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MetaThe Guardian: Swallowing the Red Pill: a journey to the heart of modern misogyny (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by Modredpillschool

A while back, I was asked by Stephen Marche to do an interview for the Guardian regarding TRP.

It's probably one of the more pleasant takes I've seen in mainstream directed towards us. In place of out-right vitriol is instead pity, which I think is a bit of an upgrade from articles past. I wouldn't be surprised if his thoughts aligned more with ours than he lets on in his writing.

He does seem to outline at a glance that there's an issue and that TRP is addressing it- perhaps harmlessly so. But since he's part of the mainstream media, the narrative must continue. That narrative is that there is a never ending hatred of women ingrained in our culture- and we can't expect our "boys" to deviate from the course when role models like pop stars are also misogynists.

We can't expect much depth from a tabloid (heh) so it should come as no surprise that his final suggestion is that the latent, underlying misogyny is everywhere simply because nobody told us what we needed was a little love and to just stop hating. He suggests that rather than being angry we can't find "love" we should try finding "love." You shouldn't dig too deep.

Here's the unabridged Interview for anybody interested:

Stephen Marche
So just to confirm you are the redditt moderator for the red pill yes? How many do you moderate?

RedPillSchool yes, I am the head moderator for /r/TheRedPill

I moderate about 15 subreddits

but really only a handful are active, TheRedPill, asktrp, redpillwomen, are the big ones.

Stephen Marche How long have you been moderating them all?

RedPillSchool I've been moderating since the red pill's inception, about 3 years

Stephen Marche How much of your time would you say is devoted to TRP?

I mean, it must be close to a full time job, right?

RedPillSchool Probably too much time. During busy weeks there's probably close to 20 hours of moderator duties. During development of TRP.RED, I was spending about 8 hours an evening working on development.

Stephen Marche Wow.

Were you in any way involved in, like, publishing books about the material?

Or was it just the subreddit?

RedPillSchool I hadn't published anything before. I got started when I stumbled upon a few manosphere blogs and realized there wasn't really a good forum for discussion on masculine topics.

Stephen Marche Was there an event that led you to start TRP. Personal or otherwise?

RedPillSchool Well, the events in my life did lead me to it. Having spent my twenties as many guys did looking for relationships or female companionship, I noticed that the dating game just wasn't what I was taught.

Like, what my parents prepared me for, and what I learned from television and movies.

It was stacked against guys, and it was a very unpleasant experience. I noticed the attitude of women in the dating market was very negative, it was a terrible experience

So that lead me to researching others' experiences

which lead me to the mansophere, and eventually theredpill

Stephen Marche Can you give me an example of one of those terrible experiences?

RedPillSchool sure

Well, an experience I had repeatedly were flakes. It hadn't always been this bad, but over the past ten years, the flakiness of women has gotten worse in my experience. You'd meet a girl, hit it off, have a drink together, chat, really connect. Get her number and agree to a date. And either she'd no-show, or cancel right before (or after) she was supposed to meet you. It's rude, it's not good people skills. But in the dating market, it's the new normal.

So for a guy trying to connect with women like myself, I found myself putting in all this effort, to meet women, put myself out there, chat with them, really advertise myself. And to have all that work go to nothing when women flaked, it was very defeating.

It's not the way courting worked when my parents met. There was value to your word when you agreed to a date.

But not our culture now, that's just not what it is any more.

Another example

I noticed that flirting became a blood sport

Fun and friendly conversations became more combative at bars, women would regularly use put downs and insults to knock me off my game. I didn't understand why meeting people had to be such a poor experience.

I later learned that this was women's way of "testing" me. And there was a way to respond to these tests, that a lot of these women were actually interested in me, I just never learned how to deal with this testing.

I later learned not to get emotionally invested in these little games, but rather turn them around and get women to laugh. I would never had known that with what my dad taught me as a kid.

The manosphere fundamentally became a surrogate father for the life lessons I never got.

Stephen Marche What did your dad teach you about dating?

I mean what was wrong and the trp corrected it?

RedPillSchool My dad taught me to take words at their surface value. Like, people say what they mean. And maybe they did when he was a kid. Or maybe he was clueless and meeting my mom was a fluke.

So I was clueless when I met women. I just knew what he told me about meeting my mom. And what I saw in movies

where having a good heart and being yourself is all you need to meet the right girl, and she'll appreciate you for it.

but that's not what happens now. You can't be good, or nice. You have to be attractive. Good and nice aren't attractive any more.

I think my parents had marriage on the mind, my mom looked for good and nice because her parents taught her that. They told her "find a good and nice guy because you need that in a good husband." But girls these days aren't looking for a husband. They might want good and nice when they're 40 and looking to settle. But at 25, girls are looking for a bad boy. And I wasn't bad at all.

Stephen Marche Any specific movies that come to mind that were particularly wrong?

RedPillSchool I can't think of a specific movie at the moment, but I do know a popular television show that my generation grew up with: boy meets girl.

Stephen Marche Right

RedPillSchool Movies do a similar thing though, you find the common mantra is: just tell her how you feel and she'll return the feelings if she likes you.

But it turns out, that's terrible game. You don't pour your heart out. You'll look too invested and scare her away.

Saying it now feels a little silly, like, how was I ever that stupid?

But back then, I thought, this is how you get girls. And they wouldn't respond well to it. They'd say "you're a good friend, but"

and then they'd date guys they call jerks, and complain to me how they're such jerks!

Talk about confusing! Jerks are bad, you hate how he's a jerk, why not date a nice guy like me, then?

I later learned one of the most important lessons: You cannot negotiate attraction.

Stephen Marche OK. Now that is true enough. But here's the thing: Why would you want to be with women who don't want to be with good men?

RedPillSchool Well, you know, because eventually you start wondering why stick to being good when it's never rewarded?

It's not that there were women who liked nice guys- nice guys never got it. It wasn't like there were a bunch of girls looking for good guys and I just needed to go to the library to find them. They didn't exist at all.

So I thought, maybe it's not them who are broken, maybe I gotta change me?

And sure enough, adapting to the market, now girls like me.

Stephen Marche But here's my point. Do you like women more? I mean, the "reward" of using the game seems to be with women you have contempt for. You see what I mean.

RedPillSchool Yes, I see what you mean.

Stephen Marche I mean if these girls see you as a commodity, why bother?

MAybe that's my naviete. Not having been dating for a long time.

RedPillSchool I think the problem is that my old view of women, when I was unsuccessful and "nice," I did build resentment for women.

so learning that everybody else was playing by different rules actually helped dissolve that resentment

I don't resent them for playing the game. The mating "dance" has always been a back-and-forth between men and women to select their optimal partner

I did resent them, but now I appreciate them quite a bit.

Stephen Marche So you think trp actually made you more repsectful of women?

RedPillSchool Yes, it helped me understand human nature. It was like me getting angry with myself for getting hungry, instead of taking the logical step to feed myself.

So once I understood why and how things happened, it put me at peace with it.

And that's a good thing. I'm in a long term relationship now with a girl that I love, and it works, she's very attracted to me. She compliments me on improvements I've made. And I know without the advice of TRP, I would've been clueless and getting caught up on her "tests" rather than beating them.

Stephen Marche Does she know you're the moderator of TRP?

RedPillSchool Yes

Stephen Marche And how does she feel about it?

RedPillSchool She's a smart lady, so she agrees with the philosophy we discuss on the forum. None of it was terribly surprising to her.

She trusts me, and knows that she's attracted to me. And I think in her mind is that it's probably silly, since, as a woman, she didn't have to put the same amount of effort into attracting a mate. But, if it works, don't fix it.

Stephen Marche You think women don't have to work to find a mate?

RedPillSchool I think women can find a mate with far less effort.

Stephen Marche I mean, man, I once saw my wife putting on "anti-feathering agent" which makes lipstick look better and I thought "Jesus Christ."

RedPillSchool Haha, yes, there's a lot of effort that goes into presenting themselves.

I think the comparison I use is that for guys, if they don't put in effort, they simply won't meet anybody. For women, even if they don't put in effort, their default position is having to reject potential suitors.

Now, finding a mate that they are head over heels in love with, that might not be easy for them.

But for a guy, simply meeting somebody willing to talk them can be such an impossible task that they'll go years without hope

Stephen Marche Do you think TRP helped you find love? Or do you think that was mostly chance?

RedPillSchool Yes, TRP was instrumental in my finding love - not only finding it, but understanding how to find it and what to look for.

Stephen Marche Explain that.

RedPillSchool Well, first of all, there are qualities that you might look for in a mate. In my twenties it was basically a crapshoot of whoever would talk to me was a potential mate.

That's not very effective

Now that I have options with TRP, I can be more selective. And TRP helps me know what girls would make good long term partners.

So finding my current girlfriend, I now have the skills to attract her, to keep her attracted, and the knowledge to know she was worth a long term relationship with

Stephen Marche So can you tell me--I don't want to blow your anonymity--but can you just give me a general demographic on yourself.

You're an American, yes?

RedPillSchool Sure, ~30 +/- 3 years, USA

handsome

Stephen Marche white, atheist, conservative? Like those polls say the bulk of TRP is?

RedPillSchool haha, yes.

All three

though there are a lot of religious people in the community, so atheist isn't a good marker for red pill members

Stephen Marche Trump conservative? Or like Rand Paul conservative?

RedPillSchool I would've preferred Rand, But since he fell out, I'm on board with trump in a very watch-it-burn kind of way

Stephen Marche So I guess the question is why are you starting the new site off Reddit?

RedPillSchool Well there are a few reasons for the new site.

First, we wanted to have a safe backup for our forums if reddit admin kicked us off. We're a very unpopular subject matter and we know the admin have removed other subreddits for being unpopular in subject.

We're accused of misogyny almost daily, so it would make sense if they wanted us gone.

I won't deny that the language is colorful and there's a lot of emotion expressed by the men on the forum.

But there wasn't really a way for guys to express these feelings. It's politically incorrect, but that doesn't mean the feelings just disappear. Guys needed a place for straight-talk with other guys. Like a locker room.

A lot of these guys didn't have dads, or a positive male role model to discuss these things with, so they lack male companionship and comradery

But it's risky, because the gender wars are heated, and feminists are quick on the trigger to try to take down anything they consider wrong. So TheRedPill on reddit is not a safe long-term bet.

We made backup forums, but they're only in case we get moved off reddit. They're locked right now.

Now, the main site that is open now is trp.red, I'm sure you saw

We wanted a place where men could discuss masculine topics with each other without facing the same public shaming outcry that happens on other social media sites.

There are examples of Milo Yiannopoulos getting reported and losing his verified status on twitter because of his views on masculinity

and nobody can talk about these subjects on facebook because that's career and family suicide.

it's a big topic that has become taboo in our culture. We just can't talk like men to other men about things that affect men.

So we decided this was a niche that needed to be filled. A place for men to discuss masculine interests without the social backlash of being politically incorrect.

Stephen Marche But surely there's a line somewhere. I mean, to me, the site is 90% locker room talk, then like 10% misogyny. Does that sound fair to you?

RedPillSchool Haha, well I would argue that the definition of misogyny isn't really very concrete, that much is labelled as such because it's inconvenient.

So, let's say there's a guy who just says "well I hate women"

I think that's textbook misogyny

and, in fact, we let them say that. Because there's nowhere else for a man to blow off steam. And sometimes you have an experience that makes you think, "women, right?"

but they stay, they learn, they vent, they get advice, they get back on the horse.

The endgame of our advice isn't to hate women. It's to understand them so you can stop being so darn frustrated by them.

Stephen Marche So TRP is a way to work through misogny and escape it?

RedPillSchool In a way, yes.

But I do take exception to the word. Because I think it's used unfairly to stifle men from venting very real feelings.

Stephen Marche But those real feelings are hostility to women

RedPillSchool I think, a guy gets cheated on by his girlfriend and he swears off women altogether, yeah, you can call it misogyny, obviously all women didn't break his heart.

But he's not really thinking in his head, "all women just hurt me"

what he's thinking is "my insatiable desire for women in my life is hurting me "

the dark secret is, men need woman, and I think sometimes resent that their happiness is inextricably linked to satiate their biological imperative.

Stephen Marche Do you talk often with Redditt admin about the site or its future?

RedPillSchool Reddit admin do very little to communicate with mods, so there has been no open dialog with them. Though I have contacted them regarding this.

Stephen Marche Sorry. regarding the new site?

RedPillSchool Regarding the subreddit.

Stephen Marche So you didn't start it because of something an admin communicated to you?

RedPillSchool No, there has been no evidence that we're being removed that I know of.

We started this project about a year ago to make sure we were ready if it did happen, because about a year ago they started removing other politically incorrect subreddits. We just wanted to be prepared.

TRP.RED as a social media site was borne out of the original plan for a backup forum. It sort of evolved from our original plans.

Stephen Marche Surely you must find SOME stuff posted on TRP offensive. Or worse

RedPillSchool I think it's about the perspective that you approach the content. I have been very dedicated to ensuring that the space allows for male anger and male venting. Because of this, I understand it and embrace it.

If a guy came on and talked about actually hurting women or plotting to harm them, we'd remove them and possibly contact authorities if there was any risk of an immediate threat.

But this is the one place where men have the freedom to throw around ideas, vent, and discuss openly with other men.

I do, however, see why it is offensive to some people.

For instance, there are people who want to believe that every person is entirely unique and different.

It's a comforting thought that we are all individuals

Some of what we say tries to predict behaviors based on knowledge of the group.

Essentially, a stereotype.

it's offensive to people to think, "well, just because I'm a woman, doesn't mean I will do what these guys are saying, so this is offensive to me."

but I think that lacks an understanding of how generalizations are applied. Of course it's impossible to truly predict behaviors of an individual. We try to capitalize on behavioral trends because we know enough women will behave a certain way.

For instance, enough girls like tall guys, that we can reasonably surmise that being tall will net you better results than being short

But some women date short guys.

It's just a generalization

Stephen Marche That's not really the stuff I'm talking about. It's more the "if women come home with them you can rape them," material.

I mean, I know what a tiny fragment of TRP that is, but it is shocking when you come across it.

RedPillSchool That's the sensationalized version of the red pill that gets bandied around.

