Update On The Stripper Pickup Attempt

In this post I asked where I went wrong.  Some of you got the right answer (and some of you — feministx, omw — were wide of the mark).

While I can’t go back in time and tap the neural network of the stripper I tried to bang to find out what she was thinking, I have a pretty good idea where I dropped the ball. Those who said I waited too long to leave the strip club and join her at the after hours bar were correct. When I arrived, she was sitting there looking annoyed.

G Manifesto, Challenge, and Chuck had excellent tactical suggestions (don’t order beer, offer a different venue to meet her, dress in custom tailored suit, etc.) but the game killer was the overplay of my aloof and indifferent hand. The Big Mo’ was lost.

Maxim #84: Respect the momentum.


  1. interesting. hmm. live and learn.

    any tips on how to tell where the momentum is going? sometimes a happy medium is the hardest to maintain.


  2. “Roissy Maxim #84: Respect the momentum”

    Aloof Game is really solid especially in the beginning of a swoop. It helps set the stage and gets you on strong footing.

    But there really are times when you have to step on the gas.

    If you have blood in the water (ie girls that want to swoop you) go for the kill.

    I play almost every night with almost every girl like its my last.

    (Exception would be a girl with Money, Breeding, Intelligence, Class and rare Beauty. But let’s face it, how rare are those in America?)

    If a girl is on the ropes, and last call is around the corner, go for The KO.

    – MPM


  3. Finally….now i’m about 1 for 5 on these things.


  4. On one hand, part of the problem sounded like feminine disregard for time. Did she announce at what point she was leaving or was her indication that she was leaving soon some sort of general, let me change, talk on phone, do a line, etc. and then I’ll go to the bar thing? If so, how could you know?

    OTH, I think the big mo killer was R’s attempt at DHV by sitting in a grotty strip club “for a few beers,” making him a chump customer.


  5. i thought it was that her state and energy totally fell, which is a consequence of waiting too long, ina way. so the question is how long should you have waited – 5 mins? 10? 20?


  6. Interesting to note that the worst advice on how to pick up Exotic Dancers was given by girls.

    The worst source of swooping girls advice: Other Girls. Particularly civilian girls.

    If you want knowledge on how to swoop Exotics you need to ask someone who does it consistently week in week out.

    Like your humble author.

    If there was some sort of International Governing Body that tracked Exotic Dancer swoops I wouldn’t be surprised if I was #1 ranked.

    – MPM


  7. maurice

    “so the question is how long should you have waited – 5 mins? 10? 20?”

    The ideal time to get there would have been right after she ordered and paid for her drink.

    – MPM


  8. She’s still yours if she’s worth the effort. Despite being mainstay beta strategy, persistence is also a mark of an alpha who pursues what he desires. It’s a sad lament of the beta-turned-PUA who gives up his desire to pursue the next available option.

    Meanwhile, I expect 1 free Roissy advice coupon, to be redeemed only when I have failed myself and most need the slap in the face that only the brutal truth can provide.


  9. Roissy finally you delivered.

    I asked for a post on game, women, and roissy maxims, and here you go fulfilling your duties as a humble host.


  10. Roissy Maxim #84: Respect the momentum.

    I think this may be the most important maxim once rapport has been established.

    We’ve all had those nights with a woman where everything seems amazing. Momentum is gathering steam. Everything’s going as planned. You get whatever you’re after, her phone number, a peck on the cheek, anal. But there’s always the hangover effect. such a night creates high expectations for future encounters.

    There are two aspects to momentum. You can either overshoot it or underestimate it. In the stripper’s case, Roissy underestimated the power of momentum. If timing was precise, he could have swooped, G manifesto-like, right into her panties, but the momentum subsided.

    It’s like in a basketball game. If you watch basketball very often, you know that teams go on “runs”. A team can rope off 10, 15 straight points, but then they start getting careless. They start taking deep 3 pointers because they get too carried away. One of the biggest momentum killers is a poorly executed play. Many times, the tide of the game can turn back to the other team.


