this is an observation that plenty of men come to when they have absolutely no horse in the race.

Plenty of happily married traditional older men, plenty of younger guys who are getting sex all the time as AFs, and plenty of chump virgin missed the boat types who are out of the game will all notice the same things about modern Western women, even when the context of a social interaction is decidedly non-sexual.

Because outside of sexual interaction, there are resource competitions, and the legal rules and social tendencies have been set up to mean women don't need to behave or play fair.

It's not so much, IMHO, that women are basically shitty - - women are just people - - it's that without consequences (or incentives) people devolve into their worst selves.

[–]hawkeaglejesus 41 points42 points  (1 child)

You know what's happened in the last 10 years right? Social media, smartphones, and SJWs/feminism.

Women no longer have to put in nearly as much work to get exponentially higher amounts of validation. Before the sexual apocalypse at least it was accepted that a woman had to be pretty to get validation, but now every woman is a special snowflake and if you don't tell that 200lb+ lard ass that she's pretty you're a misogynist rapist.

Feminism has also taught women that they can berate and abuse the fuck out of men and get away with it scott free. So why bother being nice and polite when you can be shitty and the results don't change?

[–]jackandjill22 6 points7 points  (0 children)

That seriously true. They're way more abrasive then their former contemporaries; not personally quite old enough to remember however when somethings wrong it's relatively easy to tell.

/u/illimitableman everyone's close-minded isn't that right?

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (4 children)

Im sure other Gen X'rs in here will confirm this. We are spoiled for choice with girls in their early 20s. They cannot stand men their own age. I see it in action at my local bar. The bartender and all the younger guys have the hots for the girl their age behind the bar but they will not make a move. This current generation pander to these whores and get fuck all in return. It is hard to watch. At least my son will be taught properly, I will teach him to be aggressive and lead women. Rapid seduction is the only way to treat a woman yet the poor kids these days do not have a clue. I guess I will be forced to continue fucking 20 somethings deep into my 60s. It's a dirty job but someone has to do it.

[–]bowie747 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You're the hero that this world needs.

[–]SavageStalker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Having been glued to their Poke'Mon Go games certainly won't help them materialize their innate manliness. Last generation of men serve as a very important example of qualities such as : integrity, courage, tenacity, chivalry and having a sense of duty in your work/job.

[–][deleted] 28 points29 points  (2 children)


What is this?

[–][deleted] 26 points27 points  (0 children)

"That's rape!" -today's generation

[–]LadyLumen 23 points24 points  (5 children)

As a millennial woman I can agree with this. Gen X guys seem a lot more masculine than my generation. Maybe it's the fact that we have chemicals mimicking estrogen contaminating our food and water supply, maybe it's feminism, maybe it's the vast number of guys being raised without dads. It's probably a lot of things. But a lot of guys in my age group really are goony beta weenies. Many of them even seem gay (who are not gay) and walk and talk in an effeminate manner. And this whole stupid hipster trend doesn't help.

[–]wile_E_coyote_genius 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Where's the link to that mouse experiment?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)


Among the aberrations in behavior were the following: expulsion of young before weaning was complete, wounding of young, increase in homosexual behavior, inability of dominant males to maintain the defense of their territory and females, aggressive behavior of females, passivity of non-dominant males with increased attacks on each other which were not defended against.

[–]HillaryLovesSeizures 1 point2 points  (0 children)

An excellent book on this subject is Boys Adrift: The Five Factors Driving the Growing Epidemic of Unmotivated Boys and Underachieving Young Men

The endocrine disrupting phthalates (estrogen mimicking) present in plastics pose a huge problem for boys. The book states that boys born today have 50% or more less testosterone compared to boys from the 60's. These endocrine disrupting phthalates also make girls more masculine. It's scary stuff.

[–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 81 points82 points  (32 children)

That was my assessment as well, being middle of X with no shortage of young sluts wanting to fuck. However, finding one worth more and a load of man juice on her face is near impossible.

[–]Theophagist 81 points82 points  (25 children)

finding one worth more and a load of man juice on her face is near impossible.

I used to worry about that, but then I asked myself what I would even want one of those for. I don't care if she loves sports, guns, heavy metal, and hand-builds beer caddies for the top of trash cans, I only want her for her feminine essence. Male friends offer the intellectual fulfillment which I require.

[–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 25 points26 points  (1 child)

Agreed, I don't need a bitch for that. I mean one worth fucking a second time.

[–]Theophagist 0 points1 point  (0 children)

LOL true dat.

[–]cannibaloxfords 9 points10 points  (22 children)

yea but what about when its time to have a kid....when ur older.....then u start looking and watching for additional elements besides killer sex, a fine body, and divine head.

[–]Theophagist 47 points48 points  (19 children)

You speak as though this was the implied course, something to aspire to. I'm 40 years old now, no kids, divorced twice, and I seek to spin plates and do it until I die. If 19-year-old Christian virgin Sabrina Magicpussy comes into my life and I decide I want an LTR then so be it. But when a life partner becomes the goal I am treading in Disney Fantasy territory and almost guaranteed to fail.

I don't have the time or the inclination to screen women for their taste in music. Under 25, low BMI, not covered with tats, looks feminine, all the pre-req's are set, now to screen her with my weener.

[–]KumonRoguing 28 points29 points  (12 children)

I am glad this and the life partner with kids ideals are allowed to coexist here. Over in mgtow all they do is hate on mra and redpill. Then in mra all they do is hate on redpill. This is one of the most accepting subreddit regardless of what the rest of reddit may say.

[–]SatanAscending 15 points16 points  (2 children)

It's your life and you choose how to live it, right?

[–]KumonRoguing 9 points10 points  (1 child)

As long as you kick the shit out of whatever you do!

[–]killking72 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Well a lot of mgtow dudes I've seen fall victim to the mentality of "I know the one true reality" and then get a sense of superiority.

Guys in here just want to fuck bitches and high five eachother. Pretty chill.

[–]Modredpillschool 6 points7 points  (7 children)

Over in mgtow all they do is hate on mra and redpill. Then in mra all they do is hate on redpill. This is one of the most accepting subreddit regardless of what the rest of reddit may say.

I don't really get the hate. I consider MRAS and MGTOWs brothers with similar struggles and understandings. Even if I disagree with MGTOW's conclusions, and I don't think MRAs quite understand the landscape (trying to put out fires at the top of the building).

[–]DiebytheSword666 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Amen, brother -

I'm 42, and I'm turned off on the whole tattoos (and piercings) that most women have these days.

[–]cannibaloxfords 2 points3 points  (3 children)

i get what you're saying. My case is a little different, also fast approaching being older, have red pilled for a loooong time, all different sorts, colors, heights, 10's, etc.....but that male drive/instinct also wants a kid. I posted before here on this subject and got some killer replies

[–]Theophagist 2 points3 points  (2 children)

I feel you. A shame a single male can't expect to be allowed to adopt.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If 19-year-old Christian virgin Sabrina Magicpussy comes into my life and I decide I want an LTR then so be it.

I almost died laughing. This is fucking brilliant.

[–]Thomaskingo 8 points9 points  (1 child)

its time to have a kid

If that time ever comes you need someone, who hasn't had a history of egotistic behaviors. Find a women with a nurturing instinct and a responsible nature towards family life. Many of the divorce(with kids) AWALT stories have women with narcissistic personality traits in them. They simply care more about themselves than their children, and that makes a marriage and a family weak.

[–]sunkindonut149 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I feel that today's young people are more sexually adventurous.

When I was a youth observing normies around me, there was less hanky-panky. But now people are talking about whips and chains dude, whips and chains, surprise buttsecks, the Dirty Sanchez and the Cleveland Steamer.

[–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Mooj: It's not about these rusty trombone, and dirty sanchez. It's not about rainbow showers and camel-toe slide, and your Cincinnati bowtie, your Arabian goggles or the hot carl and pearl necklace, or pussy juice cocktails, and the jagged-head dildos, and the double-decker pussies. Shit stained balls, and cum swapping, and the hanging brain, it's not about the rattlesnake wiggle, and the alligator fuck house, donkey-punching, the tea-bagging-

[–]euneaux 44 points45 points  (5 children)

The 1000-Cock-Stare epidemic is worse than ever.

[–]the_pill_is_free 14 points15 points  (1 child)

Before it was just hookers and strippers that had it. After using the services of some working girls, you start noticing the dead eyes everywhere.

[–]1Your_Coke_Dealer 13 points14 points  (0 children)

So many sorority girls. They also are fully aware of how skanky they've been and have a tendency to eventually feel worthless when guys fuck them but never commit.

Well, duh, I'm not stupid and I know they're fucking a dozen other guys this week alone. Why would I take the bullet and commit?

[–]theeverywhereman 10 points10 points [recovered]

Can you elaborate a bit on this? Is it some kind of perennial cock hangover and the doom of diminishing cock returns as the wall approaches?

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)


Have you ever seen a porno where in the end of it after the woman has been finished with, her eyes are just wide open and she has a deadness in her eyes.


[–][deleted] 31 points32 points  (2 children)

This. Another article on this same study stated that only 5% of Millennial women were sexually inactive. If 15% of all Millennials are sexually inactive, this suggests that 25% of Millennial men aren't having sex at all.

The real story is that Millennial men are 5 times more likely to be incels than the women of their generation.

[–]blackhawks93 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yup. But remember that women are victims and men are oppressive. White males control everything and have absolutely no problems. /s

[–]HappyMexican 27 points28 points  (5 children)

I have tried NOT to believe this, I tried to give the benefit of the doubt, but that rule just seems to pop up as true the more I go out dating. I use to go out every weekend to bars and social events, for years now, What I find is since I am not in the top 20, getting sex is a fucking shit storm of frustrating, soul wrenching failure, and then maybe I get laid that month, but probably not.

I have been cuckold by more attractive higher SMV males already out in the field. Twice at least, my girl who I came with left with a better looking, cooler guy and slept with them instantly. The rule slapping me in the face.

Other guys who are really nice/stable cool dudes I like, had the same issues. After going to the same places I saw the same guys like me still trying as well, but because of their low SMV, they left empty handed too. They were all Lower SMV, hmm what a coincidence no?

Why put up with that shit when I can just go home and play video games, work on my skills, work out and enjoy spending time with my friends. I spent months trying to get laid and I screwed up my diet (Trying to have fun socially makes you fat), wasted hundreds of dollars, and felt like I wasted so much time. So annoying.

I think its less to do with feminism and more to do with guys are tired of begging for attention, blowing money/time and coming home with nothing all the time 95% of the time. THAT'S why we see 9 percent drop.

[–]DatFeeler 9 points9 points [recovered]

If it takes a ton of effort to get laid you might have one or both of two issues:

  1. You're not following rules #1 & #2 ( you're unattractive )

  2. You have unrealistic expectations based on your SMV position (mostly looks).

I see your point though. Most dudes these days would rather not bother. I have steady plates now, but I have to agree that the process of acquiring/replacing them feels like pulling teeth sometimes.

MGTOW might be for you.