Stephen Marche Lets talk about that. The media response to this stuff, because it does seem pretty distorted to me.

RedPillSchool There's no discussion of rape strategies. It's antithetical to our entire purpose, which is to find a way to become attractive enough that women will want to be with us.

If the group was seriously pro-rape, there simply wouldn't be a discussion on building attraction. We'd just take 'em all by force.

There have been probably a handful of comments I've removed over the past three years, and they're usually one-offs by trolls who want to make the group look pro-rape. They're banned and removed, since that is strictly forbidden in our forum rules.

Stephen Marche You been following the Jian Ghomeshi case at all?

RedPillSchool No I haven't

Stephen Marche What do you think of what happened with Roosh V?

RedPillSchool with the roosh v day meetups that were cancelled?

Stephen Marche Yes

RedPillSchool He knew he was infamous and would cause a stir. I think he planned it out that way.

No coverage is bad coverage

his message is targeted at guys that cut through the crap, so the news says "pro rape group getting together" and the guys look him up to see what the hubbub is, turns out he's a masculine blogger

Stephen Marche How long do you think you're going to keep running TRP?

RedPillSchool As long as I can

It's changed so many lives

including my own

Stephen Marche Can you think of anybody whose life it has changed for the worse?

RedPillSchool Not in particular. There are some guys who got the information but didn't really digest it, and they claim it didn't work.

Stephen Marche Do you think TRP is mostly misrepresented or do you think it kind of courts that shock value?

RedPillSchool I didn't ask for it to be misrepresented, but it is a great advertising scheme when people see shocking headlines and come read what we have, and end up staying.

The truth is, some of these topics are just outside the overton window, no matter how true or false they may be

and so there will be outrage

Stephen Marche Does it bother you?

RedPillSchool Not really. I didn't expect mainstream acceptance, nor do I work towards that goal.


[–]ddiogenesofsinope 109 points110 points  (5 children)

But Redpillers are responding to a much more novel and contemporary reality that such biological imperatives: they are responding to women having financial and sexual power over their own lives and bodies.

Loled.

Nothing on self improvement, nothing on saving men from a life they don't want or guiding them like a father would do his son.

So how about this. The traditional mechanisms which democratic societies had for delivering gender roles have been dismantled. Sure.

But we're about 50 years into this experiment and is it any wonder that no one is happy with the current situation. Not men, and especially women. You know one of the biggest things for a lot of women I know is that they just want to know how to be women. They just want to be feminine and not be ashamed of that. Men want to be men and not be ashamed too.

The social situation has fundamentally changed and no one gave me the proper tools to deal with being a modern man. My parents have no idea whats going on. Tinder? Temporary jobs? No money to move out? The traditional mechanisms for courting and securing jobs have been annihilated. And TRP is one of the only sources offering even the slightest nudge in the right direction for men.

No job and no woman? Think about it, what is anyone else offering me? TRP gave me something to strive for. Some maxims to live by. A way of pushing myself forward in a fragmented world to achieve my own dreams. Not society, and certainly not feminism.

It gave me something useful, tangible, and best of all, it makes sense. It is modern advice for the modern man. And if you don't like it just fuck off. You don't have to read it.

That's what attracted me to this place in the first place. the visceral reaction against it. If it truly means nothing and is flawed, people would ignore it and hope it dies. But the fact its being written about in mainstream newspapers and has an entire sub dedicated against it, tells me its struck a chord. It has some kind of truth to it.

Lead, follow, or get the fuck out of the way. Like it or not, I'm carving a piece of this world out for myself.

[–]riverraider69 17 points18 points  (2 children)

But Redpillers are responding to a much more novel and contemporary reality that such biological imperatives: they are responding to women having financial and sexual power over their own lives and bodies.

This is much truer than it looks. Women have much more of a choice now than 100 years ago, mainly from an economic point of view. So we live in a world where they exercise this choice. And in this world, it's much better to be a well-muscled asshole than a hard-working gentle money-saver.

The problem is that biology made men to be 5 alpha for 95 beta, because that's what used to be necessary, while now the demand is closer to 50-50, or worse. So neither side is happy. Except of course the 5 alphas, who no longer have to fear shotgun weddings, angry husbands or even actually raise their children if they don't feel like it.

[–]rickception 0 points1 point  (0 children)

i was "a well muscled asshole" trust me, it wasnt good either

[–]kankouillotte 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It has some kind of truth to it.

Well that's for sure. Results show.

[–]PD132 381 points382 points  (31 children)

"What the boys of The Red Pill need, in all honesty, is a massive dose of Romantic poetry. They need a dedicated course of treatment in the novels of Jane Austen...."

He's right about that, anyway. Mr. Darcy from Pride and Prejudice is one of women's all time favorite romantic heroes. What does he do when he first meets the heroine?

(1) Tells her she's unattractive and refuses to dance with her.

(2) Convinces his friend to dump her sister, even though they're madly in love, because the heroine has a shitty family and he doesn't want his friends associating with them.

(3) Ditches town, leaving one of his enemies to sit there telling the heroine how much of an asshole he is until she can't quit thinking about him.

(4) He's rich, he's handsome, and he lives in a giant mansion with a bunch of servants who tell her how he's really a great guy underneath the asshole exterior. Then he writes her letters showing her what a great guy he is underneath the asshole image.

Maybe this Guardian guy needs a little dose of Jane Austen, too.

[–]bokehnikon 222 points223 points  (20 children)

First line of Pride and Prejudice: "It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a good fortune, must be in want of a wife."

Hypergamy laid bare.

[–][deleted] 143 points144 points  (8 children)

Sense and Sensiblity:

1) Man meets girl he likes, but can't get together with due to secret betrothal.

2) Man sticks with the girl he is engaged to, even though his family hates her.

3) Family disowns him of his inheritance due to the "bad match."

4) Engaged girl "transfers her affections" to man's younger brother, who now gets inheritance. They marry, because the family can't disown everybody.

5) Man, now disowned, has to live as a preacher.

Austin knew what she was talking about.

[–]Five_Decades 45 points46 points  (1 child)

It is too bad intelligent replies like this are not what critics think of when they think of TRP.

[–]IAMAwhitecismaleAMA 12 points13 points  (0 children)

It's all about The NarrativeTM

[–]Smurfboy82 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Well goddamn that's completely fucked.

[–]TuckerP 18 points19 points  (3 children)

Holy shit, I need to read more romantic novels.

[–][deleted] 19 points20 points  (1 child)

There fucking classics for a reason man. Both in literal terms and they are the model of how to get a girl or guy in novel form.

[–]ChadThundercockII 2 points3 points  (0 children)

When I was 8 or so I read three books from the same authors, a woman called Jude Deveraux. This woman, in all her novels, had a fixed idea of what a man should be. I acted like that for the a few years then chick flicks came in and ruined everything, which turned me into a beta fag. Romantic literature has some things right.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lol these are actually really good books.

[–]lakalahehe 1 point2 points  (0 children)

lol, I noticed: So it was a bad match after all.

[–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (5 children)

What. Maybe I need to read this...

[–]2IVIaskerade 35 points36 points  (0 children)

That first line is Austen satirising the prevailing thought at the time - that a man of position and money needs a wife - a thought train that is mocked continually throughout the novel through the character of Mrs Bennet.

[–]spectrum_92 19 points20 points  (3 children)

Jane Austen is the greatest female novelist of all time, get on that shit.

[–]RedPillFusion 7 points8 points  (2 children)

This could be what /u/redpillschool was getting at when he said it wouldn't surprise if the author bought into more than letting on. These are some of the most well-known novels and authors in human history. Could be a wink and nod our way.

If I were to start straight-talking red pill theory in transparency, I would be dethroned from a couple of positions I currently hold.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I can't believe we are discussing Jane Austen in here...

I doubt it. The primary themes in her works speak to social constructions interfering with "true love." The female prerogative is still the point; let's not forget that Miss Bennet's opinion of Mr. Darcy changed the moment she "laid her eyes on his estates at Pemberly."

TRP truths can be divined from her works only because she was lampooning society. I don't think that the author of the article was that clever or nuanced.

[–]PD132 7 points8 points  (0 children)

This Marche guy brought up Jane Austen because he thinks we're all a bunch of uneducated 16 year olds. But he has to think that.

What kind of blow to his ego would it be if a bunch of intelligent, well-read adults are pointing out that his romanticized world view about what women want is in fact the kind of thing that a sexually inexperienced 16 year old believes?

If he'd actually read Jane Austen, or any romance novel that women like at all, he wouldn't still believe this stuff.

[–]daymi 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Maybe it's because English is a second language for me, but I never understood what that sentence meant. Is it some old English style?

[–]Kayyam 1 point2 points  (2 children)

It's a simple phrase really.

[–]daymi 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Not for me. "in want of" is very old English that seems to mean something like "missing something". Not sure whether it also implies that he wants to have it, as in the modern usage.

Then the good fortune, does that mean luck or wealth?

It's not the case that wealthy men have no wife, so that must not be what it means...

Or does it mean that for a man to be fortunate he must have no wife?

[–]Kayyam 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fortune as in wealth.

"being in want of something" = "wanting something".

So it means that single wealthy men must be looking for a wife.

[–][deleted] 38 points39 points  (0 children)

No shit. The crisis point in Pride and Prejudice is when her younger sister elopes with a man, and (it is implied) has sex with him before marriage. This scandal threatens to ruin all of the unwed sisters of her family, tainting them with shame and making them unworthy to marry in the eyes of polite society. Only a shotgun wedding arranged by the hero prevents them all from descending into spinsterhood.

Austin comes from a different time.

[–]human_bean_ 14 points15 points  (1 child)

It's kind of funny how women don't even try to hide it. They simply feed the lie men tell themselves.

It's like religion. People don't want to die so they believe in afterlife.

If men didn't desperately want to believe in the lie, it would disappear in a day.

[–]ChadThundercockII 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's like religion. People don't want to die so they believe in afterlife.

ALL beliefs have some sort of "afterlife". From a strictly anthropological point of view, it's not a religious problem, it's a human one. People believed in the afterlife at the beginning of human abstraction and called it "the dream world".

[–]pacollegENT 5 points6 points  (1 child)

hahah this is gold

[–]razormachine 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well I actually agree that a "true" romance (the one we were lead to believe exists) would fix a bunch of guys on this reddit, and flush a lot of accumulated anger down the toilet.

Sadly that kind of romance does not exist in the real world.

So lets do the next best thing fuck n'dump those bitches :)

[–]Circusmidget 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Never thought I'd learn classic lit from trp

[–]kankouillotte 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He pretends to know literature yet he couldn't see what was under his nose this whole time. Talk about blue pill.

[–]TheRedThrowAwayPill -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Taming of the Shrew

-by William Shakespeare  

[–]DirtyProject0r 165 points166 points  (30 children)

Lets talk about that. The media response to this stuff, because it does seem pretty distorted to me.

proceeds to write a distorted article on TRP

[–]1Su-Wu_Red 96 points97 points  (5 children)

I agree that it was distorted. But it will speak to the men that it needs to speak to. I mean, guys, we got AF/BB to be acknowledged on the guardian. This is a massive platform.

Men who are "woke" will read this, and it will be an aha moment:

AF/BB - Alpha Fucks/Beta Bucks. AF/BB, as an idea, is closely related to AWALT (“All Women Are Like That”). All women, in this argument, divide men into two types: alpha males they want to fuck, and beta males they use for financial and emotional support in exchange for sex.

Also, his question about "how cool does a man need to be before he can mistreat a woman" is an underhanded way of acknowledging the existence of alphas.

This guy got an article about redpill published in a far left newspaper based in the divorce rape capital of the world - London. He's not Rollo, but this is one hell of an achievement. Is it perfect? No. But it is progress. The conversation is entering the mainstream whether people like it or not.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (3 children)

All women, in this argument, divide men into two types: alpha males they want to fuck, and beta males they use for financial and emotional support in exchange for sex.

You've mischaracterized the nature of Alpha and Beta.

Alpha and Beta aren't divisions of people they are divisions of behavior. A person can have measures of both if he is displaying both types.

In other words, there are plenty of guys who are an alpha for AF but who still have plenty of resources to be harvested for BB.

Or there are guys who have neither value as AF nor BB. They get nothing.

One of the most problems people have with TRP theory is this obsession with designating everything as either "alpha" or "beta" without much nuance for circumstances, that it doesn't match reality. Because Alpha and Beta are much better understood as a spectrum of behavior.

[–]1Su-Wu_Red 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Few things:

1) I didn't write that, Guardian journo did.

2) I agree with your analysis about how AF/BB is a continuum rather than discrete categories.

3) My broader point still stands about the significance of such concepts being published on a mass media platform, however much they may lack nuance.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

My bad. I didn't realize you were quoting.

[–]Wilreadit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

AF/BB can be in the same person too.

[–]Wilreadit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The conversation is starting that is the main thing.

Now conversation is good and bad. It is good for countering feminism and the whole narrative that society has been sucked into.

It is bad for Red pillers as it negates any advantage he might have on the enemy as the smart ones have one more defence. TRP defence.

Well so be it. I am willing to play.

[–]389428347934 42 points43 points  (23 children)

I'm going to have to go against the grain here.

I feel, unfortunately, (and with no disrespect), /u/redpillschool was played.

The writer clearly had an angle going into this piece. You don't write an article this slanted (i.e., misogyny) without planning it. RPS was basically farmed for quotes to support his thesis. He set up some false flag sympathetic questions to lure RPS into responding with some money quotes. For example, the demographic question was a clear way to paint his character with a quote proving something the writer already suspected. The questions about dating were an set up to paint the community as helpless love-starved men. I'm bewildered that RPS didn't see it coming - or perhaps he did.

I think RPS did a good job given the situation. He articulated things well. However, I am actually surprised he agreed to the interview. Don't we say around here not to engage feminists? And isn't the phrase "The first rule of TRP is to not talk about TRP?" I'm all for "there's no such thing as bad publicity," but what on earth does any Red Piller have to gain by engaging a feminist? Just yesterday there was a post where a reader was advised not to engage his friend about feminism and her planned slut walk, and the community seemed to support that.

Perhaps RPS knew all this. If so, perhaps this could open up a broader discussion. Why engage feminists? What are some strategies for talking with them?

