Why Don’t Fathers Teach Their Sons Well?

How many of the men reading this have fathers who give (or gave) them realtalk about women? How many had heart to hearts with Pops about what women really desire in men? Reader Zombie Shane writes:

I have a theory about “The Natural”.

It’s kinda the White Peoples’ version of Amy Chua and the Tiger Mom phenomenon.

And here’s the theory: I think that some Dads CHEAT and teach their sons all the secrets at a very young age.

Kinda like what Adam Carolla and Jimmy Kimmel used to do with that fat obnoxious kid on The Man Show.

Can you imagine how much more poontang you would have scored in the early years if your Dad had taught you the forbidden secrets?

But instead your Dad forces you to be self-taught and to learn all the lessons for yourself.

Yeah, long-term, it’s a much better character-building exercise to absorb all the “hard knocks”, and to learn from experience, but wow, can you imagine if you had had the “White-Peoples-Amy-Chua-Dad” in, say, Middle School?

Being an 8th-Grader and hitting on all that fine-assed perky young just-barely-pubescent poontang?

Shit damn, man, shit damn.

Actually, on second thought [thinking about all that jailbait tail], maybe I should thank my Dad for keeping me out of prison [or at least out of Reform School] at that age…

The fact that you had a dad around to raise you is a leading indicator he is a beta male who himself didn’t know the secrets to women. That’s my theory for why more fathers don’t teach their sons the truth about women: they don’t know it themselves!

Not that there’s anything wrong with having a beta male for a father. If you like civilization you can thank beta male fathers.

Another theory that perhaps explains why so many fathers neglect their duty to impart the lessons of love to their sons is that they feel embarrassed talking about these topics. Even the most cold-blooded womanizers would squirm a little when the time came for them to teach what they’ve learned to their sons. And it’s easy to understand why: when you know women inside and out, you can’t help but be aware of their unsavory natures. Any talk with your son is going to necessarily implicate his mother.

Finally, there are some fathers who are so alpha that they actually view their sons as competition. To them, revealing the secret of snatch is like fraternizing with the enemy. These aging Lotharios wistfully long for the days when pubescent poose clung to them like dryer lint. In some dark recess of their minds, they harbor an envy for their sons which motivates them to conceal their knowledge.

Ultimately, though, I think the best explanations for the dearth of fatherly wisdom regarding female nature is that there are too few fathers experienced in the ways of women to know what to teach, and there are too many fathers protective of their children’s mothers who fear the risk that dangerous knowledge would tarnish by association the esteem with which the children hold their mothers (and sisters).

There is also the theory — and I throw this out here for completeness — that fathers are somehow genetically or psychologically predisposed to encourage their sons to attain resources and status to win the attentions of high value women, and that this mitigates against them teaching their sons the dark arts of seduction which would enable them to short circuit the laborious process that is the conventional method for attracting women.

As regards the origin of Naturals, the greatest influence on them is likely to have been their peers rather than their fathers. Or, if they have been influenced by their fathers, to have been influenced *despite* their fathers’ reticence to share their wisdom. I suspect Naturals benefit from three advantages, in varying degrees of imprint, that most men don’t have:

1. Fathers and friends who teach them the effective (note: I did not say morally righteous) alpha attitude through their own behavior with women.

2. Favorable genetic traits in whatever ratio, which may include sociopathy, narcissism, lack of empathy, mesomorphy, good looks, high sociosexuality, intelligence, artistry, humor.

3. Fortuitous successful early encounters with girls that set the budding Naturals on a path of alluring self-assurance.

So… if your father was an unapologetic cheater, you see vaginas in every Rorschach test, and you got your first knob job at the ripe age of seven, chances are good you are a Natural with women. Chances are also good you would not be able to teach other men what you know, because you only know it intuitively.





Comments


  1. My dad told me nothing about women. Not. A. Damned. Thing. It was a long, hard slog through two dud marriages, several girlfriends until at age 45 (or so), I finally figured it out. As I have no kids and no nephews, I really can’t share my accumulated wisdom with younger, male family members. Suckage.

    Liked by 1 person


    • on December 12, 2012 at 3:03 pm Hugh G. Rection

      Just imagine that maybe your blog helped a few guys…

      Like


      • Yeah but he is not propagating his own genes or those of his close family.
        It doesn’t matter rationally but the hindbrain knows that it sucks.

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    • Ditto. My father told me nothing about women, because (and it saddens me to realize this) he’s a hard-working beta provider that always defers to Mother. I learned a lot from Dad about cars and construction and appliance repair and such by watching him but he really didn’t tell me much of anything at all. So what I learned about treating women I learned from watching Dad and his contemporaries.

      And as a result I told my 21-year-old son nothing about women because I was also a hard-working beta provider that always deferred to his Mother.

      I’m working hard to amend this deficiency in my parenting. Among other things, I’m even now working on a “letter to my 21-year-old son” similar to one recently posted at Man For The Ages and another to my 19-year-old daughter modeled on one that got a lot of attention over at Shining Pearls of Something a while back. Just because you don’t find the red pill until your late forties doesn’t mean it’s too late, for you or your kids.

      Liked by 1 person


    • on December 13, 2012 at 1:11 pm Great Books For Men GreatBooksForMen GBFM (TM) GB4M (TM) GR8BOOKS4MEN (TM) lzozozozozlzo (TM)

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      womenz were taught to follow genensisnsi geneisnsi
      and honor their husbandz and love and sevre thim
      before teh ebenrkekeifieirs bernekeified womenz
      and doesuled themz
      in sectriev tapings of buttehxt

      and too many menz were to tsupid and weak
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      which all tech of natural, exalted, man;s rigight RIGTST
      and teh true nature of womenz zlzlzl

      while showing just how dioshonorable the buttcocking liars who beebrnekifiy future wives and deosul them in steeceterly taped buttehxting seessions, and lie abou their hiegts, as women fawn over the sodoomitesz and publish, promote, and praise them,

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      turn toward your true fatherz
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      Like


    • My husband can’t really get away with saying nothing. My son is six – SIX! – and girls are already after him. He dances, which drives the little ponytail crowd wild. He had a fifth grade girl hold him down and kiss him, so my husband has been coaching him about how to deflect the little ladies without necessarily hurting their feelings.

      I have no idea what I think about all of that. Jesus. Girls are so damn aggressive. In GRADE ONE! It’s pretty crazy. A Dad who doesn’t step up and offer some explanations is going to be in for a world of shock when his son is a teenager.

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      • My daughter is soon to turn six and she told me today she wants to have a boyfriend when she gets older. She asked if that was okay. I told her she could when she was sixteen but that she’s too young right now. The kicker was that after she agreed to that she made sure I knew she didn’t mean so and so because he was too little. Yes, constant vigilance!

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      • Oh good- Bernanke’s being butthexed already.
        JB – Does any of this surprise you?
        I guess many of you either don’t remember what childhood was ACTUALLY like or you’re doing your level best to repress the memory.
        Girls start their ‘sexual awakening’ around 5.
        I know, it’s not very Li’l House on the frickin’ Prairie Disney cute, but still true.
        At that age, mopst normal boys still think girls are useless and have cooties. Except for mom, provided she knows how to cook and how to fix a skinned knee.
        Dancing’s got shit to do with it.

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  2. The fact that you had a dad around to raise you is a leading indicator he is a beta male who himself didn’t know the secrets to women. That’s my theory for why more fathers don’t teach their sons the truth about women: they don’t know it themselves!

    One of the dumbest statements ever offered on this estimable sight. It smacks of feminine retro-rationalization for their short-sighted choices, redefining whole types to fit the just-so stories of their lives.

    Matt

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    • on December 12, 2012 at 4:20 pm The Man Who Was . . .

      I have sent Heartiste evidence that women used to go for, and end up loving, beta male husbands. You didn’t need to be an alpha in the past, so most men weren’t. That has all been swept away.

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      • I personally think that beta males in the past were more alpha than they are today, simply because liberalism shifts men (and women) more toward the omega end of the spectrum.

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      • This is a complex issue.
        What I think happens is that feminization attempts effects different types of men in different ways.
        The men that already have a natural biological slant towards more feminine thinking patterns and general outlook will fare much better under the new paradigm. You ever see videos of men that write the articles for magazines or other mainstream media. What is the recurring theme between these men? They seem to naturally slant towards the feminine. So under the fem-centric paradigm, these men are not co-opted under a total unnatural strain. They are able to assert themselves and function in a successful manner. These guys are also the ones that are able to have decent looking women, even though they come across as prissy intellectuals because it comes across as geninue and they are able to achieve success despite the suffogating air of the feminine impertative.
        Now look at your average AFC. Think of a guy that watches football, drinks beer, plays video games, etc. Supplicates to his wife or girlfriend. He is the one that suffers the most from the feminist propaganda machine. His natural state goes to the masculine yet he is brainwashed into not using his masculine traits and these traits wither away from atrophy. This is the type that gets beat down by the system while in previous time he would have thrived. Maybe not a pussy slaying machine but attractive enough to a decent amount in the biological sense. This is also the same pool of men that are more likely once taking the red pill to say “It was so easy. I just took the red pill and them bam, success skyrocketed with chicks”.
        Now you get to the guy that is simply just awkward and nerdy in any era. He is straight up fucked without the red pill. In a previous time, he would get a plain jane and they would have children and he would make a meager wage to provide. Now it’s japanese anime, porn, video games, emotional eating, basically a living death. Feminsim wants to end such men, they don’t even make the grade for being ‘a beta bucks’ type.
        Then you have the naturals in this day in age. Here’s the issue with the naturals today. They seem to be a genetic outliner with flaws. How many real complete naturals do you guys know? I can’t think of any. The ones in the upper SES seem to be total sociopaths or actual ‘douchebags’, I’m not speaking the hater sense but these men are simply fucking dicks at every waking moment of their lifes. The naturals from the lower SES seem to be fucking idiots, they might be naturals but they often times have unappealing low class mannerisms, behaviors, and customs.
        If you really think about it the red pill man is the only male in a broad sense that has the ability to become complete. They usually are in the middle SES or above, so they have an understanding of class issues and have some type of real skill and intelligence. The women that has changed the dymanic of so many men in America can be dealt with Game and the correct alpha mentality. This allows the red pill man to have a more real understanding of reality in general which will spark better behaviors and policies for that man’s life.
        That’s my hope for the coming future. That men can become complete again. I envision a future where instead of all the guys watching James Bond and thinking ‘Wow, that guy is awesome. But he’s a relic and I could never aspire to be like”, they actually try achieve to become their own personal James Bond complete with masculine attitude, chrisma, style and overall demeanor. The red pill, Game and such make it possible to correct these imbalances.