[–]HappyMexican 1 point2 points  (1 child)

FOr sure not unrealstic with what I go for as I don't ever go for super hot women at all. I think my SMV is just below average, I am overweight by like 40 pounds (been trying to lose it for a year now though, at gym every week), but weight loss is slow because I have big over eating issues, I use to be 100 pounds bigger too.

I agree something like monk mode is probably what I need to do right now, lose the weight and get some more skills. Only issue is being by yourself for that long (I live alone too), can get pretty depressing. Going out once in doesn't seem to be enough either. I'd take any tips for that too.

[–][deleted] 23 points24 points  (10 children)

That's what I looked for in the article I read about it and no mention of male female ratio was nentioned. I guess I got the SJW sanitized version.

[–]DatFeeler 28 points28 points [recovered]

There's a link on main Reddit that has a breakdown by sex.

Something like 96% going to 93% for women and 94% going to 76% for guys. I'll try to find it.

[–]rumovoice 12 points13 points  (5 children)

This stat is completely wrong and is made by someone who wasn't able to properly read the original article. This was mentioned multiple times in top comments.

[–]elevul 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Yeah. I don't think we even have the full breakdown, sadly.

[–]pink_ego_box 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Yes we do. The article is cited in OP's link and anybody can use sci-hub to circumvent paywalls.

"The increase in adult sexual inactivity between the 1960s and 1990s cohorts was larger and significant among women (from 2.3 to 5.4 %) but not among men (from 1.7 to 1.9 %)."

"The larger increase in sexual inactivity for women (vs. men) is inconsistent with previous research finding that men and women’s sexual behaviors have become more similar"

"The shift toward higher rates of sexual inactivity among Millennials and iGen’ers was more pronounced among women and absent among Black Americans and those with a college education"

All comments above yours are stupidly misinformed opinions and not facts.

[–]elevul 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Oh. But that doesn't make sense when seen in a TRP perspective, because in real life we see young women having overwhelmingly more sex than young men. So either the interviewed women lied (probable, considering that we have seen them lie plenty of times in other non-polygraph tested surveys), the women experiencing less sex are utterly unattractive (obesity epidemic?) or there is another factor at play here.

[–]pink_ego_box 5 points6 points  (0 children)

But that doesn't make sense when seen in a TRP perspective

See, that's the problem. Your beliefs based on anecdotal evidence clash with scientific data with tons of controls. Yet you prefer your beliefs to the data to alleviate your cognitive dissonance. TRP is not a religion, dude. It's trying to see the truth and the facts to improve yourself.

There are lots of explanations of how they controlled the surveys (they're anonymous, they can refuse to answer some questions, etc...), and how they controlled the data for biases, in the study. Read it before looking for explanations that fit your beliefs.

There are also theories that explain the difference, including the fact that hookups actually rarely end up with sex (according to both male and females), and the fact that marriage occurs more lately now than before.

[–]insoucianc 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Not true. Overall decrease was an average of 15%. 5% decrease for women, 25% decrease for men.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Wow that's awful, thanks for posting it

[–]inspiron3000 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The Guardian link (https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/03/millennials-dont-have-sex) is an opinion piece by a feminist blogger.

This link refers to another article (https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2016/aug/02/less-sex-please-were-millennials-study) by the Guardian (from the previous day) by a science editor.

The initial article references the wrong paper (http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-016-0769-4) (open science behind paywall) making the stats mentioned impossibly confusing.

You may use critical thinking and find the real abstract (http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-016-0798-z) (paywall) and the full paper (http://sci-hub.cc/10.1007/s10508-016-0798-z)

[–]L-System 20 points21 points  (5 children)


It said, millennial women went from 2.3% to 5.4% that’s 2.35x. Men went from 6 to 15, 2.5x.

It’s pretty much proportional

[–]Hexthorne 46 points47 points  (2 children)

It's even more false than that. The original study is only talking about the % of the population self reporting as virgins increasing, not about amount of sex for the population overall.

Millennials are not having less sex, there's just more virgins (neckbeards and whales) within the Millennial age range than were seen previously.

These are also self reporting numbers, so it's difficult to tell if there's an actual increase in virgins or just an increase in the number of people willing to admit it in a study. The shift could also be related to access to porn, the obesity epidemic narrowing the dating pool in the top range (that's definitely a factor but hard to tell how big of one), or economic in nature.

Holy fucking hell this sub is absolute trash at parsing scientific studies.

[–][deleted] 3 points3 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]Modredpillschool 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Women could go from 1% to 2% and men from 50% to 100%. It's both a 100% increase, but don't pretend it's the same increase.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

The problem I have with the idea that 80% of women are getting fucked by the 20% of men that are Alpha is that it's wrongly assuming that 80% of women actually fuckable in the first place. As if Alphas were just running around fucking everything that moves, including fatties, post-wall women and just plain ugly bitches. I don't know about you, but in the course of a typical day; what's the proportion of all the women I come across to that I would be willing to fuck? It's nowhere near 20%. Maybe 5% at most. Now, if we only consider women in their 20's, maybe it's actually 20%. So that's it. It's not 80/20. It's 20/20.

[–]DatFeeler 3 points3 points [recovered]

It's not 80% of women fucking 20% of men. It's 80% of all sex is had by only 20% of men.

And you'd be surprised how lazy some guys are, even if they are good looking. I've seen guys that are 9+ fuck 5's because they were bored and there was nothing on TV.

My personal opinion on the subject of sex distribution: For men: Top 20% of men = 80% of sex

50th to 80th percentile of men = remaining 20% of sex spread heavily skewed towards guys that are 7's and 8's.

Bottom 50% of men = incel / zero sex

For women: 3's and above = sex as they wish and desire, quality of guys they have sex with based on availability and how bored the guy is

2's = occasionally fucked by guys that are 5's and 6's.

0/1 - incel

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Oh right, I get it now. It makes more sense to consider the 20/80 rule to be about the amount of sex, not about about the amount of people involved.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Where are the stats? I'm having trouble understanding the gender divide here.

[–]Banned_For_Opinion 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Go figure, women still choose when and where they get to Fuck. When you use sex as currency and everything is about sex, but sex. Men tend to stop trying. I know I try a lot less than I did 10 years ago because I'm sick of dealing with women's bullshit. Sticking my dick inside of them usually isn't worth the effort anymore. Usually...

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I immediately thought of the 80/20 with tinder hookup culture. Less men are having sex because women have such a ridiculous number of options readily available to them.

[–]covertpenguin3390 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Well back in the day women couldn't just "explore themselves" sexually for so long and get away with it meaning that more of the male dating pool was "taken". Now that they can bang as much as they want without too much repercussion, they can stick to the top 20 like you said. I don't just blame it on feminism though, I really do think that beta/video game nerd males have just gotten worse over time since there's no more tough love any more. Hell, I'm glad I got bullied a little bit my freshman year of highschool, got me to join the wrestling team and be good at something other than math and halo. Not being coddled in my social life is probably what drove me to be the somewhat success with women I have been now that I think of it.. Bring back bullying!

[–]PM_me_ur_earpussy 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Are you sure that you looked at them?

"The growing tendency to not to have sex at a young age was even more pronounced in women: 5.4% of millennial women were sexually inactive, up from the 2.3% of Generation X women at that age."


They also discovered that levels of sexual inactivity increased for women more than men,

[–]cs_throwawayyy 261 points262 points  (80 children)

I personally blame the rise of social media. Before all of this, people weren't aware of the high watermark lifestyles. Now all you have to do is scroll through any social media feed to find at any given moment that some one is having a great time(vacation, job promotion, getting married, etc).

So now the expectations for great life has increased, throw in women hypergamous ways. Do you think they want to settle for TV on the couch every night.

Ignorance truly is bliss, now everyone is playing the rat race trying to one up the other on social media.

[–][deleted] 128 points129 points  (58 children)

You just described Toronto

[–]Mildsoss 68 points69 points  (28 children)

I keep hearing this about Toronto women. Are they really that terrible?

[–]____MegaManX____ 112 points113 points  (11 children)

Toronto Canadian women are the core of feminism, the fucking bee hive of Feminists. 95% of them are looking for Drake lifestyle type men

[–]Skully5591 90 points91 points  (1 child)

And they don't even look close to the hoes we see on Drake's videos.

[–]d0lphinsex 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Sounds like Swedish Stockholm women as well (I guess Canada ~ Sweden).

[–][deleted] 4 points4 points

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Starting to think that asshole game is the only thing that works in this town.

[–]PrimeNumber301 2 points2 points [recovered]

What's a Drake lifestyle? I know that he's a musician, but not much beyond that.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Well he's worth about $90 million. Seen courtside at many NBA games and is friends with a lot of athletes. Gets to party and live a lavish lifestyle. Probably eat at really nice restaurants and stay at luxury hotels. Fly in a private jet.

[–]setzer_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm doing just fine over here. Its true they put up a very cold feminist shit testing front. But like all women, it can be broken down. Their true feminine character is inside of them just waiting to come out. Hypergamy definitely runs deep around here, but I consider it healthy for me to keep myself in check though, realizing its a dog eat dog world and men are competing for the top spots always. It forces you to compete, no slacking off. If you can make it out here you can make it anywhere. Going back to suburban GTA cities seems like a joke now.

[–][deleted] 60 points61 points  (11 children)

I never understood how bad the GTA area was until I experienced myself. Working in Ottawa and Toronto for 8 months showed me everything I needed to know about the situation.

Effectively every woman in Toronto is seeking the Sex in the City lifestyle they see on television. This combined with an educational system which is heavily influenced by feminism and equality of outcome has lead to a multi-generational set of self entitled virtue signalers.

Not to mention the vast majority of above median salary careers are in government and largely have "equal opportunity" hiring practices. These are largely equal outcome not equal opportunity in nature like all affirmative action systems.

You also have a rapidly increasing housing in-affordability problem.

It's pretty much doom for white beta males. Only the most specialized can be successful there. You also have to consider that unlike the US, Canada is mostly white. Roughly 16% of the population is non white. Unlike the US this does not include South American, Native American, Indian & Caribbean as white. With blacks being the smallest visible demographic representing less than 1%. However, Toronto specifically represents more than half the non white population of the country.

You have a large group of virtue signalers which have never left there backyard and assume Canada is multicultural. This is one of the biggest lies in Canadian culture. The reality is you have white Canada with Vancouver representing most of the Asian subset and the GTA representing all other ethnic groups mostly in Toronto, Peterborough and Brampton.

With the only notable exception of Native Americans which has pockets all over the country largely due to the reservation system with most living in poverty due to corruption in their own communities.

[–]NietzscheExplosion 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Interesting comment to me as a fellow Canadian, however I don't see your point with mentioning "Canada so white"...

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

The reason is largely based on how the above median salary jobs in the GTA area are largely government or corporate based for the masses. I challenge to find a job posting which does specific state "we are an equal opportunity employer...." which is code for we are only going to hire white men if they are the only qualified applicant.

This has resulted in a salary gap against white straight men under 35 which is very traceable in both the GTA areas and other similar cities like Ottawa or London in the UK.

Naturally this elevates women and minority salaries as a result. Earning is a large part of female sexual strategy.