I would be interested in /u/redpillschool's thoughts and strategy for dealing with this interview.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 63 points64 points  (14 children)

Of course it was never going to put us in a good light. That's not the point.

[–]Dollar_thief 23 points24 points  (5 children)

"No publicity is bad publicity."

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Aka the Kanye West marketing strategy

[–]Dollar_thief 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Exactly, Kanye is a dark triad marketer - he knows what will make people talk about him, and does it. Very clever guy, knows a huge amount about psychology, hypnotism, influence, power, and has decentsih lyrics too.

[–]389428347934 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Right, but doesn't that contradict what people say around here that we shouldn't engage feminists? Or not speak about TRP?

[–]Docbear64 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I think it comes down to the difference between personal presentation and defense of the pill and a general education of the pill. you taking up the mantle of the pill in public is going to harm you and cause you frustration on a personal level , we are not a religion we are a group of men sharing , crafting , and improving our world view in terms of sex and relationships.

This article is not a personal defense of the redpill but a general education . This is who we are and why we feel this way . there's a big difference between proclaiming the redpill to be the truth to a blinded society and merely informing the society that we exist and I think that's the importance of the tone in the article RedPillSchool does a good job of being inoffensive and cordial . When you know that the media would like to spin us all as angry women haters it's important to .... keep frame .

RedPillSchool has increased awareness and like all of us there will be a wave of eyes that make their choice . Hopefully the attention doesn't cause a backlash . closure of the sub but RedPillSchool has always known that's a possibility no matter what .

[–]389428347934 11 points12 points  (3 children)

That's what I'm getting at.

I think there's a valuable discussion here. What are the benefits of engaging a feminist or talking about TRP when popular wisdom here is not discuss it at all, or to let men discover it on their own?

Do you have any advice or tips on when feminists should be engaged? Or what you should do when you do engage them?

You knew TRP was going to be cast in a negative light. Surely you had some plan or awareness on how to conduct the chat given that. I think that could be valuable info for newbies who may not have the luxury of choosing to when speak about the TRP, but are forced into speaking about it, or defending their new, solidifying mindset.

What kind of advice would you give, in retrospect after having this interview? Is it still good to speak about TRP if you know it will not be well received? If so, how should one talk about it?

I'm sure it was an interesting experience having that interview, and there may be some tips new people could learn from the process and mindset you had going in.

[–]Xemnas81 17 points18 points  (0 children)

RPS was getting shit-tested by the Guardian, Valenti and by extension, the 'progressive' left. They pinned him in a corner as SJWs do. It was not an interview, it was an interrogation. RPS is not an idiot, he knew this, so he used power talk to show up the SJWs and to show individuals still capable of critical thought how much the hamster is beginning to flail.

This article represents one of many last power grabs by the regressive left. Believe it or not, this is a bittersweet victory.

The alternative was for RPS to say "no comment" and for the Guardian to create an absolute smear campaign regarding Roosh and associating the TRP sub with rape apologism. (The irony that the MSM still thinks Roosh is directly affiliated with TRP is not lost on me.)

[–]Redpillc0re 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Engaging a feminist in private brings no new subscribers here. Libel from a tabloid will bring a few thousands. You seriously think that negative press is damaging or leads to unpopularity? Why are people obsessed with the sins of celebrities then? redpillschool did well. He treated guardian like a slut, pumped and will now dump. And he didnt even compromise his style to do it.

[–]3savoryprunes 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Sitting down for a formal interview is nowhere near the same as defending your participation here to your social group. Exposing some of the thinking behind the leadership of this sub to the mainstream press is just that - exposure. Arguing on a one-on-one basis with a raging feminist accomplishes nothing. You cannot reason with them. It's a lose-lose situation.

On the micro scale, it's all about your social posturing. Keeping your lips shut is the easiest way to hold frame. If you're feeling really confident, there are covert ways to "plant seeds" or you can just black knight.

On the macro scale, it is just as RPS has done. No press is bad press.

[–]1james-watson 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Yeah, I think you approached from a very honest, masculine point of view and gave him the benefit of the doubt. This is commendable, but unfortunately naive if you read the article.

He fucking SHITS on EVERYTHING TRP, it's worse than if Jezebel wrote about us. Just goes on about how we're all vicious rapists worse than General Butt Naked himself.

A chat with GLO to prep you for this would have been beneficial, as he did very well on his reality show to prevent getting quoted out of context. Short, clear sentences that cannot be chopped up and used for their purposes.

I'd say this was a loss, but hey, who gives a fuck. These faggots will keep pounding that drum till they get raped in divorce court. Then they'll be on here posting for help.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

unfortunately naive if you read the article.

I think you misunderstand my motivation and purpose. We weren't going to be cast in a good light, nor was that my intention with entertaining the interview.

I did it because each and every hit piece against us brings new subscribers who read it and go- is that really what they think? I posted the full interview here so that people who make it here can read and understand the difference. If what I said in the full text is reasonable, what does that say about the author of the hit piece?

I didn't need to be ridiculous to get the hit piece- I let him do the leg work.

Ain't my first rodeo, son. How do you think we have so many subscribers?

[–]1james-watson 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Just talked to a buddy who found TRP through this exact method. Apparently someone on the relationships reddit referred to TRP with the usual "bunch of rapists" tag, and he was curious and dropped by to check it out. Another man saved from the clutches of the matrix.

The proof is in the pudding, so keep on doing the lord's work and spreading that red gospel. I'm on board: no publicity is bad publicity. Let men come here and decide for themselves.

[–]swan1114 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's how I got here. Bad press. Excellent interview. It's interesting how he cherry picked your quotes /u/redpillschool

[–]MisterMisogyny 23 points24 points  (1 child)

paint the community as helpless love-starved men

Isnt this true though? IMHO, one of the most profound and important parts of the red pill is that -- for a man -- being "loved" in the blue-pill sense is not possible. A woman will never love a man the way that a man wants to be loved. Her love is transactional and opportune. We say that love only flows downwards: men love women, women love children, children love puppies. For me, the realization that I will never be loved the way that I wanted to be (except by my mother) was the bitterest part of the pill, and it was the part that weighed heaviest in each of the stages of grief.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Only women whose relationship with us is purely biological (like mother, sister, daughter, aunt, etc) can ever love us for who we really are. Even then, there's a certain point beyond which they'll lose respect for us. A man, at the end of the day, is alone.

[–]TRP VanguardWhisper 11 points12 points  (2 children)

I'm all for "there's no such thing as bad publicity," but what on earth does any Red Piller have to gain by engaging a feminist?

Feminist outrage is free publicity, young Padawan. Not only that, negative publicity from Joe is positive publicity with anyone who can't stand Joe.

You don't engage with feminists trying to reason with them. If they could be reasoned with, they wouldn't be feminists. What you do is wind them up, and wait for their howling to attract wolves.

Hell, we all know half the shit we say in here is ridiculously hyperbolic. But it not only helps us get in the right mindset, it also creates a storm of free publicity from TBP and feminists and haters because no one let them in on the joke, and they're such a bunch of spergs that they take it all literally.

They actually talk themselves into believing their worst fears. I'm not sure whether to laugh or cry, sometimes.

So of course no media article on us is ever going to be anything but a hit piece. But so what? Will that make women suddenly stop being moist for selfish, cocky men? Nah. It'll just make more people come here to see what the fuss is about.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew 0 points1 point  (1 child)

"You don't engage with feminists trying to reason with them. If they could be reasoned with, they wouldn't be feminists."

Excellent point.

I've always loved the Streisand effect, or similar: all the hate, whining, false accusations, and all the insulting media coverage creates attention that does the opposite of its intended purpose: it draws more men here.

The more hate, bitterness, and white-knighting that is directed at us, the more the limelight shines on us, and the more exposure we get.

Interesting to see how the intelligent men are able to differenitiate between hyperbole and reality, and stay here and join us.

[–]TRP VanguardWhisper 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You get it.

There is no set of instructions, for attractiveness or anything else in this world, which can free you from the need to think for yourself. Anyone who cannot think for themselves needs to learn, or give up and get their loser ass out of the way.

Not all of the advice here is going to be good. None of it is going to be a step by step plan, or consistent, or coherent, or anything.

TRP is not a life plan, and silk is not a parachute. Learn to sew.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

RedPillSchool: I didn't ask for it to be misrepresented, but it is a great advertising scheme when people see shocking headlines and come read what we have, and end up staying.

I think they were both in it for themselves - both knew - and funny enough - both succeeded. Idiot journalist gets his article and can add the bullshit so people read it. RPS understands this, doesn't do too much to even set him straight, but is honest, this means TRP will get get more eye balls - more lives saved, everyone wins.

Also - I'm more than willing to think the creator of the sub knows better than we do about this subject.

[–]redzorp 3 points4 points  (0 children)

At the end of the day, that interview will bring at least another 50,000 male readers to this site, out of which 10,000 or more will sign up.

That is a good thing.

[–]Wilreadit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes that may be what had in mind.

But it doesn't matter. The point is there are thousands of people who have been fed up with the misandry narrative but don't know what to do. They would think their cases are unique. Now once they hear this atleast they will know where to seek help if they so choose to. That is the point here.

Remember the day more people support TRP than feministic BS, things will change. It is not impossible, but it will require effort.

I believe that humans are smart. But not all are smart to seek the light. But most are smart to follow the light if someone else shows it to them.

Feminism arose to a demand where they were being treated like slaves. Fair. But now they have tried apply retribution and it is all about power and societal control.

TRP is a check on that to balance it.

[–]ANGRY_ATHEIST 61 points62 points  (13 children)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Marche

Marche has a son, and lives happily with his wife, Helen, and her partner, Tyrone, in Toronto.

omfg my sides. I'm in tears. Just stop.

[–][deleted] 26 points27 points  (2 children)

He's actually called Tyrone? My bullshit detector is triggered.

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Stephen_Marche&diff=715308922&oldid=680755671

If that was you, lulz. Well played.

[–]TheRedThrowAwayPill 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Ok, which one of you idiots did this? lol hilarious

[–]DASmetal[🍰] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The ever-elusive hacker known only as The 4Chan.

[–]OFF_THE_DEEP_END 8 points8 points [recovered]

Is it true? I think someone is playing a joke. The citation on the wiki says nothing about a Tyrone. And it was added to the wiki after the article I think.

[–]ChadThundercockII 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Tyrone is too stereotypical. Someone is trolling his page.

[–]tallwheel 5 points6 points  (0 children)

No way! You are fricking shitting me! Which one of you guys edited that page?

[–]fuckin_retard 5 points5 points [recovered]

I checked the listed source for that: the article named "Why Fatherhood Matters", and did a search for keywords "Helen", "partner" and "Tyrone".

Came up empty. Somebody spammed his wikipedia page.

[–]Wilreadit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Totally uncool. These are the jokers who fuck things up.

[–]mugatucrazypills 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I thought the BluePillerShameStartup Guy for Jesus the other day was good, but this Marche takes BP to an ART !

[–]Archange_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The wife of Stephen Marche is Sarah Fulford, the editor in chief of Toronto Life. So Wikipedia is wrong; probably a prank.

[–]xfLyFPS 1 point2 points  (0 children)

AHAHA.

This must be a fucking parody.

[–]TheSKSpecial 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fuck me sideways, he's an actual cuckold. A real life, true blue, I-allow-another-man-to-plow-my-wife cuckold.

Sensational.

[–]Isaiah4verse1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why am I not surprised this cuck is from Toronto.

[–]TheRationalMale.comRollo-Tomassi 53 points54 points  (6 children)

This guy led you to the quotes he want to post about TRP before he typed a word.

Never forget, it's their game: https://therationalmale.com/2013/04/02/its-their-game/

No matter what ANY cathedral writer tries to convince you of, you must always presume you will be misrepresented to their narrative.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 52 points53 points  (3 children)

No matter what ANY cathedral writer tries to convince you of, you must always presume you will be misrepresented to their narrative.

Exactly. I'm actually surprised he didn't butcher it worse. Either way, watch our subscriber count grow, grow, grow!

[–]autoNFA 6 points7 points  (2 children)

I'm surprised he didn't challenge either the central Red Pill metaphor (men get fed lies about dating in the modern world) or the effectiveness of TRP's advice for getting laid.

[–]3savoryprunes 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm not. He knows it's true and so does most of society deep down. Trying to refute the obvious would hamper his focused attack, broadening it too much to be sustainable.

[–]indeydius 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I want to know what's next. Open Hypergamy is real. Now we have more men waking up at the same time that society at large is becoming aware of the pill. It's like computer security. Every new measure brings a counter-measure.

Spreading the pill changes the game. Publicity escalates the gender arms race. Where does this go, Rollo?

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is a serious principle to live by. Just look at Roosh's Dr. Oz appearance.

No amount of effort would have given Roosh an open, unbiased platform. Dr. Oz's show had the "home field" advantage and edited and misdirected the entire thing in order to perpetuate their agenda.

Always assume someone has THEIR best interest in mind, and will not be partial to you. Assume once you're not there to defend yourself, they'll misrepresent you.

There are so many examples of everyday lies and misrepresentation.

I can see how RedPillSchool was careful with his words, and obviously knew going into it that it wasn't possible to get a "fair" interivew.

[–]ControlBlue 113 points114 points  (4 children)

Topics: Gender, Women, Reddit, Internet

How fitting that "Men" is lacking here.

All I needed to hear really, we are actually NOT concerned here, it's the women and the betas talking to each others in their echo chamber, let them be.

that love is infinitely more powerful and real than any marketplace, sexual or otherwise

Typical "Power of Love" bullshit, that person must have been really sheltered to still think that. This is the result when you have an entire generation of men and women growing up on Disney movies, chick flicks, pseudo-sciences, and manipulated medias.

Just pathetic really. The wake-up will be harsh.

[–]iLLprincipLeS 32 points32 points [recovered]

Topics: Gender, Women, Reddit, Internet

What I like is that this is part of a series called : the web we want that basically is an anti free speech campaign. The article about TRP is written just to portray some imaginary online boogeyman that hurts imaginary virtual feefees. For fuck sake, they even got that Jessica Valenti just under the TRP article.

Internet is internet. Strangers that the moment you close your screen, are gone. Just because some whales chose to live a life in the online world instead of the offline world does not mean anything.