  11. Not sure ’twas a solitary offense that made the hole vanish – I wasn’t there to observe NVC.

    Perhaps that delay acted in concert with meeting her at the time and place she designated to form a triumvirate of fail.

    Happens to everyone.


  12. roissy:

    also, wrt momentum…i’ve long noticed that i go on runs of several weeks or so at a time where i’m money with women. chicks at work will hit on me, make comments, flirt, what have you. of course your confidence goes through the roof during these times.

    otoh, there are times that are the complete opposite. you feel a little less confident and women don’t react in those same ways. you can flirt with a chick, but her response isn’t all that accomodating. as i’ve gotten older i’ve started learning that i have to capitalize on the momentum and resign myself to riding out the bad times.

    for me, this momentum cycle seems to last for about 2 months before it is broken. i can often tell when a new cycle is about to begin because a chick i work with or that i know will make a flattering comment. i’m not sure if my confidence increases and i perceive things differently or what…

    just wondering if anyone has any similar thoughts on this?


  13. Chuck

    “just wondering if anyone has any similar thoughts on this?”


    The key is staying in that zone.

    Game and swooping girls ebbs and flows much like a mighty river.

    The best way to get your Game back if you have lost a step: Work out.

    Haircuts and new custom suits help as well.

    Or a change of city.

    – MPM


  14. So,are you all saying Roissy should have gone right over to the bar next-door?Wouldnt that have appeared “needy?”


  15. Chuck:

    Definitely! Girls can smell the stank of rival pussy and it drives them nuts… and we all know what a crippling dry spell can feel like.

    The real mystery is the moment that things perk up… that first comment from the co-worker, or that first little smile from the girl on the train. Suddenly you’re money again. But what IS that? Bottle that stuff and cash in your millions!


  16. The less discussed portion in Roissy’s scenario was that the doorman came over and whispered something in her ear and she subsquently got up and left. This could indicate that she was banging the doorman and maybe using Roissy as a prop to make him jealous, no?


  17. as I said, I think the biggest problem is not knowing how to judge the momentum.

    Any tips, roissy? Or G? Heck, anyone. Its perhaps the most subtle point here.


  18. I pretty much have nothing else to add except smoke something like a nice camacho cigar or a zino classic(premium selection).

    I am sure the G manifesto can give you a run down of cigars appropriate for such a venue.


  19. There is a bit of over analysis going on here. Sometimes things just don’t work the way we desire. Learn but don’t over analyze


  20. Oh yes, i am sure the G manifesto will disagree, but i find the G man’s whole idea of “putting the entire place on lockdown” a bit expensive.

    I know, i know, what you are going to say: it is a matter of bankroll. I am a trader too, maybe not as successful as you(i am still in my twenties, damnit). But still, I want bargain, i want the pussy while spending as little, as close to nothing as possible.


  21. I always smoke. Nothing in particular, just whatever I feel like – women don’t know jack shit about cigars. Last time it was a CAO Mx2 and a Partagas.

    One could take a Montecristo to reference it’s being a “premier” smoke to dhv, but then, you’d have to actually smoke it. Only ones I like were the Platinum.

    If you really wanna get stripper/club slut attention, start puffing on a cool-looking, $900 Dunhill pipe.


  22. I agree with you, [email protected]:43p.m., but my criteria for a cigar in a stripclub will be–

    Something that have nice, rich aroma–that has the serious potential of getting attention from a random layperson to ask “that smells rich, what kind of cigar is that?” “what are you smoking?…. i like the aroma” “. You know, something that gets attention.

    Which, like you say, will allow you to dhv. hell, if you can tell a uniquely fascinating, short/snappy story about the cigar in 3 to 5 minutes, the more the merrier.

    I am not sure about pipe. i am in my twenties…smoking pipe in a strip club by somebody of my age will look too “put on” by me. I will look as if i am trying too hard to look important. Maybe if i am in my late thirties. Or, it could be that i just need to really be better with pipe in such a venue.