Granted your 20 - 25 year old slut only wants you to have enough walking around money to feed her lifestyle of partying. However most men can't even manage this in a good part of the inner city due to raising costs and work pay scarcity.

The link is pretty obvious why your seeing a decrease in male sexual activity in the region under 35. Not to mention this turns HR departments into a virtue signalling pissing match to see who can attract the most non white male employees.

[–]NietzscheExplosion 4 points5 points  (1 child)

I see, and completely agree. We just got passed the "are you a white guy", federal, "equal opportunity" survey at work as a private company. This is required to bid for Federal government contracts. It's "voluntary". We shall see, I will not be filling it out for obvious political and philosophical reasons. Why fill out a voluntary survey designed to hurt my demographic?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The reality is because they lump women and minorities it's basically just women.

half the population is women and 8% of the minority population is male. 4% of this in the GTA.

So the policies benefit 50% of the white population which is roughly 84% + the female minority roughly 8% vs 8% of the male minority population.

It's 92% (total pop) vs 8% in a female/male demographic sense.

in reality 96% of the jobs go to women and 4% to men which are in a specific sub set assuming you get a wide variety of candidates within the GTA specifically.

These are choose jobs it's not hard to see the real problem here.

[–]MAWL_SC 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am from Quebec, every woman I dated from Ontario was a snotty cunt. This is judgy disclaimer , but Ontarians always struck me as cultureless bystanders, vanilla Canadians, they even sound like Americans when they talk(not that that is bad, but to illustrate a point). It's assy to say but w/e.

[–]LosingMoneyAllDay 31 points32 points  (0 children)

Yeah no kidding. You can't afford real estate? Neeeeeexxxtt

[–]I_Need_More_Space_ 12 points13 points  (25 children)

So why not move? Why don't men just move on and leave Toronto to the feminists to keep their city running? It would surely fail pretty quickly. Honestly, I move around a lot. Moving is not a issue for me. Thinking of living somewhere that sucks just makes no sense.

[–]The_Turbinator 36 points36 points [recovered]

Take a look at this population density map of Canada. Toronto quite literally IS the centre of the universe in Canada. This is where the greatest amount of our population lives. This is where all the jobs are.

Simple as that.

The population density map: http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recensement/2006/as-sa/97-550/vignettes/img/map-2006-pop-density-canada-sz01-en.gif

Same, but presented in a way that shows you more clearly where everyone is consecrated in to: http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/11-402-x/2010000/chap/geo/c-g/map1-eng.gif

Based on that, the only other viable option is Montréal. Which is in the province of Québec. A French speaking part of Canada, where you absolutely positively have to know fluent French to live and work in. No one in Toronto speaks French. Your other option is the prairie provinces and no one wants to live there unless they absolutely positively have to because the winters are long, cold, and unforgiving. The last option is Vancouver. Low population, scarce jobs, the most expensive real estate in country. An average price of a house is now 1.2 million dollars in Vancouver due to unchecked foreign Chinese national ownership of Canadian property. The rich Chinese nationals use Vancouver real estate as a safe haven to hide their money from China, pricing the Canadian citizens right out of home ownership.

Canada is really actually a pretty shity country to live in.

[–]NietzscheExplosion 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Canada in 20 years will be a collection of city/provincial states. The "country" is done. The federal government provides NO return on investment and is not powerful enough to survive tough times (and the misogyny bubble be just around the corner fellas).

It is currently easier for most areas to trade with U.S counterparts than other provinces. (I.E Southern ON with it's manufacturing U.S buddies, Ohio, Michigan and west NY. Alberta with U.S oil south and Natty gass gobbling California, Vancouver with whoever will stick a dick in her)

We can't get a new rail line built let alone a trade agreement countrywide. It's not even as solvent as the EU. We have been part and parcel sold to the highest corporate bidders, but one thing we have , at least here in Alberta is a nasty winter to help kick their corrupt fucking asses out when the time is right.

I look forward to that and not being attached to Toronto in anyway whatsoever.

[–]I_Need_More_Space_ 16 points17 points  (6 children)

And I always hear dipshit entitled Americans say, "Canada has free healthcare, and people are happy in Canada."

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Til where the fuck Toronto is

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Actually, you don't ABSOLUTELY need to know French to work and live in Montreal. Sure, it doesn't hurt, but as an anglohpone (native english speaker) I've managed to get by more or less with a rudimentary understanding of the french language.

Mind you, the job market here is shit.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Montreal is the only outliner. Anywhere else in Quebec, you need French 100%.

People will even look down incredibly hard if you have an accent (speaking French).

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger 86 points87 points  (3 children)

The funny thing is, people aren't actually having awesome lives. Their social media pages are the highlight reel. The parts they want to show the outside world.

Off of Facebook people fight, worry about money, deal with sick kids, work sucks, shit breaks, things need cooking and cleaning.

When you spend 18 hours a day on your fucking cell phone reading social media and seeing how awesome everybody else's highlight reels look, you start to feel like your life is falling apart. Like you're the only one who doesn't have an awesome life.

This is especially painful for women. When they look at all of the fancy trips and glamour shots on Facebook, it seems like everyone else's husbands and boyfriends must make more money, look better, spend more time doing cool shit, etc.

Social media makes attached women think that they've undersold themselves and need to get out, and unattached women think that objectively good guys aren't good enough.

[–]I_Need_More_Space_ 37 points38 points  (1 child)

Preach on reverend. People can't believe why I don't have ANY social media when I have a pretty awesome traveling profession. Women especially don't understand. "Why aren't you showing off on Facebook?," is the look and vibe I get. Um. Because I don't give a shit about sharing my life with people who don't matter. I'm aware of the humble brag, but it was necessary. Pardon.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is the most pithy, succinct, salient description of the fool's gold that is social media that I have ever read. This is also why I don't have facebook, twitter, or instagram. I have a great life and it is completely free of online attention whoring.

[–]StirlingG 42 points42 points [recovered]

Do you think they want to settle for TV on the couch every night.

Ironically, this is what most women do now. Sit on the couch and wait for a high-smv male to fawn on them for their looks.

[–]Morpheus-Man 35 points36 points  (8 children)

Lazy ass bitches that netflix and chill their entire youth, going to the gym once or twice a year for snapchat views, while cock falls on their lap via tinder

[–]Drogba006 40 points41 points  (7 children)

Hobbies: Coffee, pizza, friends, Netflix, good vibes.

Love it

[–]Rynolz 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Holy shit that's every millennial girl alive right now.

[–]Drogba006 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Realistically? No, but a large majority

[–]99_Problem 11 points12 points  (1 child)

And "traveling." Don't forget traveling.

[–]SavageStalker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Very accurate. Add in there 'Bubbly personality' and that's probably about it.

[–]askmrcia 31 points32 points  (1 child)

Easily the best and most true comment on this thread. Could not agree more. Thanks to social media, women never want to come across as boring. They look at all their friend's social media pages taking these amazing vacations and want that themselves.

You all really think girls love to travel? Hell no. They say they love to travel to seem more interesting. Girls only travel just to post pictures of themselves to show how cool their lifestyle is. Actually girls only go out to clubs to post pictures to show how cool their social life is. They will go to clubs just to take pictures and post it on the Internet. Just go to any club or high traffic bar and watch all the selfie takers.

So if you're a guy in a relationship, how can you keep up? You're going to have to keep sending more and more money and time going to all these activities just to make it seem like you have a life.

No modern girl wants a guy who's going to go to work, workout and watch Netflix when he gets home on most nights. That's boring. She can't post that shit online. You have to take her to clubs, sporting events, vacations to South Beach or the Mardi Gras, ect...

You can't do that then you have to cause some drama so she can have something to talk to her friends about to make her life seem interesting. You can't do that then she will leave. Social media is a huge issue

[–]2Overkillengine 15 points16 points  (0 children)

There are some benefits to social media for men though - it is a good red flag indicator tool that women voluntarily use to out themselves as poor LTR prospects but prime pump and dump prospects.

The more social media she engages in, the more of a media validation junkie she is.

Act accordingly.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Social Media has also increased people's narcissistic tendencies. think about how social media is. You literally bragging about how great your life is. People talk about being able to connect and all that, but I'm convince that social media is a "Narcissist's Dream Come True"

[–]1scissor_me_timbers00 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah no kidding. One of my pet peeves is when our culture acts like we're living in this awesome new technological age with all this cool new stuff like Facebook, and how were right around the corner from solving most of the worlds problems with tech and science. "The 21st century is gonna be great man"

In reality, much of this shit is deteriorating the cultural fabric that actually gave life meaning. Don't get me wrong, I'm not religious conservative, but things like Facebook are a paltry imitation of social life.

[–]virtualvirgincake 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Delete Facebook and change your life

[–]fakenate1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh thank goodness those were actual caviar dreams I was having back in the 80's.

[–]Modredpillschool[M] 102 points103 points  (37 children)

Some factors that I think are helping these stats:

  • Instant and free access to porn (not a substitute for sex, but definitely lowers men's drive to achieve natural sex).
  • Feminism changing female attitudes.
  • The shift in the sexual market taking away opportunity where betas used to thrive.
  • Obesity.

[–]mrheh 54 points55 points  (27 children)

Don't forget student are being programmed from a young age everything is rape and sexual harassment now with the added cherry on top is every single class will discuss how evil men, especially white men are. Boys/Teens are terrified to be labeled a sexual harasser and rapist or repeat the "mistakes" of other evil men in history. They are encouraged at a very young age to be a new generation of "men" who will basically be the weakest human he can be so woman don't feel inferior.

[–]askmrcia 71 points72 points  (25 children)

This. There was a thread on the front page of reddit yesterday, where a user was asking girls what makes a guy creepy.

And the answers were just....

Put it this way most of the answers that girls say what makes a guy creepy is the following :

  1. Don't know how to take a hint that we're not interested.

  2. Adding girls on Facebook

  3. Messaging girls on Facebook

  4. Walking up to them and trying to talk to them when they don't even know you

  5. Eye fucking them

  6. If they text back short responses, then that means they not interested. So guys need to get the hint.

  7. Calling them on the phone because no one calls anymore.

  8. Trying to touch the girl on the first date

  9. When making out, trying to move hand on crotch area

I can keep going. Girls are pretty much telling guys that just interacting with them can make a guy a creepy rapist. Guys are being taught to walk on egg shells around women now. The guys that so well with women are guys who don't give a shit being called a creepy rapist. But most men feel like they can't interact with women because they will be called a creep. And people wonder why guys fear rejection. It's not the fear of rejection, it's the fear of being humiliated and getting a label placed on you.

[–][deleted] 53 points54 points  (2 children)

It's not the fear of rejection, it's the fear of being humiliated and getting a label placed on you.

Exactly this. Calling a guy creepy is a complete deathblow to them. I'm in great shape and pretty decent looking, but I would rather be called fat, dumb, stupid, idiot and all that, before being called creepy.

[–]marplaneit 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I can make the most sexist jokes, use sexs jokes, all around my classmates at med school, and they all laugh.

