Reader Mailbag: The Stymied Smash

mas00 inquires,

Need some CH readers help. Been going out sarge’n by myself lately. I never do this, trying to throw myself into my fears. I’m 30 so time is not on my side.

Unless you look unusually prematurely old, time is most certainly on your side. Most men hit their *physical* sexual attractiveness peak in their mid 30s (as long as they don’t get soft and pudgy). Men can sustain their *attitudinal* sexual attractiveness well past their 30s and into late middle age. The point of this reminder is to wake you from falling into very bad and confidence sapping feelings of self-doubt. Chicks most certainly do not dig self-doubting Thomases.

I met this Hawaiian girl at a bike festival with her gay friend(guy). She had an amazing body, big ass HB 7.5. face was alright nothing amazing. We all talked for a bit, I got her number about 10 minutes into the convo. She gave me a free token for a beer/basically bought me a beer and told me I had “nice eyes”.

I’m just gonna assume she’s not an industry worker.

Anyways they were leaving and asked if I came alone I said yea I was gonna meet someone but they bailed.

Fibbing is always better than DLVing. (Demonstrating lower value.) Don’t tell a girl that your friends “bailed”. Tell her you bailed on them to chat up new people.

She said come with us to the street fair you aren’t doing anything.

An in-demand man is always doing something. She’s already trying to box you into a beta corner. This is an example of a mild form of shit test that many women will utilize without really being aware that they’re doing so.

I told her there was a party later and she and her friend should come and I was going to hang around. (bad move right??).

Not necessarily. Manufactured scarcity can be alluring. And you want to avoid following a girl around like an affection starved puppy. But if she’s really showing interest in you, it’s better to push for more time together than to retreat from the playing field by promising to meet at a later time. To put it simply, if the road is opening up to you, hit the gas. Don’t park and wait for a tow.

I thought I could ride out my high and stay approaching.. I guess this is a good lesson in know when to close the day?

Right. The point of approaching is fucking. Not more approaching.

I text her later on that day

Me- ” hit me up if you want to come to the party”
her- “ok for sure”.

Never heard from her.

Could be any number of reasons why she went cold. But I’d start with your phrasing. Don’t write “…if you want to come to the party”. That’s pleading for her company. Instead, state “come to the party at X. see you there.” AAS. Always. Assume. The Sale.

1 day later I text her around 10:30 am a funny meme that has samuel L jackson from Pulp Fiction pointing a gun and say “morning mother fucker”

If she was a friendly guy you just met would you be sending him funny memes the very next day? No? Then you shouldn’t be sending them to a girl you just met. Remember, dude, you hardly know her and you have better things to do. Why would you waste time trying to cheer up a girl you talked to for a few minutes, unless you were some needy beta desperate for a love connection?

Listen, girls can SMELL value on a man from twelve parsecs. They can sense it like you can visually tell the difference in nanometers between the right and left boobs.

nothing all day, until 10:30 I text her again..

me- I owe you a beer unless you handed out free beers to every guy who approached you

So far the texting ratio is decidedly not in your favor. You’ve sent three texts to her one text. Look up at the Jumbotron. Are you proud of your works, Oxymandias?

a day later

her- “haha so they all owe me beer”

She texted you A DAY LATER. This dynamic should be the other way around.

How should I attack this?

Lost cause. You’ve shown her nothing of worth except “nice eyes”, and that plus a buck will get you a cheap coffee and an afternoon fap. You want my sincere advice how to attack this? Go nuclear. Text back:

slut

Just like that. No punctuation, no nothing. Only The Asshole Force can save you now.

I feel like I had the upper hand

You never had the upper hand. Do you think a girl’s compliments mean anything? Attention whores toss out glib flattery like candy in order to stoke the chase in their suitors. Girls don’t mean it when they say shit like “nice eyes” in the way that men mean it when they say the same to women. The only evidence that a girl means anything noteworthy is her parting vagina welcoming your Mosaic staff.

but I didn’t move to another venue and now somehow the power dynamic has switched?

Your critical error was your lack of leaving any sort of impression on her. A venue change may have helped, but only in the sense that it would have prolonged the window of opportunity for you to salvage this mess.

While with her I ran into some random people I knew we talked for a while and I thought that showed I had value.

Depends what kind of random people they were. Nerds and fat chicks? Then you lowered your value. Cool cats like yer humble host CH? Value overload.

I’m a bit unsure of what route to take this.. Any help greatly appreciated. I want to smash this one.

You want to smash this one. She knows this. This is why you will not smash.

I can give you little. The lead is cold. Ice cold. Try non sequitur text game. That might do something. Otherwise, accept your momentary defeat and take the lesson to heart for the next girl you want to smash. Don’t worry, there will be plenty of them.





Comments


  1. Yea – you are correct about the sexual peak of men. I’m currently 35 and banging a smoking hot 27 year old blonde. This is after dumping a pretty hot 30 year old chick 3 months ago.

    In your 30’s ….you’ll never have more access to high quality pussy. What are you thinkinking “Time is not on your side”??

    In your 30’s you have the resources to attract and the experience to be able to manage these broads. Get out there kid.

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    • 30s my ass. I peaked in my 50s. Though there are times after roguring ForeignBride that I have trouble urinating. With my Pierce Brosnan good-looks and slightly peppered hair, I should apply for a job as an actor in a FloMax or Viagra commercial.

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      • “I know it’s not fair, but the fact remains that us men stay attractive longer.” –Onslow, Keeping Up Appearances (say in a low-class English accent)

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      • yeah speaking of which i was just looking at padma lakshmi thinking yeah i remember her being hot, and she’s in great shape for a mom, but her face is already gone. age and darker skin are tough on a woman

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      • YIKES!!!

        As recently as about 8 or 10 years ago, she was arguably the most beautiful woman in the entire world [or maybe second to Monica Belluci].

        Father Time is not friendly to the fairer sex.

        Not friendly at all.

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    • 40 is working fine for me, occasional pushback from early twenties girls but not bad.

      to the dude, almost your entire problem is summed up in “I want to smash this one.” i know how hard it is to get a nice big ass out of your head but you have to get into another chick to do it or you will stall out. good luck! there is no lack of help here.

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      • 44 here and my only problem with girls in their 20s is they generally feel more entitled to my commitment. Older girls generally know the deal. I lose some lays to less slutty girls in their 20s because I’m up front about my lifestyle but my conscience is clean.

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      • Another at 42. I skip baths about twice a week (paying work to complete; can’t be bothered), shave every couple days, letting the beard grow (can’t be bothered), and let my hair grow about shoulder length, with just enough clay to keep the frizz off. Don’t think Legolas; think Gimli. I get come-on’s from bank tellers, check-out girls, cops(!), nurses, and what-all when I do business around town. These drones (7-9 on good days) could just as easily say, “G’bye! Have a nice day!” but put in the extra effort ’cause… hell if I know. Point is, CH is right, you ain’t shit ’til 30. Your 20’s are for practice. If that Hawaiian is single in ten years, she’ll beg for you.

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      • Take care of your shit and she’ll beg for you even if she isn’t single. I’ve had more than one married friend ask me to impregnate her. Bitches do not fuck around when it comes to (perceived) genes. Work out; eat right; dress well; be interesting; always push boundaries = the world is yours for the taking.

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    • There are plenty of very handsome men in their 50’s. “Men age like fine wine and women age like milk” LOL

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      • “Men age like fine wine and women age like milk” LOL

        what’s so lol-worthy?

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      • you mean ”men age like wine and women age like milk”? Why do you find it funny? I think it’s really hurtful! Every time i hear it I feel pressure in my chest and feel without any energy … I think people shouldn’t be so cruel to say this so often … I prefer polite people.

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      • Don’t find it hurtful. It is just biology. Use the knowledge to cultivate a beautiful heart so when your physical beauty is gone, you will still have your beautiful character.
        “Beauty is fleeting”.

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      • “The truth? You can’t handle the truth!” QFT
        The reason you hear it here “often” is because it is the truth. You don’t hear it on the street because the truth is turned on its ear there so people won’t get “hurt”. Of course this means they eventually come to the truth too late… and feel more pain because they didn’t prepare for it. Buckle up buttercup, life is a bumpy ride and worse when you go through it with blinders.

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      • I know it’s just biology but I still feel like shit when I hear it, I can’t help.

        ”Use the knowledge to cultivate a beautiful heart so when your physical beauty is gone, you will still have your beautiful character.”

        Yeah, I agree with that. It’s just that men don’t give a shit about beautiful character. Youth and beauty are MUCH more important than character. At least for men. Maybe us women see other women differently and value good heart more than looks? I’m sure we do.
        ”Men are different than women”.

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      • ok, they age like fish then?

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      • embracing,

        I didn’t want to sound offensive and I agree with you that beautiful character is most important for both men and women. BUT it’s not enough to be loved. That’s why men who are nice and have a good heart are ignored by women and women who are not pretty or young often remain single.

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      • Maya I am not discrediting that men are attracted to youth and beauty.

        “Let thy fountain be blessed: and rejoice with the wife of thy youth.” –Proverbs 5:18
        I’m saying there are different stages in the life we must acknowledge, first in our youth we want to look beautiful. Why do we want to look beautiful? To attract a husband and have babies and give our youth to him. There is a reason women’s fertility steadily declines over the years, where as men can still father children until much later in life. It seems unfair, doesn’t it. But that’s how it is, and we just have to understand that God saw fit to make it like that so that’s how it’s supposed to be. When middle age comes we will hopefully be able to rejoice in that age too, looking happily at the fruits of our youth, if we spent it wisely.
        Men don’t care about a kind character? Well, you may have a point, if he wants her just 1 night-then yes. But who wants a difficult and a haughty woman to mother his children?

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      • “Maybe us women see other women differently and value good heart more than looks? I’m sure we do.”

        there is your lol of the day everyone. women value a good heart. you heard it hear first.

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      • embracing,

        Maya is a feminazi, which means her opinions don’t count.

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      • ”That’s why men who are nice and have a good heart are ignored by women and women who are not pretty or young often remain single.”

        LOL, this sounds like being a nice guy with a good heart is equivalent to being an old, ugly girl. What I meant is that being a good, nice guy is not enough – like being a good, nice girl is not enough. It’s a lot, but if you don’t have other qualities (youth, looks, power etc.) nobody will EVER fall in love with you.

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      • on October 8, 2013 at 2:28 pm leavesarefalling

        women with kids don’t have time to cry like little bitches about their vanishing looks. That void gets filled.

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      • embracing,

        ”When middle age comes we will hopefully be able to rejoice in that age too, looking happily at the fruits of our youth, IF WE SPENT IT WISELY.”

        Wisdom is not enough. I consider myself a very wise person but most likely (I’m 100% sure actually, since I’m not willing to settle for a passionless marriage) I will spend my middle age alone. I also know a few other women who spent their youth wisely but remained single, so it’s not that unusual.

        ”Men don’t care about a kind character? Well, you may have a point, if he wants her just 1 night-then yes. But who wants a difficult and a haughty woman to mother his children?”

        Sorry for not being clear … I explained it in the comment below. Actually, men probably do care about sweet, feminine character but they care MUCH MUCH more about looks and youth. (see the ‘dating market value test for women’)

        [CH: Looks are necessary but not sufficient as a criteria that men use to choose women for LTRs.]

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      • “Why do you find it funny? I think it’s really hurtful! Every time i hear it I feel pressure in my chest and feel without any energy … I think people shouldn’t be so cruel to say this so often … I prefer polite people.”

        Why do you take everything to heart, Maya?

        The truth is meant to caution you, not to make you immobilized with fear and pain and hurt.

        Besides, just because the truth hurts, does it mean it should be left unspoken? This is how delusions develop, and how reality gets pushed aside so that lies take its place. What’s more important in life than truth? Once you know the truth, maybe you can devise some kind of defense or counteraction, don’t you think?

        Of course, I am speaking about absolute truth, like mathematical truth – something that can’t be refuted. I am not speaking about relative truth or perception, where one man’s truth is another’s lies.

        This brings us back to the reality of the sexes. Embracing is right – men age much better than women do. She’s not being mean. This is a fact. Should it upset you? Yes…….so you’ll act on that fact and change your life. Otherwise, what’s the sense of getting upset if you’re not going to do anything about it?

        Maya, every time you show up here you are upset why someone said something less than flattering about women aging and not looking as hot.

        Maya, you’re powerless, which is why you’re getting upset instead of doing something about it. Change your course and your attitude, and you might feel a lot better about your situation.

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      • @ corvinus

        I doubt she’s a feminazi. She is too much of a simpleton to be one. She isn’t vicious enough either. She’s just a woman raised in a delusional liberal egalitarian society, and she bought into the idea of only saying nice thing so that you don’t rock the boat or hurt people’s feelings, including hers. She has a Mickey Mouse view of the world, as most liberals do – that’s all.

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      • on October 8, 2013 at 3:50 pm Imperial Leather

        Unfeminine women in particular age like curdled milk

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      • Maya, the ONLY thing men care about is good character. And if you can make a sammich. A big sammich. Like Dagwood eats. And if you’ll scratch my back. Yeah, right theeerrreeee. Ahhh!.

        Seriously, though: stay thin and flexible. Don’t ruin your skin; wear sunscreen. Read difficult books, and have your own hobbies and friends. Then, if you want to “bag” a man, get up in your stand, watch the forest carefully, and wait for a buck who’s too stupid to stay in the thicket at dusk. Shoot him in the heart, gut him, haul him home, eat his meat, and hang his horny head on the wall. If you feed him sammiches and keep eating him, he’ll last more winters than you’d expect.

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      • > “Yeah, I agree with that. It’s just that men don’t give a shit about beautiful character. Youth and beauty are MUCH more important than character. At least for men.”

        NOT. TRUE. AT. ALL.

        Search the archives.

        No man wants to mess around [much less even dream about settling down] with a chick who has been infected by The Darkness.

        Men want women with kind and gentle and warm and loving HEARTS.

        Keep The Darkness out of your heart.