    Has the G manifesto ever smoked pipe in strip club?


  23. About smoking in a strip club. They recently banned all smoking in bars in Maryland recently. Including strip bars.

    The vast majority of the dancers were greatly pleased by this ban. The dancers hated the smoke, they hated to smell like smoke when they went home. Their hair would stink. Some had asthmatic problems and had to use inhalers while working. Their throats would be sore. Some guys would smoke in the private rooms, pissing everybody off. This included smoking dancers as well. They prefer a non-smoking atmosphere , too. Most people who smoke and drive blow the smoke out the window of their car.

    Banning smoking didn’t see to hurt the bar business, and has made going to all bars, not just strip bars, much more enjoyable.

    So, I find it hard to see how smoking would attract any dancer but a nicotine addict. Is that the point? Why not try wearing a silly hat or shirt. Eg. logo: Rich and Dumb. That would probably attract a dancer just as well. After all, they want to sit with customers, and will use anything for an ice breaker.

    BTW, about that 2nd hand smoke stuff. When I was much younger, we used to see about 10% of lung cancer patients who never smoked. Now, I can’t recall the last time I saw a lung cancer patient who doesn’t smoke or wasn’t a previous smoker. Just hasn’t happened in years in my experience, and I see several new lung cancers a week in my business. So, I think 2nd hand smoke is something to avoid.

    Of course, smoking is sheer madness. But, to each his own.


  24. lurker

    “Any tips, roissy? Or G? Heck, anyone. Its perhaps the most subtle point here.”

    That is an interesting point. I wrote about it a while ago: Components of a Magical Night

    Master Dogen

    “But what IS that? Bottle that stuff and cash in your millions!”

    I guess it would be called “Swagger”.

    The closest thing to a product that can give you that is a really good clean E-Tab from Amsterdam.

    Darth Maul

    “I am sure the G manifesto can give you a run down of cigars appropriate for such a venue.”

    I agree with Firepower. It really doesn’t matter. I think it can also be smooth to just have an unlit cigar. I knew an old school G that always did this.

    I have tried it as well in some unsuccessful bids to stop smoking when I was younger (now I don’t even bother, the pros of smoking outweight the cons).

    “Has the G manifesto ever smoked pipe in strip club?”

    No, but it could work for certain cats I am guessing. Maybe some artist on the Picasso tip.

    “Oh yes, i am sure the G manifesto will disagree, but i find the G man’s whole idea of “putting the entire place on lockdown” a bit expensive.”

    There are lots of ways to “lockdown” a spot. Money is one. Personality and charisma are another.

    – MPM


  25. @G Manifesto

    I’m a chick and I got the answer right…we get it right sometimes. All weigh in on the time he should have waited. 10 Minutes max. He shouldn’t directly follow her, let her get settled at the bar, she can pay for her own drink. Then before she starts to think about her worth (yes women do), he arrives and her mind shuts/snaps off. Well the over-analyzing part anyway and he’s offfff!


  26. joel

    “The vast majority of the dancers were greatly pleased by this ban.”

    That is what the anti-smoking moral pushing nazi’s would like you to believe. 9 out of 10 dancers smoke.

    “Banning smoking didn’t see to hurt the bar business, and has made going to all bars, not just strip bars, much more enjoyable.”

    This whole “smoking didn’t hurt the business” thing is bs that they bring out every time. It comes from the time NYC claimed that the smoking ban didn’t hurt biz. What they fail to tell you is the ban happened around the time NYC was recovering from 9-11. So biz when up. Unrelated to the smoking ban. Bottom line, people go out way less with smoking not being allowed.

    “So, I find it hard to see how smoking would attract any dancer but a nicotine addict.”

    Again, 9 out of 10 dancers smoke.

    “BTW, about that 2nd hand smoke stuff.”

    Inconclusive studies on 2nd hand smoke.

    “Of course, smoking is sheer madness. But, to each his own.”

