The Pill And Female Mate Preference

This blog has touched upon the effect that the birth control pill, now a fifty-year-old institution, has on women’s attraction mechanism. However, the studies examining the matter don’t seem to agree. I have read, (and experienced), contradictory evidence that supports both theses that women on the pill prefer niceguy betas or badboy alphas.

Does anyone have clear, updated information on this topic? It strikes me as one of major importance in any discussion about changes in Western female temperament, mating preference and even looks. Not to mention, the pill may cause changes in men who have to drink the water that is now polluted with estrogenic compounds. The subject deserves more rigorous science than it is currently getting. Naturally, it’s understandable why feminists would be loath to broach the subject, but that’s no excuse for the paucity of corroborating science by non-feminists, aka rational people.

UPDATE

JR writes:

I don’t know of any recent scientific studies, but you only have to think rationally in order to shed light on the topic. Unless the pill has in fact affected women’s biochemical processes, it stands to reason that they have reverted back to a more or less ‘pre-cultural’ preference for ‘alpha males’ of the crudest variety because the pill has freed them from considering the potential negative consequences of sexuality.

The female preference for alphas is basically a given, so the only question is: are there artificial forces preventing them from chasing them constantly?

This is a good point, and one that’s been discussed before. The pill exerts a psychological and a physiological effect on women. How much emphasis to give each effect is up for debate (though I tend to agree with JR that the psychological influence is just as strong as the physiological influence), but that there is an influence seems to me unassailable. You just can’t fuck with the primal forces of nature without some kind of blowback.

Note that the psychological conditioning caused by the pill is not limited to just the pill; condoms and other forms of prophylactics would have the same mate choice conditioning effect as the pill, if not to the same degree. The difference with the pill is that it alone could seriously fuck with the physiological engine of female mate choice.





Comments


  1. on October 11, 2011 at 1:29 pm greatbooksformen GBFM

    lzoozolzlzozo

    one BIG effect of the pill has beeen to transofrm the sacred ginahole into a grand-central germhole lzzlooozozozozo

    now when i go down on a womwanz i wear full scuba gear and a diving mask and a self-contained breathing apparatus and when i likckck her pususysysysys it is only through threee layers of industrial strength palstcis zozozozoozoz

    the longer she has been on the pill = the more dill pickles been up ger gina chute, shooting theirr billions of spermz and gizzzes int9 tthe gina hole

    when you think about it, there is no place on earth that is less sanitary then a moist, wet ginahole that has had lotsas cockas in it.

    i mean if there was a warm beer sitting on the tapled which had had lotssaa cockas in it and olotssas lotassa spplooge and stdsm would you drink out of it? lzozlzlz

    so why are you bying her dinner with hopes of sticking your cock in the world’s least sanitary hollioilio?

    that same mouth which got gizzed on will someday kiss your kids and send them off to shcooslsos zlzoozozo

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    • Shit man, this is disgusting. The more i read you, the more i feel bad about all the heads that i had to give, and the more i’m convinced that only virgins are truly worth it. Good luck finding them.

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      • on October 11, 2011 at 2:54 pm greatbooksformen GBFM

        dude my heart goes out to youuzz

        and every betamale

        who’s gotsa tastes the GBFM gizzaalizziz

        as i got em when they wer eyounger hooter tighter
        and fifty puound ls lighter
        for free teee heee heee lzozozzlzl

        alongside my new t-shirt lines

        http://cafepress.com/greatbooksofrmen

        i ama coming out with full-body hazmat suits to be worn whil egoing down on any psot-college ameriznsnsaz womansz zlzoozlzolzoz who the neocnszz butthexed in their prima nocta sectrive tapings of tucker max trhemys with goldman sax bttheixng cermeomnies zlzozzo

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  2. Well the pill simulates pregnancy on a hormonal level- I think. If so, the signals to the brain would probably be mixed, as the evidence seems to suggest. Although women on the pill, as far as I have experienced, don’t show some of the specific behaviors (morning sickness, odd food cravings) that pregnant women do. Worth a Google search- I’ll take a look later.