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      • on October 8, 2013 at 12:26 pm The Burninator

        @Maya

        Um, yeah, women value women for a good heart. That’s why bitching destructive gossip and passive aggressive tearing down of even the slightest competition in the female world never, ever happens. Because you’re all just valuing each others hearts and souls and having chicken soup and attending quilting parties together.

        Meanwhile, in real life, women will push other women off of buildings if they think they can get away with it, if that woman is a threat to her prospects in life/romance. A woman will turn on a woman in a heartbeat, even a “BFF”, hell, especially a “BFF”, and rip her soul to shreds for the slightest reason that any “shallow, looks and youth enjoying man” would consider foolishness.

        And don’t let’s get started about an alpha who tries to develop a heart? Bitch drops him like a bag of five day old mouse turds the moment that happens.

        So much for “value the heart”.

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      • However, lesbians tend not to care about looks at all. Which is why they’re all so terrible-looking. So there’s some basis to what she’s saying.

        But yes. Destroying your friends emotionally is a common female pastime.

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      • “Meanwhile, in real life, women will push other women off of buildings if they think they can get away with it, if that woman is a threat to her prospects in life/romance. A woman will turn on a woman in a heartbeat, even a “BFF”,
        hell, especially a “BFF”, and rip her soul to shreds for the slightest reason that any “shallow, looks and youth enjoying man” would consider foolishness.”

        Hell, Yeah! But certain women commenting here don’t live IRL, which is why they can’t see how true this characterization of women is.

        I don’t trust any woman, not even a best friend, and I don’t believe in stupid affirmations like BFF either. I’ve often mentioned that because I don’t trust women, I don’t share secrets with even close GFs.

        Every woman is in competition with another, especially over looks and over men’s attention. Even if personally I am not, other girls are with me. Therefore, better keep a distance. Share only superficial stuff, and leave the juicy important salient parts of your life to yourself. Women can’t shut up, so while they are telling me all their shit, I keep my mouth shut about mine. LOL! Even if sinister intentions were not at play, if they can’t shut up about their personal shit, would they be able to shut up about yours?

        The BFF bullshit is such a disingenuous artificial concept, I can’t stand it. They are BFF for a short time, but as soon as an opportunity arises (over any stupidity), they’ll stick the knife and call each other bitches. Try looking hotter in the company of one of your GFs and watch the jealousy and the bitchiness climb to unimaginable heights. And, what if you got more attention from guys that night, she’ll accuse you of trying to undermine her, or outright stealing the guy that she’s sure wanted her, in her delusions.

        There is no such thing as a good heart when women are competing for “resources” – i.e. men, and looking hotter than other women. Oh, I can go on and on, but I learned the hard way. Once bitten, twice shy.

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      • Yup. The tendency of women to have – and routinely attempt to destroy – their “BFFs” is a perfect example of “keep your friends close and your enemies closer.” As a woman you want your friends to be attractive and desirable because it maximizes the attention you get when you go out together. But you don’t want them to be more attractive or desirable than YOU, and if they are, you look for ways to cut them down to size – either by directly tearing them down, or by insinuating bad things about them (i.e. sluttiness) to others.

        I’ve had it done to me so many times, and truth be told, I’ve done it myself. Woman’s inhumanity to woman is one of those secrets we don’t like revealing to men, because it interrupts the “women are angels and morally superior to men” cultural narrative we push so hard.

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      • on October 8, 2013 at 11:10 am The Burninator

        It’s cutesy and kinda funny.

        I’ve heard a variation of this.

        Fortunately, a lot of men age and end up looking like Sean Connery. Unfortunately a log of women age and end up looking like Sean Connery.

        🙂

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      • hahahahahaha thats goin on the pile

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      • Women end up looking like Sean Connery. WOW.. that is a good one

        “Cutesy” – I was going more for “profound” … but it ended up cutesy. hahaha

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      • WOW, I admire you for being able to laugh at this … I felt really bad when I read it.

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      • Maya if I don’t laugh I’ll cry. 🙂

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      • LOL, [email protected] you know it was funny. Get a sense of humor.

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      • Maya you’re stuck in a sort of psychological loop and need to get into therapy.

        Don’t get trapped in the limbo of help-rejecting complaining–getting “first aid sympathy” with your complaining, thus neglecting getting surgery for the structural thought defect of unrealistically wanting a “Hollywood” marriage.

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      • on October 9, 2013 at 11:51 am The Burninator

        Toughen up Maya, life isn’t fair, you either accept it as it is or you doom yourself to a room in a decrepit Victorian house, staring at yellow wallpaper and musing about the horrors you feel. If your feelings are hurt by casual jokes you’re in for a whole new world of pain if you ever walk outside the door of your home.

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      • “Men age like fine wine and women age like milk” LOL

        what’s so lolworthy?

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      • hearts, it was me … i wrote you a message and explained everything 🙂 sorry.

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      • Maya and all the ladies: lift weights, do interval training, get lots of protein to fortify those muscles that give you your shape – stay tight and fit in your legs & ass, be shapely and avoid the b.s. diet that most Americans and Westerners eat, limit the refined carbs as low as you can and BELIEVE me men will forgive a 30 something and 40 something face. Do NOT fool yourself into thinking that running alone will do the trick : it just accelerates the muscle wasting away that is gonna happen as you go thru your 30’s & 40’s. Yoga won’t do it either: take off the fat and put the muscle where it looks good and you can save on clothes that way because we won’t care what you wear as long as it’s tight

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    • Plus one. Agree with Uncle Elmer, burke, and EYF. It takes work but a man can stick it out after his 30s.

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  2. As if by order. See “How to Date Young Women for Men Over 35, Volumes I and II” by R.Don Steele.

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  3. on October 8, 2013 at 8:52 am The Burninator

    I’m aware that this will be yet another flametastic statement, so I’m girding my loins with asbestos.

    Fib = lie. Why is lying necessary precisely? To people with morals I mean, not the amoral “pussy at any cost, even the cost of my dignity” folks? One of the greatest strengths of men is their brutal, cold, hard ability to confront reality without the need for lies. Lying seems to me to be entering the world of women’s minds. No thanks. Rather say nothing and let something slide, or lead the conversation off into another direction, than create a false reality for the benefit of a broad.

    To the “all’s fair” crowd, this does not apply to you, have fun in your amorality. Just talking to the hard realist men.

    Not sure I buy into sexual peak being mid 30’s. Not disagreeing per se, just not certain why 35 instead of, say, 42. Physical fitness remains at both ages, and earnings are generally higher at 42, not to mention having more connections and experience in life (just picking a random age with good general health, mind you).

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    • on the age stuff, the only difference 35 to 42 is that girls in peak nubility don’t piece all that together. they can think ‘my dad’ unless you prep them for it. late twenties and early thirties girls, no problem. but 21ers can be tougher later.

      as to lying, i think it falls under fake-it-til-you-make-it. it’s not ideal. but at the moment, no offense to the guy, but he’s not a high-value guy. the goal is to become the high-value guy, and not have to make up stories or lies. in the interim, though, they are at least useful and illustrative.

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      • on October 8, 2013 at 9:29 am The Burninator

        Fair enough on the age thing. My perspective is a bit different I guess, 21 year old chicks seem to me (even when I was near 21) as vapid, clueless idiots. Hot? Physically, yeah, but is it worth it? I don’t want 50 year old crusty women, don’t get me wrong, but 21 to 24 is like dealing with kids intellectually, emotionally and it just seems like its not worth the effort. A tight 28 year old is just as physically alluring, while dispensing with at least some of the “like, ohhhh mah gawd!” crap drama of a 21 year old. Extreme chick drama bored me when I was young, it hasn’t mellowed as I’ve aged.

        Agree he’s not a high value guy. First, he went down the Texting Game route, which is nearly 100% femme oriented and gives him little chance to be anything more than another stream of digits flowing on her phone, like every other dillweed who is texting her. I see texting as taking away all of a man’s advantages that help him get a woman – his presence, his air/aura, his projected strength, the physical attraction, the sound of your voice in command tone, etc. That’s likely really OT I guess, but I just don’t get the fascination with texting for men. Women will look up from the palm held idiot if you have what it takes to fascinate her. If she wants to talk, she can call me direct, I refuse to deal with texting, it’s a plague on what’s left of our intelligence and humanity.

        As to lying, something about faking reality for a chick, lying, just sticks in my craw and seems way too close to situational ethics (aka female ethics). Clearly it’s just a “me thing” though. I appreciate your explanation burke, thank you.

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      • thanks, and i agree with you on all of that, btw. the girl i actually would choose for ltr right now is 30. the 24-year-old i hooked up with a few weeks back gave as her reason for having a surreally ridiculous tattoo “i was so drunk” so i do get it.

        alright man, keep it up

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      • “but I just don’t get the fascination with texting for men.”

        I’ve seen you write this a few times so here you go:

        18-23yo’s don’t pick up the phone or call new guys because their generation was raised on txt’ing, not phone calls. I have literally not talked to a girl on the phone in years and I know girls who are the same. It’s just not the culture right now.

        Once you have a shit-load of attraction established, you can do phone calls but if you grabbed a 20yo’s # in 15 min at a bar and try calling her, you are going to seem weirdly out of touch to her and at best be leaving a gay voicemail…that she’ll respond to with a text.

        I was gaming before txting was a thing that people did, back when girls gave out their home phone #s and shit. But the culture has changed and we adapt. “But YaReally, you’ll stand out by calling, establishing your manly mature nature to her!” No, that’s logical in theory, but in reality with young chicks these days you will be leaving a voicemail or “1 Missed Call” on her phone’s display.

        Like I say, once you HAVE massive attraction built, like if you had a solid couple hours to build it when you met her, or you’ve already hooked up, cool, do what you want and it’ll work and she’ll be all “he called me! What a manly man!! I wish boys my age had the balls to call a girl!!” and I agree that txting takes a bunch of manly shit away. But you aren’t getting a chance to display that manly shit to an 18-23yo if she doesn’t pick up.

        (personally I prefer txting because I hated the time-sink of dialing all my #s to yap all day, and if your txt game is solid you can build attraction, run comfort/rapport, get them sending nude pics and sexting etc. it’s not a big deal tho I agree it’s easier to do a lot of that via voice, and having to dial #s built good shit in guys learning game because we had to go through the butterflies and improvisation involved in calling and not knowing what we were in for once we heard “rinnngg…rinnngg…”)

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      • on October 8, 2013 at 10:59 am The Burninator

        @Yareally

        That actually explains something to me.

        I don’t do 15 minute pickups and rotate through 100 women a night in 15 minute intervals, ergo, there’s not a lot of need to get all texty for me. Plus, I don’t generally hit on 20 year olds (they tend not be allowed into the places I go), and 21-24 are far too idiotic to deal with 99.9% of the time. But outside of that, it’s the different methods if what you’re saying is accurate that explains why I generally don’t need text (and I hadn’t thought of it that way, fwiw, thank you).

        My general “method”, if you’d call it such, is straight forward. I focus only on women I generally believe will be a sure close. Usually she either hits on me first and it’s easy picking to build up a conversation with her over at least 1/2 an hour or longer, and generally have her on the back of my bike going to a new bar by the end of the night…OR…she’s actually in the super high value category (8.5-9.5) and I’ve broken down her defenses and have her hanging on my shoulder and giggling, then onto the bike for more venues that night, almost always finished with at least a kiss. She knows who I am and leaves with a high level of interest and solid butterflies in the stomach instead of “Hey, wasn’t guy X who spoke to me for 10 minutes real similar to guy Y who spoke to me for 10 minutes last night?” She knows right from the get go that I don’t have or use Facebook or Twitter, and that I refuse to text, so she’s prepared. If she didn’t like it, we wouldn’t have gotten to the “on the back of my bike” part to begin with. When I call, she knows who I am, and she answers the call immediately most of the time. If not, no big loss.

        My strengths are not in being a sarcastic douche (though I can be I guess) and playing invisible-man texting mind games (and for the Yoot today, I guess that’s what you have to do to get it done, so no harm no foul I suppose). Generally I have to let my rather commanding physical presence, “intimidation”, bad boy aura, physique, voice, verbal wit and charm, solid social proofing in my “kingdom” of “bike night” (a weekly thing here) and facial expressions do my work for me. That kind of thing doesn’t lend itself well to texting, imo.

        Agree on the pre-texting world being more confidence building. At this point in life I could really give two fetid shits whether a girl rejects me or not and I certainly didn’t have loads of guys to run to for advice in my Yoot, so yeah, scarring builds up and you learned a natural nonchalance to rejection.

        Thanks for the explanation. I’ll still never text, but if a guy has that as his best or optimal tool for his method, then go for it I suppose.

        Like


      • Ya I could tell your style of game, the types of girls you hit on, and your attitudes/beliefs about younger chicks just from your not understanding this, and I think a lot of older guys have the same mindset of “txting is gay, back in my day we CALLED women like real men!” And it’s totally valid, but like I say when reality hits theory, if your target market is <24, reality is gonna win out.

        I don't actually have a specific preferred age range. I've run the gamut from 17 – 52 (lol just a makeout, oldest I've actually banged is 48) but my friends tend to be younger than me and I'm hitting my prime in my early 30s now where I'm old enough to be an 18yo's older man experience but not old enough to remind her of her dad, so I end up gaming a lot of 18-25yos).

        It's no biggie, like you say whatever system works for whatever your goals and situation are. You don't need to txt because you build enough attraction/comfort/etc in person. There's no need to condescend and assume everyone who's getting 15-min #s is just approaching 100 girls a night. Maybe he's doing daygame and the chick is in a rush to get back to the office, maybe she wanted to hang with him longer but her drunk friends pulled her away, maybe the guy wants his choice of woman and she's the one surrounded by 4 cockblocking guys who won't let him get more than a few minutes with her VS being limited to the girls that choose him first, etc etc.

        Ideally when I'm older I'll be able to rely on social circles etc and not be the 50yo at the bar, but there's nothing inherently wrong with either style.