Poor nerdy dude, made a so so joke being the most insecure bastard, and girls tried to be nice and made a half ass haha.

After that, all they did was telling me how a creep this dude was. Like really?

[–]mrheh 26 points27 points  (3 children)

Thank god I'm 31 now and the crazy feminist shit wasn't where it is now when I was just starting school. These little kids are going to hate themselves and be terrified of girls and too afraid to ask a man for advice because men are the cause of every problem in society and history.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 18 points19 points  (2 children)

this is exactly why I didn't have strong male friendships. The masculine men talked game. I didn't know why they would be jerks to me or my other (soft) friends. They spoke a completely different language and showed no effort to make me a part of their circle. Looking back, why should they? I was a weak (feminized) man. The end result was that there were two men: good men and evil men. Feminism divides men against themselves.

[–]luciansolaris 3 points4 points  (1 child)


[Praise KEK!](91403)

[–]2awalt_cupcake 2 points3 points  (0 children)

We're losing that too. I've been in multiple fights with men since joining this sub over girls and not because I was gaming them! Just because they thought I was going to.

Brotherhood < pussy

[–]misfit2872 23 points24 points  (7 children)

The most prominent way to be labelled a "creep" by women......not being a Chad,not being alpha enough for their tastes....or not being a douchebag.....basically being a member of the 80% club....

[–]2awalt_cupcake 17 points18 points  (3 children)

The other way is to be Chad in her eyes and then turn into a sniveling beta. She'll think she got tricked into fucking you for so long. That means she was raped and you are a rapist that tricks women into fucking.

[–]saibot83 9 points10 points  (2 children)

I've made this mistake once or twice. Oh... the HATRED that came my way. It turned me off of women quite a bit. I'm the same guy I've always been. I just got feelings for them and became too needy. I'm trying very hard to exorcise that part of me. I was insanely beta back in the day. Less so nowadays but it still lingers. The ghost of non girlfriends past.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 4 points5 points  (0 children)

This shows how narrow minded women are of men. They expect us to be these walking stud machines and lo and behold when we turn out to be normal people with feelings, they retaliate in disgust!

[–]KinkadesNightmare 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You gotta tell me how you turn off the neediness.

[–]askmrcia 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Exactly. Creeps are defined if a girl likes you or not.

I've known guys that stalked their girlfriends, showing up at work, waiting outside their jobs and shit and guess what? Girls would still sleep with them because they are attracted to them.

Now you get some austic fat guy doing that shit. You're going to jail and get the stalker label.

[–]TRP117 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Ironically actually creepy individuals such as Ted bundy usually have a harem of sorts that looks up to them and is attracted to them.

I mean look at the amount of pregnant prison workers and guards.

^ these people seem way more creepy to me than some guy who is stuttering and scared giving you a complement. But I'm a fucking man right, I wouldn't understand.

[–]d0lphinsex 13 points14 points  (6 children)

Eye fucking them

When making out, trying to move hand on crotch area

This is my game. Works 60% of the time, every time.

[–]askmrcia 2 points3 points  (5 children)

It's my game as well. It works quite well for me

[–]d0lphinsex 6 points7 points  (4 children)

  1. Eye fuck girl.
  2. See if she responds (looks at you, looks away, looks at you again, maybe smiles and eye fuck you back)
  3. If not - NEXT
  4. If - go forward and make out with her.
  5. ESCALATE. Move hands on ass, breasts, crotch.
  6. Make her feel your hard-on (important)
  7. Talk dirty to her, tell her you want to fuck her.
  8. Ask if she wants to go home to you.
  9. If not - NEXT
  10. If - Great Success!

How's your procedure?

[–]askmrcia 5 points6 points  (3 children)

I honestly have nothing else to add. I pretty much do exactly what you did.

I'm seeing a girl now who I'm currently dating doing exactly how you described.

Make eye contact, smile, hug (pull her so that she can feel your boner), kiss, run hands from back, to waste, to butt, then place her hand on my crotch and proceed from there.

If she stops you then move on then stop. If not, keep going until you get a hard "no". I always had a fear of escalating in high school and being called that "creepy guy". The one time I didn't care if I was called one was how I got laid and the rest is history.

Based on everything you and I just said, we are the biggest creeps based on what female redditors say. Lol it is what it is.

[–]d0lphinsex 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Fucking YES! I try to visualize me being Michael Douglas eye fucking Sharon Stone in Basic Instinct. So spot on how I want it to be (and how it goes most of the time). It works best if the dance floor is crowded though. Where do you do it?

Based on everything you and I just said, we are the biggest creeps based on what female redditors say. Lol it is what it is.

Yeah we're the definition of sexual harassment. It works though, so the ugly SJW:s can fuck right off. Strange that behaving like an alpha makes girls instant horny and wet.

[–]askmrcia 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Exactly, dance floor works great. Now where I do it most is when u take a girl out for drinks and when I drop them off I get out the car and hug them. And then I start the process from there. So usually its in their drive way, late at night where no one can see me.

This is why I always try to pick the girl up. If you just meet them somewhere, you just cocked block yourself.

[–]MAWL_SC 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You guys need to write a how to guide! Don't stop now,lol.

[–]TooMuchToDoo 31 points32 points  (2 children)

I think the correlation between obesity and the easy access to porn cannot be understated. The US Department of Health states that 64% of the female population in the US are overweight and 36% of the population is obese (as an aside, the male population is 74% and 36% respectively, but the fact is that women aren't attracted to men in the same way as men are attracted to women-- we're attracted to good looks and beauty, women are attracted to that, along with charm, wit, job security... etc).

While the obesity epidemic spreads, males have easier access to viewing ungodly attractive women who appear more than happy to shag them, even if it might be through a computer screen. Looking out their windows to see Suzy McLandmass isn't exactly a motivator to get outside and mingle with the opposite sex.

[–]MAWL_SC 2 points3 points  (1 child)

You know, it's interesting. If some fat old girl is suddenly present I'm like w/e, but if I know a young hotty will be around it's pushups, shave, best clothes, cologne, etc.

I struggle reconciling if this is pedestalising or simply alpha behavior.

[–]Limekill 2 points3 points  (0 children)


It's not. Its getting what you want.

Pedestaling is being her bitch (i.e giving her everything/anything she wants and you get little or nothing in return).

[–]FRedington 3 points3 points [recovered]

Would you consider that more younger men without the personal experience of having been "Divorce Raped" as many of their fathers have been are choosing to GTOW rather than experience what their fathers have first hand?

[–]Modredpillschool 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I don't know if that's affecting the virginity rates, but I know it's affecting the marriage rates for sure.

[–]tenix 37 points38 points  (2 children)

I have been lurking for about 2 years now and finally deciding to post. I would go further to say that social media is a major cause for this. Social media allows hypergamy to run unchecked. Imagine being a in a relationship while your girlfriend is constantly posting on twitter, facebook, snapchat and while secretly looking for the next highest bidder. It's disgusting. Our mothers did not do this. Our grandmothers did not do this. Western women today get more daily attention than 1950s movie stars.

Looks like someone else posted this, too.

[–]2Overkillengine 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Social media is just gas tossed on the already burning fires of Rome. Letting women have a pass on the obligations that gave men a reason to treat them as anything other than a disposable meat hole while still sticking men (specifically the ones whom were participating in society in good faith) with the bill was the spark that started the hellish inferno burning society down around our ears.

[–][deleted] 83 points84 points  (10 children)


I think that's the source. Read through the article and it's really weird they didn't plot gender differences. How do you write a paper about sex in different age groups and generations, but ignore gender differences? Or differences in sub-groups? Seriously weird.

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorCopperFox3c 116 points117 points  (7 children)

This is a common Progressive tactic, the lie of omission. You'll see various disparities discussed in news articles and wikipedia articles regarding race or age, but they will curiously leave out gender differences unless the data support their worldview.

I wrote a post about this related to male unemployment and inner city violence a while back here: Lies of Omission – Progressives and the “Wizard behind the Curtain”

[–]103342 20 points21 points  (2 children)

Just the fact that they refuse to paint the full picture says pretty much everything you need to know and more.

[–][deleted] 2 points2 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]Hexthorne 4 points5 points  (2 children)

The lie of omission is as old as time and is used on all sides. Ascribing it to progressives alone just shows your ideological biases and contributes nothing.

If you've picked an ideological side (conservative vs. liberal, republican vs. democrat, communist vs. capitalist) you've already been taken in by someone who's using you and/or your vote to get what they want. Better to evaluate independently and use what works, rather than get hung up on labels. Don't fool yourself into thinking you're special because you "saw through the progressive/conservative lies" - that just means you're being taken for a ride on some other issue by your own side.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

You cant relativise everything. Liberalism gets a bad rap on the internet because after FDR, Liberalism changed hands from people who wanted freedom to those who would use the state to help certain groups to a larger share of the national wealth. Republicans used to be the Liberals, abolishing slavery to the protest of Democrats. In Europe, Liberalism was never really a thing anyway, we go from Fascist to Democratic and back again in one day.

But the fact is that modern progressivism is really a whole new era of bullshit. Its extremely sick as this "the ends justify the means" shit makes people cool with Hillary Clinton basically corrupting everything she touches. Fraud and Felony are cool under progressivism, which is a feature this ideology shares with Totalitarianism, not Liberality.

[–]dewise 1 point2 points  (0 children)

In totalitarian states of the past corruption, fraud and felony were not cool, at least publicly. You cannot sit on bayonets, you need to project image of being just! People engaged in criminal activities as long as they could get away with it. The bad stuff was a bad stuff, it existence was denied as far as possible, but if it was no longer possible, perpetrations paid the heavy price. If you did something bad and many people knew so, there was no way for you to get away with it, whoever you are: the system would punish you, because it needs to project image of justice for its own safety!

With values shifting, the modern "western" system no longer needs to project image of being just. You just need to adhere to "holy" ideology, advance it by all menace necessary and all of your sins will be forgotten. This so called "social justice" is neither social nor is justice. It non-religious ideology, basically medieval stuff.

If we were evil geniuses engineering unjust, anti-social ideology, how would we call it? Yeah, that's right.

[–]playingwithfyre 78 points79 points  (15 children)

Matching efficiency had increased due to technology. Less compromise necessary, shift further towards 80/20.

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[–]offthebeatmeoff 23 points24 points  (8 children)

It's multiple factors. It's a perfect storm of several factors. Less slut shaming. Online dating is the norm now. As a result of these factors and possibly more girls have access to more attractive men at the tip of their fingers with less social repercussions. You can't really blame them for any of it.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (6 children)

I'd add economics to the list of factors. Women have never been as economically independent as they are today, millennial women especially. Average men are simply not needed anymore. Before, they received sex in exchange for provisioning, now they're useless. Just look at the rate of women's academic achievement: how could a phd be attracted to a loser working at gamestop and smoking weed all day? I'd say economics is the major factor, feminism simply rationalized what had already happened.