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      • Great post. I would only add that the feminine-thinking men you talk about seem to be exactly what we understand as SWPLs, while the more masculine, average AFCs are your typical provider beta Republicans who fail every shit test liberals and women throw at them. Yup, without the red pill, anybody who’s not a wealthy SWPL or a natural is effed.

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    • It ain’t dumb if it’s true.

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    • The joke is on you, Matt!

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    • Why is it dumb? Relatively few men are red pill.

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      • It’s dumb that he continues to equate PUA with alpha, assuming that the apex homo sapiens sapiens is so consumed with collecting sterile vaginal friction that the very act of fathering a child is proof to him of beta.

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      • Not fathering. Raising…

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      • I think the same logic applies, probably moreso.

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      • Bingo. It’s alpha to father as many as possible at a reasonable cost that doesn’t prevent further endeavors.

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      • Siring is not fathering. Fathering is raising. Otherwise your ultimate legacy is omega. Leave a boy to be brought up by the beta mop-up crew, and your line devolves into social offal into extinction.

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      • I agree with you. I have two kids and I love spending time with them. Based on my feelings towards my kids, and my father’s enjoyment with his kids, I’m reasonably certain that it is an innate characteristics that males love their children. Perhaps not as much or not the same as the natural mother, but I don’t believe its a socialized trait. I feel some sort of positive neurological reaction just in seeing their faces. And of course that makes evolutionary sense: the kids whose dad stuck around are going to receive more resources and nurturing, and will be taught important survival information. I would be shocked if science were to someday determine that men are hard-wired to knock females up and then disregard their offspring.

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      • “the beta mop-up crew” – fantastic!

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      • You’ve got a point, but you’re also so does Heartiste. I would say “Alpha” males are much much more likely to not raise a child they fathered than a “Beta” male, simply by virtue of them have many more (appealing) options in life. Especially in recent times, and in older times if the alpha male stuck around and raised his child, he would be more likely to father a child with another women who he wouldn’t end up raising as well.

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    • Not only that Heartiste, but I think you left out the generational issue?

      If your dad married “June Cleaver” or “Doris Day” or Edith Bunker; what would he need to tell you about women other than what you observed in your mom?

      He didn’t suffer harlets, cunts and bitches… because women used to know how to act right; or else…

      This is one reason I like watching old movies.

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    • @ Matthew King (King A) — mixing it up a bit I see….no more “King A (Matthew King)?

      Anyway it’s “site” not “sight”….

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    • EXACTLY what I thought too when I read that. CH has made many great “predictions” and his analysis of social norms is usually spot on. But I have to take issue with his inference that sticking around to raise a family is beta.

      That. Is. So. Dead. Wrong.

      CH, this is for you: Isn’t patriarchy alpha? Aren’t societies created by alpha men? What happens when “alphas” don’t raise their youngs? You get a ghetto-type society run by screeching women… which is not sustainable.

      Men who leave their children..are not alphas… they are parasites.

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      • Don’t forget that CH also said that the beta male is essentially the bedrock of civilization…in this case I don’t think it’s used in a pejorative sense it’s just a matter of distinguishing between the male who desires to build a family and the male who desires to go for all or nothing.

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      • There actually is a middle ground where the father shows up every two weeks or month or so or when he’s in-country. He becomes the idol of the child and provides. He just doesn’t provide stealth alimony making life too easy for the mother. That last part is not part of the MO of an alpha.

        Patriarchy is only alpha if the patriarch can discretely have mistresses. Otherwise you’ve just defined a matriarchy.

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      • Well I guess an Alpha guy would need a legitimate son for inheritance purposes, and then a bunch of bastards for alpha creds…..

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      • Technically true.
        BUT: We have about 50,000 Billion Single Moms(TM) at this point, ages 14-55 , which makes one wonder if there are ANY men in America who are actually raising their own biological children.

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    • CH has a point here. A man who has the ability to have 20 kids by sleeping around, but instead chooses to have only 3 because he settled down is an idiot from mother natures perspective. Of course this is simply not good for society which is why us humans look down on such men, but mother nature will never care what we think. Those who pass on their genes the most win.

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      • John, in reality for humans, it was an advantage to the race to have an Alpha stick around and raise his progeny, as therewas a greater chance of his genes surviving. Fucking/impregnating/leaving had a high rate of gene loss.

        Nowadays with thegovernment taking care of these bastards, the Alpha can father many and the rate of his gene pool surviving, even without his physical presence is great.

        But is it moral?

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      • In order for that to work though you need a large percentage of uber betas willing to raise the alphas sons. Which come to think of it, we do have in this society, if you consider how many families have step kids…..

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      • John
        Those who pass on their genes the most win.
        ———————–

        Win what?

        a trash heap?

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      • Exactly.

        If you want to see the end results of the “play and spray” method of reproduction and child rearing, visit Detroit.

        We have civilization because our male ancestors figured it was best to concentrate their resources and time on a few children they were reasonably certain belonged to them. Civilized men, Alpha or not, care for their wives and legitimate children.

        Of course, even the most civilized cultures still allowed men to take mistresses, however the mistress and bastard children weren’t entitled to anything, making their lives precarious at best. It was much more secure to be the wife of a Beta, then the mistress of an Alpha.

        Western culture screwed this up and we’re unraveling quickly.

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      • The man who fathers 20 children in a harsh, highly selective environment such as Northern Europe and doesn’t stick around to ensure their survival is the genetic “idiot” compared to the man who fathers 3 and gives them their best chance of survival via his constant vigilance and guidance.

        Single moms don’t fare too well against cave bears and they sure as shit can’t kill and drag back a reindeer over several miles to keep the tribe alive for the winter. K selection (maximal parental investment) is the only reason you are alive today.

        However, since we live in an era of widespread technology, abundant resources (at least for now), and virtually non existent environmental selection pressures, we are seeing a lot more R selection strategies even in formerly heavily K selected groups. Even if a more R selected strategy “works” in modern society, it still has dire consequences for civilization and culture.

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    • The dumbness is a secondary effect of our different understanding of alpha. Long ago, the PUAcracy inserted their personal preferences into the term and began conflating alpha with alpha-mimicry. Ever since, there has been an imprecision of terms, and with CH’s assertion that fathers per se have beta tendencies, he’s just taking his erroneous definition to its conclusion.

      Simplified: CH doesn’t want children, therefore his definition of alpha cannot have room children, or he must consider the possibility he does not define alpha.

      All that said, CH has a point remarking upon the betaization of the average man since the dawn of feminism, which by sheer numbers made it more likely more children would have betas for dads. There are more of them than ever. But that is an uncontroversial statement. What’s controversial is incorporating that phenomenon into the definition of fatherhood itself.

      Fathering is actually not that complicated or that hard. It is not about nurturing or attention or fawning. It is about protecting and providing. Most fathers qua fathers do not see their children much, if he’s being a father. But the feminist translation of classic terms into vehicles for their propaganda has since redefined “fathering” into mothering by dudes.

      Cooing, doting, cossetting, feeding, kissing boo-boos, changing diapers, and, ugh, assisting in the birth process: not fatherhood. “We’re pregnant!” Ugh ugh ugh. Used to be men weren’t allowed anywhere near midwifery. The pacing in the waiting room, buying cigars, waiting for word from the matriarchs who preserved the mystery of the strictly-feminine ritual. And why not? We don’t teach boys how to take care of their period either. Now half-a-fag dads are huffing and puffing as “co-partners” in their “wives” Lamaze classes and being sad, goofy fifth wheels “filming the magic” in the delivery room.

      The father is supposed to be the more distant presence, more in the background during early development. “Just wait until your father gets home!” He is the head of household, the final authority, not the caretaker or sympathizer. He doesn’t burp the baby, change the poopie diaper, or breastfeed the kid from his manboobs. He builds and sustains the domicile and leads it as a unit among the vicissitudes of the outer-world.

      To imagine an alpha can’t hold court in his own castle, delegate responsibility as needed, and otherwise slay dragons to put food on the table, is to unwittingly perpetuate the feminist understanding of “fatherhood,” which will be easily mistaken for betadom.

      Matt

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  3. I got the nutcrushing feminist talk from my mom, and then later real talk from pops. Full story:

    http://delicioustacos.com/2012/04/07/talk-to-your-kids-about-sex/

    “This was precisely what I needed to hear. When you are in a desert of female interest you begin to think you are a hideous unfuckable mutant and will remain a virgin forever. You are not thinking about how to hurt, break the heart of, or rape a woman. You are thinking about the problem of even getting a woman to notice you. You can’t even get into a situation where you are alone in a room with a woman and rape or heartbreak might occur.”

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  4. I do the Big Brother program and give my Little real advice I wish I had gotten from my brother or father. Gotta give back, man.

    Looking back, my old man was/is a natural and what pre-game basic skills I had come from just having him as role model. That guy owns a room, knows everybody in town, teasingly flirts with every waitress, tour guide, clerk, etc. he comes into contact with (in front of my mother (who was engaged and he gamed away way back when calling off an engagement was still shocking)), etc.

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  5. “The fact that you had a dad around to raise you is a leading indicator he is a beta male who himself didn’t know the secrets to women.”

    You have said something so reductive that I feel I must step in to defend my father’s honor. My mom was a 9.5 (maybe a 9 because she wasn’t tall and leggy), and my dad married her when she was 20 and he was 31. My dad was a drill sergeant in the national guard and is a millionaire many times over from owning and operating his own company. There has -never- been a question of who sets the frame in my family. My dad is in charge and my mom is quite happy with that. To this day, she remains remarkably youthful, feminine and content in a way that career women can only gaze into the abyss of the November Vogue and wonder about. True, he’s been so “beta” as to live within conservative social mores and not remain a poon-chasing manboy into his middle-age.

    I suppose that’s no match for the “alpha” pump and dump behavior of your average animalistic thug.

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    • In the interest of full disclosure, my dad had to learn about hypergamy the hard way. His first marriage, which lasted about a year, ended when the flighty, no doubt liberated woman ran off with a much older guy who served in a superior work role to my dad. Fortunately, that was annulled and he was not “raped” by the state over it.

      My dad also benefited from a rather “alpha” father of his own (outgoing, business owner, played lead sax in a band on the side, yes, a bit of a womanizer).

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    • I don’t think Heartiste said there were no exceptions, simply that Alpha males are less likely to stick around, which I’d agree with.

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  6. Not teaching about women is the least of these fathers’ problems. Frankly, it would be irrelevant whether they did teach that shit or not if they just produced self-confident and masculine young men. Instead they produce narcissistic (in the thelastpsychiatrist’s sense of the word, not this blog’s horribly misguiding “egotism”), self-loathing, effeminate manchildren. I was one. It’s not fun. And “game” can’t save somebody with those problems.

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  7. My dad was both the stereotype ‘patriarchal’ come home from work, expect dinner at table, kick off shoes and watch tv, rinse repeat.