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 11:45 am The Burninator

        Yeah. I suspect my issue is that I didn’t come to these blogs to discover game, been basically a natural all of my adult life and some of my teenage years as well. It’s hard to wrap my mind around guys needing all kinds of techniques and instructions patiently explained to them, but then I guess everybody has to start somewhere, and I’ve likely internalized lessons I learned long ago without being explicitly instructed by others. Or something like that, heh. When you grow up as a legacy “rugrat” to a 1%’er MC gang member and hang out in bars, MC homes and clubs at age 14+ you learn a lot about women and their twisted nature by just watching the insane shit they’ll do for their men, when their men are by any account “shiftless, dirty rotten bastards”. Absolutely gorgeous women will lay down and let the “right kind of man” walk all over her and she’ll thank him for it and loyally wait for him to come back and do it again after he leaves. On the flip side, she’ll be arrogant Princess Bitch to guys who promise to “take her away from all of this, let me help you”. It’s only recently since hitting these blogs that I’ve learned about red pill and “alpha”, and it explains a lot to me. I just figured most all women were pushovers and weak minded prior (and that thinking hasn’t changed really, but now I am learning why).

        The 15 minute thing is a generality, lots of guys here and on other sites seem to brag about moving from one chick to the next in the same club. 100 a night is hyperbole of course, but you know what I mean. If it’s 5 guys cock blocking (another thing I find strange, I’ll just give her a head nod to “come over to me” if she’s giving me signals and surrounded by dweebs hopping up and down around her like attention starved pups) or the other things you describe, that makes sense and is different than what I was talking about or assuming.

        My range for women is in what I consider the sweet spot of 27-36, looks range 7+, all other things being equal. Exceptions can be made on either thing, but on a case by case basis.

        These sites are fun, lots of things getting clear from a psyche perspective,and I thank you and everybody else for putting up with my dumb ass questions. Not sure I want to learn more though, don’t want to mess up the norm with overthinking things, ya’ know?

        Will never get text game, don’t want to actually. Hopefully some day the towers will come down and texting will disappear. God only knows what will replace it though. Maybe we’ll have Holograph Game develop, heh.

        Like


      • “It’s hard to wrap my mind around guys needing all kinds of techniques and instructions patiently explained to them”

        Ya you have to understand that game was developed to help the guys that you would naturally write off as evolutionary failures, if you even acknowledged their existence at all. Billy the computer nerd virgin in your comp sci class didn’t vanish after you all graduated…that guy is out there, cooped up in his CPU room playing World of Warcraft with no friends inviting him out (cause he doesn’t drink or know how to socialize or be comfortable around new people) and hitting 30 without having ever felt what it’s like for a girl to be attracted to him and is wondering if he’ll die alone.

        Game can take that guy and tell him “look man, we get that you don’t understand the social rituals that everyone around you seems to naturally get. Maybe you fucked up, maybe you were a victim of circumstance, who knows, it doesn’t matter. If you study and apply yourself, you can turn your life around. You might not become a super big pimp (tho you CAN if you dedicate yourself), but you can at least find yourself a cute little girlfriend and feel what another human being’s warm body cuddled up to you is like.”

        Your attitude, no offense to you, can’t help those guys. You’re like a rich kid who’s dad has connections that thinks poor people should just “get a job”. But that’s why you don’t teach pickup so no harm no foul lol

        “It’s only recently since hitting these blogs that I’ve learned about red pill and “alpha”, and it explains a lot to me.”

        Ya most naturals who find this stuff are intrigued more that it connects blurry dots than by the actual tactics/routines. Like “ohhh so that’s why that thing i’ve noticed always happens”

        “I focus only on women I generally believe will be a sure close.”

        Ya this is standard Natural game. The limitation is that you don’t get as much choice because you can only select from the girls who choose you first (even if she’s high value and you’ve broken her down via social proof teasing negging jealousy plot lines etc, you’re still waiting for the point where she notices you and actively selects you).

        That’s not a big deal, but it’s a limitation that a lot of guys who do cold approach dont want because often we get into the game to have choice: ie – to see a girl we’re attracted to who has no idea we exist in a situation that isn’t necessarily favorable, and to be able to go over and get her.

        Again tho it comes down to your goals and lifestyle. Your system works for you, so don’t change it up by adding txting. It wouldn’t be congruent to you anyway. I txt but I don’t use Facebook Twitter etc so I draw the line at some point, but I like banging the <24 girls so txting is a necessary evil.

        "She knows who I am and leaves with a high level of interest and solid butterflies in the stomach instead of “Hey, wasn’t guy X who spoke to me for 10 minutes real similar to guy Y who spoke to me for 10 minutes last night?”"

        Ya, this is why we work on ways to stand our quickly. Negs/teasing, DHVs, social proof, even your initial txt message, etc are all ways to make your 10 min stand out from the other guy's 10 min. But that's the weakness of gaming in nightclubs where the environment is ADD. You probably hang more in bars and lounges/pubs where the atmosphere is less chaotic and you can have a conversation.

        "When I call, she knows who I am, and she answers the call immediately most of the time. If not, no big loss."

        Ya, your game style plus their age range means she likely to pick up. Understand that you're running the same game everyone else does (attraction, comfort/rapport, venue changes, social proof, abundance mentality, escalating, etc) but in a nightclub enviro with <24yo's you generally have to distill that all down into a more efficient method because of the environment. If you ran into a 20yo at a local pub, you could run game the same way you do, but like you say 20yo's don't tend to go to the venues you go to.

        "That kind of thing doesn’t lend itself well to texting, imo."

        I agree 100%. It's kind of like with short dudes, I tell them not to waste time gaming online girls because those girls will get hung up on the height number in their profile and reject them or play harder to get than if they met that girl out at a bar where the girl could experience their full presence and attitude and voice and social proof and all that shit. They are WAY better off being out with a social circle partying and having fun and meeting girls that way.

        "Thanks for the explanation. I’ll still never text, but if a guy has that as his best or optimal tool for his method, then go for it I suppose."

        lol ya we're all just adapting. I'm not calling you out or anything, just explaining what it looks like from other types of guys' perspective and why their game is run different.

        I have as much respect for the effeminate fat balding accountant who runs slow indirect social circle game to get laid as I do for the manly badass leather jacket dude who directly approaches chicks in a dive bar, cause they've both figured out how to achieve their goal.

        Like


      • Also:

        “If it’s 5 guys cock blocking (another thing I find strange, I’ll just give her a head nod to “come over to me” if she’s giving me signals and surrounded by dweebs hopping up and down around her like attention starved pups)”

        You’re assuming the other guys are dweebs, and that you’ve got (or can get) enough of her attention that she’s even looking in your direction to SEE your head nod.

        In a high-end nightclub where the guys are all tall jacked rich socially proofed naturals with high-value in that social circle, she’s not going to notice you’re even in the room let alone be coming over via your head nod. You’re simply not on her radar.

        In a dive bar with a bunch of gameless dudes, where you’re shaking the bartender’s hand and causing a ruckus with your boys or if you stomp into her group with sometime, ya, now you’re on her radar and you can work the head nod.

        Again I’m not talking smack about your game, I’m just saying you’re gaming in an entirely different environment with entirely different obstacles and advantages.

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 12:41 pm The Burninator

        @Ya

        You’re an insightful man, no offense taken, I see you’re talking to explain concepts. I get why guys come here and other sites, and I respect that. The limitation is mine in not getting deep down that men need this, it’s nothing on them at all. Most men grow up in single parent homes these days, usually with mothers who beta-ize them, so I get the need and am glad to see it filled, it’s just so counter intuitive at a gut level (though not an intellectual one). Frankly we need more men in the world and less wimps with vestigial penises, so this entire movement is A Good Thing ™. My parents divorced as well when I was young, and I was fortunate (I guess?) to get semi-adopted by my MC uncle who basically showed me the ropes from age 12 forward.. Man is in his early 60’s and women still seek him out without him trying, he’s a fugging demigod.

        To correct a point, I don’t ONLY just wait for women to approach. Normally I don’t really have to do much approaching and they come to me (though I suspect that will change as I get older), BUT if I do see a 8.5-9.5 that gets my hunting instincts riled, I’ll approach her first. Usually the social proofing and her seeing me the entire night with men and women making pains to come up and talk to me, seeking my approval/friendship, is enough for her to start smiling immediately as I walk up. Sometimes not, but no big deal. I can usually tell the receptive high end chicks before approaching them at a glance, from experience these days. When I’m wrong, oh well, life goes on.

        You are correct that I do what others are being taught, just haven’t known it in those terms until recently. And I doubt I could be much help teaching, unless men wanted to start hanging out with me and watching what I do, I’m pretty much still at a loss for terminology and I certainly can’t give formulaic explanations (yet). To be clear though, I’m glad this kind of movement exists. It’s like a deep subterranean world I had no idea existed until recently. Fun stuff.

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 12:54 pm The Burninator

        I don’t game “dive bars”. If you’ve never been to real biker bars, it’s not what you think. I get you’re talking about urban type high end clubs, and true that’s not my kingdom, I stay away from them.

        Biker bars, at least around here, are on the weekends where all of the hot corporate and high end chicks go for their alpha fix. They come in groups, without men, and you can see them piling out of their cars prepping makeup and fixing their hair up like their life depended on it. It’s like a friggin’ magnet for that type on Fridays, Saturdays and “bike night” (around here, Wednesday nights)

        I assume the 5 around her are dweebs because it also attracts a certain type of “was at the high end club but heard all the women talk about coming here” guy who wasn’t quite smart enough to stay out. The women, in this mileu, are no longer looking for suave sophisticated Don Draper, they’re looking for tall, muscled, tatted up/pierced extremely dominant biker men. In that, my kingdom, they are interlopers, just like I’d be in their club. The other alpha/dominant bikers don’t need to compete in that setting with me, so they’re not orbiting the corporate broads, there are plenty to choose from already hitting on them if they’re single or their old lady doesn’t mind and is looking for a threesome. Plus, I don’t do the normal biker garb thing, more the cowboy-biker type (Stetson, boots, brown leather bags/tank cover/horns on the bike, etc), so I kind of stand out in the crowd of other dominant males.

        In essence, the women have pre-selected what they’re looking for by coming there, and stepping in front of 5 coifed Mr. Dapers and walking away with the chick is not only not a challenge, it’s exactly what she wants most of the time. If she wanted their offerings, as alpha as they might be in his settings, she’d be back at his settings.

        Seriously, if you ever get a chance, hit the rowdy biker bars on the weekends. Don’t dress like a metrosexual (go black t, boots, jeans at a minimum, don’t fake a jacket unless you actually ride and have patches to back it up, and do not EVER cop an attitude with any of the dominant men there, it’s just not wise). You’ll be amazed. If you’re ever in Ohio give me a shout and I can take you on a tour, you’ll dig it.

        Hope that makes sense.

        Like


      • “BUT if I do see a 8.5-9.5 that gets my hunting instincts riled, I’ll approach her first. Usually the social proofing and her seeing me the entire night with men and women making pains to come up and talk to me, seeking my approval/friendship, is enough for her to start smiling immediately as I walk up.”

        Right, BUT you’re still working from situational value. ie – you’re picturing the high-end chick being in YOUR bar on your turf where YOU have value and people coming up for your approval etc. This is another thing Naturals do. Let me guess, you’ve been hitting the same handful of bars for years? Maybe you even have one that you’ve been going to since you were a teenager?

        Put yourself in a brand new city, in an 18-24yo nightclub venue where you don’t know anyone and you’re out by yourself and everyone is dressed differently than you and all seem to know eachother, and you’re going to be the guy sipping beers by himself in a corner thinking everyone there is stupid and missing the comfort of the bar where everyone knows your name.

        I can go into a situation like that and comfortably build the same value (or at least the appearance of it) you have at your bar to get to the same “she smiles when I finally come over to talk to her” position. The only real difference is versatility…you’re locked to your bars but I can go anywhere. I could build a lot of value in your bar (befriending the guys while ignoring the girls) and probably give you a run for your money that night lol

        Thing is tho, that versatility isn’t that important. When you’re young and traveling and making new social circles after college etc, versatility is a good thing. But when you’re older and established and you have your set of bars and social circles etc like you do, you don’t need to be versatile because you won’t be IN a <24 nightclub…you don't HAVE to be, you're already established and have solid access to value and poon.

        Like I say I fully expect to be like that when I'm older. Pick a city to settle in, establish myself at some places, build a solid social circle and let the versatility slide off.

        Stuff like being able to cold approach is more for the guys who just want to take things as far as they can in terms of pickup being an art or personally challenging themselves. Like you can just play poker straight-up by the numbers and win consistently over time…or you can showboat and try reading people and bluffing and see how much you can get away with lol

        Situational value isn't a bad thing, as long as you always have access TO that situation. 🙂

        Like


      • @Burninator —

        The thing about 27+ girls is they’re getting a little desperate to find Mr Right, and are way more direct than the younger ones. If they’re interested in you, they will let you know, and they’ll give you a fair shot without all the games. (They also don’t play innocent in bed.) Not that it’s impossible to fuck it up, but if you know what buttons to push, the older girls are way easier than the 21-25 ones.

        And this might just be my location, but I’m txting with chicks in their 30s … the art of the phone call is dead at this point.

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 1:27 pm The Burninator

        “Right, BUT you’re still working from situational value. ie – you’re picturing the high-end chick being in YOUR bar on your turf where YOU have value and people coming up for your approval etc. This is another thing Naturals do. Let me guess, you’ve been hitting the same handful of bars for years?

        Normally, yes, quite.

        “Maybe you even have one that you’ve been going to since you were a teenager?”

        No, grew up ~40 miles from where I currently live. The talent where I grew up dried up and blew away decades ago.

        “Put yourself in a brand new city, in an 18-24yo nightclub venue where you don’t know anyone and you’re out by yourself and everyone is dressed differently than you and all seem to know eachother, and you’re going to be the guy sipping beers by himself in a corner thinking everyone there is stupid and missing the comfort of the bar where everyone knows your name.”