[–]offthebeatmeoff 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I didn't even think of that one, but you're right in a sense. This is anecdotal so don't take it as hard evidence, but I noticed more educated are bigger sluts. I'm pretty young. I won't say my exact age, but I hooked up with Phd candidates and MDs who all kind of made the first move on me. It was all pretty good, but they acted high and mighty and pretended like they couldn't give me a relationship because of my age and how were in 2 different places. Like I'd actually want to date some pretentious skank 5 years older than me.

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[–]d0lphinsex 2 points3 points  (0 children)

how could a phd be attracted to a loser working at gamestop and smoking weed all day

Brad Pitt looking? My best friend's brother works as a janitor. He's dating a very successful photographer who buys him trips, invites him to parties with millionaires etc. He's 25, she's a hot 40+ milf.

[–]Camberlain 32 points33 points  (1 child)

I agree. In generations past there were a small number of players who got lots of girls and a small number of losers who got none. The bulk of guys got their one wife or girlfriend. It seems that due to changes in society and technology the number of both players and losers have skyrocketed and the monogamous couples have decreaced.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)


What is this?

[–]MOCKxTHExCROSS 104 points104 points [recovered]

I believe there are several reasons for the marked increase in male virgins:

  1. Increased levels of economic inequality and debt, particularly for millennials. This negatively impacts the provisioning strategy behind BB for males only.

  2. Increased levels of obesity. This negatively impacts men more because unattractive men have more difficulty securing sex than women.

  3. Decreased testosterone due to environmental endocrine disruptors and obesity. Women prefer high T men, especially for sexual relationships.

  4. Lack of male role models in education. Game is learned, not innate, and these missing men are the ones who used to teach it.

  5. Ease of access to porn from a young age reducing the physical consequences of a sexless lifestyle, and rewriting the reward system around sex.

Edited per feedback.

[–]Bearhardy 68 points69 points  (29 children)

I think the 1 and the 6 are the biggest ones, take me for example I'm no virgin, I'm fit and look good but for me it's not worth the hassle or the money to pursue meaningless sex because that's all you can get fromwomen now a days, if they fall in my lap good if not I got porn so I don't go insane, the rest of my time goes into working, reading and trying to get out of this goddam rat race

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[–][deleted] 53 points54 points  (17 children)

Former fat loser here. Escorts are pretty rad, I wake up and hit the gym, hit the market on my way home, make a phone call or two, then a ho arrives to tell me how good my cooking smells and I bang her in between stirring the pot.

No she doesn't get to taste it.

[–]I_Need_More_Space_ 15 points16 points  (10 children)

I'd be pretty paranoid to order one in the U.S. When in Amsterdam though, its all in. ;)

Do you take an escort on a date first to see that she isn't po-po? Fuck. The whole idea is pretty scary in the states. Bravo to you for being successful at it.

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (8 children)

Dude no.

When I was still a naive faggot I took one on a date. We went for ice cream as it was a super hot day. That same girl did a hit of heroine and a line of coke (no idea why you'd do both) in the bathroom the moment we hit a hotel.

No fucking thank you.

You're paying her to be there, pump her until your dick doesn't work anymore then kick her out. I did it once in the US and got some crazy dominant chick she was fun. To be honest the only time I've ever had an issue was in Amsterdam... one of the chick's in the glass doors called me over and I was like welp why not and the moment I get in there she puts her hand on the alarm button and is like "give me your wallet or I'm calling the cops".

[–]I_Need_More_Space_ 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Dude, that is a terrible experience. I'm sorry to hear that. I've been to TRL Distict like 6 times on 2 different Amsterdam trips. And I'll keep going back. Never had a problem.

Just don't go drunk. I think day fucking is better than night fucking. The night hoes seem to be really greedy for money and don't perform well probably due to the higher rent for the evening shift. The most beautiful Czech Republic absolute HB10 fucked me stupid on 2 separate occasions (1 trip) like at 2 p.m. I still think about that fucking broad. Perfection.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't drink so he while experience was sober.

But that's beside the point honestly. I've had a number of experiences like yours elsewhere, typically day fucks especially with any pay for play things as the day crowd are way way way more normal.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Oh shit. I was going to go to some Amsterdam whores at some point. Isn't it legal over there?

[–]DarkuSchneider 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It is risky business indeed not for the faint of heart. The bigger the city the more likely there is vice police to curtail it. Small towns don't have the money for undercover vice unless its a blatantly obvious issue there. The pros usually have some disclaimer on their advert that by contacting them you are contractually agreeing you are not police or investigating anything or entrapment etc... but you will see flakes and scams on the streets and red light districts.

If you are in the states just go to Vegas. It's cheap to go to Vegas especially in the off season and have a sex-cation. You can either try to game tons of out of town women that may want no strings adventures too at the casinos (slots for sluts) or you can go to legal prostitutes in a nearby county as it's not legal in Vegas itself. The sex ranches come to Vegas and pick up/drop off guests on a shuttle if you don't want to drive. It's a little more pricey than the illegal trade but you can get real porn stars sometimes and the state tests sex workers regularly to verify they are not disease ridden or fucking you in a drug den. The state touts a good health and safety record because of regulation. The no jail/getting mugged part is nice too. You can also go to Tijuana, it's cheaper but riskier outside the fancy cat houses.

My buddy spent $1200 in NV and banged a hot porn star all night long and had a blast. You can spend a couple hundred for regular girls and negotiate the fee and expected experience. I tried it for the novelty but not for me really. I am not a young man anymore and thoroughly over pussy. IMHO If you have more money than free time go with pros. If you have more time than money game you ass off as long as you can. Either way you need to be RP or you'll get screwed in some manor.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Curious: what is your source?

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Google fu typically. Basically once you get a number you treat her like a normal service person, like if you were texting a plumber.

If she is normal about things then you're probably good to go, if it's some kind of agency you'll find out right away when you call her and there's some dude in the background or shit like that, basically what we are looking for here is college girls looking for help to pay their tuition, anything outside that you need to use your judgement/trust your gut.

The whole thing is based very heavily on trust. If the girl that shows up is not what you ordered, tell her to leave.

[–]Pastelitomaracucho 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I laughed hard. Excellent post

[–]Mithra9009 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Curious: what is your sauce?

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[–]Endorsed ContributorBluepillProfessor 2 points3 points  (1 child)

You eat out tinder whores? Yummy. Just FYI that tangy flavor that sticks on the sides of the tongue is not what you think it is.

[–]acetylcysteine 0 points1 point  (0 children)

this. cost/benefit ratio of dating just isn't worth it with online dating and the subpar females out there. most single men i know agree. if you want a ons just go to a bar/club and save yourself 3 hours of mind numbing conversation.

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[–]1ItsTheHomeWrecker 8 points9 points  (1 child)

deleted What is this?

[–][deleted] 18 points19 points  (6 children)

increased levels of obesity and economic inequality/debt are definitely the two factors that i'd be willing to place bets on. Obese men AND women are going to have trouble having sex, more so for men though. On economic problems, being poor is absolutely the worst thing for a man over the age of say 23-24 or so. I mean seriously, if youre saddled with mad student loan debt and grossing well under 40 k a year (a VERY common situation nowadays), good luck finding a fucking mate that isnt trashy or much, much younger. this isn't always the case though, my parents can definitely attest to that, but that doens't change that fact that i's going to hinder you considerably. It's hard for most women to be attracted to a guy that is living in a shit apt or at his parents at 27 with outstanding debts. I do feel that over time women will adapt though, but it's gonna suck no matter what

[–]throwawayyourliberty 12 points13 points  (3 children)

Wrong. Most men were always poor. Now women earn more or as much as their male peers. Women never want to "date down" the hierarchy. That means they will not consider them as an adequate reproduction partner.

Most women have now more degrees. Even if their male counterpart is as rich as them, they will not consider them as an adequate reproduction partner.

Last but not least, there were social constraints powered by culture to prevent women to act on their hypergamy. Now they are completely loose. Nothing of all three points have anything to do with economic inequality or debt. We will never feel the Bern.

[–]svensin 4 points5 points  (0 children)

yup, friend of mine is dating a nurse, hes a typical chad, she makes a lot more money than him, shes quitting nursing to sell nursing hats, hampstering up in her head that she "doesn't like nursing".

It's very amusing to watch

[–]Hjalmbere 1 point2 points  (1 child)

True, women have degrees, but few of them in STEM subjects. Hence SJWs have to invent needs through social engineering for crap like gender studies. I would like to see salary averages for gender studies majors as compared to skilled carpenters btw.

I'm betting that many women would end up living more fullfilling lives if they maximized their attractiveness instead of getting degrees in subjects they're not really interested in.

[–]24SevKev 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Came here to say this but you beat me to it

[–]MOCKxTHExCROSS 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's hardly an original analysis. The reason it is uncommon in mainstream press is that while there are options available to counteract all 5, they all take substantial work and involve constant self-criticism.

[–]pink_ego_box 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I believe there are several reasons for increase in male virgins, and decrease in female virgins, mentioned below in the comments:

Except that the study shows the contrary.

"The increase in adult sexual inactivity between the 1960s and 1990s cohorts was larger and significant among women (from 2.3 to 5.4 %) but not among men (from 1.7 to 1.9 %)."

"The larger increase in sexual inactivity for women (vs. men) is inconsistent with previous research finding that men and women’s sexual behaviors have become more similar"

"The shift toward higher rates of sexual inactivity among Millennials and iGen’ers was more pronounced among women and absent among Black Americans and those with a college education"

Can we have a discussion based on what the study says now ? Link here : http://sci-hub.cc/10.1007/s10508-016-0798-z

[–]Tailback 91 points92 points  (23 children)

I have a temp co-worker that's a 22 year old Male. He's on his 3rd Summer working with us and is a great kid. Funny, smart, and IMHO a pretty good looking guy. Better looking than I was at his age at least. He's 6'4" so he doesn't have my height disadvantage.

He could care less about girls. He hangs out with his buds, plays games, watches movies, and just enjoys his life. His ex girlfriend from HS called him last Summer for a bootie call and afterwards asked him to get back with her. His answer? "I'm not really interested in relationships."

I brought up RedPill and MGTOW to him and asked him if he had read any of that. He said "No, it's just that guys I know have seen how screwed up relationships are. Bitches are just crazy and not worth my time."

God how I wish I was that aware at his age. I'm happy with my marriage, but really it has been a huge waste of money. She had student loans and credit card debt when we married. We HAD to buy a house despite "our" amount of debt. Furniture, trips to see HER family, etc.... I was in the Army so a 800 sq/ft studio apt would have been fine with me until I die. I'd have money coming out my ears at the age of 40. Right about the time to get into a "seeking arrangement" or lining up escorts along with yearly visits to PI, VietNam, and Thailand.

Read this and learn all you HS to early 20's guys.

[–]Endorsed Contributorgekkozorz[S] 99 points100 points  (9 children)

22 is a tough year to be a male, assuming you're anywhere below Christ Hemsworth and Ryan Gosling on the looks scale. There's a reason that's the age where the infamous Elliot Rodger went postal.