Want to do something? Encourage women to not be so much of attention whores that they need to eventually make their boyfriends suicide, to get some online sympathy:

‘Get back in': Teen charged with pressuring boyfriend to commit suicide. Detective Scott Gordon suggested that Carter encouraged Roy to kill himself while simultaneously putting together “a plan to get sympathy from her friends."

[–]tallwheel 9 points10 points  (1 child)

the web we want

What a ridiculous phrase. It doesn't matter how anyone wants the Internet to be. The Internet grows organically based on a free market of money and ideas. You want to decide what should and shouldn't be on the Internet? You'd get along great with the Chinese government.

[–]drqxx 54 points55 points  (1 child)

Thank you for giving us 20 hours a week of moderation.

[–]KartagoPill 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It's cray cray

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorCopperFox3c 41 points42 points  (2 children)

Article aside, I enjoyed reading the interview in the OP. We forget sometimes that there are people behind the screen names, with experiences that have shaped and defined the things they say here at TRP. These aren't simply beliefs, but often things we had to learn whether we wanted to or not. Hard-won knowledge. Battle scars. Even amongst the ECs and Mods. Sometimes that gets lost in all the anger phase posts.

It's humanizing in a way.

[–]1IamGale 1 point2 points  (0 children)

These aren't simply beliefs, but often things we had to learn whether we wanted to or not. Hard-won knowledge. Battle scars. Even amongst the ECs and Mods. Sometimes that gets lost in all the anger phase posts.

It's humanizing in a way.

Spot on. I couldn't of said it better myself.

[–]Archange_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Chads need not come here. They have their way with women on easy mode. Only those who had to battle their way through arrive at the red pill.

[–]bokehnikon 147 points148 points  (58 children)

Like most mainstream media coverage of TRP, the article doesn't really address the truths expressed by TRP but instead devolves into ad hominem attacks , insinuations, mischaracterization and petty moralizing.

A quote from the article:

What the boys of The Red Pill need, in all honesty, is a massive dose of Romantic poetry. They need a dedicated course of treatment in the novels of Jane Austen and Dostoevsky, combined with significant therapy in negative capability. They need to learn that love is awful, in the both the ancient and modern senses of the world – that love is infinitely more powerful and real than any marketplace, sexual or otherwise.

[–]IGoYouStayTwoAutumns 153 points154 points  (9 children)

Studied the Romantics. Used the material on women. Didn't work.

Studied TRP. Used the material on women. Worked.

Case closed.

[–]bokehnikon 42 points43 points  (5 children)

The Romantic poets such as Blake and Shelley made the young women of their day swoon. But that's because their SMV was sky high: they were famous literary figures, the equivalent of being modern day rock stars, reality stars, athletes all rolled into one. And they were members of the aristocracy, with estates and titles. That stuff will get even today's woman tingling.

The "Byronic Hero" of the Romantic movement was a dashing, masculine yet cynical and brooding male, who might be moved to tenderness if he deigned a woman was good enough for him.

The poetry? Just fluff to make the women think they conquered their man, that all those words were written just for them.

[–]MuhTriggersGuise 18 points19 points  (4 children)

they were famous literary figures, the equivalent of being modern day rock stars

On the same token, modern day rock stars can pull some serious beta shit but it is highly outweighed by their massive SMV. For instance, they may sing about putting a woman on a pedastal, or stalking someone, or worse, and will be idolized for it. Any man without a huge following of fans validating their SMV would commit social suicide by acting in such a way. But the legions of fans validating the man make beta behavior forgivable, or even preferable, since it makes an attraction "god" seem a little more human. Then your average run of the mill Joe doesn't understand why his stalking and profession of love never works on women, "I mean look at the rock star!"

[–]Five_Decades 20 points21 points  (3 children)

Reminds me of a thread I saw on another forum, some guy created a fake Tinder account and put up a profile pic of a guy who was a 10 in looks. Tall, face of a roman god, great body, etc. Then he pretended the guy was autistic when chatting to women. Seeing the women hamster away his bad social skills and pretend that people who judged him were bad people (and that they were above that kind of behavior) was funny and sad at the same time.

Everyone reading it knew how those women would react if the guy was a 2.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child)

It is one of the most famous and notoriously known thread from Bodybuilding form. It is just hilarious and sad to see the responses.

[–]iLLprincipLeS 23 points23 points [recovered]

God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?

Replace God with Love and it will fit just as good. What remains, nothing remains. Those are things of the past, learn the ways of the new world or others will teach them to you. Kneel to the False Gods or rise, You, God.

[–]GunsGermsAndSteel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

So much truth here! Do what works, not what you think SHOULD work.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 257 points258 points  (7 children)

that love is infinitely more powerful and real than any marketplace, sexual or otherwise.

It's such a comfortable idea, to think that there's a powerful force in this universe that defies the laws of physics and economics.

A comfortable lie.

[–][deleted] 39 points40 points  (0 children)

A lazy lie. Allows us to shrug our shoulders and declare it out of our hands.

[–][deleted] 26 points26 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]Boobsbuttsandbats 12 points13 points  (1 child)

Right, and what sort of corner are those statements trying to back people into. If I need to marry someone, have a child, and then walk out on them, just to prove that "love" is a lie, what have I proven. These fools will just say I'm heartless. It's like saying I'd work my ass off to become an architect or engineer, and then throw my career away to build in some fatal flaw to my building or bridge, just to prove I have "free will". There's no way to win that argument with most humans.

[–]stickfiguresk 33 points34 points  (0 children)

a lie that can swoon women for the right men at the right time.

[–]Endorsed ContributorThotwrecker 64 points65 points  (12 children)

AKA what TRPers need is a healthy re-indoctrination.

I get it, the Romantic / Plutarchian concept of love is sweet. It feels good when it works. It feels good to believe in the angelic nature of women, and the inevitable triumph of love and persistance. It's the American Dream in a way - its similar to how we believe if you work hard and give everything you've got to your craft, you'll reach the upper echelons of success. In the same way, Western society wants to believe that if you truly dedicate yourself to being good for women and helping them and showing them the depths of your love, eventually you will win the "long game". Sacrifice, sacrifice, sacrifice, and eventually you have your day.

It's pretty to think about, but it's a fantasy, a world that has never really existed. I don't care how many times you tell me that being illusioned is better for my quality of life. I was THERE when my quality of life was low; I know what it was like THEN, and I know what it's like now. Telling me to "go back" is like telling me to go back to being an intern like when I was a freshmen. It's like telling me to "go back" to my busted ass 96 civic now that I'm in a porsche, because you think my civic is more "wholesome" and will actually make me happier.

Fat fucking chance.

[–]rossiFan 26 points27 points  (11 children)

They don't understand - I CANNOT go back.

[–]GunsGermsAndSteel 17 points18 points  (3 children)

Exactly. It's not like I'm going to forget what I have learned. Seeing RP strategy work again and again on women has changed how I deal with them. I've always been super dominant and aggressive sexually, but outside of the bedroom I was the guy who'd write them poetry and buy them dinner and just basically put them on a pedestal. What I've learned through RP is that the way I've always treated them in the bedroom (like they're just a toy for my amusement) is, to one level or another, how I should treat them all the time. I learned they don't fucking want poetry. Maybe once or twice ever in your relationship with them, sure. But what they want on a daily basis is to be submissive to you and to be secure in the knowledge that you're a couple notches higher in SMV than they are.

[–]Senior Contributordr_warlock 1 point2 points  (1 child)

You can't be Prince Charming in the streets and a caveman in the sheets. "Prince Charming" is not charming because of chivalry, he's charming because of his status. He chose her, an average woman (i.e. 50 Shades of Grey).

She's not having sex with you, she's having sex with the idea of you. If you act beta before sex, then try to spank her and make her suck your dick, she'll be disgusted and feel very uncomfortable.

[–]GunsGermsAndSteel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's kinda the other way around: if you dominate her in bed but then act like a bitch the rest of the time, THAT is what she's gonna be disgusted by. And I can't blame her.

[–]Fenrir93446 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Bro, you seem pretty confident and well acquainted with this subject matter. Would you mind my contacting you from time to time with inquiries?

[–]jerstv 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Once the mind expands, it cannot shrink back. Only disease or trauma can make you unlearn something.

[–]3savoryprunes 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Cypher tried and we saw how that worked out for him.

[–]DASmetal[🍰] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I cannot will not go back.

We all made a choice for one reason or another to be here, to subscribe to this philosophy and to incorporate it in to our lives. I won't give back something that has made me better and feel happier than I ever was before.

[–]akolyteofthecentury -2 points-1 points  (2 children)

See those who're addicted to nicotine. In a way, some of us are more addicted to the redpill - as an extension of masculinity - than they are passionate about it. TRP will make you powerful and beingpowerful feels fucking good. Doesn't have to be a bad thing if you know when and how to wield it properly, be it with others or yourself.

Some people will ask smokers: Why don't you just quit?

goofy hoe, would've done so already if i could!

Going back to the 1930s and girls were cooing over a stupid, hastily stuttered poem surely would be nice, but you're going to have to grow up eventually.

[–]tallwheel 1 point2 points  (1 child)

You've got it backwards. In this analogy, the blue pill should be nicotine. The blue pill is a comforting crutch like nicotine is. TRP is nothing but a healthy dose of opening one's eyes to reality.

[–]akolyteofthecentury 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see what you're saying.

Reality and by extension truth is all you seek after you've woken up. Thats what i was playing at: Damned if you do, damned if you don't. You're always on a chase - the moment you don't have momentum, you stagnate. Everyone has to decide where to run by themselves.

The need for comforting lies will be replaced by the drive to tear the veil of ignorance down, to have truth show itself.

When truth is all you know, you won't stand for childish dreams, lies and fallacies but instead for what really is. And that becomes your "crutch".

[–]Belerion 44 points45 points  (2 children)

So basically "the boys" need fantasy instead of reality.

[–]InformalCriticism 3 points4 points  (0 children)

This.

[–]bslizzle 41 points42 points  (2 children)

How ironic is it that RPS actually cites movies (really meaning fiction) as giving men the wrong ideas about how to be attractive, and then the author goes and says "Look at this fiction. It will change their minds."

[–]CornyHoosier 18 points19 points  (1 child)

He's still jacked-in. They don't live in reality, they're still playing their game.

[–]Jigsus 8 points9 points  (0 children)

He's jacked in because he's married. I wish his wife won't ever cheat on him or divorcerape him but if it does happen we've got a seat saved for him right here. He can come here to understand. In the terms he's familiar with TRP is a "safe space" for desperate men.

By his own admission he hasn't dated in 10 years. That's why he doesn't really know how bad the market had gotten. He doesn't even know about how much women flake these days because they can just fire off a text with a lame excuse.

So yeah he's jacked in. I hope he never needs to swallow the pill.

[–]Kalepsis 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Hmm... yeah, I tried it his way the first 28 years of my life. Got educated, spat poetry, did favors, doted on women, fell in love. But all that effort served to show me one specific truth: women don't want that. They want the tingles.

[–]CornyHoosier 22 points23 points  (1 child)

The author called us boys the whole time and told us to read Jane Austen and Freud, specifically bringing up that we want to fuck our mothers and kill our fathers.

It just holds true that unless you want to take the pill, it won't make sense.

[–]marinewannabee97 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Freud? That fucking joke of a pseudo scientist? No thanks, if I wanted to ingest massive quantities of shit I'd go swimming in a manure pit.

[–][deleted] 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Yes, romantic poetry will be so helpful in encouraging us to be BB pillow bodies.

[–]FortunateBum 9 points10 points  (2 children)

I think mentioning Austen and Dostoevsky are clues to what the journalist was really trying to do - promote TRP. Those two writers are perhaps the most Redpilled in all of literary history. Tolstoy is the top, but he's so blatantly redpilled, he doesn't make a good dog whistle.

[–]bokehnikon 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I thought of that possibility. However, give the rest of what the journalist says he probably has a popular conception of both authors: Austen=romance and Dostoevsky=Christian morality/good vs evil.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It is telling that people (majority) read Pride and Prejudice and went "yeap, that's totally how romance works".

[–][deleted] 27 points28 points  (5 children)

that quote.... made me laugh out loud. Not LOL but literally laugh out loud.

What this author needs is to open his mouth really wide and for me to take a fucking dump in his mouth. That will improve the quality of his writing.

[–]idgaf- 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Me too. Huge facepalm when I read it and some pained sympathy for all the idiots who are still plugged in.

That word, "love" is so poorly defined it's practically always with manipulation or delusion attached to it.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 16 points17 points  (2 children)

I know a very good Korean All You Can Eat restaurant. We should go before you shit in his libcuck mouth.

[–]TomFoo 12 points13 points  (1 child)

Korean here. Where's the damn soju.

[–]BFMCBeaner 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Drinking Soju to me has been renamed "teleporting" back in the 90's when I was stationed there the first time. When you start drinking you are at A,B & C spatial and T space-time co-ordinates. After drinking soju you magically teleport to X, Y & Z and T' and don't know how the fuck you got there and why am I in this stolen Man dump truck in the red light district by the train station honking the air horn?

The next night all the Soju tent ajjossi's and Ajjuma's are cussing and chasing me off? Apparently I didn't know that I tore down the tents like an asshole up the whole main drag of Anjeong-Ri.

I've since learned to tame the dragon of drinking Soju but have graduated to the more refined tastes of Bukbunjaju.

[–]rios_salvi 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I laughed out loud as well.

After reading through the interview I would think he understood trp a little bit better.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

What if there is anger? Are we angry just because? No one wants to address the blatant hypocrisy of double standards: spoiled brats raised by helicopter parents have gotten smarter and learned to play the political and legal game to get everything they want without any of the downside traits of "equality" and have done it geniusly enough to make us feel guilty about it.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMarsupian 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Ive read plenty and enjoyed most of it but unlike TRP romance doesnt help me achieve my goals.

You can stay dreaming or you can take action.

[–]rossiFan 1 point2 points  (2 children)

They need a dedicated course of treatment in the novels of Jane Austen and Dostoevsky, combined with significant therapy in negative capability.

I think I just threw up in my mouth a little.