        Take away the 18-24 year old, and that’s not an issue (I’ve mentioned here or on another thread that teens to 24 get on my nerves very, very quickly and always have). I was just in Pennsylvania for two weeks (I live in Ohio) and in totally new scenarios. Did quite well actually, though to be fair to your point I picked places similar to where I go now. I just didn’t know anybody right off the bat. By week two I had all the bartender’s names down in the three places I haunted, they all knew me by name, had 5 cold approaches from desirable chicks offering me their number/conversation, and I had at least one screaming fight between two girls over who got to sit down next to me that almost turned into a physical cat fight.

        “I can go into a situation like that and comfortably build the same value (or at least the appearance of it) you have at your bar to get to the same “she smiles when I finally come over to talk to her” position. The only real difference is versatility…you’re locked to your bars but I can go anywhere. I could build a lot of value in your bar (befriending the guys while ignoring the girls) and probably give you a run for your money that night lol”

        Doubtful. There’s a certain look, lingo and you have to actually be naturally dominant to survive a night trying to compete with the folks I hang with. It’s easy to tell the posers from the real thing (poser as in guy coming in trying to make it in order to get chicks) in the first sentence or two, and you’ll get those interrogations from the naturals in the bar if they don’t recognize you. If you can’t walk out in the parking lot and fire up your sled and drag race ten other men to the next bar with hot chicks vying to be on your back seat, chances are you won’t be hanging with us long. No offense (maybe you ride? I don’t mean to assume). Players get weeded out really, really fast, even in herds if they try that maneuver (which, as I mentioned, is always a mistake, don’t pick fights with big muscular guys in leather jackets who are usually combat vets in their own dens).

        Also, in that situation, the chicks wouldn’t be looking for you, they’re there for the alpha fix like a crack addict is at the dealer looking for something to put in her pipe. She is not, in that situation, interested in a snifter of scotch; she wants that crack, heh.

        An analog: If I tried to metrosexual it up and do club rap, and went into an age appropriate high end club (say, a very specialized jazz club for the 28+ crowd that plays a specific genre of jazz as its specialty) I’d fail within minutes. You can get by on a lot, but eventually folks figure out you’re a fish out of water. If it’s a place with little specialization though, then yeah, easily I can easily see what you’re saying (and have the same results as you I’ll wager). Too much specialization (which is by definition large rowdy hard rock biker bars, or very specific style jazz clubs, or whatever), it’s not going to work for you for very long, if at all.

        “Thing is tho, that versatility isn’t that important. When you’re young and traveling and making new social circles after college etc, versatility is a good thing. But when you’re older and established and you have your set of bars and social circles etc like you do, you don’t need to be versatile because you won’t be IN a <24 nightclub…you don't HAVE to be, you're already established and have solid access to value and poon."

        Agreed.

        "Stuff like being able to cold approach is more for the guys who just want to take things as far as they can in terms of pickup being an art or personally challenging themselves. Like you can just play poker straight-up by the numbers and win consistently over time…or you can showboat and try reading people and bluffing and see how much you can get away with lol"

        Good explanation, heh.

        Like


      • “Seriously, if you ever get a chance, hit the rowdy biker bars on the weekends.”

        I do lol. I just do it for the challenge of putting myself in uncomfortable environments where I’ll feel social pressure and have to handle that. Esp back when I was going out solo, I’d hit the high-end martini lounges one night, the meat-market young’un nightclub the next, the cowboy bars (legit ones with guys all wearing their bull-riding buckles and brawling lol, not the country music nightclubs), goth/punk bars, biker bars, college pubs, hipster bars (fucking hate them lol), cougar bars, non-white clubs, etc.

        I actually like to take friends to venues I know they won’t be comfortable in just to fuck with them lol

        I’m focused on versatility right now though. I could get laid more if I focused on one venue but I like being able to walk into, say, a bar full of cowboys looking at me like “who the fuck is this city boy?” and girls looking FOR cowboys, and seeing if I can make shit happen. I’ll grow out of this I’m sure lol

        “Don’t dress like a metrosexual (go black t, boots, jeans at a minimum, don’t fake a jacket unless you actually ride and have patches to back it up,”

        Clothing-wise i’ve found it really just comes down to congruency. Like when I started going to country bars I would throw on a plaid shirt etc and try to blend in. But I was never congruent to it the way the actual cowboys were so eventually I said fuck it and dressed like I normally do (black dress shirt or t-shirt, jeans, sneakers) and when girls would ask if I two-step I’d say “do I look like I two-step? I fuck, do you want to do that instead?” lol. And it would go over well because I wasn’t pretending to be something I’m not.

        That’s why a biker jacket without actually riding would get my ass kicked, because I’d be incongruent and at the end of the day everyone, even big scary biker guys, respect someone who owns their shit. This doesn’t mean they won’t test me or try to tool me, but it means that as long as I can laugh the tooling off, treat them with respect instead of seeking their approval or looking down on them, and dish a little shit-talk back in a cool alpha way, they’ll approve of me even if I wore an Armani suit in.

        This is just based on experience and I know the guys you run into who are dressed metro or whatever ARE generally fucktard tools that get owned so you might not have seen someone who seems out of place end up with the crowd loving him but that’s cause it’s hard as fuck to do and scary. But that’s why I force myself to do it. 😀

        Also I don’t have to win over EVERYONE…but I’ll win over enough that the guys who hate me will have to suck it up and stew in silence because their high-value buddies are laughing and offering me a beer. It takes a lot of calibration and reading who’s value is where quickly.

        Most guys can’t go into a biker bar and befriend everyone cause they go in already feeling like an outsider with prejudices and negative thoughts etc and people sense that and respond in kind.

        It actually works in the reverse venues too, where in a high-end venue people will judge you if you’re not dressed well or if you’re dressing up but clearly not really rich/etc (same incongruent faking it as wearing a biker jacket without a bike)…and they WILL judge you, and they’ll tool and shun you…unless you own it and don’t care and be fun, social, treat everyone cool etc. if you do that, they won’t care. But most guys can’t do that because they can’t shake the social pressure of feeling like an outsider who doesn’t belong and that no one will like.

        “and do not EVER cop an attitude with any of the dominant men there, it’s just not wise).”

        lol ya, it’s all about respect. I think the biggest problem most guys have is they to into a new environment either not having respect for the crowd there (like a snobby Armani suit guy in a biker bar looking down his nose at the filthy bikers, or a rough biker dude in a high-end bar looking down his nose at the metro snobs), or not feeling high-value/confident or offering enough value that they believe people will give THEM respect (wussy suit guy in a biker bar thinking sketchy bikers will pick on him, biker guy in a high-end bar thinking snobby Armani guys will look down on him).

        So when you either don’t respect them or don’t expect them to respect you, there’s conflict.

        “If you’re ever in Ohio give me a shout and I can take you on a tour, you’ll dig it.”

        Ain’t gettin me on the back of one of those things. My ride is a nice comfy recliner in front of an Xbox lol. But I’m sure we’d get along and take down some tattooed poon.

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 1:32 pm The Burninator

        Fair points Sloth.

        I don’t mind direct and great in bed from late 20 somethings, given as I’m 46 years old, they seem to me to be the ideal range I’m looking for. Best of both worlds. And I really have no interest in trying to “get to know” a 19 year old ditz. Everything inside her head I can probably know within a matter of 30 seconds flat, with enough time to order a scotch and wash away the memory of her stupidity before she’s even done talking. If she wants to smile, wink, say nothing, drop to her knees and slobber on my nob, great, she’s welcome. Otherwise, really, the babble about nothing just isn’t worth it to me.

        Like


      • “Otherwise, really, the babble about nothing just isn’t worth it to me.”

        lol I’m at that point with the 18-20yo’s and a bit further up. As I get older, I’m sure I’ll feel that way with the 20-24yo’s. I’ve found 27+ chicks to have a shitload of baggage and negativity (just a general depressed outlook on life because they’re getting old and the wall is looming and they haven’t found a husband and feminism didn’t warn them that working an office job eats away at your soul) so I think in my late 30s and 40s I’ll be gravitating toward the 24-26yo range.

        I think that’s part of why my game has evolved to be more sexually up-front. Realistically there is no conversation a 20yo is going to have with me that blows my mind or opens up new paradigms and shit lol. So instead of talking about Miley’s twerking, I just drop innuendo, tease, and try to turn the conversation to us fucking ASAP.

        I also like the optimistic happy-go-lucky nature of the 18-24yo’s. Life hasn’t beat the smile off their face yet and I like being around that energy. Like having a yappy little puppy that wags its tail at every shiny object it sees…ya maybe a big scary dog is better long-term for security and shit, but when no ones looking I’m gonna run around the room dangling shiny objects and talking baby talk to that puppy rubbing its belly while it spazzes out having the BEST DAY EVER lol

        Like


      • Jesus H Christ, there’s like a fucking PhD dissertation worth of shit between Burninator and YaReally up there.

        I don’t have time to read all of that shit.

        But getting back to something that Heartiste was saying:

        Heartiste: “An in-demand man is always doing something. She’s already trying to box you into a beta corner. This is an example of a mild form of shit test that many women will utilize without really being aware that they’re doing so.”

        Burninator: “Fib = lie. Why is lying necessary precisely? To people with morals I mean, not the amoral “pussy at any cost, even the cost of my dignity” folks? One of the greatest strengths of men is their brutal, cold, hard ability to confront reality without the need for lies.”

        burke: “as to lying, i think it falls under fake-it-til-you-make-it. it’s not ideal. but at the moment, no offense to the guy, but he’s not a high-value guy. the goal is to become the high-value guy, and not have to make up stories or lies. in the interim, though, they are at least useful and illustrative.”

        The bitch had a fag with her.

        In fact, arguably you could say that she was a FAG-HAG herself.

        The dude needed to distance himself from that situation as quickly as possible [unless he felt like he wanted to take it up the ass in a threesome with her and the fag].

        So that would have been a good opportunity to throw some really hardball reverse psychology back at her.

        SHE: “So you wanna go party with us?”

        HE: “Nah, sorry, but I gotta go take care of some important business.”

        Then a day or two later, when she texts back, you pull a YaReally.

        SHE: “So what was that ‘important business’ the other night?”

        HE: “Ahh, I’m really not supposed to talk about it, but I had to go assassinate some rival drug dealers. You might have heard about it on the news.”

        Bottom Line: Make yourself scarce.

        Make yourself mysterious.

        Play hard to get [at least as long as Mr Fag is in the picture].

        Never allow yourself to look like you are following her around just to beg for the poontang.

        Always remember that you are the prize. Not her.

        Like


      • on October 9, 2013 at 7:12 pm haunted trilobite

        It’s a worthwhile read even if just to arrive at the yappy puppy analogy

        Like


      • Ya that’s why I think a big disadvantage of going into manosphere stuff headfirst is the blind leading the blind kind of thing. Three things I’ve noticed and I’ve had to unwire:

        1) Be James Bond at the bar. Don’t put yourself out there just act stoic/aloof and let the girls come to you.
        2) Call the girl. REAL men call. Don’t be a little kid and get wrapped up in texting. You’re not a teenager.
        3) If the girl isn’t on your dick, or heaven-forbid, if she flakes, then NEEEEEEEEEEXT. You’re a high value man and high value men don’t put up with that.

        On the surface, I can see how AFCs can be drawn to those kind of ideas as it gives them a basic framework to work towards. But man, you will throwaway a lot of potential lays and lose out on opps. to escalate or try to recover which can also help your game.

        Manosphere is a great place for ideas, but PUA is where it’s at if you want to apply it and learn from trial and error.

        So back to your point YR; someone like King A for example might write really well about never texting girls and it will suck a few guys in and they will believe it. It’s better to let those guys go and call 10 girls instead of texting and see what conclusions that draws them to.

        Note to others: I have done all three of the above and went and learned first-hand why it didn’t work out in a way that benefited me the most. I say that with the caveat that yes, I could have thought for myself a little more at the time and understood it was good advice but hey. Throw rocks if you don’t live in a glass house and all that.

        Like


      • “1) Be James Bond at the bar. Don’t put yourself out there just act stoic/aloof and let the girls come to you.
        2) Call the girl. REAL men call. Don’t be a little kid and get wrapped up in texting. You’re not a teenager.
        3) If the girl isn’t on your dick, or heaven-forbid, if she flakes, then NEEEEEEEEEEXT. You’re a high value man and high value men don’t put up with that.”

        Jesus. I thought I was reading the gay rooshvforum for a second lol. Agree 100% that these are retarded mindsets the manosphere has that should be wiped out.

        All 3 of those are based on ego protection:

        1) being James Bond is to prevent you from doing anything embarrassing (or, you know, “fun”, that thing that girls just wanna have). “Posting up at the bar” is super gay. The hottest girls want the guys who aren’t concerned about looking like James Bond and who can have fun. You’ve all seen the guy on the dance floor who dances terrible but doesn’t give a fuck, everyone LOVES that guy, especially girls, because he’s not stifled and worried about how cool people think he is.

        2) not txting is about trying to look cool and mature. And again the reality is, calling <24yo's is just a massively low % play. It also reminds her that you're old and out of touch because "no one CALLS". You might as well ask for her ICQ number or her yahoo e-mail. If you're a serious player, you get her attention any way you have to, because you know all that matters is getting her in person face to face again. You send a fucking smoke signal if that's what it takes to get her standing in front of you where you can work REAL game and close the deal…anything less is you protecting your "well I'm a mature man, not some teenager" ego and throwing away lays.

        3) as i quote all the time: "you can't Next a girl you haven't fucked. That's HER Next'ing YOU." Prematurely ejectulating is just an attempt to protect your ego as "a guy who doesn't chase". The reality is, if your game was tighter, she wouldn't be flaking on you…but your game won't GET tighter because instead of admitting you suck and trying to turn flakes around, you protect your pimp player ego and tell yourself you "Next'ed that bitch" while the other forum keyboard jockeys high-five your dick and talk about what high standards they have and how their pocket square matched their socks and a girl made eye contact with them last night.

        The guys spouting that shit can't see that and would write off what I'm saying tho, because they've heavily invested a massive part of their identity in the James Bond image and they get enough success now and then occasionally even with a decent looking girl, to keep rationalizing that their game is flawless…all those girls who don't want to bang them are just low-quality American sluts after all.