For girls, this is the prime fertility year, so they're having the time of their lives with as many chads as they can fit in their box. For a dude, you're nobody. College is most likely over or ending, so there's no longer a little mini dating pool consiting of 18-21 year olds where you fit right in. You're in the same dating pool as grown men. You're making shit money (especially in this economy) and your only fucking experience (if there's any at all) is with thirsty, needy college sluts who drink too much and give it up easy. Now you're entering the world of chads with actual money and experience and ladies with drying ovaries and heightened expectations.

I would never want to relieve my 22-year-old dating experience ever again - what a nightmare.

[–][deleted] 34 points34 points

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[–]zedsdedforever 18 points19 points  (0 children)

keep going. As always, shit gets better when you make it better

[–]Long_Stroke 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Ouch, that was just too accurate

[–]virtualvirgincake 25 points26 points  (3 children)

Yo this is pretty accurate.

I was at the top of the pile in college and now I'm at the bottom again. Everyone treats me like a kid at work.

But I know just in a few years, the table is going to flip massively. I can already see it taking place as I get older and I'm getting more confident

Money, knowledge and fitness are the only things I care about right now.

[–][deleted] 5 points5 points

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[–]virtualvirgincake 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Why are you telling me to be careful?

[–]CQC3 9 points10 points  (0 children)

It's even worse if you have no preexisting social circle and go to a commuter college.

[–]CornyHoosier 28 points29 points  (6 children)

I'm happy with my marriage, but really it has been a huge waste of money. She had student loans and credit card debt when we married. We HAD to buy a house despite "our" amount of debt. Furniture, trips to see HER family, etc.... I was in the Army so a 800 sq/ft studio apt would have been fine with me until I die. I'd have money coming out my ears at the age of 40

You just describe my buddy to the letter (he was even in the Army).

A couple years ago he got oneitis from one big ol snooty bitch. Within a year and a half she pressures him into marriage. Within 6 months of that they have a new house, a kid (that seems like less than 9 months ... hmmm), a car (for her) and a dog and all their vacations are to her family out on the East coast. The worst part is that she doesn't even work and dictates how all the money will be used. I've literally started buying him cases of beer (when I occasionally am allowed to come over) because she thinks him spending $20 on a case of Coors every couple weeks is too much.

The poor fucker just got a new job and it came with a bonus. The moment he mentioned it to me her eyes and ears perked up and she started talking about how they were going to use the money on new things that conveniently were going to be used by her. He is confined to some hell hole they they have dubbed a "man cave"; which I just find to be special.

I'm the only single friend he has left as she has hate-banned all the rest. I recently kidnapped him for a guys day by saying I needed his help moving something ("nah, just leave your phone at home, we'll be right back"). I took him to a couple breweries, we went out and raced some remote control drones/cars, went for a sloppy BBQ lunch and topped the day off with a Rockies baseball game. I've not seen him that happy since our college days.

[–]askmrcia 16 points17 points  (5 children)

This was really sad to read because you just described almost all my friend's situations. There are times I wished I was married or in a ltr then I remember my friend's situations or read something like you just wrote.

My cousin is married. He's 40 and I'm 26. His wife is what most would call a unicorn. Not a slut, pretty, church girl, and I can't see her cheating on him. Sounds good right?

Well why does my 40 year old cousin who is almost a pastor at his church often calls me or come over to my house out of the blue?

He hates being around his wife and three kids. Sometimes he looks so tired and defeated because all his money and hard work is going to his wife. Again this girl is like the best of the best. She don't work though, but she also doesn't demand tons of money. As good of a woman she is, he still has to spend alot of money to take care of her. She still can get on his nerves. Kids too. His situation is perfect because most guys would love to be my cousin, but I'm telling you right now the guy is miserable because he's pretty much a slave to her.

Me? I do pretty well with women. I have my dry spells here and there and sometimes I do get lonely. But those are temporary like a day or two. And I have far more free time then my cousin.

I really think being single and never getting married is the best way to do things in today's society.

[–]CornyHoosier 16 points17 points  (1 child)

I really think being single and never getting married is the best way to do things in today's society.

Welcome to the club. Plenty of beer, tons of freedom to do whatever you want when you want and now all the women around us are slutty as hell so you don't need to get into a relationship to fuck them.

(Freedom Brag: If you told my 24 yo, broke, fat, virgin ass I'd be living my current life at 31 yo, I'd have laughed in your face.

I literally bought some ammo for my new Berretta .40 and some new FPV Drone parts last night. Then I went to the bar to drink a bit with some buddies, before we went to the Rockies game. As the game was ending I was drunk and horny so sent out a quick texts around the 8th-9th inning and had this new girl I've been seeing waiting at the door by the time I walked home.

If this ain't the American dream I don't know what is.)

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I really think being single and never getting married is the best way to do things in today's society.

Exactly this. I would rather be an ugly dude who can't get laid, than a married guy who gets "duty sex." At least if you are an ugly dude who is single, you can at least pay for sex and you have less drama, along with more free time. My older brother is getting married and I wish him the best of luck, but I'm never getting married.

[–]2Overkillengine 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I really think being single and never getting married is the best way to do things in today's society.

Because even in the best case scenario one still is a slave under the current marriage laws. Just because the whip isn't getting cracked across one's back at that second does not mean it isn't there and ready to be used should you have the gall to step out of your designated role.

[–]okiedokie321 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Question: TRP thoughts on conservative church girls? Are they RPW material?

[–]Venicedreaming 9 points10 points  (3 children)

Are you really happy with your marriage?

[–]Tailback 35 points36 points  (2 children)

Tonight, no. But, on the whole, it's been pretty good. She's a submissive, has worked the whole time, and is a very good housekeeper. We found out after marriage she can't have kids so that's a big stress taken off the shoulders.

Would I have made the same decision with the info I've learned in TRP or MGTOW? No...absolutely not and I'd be a decade ahead of myself financially for it.

She's starting to lose her looks body wise now. She's 40+ but the fact that she has good genes, was an athlete, and no kids has kept her pretty damn good looking. The last couple years she's stopped caring about gaining weight. That pisses me off because for years she was hounding me to exercise. I am exercising now, lost about 20'ish pounds, am feeling and looking great.

Right now, I wish I was single and on a holiday tour through the Philippines, Thailand, and Vietnam. Not just for the cute women, but also for the food. My wife is deathly (carries an epi pen) allergic to all forms of seafood. My Mother worked at a seafood processing plant and I grew up on the best of the best. I miss it. At least I get my sexual needs taken care of whenever I want.

[–]okiedokie321 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Sounds like she is RPW material. Shame she is starting to let herself go weight wise though, but I also think if she's been so good to you for so long, there's no point in going on a holiday tour to fuck bitches. I don't think she'd be down with that. Not trying to be blue here, just saying what's fair.

[–]Tailback 2 points3 points  (0 children)

She's about 15lbs overweight and still looks pretty good. Yes, she's totally RPW material. I'm not looking to bail out on her, she's been damn good to me all things considered. It's just the financials that piss me off all the time. We make decent money and are mostly frugal, but there's never money for things I want to do. We spent 15 years clawing out of her college debt.

[–]oneway_rp 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Late to the party on this thread but hoping you catch this. Coming from an early 20's guy who graduated college 2 years ago -- communicate this to your coworker or any other temps his age if you haven't. I found TRP when I was 20 during a summer internship, right after my LTR dumped me, right before my final year of college. The collective wisdom on this sub combined with being taken under the wings of a couple RP coworkers in their early 30's that summer forged me into a new person. Cannot tell you how grateful I am for that experience.

It goes against the milennial narrative everyone loves to shit on, but there are a lot of guys my age who genuinely want to learn from stories like yours.

[–]Tailback 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We all are learning regardless of age. I'm closer to 50 than I am 40. I didn't find this sub until a co-worker and friend got divorce raped and made homeless and destitute over a single weekend.

My young temp co-worker is ahead of where I was by 20+ years.

Most young men don't take advice from older men seriously. I didn't. The 2 dozen or so kids that asked me for advice on the military never did. Every single one I ran into after the fact told me they wish they'd listened. I wish I had listened to my Father. My pops gave me solid RP advice even though he was at best a purple pill guy overall.

[–]Wingardienleviosah 30 points31 points  (1 child)

the mouse utopia expiriment This relevant expiriment deals with the social breakdown of a fully matured mouse colony in which all the natural hinderances to their population besides physical space have been removed. This means no predators and an unlimited food supply(aka the present situation of modern man). The results are quite pertinent to this discussion, particularly when references are made by the experimenters to the male mice that have opted out of the mature society and its confusing roles despite being physically normal specimens. They are reffered to as the 'beautiful ones'. The social breakdown and cessation of human reproduction reflects our own stage of late mature societal development. I think the level of violence and opting out among males is a natural response to the death of a coherent role for us in the society.

[–]Simply_Sherlock 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Beautiful one here.

Let it all burn.

[–]silverbullett 26 points27 points  (2 children)

Don't forget about the changing college graduation rates.


Women don't date down.

[–]ImmmOldGregg 19 points20 points  (0 children)

They would rather eat each-other.

[–]CornyHoosier 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Correct, but they will fuck down. They just ain't bringing you to meet their parents.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 25 points26 points  (2 children)

Probably most guys are having less sex. Women are only upping things from what I know

[–]virtualvirgincake 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Accurate. But do they want sex though? Or are they looking for their 'one true love' and getting alpha widowed in the process

[–]1PantsonFire1234 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Probably, since women always look for commitment. The only ones who aren't are those already Alpha widowed. Their damage is a whole different topic.

[–]7Tomus 25 points26 points  (2 children)

Its like you either have too much to fuck or nothing at all. Either you are top 10% and you get all the pussy you want, or you are just somewhere in top 50 and you ocasionally get lucky. If you are even lower, then you are just another orbiter material at best.

With tinder nowdays, all a woman have to do is open the app and wait 5 min for the floodgate of thirsty sausages to open. Does not matter if you are top 10% or ugly hog, you will find lay pretty fast. While on the other hand, if a dude does not look like Adonis he is left with nothing.

So yeah, with relativelly high supply of good looking men just few clicks away any normal guy has abysmal chance of getting laid.

[–]Unholy_VI 20 points21 points  (1 child)

Yes that's pretty much stated in the sidebar.

Every woman literally worth a fuck thinks she deserves a 'chad' (top 10% guy) to fall madly in love with her, give her great kids and a wonderful princessy life. She'll settle for a beta if she's not good enough SMV to get a chad but even if he's higher smv than her (say a 7ish guy and a 5ish chick) she'll still feel slighted at not having her chad and look for opportunities to cheat/start relationships with guys higher smv than her beta.

Hence all the man hate. Every wonam 5+ has probably been fucked at some point by a bored chad who then kicked them to the curb and probably treated them pretty harshly when they started stalking him afterward. it's kind of funny. They reinforce this belief that all guys are assholes who don't want commitment because of something that only 10% of us did...we just did to pretty much all of them.

they forget all the perfectly suitable guys that pursued them but weren't' up to their delusional standard.

[–]Limekill 1 point2 points  (0 children)

lol but true. They all hate men, but really its 10% of alphas.