    He was also completely out of me and my brothers life. He was also subservient to his mother and not sticking up for his family. He left my mom to do all the raising. My brother being the elder got to escape the smothering grasp of my mother. He got to experience freedom to grow. Me being the baby was coddled and over protected. My beta death warrant was sealed then and there.

    I love my dad, but i know he fucked up raising me. I love my mom, she sacrificed so much for me and my brother, and i know she did what she had to because no one was going to do it for her, but she helped craft me into a white knight mangina. Probably was not her intent, but the dysfunction of our family put me in a position to always protect my mom (women) from the threats coming from my pussified father at the behest of his evil mother.

    We are all products of our environment.

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    • I have a similar story, but what I take from the whole situation is that it has led me to this blog and game in general, where I have learned the theory as well as a systemized way of attracting women. Now, although I still don’t get pussy (because I am not ploughing the field), I feel I know far better than my alpha friends, who seem to sometime work so hard to get pussy.

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  8. Context error, dude: the things many Dads teach is what *worked* forty years ago when they were coming up. Check your own comments section, they’re full of examples of the older set not getting it b/c of the huge changes that have happened in the late 20c.

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    • Yup, being a good beta provider 50 years ago got you a decent looking woman.
      That’s why Indian men are the some of the worst betas the world has ever seen. In India, the only damn thing that matters in getting hot women is job, money and class. That’s it. Game is not necessary in the least. So their fathers only concern for there sons is education and getting that great job.
      Thus when the Indians come to America, so follows the great plague of creepiness for these people. Indian men are the world heavyweight champions of the entire world of creepy beta game.

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      • I heard theire dicks are jet black. eeewww~!

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      • The thing is though that asian men that learn to be social savvy with game are stone cold players.
        When your culture is clawing at you to be the perfect beta, you have to be quite the mighty warrior to claw through all the horrible muck and shit to the rarified air of getting skinny pussy in America.
        Plus the Indian man with Game sticks out due to his uniqueness and can use such novelity to score above his station.

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      • I wonder if there’s a correlation between betatude and lack of women. India, China, and Korea have a lack of women due to rampant sex-selective abortion. The United States has a lack of (fuckable) women due to obesity.

        The thing is though that asian men that learn to be social savvy with game are stone cold players.

        Game helps any man: black, brown, white, yerrow.

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      • on December 12, 2012 at 3:35 pm Customer Service

        I think the reason why brown players are stone cold is the same reason short players are stone cold… because they need to be. From what I’ve seen brown guys and short guys have it bad when it comes to stereotypes… so the ones that succeed have tighter game.

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      • Indian culture is also very sentimental which adds to the beta-ness.

        As an aside: No other country is as racist / class obsessed as these people (who, before we came there, used to wipe their arse with one hand and eat with the other.)

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      • Indian culture is also very sentimental which adds to the beta-ness.

        This would also appear to be true for Eastern European culture, but so do Latins, and their men appear to be able to pull this off better, primarily because they seem to have more of a cocky prick attitude (like Silvio Berlusconi).

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      • Yeah, I knew an Indian guy or two who followed this model: dress like GQ (cheaply, if you can) and act friendly-aloof–and fight the accent (it doesn’t play well with US girls). And hit upscale bars. Most girls assume an Indian guy at a bar is a doctor/lawyer/business type, so if he’s dressed well and sounding too FOB, they’re DTF.

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      • If that’s a college bar, many of the girls are DTF anything that isn’t White.

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      • @Wolfie65:

        Not so; they are DTF a brotha or Puerto Rican, and then deny it later.

        “Good” minorities—i.e. chinky-dinkys, gooks, Dehliheads, etc.—aren’t “sexy” because they don’t beat women.

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      • “Good” minorities—i.e. chinky-dinkys, gooks, Dehliheads, etc.—aren’t “sexy” because they don’t beat women.

        That’s actually not true — they’re horribly misogynistic and China has the highest female suicide rate on the planet because of it — but regardless, they do usually come off as more beta than white guys.

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      • Dear troll, Why do you care if my dick is purple or black? There is no way I am going to let it inside your mouth. However, I do admit I can see it sliding in and out of your mother’s a-hole.
        *GQ Indian*

        Like


      • Actually, job, money and class are not mutually exclusive with game. Except these constitute a fraction of game. Because of female hypergamy, the core of game teaches the man to be higher status than the woman. Job, money and class are effective in helping to create higher status, but these alone, without the other ingredients of game, leads the man to become a beta provider.

        Like


      • Ok let’s examine a key word here in my post ‘India’.

        In INDIA, Game means nothing in the macro sense.

        Job, Money and Class in INDIA is everything. Hence why they are the creepiest motherfuckers the world has ever seen when they set foot in the West and attempt any interaction with women.

        Like


      • India’s first game show. Mystery meets keys to the VIP:
        http://www.youtube.com/show/superstud

        Like


    • on December 12, 2012 at 4:23 pm The Man Who Was . . .

      Yes, being a beta provider used to work.

      Like


      • It’s also due to a serious testosterone deficiency. Creepy betas usually have the soft pallour of oestrogen + lack of outdoor activity

        Like


      • But beta providers had to have been more alpha. Your own father (who probably actually helped raise you), your buds at the bar, your co-workers, even your church, all encouraged you to be a man. Yes, they may have discouraged sleeping around, but at least you were supposed to be in charge in your own home, and the laws backed you up if your wife went loco on you.

        Like


  9. Unless your dad is a bitter, divorce raped guy posting on the Spearhead.com, there is a good chance that he doesn’t actually understand game or the post-feminist, marriage 2.0 environment.

    In his day, women were kept under control by civilization, so the pedestalizing, beta provider, nice guy, just be yourself strategy was all it took to get a decent marriage.

    Since the fathers were ignorant, it wasn’t really possible for them to teach their sons well. That said, even bad advice would have been better than nothing.

    Like


    • made me think of Milhouse’s dad after he got divorced and had to live in Bachelorville Apartments (10 days since last suicide). Basically, what could he tell his kid, he never had a chance.

      Like


    • I think this is a lot of it. Particularly small towns were somewhat insulated from the rapid changes post-feminism.

      Like


    • on December 12, 2012 at 3:17 pm Hugh G. Rection

      That just put a smile on my face. She created that hell for herself. Put a bunch of women with not a lot to do together in an office and drama ensues. Now imagine them all PMSing at the same time.

      Like


      • That article is a gold mine. My favorite part:

        “The effect a lack of testosterone was having in our office was even more apparent when I temporarily hired two male directors to work on a series (camera operators are usually men because of the heavy equipment). The team suddenly became quieter, more hard-working and less bitchy – partly because they were too busy flirting.

        Two girls openly went after one director, even though he had a live-in girlfriend – his partner didn’t stand a chance against their relentless flirting, and was dumped when one of them won his affections.

        When we had meetings with men, staff turned ferocious, each out to prove that they were the sexiest in the room. With a male commissioner at Channel 4, one employee said ‘Watch this!’, then stuck her hand down her bra and tweaked her nipples. The man and I were speechless.

        In this climate, I didn’t dare employ any men because of the distraction and – even worse! – catfights they created. I hate how much that sounds like stereotyping, but I’m afraid it’s what I found to be true.

        And while I stand by my initial reason for excluding male employees – because they have an easy ride in TV – if I were to do it again, I’d definitely employ men. In fact, I’d probably employ only men.

        Making close to half a million in our first year should have meant profit, but this was wiped out by high salaries and accounting errors by staff. Then, when we began having cash-flow problems, Sarah signed herself off sick with stress for a month. She also confessed she’d been dodging calls from people who were due payment, thus ruining my firm’s reputation.”

        I’ll certainly look forward to her attempt to create an all-male company. I doubt that’s even legal (unlike, of course, her all-female company), but maybe if a woman does it, it’s okay…

        Like


      • Noticed atleast two seperate home improvement related companies broadcasting on their trucks about been women owned. Since women control the household expenditures, it’s not too tacky to claim it so Wifey will be more incline to support Team Vag. Surprisingly both trucks were operated by men who i assumed are fetching materials for the projects actual been built women.

        Like


      • Every honest woman I know (wife, sister, etc) admits that a room full of female workers is terrible.

        There was an open position at my wife’s office recently, and she and her female coworkers began bracing for drama when a post-wall 50-year-old ex-sorority girl came flouncing in for an interview. Every reaction was the same — oh shit, don’t let that bitch in this office. They didn’t even give her the benefit of the doubt.

        All women, even the ones who don’t LIKE drama, get sucked into its gaping maw when “all the other girls” start doing it.

        Like


      • Nope, as announced today we shall have QE until the chance of butthex on a first date is 94.5% or until the entire population is bernankified. lolzlzlzlz.

        Like


      • Buy gold, silver, guns, and ammo. And food and water. And gas.

        Fuck.

        Like


      • ‘Hoarding’ gas is a fool’s game.All they have to do is quit making 1 tiny li’l part for your car and all your gas is useless toxic waste.

        Like


      • Gas generators can power houses, and even if a single car doesn’t work, you can barter for one that does—or parts.

        Gas is also useful as a fire starter and Molotov cocktail.

        Gas is an efficient fuel source that can last, if treated properly.

        Survival experts recommend saving gas if you can store it properly.

        Like


  10. My dad is the biggest beta on the globe, borderline omega. Told me I should wait for marriage. He didn’t have a girlfriend before my mom (he met her in his early thirties). Dad does this weird thing where he admits to being really bad with women while simultaneously giving me advice (bullshit advice like you need to respect women if you want them to like you and always be a gentlemen and a nice person and all that horseshit) about women.

    I use to get angry at him for all of the ridiculous, and ultimately destructive lessons he taught me, but the older I get I just fell bad for him.

    Like


    • The thing is, is he happy? If he is happy, fair enough. The only problem is his advice is not working for you.

      Like


  11. I love my father for everything he did to raise me–the time, devotion, love, and true care. He did the absolute best with what he knew.

    It is in this one area though, that I wish things were different. He married the first woman who took a liking to him. He follows every rule, dots every “i” and crosses every “t.” He’s never taken a risk in his life.

    At least I have learned what not to do.

    Like


  12. My dad was born on another planet: NYC cerca 1932. He was the natural who also was aware of why he was that way. He owned every room he stepped into.He told the Black Panthers to go to hell in the 1960’s, had women throwing themselves at him constantly, and married my mom in 1974 was 22 was twenty years younger than he was to the month. He ran my house with a firm unshakeable hand. His frame never lacked, even when the IRS hauled him off to jail. You are dead wrong on that point. Part of being a man is accepting responsibility. He did.

    He passed away three years ago this past July. My mom has told me quite recently to head off any man trying to proposition her. Her exact words were: there will never be another man in my life. Isn’t that what you say women are satisfied with? One night with an alpha can sustain them for years? My mom had thirty years with him.