        PUA community is like 90% keyboard jockeys, Mannosphere is like 98% lol. Like Tyler says "my video on pickup gets 100,000 views…you think 100,000 guys are going out trying it out that weekend? Fuck no."

        Like


      • “1) Be James Bond at the bar.”

        Some of my friends have actually given me the nickname 007.

        Like


    • lying is the active engagement of higher functioning over your hindbrain lower instincts.

      it’s why people that don’t like liars usually possess a simian crease. you are too stupid to know when you are being lied to, ergo you are food for the rest of us.

      science bitchez

      Like


    • on October 8, 2013 at 12:08 pm The Burninator

      Yeah, I saw that television show too, where they basically tried to make a biological case that liars were all that and a bag of chips.

      If I strike you as a low level, low intellect simian, then your biological theory would apply.

      Intelligence incorporates free will. Free will gives you the choice to choose to lie, or to not lie. It is only the concrete bound amoral who make the case that lying equals intelligence. No, it is an artifact of having intelligence, but then so is choosing not to lie for philosophical reasons. In fact, an explicitly thought out philosophy is far more cognitively complex than learning at age 2 to pretend to have not eaten the cookie on the counter.

      Make your decision as you will. I prefer to not indulge in situational ethics. I leave that to chicks, its their natural medium.

      Like


      • yet you couldn’t hit reply to the right post……

        situations build to a pattern, pattern to behaviors.

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 1:49 pm The Burninator

        Actually I replied directly below you, to keep the tree from expanding too far to the right. I hit exactly the correct reply, thanks.

        Like


      • hehehehe. ya got rocks in your head son!

        Like


      • For what it’s worth I don’t lie either. That doesn’t mean I’m always flat out direct with my intentions, because in a lot of situations that’s not an optimal strategy (triggering her ASD, triggering cockblocks, feeding into her too-high ego, not enough value established yet, etc) but I don’t lie about how old I am, what I do, what I think or my opinions on shit, tell her something she’s doing is okay when it’s not, etc.

        I CAN lie, and it works, but on principle I choose not to because I think it builds a bad framework. It’s choosing instant gratification over long-term growth. Just like choosing McDonalds over a healthy meal or Xbox over a workout or gambling instead of earning your money.

        I’ve been having a discussion with a buddy the past couple months actually, where he’s trying to rationalize lying about his age (30) because he’s newly back in the game and concerned about it. I’ve told him that he CAN lie, and he’ll probably get more lays that way because he won’t scare off some girls…but ultimately he’s not going to build healthy mindsets and break his limiting beliefs, which will haunt him when he’s 32, and 35, and 40, because he’s not going to have any reference experience that if you own your age the girl won’t care about it…and in fact he’s going to have the OPPOSITE reference experiences built, that lying about your age gets you a reward (the lay) so it’ll be an even harder habit to break when he physically can’t pass for 26 anymore.

        I have no qualms with my age because I spent a bunch of time in young’un bars telling 18-24yo girls I’m 30+ when they ask. Ya I lost some lays at the start because they could tell I was nervous about it…but now? Shit, I’ll tell them I’m 40, I don’t care, they’ll still be attracted. Those are the references I’ve built up by not lying.

        But to each his own. I won’t tell someone not to get liposuction, but I WILL stress to them that if they do, they’ll still have to learn about proper eating habits and exercise because they took a shortcut.

        Like


      • on October 9, 2013 at 7:47 pm haunted trilobite

        Catholic priests, and probably others in positions of power like Slick Willie, have this thing called ‘mental reservations’ – it iz da bom! Bob Dylan has this thing where he’s an alter-ego for Zimmerman, and disassociates himself with anything that he says or sings.
        I’ve a theory (unproven) that men who don’t lie will be more attractive to women. Women are already employing forms of deception, like make-up, to approximate that post-orgasmic flush, and figure-enhancing clothing or footwear. They often instinctively downgrade their notch-count or rationalise this or that lie to suit any situation. The last thing they want is a shifty man, and are just waiting for the chance to catch a liar so that they feel superior. At that point attraction is obliterated. It’s like in prison – all the murderers and total scumbags are delighted to get the chance to pick on the guy who slept with the underage girl, coz it’s such a rare chance for them to feel like they’re better and look down. The man generally has to lead, and is generally more sure-footed when not lying.
        Agreeing and amplifying is all about lying, but it’s obviously in jest and not your problem if they can’t understand art. Dandyism is all about life as art.

        Like


  4. That was a tad cringeworthy. Though I think I’ll send a meme of my cock one of these days. Bound to be more effective than Samuel L Jackson at any rate

    Like


  5. Seriously, listen to CH here. This girl has lost 99.9% of interest and the only option is to go nuclear like he said. I wouldn’t use ‘slut’, but I’d be aggressive with some phrase like “Let’s get some beers then you’re coming over so I can cuddle the fuck outta u.” Versions of that have worked many times for me.

    Too many betas are scared to send something like that though because they are still holding out hope that the chick is interested, although she isn’t. Worst case scenario she never responds and you never see her again, thus it doesn’t matter. Make it happen.

    Like


    • > “Too many betas are scared to send something like that though because they are still holding out hope that the chick is interested, although she isn’t.”

      If you wanna score with the chick, then you need to be working “sex talk” into the conversation almost from the get-go.

      And actually, it shouldn’t be “working into” in the sense that it shouldn’t be “work”.

      It should be “play”.

      And it should [really it must] come naturally to you.

      You should be playfully, naturally talking about sex with her.

      Very early on.

      And not some weird, creepy, stalker psycho licentious perverted talk.

      I mean talking about how babies are made as though it’s what you and she should naturally be doing with one another – making babies.

      [Which, in fact, is PRECISELY what you and she SHOULD be doing with one another.]

      Like


  6. I’m mid-40’s and banging 28 year olds, 25 year olds. The one 35 year old I was banging in an LTR is the nut case. The others are fun. So why limit yourself?

    I honestly think that guys who unplug from the Matrix, myself included do get stuck in the tactics and not the strategy.

    We tend to over-emphasize that “one killer text” or whatever rather than looking at our overall game fundamentals: did I establish attraction? Was I moving towards comfort?

    Not “Oh no,… I think I’m beta backsliding by asking her how her day was so I better not call her for a few days”.

    Like


    • +1

      Guilty as charged

      Like


    • “I’m mid-40′s”

      Jesus. I always thought you were a college kid lol well done, man…extra props from me for your dedication/progress knowing you’re an older guy.

      Like


    • quit fucking with the “what” and focus on the “why”. im 38, and wont even fuck with anything less than an ASU 8+.

      agree.

      Like


    • @Lumpy

      If you’re reading this, I officially nominate Walawala to be archived at yareallyarchive.com

      Like


      • @ immoral & YaReally:

        Being more self-aware is key but one thing I struggle with is “Am I beta backsliding?”

        Had a blow out and break up with my gf last night.

        I surfaced a series of issues she’d been hiding.

        It went against all game principles of keeping your emotions intact, not using text to blast someone.

        But…in our context, text is a medium we use, so it’s not beta to use that—congruency is vital.

        Secondly throughout this, I blasted her for being lazy, disrespectful and of trying to derail a big party I’m organizing by acting like a big bitch.

        Beta? Well, context is everything. I rarely express these feelings except when I’m pissed and I was pissed off.

        Secondly, she kept saying “You are too egotistical and autocratic”—Alpha, jerk?

        My response: “I’m a man, i’m not your brother”.

        Finally she said she wanted her stuff back and wasn’t coming to my party.

        Me: Ok.

        But I felt why should I let this girl off the hook so easily. I called her “Immature. Grow up”.

        Also: “You’ve never had a strong man call you on your bullshit”.

        I realized that she didn’t lose attraction, we broke rapport somehow. This wasn’t “I don’t love you….” It was “You’re too domineering” type of thing.

        But women say this shit to try to get self-effacing betas to back-peddle.

        This morning, she sent a follow up text: “I’m picking my stuff up”.

        Me: Ok.

        Somewhere it’s written err on the side of asshole. I think there is a point where a girl is pushing for more power and uses this “you’re too domineering” as an excuse.

        The irony—I thought I”d been too beta: giving her all sorts of attention on her birthday, making special arrangements etc etc.

        Chicks don’t see this as a nice thing, they see this as entitlement and demand more.

        I think that women don’t think logically or straight. They get emotional, they get angry, they seek revenge or to try somehow to make guys feel bad.

        If you don’t see this as a structure, it’s too easy to cave in.

        Thought i’d share it. Comments welcome.

        Like


      • At first glance, I’d say you’re fine and in the position of power. I’ll provide two examples that are different but can relate to your situ.

        Before I begin, it seems that you are right, that there are “tests” going on to see if you will beta-backslide or not which can get exhausting because at some point it would be nice to think that it isn’t ALWAYS about who owns the frame.

        Scenario One:
        1) Asian chick I was seeing last year tried to get involved with my New Years Eve plans; surprise surprise I already made plans with my friends. She gets all pouty and tries to invite herself and I refuse. She gets mad and gets cold on me.

        I decide to go cold on her and freeze her out.

        Day before I go home for xmas
        Her: Hiiiiii, have a safe trip 😉
        Me: (No response)

        Day of Xmas (right before midnight)
        Her: Hope you had a Merry Xmas!!! (insert 4 or 5 Xmas related emoticons)
        Me: (No response)

        3 Days after Xmas
        Her: Hiii, so would you be down to see Zero Dark Thirty for your Xmas gift, then back to my place for no strings attached sex???
        Me: (A day later) Sure

        Now the point I want to drive home here WalaWala is that in my situ, I knew I had the upperhand and by going cold on the girl, she eventually came back on my terms. Do you have the upperhand? It seems that you do. You may doubt yourself but eventually they will come back.

        1) Assess your value in the relationship
        2) Freeze out
        3) Let her come back to you and reply after the 2nd or 3rd attempt to reach out.

        Okay so that is scenario one, I’ll go into scenario two.

        My roommate is a frat-natural, similar to the type that YaReally described here in the comments. He was seeing this girl in an LTR and their relationship was a constant mix of her shit-testing him for more commitment signs because he was aloof and gave off an aura that he didn’t care AS MUCH as she wanted him to. He would attempt to break things off here and there because he realized he was in NYC and didn’t need to put up with her shit as much. Sound kind of similar to your situ overall.

        So, about 6months back they get into a fight but this time she ends it on him. She drops him off at a train station and ends it. He comes back to my place befuddled and a little disheartened. I thought he finally wised up and broke up with her but no it didn’t happen. We tried to piece together what happened and it seemed like he played the jerk card one too many times and she was trying to teach him a lesson.

        Why did it seem like this? Because she was still reaching out to him. Read between the lines and judge by her actions. She was still trying to talk it out with him and explain all her frustrations that led her to end it. So in this situ, the ball was still in my roommates court more or less, she just pretended to let it be in hers by breaking up.

        A week goes by and no contact. I discuss with my roommate his thoughts on getting back to her and he had a hunch that because of all his jerk/aloofness, she wanted him to display some signals of caring/commitment/beta/etc. That kind of blew me away for a minute.

        “So you mean, she will get back with you if you go over there with flowers and apologize?”

        Yes, he responded. That’s all she wants me to do and the relationship is on again.

        Again, this blew my mind. A lot of what the Chateau has taught is is to NOT beta-backslide. By doing that, I thought my roommate was stepping into a frame that wouldn’t last for too long, even though it was plausible she would get back wit him.

        Now, depending on how you look at this situ, there is a happy ending for sure. He wised up and called her and officially broke it off with her. She flipped out and VERBALIZED that she wanted him to show some effort and to apologize and make-up for his constant barrage of aloof/jerk behavior. Again, that blew me away. Now perhaps, even if she said that she may have been repulsed by him displaying such signs of affection; who knows. But on some level, yeah, the beta displays of commitment would have gotten him back together with her. In hindsight, the fallout showed she was more pissed he didn’t play into her frame and that he pulled the ultimate of trump cards.

        Do realize Walawala, that your girl may just want the validation of you showing commitment/beta-backsliding even if that causes her to be put off by you in the long run. I think that’s what may have happened had my roommate made the decision to get back with his ex.

        So there I leave you. You do have two decisions here. My bet would be to go cold and do the freeze out and keep living as you’re living. If she already mentioned that she’s coming to get her stuff (again), to me it seems like she’s trying to provoke you to beta-backslide right there.

        Odds are, you are a higher-value man than what she normally runs into (high-five), so while it’s hard to see the forest through the tries right now; in the end I think she will come back on YOUR terms should you fall-back and let her chase.

        Best of luck and please follow-up here with an update. We learn a lot from your posts.

        Like


      • Remember….that these threats that girls make: ” I’m not coming to your party” are cries for attention.

        My “ok” is a definite freak out.

        The old me would have been “Oh come on…”

        New Me: “ok. Immature princess.”

        Like


      • “I realized that she didn’t lose attraction, we broke rapport somehow. This wasn’t “I don’t love you….” It was “You’re too domineering” type of thing.”

        This is key. It’s good you picked up on it. This is the same mechanic as “you’re an asshole!!” where she tries to get you to be nicer, to see if you’ll cave, but really, she’s attracted to it…the evidence for that is that she’s been with you for X length of time, duh, lol. “My last boyfriend was such a jerk!!”, she tells her Nice Guy male orbiter friend, as she asks if his asshole roommate is single.

        “But women say this shit to try to get self-effacing betas to back-peddle.”

        Basically this. Shit-testing doesn’t stop, even in a relationship. Why do some marriages go amazing for 3 years then go down the shitter and the chick no longer wants to touch his dick? Cause he thought the testing would stop and he could relax.

        Two keys:

        1) testing only feels like testing when you’re still learning…once you’ve internalized a lot of the right mindsets, the testing really isn’t a big deal and you don’t get it as much. Think of it like a guy taking martial arts. He might’ve gotten picked on a lot before that, but after he trains a bunch he develops that vibe that people just know not to fuck with him. And when it DOES happen, he’s internalized so many of the right mindsets that he just pooh-pooh’s it away as no big deal, even tho a few years before that it would’ve been a huge deal to him. So a naturally alpha dude might get very few shit-tests over the years, because he’s congruent to his alpha shit…whereas a super newbie who’s super incongruent still, will get shit-tested 50x before he even gets in the girls’ pants because she can tell he might not be as solid as he portrays and has to test to find out.