[–]Wilreadit 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Careful don't puke the Red pill out.

[–]rossiFan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That was digested and wholly absorbed years ago.

[–]3savoryprunes 1 point2 points  (0 children)

And so the interviewer's "solution" for an online community named for dispelling an illusion - more illusion.

[–]filitantmeminist 95 points96 points  (11 children)

I saw the article this morning. It's full of slander and propoganda. Throws "boys" in as much as possible.

Typical scared and confused nu-male.

[–]coffee_and_lumber 42 points42 points [recovered]

Typical scared and confused nu-male.

These guys are in dire need of being taken out into the wilderness for a week, just to see the fallacy that is their entire belief system about what the world actually is. Put them in the company of high testosterone, deeply capable, masculine men just to see their own inadequacies highlighted in an extreme way that they cannot deny or distract themselves from. No smart phones, no technology, just food, water and (relative) shelter. There's nothing that shakes you more than sudden, hard-hitting inner realization that you are a fragile meat-sack and your fancy shoes, devices, restaurant knowledge and platitudes mean absolutely fuck all in the face of nature.

[–]1Claude_Reborn 14 points15 points  (0 children)

The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it.

Don't forget where the term "red pill" came from.

[–]benuntu 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Unfortunately, this doesn't work, and I've seen it first hand. Most guys just retreat back to their safe caves with their cell phones and video games. Then they'll joke about how these "manly men" are so outdated it's like passing a Model-T on the interstate going 80 in their Prius.

And perhaps in some way, they're right. At least in the current time frame, the need for protectors and aggressors is so much less than just 100 years ago. Physical strength, survival skills, and a hardened will were not just attractive qualities but a requirement for actual survival. Now we just let those men fight our battles, deny them benefits when they come home, and have them work for minimum wage. Or betafy them early on in life to a point where they feel bad about acting according to their nature.

I'm just grateful that our human biology is not so short-sighted as our society is. Not only do women intrinsically desire those qualities, they are imperative for survival of the species. And we're not through needing those traits either. We're just a couple steps away from collapse of civilization at any point.

[–]Jigsus 20 points21 points  (1 child)

Don't fall into the trap of thinking that your simple high testosterone stuff is "real". Fancy shoes, smartphones and tech are just as real as nature because they are important in their respective environments.

A real man can pick out fancy shoes and chop down a tree.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Except that none of us are in the face of nature.

[–]1RXRob 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I'd forgotten the term "new man"

Born in 1983 in Britain, I spent my pubescent years thinking that that should be my goal.

I didn't lose my virginity until I'd left school and got a job in sales. What a surprise.

[–]2IVIaskerade 4 points5 points  (1 child)

I love it.

There is no such thing as bad publicity. Fuck, TRP just got an entire article dedicated to it. It might not be in print (I'll have a look in the next few issues to see if it is, but I doubt it), but publicity like that rarely ever comes free.

[–]Apollo908 5 points5 points [recovered]

Honest question, forgive my ignorance, what is nu-male? I've seen the term a few times now and can't pin down its meaning from context clues alone.

[–]Endorsed Contributorbalalasaurus 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Stephen Marche Do you think TRP is mostly misrepresented or do you think it kind of courts that shock value?

RedPillSchool I didn't ask for it to be misrepresented, but it is a great advertising scheme when people see shocking headlines and come read what we have, and end up staying.

The truth is, some of these topics are just outside the overton window, no matter how true or false they may be

and so there will be outrage

Stephen Marche Does it bother you?

RedPillSchool Not really. I didn't expect mainstream acceptance, nor do I work towards that goal.

And that right there is what will be lost on the interviewer and countless others.

For every hundred men who read about us and think we're evil, if even one swallows the pill, then it's all worth it.

RPS, you're a hero.

[–][deleted] 19 points20 points  (2 children)

The most important part of this article---very well stated by the way---is the section about missing father figured and role models.

We killed the father and killed god in one swoop( god is basically one huge dad, who punishes and rewards, who disciplines) and replaced him with the government whose goal is to feminize men making them easier to control.

Women are easy to control and manipulate, we see it every single day.

TRP is crowd sourcing a father. That's what we do here. We discipline stupidity and feminine behavior from men and reward with effusive praise when you work hard and succeed.

[–]ChadThundercockII 1 point2 points  (1 child)

And God never loses frame and can't seem to need anything from anyone. God is the alpha of all alphas.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Exactly.

God is always a man to women for this reason.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 41 points42 points  (1 child)

The progressive left's moral policing is so intellectualy stifling that they need a source of controversy and excitement. That's why they come to TRP.

Because being called a souless vagina machine is much more interesting and engaging than being worshipped as a goddess.

As for Bloopie Men they need an occasional break from punching themselves in the dick and apologizing for all that is wrong with the world.

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorVasiliyZaitzev 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The progressive left's moral policing is so intellectualy stifling that they need a source of controversy and excitement. That's why they come to TRP.

Indeed. It's the very reason for the existence of TBP, so morally indignant blooper phaggots and be outraged, nay, OUTRAGED!! about shit.

As for Bloopie Men they need an occasional break from punching themselves in the dick and apologizing for all that is wrong with the world.

I love this description, and I am stealing it!

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 48 points49 points  (2 children)

Of course the ever present subtext (with the Guardian especially) is "women are correct and men just need to shut up and start agreeing with them in order to be happy".

Good work on the interview, but my god... the fucking Guardian... exclusively read by older women with cats and the men who orbit/support/marry them. It's for people who want to look deeply beneath the surface of society and then have their preconceived notions proved true. But like... at a deeper level.

[–]DrunkEllington 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Hey now... my cat is red pill as all get out.

(Brings some humor to the sub)

[–]Nergaal 1 point2 points  (0 children)

1 in 100 of "the men who orbit/support/marry them" might actually wake up reading this.

[–]Senior ContributorNightwingTRP 44 points45 points  (6 children)

He suggests that rather than being angry we can't find "love" we should try finding "love."

Hahahaha.

Oh thank you Stevie-boi. We've just not been trying hard enough (I literally can't stop laughing while I'm typing this.)

Though I do have a genuine question regarding this:

Locker-room talk goes like this: you say to your friend, my God, did you see the tits on that yoga instructor, and your friend says, it hurts you, doesn’t it, and you say it does, it does, and he says you know I’ve sucked tits like that before, and you say yeah right and he says really and you say who and he says in Brazil and you say of course it would be an unverifiable claim, and he shrugs and you laugh and he laughs.

The quantity of locker-room talk is inversely proportional to familiarity with women. So, as you fall in love, maybe even get married, it no longer becomes feasible to talk with friends about women’s bodies in such specific detail because, say, your friend works for your wife, and you don’t want him thinking about her cleavage when she’s firing him.

But very quickly – mid-30s, really – a new locker-room talk emerges. The new locker-room talk goes like this: you ask your friend what summer programming do you have your daughters in, and your friend says I’m trying to find something with science in it, and you say, yeah, you gotta fight those cultural assumptions about girls and STEM, and he says totally, and you say I’m just trying to do little things like nature walks and trips to the science center, and he says we should go together some time, and you say totally.

What is this pure triple-distilled faggotry?

Also, in case you're interested, he tells us why he loves the taste of them blue pills:

It is exactly this capacity for contradiction that the boys of The Red Pill lack so utterly.

Cognitive dissonance lads! Become more feminine. Reject logic, accept that nothing will ever make sense (despite the fact that modern science and stats have shown us we can make sense of things which don't) and just follow that narrative.

What the boys of The Red Pill need, in all honesty, is a massive dose of Romantic poetry. They need a dedicated course of treatment in the novels of Jane Austen and Dostoevsky, combined with significant therapy in negative capability.

Have you ever read any Austen or Dostoevsky, Stephen? I have. Still here.

They need to read Freud, who wrote that every man wants to murder his father and sleep with his mother and that the only way to be civilized is to recognize that everyone is barbaric way down deep inside.

Have you read Freud, Stephen? Again, I have. I ended up here.

Instead of culture, the world offers the boys of The Red Pill contempt. Instead of education, outrage.

Your suppositions and speculation are nothing but a load of words designed to act as pseudo-intellectual propaganda. i.e. "Look how well read I am. If only they'd read this stuff too then they'd be much better off." The epitome of poor argumentation, ya know why, Stephen? It's based upon the assumption that YOU turned out correctly. Something we fundamentally disagree on and precisely why you're a moron. Take care Stephen. Don't come back.

[–]Rodion-Raskolnikov 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Yes. Dostoevsky was pretty red pill. As was Tolstoy.

[–]1Claude_Reborn 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Instead of education

AKA Educate yourself shitlord!

Man.. these people are such stereotypes.

[–]Senior ContributorNightwingTRP 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The most delicious bit, is that the top rated comments from the land of misogyny on this article... are a discussion of classic literature. You just can't make up how perfect of a response that is to his assertion that we're ill-educated or poorly read.

[–]fingerthemoon 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Why debate the logic you can't understand when you can simply attack the character of your opponent and discredit their arguments?

Your comment had me cracking up. I need to go read the full article now.

[–]ChadThundercockII 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He suggests that rather than being angry we can't find "love" we should try finding "love."

I once found love, here is what happened. So I'm being manly as fuck, holding frame before I ever knew what the fuck it was, calling the shots.. etc etc. She has some emotional problems from failures, I dealt with that shit like a champ. Her friend liked me, her mother also. As we are in a very religious society, I didn't want to take her virginity at 18 because she needs that shit to get married.

Fast froward a month and a half. She starts acting like a real bitch, still holding frame though. When she saw she couldn't win, she sat me down and told me we have to break up because it's not working. Still holding it, and said that I felt the same way which was a lie. I liked her. She was very feminine and we got along. But I had to keep it tight.

She broke up with me because I didn't stick my schlong in her tight her and made her scream like a whale.

Never again guys, never again.

[–][deleted] 40 points41 points  (2 children)

This article was more effort than usual so I give him a nod for that but in all honesty before I got halfway through I looked up his picture and went "Yep, thought so".

He looks like a homosexual that just shit himself at a Harry Potter pantomime in excitement.

[–]putinbusch 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What an ...... interesting mental picture you created......

[–][deleted] 56 points57 points  (17 children)

The Guardian isn't a tabloid, it is a broadsheet, but the most left-wing, retarded of them. I'm surprised there was anything acknowledging the existence of the red pill in there, and certainly wouldn't expect anything unbiased (it is very biased towards feminism). But, it does mean that the term gets in front of more people, and so some will come to check out what it says for themselves, which is a good thing. However, the Guardian demographic is the very last one I would expect much from (outside of The Socialist Worker) with regards to men.

Also, promoting rape? I have been here for over a year, I don't remember a single post or comment ever suggesting it. Where do they get this bullshit from? Lots of talk about the rise of false rape accusations, sure, but not encouragement to carry out real rape. That would be stupid.

[–]Dayman_ah-ah-ah 20 points21 points  (2 children)

The rape comment threw me off too. I haven't seen a single post here promoting violence or rape.

[–]Kalepsis 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I was going to say something similar. As OP said in his interview, the only instances I've seen of that type of speech were from obvious feminist trolls trying (and failing) to give us a bad name.

[–]tallwheel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yep, but according to the critics of TRP, that's apparently just about all we do!

[–]2CHAD_J_THUNDERCOCK 24 points25 points  (0 children)

The Guardian is one of the most expensive brands of toilet roll available in most supermarkets

[–]2IVIaskerade 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The Guardian isn't a tabloid, it is a broadsheet

The guardian isn't a broadsheet. It likes to think of itself as one, but it's Berliner format.

The Financial Times, Daily Telegraph, Sunday Telegraph, and Sunday Times are the only broadsheets in Britain.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 16 points17 points  (11 children)

Guardian isn't a tabloid

That's the joke!

[–]shit_with_holes 8 points9 points  (9 children)

I think this is the best place to ask the question, but could you please tell me of some quality and properly unbiased media sources? Particularly Australian media?

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Not really. The feminine imperative is integral to our species.

[–]istealalbums 8 points8 points [recovered]

Dunno about Australian media, but The Economist is occasionally redpilled (i.e. moderate and not hopelessly left-wing) and does discuss Australian politics and economic issues as part of its international coverage

[–]shit_with_holes 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Cheers, that'll be going into my bookmarks.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

unbiased media sources?

Contradiction in terms. Every media source that's a business is going to be looking at their bottom line, which will necessarily influence their product.

[–]_the_shape_ 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Always assume that any and every media source has a "bias" (read: agenda) - always. It is your job to sharpen your senses to sniff it out.

Train yourself to read between the lines, seek truth, yes, but never the gospel of truth, so to speak, because it does not exist.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Particularly Australian media?

Maaate. Your pissing into the wind if you think that.

[–]2IVIaskerade 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Reuters, The Financial Times, and The BBC (for world news particularly) are all reasonably unbiased. They will rarely be the ones to break a story, but their articles are less biased than

If you're into economics, Zerohedge is another good one.

[–]mugatucrazypills 6 points7 points  (1 child)

BBC ? You mean the Palestinian news service out of the Islamic Republic of England ?

[–]2IVIaskerade 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't know what you've heard, but it's not quite that bad yet in most of the UK.

[–]itsawomensworld 12 points12 points [recovered]

How many female 25 year old virgins exist that don't want to be virgins that are in presentable physical shape. Now how many men are there in the same predicament?

To deny our existence is to deny reality.

[–]Archange_ 6 points7 points  (1 child)

It's actually worse. The topic cannot be raised.

I once brought up not male virginity at 25 but lack of success with women to a group of men and women who seemed reflective and open minded on the topic. The example of lack of success was 1 woman and less than 10 fucks in a year. The women in the group and one or two men reacted first with surprise, second with personal attacks on my virility and intelligence then called me creepy. They concluded I was fake and expelled me from the group.

Some aspects of reality really cannot be brought to light.

[–][deleted] 12 points12 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]sfstexan 39 points40 points  (9 children)

"What the boys of The Red Pill need, in all honesty, is a massive dose of Romantic poetry. They need a dedicated course of treatment in the novels of Jane Austen and Dostoevsky, combined with significant therapy in negative capability."

Lol. Yes. Let's all go have a fucking poetry night.