    My dad didn’t teach me everything about women, like he didn’t teach mr about quite a few things, because I needed to learn it for myself. He didn’t stop me from buying a shitbox for my first car because I needed to learn that lesson myself. He taught me that women desire strength in a man, that when she reaches out for you, she wants to feel rock, not oatmeal. He taught me that a man is in charge of his wife and his house. He taught me that women crave confident, powerful men. He told me to date more than one woman at a time. He told me a lot more, but I was too young and dumb to listen.

    “When I left home at sixteen, my father was an idiot. When I returned home five years later, it was amazing how much he had learned.”

    –Mark Twain

    Like


  13. Told them to ignore the nihilism, libertinism and porn but absorb the lessons regarding the nature of women. They are bombarded with nihilism, libertinism and porn in all media regardless, so the dose of truth and context provided by CH makes it more than worth it. I don’t ever want my boys to be anyone’s fool or slave. I fear I may spoil them with the knowledge dropped by CH, but it will spare them a great amount of frustration and heartbreak in life. Their lives will be hard enough. Destroying pretty lies can otherwise take a lifetime of experience. CH’s indulgence of commenters like Matthew King greatly enriches the volume of wisdom provided here.

    Like


  14. Here’s a great start to talking to your son about this sh!t.

    http://dannyfrom504.wordpress.com/detinennui32s-advice/

    Like


  15. The MMA fighter Matt Brown is pretty alpha, and by alpha I mean the good alpha (good at building stuff & beating up neggers (not a typo), reticent, manly, stoic, self-reliant, good at picking up pussy, non-peacocking). When he was on The Ulitmate Fighter one of his teammates noted he didn’t say much but when he did, it was usually pretty manly. He’s one of the few fighters who does not shave his chest (when did this become the norm, btw)?

    Anyway, I was always curious what his background was:

    http://mmajunkie.com/news/2010/08/despite-fatherhood-and-time-away-ufc-on-fox-5s-matt-brown-still-a-tough-guy

    and:

    http://sports.yahoo.com/news/mma–matt-brown-becomes-elite-mma-fighter-after-surviving-near-fatal-overdose-063249298.html

    “His father owned a machine shop and Matt worked in it as a machinist.
    “I’d worked there since I was a little kid,” he said. “By the time I was 15, I was doing things that people with four years of college education weren’t able to do.”

    That’s a natural right there.

    Like


  16. Alpha Mum married an Alpha Dad (Alphas in their prime and present, although arguably mum’s value is low, old age and all). They have been together for 26+ years. Dad had a couple affairs, the newest/latest one was with a girl that was a year older than me (I am in my early mid twenties) and he was in his early 50s. Broke my mom’s heart even though she stayed with him. I think he loves my mom in his own way, would never leave her, as I type this, my dad would never eat a home meal unless it was prepared by my mom (not counting restaurants).

    I resent my dad for his affairs. I swore I would never date an Alpha (never knew the terms alpha/beta then, but recognized the ‘dark triad’ traits). Now I am dating an Alpha (how I found this site) for about 6 mths + and while it is the happiest I have felt, it is also panning out to be the most confusing. It is quite difficult to not have control (I have mild OCD so like controlling in general) and wrestle with esteem/jealousy issues you never had before etc.

    My brother was the opposite of my dad. In high school he was so low beta, it was embarassing. He had the looks and got nice allowances, but, he wanted the kind of sappy love he saw in movies; the constant pining over a girl, writing love poems and listening to cheesy love songs etc. Getting the girls was never the problem, but his whole intense love thing scared them FAST. Forward to college when he played varsity football in a small football town where varsity athletes ran the show. Girls were all over him like white on rice, he loved the attention, will sleep with as much as he could handle but if he met a girl who he fancied, he would revert back to his creepy intense love beta ways. So the girls he wanted he could never secure long term and the ones he could care less about would not stop bugging him.

    Even though I detest my dad’s actions, having a dad like him made me smarter (until now…ugh) and significantly reduced my sexual milleage. If I had a son, I would want him to be exactly like the Alpha I am dating and thanks to finding this site, he will never be “confused” about women. Yes, I will be THAT mom.

    Like


    • Another problem with alpha-dads is that you resent them. You may misread his attitude and drive yourself towards female pedalisation and oneitis because you are rebelling against his world view. In my dad’s old age, I just enjoy it for what it is. He takes no shit, has ultimate unshakeable confidence, and doesn’t give a fuck. Things that I used to hate.

      Like


    • If a man must stray after having children, then discretion is even more important. A father can be a legend to his children if he does things right, but image and perception play a huge role. I think that this is the idealistic fantasy of fatherhood, subject to our individual prejudices, that all fathers strive for. Its all about passing your thoughts and experiences onto a genetic copy of yourself. Parents are human too.

      Like


  17. P.J. O’Rourke had a line, that there’s the day that comes in a boy’s life when his dad turns to him and says, “if it float, fucks, or flies, rent it.”

    Like


  18. Whether they’re Alpha or beta, some dads split so the only influence a male child has is his mother, siblings, and friends. Just pointing out the absence of a father prohibits his teaching to his son, but if he was around, would he have is the question?

    Like


  19. My old man was a good-looking, wide-open, cheating, drinking carouser. Never held a job for very long (until he got in the bar business – that suited him just fine). Never met an attractive woman he didn’t put into play. Of course, he’d play the fat ugly ones, too, if he needed something from them – just wouldn’t bed them. Like a previous poster’s dad – he owned any room he was in. And he was a fucking asshole. Women loved him.

    As a youngster, I swore I’d never be like him – I was gonna be a nice guy. Around 16 y.o., I had been laid maybe 3 times. Til then, I didn’t realize how easy it was to attract women. I felt something was missing in my life and basically said “Fuck what they think – I’m horny”, and unconsciously became my father. I had unknowingly been groomed by dear old dad all my life.

    Having recently discovered CH, I have been trying to figure where I fit in the socio-sexual hierarchy, and had pretty much placed myself as a lower-alpha, although my Dark Triad scores indicate I should be incarcerated. (and I have been a few times, for a few hours, til I posted bail).

    Not sure where this “Natural” thing falls in the hierarchy (or if it does at all), but it fits me much better. It is honestly something I do not consciously realize I’m doing. It just comes, well – naturally.

    I can say from experience, however, it doesn’t help in long term, committed relationships: ie. marriage. I’m in my second marriage and once again find myself in trouble for doing what I do best. It’s a curse, I tell you, nothing but a curse.

    Like


  20. My dad told me everything. I chose not to believe him. I learned my lesson. 🙂

    “Never live in a womans world, you are king, they are here to delight in your mystery.”

    Like


  21. interesting, but ALL of the “naturals” i know [especially the non white ones] were gaming their single parent moms long before they were gaming fresh ass.

    I’ve also notice and witnessed with my own eyes, that nothing teaches a guy the ins and outs of a woman’s innately unstable and nonsensical mind than growing up while being parented buy a love sic, horny, desperate, impulsive single mom.

    they will simultaneously display why women ain’t shit, while at the same time
    (by the quality and number of men she has banging her head off the headboard when she thought he was sleep) show him what a “real man” should be.

    many single moms also have the bad habit of coddling and encouraging extreme “Alpha behavior” when displayed by their “little man”. this along with his no longer seeing women as some great mysterious and innocent creature, allows him to simply play the old ” it works on mom, why not on her” rule book.

    Like


  22. My old father, bless him, is definitely beta. He has some sense, but seems to find alpha behavior either offensive for religious reasons, or bad manners. He can’t understand why women so often end up with “completely worthless lowlifes” who “treat them like absolute dirt.” Or, why my rebellious more alpha younger brother has so far done the best of his children, and is also the only one married yet.

    Like


    • In his generation, it worked. There’s not a damned thing wrong with being beta, especially if you’re beta who’s got his eyes open and isn’t falling prey to all sorts of shit-tests. Civilization is a good thing, and we need more or it, not less. Now, granted, that probably means you’re either going to marry a foreigner like I did or be utterly miserable… but you play the field the way it’s striped.

      Like


      • In a well-functioning civilization, beta males are closer to alpha – or at least alpha-flavored. In essence, the betas acted at least sort of alpha-ish (they had their eyes open, as you say), and correspondingly women faced actual consequences for going too much for the too-excessively alpha cad types.

        Our civilization isn’t a well-functioning one, so at the moment only alpha is alpha. Good for the players, bad for the game, and unstable for everyone. Will be interesting to see how it all shakes out.

        Like


  23. My dad never taught me ANYTHING about women, though, by 22, if I remember correctly, I had already banged 31 chicks. I’m 34 now, and lost my virginity at 16 to a known whore … yet, despite my sexual CV, pre-exposure to CH, I was an emotional beta.

    Anyway, just today, [I] was teaching my dad about the nature of women when he commented that “your mother would never leave me”. lol

    This warehouse of man knowledge greatly increased the quality of my interactions with women.

    I’m more charming, more daring and more bold.

    Thanks Heartiste!

    Like


    • I think if I stopped to count ’em up, it’d be just under 30. From my Dad, all I got was a borderline case of “unable to empathize with other human beings.” I try to keep a lid on that, though, because that’s a trait which shouldn’t be let out to play very often. Thing is, on said count, eighteen of that happened in a single year, when I almost died, which was a brutal but red-pilling experience (went from failing all shit tests, to passing all shit tests, b/c frankly, after almost dying, I simply wasn’t going to put up with shit, period).

      Settled down after that, b/c I found a keeper worth importing back to the States. I must be natural beta, because I’m much happier married to somebody who’s an honest-to-god match for me than when I was on the prowl and laying hot but vapid women left and right. I could have my bed warm and my coffee made fresh in a week or so, but I wouldn’t be able to actually replace her.

      Sentimental, I know, but there it is. I *enjoy* the “beta lifestyle.”

      Like


      • Hey, give yourself some credit.

        If you wanted her, if you took her, if you live in a perpetual state of amused mastery, and especially if she’s started cooking for you — you’re alpha.

        Like


      • Maybe. But frankly, I enjoy a lifestyle where I provide for a gal, and she provides for me back — she makes the coffee, I kill the bugs. I honestly don’t think “beta” is *necessarily* pejorative, unless it’s used in a context which means “crap with women.” Conflating the two is a mistake in my book.

        Like


      • Happycrow-

        You sound almost apologetic about this. Why? The situation you describe is perfectly normal in the context of most of civilization. Masculine men married feminine women and they worked together to provide stable homes for their children. I believe most men can be happy in this situation, or why did it become the norm in most of history? Western culture is a sick deviation from this model.

        Like


  24. Mom told me that, no matter how strong a woman appears, part of her still needs to be dominated by a man.

    The red pill was given quite early in my house. She encouraged alpha behavior (with limits, of course).