[–]marinewannabee97 23 points24 points  (1 child)

I'm gonna say this as a bisexual guy. Women are stuck up, period. One shirtless pic on grinder and I can guarantee at least 5 responses within the hour, same pic on tinder? Fucking nothing. The start dates are also different, the two guys I met through grindr were at least 8s, however to even get a fucking response on tinder I had to lower my standards to 5s. IDGAF anymore, more time to train, study and work.

[–]okiedokie321 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Fuck, I wish I was bi (straight male here). You guys have the best of both worlds.

[–]Granarc 21 points22 points  (2 children)

Young Men are having less sex because LTR's are dangerous. Take 20-30% of my shit for 22 years if she has a kid.. take half my shit and 50% of my future pay if we were married then her mood changes and divorce rapes me, seems like a shitty deal to me. Thanks to this Female Superiority game of cash and prizes, men are going their own way. The thing that all american men need to realize is that anyplace else on this planet, we are fucking super status magnets. Go Lay Pipe elsewhere my friends.

[–]plenty_of_eesh 4 points5 points  (0 children)

But don't come to Brazil! It's terrible for that here...


[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"The thing that all american men need to realize is that anyplace else on this planet, we are fucking super status magnets."

Keep on believing that.

[–]Gelu_sf 20 points21 points  (1 child)

This whole primal switch thing looks exactly like the women jobs in STEM: in societies where wealth is absent there are more women in STEM than in high-welfare societies.

There was a study showing that in Sweden almost no women go in tech, instead they choose soft subjects, nursing, humane fields, stuff like that. Whereas in Bangladesh you're more likely to find a woman programmer because they're forced in to a higher paying field due to poverty.

Same here.. when women have what they want they revert to their natural state. The path of least resistance is the most natural. Hence, those low-T millenials are not the cavemen women are looking for (and importing in droves from MENA)

[–][deleted] 52 points53 points  (5 children)

There are two classic millenials that work for me and their situation perfectly describes these articles.

He is a fat Hiillary fan who whines when I assign him tasks. I have to chase him to complete everything as I overhear him planning lunch all morning. He takes girls out to expensive restaurants and is perpetually friendzoned. He is a loser.

She is kind of cute, "dates alot", and has been alphawidowed by a guy who she " shares dog custody" with. Guaranteed that every dog dropoff and pickup involves his Alpha cock in her mouth. She also lies on all the surveys and says she isn't having sex with anyone.. That's what she tells my team so I am sure surveys are also falsified to soothe her hamster.


Bitches are still fucking and lie about it. They fuck the same minority of men. The majority of millennial do men jerk off onto their mantitties and take comfort from articles like this. They want to think everyone is sexless

[–]103342 16 points17 points  (1 child)

The majority of millennial do men jerk off onto their mantitties and take comfort from articles like this. They want to think everyone is sexless.

This is probably it... I saw this on the front page of reddit and thought: "Yeah, right".

Sometimes you just gotta swallow reality and take anecdotal evidence for what it is. I know enough people and their private lives to realize that there is a pattern going on in the youth and no one is a special snowflake, but probably one among many other people.

VERY, very, very few people actually get away from the norm and context of society. Chances are, if you are where you are there are a lot of people in a very similar position to yours.

[–]juliusstreicher 5 points6 points  (0 children)

This is probably it... I saw this on the front page of reddit and thought: "Yeah, right".

Clickbait shit is exactly what it is. I can't really remember but ever since I was in High School in the 70s, there's always been some 'study' that seemed to verify that I, fat beta, wasn't really the POS loser. Somehow, apparently, I read the abstract wrong, since the self-reported freedom of sex with no boundaries, or whatever, never fully materialized for me in real life. In fact, quite the opposite.

Whole point being: Yeah, the study is a crock of shit.

[–][deleted] 50 points51 points  (13 children)

I only really lurk here but I have a scenario that seems kind of applicable. This is from a few months ago before I knew about RP or anything remotely similar.

I had a profile on OKCupid because I just moved to a new area. My profile looked similar to most others I'm sure - I like reading, hiking, blah blah blah.

Someone "likes" my page or whichever OK equivalent so I think, well... might as well start a conversation.

So I do so. Her first response is, "Your profile makes you sound like an MRA," to which I had to ask what an MRA was because I genuinely had no idea and the only google search turned up Men's Rights Activist - to where I really got confused because I figured that nowhere in my profile about enjoying reading or making beer did I think I put that in there.

The only response I got when I asked where in the world did you get that from? Was, "just a hunch."

Then the conversation was over. I deleted my profile shortly after and am still confused.

[–]itsmehobnob 110 points111 points  (5 children)

Remember the scene in Good Will Hunting when the guy in the bar is bragging about some idea and Matt Damon shuts him down saying, "Of course that's your contention. You're a first year grad student. You just got finished some Marxian historian, Pete Garrison prob’ly, you’re gonna be convinced of that until next month when you get to James Lemon, then you’re gonna be talkin’ about how the economies of Virginia and Pennsylvania were entrepreneurial and capitalist back in 1740. That's gonna last until next year, you’re gonna be in here regurgitating Gordon Wood, talkin’ about you know, the Pre-revolutionary utopia and the capital-forming effects of military mobilization."

The girl in question just got done reading about MRAs and sees them everywhere.

[–]1v1mebruh 23 points24 points  (0 children)

The girl in question just got done reading about MRAs and sees them everywhere.

This may also be a factor contributing to what OP is talking about.

[–]darkrood 19 points20 points  (0 children)

When you feminazi, every male is male Jew

[–]flat6turbo 29 points30 points  (4 children)

use tinder and lie about your income on sugardaddy sites.

guaranteed lays.

[–]D4rkr4in 11 points12 points  (1 child)

Wait girls browse both huh...

[–]darkrood 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I thought you have to provide tax return, etc

[–]SpaceNerd 1 point2 points  (1 child)

You delete your profile after one negative interaction online?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Nobody said it was the first and only.

[–]blackierobinsun2 18 points19 points  (1 child)

Because women are more stuck up than ever, thinking they put on a little makeup and they deserve a millionaire, they live in there own reality with a stick so far up their ass, women in America shouldn't be allowed to work any office job if it was up to me

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (0 children)

i use to work (retail) with a girl.. kinda cute, probably a 6. she told me her husband was going to be 6'4, jacked, and makes well into 6 figures at minimum. so basically a pro athlete or a harvard doctor/lawyer. i asked "why in the world would this guy date you, the cashier?" she didnt have much of a response.

[–]WilliamBott 15 points16 points  (2 children)

Men are looking at the product of this cultural virus and saying "yeah, these people aren't worth fucking," and sticking to their porn and video games.

As a MGTOW, you nailed it right there.

[–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (0 children)

What a strange game; it seems the only way to win is not to play.

[–]Scrubstepcat 29 points30 points  (1 child)

10/10 great post. pretty much sums up the reality here, and why ive been against feminism for a /long time/and only now with this shit opening up and becoming mainstream people agree with me. It's unfortunate we can't just live in a world where a higher concept of love is possible. I don't give a shit about casual (with a random person) sex, I don't get pleasure from casual sex, I need someone I love and unfortunately I like vagina. Love for me requires intellectual fullfilment, aswell as physical, it can really feel like a catch 22 at times. On top of it all, I can rarely find male friends with this fullfilment, let alone a female who can come close to fulfilling it.

[–]bar_hopper_dc 28 points29 points  (10 children)

Little bit of a end-of-anger-phase rant coming.

This flies in the face of what women really want - to be protected and nurtured in the company of high-quality men.

TRP in a nutshell. Forget what you've been taught about women. Forget all the fucking movies and tales of romance. Forget poetry. Become a high value man, embrace your sexuality, and express it by approaching, flirting, and fucking.

Society has "advanced" to where it is by suppressing our natural instincts. In many contexts, that's great. For the most part, we've achieved a relative level of safety and stability, and I wouldn't want to live in a society where that isn't the case. But men are suppressing their instincts too much.

How many guys are literally scared to talk to a girl? What the fuck? Seriously? Why the fuck should a guy be afraid to talk to a girl? It doesn't make any sense. Maybe back in the tribal days, you'd get killed by some alpha tribe leader. But not today. There is nothing to be afraid of. And yet, how many guys have approach anxiety?

Men have suppressed their natural instincts too much. Learn to use your dick. Feminist brainwashing bullshit essentially tells men that they should not be having sex. What they're really doing is powertalking and telling betas to give up because their seed isn't worthy. So guys accept it. They don't improve. Married betas talk about how they "can't believe she puts up with me!" as they get fat and decay into a sea of watching sports, drinking, and depression. What a fucking joke.

Learn to listen to your instincts. Learn to listen to your dick. Raise your testosterone. Be horny. The alternative? Sit around in your fucking man cave and wait for a social circle opportunity, and hope and pray that you don't "fuck it up." Choice is yours.

[–]F_Dingo 19 points20 points  (7 children)

How many guys are literally scared to talk to a girl? What the fuck? Seriously? Why the fuck should a guy be afraid to talk to a girl? It doesn't make any sense. Maybe back in the tribal days, you'd get killed by some alpha tribe leader. But not today. There is nothing to be afraid of. And yet, how many guys have approach anxiety?

That fear stems from just not having any prior experience or even knowing what to do. I know this line of "dude, just approach and talk!" gets piped off on here, but a bunch of millennial guys just don't even know what to do or know where to start. I know this because I'm one of them, I'm fucking almost 23 years old and have had Z E R O interactions with females my age, ZERO. I could count the number of times on my hands that I had interaction with females in highschool (fucking pathetic I know).

At my job last week I finally worked up the nerve to approach this foreign girl, just to ask what country she was from (simple question, easy to do). I know this sounds pathetic, but the shit was tough for me to do because I just don't have any prior experience interacting with girls my age.

The good news is I approached another foreign girl at my job with this same question, have to start somewhere. Baby steps.

[–]bar_hopper_dc 15 points16 points  (0 children)

So true. Approaching girls is not easy when you start out. You overcame your fear, and now you have momentum. Good luck on your journey brother.

[–] points points

[permanently deleted]

[–]okiedokie321 1 point2 points  (0 children)

She is anti-social and sometimes boring and won't have kids, but she does work, is loyal, and is overall a good life partner.

Is that key to TRP for those who want to settle? Boring, anti-social girl? If that's all it really was, then shit. I'd rather have that than a 9/10 social media whore.

The dynamics would be different for the alpha male and I don't think I'd be turned on much, but pussy is pussy I suppose.

[–]plenty_of_eesh 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Well done, but I can promise you there's more than just "Breaking the seal and it's done".

I'm 45 and approach-anxiety still haunts me. I've had relationships of length varying from one night to six years, and I've had hundreds if not thousands of "first time" conversations.

In the last few years my eyes have been opened by TRP (although I don't buy in 100%), and so I have both the "academic" knowledge and the personal experience that should make approach a no-brainer for me.

I even had a PUA friend once give me training "in the wild" and I was stunned how easy it was to open sometimes..

And yet. I still have this fear/shyness.

It's something deep, and ingrained. And it explains why, despite the majority of men having heard of "pick up", relatively few still put themselves out there on a regular basis and cross that line, even though there are a thousand blogs extolling the virtues of it.