        2) why does she do this? Why can’t they just fucking let it go? Ultimately it’s just about security. She wants to know that you are who you are and that you’ll stay that way so she can relax and trust that you’re the “oak tree” to her “squirrel”, the way she can trust her father to always be the ultimate authority figure when she acts out etc. She generally doesn’t even shit-test consciously or with malice, it’s purely juuuust to make sure you’re still a man and still act as such. Think of it like double or triple-checking on something that’s cooking…you know it’s probably going fine, but you might check a few times if its important to you, to make sure that its not boiling over or burning. You just want that security and reassurance that shit’s still on track.

        Anyway that doesnt mean this’ll be easy or fun lol. You’ve already missed the chance to Soft Next by the books (blackdragon’s post on How To Soft Next that I always link), so I would handle this in one of two ways:

        1) total freeze-out. No responding to her txts except with “k” if it’s something where she needs an answer like “are you home I’m picking up my stuff now” and when she comes over, completely ignore her. Work on the computer with headphones off so she knows you can hear her but are just choosing not to interact with her, and the most you say is “there’s a box over there for your stuff.” and idly point at a box and go back to work or surfing the net or whatever.

        Odds are pretty high that the freeze-out will frustrate her because she wants you to react (and you’ve set the precedent that that’s a possible outcome with your txting), and she’ll try to get your attention. Probably by bitching at you and getting in your face. If you can keep a non-reactive face like you don’t have a single fuck to give, she’ll see that that route isnt working and probably switch to “look I’m sorry it’s just that I hate when you’re so domineering and–” and try the apologetic “I love you but I want you to change a bit” route.

        This is where you can slowly warm up and not apologize for who you are or change, but couch it in stuff like “look, you knew who I was when you met me. If you want to date some spineless kid that lets you do whatever you want like a spoiled brat, go find one. I love you, and I like what we have together, but if its not enough for you then you shouldn’t be with me.” It’s a false ultimatum because you KNOW she isn’t going to choose going out and finding a gayer boyfriend…she doesn’t want a NEW one, she just wants her current one to change, is her thinking (and again this is all wrongful emotional thinking, if you changed she would lose attraction).

        Now from here you can go into Option 2, but you can do Option 2 from the start, I just put Option 1 first cause it can transition into 2, you’ll have to play it by ear:

        2) pick a verbal fight when she comes over to get her shit. Call her out hardcore, bitch her out, say everything you’ve wanted to say about what you think about this retarded fight, call her a drama queen, tell her you don’t need that shit in your life, bring up shit she’s done to piss you off, and just give her the works emotionally.

        But, as you guys are yelling at eachother, start to bring it toward “I hate that I fucking love you so much or I wouldn’t give a shit about any of this. I was going to just ignore you when you came over, like I would with any other stupid girl, but for some reason with you I can’t. Maybe I DO need you out of my life just so I can get you out of my fucking head!” where you’re actually making an SOI and making her feel like she’s the special one and she’s further along than any other girl has gotten with you etc etc.

        Then at an emotional peak, just grab her, pin her against the wall, and make out with her. Pretty solid odds from there that she’ll start ripping off your clothes and you guys’ll bang. So you can start this from a freeze-out where you wait for her to get you to react, or just launch into it full-out.

        Some notes:

        1) if she brings a friend to help her get her stuff, that’s a different situ. That means she’s serious and you should just play the freeze-out card and wait for her to txt you when she goes on some gay date with a spineless Nice Guy and misses your manly domineering shit.

        2) if she comes alone, she’s hoping to bang. Part of why she’ll likely come over to get your attention if you freeze her out is that she doesn’t REALLY want to move all her shit and find a new BF, that’s a lot of work lol

        3) never apologize for who you are or tell her you’ll change. Once you do that you’re setting a fuckton of bad precedents: you’re REWARDING this shitty behavior which means she’ll use it again in the future (maybe when you’re married and have a kid with her and are trapped), you’re giving her a metric to measure your progress by (“you SAID you weren’t going to be as domineering so either you let me buy this $500 purse or you’re a liar!!!”) which just gives her more ammo, and you’re changing behavior that she ultimately finds attractive or she wouldn’t be with you in the first place.

        4) a lot of the stuff you’ll say to her in the “pick a fight” stage sounds like what abusive men say to their victims. That whole “I hate that I care so much about you that you make me this mad” thing. There’s a reason girls go back to guys like that when they say shit like that. It’s not a real healthy dynamic, but it works.

        5) you might think “fuck, that’s what I have to do? I have to act like an abusive asshole? And pick a fight and do a passive-aggressive freeze-out like I’m a chick? Fuck, I just want things simple again”. Well you don’t have to do any of this, you can Next her and move on and she’ll probably txt you in a few weeks/months and you can get back together (but give NO ground, no agreement to changing yourself, at that point you have Hand so you dictate the terms).

        Unfortunately, because you didn’t do a proper Soft Next, your relationship is now a dramatic one. If you had kept your cool and done a Soft Next and trusted she’d come back, you would be showing her that you won’t be dragged into drama. But you let yourself get sucked into her drama and while she won’t necessarily lose attraction for you from that, she NOW has a reference experience that “if I cause enough drama, he’ll react. So if he’s not reacting I just have to cause even MORE drama until he does what he did before”.

        Think of it like bullies picking on a kid in school. If the kid is chill and doesn’t react, they’ll eventually think “okay he doesn’t play along this is boring” and stop and find someone who does react. But if on the last time they ever decide to bully him, he flips out and freaks out and they get the hilarious reaction they wanted, they will NEVER leave him alone because he’s just taught them that they just have to push him further to get him to react.

        At this point, realizing this and if you get back together, possibly experiencing it, you may have to make the decision of “is the amount of drama this relationship involves worth all this?” and you may decide to end things.

        But understand that while she instigated this, the end result comes more from how you handled it than anything going on in her head. When you’re face to face with a tiger, if you run away you trigger it’s instinctive “chase and kill the prey” program and it does that. Getting sucked into her drama triggers her “make more drama to get more reactions and attention and rewards” programming.

        That’s why picking a fight is a solid move, because you’re not rewarding her drama. If you said “I’ll change baby just come back”, that’s rewarding her.

        But if you put her thru emotional HELL, freezing her out, bitching her out, making her feel like the biggest piece of shit in the world and that you’re madder at her than you’ve ever been mad at anyone, that you absolutely fucking loathe her and she feels absolute dread and even fear of you, and hate and rage and disgust from you, that’s making her feel “pain

        Then you turn it into how you hate that you love her so much, that’s easing off that pain, and then the makeout and rough sex that follows is removing that pain. So in the end she was punished for her actions rather than rewarded and, if you made her feel shitty enough, she’s less likely to dare going down that road again with you because she never wants to feel that feeling again. That’s why sometimes you can flip out and it stops the behavior, because she wasn’t expecting a reaction when she poked the bear and instead it got up and tore the shit out of everything around her and stopped just short of killing her, so she stops poking it.

        Anyway hope some of this helped. If she’s already picked up her stuff, you may have to do this via txt messages which is harder but can be done and may progress into her calling you on the phone when the txts get too chaotic, and the second she wants to talk voice is the second you know you have Hand because she’s trying to sort shit out. That’s when you keep being mad a bit and then slowly turn around. The prob is you can’t instantly transition to fucking her like you can in person so you have to leave it a little unresolved and end the phone call without patching things up and wait for her to suggest meeting up for something. She’ll probably make up that she forgot her toothbrush or something lol

        Anyway hope it works out. A lot of people will tell you to just Next her but I’m assuming you want her back and don’t want to toss it away without trying something. This is my recommendation, but whether it works out or not, use this as a reference experience for why you Soft Next by the books…when you don’t, this is the drama you end up in. 🙂

        Like


      • Thanks. Good insights.

        Like


      • @Ya, she kept telling me: “I’m doing what you do disappear”….seems she’s angry and now trying to get back at me by breaking up just before a big event I’m organizing.

        I told her off and called her out for not coming out to a dinner I had organized. She snapped back “I’m not coming to anything”.

        Me: Ok. Immature princess.

        Next day she texted insisting she come over and pick up her stuff.

        All this is stuff she knows would piss me off or get to me.

        I think it would have ended this way one way or the other and she was looking for some event to hang this on and blame me.

        Not a healthy dynamic overall.

        I’m trying to understand what exactly is going on here. I’ve seen this before: Girl goes nuts, lashes out, threatens or does break up.

        I disappear.

        TIme passes, she comes back hurt, apologetic, or throwing herself at me.

        By that time I’m totally over it.

        Does this illustrate how illogically women act? They destroy or sabotage what they want out of anger or revenge, then suddenly fall into regret?

        That seems to be the general pattern.

        Like


      • She basically needs to know that you don’t need her.

        If she breaks up with you and you chase, she won’t come back because you need her. If you go silent, she feels like you don’t need her, so she comes back.

        Her logical and emotional brains are almost always in conflict.

        The fucked up part of it is that she will run it into the ground, to the negative outcome for both of you, just on instinct. She’ll try to beta you which will appease her logical brain but kill her attraction so she’ll leave you. Or she’ll try to test you until you get sick of it and Next her, which appeases her emotional brain (getting an emotional fix/reaction) but makes her logical brain sad.

        They have no idea they do this and it’s not malicious. But it’s pretty annoying when you’re not into drama.

        A Soft Next can last anywhere from 5 minutes to a few hours to a year+ depending on the situation…but trust that if you follow the psychology, she’ll come back eventually. Because even when she’s mad at you, you’re more alpha/attractive than the guy who would supplicate to her. She just doesn’t realize that until she’s not around you and/or is exposed to lame supplicative guys.

        It’s okay for her to feel negative emotions. She cried during The Notebook and was scared during Twilight. It’s fine and you’re not a bad person because she feels bad emotions…you are in the right and taking right action, it’s her that’s working herself up into an emotional mess. Be okay with her vanishing for a while, and trust that she’ll come back.

        Like


      • Thanks, just broke up with my current gf who claimed I was too “Autocratic and egotistical”.

        This is a shit-test and also kind of an affirmation.

        I had thought I’d been beta-backsliding. She sees me as too strong, constantly calling her out on her bullshit.

        Like


      • Don’t worry, he’s on my short list for inclusion. There’s a bunch of random infrastructure work that needs to be done before I pull in any more commenters.

        I also am making a chrome extension to let CH readers hide dumbass commenters. All the noise here is annoying.

        Like


      • Lumpy, what kind of work do you do day-to-day that allows you to create the archives and the chrome extension. It’s impressive as hell. Has anyone done anything similar?

        Like


  7. Is “feminist outrage” redundant? My, how they hate the idea of men actually wanting sex: http://www.salon.com/2013/10/07/georgia_tech_fraternity_creates_disgusting_guide_to_luring_your_rapebait/

    Like


    • the guide is so tame. whatever.

      what makes them ill is that they all fell for such a crude approach. no girls currently in college will hesitate to dive headlong into one of those parties. they can’t stand feeling left out.

      i was (re)watching the pickup artist and this married girl i made love to a while was so certain she would never fall for such ridiculous lines. i had to keep my mouth shut, mixed company and all. but women truly have zero ability to see themselves honestly.

      i know married girls fucking 5 (other) guys concurrently that call other (hotter) girls sluts and talk about how much they hate cheaters, ones like the one i mentioned above that think they’re ‘above’ being picked up but were picked up and hosed down by me in an evening, and endless girls that choose to be drunk enough to have plausible deniability when they hook up. the older i get the harder they are to spend time with aside from physically.

      Like


    • Was about to post this here. The Cathedral destruction of this email sender and his fraternity is already underway. A cursory Google search will support my previous sentence. (See the Deadspin piece if you want to punch a mangina writer).

      His sign-off (“In luring rapebait”) was too much, but everything else in it is how consensual hookups happen at any given bar/club/party on any given weekend.

      Like


    • on October 8, 2013 at 10:08 am Hugh G. Rection

      What is it with the lefty media and picking apart fraternity/sorority e-mails all the time?

      Like


    • If you’re a college girl, and you know things like this happen at certain parties, and you go to those certain parties anyway, your consent is given in the act of walking through the door. IE, the girls there want to be treated like this.

      Point is, the only right of protest women have against behavior like this is to not participate. Feminists need to stfu about frats.

      Like


      • Exactly. If this stuff didn’t work, they wouldn’t do it. Every college girl at a frat party knows the entire purpose of the party is to get girls drunk so it’s easier to have sex with them. If you go and get trashed, you’re going to get groped. It’s inevitable. It doesn’t make the guy a predator and it also doesn’t mean you’ll end up being raped. If you don’t like the atmosphere, leave.

        That rapebait signature is so obviously tongue in cheek. We had one frat at my school that served a grain alcohol drink at mixers called “date rape punch.” Just a reference to how strong it was. Maybe not in the best taste, but just a joke.

        No one forces the alcohol down a girl’s throat. By this author’s shrieking outrage, you’d think the email was a guide to roofies and chloroform.

        Like


      • on October 9, 2013 at 11:15 am alexandrahamilton87

        You’d think they were Cary Grant in North by Northwest, having bourbon forced down their throats. Well, no one has nice bourbon at frat parties, but the point stands.

        Like


    • This guide is a good look into the mindset of Naturals.

      Key positives:
      – approach all
      – don’t stand around in a chode crystal with your bros
      – venue change (from meet location to “pour a beer” location to dance floor)
      – create jealousy (ask her friends to dance) and tease/neg (“that’s no fun”) if she doesn’t comply
      – look for and pounce on any IOIs
      – escalate that night

      This’ll all lead to a good night.