    Thanks, Mom.

    Like


  25. My dad did everything to make sure I was a functioning human being in the world…except he left out all the advice about women. Once I started discovering all this stuff on my own…he told me he knew about it already. Damn the luck.

    Although the stories my grandfather told me about his dealings with women make me wish I could of learned from him when he was that age. He was an alpha.

    Like


  26. My old dad was always an old fashioned sort of guy, a man for whom the 1950s never really ended. Always dominated in our household but really never taught me anything about women because I suspect he never really knew anything about them. I don’t have any regrets about not being taught anything by him. It just wasn’t a skill he ever really needed in life.

    These days though it foes bug me how at times I find it hard to teach my son these things (he’s 15). I try and some things he understands, but although he wants to learn these things he really doesn’t want to be taught them by his father.

    Like


  27. Haha oh heartiste, your a character. How many conflicting resolutions must you come up with in a day? Love it.

    Being a son of a true Alpha. Game is not so easily passed down with heart to hearts. My father womanized right in front of me since I can remember. Taking home day care and pre school care givers.

    My father tried, without any care of judgment or of sounding like a “pig”, tried to teach me game. I had problems with trusting my dad. A drug dealer, partier, womanizer. Naturally I was a resistant child , didnt listen to my dad, fighting , breaking shit ect. Rules did not apply to me. I don’t think you can’t be the dominant one and teach dominance to a young male at the same time. I had to learn how to pick up pussy on my own bro.

    Like


  28. I’m gonna explain game as simply as possible for the skeptics and slow learners: Treat beautiful women as you would treat ugly women.I’m gonna explain game as simply as possible for the skeptics and slow learners: Treat beautiful women as you would treat ugly women.

    betashlub mind melt, but pretty girls are special.

    do you think the drones comprehend how grovelly they are towards pretty girls? If they treated everyone equally, then we’d all be happy.

    Hearts pretty egalitarian when you get down to it, you know?

    Like


  29. My dad was a natural, a philanderer, a criminal (spent a good chunk of his childhood in juvy, fortunately staying out of prison as an adult), a handsome devil, and an all-around giant asshole. He never taught me a single thing about women, so I grew up embarrassingly beta (though my nordic good looks helped offset my betaness). But I am eternally grateful for his genes.

    Like


  30. I love that this post has unleashed a cataract of spontaneous daddy confessionals. Only the divorce generation could be so wrapped up in such Freudian psychodrama. My daddy wasn’t alpha enough! ::single tear::

    Like


  31. Teach your son this and learn it yourself.

    A report was released this week from the Combined Intelligence Agencies of the United States.

    In it they predicted that during the time period 2012-2030. that there would be no return to growth levels as they were pre-2007

    I concur, wholeheartedly. The driver of growth is energy and the cost of exploration and production will only continue to rise. And the report went on to detail this reality.

    Regardless of what Reagan or Bill Clinton did in the 80s and the 90s, the driver, the facilitator and reason for the growth during those days was that energy prices fell dramatically with addition of Cantarel from Mexico, the North Sea, and Prudhoe Bay in Alaska. The historical inflation indexed price of petroleum was less than $20 during all of that time. And those assets are near exhausted.

    Since the invasion of Iraq in 2003, the indexed price of oil has continued to rise. Yes, there are new technologies but each of those technologies is only possible at the higher price of oil and have their own impact on the increasing price. “Fracking” involves using a giant compressor the size of a large building to pump a specialized fluid down into the earth and force the layers of rock apart. That is far cry from poking a whole in the ground and oil spurted out. And it costs far more money. That compressor is massively expensive to build, operator, maintain, and transport. And all “new” technology is costlier. I quoted “new” for the reason that they ideas were often and even used years but were uneconomical until oil prices reached present levels.

    So what you have today is the “new normal” with low or no growth, small shoots of growth that are stomped down by an increase in oil due to demand. And one could doubt that ANY growth is occurring at the published rates. The those indexes are consistently manipulated for political benefit. It might be meaningful change to incorporate a new component or reduce an older one, but I promise those changes only occur when it is politically beneficial to publicly do so. It is a tendency of organizations to do report the positive. When your boss asks for a status report, it is not in your best interest to tell the whole truth and highlight your deficiencies or failures unless pressed to do so. And your boss reports to his boss in the manner, and his boss does likewise. I am not saying that there is malice, but I am saying that I would think growth is lower than published rates.

    It was said in 2008 that your personal financial picture will never again be as good as it was in 2007. There might be isolated cases, businesses, products, areas, and even countries that fare better. But the majority will not.

    When there is growth then all boats rise. If the number of jobs is increasing significantly and therefore more well paid positions of responsibility, then all benefit, both men and women.

    But when there is no growth then there is what is called a Zero Sum Gain. If one person gains another must lose. If you believe anything else then you are a fool.

    So for every woman that might gain, that you might assist in that gain, then a man must lose. And by derivation from that reality, any gain to women in general must entail a loss to men in general. You know and I know, the world as it is favors someone with a pussy. You do not.

    Open those doors and be a gentleman at your peril.

    And you be sure and teach your son to look out for himself, first, foremost.

    Ask not for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for you.

    Like


    • There is a lot of truth to what you’re saying. I worked on energy policy for sometime and what you are saying is pretty much spot on. It’s almost economically impossible for the Untied States to grow at 5% GDP for sustainable period with Oil at $90 a barrel. Gas was 99 cents a gallon in 1997. 15 years later it is 4 bucks a gallon in the summer. That is a dramatic spike in a 15 year period.

      You make a lot of good points. This is really a zero sum game. Growth is stagnant and most of the growth is a direct result of governmetn spending in health care and defense (1.5 Trillion).

      Other than bombs and health care treatments, this country isn’t producing much. And that doesnt’ bode well for men trying to score some tail in the long run.

      My advice? Get a job with the federal government, when they go broke, they will be the last one out of town….so if they go down, we all go down.

      Like


      • Bad advice. It would be better to learn useful skills and trades, that people will need or want no matter what. Federal government employee is definitely not a useful skill.

        Like


    • About those status reports: Did you notice that the growth and jobs numbers are announced with some fanfare, then quietly adjusted down a month later? Again and again. What a racket.

      Like


  32. A friend of mine in high school was a natural, and his Dad was divorced. While I did not see the girl myself, I was told that his Dad had a pretty cute younger girlfriend. This had to have had an effect on my friend. When I was 15 and couldn’t keep a stiffy down in glancing at a girl’s ass, he acted around the hottest older girls like he had seen a million pussies. When he was 15, a senior girl blew him and he shot off all over her face and hair, which became known throughout the highschool when she returned to the party without checking a mirror.

    My father, on the other hand, is mentally/emotionally the beta male prototype. I once asked him for advice on a high school girlfriend and his response was that he had fewer lovers than he could count on one hand and that he knew nothing about women. But…he was a college football player and as painful as it is to admit it, my Mom was pretty hot back in the day. i think he was able to keep her hypergamous nature at bay by maintaining a high income, and maintaining close ties with both families (both families from small towns, married, siblings married). And he was physically big. My old man had a strong mother and all sisters as well and you’d think that would make him understand women, but his m.o. is the stereotypical “yes dear.” But he’s been married for almost 40 years now…

    Like


  33. As a dad, I regret to report that all sons believe that sex was invented when they hit puberty, and older folk were formed by spontaneous generation.

    Like


  34. My 14-year-old son was pretty crushed a few weeks ago when his lil’ hottie cheerleader girlfriend dumped him.

    As he was about to go over to her house with flowers, and send her a desperate love text, he asked for my advice.

    I asked my son if he reallllly wanted her back. He said yes, he really wanted her back. So, with some reluctance, I went ahead and told him, “You definitely shouldn’t send that text or take her those flowers. You should start talking to her super-hot best friend.”

    He almost argued with me. But I asked him if doing what he had been doing was working with her. He said no. So I said, then just try everything I tell you, and see what happens.

    He did.

    He got with her best friend.

    Of course, predictably, and sadly (to me), his ex now wants my son back bad (after calling him an asshole and protesting, and only after first making my son seriously doubt what I had taught him).

    So, although I hate the game, and I wish that just being a loving provider worked, I know better. And I will continue to teach my son the truth when he asks.

    Like


    • Father of the Year Award right here.

      Well, Father of the Month. Father of the Year would have got him a really hot hooker. Or two. Wearing cheerleader outfits. Or his favorite porn star.

      Excuse me, jizzonline.com is calling…

      Like


      • God bless you, Sean.

        What I wish more than anything, is that as a 12 year-old aspiring beta, my father sat me down to watch “The Last American Virgin.”

        For the most part, it’s a cheesy ’80’s sex comedy, but there’s a “Fairy Tale” plot of the main character who falls in love with Karen.

        It follows the fairy tale script, it shows him winning the girl like every beta thinks he can. If you believe in Magic, you root for the guy.

        And when the movie ends, it feels like you were whacked upside the head with a 2X4.

        I would have stood there dumbfounded, and my dad would have said, “Son, that’s how the world works, and don’t you forget it.”

        It would have saved me endless amounts of pain.

        If you have a son who shows any beta tendencies, kick out the wife and any daughters and watch that movie alone with him. It’ll mean everything to him.

        Like


      • I just read the plot of that movie. Sounds like truth, not fairytale. I plan to watch it with my son, thanks.

        Like


    • Keep up the good work. Father of the year!

      Like


    • … although I hate the game …

      Love the game. Love the players. Women do.

      Or why allow yourself to hate a necessity? At very least put it in perspective: “I hate work. I hate being poor more.”

      Like


      • Good point. I remind myself of the fact that it is necessary, and that I’m actually giving women what they crave, when I start to feel bad about some of the things I do.

        Like


    • BRAVO!!!! The right thing to do is rarely the easy thing to do.

      Like


  35. AYouth depression, mental problems and self harm are all symptoms of low self value, low self image.

    Betatude literally kills young men.

    Fathers have a responsibility to teach their sons to be of high value and survival skills

    Like


  36. My father is 5’6″ and was very popular with women. He even had a little black book stuffed with numbers. Of course, he looked somewhat like Sean Connery, although he was a midget version. He is now 80 years old. It’s clear women have changed, contrary to the delusions of the Manosphere. I’ve talked to several very old men and they claim women then were far different than the women of today, and that they were far better in the past.

    Like


    • Oh no, they were similar in the past and not that much better, but they had very different incentives.

      In the past they had to have many children to support them when they would be old, and there was a big risk of involuntary pregnancy when they had sex.

      Both of these meant that they had to invest in men, as both husbands and sons, in order to get men to invest in them.

      Not anymore: they can pump and dump men without obvious consequences, while still demanding that men invest in them.