[–]2IVIaskerade 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Don't knock Romantic poetry (this meaning poetry of the Romantic era, which spanned from 1780-1830). It's got some great stuff in there.

Ozymandias, The Rime of the Ancient Mariner, Lord Byron's Don Juan, William Blake, William Wordsworth, Edgar Allen Poe, Ralph Waldo Emerson, all excellent authors and poems.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I had read most of these before graduating high school. What a bullshit assumption by the writer of this article. Who the fuck do you think are the professors who teach this subject? Who do you think wrote all this romantic poetry in the first place?

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Not the worst idea, lemme go get that Jack Frost book out...

[–]Mgtowredpillonroids 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Bukowski wouldn't be too bad, although I won't say that I've read more than a fraction of what he's written.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Post Office is quite funny and very MGTOW/RedPill :) What's funny is that modern day feminists often like Bukowski (like Lena Dunham), but in this novel he writes the "he" (the main character is based on himself) "raped" a woman (not really, she actually wanted it). And the way he writes about women in this is glorious.

[–]throwawaycomedian95 1 point2 points  (1 child)

To be fair, poetry club could raise SMV and introduce us to women

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorVasiliyZaitzev 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"What the boys of The Red Pill need, in all honesty, is a massive dose of Romantic poetry.

I'm rather fond of Herrick. "Gather ye rosebuds while ye may..."

That said, there are a lot of guys who are going to get to that part of the article and say, "Oh, for fuck's sake!" and then wander over to TRP to see what it's about.

[–]istealalbums 11 points11 points [recovered]

Thanks for posting this and agreeing to do the interview. One of the things I dislike about this subreddit is the constant echo chamber, hence why I also subscribe to Purple Pill Debate despite its flaws.

It's really unfortunate that the author chose not to address the views echoed here head-on. From the subheading we can see immediately the way he frames the debate—"Stephen Marche aims to find out if The Red Pill is perpetuating a culture of hatred – or if it’s just a place to vent."

Of course, in reality, it's neither. Venting and hatred is counterproductive to this subreddit's stated goal of sexual strategy. The idea that some of these ideas about women may be valid is never even considered. For once I wish a journalist, ideally a women, would address WHY sexual strategy works as well as it does, without resorting to ad-hominem attacks or reframing. We see examples of the reality of sexual dynamics and gender interactions in real life, and obliquely in subreddits like Troll X. Many of my female friends complain about getting bored in relationships, hating "clingy" and "whiny" guys, and listening to the refreshingly redpilled Amy Winehouse. And I always agree and sympathize. But as soon as we bring these topics up, even in an anonymous forum, we're shamed, belittled, mocked, and condescended to. I'm not angry about this article, but it's unfortunate that it's all bias and derision disguised as compassion.

[–]CornyHoosier 9 points10 points  (1 child)

In the article he brings up Kanye West and this Weekend fellow, but never dives into it. Why do these men get away with saying and doing things the average man would be destroyed over?

It isn't because of "the patriarchy", because you won't see most men speak a word of defense to help them. It's because their SMV is so high. It's that simple.

If Kanye West was some unkempt guy with acne working at a McDonalds and tried to even get near a semi-attractive woman she'd call him a creep and walk the other direction. Instead he is confident, rich, attractive, famous, etc. so he gets to say and do whatever he wants to women because they want him to do it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In the article he brings up Kanye West and this Weekend fellow, but never dives into it. Why do these men get away with saying and doing things the average man would be destroyed over?

Money and Fame.

[–]NotUpToAnythingGood 8 points9 points  (5 children)

Just read the article. At points, it's almost like he's able to grasp a glimmer of understanding and then runs away.

His hack job of the interview is deplorable. The full interview makes much more sense. I was thinking of saying something but comments are turned off on the article.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

At points, it's almost like he's able to grasp a glimmer of understanding and then runs away.

Or, he's skirting as close to the truth as he can, and still maintain his career.

[–]1Su-Wu_Red 8 points9 points  (0 children)

EXACTLY. The last thing the guardian needs is some SJWs calling for a boycott of the paper. To be honest, if I was part of leadership at the paper and was focused on the bottom line I would have never published this piece. Not because I disagree, but, its just a huge risk. They have more to lose than gain by acknowledging TRP.

[–]2Archterus 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Or hold onto his one remaining atrophied ball when he goes home to his wife and Tyrone.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

If comments were on, you would quickly be banned if you criticize the Feminine Imperative or anything about women. That is why I stopped reading the Grauniad long before I encountered TRP. I could not stand the censorship. I went to the Telegraph, which had a lively and honest comments section (which was refreshingly Red Pill, the commenters took no shit from feminists), but it was obviously too much for advertisers and feminazis, so they basically closed down the comments. They do still have decent articles in the men's section, which is a carry-over from the kind of support they previously saw in the comments, but I no longer subscribe.

[–]NotUpToAnythingGood 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Being banned / blocked for speaking the truth doesn't faze me in the slightest.

Thanks for mentioning the Telegraph. I'll have to check it out more often.

[–]sir_Preacher 9 points10 points  (0 children)

He made a very important observation in his article. And I like how he puts it.

Among men today, there is violence hidden under the virtue, and virtue hidden under the violence. The only constant is the hiding.

He understands that guys who appear to be tough, strict and insensitive on the outside, more often than not, are very nice and kind, once you get to know them.

And that ''nice guys'' are really not the nice people they appear to be. Their ''niceness'', is just a means to an end, which will quickly turn to violence when they don't get that end.

It's no surprise that most of school shooting are done by some ''nice guys'' nobody thought could do any harm.

In fact, the most loving and generous men I've ever met are men you'll easily judge to be tough and insensitive.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 7 points8 points  (0 children)

The idea that all men over here were friend zoned Mr Nice Guy's once is overplayed though. There are countless of reasons guys held frustrating thoughts about women. And it's not just women.

For me personally I've always been the uncaring 'sociopathic' asshole and really understood allot of game. But I was low value as fuck and had horrible people around me. TRP made me realize allot of these were crab in a bucket types. I also discovered my parents/surrogate parents to have personality disorders. Letting go of those who hold you back can be half the battle.

Basically girls liked me at first but quickly got put off when I tried to enter a relationship- being low RVM. Then there were the constant cockblocking of both family and friends. It can be equally frustrating to be slowly forced in a role of continuous meaningless flings because women compartmentalize you as the exciting darkminded fuckboy.

TRP did not only help me but also a big part of my friend group. All of us subscribe over here. None of us are your typical basement dweller or friend zoned orbiter. The opposite in fact. Most are are popular and socially active dudes, playing sports, making career advancements or simply being well rounded characters. Yet all of us encounter equal difficulties. TRP improved our lives significantly and we see the positive effects in each other on a daily basis.

I don't think there's better face value proof for TRP than watching your inner circle of friends rise to the top. That's the best thing about the subredit in my opinion. It includes all types of men who share their knowledge and have the character to help others.

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorFieldLine 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Well, an experience I had repeatedly were flakes.

...

But not our culture now, that's just not what it is any more

I noticed that flirting became a blood sport

Fun and friendly conversations became more combative at bars

(etc)

This is the one thing I cannot wrap my head around, as much as I browse this subreddit - how can the RP detractors deny this is going on? It's so obvious. And who, women included, actually likes it this way? Why do men put up with it? How has it gotten to this point?

[–]NotUpToAnythingGood 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Acknowledging this means owning some level of responsibility on the part of the ladies. Avoidance of responsibility is part of the hymnal for the modern woman according to feminists.

Just as they will fight to the death to maintain any advantage they have while denying they actually have the advantage and demanding for more for equality. If you control the rules, you can set up the game however you want.

IMO, because of those two things, it's become increasingly difficult to find quality women.

[–]TRP VanguardCyralea 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I suspect they do enjoy it, it's very much a part of their nature. Comes as easily as Fight or Flight comes to us. They were only conditioned to behave differently in the past. Today, they've had any limiters removed.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

It was like me getting angry with myself for getting hungry, instead of taking the logical step to feed myself.

On fucking point

[–]idiocraties 12 points13 points  (13 children)

Will this cause a spike in subscribers? A hit piece to be sure, but free advertising. Would be nice if the Guardian of all newspapers pushed us over 150,000

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (2 children)

Would be nice if the Guardian of all newspapers pushed us over 150,000

Yeah. This sub managed to break 100k subs because people on reddit wouldn't stop bashing it and bringing it up in threads like "What's the worst subreddit?" I'd love to see TRP break 150k subs because of hit pieces like this one.

[–]TRP VanguardCyralea 6 points7 points  (0 children)

We've only slowed down because other subs smartened up and started adding TheRedPill to their automoderator flag lists.

[–]marinewannabee97 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's when I came, I came to see what the hubub was, I stayed for the content.

[–]coffee_and_lumber 3 points3 points [recovered]

TRP subscriber-ship seems to spike following all advertising, both negative and positive, so I'd say yes. We get pretty significant bumps from mini anti-TRP shitstorms in the middle of unrelated threads, so I'd imagine The Guardian will generate quite a few.

[–]idiocraties 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Keep an eye on this over next few days http://redditmetrics.com/r/TheRedPill

Seems to update with a lag of one day.

[–]fingerthemoon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What happened on 6/30/14 to cause the spike?

[–]idiocraties 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Well, just broke 148,000, thank you Guardian!

[–]putinbusch 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I'm on my phone. How big was the jump since the article?

[–]idiocraties 0 points1 point  (0 children)

About 250

[–]Rodion-Raskolnikov 1 point2 points  (2 children)

That's what I thought when i read it this morning. Liberal media can demonise us as much as they like, it still drives 'traffic' our way. It's how I ended up here.

[–]idiocraties 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Well then , keep an eye on the membership counter over the next few days and lets see!

Can you elaborate on your tale of how the liberal media brought you here? Always good to hear a conversion story!

[–]Synsin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I found TRP by: 1) Finding MGTOW first when doing research into female nature and the nature of relationships (when I discovered my wife cheating on me).

2) Since I like to look at both sides of an argument I then found some of the feminist channels opposite MGTOW.

3) From their many posts vilifying TRP I found my new home. 😊

[–]faded_jester 6 points7 points  (0 children)

The majority of people simply can't wrap their head around wanting to get women without also explicitly accepting the female view of what is "right" and what is "wrong". It's become taboo to even acknowledge any form of female failure. You are expected to either ignore it, or pretend it didn't happen. Any criticism is immediately dismissed as misogyny. And then we're also expected to just accept this as "the way it is".

It's not the way it is, but I do enjoy how you ensure I'll be something different than the usual guys she sees. You keep listening to women and you keep writing that poetry, I'm sure she'll come around! In the meantime I can live my life without getting entangled in the pc, movie based reality bullshit that is modern dating with "empowered" wymyns.

[–]JihadDerp 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Instead of culture, the world offers the boys of The Red Pill contempt. Instead of education, outrage.

The only part he's missing is that "boys" subsequently come to The Red Pill with that contempt and outrage, and then leave with culture and education. Because all we do here is explain how the sexual market place works (education), and offer advice about it like lift, get hobbies, make money, be useful (culture).

[–]2Archterus 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Congratulations u/redpillschool. For an aggressively feminist rag like the guardian I think you have done a sterling job.

[–]tetsugakusei 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Among men today, there is violence hidden under the virtue, and virtue hidden under the violence.

That is the moment of insight for our 'Guardianista'. The Redpillers are those trying to be the best they can, and that requires discussing and raging against the hard truths of life, giving a surface display of violence. The SJWs and their ilk are underneath rotten to the core because of their surface virtue displays.

This is a tale as old as time. Of course, the reporter has no clue how to proceed. Recommending nihilist literature will just leave the reader wondering where to go from there. He might better have pointed to Hegel's Knights of Virtue and Nietzche's The Spiders as great examples of the evil of SJWs and radfems and their oblivious supporters. This would tempt the redpiller to extend his reading from just women to politics, philosophy and the sciences.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (2 children)

This is pretty lousy journalism. There is something quite human about this community, but this guy is just being incredibly dismissive of it.

He could have written an article that was exposing and insightful. But he chose to throw away his research and make a bunch of shady inference to feed the idea that places like this are just full of closet rapists that hate women. Instead of disenfranchised young men that are rightfully frustrated about the world and their place in it.

I know it was his attempt at a joke when he said:

Sites such as 4chan exist mainly to post thousands of revenge porn images without consent.

But that is basically libel given the main audience of the piece, and it kind of characterizes his whole article. The vast majority of 4chan's users are teenagers discussing cartoons who haven't even seen a pornographic image on the site in years.

He is distorting the truth so much that he may as well have not bothered doing the research.

[–]Dicksajanitor 5 points6 points  (1 child)

It's a hatchet job, the guardian are trying to curb online commenting because their official narratives keep getting railroaded by BTL commentators - none of this has anything to do with TRP, and everything to do with the guardian backing the curbing of an anonymous internet.

They aren't left in anyway - the British establishment hasn't been for sometime now - but they use lip service to identity politics to serve their neo-colonial agenda

You may like this

https://off-guardian.org/2016/04/14/end-free-speech-and-save-the-minorities-will-anyone-really-fall-for-this/

[–]Jimmy_Big_Nuts 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Bullseye. As a leftwing TRP man, I can say without any doubt that the Guardian is not leftwing. Just look at the daily attack pieces against Corbyn. And they way they back Hillary over Sanders in the US. All they believe in is identity politics 'progressivism' which actually means repression and though police. The fact they even pretend to have any connection to the left is very damaging and acts as a smear to valid leftwing ideas.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Really good responses /u/redpillschool. Like she was trying to make out a hitpiece and she made you look like the most reasonable fucking person on the planet.

[–]leoninebasil 1 point2 points  (0 children)

article was written by a dude

[–]Kwantuum 5 points6 points  (1 child)

The ratio of fluff/content is really off-putting, what a long winded piece of pseudo-journalism.

[–]DrMrPepper 4 points5 points  (0 children)

RedPillSchool Yes, it helped me understand human nature. It was like me getting angry with myself for getting hungry, instead of taking the logical step to feed myself.

So once I understood why and how things happened, it put me at peace with it.

Here's how I look at it. If you go fishing, and you aren't catching shit, do you get mad at the fish? No. You need to realize that using rotten eggs as bait doesn't work. Or maybe your technique is wrong.