    George Burns said it best:

    Is it true that you smoke eight to ten cigars a day?
    That’s true.
    Is it true that you drink five martinis a day?
    That’s true.
    Is it true that you still surround yourself with beautiful young women?
    That’s true.
    What does your doctor say about all of this?
    My doctor is dead.

    – MPM


  27. princess leia, what works at your man-whore bars does not work with the ladies.

    Stick with the banana clubs, girl.


  28. who is princess leia?


  29. I think #84 might be the first maxim that stood out personally for me.

    I remember I was well on the way to success with this cute little redhead, but the venue change was interrupted by a drunk and angry friend (see: girl I hooked up with regularly then dropped), which ruined momentum and made me look sleazy, no doubt.

    Momentum has never been disrespected since.


  30. You know what. Fuck it. I done here.

    Since you just keep blocking my stuff.

    You can keep your dog lurker boy.

    End of post.

    C’est la vie.


  31. when you have a situation when some idiot insults you, and when you reply with the owner block your post and subsequently erase it because of favoritism. it is like fighting with both of your hands tied behind your back.

    not my cup of tea.


  32. nice meeting all of you.

    not posting anymore.

    it has been a pleasure. i had fun.

    i just dont enjoy people insulting me and then not being able to insult back because the owner keep erasing my posts.


  33. “chicks respond to the hungryman”

    janka knows

    but of course; so should you.


  34. A propos of nothing but maybe raw meat for some of you:

    The rowdy and aggressive new styles in bridal fashions


  35. My first take on this problem is one I will maintain: When dealing with drug-people most explanations for puzzling behavior do not need to go past the question – what drugs are they taking?
    Was this stripper a drug person? How do you want to bet???


  36. Nickie is a gut shot feral hog held up/head down by meat hooks dreading, dreading, the entry of the knife…


  37. The “Nickie” post was deleted very soon after I responded to it with a burst of violent poetry.


  38. just curious about something… guys seem to prize a successful stripper pick up more than the average pick up. is this because of the challenge involved (i.e., that she’s being hit on by every guy there so it takes ridiculous levels of game to break the shell and get the win)?

    also, i don’t personally know any strippers, but just by virtue of their chosen profession i would think many are used up sluts. why go after them? am i totally wrong, and are these girls actually more reserved and prudish than average? and don’t they all have mental issues?

    aside from the fact that – assuming it’s a good club – the girls are really hot (hell, even i like getting lap dances from hot women and watching them dance around on stage), i’m not sure what the attraction to strippers is for any interaction outside the club.


  39. You took something so obvious and turned it into a Roissy Maxim. I’d be pissed too if I was waiting for someone for 30 minutes, wherever and for whatever reason it was!


  40. on June 5, 2009 at 2:10 am a modest mouse

    Forget this “momentum” crap, just don’t disrespect anybody by making them wait 30 minutes for you and then expect them to be happy to see you.


  41. I don’t get the stripper thing either DB. Shrug.


  42. db:

    it’s *completely* because the stripper has a multitude of available options. she seemingly has the pick of the litter, in that club at least. any guy who can rise above the fray has displayed social dominance.


  43. Whiskey, db, its about the challenge and hotness. The girls in a strip club are focused on money and using you, making you think they like you as a person—and every guy is trying to get them to focus on them. To swoop them, to steal G’s terms, makes a powerful case that you are alpha. Plus they fuck wildly.

    G, can I ask a personal question? What does MPM stand for, when you sign off?


  44. on June 5, 2009 at 6:27 am You Know I'm Right

    On race-mixing – http://www.toqonline.com/2009/06/race-mixing/

    “Why is Hollywood portraying white Alpha males pursuing and even marrying black women? Because they want the Beta males, the Gamma males, and everybody else down to the Omega males, to follow them down the path to white racial extinction.

    The people who create these movies–the writers, the producers, the casting directors–are not artists. They are abortionists. They are aborting the whole future of the white race. And they are not doing it by accident. We know this, because so many of them are Jews, who are constantly reminded from birth that marrying out leads to extinction for them, and that goes for us too. (The fact that many of these Jews marry out does not change the moral meaning of what they promote.)”