      I t is not a change in character, by and large it was almost wholly opportunistic in the past as it is now, just the opportunities were different.

      Like


  37. CH, what did your father teach you?

    Like


  38. Reading this reminds me of why I wish I had a father. I always assumed that most men got some kind of advice from theirs, apparently not. I always went to mom, who gave me the terrible advice I followed until my mid-twenties. I would also ask gramps, but he was very old school and completely unaware of how shitty the dating market is now.

    I’m at my breaking point because I now realize that EVERYTHING is stacked against me. I’m 5’7, going to community college, living at home with mom. I’m only 28 and considering moving overseas. Game has gotten me laid, just not with any woman I’d admit to fucking. I feel like I’ve been busting my ass at school/gym, just to make it on my own. But, at this point I’m losing my motivation. I see plenty of guys who worked hard in the “traditional” sense, and get stuck sleeping with cows.

    Like


    • The trick is to stop caring. Find happiness within yourself and stop seeking external validation. Fill up your day with shit to do that increases your self-worth.

      Like


    • Yikes. Poor lil fella. It sounds like you care too much about why other think about you. That is game killer número uno. Do what YOU want to do, not what you think others want you to do. Don’t go to the gym to get bitches, go to the gym to feel good. Pussy is a byproduct of a confident man.

      Like


      • Believe me, I know this. It’s very hard to constantly be on the losing end, while trying to maintain a super confident frame.

        Like


    • You must move overseas now

      Like


    • Before you leave the country, have you tried online game? Its very easy to screen. Put your settings for a match to be someone between five feet and five feet three (or so), a high school education, etc. Its all about you being proportionately taller/more educated/”better” than her. Any man who is making a good life for himself can be somebody’s alpha.

      Like


      • Ha….The odds in online dating is stacked against men.

        Realize that there is no easy way out like going overseas. You have to go out, get rejected, then pick your self up and try again. Only then you will have a semblance of a chance. Then you may move abroad if you want to.

        There is no easy way to learning game – other than to put yourself out there again and again.

        Like


      • Online so-called ‘dating’ , for men =thousands upon thousands of fake profiles (the attractive ones), millions of fatsos and Single Moms 14-55.
        Fuck that.

        Like


    • It works both ways. I wish I’d had a father too (or at least a brother), just so I wouldn’t be so uncomfortable around men, interacting with them, and flirting.

      I remember being 18 and having an older guy at work grab my face and kiss me, and yell at me “Jesus, fucking Christ, I’ve been flirting with you for 6 months!” I liked him all that time and had been totally oblivious/uncomfortable.

      It could have been worse though, I could have ended up on the pole.

      I’m sorry to hear about your plight, Dishonored, but you’re young for a guy and your SMV will only rise once you get a job etc. You should feel relieved you found this site in your 20s and not your 40s.

      Like


      • I’m with you. I always thought it would be cool to have a brother- that’s probably why I like hanging out here. I have a father but his interest in my life could be described as minimal to non-existent even though we lived in the same home and my parents have been married thirty-five years or so. I am sure he falls in the autistic range somewhere, so its not entirely his fault. I’ve adopted many brothers and fathers in their stead though. I am lucky to have so many people looking out for me even if not in the traditional sense.

        HAHAHAHA! At least he made a move finally. Sheesh! What does a girl have to do?!?! When you don’t know the signals, you wonder why in the world they are looking at you like that!

        Like


      • Yes! Girls that are good with guy banter, always have a good, attentive father at home. The rest of us end up either somewhat untrained and awkward, or really slutty. Sometimes both (if anyone has seen the female/male interactions on Bad Girls Club, you’ll know what I’m talking about).

        Like


      • WHAT is the Bad Girls Club? Do we don wigs and sunglasses to get it? Don’t lead me astray, Flavia! 🙂

        Like


      • It’s a show about ratchets on the Oxygen Network. Basically it’s a bunch of thirsty, ratchet, ghetto sluts put in a house where they fuck, get drunk, hook up with each other, fight, throw punches, and damage property. It’s glorious.

        Like


  39. My dad has some alpha tendencies but was still beta enough to marry a whore (my mother) when he was 19. He managed to hold on to her for 18 years, but it was hardly worth it as the whore got crazier with age and eventually eat pray loved her way into a divorce. To this day I still refuse to talk to my whore mother, going on 15 years now.

    Like


  40. I grew up without my dad. Or well, I had a beta steph dad who beat me when my mom went out to the pub.

    My biological dad was never around. He has 7 children with 3 different women. He’s been to jail. Altough now he is a stable family father. Incidentally, he told me he’s never had trouble getting laid. “I’ve been able to walk into a bar with shit running down my leg and still getting laid.” he said.

    He described to me one story where they were crashing a party. Some girls boyfriend came over to kick him and his friends out. But it turned out my father and his posse beat the shit out of him and threw him out.

    My father doesn’t know why he’s had such an easy time getting laid.

    Like


  41. Actual converation from when I was a teenager

    Son: Dad, does it ever feel like you are not in an equal partnership with mom, that you are actually the one who has to make it work, otherwise it is over?

    Dad: (Staring out the windshield) Son, no woman is your partner; she does not want to be your equal. Every woman wants to be at least lightly dominated, even if they won’t admit it. They *want* to be told what to do. And don’t expect their support when you need it.

    That was all he said, because if I could not figure it out from that simple truth, there was no hope for me. I lived by those words thereafter.

    Like


  42. There is a big problem with congruence. How is a supplicating. beta-acting Dad ever going to get away with teaching a son to be the opposite? It cannot fly. A son will see him doing one thing while trying to say another. Fail.
    An apha-acting Dad can get away with teaching Niceness although it does sow a certain amount of confusion.
    My impression is that most of the cases where, in the past at least, a son got the message occured when the Dad just demonstrated tight game and said nothing much about the how and why of it.
    It is very tricky, afterall, to explain accurate truths about female sexuality with the kids mom and sisters in the same room.

    Like


    • “Dad just demonstrated tight game and said nothing much about the how and why of it.”

      That was my experience.

      Like


  43. Only in a world with no real men would boys need to learn anything about women.

    A man who behaves as a man should behave doesn’t need to know. A real man doesn’t become lovesick and pitiful and listen to The Smiths.

    Unfortunately, men don’t seem to teach their sons anything at all let alone how to be men.

    Like


  44. This father-son letter warrants reposting on an annual basis just so everyone keeps it fresh in mind: http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/ReadersSubmissions2011/reader6875.htm

    Like


  45. OT Sean Penn really needs to read this blog.

    ‘As I look back over my life in romance, I don’t feel that I have ever been loved’

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2247277/Sean-Penn-opens-split-Robin-Wright.html

    His first lesson should be: “Don’t marry a manjaw.”

    Like


    • If that’s that broad in Unbreakable, then let me just say her cunt persona must be a reflection of her actual self… and I’ll be dipped if I’ll ever understand what made some director or producer say “Heeeeyyyyy…. let me put her on the screen!”

      Like


    • One look at the way she dresses when she’s with him in public tells that she cares little about pleasing men.

      Of course, the glinty-yet-dead look in her eye gives it away long before one even sees the clothes.

      Like


    • He says that he went out to bars 4 times in a row and he ended up everytime drunk without female company.
      Even if he’s a rich and famous super alpha on paper, without the simplest form of game, it doesn’t mean shit. Bet he’s a weirdo aspie.

      Like


  46. Intuition or intelligence, brings to mind an Einstein quote about imagination and knowledge. I’m a father of a young son, It’s what you do, not say, that impresses them the most.

    Like


  47. I think a huge problem is that all modern media is geared towards perpetuating the feminist agenda.

    Movies, tv shows, much of pop music is about the heart-broken or dopey guy and the headstrong female: Beyonce’s “It’s Raining Men”…

    In China where I live, the one-child policy has created a whole generation of selfish, entitled bitches who feel guys should kow tow to them.

    I’m now gaming a 28 year old banker who on date 1 I k-closed. Then amped up the attraction with a lot of sex texts. Then date 2 amped up the comfort about my interests, goals, etc, then had major make out session.

    After that her hamster went into over-drive and she texted all this nonsense about me being a player etc etc etc.

    That was her modus operandi for putting beta males in their place.

    I’ve seen this before and have developed what I call “Outraged sensibilities game/I’m so shocked” game….It’s a kind of suprise dominance.

    I totally reframed her “you’re a player” ASD over-reaction with an over-reaction of my own calling her selfish, suspicious, unfeminine. I used a bunch of other great stuff from here saying “I thought you were different. You sabotaged a budding relationship with your own over-bearing, suspicous and entitlement tendencies”.

    This taps into that only childTiger-mom raised hyper-competitive nature where Asian males tend to cave in for exactly the reasons you mention.

    Radio silence for a few days now. I’ll update on anything significant.

    I reckon she’ll be sending me “Trial texts” in the next day or so which I’ll ignore and then she’ll want to meet up, which I’ll reframe and decide time/place and then I’ll bang her.

    I had no role models to teach me this stuff or I would have done much better much earlier.

    Like


    • Nice work dude seriously keep us posted. It seems like you flipped the script on her and agreed and amplify. Would def like to hear how it plays out.

      Like


      • @immoralgables…

        Yup…as predicted, I got an email from this girl…of course referencing that she wants to bang me…

        “”Hope you have calmed down by now. I should apologize that I shouldn’t have judged u. As u can imagine that i grew up from a traditional and conservative environment so they way u think about relationships is beyond my comprehension. Regardless i think we did hv very good connections, I’m not sure about u but that degree of connection didn’t happen to me often. All the best 🙂 “”

        She’s qualifying herself.

        She feels pussy tingles She realizes that her ASD denied her alpha cock and she’s holding out a kind of flimsy faint hope of possible pussy…

        My tactic is to leave this for a few days…see how it goes then maybe drop a text: “Drinks.”

        Any other suggestions would be welcome…

        Like


      • ” Regardless i think we did hv very good connections, I’m not sure about u but that degree of connection didn’t happen to me often. All the best “””

        Wow deja vu eh? I’ve seen it before. She’s doing some crazy ass rationalizations here. “Connection”…heh

        Only thing I would say is if you jump back in with “drinks” and her emotional state isn’t ready for it; it may come off as mis-calibrated. I’ve been learning (the hard way) is to open up, bust on her, spike the BT/DHV and then proceed toward your goal of getting her out. You’ve obviously got your own method and ways that no doubt works. At least here in the US i’ve been noticing it’s better when I pick things up and assume her state is at neutral and try to ramp it up to where she is emotionally high enough to get drinks.

        I look forward to it though. I’ve used your “Oh.” before to great effect.

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      • @immoralgables.. An update. I think “Outraged Sensibilities Game” works…

        So I waited 2 days after receiving that email and replied:

        Me: “Oh.”