You can't change the fish. You can change your method.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

The answer to the question of how shitty men are, from this perspective, is “really pretty shitty”.

Wait a second... isn't that exactly the kind of idea that he's shaming us for having?

[–]Redpillc0re 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Great job man, kudos. The article is horrible though. I know that misandry sells, but Jesus, this takes it to such heights, they risk alienating even feminists. I think misandry is finally starting to fall out of vogue though, after about a decade of crimes against half the humanity.

"Swallowing the Red Pill: a journey to the heart of modern misogyny"

Really, Guardian? In the times of ISIS and Boko haram, you found the heart of misogyny in a subreddit?

PS. if you havent read the article, then dont bother. Its really bad, and you just end up hating the time you wasted to read it.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMeat-on-the-table 10 points11 points  (0 children)

They need to learn that love is awful, in the both the ancient and modern senses of the world – that love is infinitely more powerful and real than any marketplace, sexual or otherwise.

On the surface,this seems harmless and true enough. But there is an underlying principle there that you won't see addressed--this belief that it's noble for people men to suffer in service of love.

The feminine imperative dictates that she is the prize, therefore everything that you go through is your own crucible to make you worthy of her as a woman. This is false.

Women as they are raised today are not worth the sacrifice and dedication and suffering that men are still expected to endure for them. Heck, I'd say they were never worth the price, but even less so now.

This is almost a sort of power speak--subliminal messaging that relies on subconscious cues and anchors that you've been programmed with since birth in order to reinforce your position and status.

It's cunning, but we see right through it.

[–]prodigy2throw 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Solid interview. I think you handled his leading questions pretty well. Looks like he changed the subject immediately after you called him on the "TRP is pro rape sentiment.

How often do you get contacted for interviews?

Also...Morpheus Manfred?

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Looks like he changed the subject immediately after you called him on the "TRP is pro rape sentiment.

It's hard to argue with my reasoning. You don't need a strategy for rape, other than "where do i buy roofies, and what's the best brand of duct tape?"

Also...Morpheus Manfred?

A few years ago was my first big interview, it was BBC world News. I needed an email, quickly. So I made a GMAIL, and it needed a name, so I figured, let's try Morpheus. You know, for obvious reasons. They needed a last name though, so I just thought Manfred sounded kinda righteous.

Didn't realize they'd read my "From" line on the email and announce me as Morpheus Manfred on the air. Since then I just kept it for consistency's sake.

How often do you get contacted for interviews?

More often than what gets published here. I turn down any that won't work with my text-only format, but it's a lesson I've learned being misquoted.

A majority of red pill related articles do reach out to me for at least a quote, even if they don't publish it.

Very recently there have been a few television programs who have contacted me looking to dive into our culture. More news on that later.

[–]sirmadam 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Did you ever hear off the BBC for the Reggie Yates series they did? They contacted MGTOW forums but no mention of TRP.

[–]thefisherman1961 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I love how you still archive.is an article that interviewed you

[–]NaughtyFred 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Would love to see this Radio show do a show about Red Pill instead of doing a show about MGTOW but calling it "Red Pill"

[–]Doolox 3 points4 points  (0 children)

A few years before Morpheus Manfred started up The Red Pill, Ghomeshi blurbed the Guy’s Guide to Feminism. He wrote:

“An admirably accessible guide for guys to understand and embrace the other (often more incendiary) F-word. And it’s even funny. Quite remarkable. Everyone knows feminists have no sense of humour!”

Jian appeared on the back of the book alongside Gloria Steinem and the editor of the online feminist site Feministing.

Where are Morpheus and Ghomeshi now? Morpheus is in a long-term relationship, and developing a sense of humour about himself and his project. Ghomeshi is currently awaiting his second trial. Who is really shitty here?

[–]zpatriarchy 4 points5 points  (0 children)

the best part is all the men who will come here & learn how to be stop being manginas

[–]mugatucrazypills 3 points4 points  (1 child)

at least we're modern misogynist shitlords

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I think I speak for almost everyone when I say thank you for being here and making this subreddit a thing. We may be branded as vermin but that won't stop us. If I hadn't found this subreddit I would have gone on to keep resenting women but now all that resentment is poured into self-improvement. In any case, the name of the game is to see how long this subreddit lasts before the PC police decide this shouldn't be here.

[–]Xemnas81 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I actually think that Stephen is a naive white knight who is slightly sympathetic to TRP from a plugged-in "you guys are weirdly cool and have good points but I don't get why so serious lol" perspective.

However he's also cucked by his name-dropped editor, 'Jessica' [10 pounds her second name's Valenti]. I suspect that she heavily edited this into a smear campaign.

What we're left with is feminists trying to appeal to the sympathies of insecure guys by treating them as boys, marketing themselves as knowing affectionate mother figures who will forgive them, and lure them into the circle of white knights, while others will sense something fishy (probably from the obvious man-hating and condescension) reject the trap and flock over to the Manosphere.

This fits in with my theory; to the beta Nice Guy, Feminism is the authoritarian mother figure who represses his inner Alpha Id in the names of the feminine imperative.

[–]Strong4t 2 points3 points  (0 children)

"Sites such as 4chan exist mainly to post thousands of revenge porn images"

I laughed out loud. From someone who browses 4chan it sounded so silly as to be satirical.

[–]SonOfAFeminist 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Hi all!

Thanks to the Guardian, i finally found a place to voice my anger at feminism.

I am an egalitarian and strongly believe in the equal value of man and woman. Feminism, as it is, is build on lies, raises princesses and frogs and is nothing but an insult to every man who knows how the 'male privilege' feels at the bottom of the chain.

"What the boys of The Red Pill need[...] is a massive dose of Romantic poetry." Nah, we just need less women with the "i bath in male tears" mentality.

FU, Guardian. I would pay money to bring you down.

[–]∞ Mod | RP Vanguardbsutansalt 6 points7 points  (3 children)

http://archive.is/5Uoa6

Also, who the hell is Morpheus Manfred? lol

Anyone wondering who the author is need look no further than his wiki page:

Stephen Marche is a Canadian writer. In 2005, he received a doctorate in early modern English drama from the University of Toronto.

So he's a SJW with a worthless degree. How wonderfully progressive and useful! /s

[–]TRP VanguardCyralea 6 points7 points  (2 children)

University of Toronto, no less. Toronto is a breeding ground for ultra-feminazis. They literally teach kids to be feminized little twats from an early age.

This is the city that gave us Big Red. No surprise this asshat is from here.

[–]∞ Mod | RP Vanguardbsutansalt 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Bingo! Take everything this guy says with a huge grain of he can shut the fuck up. lol

edit: huh, I didn't know she went public. Turns out her real name is Chanty Binx. WTF kind of name is that anyway? Wait, that might be an internet handle. I'm not sure.

[–]Senior Contributordr_warlock 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Religion vs. Feminist, lol. Both are ridiculous.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Does anyone else shudder when they read some BP-oriented shit? It amazes me how people can be so blind to the truth.

[–]scarletspider3 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I know right. You don't have to interrogate mods to learn about red pill, just observe chicks and ignore what they say (hamster).

[–]Rodion-Raskolnikov 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Gentlemen, is this where it starts? The mainstream media have acknowledged the situation and, surprisingly, not done the full-on 'hatchet job' we would have expected. This means that the red pill 'message' is cutting through the western-feminised-culture and is appearing to be 'reasonable' - not extremist.

[–]Endorsed ContributorBluepillProfessor 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Very good job on this interview. Gratz and kudos!

Their humourlessness is impressive

This bitch interviews ONE person and can now speak for all of us. OK, sure you can cupcake.

Definitions like these (Alpha, Beta, Plate etc) run into the dozens. Their primary purpose is clarity, obviously. More than lust or hatred, the boys of The Red Pill hunger for clarity. They desire escape from confusion. They desire a system with which to comprehend desire itself. Don’t we all?

Yes darling, but some of us like RPS have achieved it. You have not. In fact you dumb cunt you have not got a clue.

I have been trained not to judge people on the basis of their sexual tastes. That’s my inclination but it’s also been my education. I refrained from judging him, half-consciously.

Unless it is positive, strong masculinity leading and loving. It has to be an accused rapist (acquitted) or a clueless BETA. Yes darling, that is what the article espouses, being a Beta, go read it. It is a trope showing she did not read Red Pill at all before going to print in major magazine.

they are responding to women having financial and sexual power over their own lives and bodies.

No little kitty, we are responding to women having financial and sexual power over OUR LIVES AND BODIES.

What the boys of The Red Pill need, in all honesty, is a massive dose of Romantic poetry.

HHHHhhahhahahahahA!!!! Perhaps we could try The Prophet (see my posting history).

edit: I just assumed based on the writing style the writer was a women. It is even worse than I thought. H/she is a mangina.

[–]Horus_Krishna_2 2 points3 points  (0 children)

awesome interview. I love your answers. This doesn't seem bad for red pill at all, not based on your answer, some questions were biased but you answered them well. I love this:

"I don't resent them for playing the game. The mating "dance" has always been a back-and-forth between men and women to select their optimal partner

I did resent them, but now I appreciate them quite a bit. "

[–]BlueFreedom420 2 points3 points  (0 children)

When the collapse of democracy is apparent to even the most dense sheep, and the elite are loading up their arks, the red pill will be seen as one of the few philosophies of true survival.

[–]TRP VanguardCyralea 2 points3 points  (0 children)

One part I found rather amusing was how he had to defend locker room talk from the vitriol of his progressive peers. Even though this was far from a flattering commentary on TRP, he couldn't find the fortitude to lie to himself about the nature of the way men talk when in the privacy of one another's presence. His colleagues' surprise and indignation was entertaining though.

I think you're on the money with the claim that he believes more than he does, but I suspect he's married and long removed from the game. He probably buys a version of the BP narrative, albeit one cracked a few times with the RP hammer of truth.

[–]Origami84 6 points7 points  (1 child)

A great interview - if that went online in a mass media, it would certainly draw attention. Instead, being a tabloid, the article is 10% interview and the author's rambling. Still, i think it can be gleaned that RDP is not some movie's villain-level of evilness and hate but a serious approach to interpersonal relationship. Meh, maybe some guys in search of answers will come here to find them.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

It's too bad he got rid of most of the interview. He didn't need to present it in interview form, but he could've presented any of our perspective.

[–]Dayman_ah-ah-ah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is just more proof that you can't unplug other people. They will always look at what you say threw a blue lens. Great responses on your part

[–]BlackJ1 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Stephen Marche white, atheist, conservative? Like those polls say the bulk of TRP is?

I can't find the exact post in which he says it but, GayLubeOil has skyped over 300 people and he claim's that most of them are black.

[–]CornyHoosier 10 points11 points  (1 child)

I fit the white, atheist, 30 year old male category ... but I'm liberal as all get out and have read Pride & Prejudice a couple times.

Does anyone know what the first line of Pride & Prejudice is? It's pretty famous: "It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a good fortune, must be in want of a wife"

Sounds pretty Red Pill to me ...

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

But they don't though. They want pussy.

[–]chocobaby 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Nice careful work friend. It's difficult negotiating socially heated topics, to say the least. Well done. Any guy that reads that will likely be interested to hear more.

[–]MoneyStatusLooks 2 points2 points [recovered]

What they don't want to hear about is the number of us having deeply satisfying relationships. Our women "love us" and they hate that, because it goes against everything they believe to be true.

[–]1gerwig 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This was a great interview. Haven't read the article yet, but you put into words a lot of the things I've been thinking and made me realize the ways in which I was still hoping women/society would change. Even though I agree with TRP there was this feeling in the back of my mind that it's bad or evil or that the people on here are kind of weird, when in fact they are logical.

[–]Skedoolie 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Good interview. I check out this subreddit every now and then because I do believe that masculinity is being attacked and not for the better. It feels good to find others who agree with me, and as the moderator said in the conversation, a safe place to vent and discuss feeling and issues without fear of censorship or punishment. It's literally almost impossible now to talk about these kind of things on the internet. It really is censorship, but I understand how people can see it as hurtful and try to stop or remove it, like racist comments. Even then though, is it ok to censor because it is viewed as hurtful to some? People value free speech when it's in their favor. The same people that are censoring out there today were the ones crying free speech back in the 60's, it seems to me. Just my thoughts.

[–]1bradyo2 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Enjoyed reading this interview. Excellent, well thought out responses from RPS. Good job.

[–]YongeArcade 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Good interview and thanks a lot for doing this, both the subreddit and the interview.

You and the other mods are not thanked enough, in the interview he asked " Can you think of anybody whose life it has changed for the worse?"

I just wanted to say that the Red Pill has really helped me, both past and present . In "past" I mean my past in dating in my teens and early twenties where I did everything wrong. What would have brought me pain to think about before the red pill I can look at and laugh about now.

Th second thing of my past is "closure" or really, an explanation as to why two of my serious long term relationships where we loved each other and it was all great and I was just waiting for the right moment (financially) to marry them ,then the women seemed to go nuts and there were fights it all went south . I had never heard of "Shit Tests" and now i recognize that both women pulled them , I failed the "tests" and the relationships took a dive until i was out of love with them .

It is a relief just to know what went on . The second half is the present . Complete night and day in dating experience after the red pill . Rejection is no problem what so ever and that gives you all the confidence in the world . It is great fun when you don't care , flirt , chat women up , toy with them a bit anywhere and any time you feel like it and if they are no fun , then they are no fun .Just move on. Oh and spotting the hypergamy , the gold diggers , the princesses and the manipulators early on and just saying Bye and cutting them off and avoiding all the bullshit is just soooo great ,that in it self is enough for the price of admission .

Anyway , Thanks again

[–]TheWaterTemple 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Morpheus claims that The Red Pill helped him find a longtime girlfriend, and that The Red Pill is ultimately little more than an online version of locker-room talk.

First of all, you did not use the term locker room talk, although the journalist put the phrase in your mouth.

Steve makes an interesting claim:

Stephen Marche But surely there's a line somewhere. I mean, to me, the site is 90% locker room talk, then like 10% misogyny. Does that sound fair to you?

Given the definition from urban dictionary:

The crude, vulgar, offensive and often sexual trade of comments guys pass to each other, usually in high school locker rooms. Exists solely for the purpose of male comedy and is not meant to be taken seriously.