I don't know what the stumbling blocks are, how much is cultural and how much just parenting style... genetics... sibling order...

But it's definitely a phenomenal that goes beyond just "overcoming once or twice means overcoming forever."

[–]luciansolaris 2 points3 points  (0 children)


[Praise KEK!](23083)

[–]CornyHoosier 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I was a fat loser all my life, up to and including college. I was literally a 24 year old, fat, nerdy, virgin, loser with absolutely no confidence. I went to a tech school (no women) and worked in tech (no women) in a small dark room in the back of some office.

Just be aware that you can change yourself. If I could break a lifetime-cycle anyone can. I dropped over 100 lbs, started going out and about more, got some hobbies outside of computers, started dress better and liking myself more.

I'm 31 now and feel like I've lived two entirely different lives. It pains me to see younger guys living the way I used to be. I want to shake them and yell that it doesn't have to be the way they're living.

... but as we stress here on TRP. You can't help those that don't want to help themselves. You can't force people to be someone they're not, you can only be an example.

[–][deleted] 47 points48 points  (21 children)

Millennial men may be having less sex but I'm in my 30's and I'm banging more 18-25 year old poon now than I did when I was 18-25.

I say bring on the sexodus. More for me.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 20 points21 points  (15 children)

I love it when 30 year olds post this. Lets me know my hard work WILL pay off.

[–]BowlOfCandy 11 points12 points  (1 child)

About to hit 29, recently crossed the six figure mark.

It's so easy now.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah man can't wait to hit half a million poon

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (9 children)

Same here. It gives me hope that as long as I just focus on my career and all that, I can reap the benefits in 5 years. Currently 25

[–]2awalt_cupcake 11 points12 points  (0 children)

The hard part is staying disciplined to the basics: your game routine, working out, and staying on top of your shit

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (7 children)

Same, 24 and good job. I'm not totally dry now but it's not super easy for me.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children)

yeah, same for me, unless I shoot below my SMV and I'm looking to stop doing that too much. I'm a decent looking guy who is in great shape and stuff, but that's how it is, especially in college. I hooked up with some ugly/chubby chicks in college and word gets around about that. Right now, I'm focusing on the beginning of saving money for retirement and future vacations.

My current IRAs (roth and traditional) and 401K are looking good two years removed from college. (a little over $14K) I started working for a different place 6 months ago and I think they pays for graduate school as well, so I will look into that. Might as well get an MBA if it's paid for and it's a good place to work at.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children)

Get that knowledge and money bro. Vacation isnt really that expensive (especially when ur single lol) , unless you want to go all the way across the world, but there's still a lot of places in the US I want to go. I also went to South America for a week for like $800, but I had a friend living there so it was a bit cheaper. I think im good looking and im fit, but my game is a bit weak so I go below my SMV still.. lol

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

I'm definitely about knowledge and money. With regards to vacation, I have signed up for a few credit cards in the past few years with low spend requirements ($500 over first 3 months) for the signup bonus, so I have a good chunk of points or miles to use for vacations in the future.

When I get home, I'm gonna make a finance post I think will be useful to people. Go in depth on brokerage/investment accounts I currently have and why (vanguard, Robin Hood, Charles schwab). Checking and savings accounts I have and one in particular I think everyone should have (it's Charles schwab checking for a number of reasons. In short, free ATM rebates everywhere, free checking 'no maintenance fees or account minimums, you can get free standard checks, to write checks for things like rent')

Here is more information on the Charles schwab checking account. http://www.schwab.com/public/schwab/banking_lending/checking_account

[–]MAWL_SC 1 point2 points  (1 child)

It's like day and night. Girls just flat out approach me, drunk women stare, bros wives rub their tits on you. Forget the married in your 20ies myth.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 1 point2 points  (0 children)

im going to wreck so many marriages :/

[–]cat_magnet 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'm in the boat. I find it way easier in my 30s to get laid. More confidence and money I guess

[–]CornyHoosier 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yep. I'm currently 31, but seemingly the moment I turned 30 it was game on.

[–]insoucianc 1 point2 points  (0 children)

20'a here. Women 30+ are like shooting fish in a barrel. Funny how the script flips.

[–]Darkone06 8 points9 points  (1 child)

It's the economy, stupid.

As someone who makes $55K a year which would be consider a higher level salary for my age, $55K a year ain't shit.

Money is severely limiting the younger generations.

[–]Luckyluke23 11 points12 points  (4 children)

In trying to create a world where women have everything

women already had everything YEARS ago. now they are just trying to take what men have.

edit: I don't know much about milo, other that what is poster here, though i am starting to warm to him. I did find i REALLY strange when i saw a video of him and he claimed to be gay. I found it strange, not because he is gay, but rather, i thought it would pander to the feminists because they are for the gays? or at least more gay rights? and he is fighting the white male ( or just male in general fight)

[–]NaughtyFred 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Gays are becoming tired of being used by women to further their cause.

As a gay guy he can't be attacked with the classic "you're just jealous because you can't get laid" shaming tactic that females use.

Also as a gay guy (and therefore a lover of men) maybe him and others like him hate seeing the shit men have to tolerate.

[–]Layback 3 points4 points  (1 child)

he noticed there's a whole market of straight white males who were getting fucked by PC culture and feminism, so he decided to exploit his sexual orientation and intellectual prowess to fight the fight for us.

[–]Blacklabellogics 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Feminism as an ideology will always be in motion. There is no doubt that western women are ruined in their hamster-wheel of "having it all" which is not realistic from a mathematical perspective. You cannot work 50 - 60 hours a week or more away from the home, in addition to being the perfect mom, and the perfect wife.

There mere fact that so many women have fallen for it, is a testament to the tendency of women to fall in love with what sounds emotionally right rather than empirically possible.

The fact is that feminism has broken both women and men. They have broken women in that in their quest to eradicate the masculine the women have themselves become masculine in their own way. Consistently conflating being a bitch with being bossy, stubborn with being strong and dependent on the state for being independent.

Feminism has broken men in that most boys are raised to hate masculine behavior, which is reinforced both in school and media narratives. The risk for males due to false rape charges, rigged justice systems and public shaming even when acquitted push them into their passive little beta corner where they wait for the women to finally finish riding Chad, so he can have the girl who has had 500 miles of Mr. Right.

[–]johngalt1234 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Given mass immigration of terrorists that may change.

[–]Momo_dollar 9 points10 points  (0 children)

No disrespect to people on the RP, but maybe another one of the many reasons for this is because a lot of guys seem to view women as if they're a different species. Kinda like scientist observing dolphins and at first thinking they're the cutest, most friendliest things on earth, then slowly noticing hold up these dolphins occasionally do shitty things, hold up sometimes these dolphins are cruel and malicious , until finally all they see is only negativity from the dolphins and all they report ( from tinted lenses) are negative things that confirm their view that yes the dolphins are a bunch of cunts, and not the sweet Flipper they were led to believe.

I say this not based on RP itself, or older posts, but mostly the posts I've noticed over the past 8 months and the comments. People have lost the point, the point is women are psychologically different to men, so adapt how you deal with women and what you expect from women. The point is also women are not the princess' made out on TV and all that fairer sex shit is BS, women play just as dirty as men and often dirtier then average men. But ultimately most average (intelligence) women have a limited and predictable tool set of games and tricks that they can play.

What constantly going about 80/20, posting shit about girls cheating will achieve I have no clue. You can't get pussy if you resent or hate , you can get pussy or at the very least not get played by women if you know and understand how they work.

[–][deleted] 48 points49 points  (15 children)

There's a biological answer also: Millennials have low testosterone. Our environment is flooded with chemicals that raise estrogen levels.


[–]TechnoRaptor 7 points8 points  (2 children)

If you score low T on blood tests don't they give you t replacement. My t is normal anyways

[–]beginner_ 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Only if you are very, very, very low. The general guideline is 350 ng/dl blood or less is low enough for TRT. This is the average level of 80-90 year old men. So if you are at 400 at 20, your pretty much fucked and have to get it illegally or not at all. Assuming your diet and life style is in check, as a fat fuck eating chips all day, first get your life style in order.

So it also a hen an egg question. Is T lower because there are more fat guys with bad habits? Or are more fat guys because T is lower? (low T = more prone to store fat than build muscle)

[–]tb87670 12 points13 points  (11 children)

I have a High-T problem. As in a problem, higher chance of heart problems, higher chance of prostate issues (already had prostatitis 3 times and I'm in mid-20's), went bald in late teens, and have a sex drive that can cloud my mind at times. There are benefits in bed and in the gym though.

All these issues of guys being Low-T hasn't really affected me. The High-T problem me and my sibling have might actually be a boon protecting us from these issues.

[–]RPthrowaway123 3 points4 points  (7 children)

Since you have a lot of it, I have a diet question - do eggs/cholesterol really help? If they do, what sort of foods (besides eggs) could I be working into my diet?

[–]ihatereddit613 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Saturated fat in general. https://www.t-nation.com/diet-fat-loss/saturated-fat

Granted I've never tested this, but generally if I run a keto diet my fat intake is obviously high and my saturated fat is through the roof. I feel great. I'm sure there's someone out there who had the bloodwork done.

[–]probpoopin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Take a quality zma supplement, or full spectrum mineral supplement. That, vit D, and B vitamins. Zinc alone will help raise the levels. If it is gym related and you just rent seeing the gains you want. You need to check your diet. There are aps that track what you eat, and give you a vitamin and mineral breakdown of your diet. Creatine is the panacea of lifting supplements. If you aren't using it, start.

[–]tb87670 1 point2 points  (3 children)

I'm overweight and trying to focus on losing the fat. I am not doing keto, at least not yet. I lost weight before, just exercising tends to do it for me. I do eat 4 boiled eggs a day if I can because a dozen of large white eggs is 88cents at my walmart, it's a good cheap protein.

Overall my main diet was don't do candies, stick to meats and veggies. Avoid soda, eat brown rice/quinoa mix I make myself once a day if I have time (pressure cooker makes if soft and fluffy but can take up to an hour cooking counting warm-up, cook time, and de-pressurize time) but I add a bit of raw natural brown sugar while eating it to sweeten. I'm really not on any diet in particular, just eat healthy while exercising. Worked for me in the past the first times I lost weight and is working for me now, slow and steady. V8 Fruit Fusion is very good, I am considering getting a juicer to make stuff like that since it gets you a lot of veggies and fruits way faster and easier than eating the stuff.

When it comes to raising T I really never bothered to look into that due to my specific natural balance hovering above 1200 ng/dL. I actually avoid some stuff that would increase it, that would magnify my issues. Maca Root for example is non-hormonal, why I like it as a useful filler for any capsules I make.

[–]RedFrameName 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Juicing is really just extracting the sugar from vegitables. You should aim to just turn a lot of veggitables into a slurry and pound it down for the blood sugar stablizing fiber and the whole nutrients of the vegetable. Have a 350 dollar juicer and that's my experience with it. Lots of wasted vegetables or "pulp".

[–]probpoopin 0 points1 point