        She replied almost instantly with a long text apologizing and rationalizing and saying 2 people with differing values couldn’t be together.

        Me: “Please, no game playing”—pulling a page from these pages.

        Her: More apologizing rationalizing explaining.

        Me: About an hour later. “Hmmmmmmm”

        Then: “Drinks”

        That got the hamster going. She replied late, like around 11:30

        Her: “Drinks”

        Me: “Drinks”

        Me: XXXX pub, after midnite”

        Her: Too late. You mean tonight?

        Me: Yah

        Her: “I’m here now”

        I was only a few minutes away from that place. I showed up. She had a beer waiting for me. She started rationalizing and apologizing. I grabbed her, started making out and said “Is that what it takes to shut you up?”

        She was beaming and tingling. Then she said something very curious:

        Her: “If i hadn’t contacted you would you have really never contacted me?”

        Me: Smiling….”I didn’t contact you.”

        More making out, more dirty talk…. I took her home and had the wildest, roughest bang ever—and she was on her period.

        Two years ago I couldn’t never have had either the inner game or confidence to pull this off or the skill set to pull this off and recognize all this stuff as kind of girl waffle that needed a dominant hand to plough through the weeks.

        Like


      • Nice Walawala. These were my my thoughts after reading the end of your post.

        What would you say are the main differences, if any, between Asian (Chinese?) women and the ones in the US?

        Like


      • In my above comment I meant to say that this was my reaction after reading:

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      • Based on her email to you, I would say that she is soon yours for the taking. I would be surprised if this doesn’t end in coitus.

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  48. I’d say growing up with a sister helps too. Mom’s conduct as much of the hypergamy out of sight of the kids as they can manage, but sisters don’t know any better. You get to watch feminine nature being constructed right before your eyes.

    Like


    • Yeah, I’ve noticed that naturals often grow up surrounded by at least one or more sisters. Vince Vaughn, for instance.

      Those guys are constitutionally unable to put women on a pedestal because they’ve shared a bathroom with sisters, listened to their phone conversations, witnessed the shit tests, heard the shaming, etc.

      For them, the bloom was never on the rose.

      Like


      • And the guys who grow up in a family full of brothers often don’t know the first thing about women. They pedestalize, or they whiteknight — or if they discover game, they can’t emotionally calibrate.

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      • That would be me. Luckily I had decent enough looks to make up for lost time with a few LTRs in high school and college. I learned a lot by observing my girlfriends’ friends.

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      • yeah, esp guys with hot sisters. calibrated to shit tests since they were young’ns, and they are used to being in the presence of sister’s typically hot friends (and the token cock-blocker fat cow). all this subconsciously seeps into their psyche, and by college these cats are tearin’ de asses up every frat house and bar.

        yeah, i had no hot seester.

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  49. “1. Fathers and friends who teach them the effective (note: I did not say morally righteous) alpha attitude through their own behavior with women.

    2. Favorable genetic traits in whatever ratio, which may include sociopathy, narcissism, lack of empathy, mesomorphy, good looks, high sociosexuality, intelligence, artistry, humor.

    3. Fortuitous successful early encounters with girls that set the budding Naturals on a path of alluring self-assurance.

    So… if your father was an unapologetic cheater, you see vaginas in every Rorschach test, and you got your first knob job at the ripe age of seven, chances are good you are a Natural with women. Chances are also good you would not be able to teach other men what you know, because you only know it intuitively.”

    Speaking as a man who learned pretty much everything I know about game by observing a natural, I would say that these observations are spot on the money. The funny thing was we could never converse about it, because he didn’t understand what made him so good with women… So I just had to watch and learn.

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  50. The problem is that game has radically changed in the last 50 years. Your father’s info is obsolete in the bloody pulp that cultural marxism has left of our culture. Modern young women are LOL pathological narcissists who are nearly impossible to talk to without inducing a headache (not the case 50 years ago), so Pa isn’t going to provide the knowledge to work with them. This site is a “how to” for MODERN women with their pathologies.

    To quote a british 13 year old in a sexting article yesterday “When you grew up you asked a girl to kiss, today you ask them for sex.”

    Like


  51. My dad is living proof that there are more categories than Alpha and Beta.
    WW II generation, married very late, from what I’ve been able to piece together, my parents got hitched because being married would be good for his career and my mom thought he was a ‘good catch’ due to a secure job.
    Left us when I was 3.
    I can’t imagine him ever having had a girlfriend (no, he’s not gay), ever having felt attraction, love, lust – or anything else for that matter – for anyone at all.
    And I do mean ANYONE.
    He’s never said even 1 peep to me about women, sex, relationships. dating, that whole pile, and any attempts of mine to broach such subjects were met with a 100-foot thick wall of petrified, steel-reinforced ice.
    It’s like talking to a much colder, unfriendlier version of ‘Sheldon’ from ‘The Big Bang Theory’.
    Among fathers a little closer to normal, I think the main reason they don’t teach their sons anything actually true and useful about women is that they don’t know shit themselves.

    Like


  52. The reason many fathers don’t school their adolescent sons about the true nature of women is for the same reason we let our children watch Finding Nemo but not Natural Born Killers.

    Life’s hard enough without traumatizing them before they’re out of the gate.

    Like


  53. EPIC DUMPING! xD

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  54. Well, as an old guy I know this: Women used to behave differently. Men who were “gamers” in the old days were simply reviled, not admired. Remember, back then if you didn’t perform economically you were in bad shape. You lived hard. If you didn’t take care of your children and wife, you were despised. Those men may have have been betas, but, they survived the depression, WW II, and the Korean War. They knew how to work with their minds and their backs and knew they were on their own.

    Some betas.

    We had a friend who was a good looking guy, personable, I liked him, lotsa girlfriends. He wound up living with two women simultaneously, riding a bicycle to get around, and died from alcohol related disease. He was not admired. He was despised/pitied. His women were pitiful.

    These alpha fathers going who get into fights and go to jail? Pleez. We call them losers where I come from.

    And, yes, my father (born in 1908), didn’t teach me anything about women except to love your wife and take care of your family. Period.

    Naturally, this put me somewhat at a disadvantage in the latter 1/2 of the 20th century. In the 21th century, this advice is almost toxic.

    Like


    • This ..stellar No it’s great and needed ..and more .. betas were respected by true alpha’s of that generation because alpha’s knew having it “easy” with women wasn’t as much fun or meaningful as good friends you could count on..

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  55. they harbor an envy for their sons

    Jealousy, not envy.

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  56. The “alpha” vs. “beta” distinction breaks down when you’re talking about men who came of age before the Sixties and the rise of feminism.

    Example: my own father, in his 80s now, was by any measurement a “beta” — married nearly 50 years, never cheated or even flirted, old-school morality.

    And yet . . . compared with pretty much any man other than a professional MMA fighter or an actual pimp, he acts incredibly alpha. Says what he thinks and doesn’t give a damn for how it makes anyone feel, relies on himself, takes no shit. When he was growing up that was called “being a man” and everyone did it. They put on neckties even when they were bayoneting Nazis. They were polite to women (we’d call it “pedestalizing”) but settled disputes with other men by punching.

    It’s as if all men nowadays are incomplete. The alphas have some of the pieces, the betas have some of the pieces, but nobody knows how to be a whole man anymore.

    Like


    • Heartiste has said before that ideally, one should be both alpha and beta, but he emphasizes the alpha because most men lack it and have too much of the beta.

      Here’s an example of “beta game”:
      https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/when-beta-male-strategies-can-work/

      Like


    • Yeah, you’re onto something. Our dads were members of a generation that could cooperate with one another as equals, not as masters and servants. They’re almost all gone now.

      I remember my dad talking about his time in the Navy in WWII. He mentioned pulling into port, and one of my friends asked if he went looking for women when they got in.

      “No,” he said, somewhat perplexed. “They came looking for me.”

      But for all that, he married the prettiest girl in town and stayed married to her for over six decades.

      He never told me much about women, but I remember one thing specifically. Once, when I was about 12, he said “Don’t worry whether a man likes you, worry about whether he respects you.”

      He paused for a second, then said “that goes double for women.”

      Like


    • And yet . . . compared with pretty much any man other than a professional MMA fighter or an actual pimp, he acts incredibly alpha. Says what he thinks and doesn’t give a damn for how it makes anyone feel, relies on himself, takes no shit. When he was growing up that was called “being a man” and everyone did it.
      ————————————————

      Same here T. My dad would be confused that a website such as this even existed.

      Check this out. My dad had this thing on the wall of the house called “Wifey’s mood barometer”. It had a dial with an arrow on it that you could turn to point at different moods my mom was in; I didn’t realize at the time how incredibly sexist it was because guess what?

      it wasn’t; it was the truth. Women are moody masses of conflicting emotions.

      Like


      • The dial of permanent shit-test passing. He should sell that on Amazon.

        Seriously, what a gift to his wife. She never had to live ambiguously, as do women who must judge their own shrewishness by their own faulty equipment.

        Matt

        Like


      • In my house, if she appears to be headed off the rails, I ask for a State of the Mood address.

        That ain’t sexist. Or wait — it’s totally sexist. Who cares? Jesus, it works.

        Like


  57. Lots of company here.

    My dad has some core alpha hindbrain tendencies but was conditioned by society to believe that beta crap works to get women.

    When I was a teenager he stressed pedestalizing and “respecting” women (i.e. don’t push for sex). My feminist mother did her best to make me into one of those sensitive men that feminists believe they want but in fact never, ever fuck. This was the 70s — she bought me “Free To Be You And Me” book and record which was full of femmy propaganda like an NFL player singing “It’s Alright to Cry.” You can imagine the character-building hard knocks and pain I suffered before I shed the beta conditioning.

    My mom had an affair, then divorced my dad when I was a teenager and my dad was in his early 40s. I’m pretty sure it was because my dad followed the familiar death spiral of trying to placate my mother’s vague sense of dissatisfaction instead of leading strongly, which just made it worse.

    Ironically after the divorce my dad began swimming in poontang. He didn’t know any game but didn’t screw it up either — supply/demand ratios and his hindbrain alpha worked in his favor.

    He wifed up a very hot woman in her mid 30s. Thinking it was all about dreamy Disney movie “love” and crap like that. Yeah they were very compatible but a big part of it was this woman was no dummy — she know her SMV was fading fast and she wanted to grab a reliable provider and good guy, my dad. She’s an excellent quality woman too.

    My dad doesn’t know how good he has it. My mother didn’t screw him in the divorce (she totally could have). He’s still entirely ignorant of the realities of women or the sexual marketplace and drinks the PC cool-aid.

    I’m in my early 40s now, getting married shortly to a 25 year old after having a grand old time since the red pill opened my eyes. I haven’t asked my dad for relationship advice since I figured out he didn’t know anything.