  45. @Michael Blowhard

    Interesting note from the article: “And today’s wife-to-be is hiring photographers for what are called “boudoir shoots,” where they pose Maxim magazine-style in lingerie or nothing at all and give the prints to their grooms—a trend that Bratten says began about three years ago. “It’s the ultimate display of freedom and empowerment,” says Bee-Bee Kim, the founder of Weddingbee.com, a wedding-planning site that gets more than a million unique visitors a month.”

    Not particularly about this example but why does a feminist model of freedom and empowerment seem to be anything where a woman is naked and/or unfaithful?


  46. @Anonymous

    The maxim transcends the example.


  47. Darth Maul

    I am not sure about pipe. i am in my twenties…smoking pipe in a strip club by somebody of my age will look too “put on” by me. I will look as if i am trying too hard to look important. Maybe if i am in my late thirties. Or, it could be that i just need to really be better with pipe in such a venue.

    Don’t split – I’ll presume our munificent host blocked all flame threads so discussion could grow elsewhere unimpeded, while attention could likewise be drawn elsewhere than that LR thread.

    I don’t see any of ‘lurker’s’ posts either, so it appears mutual.

    Cigars with intriguing aromas are Partagas Black and Graycliff Crystal. They both have shiny gold impressed on the bands to catch the attention of easily amused bitches. I’m always astonished how women really are like fish. Or children. Shiny baubles and patience.

    I once gave an annoying “tough as nails” stripper stereotype a puff off my Camacho Corojo to shut her up – she practically turned green – and when the nausea wave passed, she cooed with admiration at my selection. Whenever I’m in a Vodka mood, I smoke those; when in Bourbon mode – Camacho Triple Maduro.

    The aroma preferred by one stripper will be as unique as the perfume scent she selects to slather all over her lithe body; everyone has a scent preference. I focus on what I like and want to smoke, for any cigar smoke is good enough for a woman.

    I suppose being older than you excuses me from any accusations of affectation a pipe may produce. Just choose a style like a Prince or a Canadian and avoid the stereotypical Billiard.

    The smokehouse aroma of a fine English Blend will be unlike anything you’ve ever sniffed. To the opposite, the baking cookies smell of American Cavendish [like Captain Black] will be appealingly familiar. Some of the vintage tinned blends from the 1970’s can approach hundreds of dollars a tin. Just the dhv to disclose to a mercenary dancer.

    Have a smoke, swoop a dancer and be cool.


  48. on June 5, 2009 at 10:10 am Dr. Grzlickson

    Guessing G suggested the custom suit?


  49. lurker

    “G, can I ask a personal question? What does MPM stand for, when you sign off?”

    My name.

    Dr. Grzlickson

    “Guessing G suggested the custom suit?”

    Most likely.

    – MPM


  50. My experience is about 50% or less of strippers smoke. You can tell a smoker from a non-smoker stripper real fast in a private room. The smoker always tires out in about 15 minutes, no matter how young they are. The non-smokers keep up, no matter their age.

    Trust me on this last point. Of course, if you smoke, too, you won’t notice how tired she is because you’ll be tired yourself.

    Now, tell me this. Is the popular bias true that girls with tattoos are sluts? I gots to know.

    BTW, the reason why scoring with a stripper has status is because the stripper is considered a public sex object, lusted after by many men, who demands payment for her favors. Getting her favors for free is a sign of high male status.


  51. they gotta know/think you’ve dated dancers before. this is stripper crack and the ultimate validation in their eyes. pure and simple. i stumbled across my first one in college, unknowing as i was an innocent young lad. since then i’ve dated 3 more. half of it is aloof, half is them asking why you don’t tip, or haven’t tipped them….you casually mention your ex who used to dance at xyz…..zoom. close the deal later on. you cannot feel like a customer or you are instantly in the other group of dudes ala the way women who aren’t dancers view the male world of betas/below and alphas.