      Key weaknesses:
      – reliance on alcohol
      – lack of comfort/rapport
      – kicking her out ASAP after a pickup that involved alcohol and little comfort/rapport

      This will tend to lead to a lot of LMR (which to an uncalibrated guy following peer pressure and unequipped to diffuse LMR in a positive way, can lead to a very bad rapey situation), likely followed by Buyer’s Remorse the next day which makes the girl feel slutty/used and regretting the night which even if she was into him in the moment, can very easily hamster rationalize (esp with the help of her friends) into a rape accusation.

      This’ll also result in more chicks hating the guy and just more drama and bad karma in general. Ya you can get laid even if she hates you afterward, but in the long-term you’re going to want to avoid having a bunch of drama in your life…esp if you end up in a career where having a bunch of chicks slandering you online or in person will be a detriment.

      How they could all tighten their game up:
      – build more comfort/rapport at the party, throw in a little 30 min cuddle & chat on a couch about life love and all her hopes & dreams
      – learn how to diffuse LMR in a positive way where she feels good about banging (agree & keep going, “go one step back then try again in 10 min, rinse and repeat”, Riker’s 3 Rules, Mystery freeze-outs, etc)
      – cuddle for a bit after banging, get to know her soul and all that, so she leaves feeling special instead of a piece of meat.

      Throwing her out sounds like a cooler story, and you can tell your frat bros that that’s what you did, but what’s not a cool story is a girl accusing you of rape because she regrets how slutty she felt on the walk of shame…what’s cooler than all of that is a fuckton of chicks banging on your door hoping for another fuck all semester long because they all feel special lol

      Naturals can get laid a lot, but their game has a lot of weaknesses when you really break it down. I wish I had known what I know now, back in school lol

      Like


      • Yep, I could have written something like this back in college. It is the “no game” way of getting girls. Just be a horny choad, hunt for someone interested, and bust a move as quickly as possible. But, it really only works with younger girls, they wise up after a while.

        And you’re absolutely about comfort & rapport: college is a lot of overlapping social circles, and if you hook up with someone, word will spread far and wide. Your gossip reviews need to be positive.

        Like


    • check out the author’s profile pic on her twitter lzozlzozlzolzozz

      Like


    • on October 8, 2013 at 5:01 pm leavesarefalling

      Are we sure this isn’t a send up of that sorority chick’s email from a few months ago. The one where she was telling her sisters how to behave at parties? It reads sort of like that.

      Like


  8. To be honest, my take on this is that she works for the beer company. They employ girls and guys to chat people up and hand out tokens for their products. Hence: ” haha so they all owe me beer”.

    Like


    • might be true, although he did have her number, and a chance, for a second. before she saw his looming betaness

      Like


  9. “Most men hit their *physical* sexual attractiveness peak in their mid 30s (as long as they don’t get soft and pudgy)”

    This may be true…but be careful…….women are nubile in their teens…….hear me young guys? Don’t waste these years. 35 year old guys don’t date high school girls are rarely 19-20 year old co-eds.

    Like


    • “35 year old guys don’t date high school girls are rarely 19-20 year old co-eds.” speak for yourself.

      with that attitude you absolutely never will.

      Like


  10. In retrospect he better play might have been to pretend to the girl that the gay friend was into him in a funny and playful manner. As in, “I think your friend really likes my ass . . .”

    Like


  11. See – THIS is the kind of post that drew me to CH. The best game analysis on the internet today.

    Hammering into my head post after post about how segregation is not productive to society, women hit a wall, and betas are everywhere are things I could give two shits about because I already know as much as I need to know.

    CH – do another one of those polls about what kind of posts people would like to see – I guarantee you these are the kind that hit.

    The fact that I’m this hyped about this post made me realize it must not come too often.

    Like


    • you are not, and never will be serious competition to a real practitioner in an expert system. but hey, cool stories right!

      i bet you can’t get over $45 K a year either right?

      Like


  12. on October 8, 2013 at 10:07 am CollegeSeduction

    As far as text game goes, I’m a bit confused on the topic. I find that when I follow the standard, give less, take longer to text them back than you, girls begin to reply less quickly and less enthusiastically, fairly often.

    However, when I throw the time rule aside, text back quickly about 2/3 of the time, and keep my messages short 1/2 time, while showing some interest, I can get girls replying almost instantly for pretty good stretches of time and investing much more in the conversation. I always listen to the don’t text them too often or too quickly (after getting their number) rule.

    I consider myself a pretty good looking guy (19 y.o.) and I’m gaming inside the greek system (I’m in a frat) and in my classes. My approach number isn’t large by any means, so I’m working on my text and escalation game, mostly, while increasing my social network.

    What could explain this phenomenon? Is there a possibility that my approach confidence and coolness is effective enough that girls need more interest cues from me before investing into the interaction?

    Like


    • “I can get girls replying almost instantly for pretty good stretches of time and investing much more in the conversation.”

      I think this is your problem. You don’t want to have conversations over text. Texting new chicks (especially in the beginning stages of seduction) can be tricky. You should be using these early texts strictly to set plans, not hold convos. Even if the girl is interested she does not want to be having long text exchanges, that’s for her girlfriends. If she initiates the text keep all replies short, playful, cocky, to the point. It is always better to text too little than too much. If there is ever a point where she does not text back do not send follow up texts.

      Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 10:38 am CollegeSeduction

        I’ll try that more consistently. I’ve been using different methods on different girls. The ones I limit conversation with until they meet me in person do seem to “hang out” with me much more quickly, and with less effort on my part.

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 10:56 am CollegeSeduction

        Though, if they’re qualifying themselves to me, via text, isn’t that productive? I’m usually quite busy with homework and studying, because of my heavy course load.. I simply don’t have the time to hang out with girls with a reasonable period of time. Is it plausible to get a number, send a few short texts occasionally, then get a hangout up to a few weeks after the initial meeting?

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 10:57 am CollegeSeduction

        Usually more than 3 weeks.

        Like


    • You’re in the Greek system so they assume you’re just trying to get whatever pussy you can like rapebait’s guide someone linked in these comments.

      So they basically assume you’re not really interested in them, specifically, you’re just a frat bro player trying to get laid.

      It’s not necessarily anything you’re doing specifically that causes this, it’s more that that’s the stereotype and even if they thought “but he seems DIFFERENT…” they probably have 3 GFs who’ve been burned by retarded frat boys who are telling them “trust me grrlfriend those guys just want pussy”

      As a result they want comfort/rapport from you to feel like you’re actually interested in them as individuals rather than just using them to rack up your notch count and high-five your Greek bros.

      So when you txt aloof, they’re getting confirmation that you aren’t really into them. When you txt more, they start thinking “he really DOES like ME”

      If you add some qualification to your game, you’ll slay shit. Check my archives for qualification but the jist is that you want to act like you aren’t sure about her, and give her some easy test to pass (“I dunno, sorority chicks usually just skate by on their looks…can you cook? I like a woman who can cook.”) where she can go “I love cooking!!” and you can qualify her and to “hmmm ok I’m impressed. You’re not like most sorority chicks I’ve met…we should hang out sometime.” If she doesn’t cook you go “lol see I knew it! you’re gonna be ordering dorm pizza and getting all fat on me. Do you work out?” and toss her another easy test to pass where she can go “omg fuck you yes I jog every day, I’ll never be fat!” and you can qualify her on that like “oh good. All my buddies’ GFs balloon up to 300lbs and I like to keep myself healthy so I need a girl who likes to sweat…we’ll work on our cardio together rrrrowr ;)”

      That kind of shit makes her feel like she, specifically her, has earned your interest and will make her invest a lot more because you made her work for it.

      Anyway, that’s what’s happening. I do a lot of fast attraction-based #-closes because my style of game involves a lot of Buying Temperature spiking so I have to do a lot of my comfort/rapport via txt so my txts are frequent and verbose and ignore pretty much all the standard txting rules. I think they’re still good for newbies tho, cause a newbie’s issue isn’t needing to build comfort, it’s needing to look like he’s actually been laid in the past 5 years lol

      Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 11:19 am CollegeSeduction

        Thanks for the advice! I’ll check out some stuff about qualification and try to start incorporating that into my game. Up to this point I’ve yet to include any of that stuff into my game.

        Like


      • Ya it’s not something guys do naturally until they’re getting laid a lot and they literally develop the mindset of “look I have a lot of bitches on the go, impress me and show me why I should make room in my schedule or bump one of them out for you, does your pussy shoot rainbows or what?” lol. Until that point, we usually come from the mindset of “I have to show HER why she should spend time on ME”

        So by incorporating qualification, you’re already by default giving out high-value signals that you have to be picky because you get a lot of girls, and you make the qualification easy enough for her to pass that she can pass it and instinctively WANTS to pass it. When you dangle a string or laser pointer for a cat, you don’t put it out of reach entirely, you put it juuust at the end of their reach where they pounce and get frustrated and then you finally let them have it and they’re in heaven. So you qualify them, but not on something too hard to pass.

        And you never qualify them just on looks cause everyone does that. Note that my 300lbs thing up above, I was qualifying on her workout ethic, not qualifying what she looks like. It’s a subtle difference but its important. “You know I don’t normally like dresses like that, but on you it looks hot, you always have such a sexy style” is 10000x better than “You look hot!”

        Good luck. You can get results just doing what you’re doing, but this’ll tighten your shit up a LOT and get girls chasing you and shit.

        Like


  13. Okay, so here’s a question for CH and commenters:

    Think back to when you were a teenager. How many teenage girls do you know who dated guys in their 20’s, much less their 30’s? And yet teenage girls are the most nubile ones around.

    Granted, a guy in his late 20’s or early 30’s may have more choice amongst women, since they typically can date women int heir 20’s and 30′,s, that young special age group is effectively off-limits for them. This means no cherry popping.

    [CH: Troll.]

    Like


    • No, you’re wrong. When I was eighteen I was in love with a guy who was 15 years older … And a few of my schoolmates in high school dated men in their thirties. I think girls grow up much faster and when we are teenagers we have nothing in common with boys our age, they are like children. Only now when I’m in late twenties I’m starting to like my peers.

      Like


    • Troll. Buuuuuuuuuuuut, girl’s under 21 typically don’t date older guys because they aren’t around them. Look at online dating sites, girls 18-20 all have a very narrow and young desired age range, then once they hit 21 and start going to bars and other adult venues and interacting with older men, their ranges suddenly change to things like 26-40 (for example) because they are no longer interested in men their own age.

      Like


      • Yep. Younger girls want to be with guys their friends approve of. And, dating at that age is much more about social access and entertainment than finding their future husband. I remember undergrads dating older cool dude graduate students, but the idea of a dating a businessman or someone with no campus cred would have been unacceptable.

        Like


      • But they do it on the low-down with professor types anyway. I have 3 college girls coming over all the time to cook me dinner etc in my college town. No, they won’t bring me to the student center holding hands and doing PDA, but I’m getting what the frat boys are getting. Also, it’s not popular on PUA blogs to admit it, but a ton of girls that age want a sugar daddy to give them some spending money to shore up what’s coming from the parents. We’re talking 50 to 100. Not much at all. Big rule is that you must pay for the cooking or cleaning she does or something that can be legitimately called a legal service. Never pay directly for intimacy. She’ll give you that to keep the situation going after she’s gotten comfortable with it. Even more important for an older man to know is to NEVER give money to a girl 18-21 as a no-strings-attached gift because you’ve become “friends”. She will only respect you if she has to get down on her knees and scrub the floor for the cash.

        Make no exceptions to this last rule. None. No matter how much you think she’s different. Never give money as a gift to a girl in that age range.

        Like


    • I dunno if it’s a troll or just a really dumb question, but I do remember a handful of girls at my high school dating older guys (“college boys” or whatever). I know for sure of a 17 year old dating a 25 year old guy. It’s not like the girls aren’t thinking about it. It’s that in most states IT’S FUCKING ILLEGAL and guys are (for the most part) smart enough to avoid the jail bait.

      Like


    • Well, they probably would date older if there was a non-calculated way to pull it off. I’m gonna let you in on a little secret, teen girls want cute, cuddly babies and they start wanting them at that age, (why do you think they babysit?) but thanks to feminism, it’s effectively been suppressed/denied. The best a teen girl can do is find a family-oriented, gb/la, fellow V and hardwire her current image into his still-developing brain via repeat exposure.
      Two close gf from hs(10s, one essentially super model looks) never bothered to marry or have kids (the one, i know, definitely wanted them) and it’ll soon be too late. And this was before feminism really had a stronghold at least in non-urban areas. The best they’ve managed is doting aunt, and if either had kids ( girls) they would have been gorgeous.

      Like


    • Teenage girls love older guys. There’s just no access to them that isn’t seen as perverted.

      A little bit of age is good on a man. It’s sexy. Like, 6-8 years older is good for an LTR, no real limit on anything less than that, depending on the guy.

      Like


    • And of course, nubiles fucking older men on the sly.

      Like


      • No strings attached, if found out yelling “I wuz being raped!”, otherwise deny, deny, deny fucking, that is.

        Like


    • At 31 I was dating a 17 year old. At 33 I could be dating another one (but after the first one I learned they are too unstable even for me xD) so I’m for the 21-23 range.

      Don’t tell me it can’t be done 😉

      Like


    • When I was 29 I dated a 19 year old. at 33 I was banging *multiple* 21 year olds.

      Like


    • LOL. I am 31 and just did my MBA at a European school and was regularly opened and given heavy IOIs by 20 and 21 year olds on campus and in the vicinity. Without having to exert much effort either.

      Like


  14. on October 8, 2013 at 10:30 am gunslingergregi

    dam lol met this chick yesterday on a online game
    I was just chattin with her
    she gave me number then I called talked for hour or so
    she texted asked if she could call today
    I said k
    bla bla bla
    I listen
    to her stories
    off the chain shit
    yea I know this type
    I tell her kiss me
    then put her finger in mouth and start suckin
    then proceed to talk the dirtiest phone sex in the history of the world
    beginning she fakin by the end
    she is screaming and shit and her mind is putty in my brain
    I like it
    I tell her drive down the 9 hours
    she is
    I say allright by
    assume sale

    Like


    • on October 8, 2013 at 10:33 am gunslingergregi

      bitched dropped phone like three times he he he
      I didn’t finish told her she had to come in person finish it up

      Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 10:37 am gunslingergregi

        omg I can be a sick sick bastard
        the shit I said I thought she hung up but just dropped phone in shock lol

        Like


    • on October 8, 2013 at 10:41 am The Burninator

      Stormwind chicks are easy, bro.

      Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 10:52 am gunslingergregi

        i know right lolzzzzzzz
        this like 4th one i’m rich in game though as always he he he
        hey no car
        but remember that post about how being good in game won’t get shit lol
        well ahh
        haven’t play in while started yesterday but there is something about this game that just seems to put bitches in the mood

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 11:03 am gunslingergregi

        she said did you here me say i love you wtf
        yea def punchin below my weight again lol
        wtf is going on seriously i don’t get it these bitches are psycho

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 1:08 pm gunslingergregi

        exchick laying down on my lap sleeping feeling like forest gump and shit
        dam the choices we make

        Like


      • on October 8, 2013 at 2:45 pm gunslingergregi

        yea comes over for comfort safe place cuddled up on my chest arms wrapped around my arm
        i guess we buds now i gave her comfort
        exchick going through some shit
        first time she ever really seemed vulnerable
        i fucking ruined her she is human now

        Like


  15. ”Not satisfied with human badboys, chicks are now getting their rocks off with extinct megapredator badboys. nymag.com/thecut/2013/10… 8 minutes ago”

    ahahaha 😀 ”taken by the t-rex”

    Like


  16. Finally CH, approves our FRs. yay 😀

    Like


  17. on October 8, 2013 at 12:09 pm thelatentsadist

    I love reader mailbag, always illuminating.

    Like


  18. On a slightly related note, see the story of the whore fucking square jawed alphaboy F. Gifford (lesser alphaboy as we later found out), while hubby J. Carson was bringing home the money. So that slutwife can rent the apartment to consume her tryst! Alpha fux, beta bux.

    As an aside, on the MSM webpages breaking out the news, the amount of blindness to the disparity in value between the two individuals (“he fucked around why couldn’t she?”) would be mindboggling, if not for the dose of reality courtesy of Mr. Heartiste and the remaining red-pill sphere.

    Like


  19. In a related note, somewhat sad alpha-fux, beta-bux story of betaboy JCarson, (lesser-)alphaboy FGifford, and the slut wife.

    Like


  20. on October 8, 2013 at 1:10 pm RappaccinisDaughter

    Oh, Heartiste and denizens of the Chateau! Do you want to LOL? Do you want to LOL hard? Do you want to ride around on your LOLlerskates all the way to your ROFLcopter?

    http://thisisthinprivilege.tumblr.com/

    No, it’s not a parody, although I don’t see how they’d write it any differently if it were.

    Like


    • Even better is this blog, run by a libtard Asian girl that summarizes a lot of that crap.

      wtfsocialjustice.tumblr.com

      It’s fascinating, from an anthropological sense. This shit’ll be primary source material in the universities of the future, marking the true beginning of the end of Western civilization.

      Like


  21. on October 8, 2013 at 1:13 pm RappaccinisDaughter

    I hope this doesn’t double-post. WordPress may have eaten my last one, or it might be in moderation for having a link.

    Strap on your LOLlerskates, kids, and let’s head down to the ROFLcopter!

    http://thisisthinprivilege.tumblr.com/

    Like


    • on October 9, 2013 at 11:28 am alexandrahamilton87

      “Thin privilege is not having to explain to a child that you are not having a baby when they ask.

      When I worked with children just over a year ago, I had been asked multiple times if I was pregnant. Do parents these days not teach their children that people come in all different shapes, sizes, colours, etc.?”

      That one made the ROFLcopter. Darn those kids, telling the truth!

      Like


  22. on October 8, 2013 at 1:43 pm Cad and Bounder

    I don’t understand this bit…

    “I told her there was a party later and she and her friend should come and I was going to hang around. (bad move right??).”

    Her friend is a gay guy. In my experience they are the worst cock-blockers on this earth. It’s a working assumption that you have to get him out of the picture because he is GOING to try and screw it up for you. And deep-down, she knows it too.

    Why on earth would anyone want to go on a date and invite her gay friend to come along??? The best approach was just to get the number, and text her for a date ALONE a few days later. Even she knows that.

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    • Why on earth would anyone want to go on a date and invite her gay friend to come along???

      Perhaps some dudes are into having a devil’s threesome.

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    • I think you’re exaggerating a bit. I’ve never found gay guys to be cock blocks. You just have to wait it out because, while the girl may be all over their gay friend, they know they’re not going to sleep with them and if you play it cool they will respect you more for it. I’ve had a few instances where I was with a gay guy and a girl and the gay guy got all the attention (typical flamboyant behavior) so I thought I had no shot, but at the end of the day the girl was actively asking to leave with me.

      In many cases the gay friend might be rooting for their friend to hook up, and building rapport with the gay friend who is more likely attracted to you than he is to her just helps to build your value.

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      • “In many cases the gay friend might be rooting for their friend to hook up, and building rapport with the gay friend who is more likely attracted to you than he is to her just helps to build your value.”

        Yep. Lots of gay dudes want their girls to get some dick. Secret Society shit. They just want it to happen while they still get to be the center of attention lol

        They ARE annoying in that they’ll longer for-fucking-ever without taking the hint from you or the girl to leave (remember they want to be the center of attention still) and often when you DO go with the girl they’ll shout cockblocks catty comments up the street at you two like “have fun sucking his COCK, SARAH!” which can kill the vibe and trigger her ASD if you react to it but you just laugh and play it off and tell her her friend is fucking funny and you’re good from there. And he’s mostly just doing that because he wants attention and the night isn’t ovee so if he cockblocks then he’ll have her attention…even tho he’d be happy for her to get laid.

        It’s like his need to be the center of attention overrides his wanting her to get laid, the same way her not wanting to look like a slut overrides her wanting to get laid.

        Befriend him but plan how to extract.

        http://www.bristollair.com/2008/inner-game/nature-reality/secret-society/

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      • on October 8, 2013 at 3:02 pm Cad and Bounder

        Tony/YaReally, this is all fine and worthy advice- if you are forced into this situation- but why willingly subject yourself to all this rigmarole?

        Instead, he could just try and set up a tete-a-tete date with her a few days later. It’s not good idea for guys to be setting up dates with girls, and then inviting a cockblocker along with them.

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      • Oh no I agree with that part completely lol. Just saying that if you get stuck in that situ (as can happen during cold approaching mixed sets), it’s not the end of the world.

        Isolation isolation isolation. If you don’t have enough comfort for her to allow you to isolate her on a one on one date, build more comfort via text or invite her and her friends out but have some friends of your own to distract them and help you isolate her, or at the very least have some kind of plan to kidnap her (I’ve snuck a girl out of a bar back to my place, having her turn her phone off so her brother and mom would stop calling and txting lol. After we banged there were like 25 voicemails waiting whoops). She loved it tho lol

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      • They just want it to happen while they still get to be the center of attention lol

        Fags mix the most annoying traits of men with the most annoying traits of women.

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      • tee hee hee

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  23. on October 8, 2013 at 5:23 pm gunslingergregi

    ok its just fucking funny anymore another chick telling people she preg with my kid
    if i had a dollar for every time i got some chick preggers i’d be rich at this point

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    • on October 8, 2013 at 5:34 pm gunslingergregi

      exchick said she would hold the cum in trying to get preg
      my legend is growing i don’t even have to fuck a bitch anymore
      guess i’m popular topic of conversation

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  24. A well known Russian leader (actually, he was from Soviet Georgia) once said, “Quantity has its own quality”. He meant that simply being in the habit of running lots of approachs will more or less always help a guy.
    1. You learn to get over the fear of rejection 2.You get lots of instant feed-back as to what works for you and what doesnt. 3. You will get lucky from time to time unless you fail with 1&2. 4.Knowing that you can get lucky kills the one-tizing. There is more to it, of course. But if you cannot find the juice within yourself to sustain a series of approachs you probably are not going to get very far with this. Something to think about.

    Of course the Ozcanoizm are largely a product of”deep” European history.Like 40,000 years deep.Sometimes you can sort out an emerging truth by notice-ing what is most scrupulously not-being talked about. Like the Germans knew for certain that the Allies were working on nuclur deviices the instant they ceased all Scientific Publications regarding such.

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  25. Damn I didn’t expect to be put on blast, but thanks for the help everyone (seriously)

    I chalk this one up to a loss… I texted her some fucked up shit other than slut and she said I was weird and never to text her again. lol Oh well no worries. I’m alright with crashing and burning, learning is the more important thing and taking it into action. I’m starting to realize my text game sucks. I’m one of those no Facebook, twitter, etc and it seems to hurt me in so me ways but oh well.

    Just gotta keep on going out, keep meeting people!

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  26. MAS
    Texting anything that causes a bang-able female to say “never again” is a great moment of advancement.
    Texting is like having stalkers. It cannot be avoided in this path, but the less the better.

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    • Yea I figure texting becomes more important once you get the lay, and establish a deep sense of report and value. As in you could be in a relationship with the woman but choose not to, i.e. establishing abundance.

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  27. on October 9, 2013 at 12:18 am Greatest Beta

    Tilikum,

    I got the book Narcissus and Goldmund. Already got thru the first third and loving it.

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    • I’m reading it on tilikum’s recommendation as well and fucking loving it. Hesse has a particularly deft way of describing fine shades of complex emotion.

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  28. Do they pay you enough to care what happens to their bloated, porcine selves?
    That is a question. Because if the honest and authentic answer is NO; then school is out. Hogs are running loose, and Nuns are legs-up for all cummers…

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  29. Who here frequents this blog and is MARRIED? that is what I want to know

    While I believe game is INTEGRAL to having healthy relationships and the principles also carry into many parts of life (not just romantic), I feel like this perceived reality is a negative one and anxiety/denial/depression are byproducts of this lifestyle. With a whole “who gives a fuck alpha” attitude, does anyone in here actually have a stable two-way relationship and it’s not so one-sided selfish all the time? I have adopted this attitude and by logical deduction I feel like I am mentally predisposed to not be in any committed relationship for a while. THis is coming from my end ; I don’t see why I shouldn’t be single. My past few relationships were just banging girls (from 2 to as long as 6 months) without even committing (and the girls are exclusive to me and I don’t give us the chance of being “officially” dating). Each time the girl put their foot down to “define the relationship” and I just said peace and bounced to another. I feeling like I am developing some commitment issues.

    I am 24 years old so I am still a young whippersnapper. but am I not committing because i’m aware of my age and my sexual capital in my “prime” or am I not committing because of some deeper issue? Why have I not felt any sort of true “pair bond” since my first relationship where I let the walls down and became a loving devoted beta BF? How can you be a devoted, monogamous alpha… I don’t see it.

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    • on October 9, 2013 at 9:45 am Greatest Beta

      Your concerns are the same as mine. If fear crossing the “point of no return” as well. I still have strong capacity for “oneitis” feelings which I would call genuine romance and intimacy. Unlike the PUAs I struggle banging a girl I have no emotional connection with. It’s kinda gross to me. Up until I was 24 I didn’t care meat was meat but then I started to change. Probably my own “clock” hinting at me that play time needs to come to an end.

      One thing is for sure if you want true intimacy it requires letting the walls down and making yourself vulnerable. In order to feel true intimacy u must allow yourself to feel pain. Game should ALWAYS be deployed whether in the context of a bang, FWB, LTR or even marriage but the laws do hurt us by putting us in a weakened position.

      What has been seen cannot be unseen. This is a powerful maxim to live by. The more married and girls that have BFs that you bang the harder it will be to trust women this is why I try avoid these situations. I once pried a girl away from her bf and I could never trust her. No matter what I reasoned she lied to him during the 8 week transition period why wouldn’t she lie to me?

      The days are indeed hedonistic and society feral so if you DO decide to enter LTR and have true feelings of intimacy and love you must screen carefully. I have dated girls that didn’t care for the parties and clubs and thought that baking a cake and inviting friends over was more fun they going to Create on Gower. Catch my drift?

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  30. on October 9, 2013 at 6:10 am Holden Caulfield

    More bad news for beta providers:

    A 25-year study released in the Journal of Family Issues, found that women were more likely to get divorced when they earned 60% or more of the family’s income.

    However, its good news for alpha cads ; -)

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  31. Me- ” hit me up if you want to come to the party”
    her- “ok for sure”.

    Never heard from her.

    Then she just told him no the female way.

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  32. And as far as a woman complimenting…they don’t really care that you have nice eyes…only what you can do for them.

    I also laugh at women that they’ve devalued themselves so much that only saying stuff like slut, whore, or any other ramped up insult is the only way a guy can make an impression on her…while other guys that say stuff that isn’t as harsh doesn’t register anything. Congrats ladies..you brought this reality on yourselves.

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  33. I’m in my 40s decent, shape and married. While I don’t cheat I do use game in my line of work where most of my coworkers are women. At a recent event a 20 something came up, out of the blue, and said “you have very beautiful eyes.” My reply, “I like them too, I’ve had them all my life.” My friend chuckled as she processed this. “I don’t like my eyes” says she. I said, “Why they fit you fine.” Another blank stare.

    The flirt kept coming back with little shit tests and I kept having fun. When she asked if we could go some place more private I said I’ll text my wife and we’ll all meet up. At that she said sorry didn’t know I was married (I have a nice wedding band on all the time) and left.

    My friend was laughing his ass off. Called me a dirty old man. Well yeah the wife loves it.

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  34. @ Ivan thumbs up. You are a real alpha…

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  35. Talking about that one word-replie-thing, there is one question i have. Is it also possible to use a more ‘complex’ structured text like “Café (…) again? Common girl try something new. We are going ….”. So this wouldnt only suggest female contact, it would proof it!?!
    (Hope you understand my grammar) thanks

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  36. Men can sustain their *attitudinal* sexual attractiveness well past their 30s and into late middle age.

    Far beyond that if you can keep “attitude”. I had mine burned in from running for 3 years with an outlaw MC gang.

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