It sounds as though misogyny and locker room talk are one in the same. And the proper assumption would be, 90% discussion, then like 10% locker room talk. Does that sound fair to you?

It continues

It’s funny, because Jessica, my editor at the Guardian, had the same idea. Wasn’t The Red Pill just an updated version of locker-room talk? No, I said, it’s nothing like locker-room talk. Well, she asked, what’s locker-room talk like, then?

Locker-room talk goes like this: you say to your friend, my God, did you see the tits on that yoga instructor, and your friend says, it hurts you, doesn’t it, and you say it does, it does, and he says you know I’ve sucked tits like that before, and you say yeah right and he says really and you say who and he says in Brazil and you say of course it would be an unverifiable claim, and he shrugs and you laugh and he laughs.

But very quickly – mid-30s, really – a new locker-room talk emerges. The new locker-room talk goes like this: you ask your friend what summer programming do you have your daughters in, and your friend says I’m trying to find something with science in it, and you say, yeah, you gotta fight those cultural assumptions about girls and STEM, and he says totally, and you say I’m just trying to do little things like nature walks and trips to the science center, and he says we should go together some time, and you say totally.

And then you’re taking your daughters to the science center and a gorgeous woman walks by, and you look at your friend, and your friend looks at you, and you don’t have to say a thing.

I’m not saying this is the way it should be. Frankly, it’s humiliating for everybody involved. But there is a truth there: if you have a working dick and a working soul, you’d better get used to living with contradictions.

It is exactly this capacity for contradiction that the boys of The Red Pill lack so utterly I’m not saying this is the way it should be. Frankly, it’s humiliating for everybody involved.

He lost me. This guy definitely had an angle from the beginning and chose his questions very carefully. Thank you for providing the full transcript.

Excuse me while I go tell that yoga instructor she has nice tits.

[–]mygunuface 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I read through the article completely, towards the middle it delved in vague references to what the author believed men were like.

The biggest issue I saw was the leading question "how shitty are men really?" the implication of a deep seated bias was strong from the get go.

But I digress, I had no delusions that the media would see us as anything but a hate-filled machine. Nothing more than crabs in a bucket people.

Btw /u/redpillschool I like the handle" Morpheus Menfred" got a good chuckle out of that one.

[–]stawek 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I LOLed on authors description of locker room talk. Yeah, that's what it looks like when you are a Guardian reporter and all your friends are raging SJWs, cause if any of you ever said something out of real locker room you'd get banned from that gym for offensive remarks.

How did they manage to write this piece based on such a good and balanced interview?

The interview itself is pure gold. If they put it on their website in entirety it would be the single piece of truth in the whole of Guardian cesspool. However, they managed to compress it to "I created a women-hating website cause a few girls flaked on me".

Also, I would gladly bet my yearly salary on a 1:100 odds that the little story about Gomeshi and The Face was pure fiction.

[–]redwithahintofred 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Excellent answers. Easy to grasp for outsiders.

"But there wasn't really a way for guys to express these feelings. It's politically incorrect, but that doesn't mean the feelings just disappear."

I loved this comment.

[–]JSizzl3 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fool tried to spin your words to make you read like a simple prick. Much respect for maintaining frame on that mangina.

[–]1IamGale 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is so interesting, thanks for sharing.

[–]redpillnexus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Great interview. He really tried to get you there with a few questions, but you handled it very well.

[–]scarletspider3 3 points4 points  (2 children)

These feminists types are always bitching about misogyny but they never bitch about the woman out there that are creating misogynists.

[–]robertjuh 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Actually, the first feminist research i would ever be interested in is a research about precisely that.

However there's a high chance the conclusion will be: "men hate women because men are oppressing filthy sex beings that try to cover up the patriarchy"

[–]marinewannabee97 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I always thought of this but am always countered by the fact that I am apparently blaming the victim. To put it another way, if not for 911 or ISIS would there be any where near as much hate in the world for Islam? Likewise women who use and abuse men create the misogynists who in reallity are mostly just men who got sick of the BS.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

How is giving an interview to the media any different from telling a friend about TRP, which everyone here says you shouldn't do? If you can't save one of them, you definitely can't save all of them. It's a waste of time. With TRP, you should only preach to the choir. I can already see this comment being deleted, and I can't think of a reason why.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

How is giving an interview to the media any different from telling a friend about TRP, which everyone here says you shouldn't do?

Well first of all, broadcasting TRP in your personal life (with your real name) is a risk, and one that can backfire very quickly.

But secondly, he's writing the piece whether we like it or not. Might as well get a few snippets in.

I was not under any illusion that it would be anything but an attack piece. But I like that. Where do you think 147,000 people came from? :)

[–]TopKekSkye 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Great read, I definitely enjoyed!

[–]bad_pattern8 0 points1 point  (0 children)

this is not a political movement, seeking media coverage has zero benefit

is everyone being consciously aware of the actual dynamics between men and women going to change those dynamics? fuck no

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The writer begins with the premise that men are "shitty". He never considers the possibility that men are equal to women. He thinks that he, himself, is not "shitty". Why? It is the socialist equivalent of Faith Alone. He effortless absolves himself of sin and becomes a woman.

[–]Luckyluke23 0 points1 point  (0 children)

considering this guy was from the Guardian, i feel as if this interview went very well. he didn't try to attack you at all, and when he did it was very small.

it was great.

[–]chrisindub 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is the clickbaitiest article I read this week.

He got great answers from our mod.

Concrete, honest and thoughtful answers.

But the author ran straight for the post-feminist narrative and didn't look back.

Any criticism of any female is misogyny in the mind of the liberal.

Don't like Hillary Clinton'a foreign policy? Misogyny!

Don't like being cheated on? Misogyny!

Don't want to lose half your income in a divorce and lose custody of your kids? Misogyny!

LOL.... So much logic fail going on.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So I actually clicked through from the archive link.

The article is tagged with "Women"

Incredible.

[–]GetrichonIMP 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If this is the heart of mysogeny, how is it a bad thing. This article translates as a man's retreat where he can find support. I just started a thread in asktrp. I was shocked at how much comradery and support you can find on this site from their fellow man.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

The article is 90% ridicule and vitriol. About 10% is a slightly more balanced assessment of the current sexual marketplace. The tone of the article is the typical tone of the white knight mangina, ie: "I understand women better than these confused, evil and sad guys at TRP". In other words all of these manginas are with an unattractive girl or they are chasing unattractive girls.

If red pill men know so little about women, if all of our tactics are baseless misogyny then our tactics should not work. Women should be repulsed by us and neither sleep with us nor chase us for commitment.

All practiced red pill men know the truth, the slavish devotion and lust projected at us by attractive women. If the red pill is as confused as people say, why do I habitually have sex with HB8s and HB9s who are 10-20 years younger than me? Why do women cry when I say I cannot see them anymore? Why do exes call me back offering threesomes with their hot friend and friends with benefits arrangements? Why do women try to trick me into ejaculating into them (I keep custody of my junk, I even supervise where they spit it out). If a scientific, business or sporting theory fails to work it is discarded. If it works then the theory is proven.

Red pill has to be true otherwise it would not work. Any guy who LIVES (not spends endless hours reading TRP) the red pill life knows the truth. The problem is that most of the members are new, or still learning, so outsiders who sort through the posts read things written by new and inexperienced members like "how to make fuck you money", "I made my first approach and got rejected", "Read this article that shows this girl is a slut".

If they observed red pill men in action they would be gobsmacked. Why is she leaving with him??? He only met her 30 minutes ago. He just touched her ass, he only walked up to her two minutes ago!! Wow she is gorgeous, why is she with that older guy, she could get anyone. Those women giggled like school girls when he asked them which strip club they work at, they threw a drink at me when I tried it.

That is what happens always with blue pill men, first they act in awe of you, as if you have magical powers, then they go into denial, then their jealousy twists their minds and they assume "well he is an evil, raping asshole and all those girls that it works on must be the worlds biggest collection of desperate sluts." Those who do not understand the red pill will always try to make the world change around their views, rather than face the ugly truth. Proof that white knight manginas really have a female brain.

[–]writewhereileftoff 0 points1 point  (1 child)

What did you expect really? For the man to commit career suicide?

Everything went perfect. If anything this is great advertising for trp and Redpillschool did a great job representing trp in the minefield that is the liberal media these days.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I expected what we saw in the article. I have no criticism of RPS, he did not give any ammuntion or quotes which could be used to make TRP look bad. You are right this is great advertising for TRP as will be the Cassie Jaye red pill movie.

[–]FrostyGoingHisOwnWay 0 points1 point  (0 children)

From the perspective of a MGTOW the article is about what I'd expect, the interview was very well conducted, the replies are spot on and I agree with basically most of it.

It's a shame that the deeper issue was touched on but not really followed through with, which is fundamentally that those "good" women don't exist these days. He doesn't seem to contest this point and quite rightly points out that if you don't respect these women, why even pursue them, that's really what puts me into the camp of MGTOW rather than pursing more PUA techniques. I don't respect these kind of women and wouldn't have any self respect if I manipulated one to date.

Whatever it is, low T levels or just ability to trump emotion with logic, I have a satisfied life without women, but I do find this sub very helpful and informative and agree with much of what is said, it's interesting to be able to test out a lot of the approach tactics as a MGTOW to see how true this stuff is and then just completely disengage.

Thanks for the moderation effort and good planning with the backups, watching this place grow over the years has been awesome, as you say it'll never likely be mainstream but growth is positive.

[–]indeydius 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Am I the only one who checked the name of the Guardian writer and the pronouns about five times to convince myself that he was a guy?

Cattiest, most fem-shaming writing I've ever seen from a man.

[–]Brewjo 0 points1 point  (0 children)

RedPillSchool Not really. I didn't expect mainstream acceptance, nor do I work towards that goal.

Outcome Independence.

[–]RedKnight1990 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"Locker-room talk goes like this: you say to your friend, my God, did you see the tits on that yoga instructor, and your friend says, it hurts you, doesn’t it, and you say it does, it does, and he says you know I’ve sucked tits like that before, and you say yeah right and he says really and you say who and he says in Brazil and you say of course it would be an unverifiable claim, and he shrugs and you laugh and he laughs."

What the fuck is this? Really, what is it?

This is the problem here. So many people are tender poets crying into wind about how harsh this new world is. Bad news, bucko, new world is just as harsh as the old one. Telling men to learn to love again while women divorce rape them is absurd.

[–]1nzgs 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It was an enormous mistake to do an interview for the Guardian. They are the most pro-SJW publication in the UK and will only use your words for SJW propaganda. I'm not sure you realise how left-wing the Guardian is, being an American.

[–]aiguo888 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lel Morpheus Manfred. He really wanted you to look like some autistic basement dwelling virgin nerd.

Standard vile journalist practice. They're hardly better than women.

"I'm cool with you bro, tell me something about the sub so we can portray it in a non biased way." and then stab you in the back with some SJW pandering piece.

There is a reason why lots of successful people refuse to talk to press...

[–]TRPApprentice 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I better Stephen Marche's bitch is riding the CC behind his beta boy back lmao

[–]wiseprogressivethink 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is there any creature more cucked than a British leftist?

[–]i_got_the_clearance 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Stephen Marche writes for Esquire which pushes feminism, 'progressive' BP ideology, and five-figure watches. Readership of Esquire, along with GQ, Playboy and all other men's magazines has been in free fall. Marche has to view TRP as a direct threat to his job.

[–]waylandertheslayer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The one thing that article got 100% right is that we're looking for answers. People who come here are confused - "Why doesn't she like me?" and "Why did she flake on me?" and "Why would she dump me?" - and when they find answers, and answers that work, they stay.

[–]EDDbDG 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Late comment, but:

It was a good article until I read "Sites such as 4chan exist mainly to post thousands of revenge porn images without consent."

[–]Botanical-Concepts 0 points1 point  (0 children)

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

5000 word article from a Britcuck publication

Naturally I didn't read a word of this.

[–]Nergaal 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is the best undercover advertisement I have ever seen.

[–]rickception 0 points1 point  (0 children)

ugh..what a man wants, thats not important, its abusive for a man to want anything from a woman, we are but mere wallets that need a chain, so we can provide for a woman to enable her the life she wants, if you are frustrated with women, its because you are just sa selfish abusive beast, if you expect something from women, you are abusive, if you do not give women everything they expect despite how it makes you feel, you are a beast

a man shouldnt ask himself if a wife would make him happy, he should ask himself how can he make a wife happy, its not a two way street..

if guys posted half the things women post on their facebook they would get fired from their jobs "a good boyfriend serves his girlfriend, thinks shes beautiful enough and never complains" or what not, they post these things in earnest, while men get expelled and/or fired for posting dank memes

Its not all one sided, there are great men and women, there are bad men and women, however a lot of the time though, not many women would be able to 1) behave the way she does 2) get a significant other if she acted the same way, but was a man

to me a girlfriend ideally is like a great friend with the addition of sexual attraction, how demonic of me to want sex though, right? not demanding it, just wanting it

sex is a limited thing used for manipulating men into becoming wallets, and society treats men like an angry pimp whos whore you refused to pay

and even if society doesnt like it, women are adults, even the ones who dont act like it, and are responsible just as men are, if she doesnt want to be with someone, she can leave, and if he doesnt want to be with someone he can leave, now to find someone else, maybe a guy has to have a good job, compete with a line of horndogs, be presumed guilty until proven innocent, pay for dates, be able to woo her with great conversation and interesting topics and fight for her attention, but the woman, well, she needs to..."put on some make up" or however the guardian phrased it

what a joke

women do not share all the blame though, the way the wast majority of men treat them, treath other men in order to get them, how they allow themselves to be treated by women, and how much they let women get away with, is a big part of the problem, if women dont need to grow up, why would they, right

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

This is a great interview. The article sux, and in no way does you justice! But then, what kind of article can you expect to be written by a man that resembles a pig...

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (1 child)

/u/redpillschool, how heavily was the interview edited for printing? it's my experience that journalists and editors cut down complex senteces into shorter phrases, often dumbing down the vocabulary as well. I get a fair bit of that impression here.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

The entire interview is listed above, you can check for yourself.