    He senses that I’ve figured it out so he never offers me advice on women. The only exception was when I told him I was engaged (this is my first marriage). He and his wife asked me with all sincerity “Is it limitless love? Because if it’s not limitless love you shouldn’t get married.” I remembered just how clueless my father is with women. He lives in fantasyland. Fortunately it worked out for him.

    My dad does do stuff right sometimes due to instinct. He eloped and got married on the beach in the Carribean. The engagement ring was a cigar band (no kidding). I learned that from him.

    By the way young guys, if you get married follow that example. Don’t make a big deal of asking her. Wait for a nice moment then just put it out there. And don’t ask – say “I want you to be my wife.” No one knee, no limousines, no $400 dinners, none of that crap. And no engagement ring. If a woman screams about no diamond dump or wants a lavish ceremony then dump her immediately. Yeah I know that’s not easy but following that advice will save you a lot of future pain. It is a great honor to invite a woman to be your wife. Treat it that way, and make sure she respects that.

    Like


  58. One of your most insightful posts based on my experience. I think the one idea about an alpha dad being worried about “competition” (from a 15 yo?) is bullshit. Everything else is dead on from my interactions with my sons at the critical age. Betas don’t know what the fuck is going on. So how could they educate the next generation? But you and Roosh and the others are helping. Thanks for the help.

    Like


  59. My dad’s definitely a beta. It’s sad because he has alpha credentials. He helped organized a massive labor strike, made coast to coast motorcycle road trips, and once saved the life of a female police officer who’d had the misfortune to pull over a wanted fugitive to give him a speeding ticket.

    But he just had absolutely no willpower when it came to my mom. I remember him coming home after 12 hours at the mill and her dumping a litany of complaints on him or demanding he “do more around the house” or give her tons of cash because Boston Market had a sale on tsotchkes. This crap still goes on today, incidentally. He makes 120K/year and ends up broke between paydays.

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  60. Some things just can’t be taught. You can tell your beta friends that guys need to play hard-to-get too until you’re red in the face, but they won’t be receptive until they get their hearts broken after “doing everything right”(emulating TV or taking the advice of female friends).

    Like


  61. Awesome alpha move

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  62. this is basic. mothers should be raising the kids while fathers provide for the material needs of the family, then spend quality time with his wife and the kids.

    a king should not be doing the job of a queen

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  63. Paleo december mofos!

    Fuck modernity, reclaim your heritage!

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  64. The problem with fathers not teaching their sons about masculinity is that those sons grow up to become emasculated men, then fathers. A few generations down the line, you’re entire male population has been raised entirely by women (whilst the emasculated fathers were at work), and you end up like Japan, full of Hikkomori (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hikikomori), Grass Eaters, and Incest (http://seedofjapheth.wordpress.com/2012/12/11/japanese-incest/).

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  65. That’s my theory for why more fathers don’t teach their sons the truth about women: they don’t know it themselves!

    True, and that is my life story. Dad is (was…) as alpha as they can get, dating actresses and singers in his time. And, unlike me, he didn’t have a rich daddy.

    It is amazing that he was so unable to teach his sons that all my older brothers screwed their marriages, and looking back now it seems that it was incredibly easy to save those marriages

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  66. Next topic: Why do mothers sabotage their sons?

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  67. Usually I’m a supporter of articles on this site. But this one is just retarded. Basically, if you stick around to raise a child you are beta?

    Never mind the fact that you’ve gamed and scored an 8-9 good girl. Never mind the fact that you got her pregnant, thus fulfilling your biological imperative. Never mind the fact that you game and score other girls when the need for variety comes. Never mind the fact that these were your life goals, and you confidently, and skillfully accomplished them. Never mind the fact that sticking around and raising one of your offspring with your values and knowledge will greatly increase the chances of your DNA spreading further throughout the world, thus winning the evolutionary game.

    Its easy to be a semi alpha who pumps and dumps all the women in his life.

    There is a reason guys do the pump and dump. Its because they know that in reality they cannot stand the crucible of fire that is a woman in love, trying to claim his balls.

    The real alpha is the one who can swat away the betaizing attempts of the woman deeply in love, and continue doing so for years and years and years.

    Fathers can be alpha or beta, but just like the rest of the male population, 95% are beta 5% are alpha.

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  68. to sum it up today to much George Clooney not enough Sean Connery

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    • There’s not enough of both George Clooney or Sean Connery. There are too many Seth Rogens, Steve Carells, Jason Seigels, Will Farrells, Stephen Colberts, and Jon Stewarts.

      All white male clowns. Self-deprecating entertainment monkeys will no self-respect or dignity. Funny sometimes? Sure, but the shtick is old and there are too many of them and not enough Sean Connerys.

      And yeah, Stephen Colbert is a moron too, stop slobbering over that fucking clown.

      Like


  69. This guy gets it:

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  70. on December 13, 2012 at 12:34 pm Diogenes the Cynic

    Brenner = Supreme Alpha

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  71. You are missing the big brothers. Almost every natural I know and every lady killer has an older brother who brought him into the fold early. The big brothers dont need to be naturals themselves but its the exposure to chasing girls earlier and successes earlier in life that I have found made the most profound impacts.

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  72. “Letter to a son that’s better than most fatherly advice. stickmanbangkok.com/ReadersSubmiss… 1 hour ago”

    I feel really sorry for the son of this disgusting sex-tourist.

    [Heartiste: Come on, Maya. Do you *really* feel sorry for him? Or are you just venting barely suppressed hatred?]

    For this person, women are apparently just worthless whores and I really hope his poor child won’t listen to this advice.

    This guy would remain single if he lived in US or wherever he comes from (because no woman who is 1 or above would want him no matter how much money and status he has) but sadly today disgusting people like him have a chance to become sex tourists and exploit poor Thai women.

    [Whatever you need to tell yourself to sleep at night in the warm embrace of your herb-shaped pillow. Do you prop its leg betwixt your labia?]

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    • “[Whatever you need to tell yourself to sleep at night in the warm embrace of your herb-shaped pillow. Do you prop its leg betwixt your labia?]”

      I have my disgust reflex triggered whenever I meet a disgusting man who treats women like we were worthless and I would say this is true for most women.

      [Heartiste: Unfortunately for your hag-shaped ego, that is not true. Most women, if real life is any indication, aren’t disgusted by men who treat women with a mentality of disposability. In fact, I’d say just the opposite is true; those kinds of men really clean up with the ladies.]

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  73. OT:

    That 12/12/12 Sandy Relief concert last night was surprisingly good. Mainly because it was nice to see good old fashioned testosterone rock music for a change. For that to happen they had to wheel out 30 to 40 year old English rock bands, but I’ll still take it. Rock has been pushed aside by endless rapper/diva and teenage girl bop music, the death of modern popular music. Young women have a great influence on what’s popular today, and they have crap taste. Yes, I’m blaming the death of good music on women too.

    It was obvious how bad rap can be when Kanye West came out. His show, that I only watched snippets of, was awful, unlistenable. Alicia Keys, on the other hand, was quite good. She is undeniably talented. And perty too.

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    • madvillian
      For that to happen they had to wheel out 30 to 40 year old English rock bands,
      ——————–

      No,

      That happened because the Jew producers know thats where the disposable income is; the kind of income that can afford to donate money to a cause.

      Much of what people THINK is art is really just the monetization of their own demographic that is sliced up, processed, packaged, and sold back to them at a handsome profit.

      You are a cannibal paying the jew for the “privilege” of eating your own feces.

      Rock and Roll died as soon as it became a career.

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      • I didn’t donate shit. My point about the death of music thanks to teenage girls, the saturation and influence of rap, and the overall hip-hop “culture” and attitude, still stands however.

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  74. I had a vietnam vet, golden gloves, 50s style dad. Seen it mentined here before…

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    • Had a friend i surfed with that was an artist and drove a VW, when he told me his dad was a horseshoer and a prison guard, i couldnt believe it.

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  75. My father died at a very young age, so, while the (alpha) memories of my father were fairly good ones, they were short-lived so I only have stories of him to fall on now.

    My father was a man’s man, and did incredibly well with women, and my mother, even to this day, was drop-dead in love with him. My mothers comment about his infidelities stuck with me most:

    “Your father… I’m not stupid, I know he was cheating on me, but he made me feel so special, and always put me first, that I turned a blind eye to it.”

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  76. […] Chateau Heartiste – Why Don’t Fathers Teach Their Sons Well? […]

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  77. […] today I read this, commenter Dishonored at […]

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  78. Well intentioned but clueless and largely absent beta father. Not as bad as some, and he was highly successful as a leader at his business, despite some anxiety and OCD like symptoms at home. Overbearing, and controlling mother.

    I am pretty typical of the mid to upper middle class of my generation.

    Help me heartiste, i’m drowning in my own tears qq~!

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  79. My dad actually taught me a lot of things.

    I’ve heard words coming out of his mouth like

    “They’re all whores, except for your mom and your sister. Treat them like they deserve to be treated”

    or

    “It’s not cheating until you’re married”

    or

    “Men dont cry, go back and fight the bullies. I’m not gonna do it for you.”

    I didn’t really want to hear and oblige to these things until I was totally crushed by some chicks and their behaviour. Looking back, needless to say, he’s totally alpha. He once told me about how he had multiple girlfriends (told me how he’d drive mom home at midnight and then hang out with the ones that were allowed to stay out longer.. lol). Mom remembers every single detail, buys HIM roses and (feels weird to say that) was quite hot back in the day. Guy also knows pretty much everyone and is easy going with everyone. I seriously have female friends in her 20s that would totally bang him and friended him on Facebook, lol. he’s quite fit, in his 50’s.

    When I caught a chick I was seeing cheating on me and commented it to him, his response was “She was older than you anyway, you dodged a bullet.. now go out and have some fun.”

    So yeah, I guess you can be alpha and stay with your family… or how would you categorize this kind of guy?

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  80. I have learned the hard way – had an alpha mom and beta dad. My 11 year old son, though, has now been taught well and he will be scoring like no others in this sad beta male driven society. The 16 commandments of poon have been hardwired – this drives his mother nuts, btw ,but in order to retain the balance of power this need be done. I watch him with anticipation as his puberty awakens. Man, I wish my dad had taught me this! For those interested, I am still married to his mother – the molding is not yet complete but the process and direction are enjoyable and promising. Its amazing how they stay when you don’t give a hoot if they come or go, or threaten, or whine, etc,etc,etc.!

    Peace and stay the course….

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  81. Some of us were born to fathers who lived in that different world, where
    productive “betas” were respected and desired by women (including our mothers) and who were therefore naturally and innocently clueless about the vag/badboy revolution. This apples to dads born in the 20ies. Dads born after WWII onwards had a CHANCE to figure this out but most did not. Those are the true provider betas – not quite innocently clueless.

    Thor

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