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  3. I love it, let us men sue the feminists and the pill makers for second hand estrogen.

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  4. on October 11, 2011 at 1:53 pm (r)Evoluzione

    I’m very curious myself, and have access to several full-text science journal subscriptions. I’ll do some digging & report back. While I hope someone’s done some new and groundbreaking work on this topic, there may be no definitive, new information, but we can still parse the existing data and study design to see if it yields any new nuggets of understanding.

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  5. I don’t know of any recent scientific studies, but you only have to think rationally in order to shed light on the topic. Unless the pill has in fact affected women’s biochemical processes, it stands to reason that they have reverted back to a more or less ‘pre-cultural’ preference for ‘alpha males’ of the crudest variety because the pill has freed them from considering the potential negative consequences of sexuality.

    The female preference for alphas is basically a given, so the only question is: are there artificial forces preventing them from chasing them constantly?

    [Heartiste: Right, the pill exerts a psychological and a physiological effect on women. How much emphasis to give each effect is up for debate (though I tend to agree with you that the psychological influence is just as strong as the physiological influence), but that there is an influence seems to me unassailable. You just can’t fuck with the primal forces of nature without some kind of blowback.
    Note that the psychological conditioning caused by the pill is not limited to just the pill; condoms and other forms of prophylactics would have the same mate choice affect, if not to the same degree. The difference with the pill is that it alone could seriously fuck with the phsyiological engine of female mate choice.]

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  6. can you say, “major histocompatibility complex”?

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  7. Pills may only have a superficial effect, on women’s hindsight rationalizations (betas are nice, alphas are bad). When they are directly witnessing male behavior, the fundamental dynamics remain the same: alphas for hot wet sex, betas for taking care of the alpha spawn. The only real effect of the pill is that the alpha bastards are now hypothetical.

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  8. My own experience was that in my LTR, when the girl went off the pill, a lot changed. I don’t know if I was beta or alpha but her sex life before me, while on the pill, was that she basically had no sex drive. She said I awoke her sex drive and it was a good times romp until, once engaged she decided to go off the pill. That is, in planning to get pregnant, she wanted to get her system ready by stopping the pill. Within months, the engagement was in danger and ultimately called off. Sexy time was also curtailed, which may have lead to the loss of her ingesting and absorbing all those good sperm hormones that make girls feel like they’re in love. Anyway, she went from me to a guy basically my opposite (muscles to girly, lean. from quieter to more talkative). Was it a hormone induced shift in attraction or just a typical relationship death spiral, who knows?

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  9. The pill does not have a large enough physiological effect to noticeably change female mate preference. The pill has simply absolved females of the consequences when engaging in sexual intercourse with their preferred male. Female mate preference has always been dependent upon one factor, and one factor alone: the survival environment. If the environment is resource poor, and requires high paternal investment for survival, then mate preference tends toward those who excel at resource acquisition. If the environment is resource rich, such that survival is trivial, mate preference tends towards selecting males highest on the status hierarchy. The mechanisms which lead to this behavior are complex, but it suffices to say that this two pronged mating strategy has been by far the most successful in human society. As human offspring require the highest parental investment of any known organism, successful civilizations have for the most part tended be based upon the majority of females seeking resource providing males. Elite females still preferred high status males, but this was due to their survival being guaranteed.

    It is important to note that this attraction mechanism is deeply rooted in all females, and is immutable. Females are attracted to resource providers in harsh environments, and high status males in abundant environments. Western society’s rising tide of material wealth has lifted all females to a level where survival is trivial, and as such the desire for resource providing males has become vestigial. Western females are attracted only to displays of status, as the rapid evolution of the “Game” community has demonstrated. Game is the collection of male behaviors which correlate most strongly with high male status.

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  10. I think the issue is a lot simpler than that. I have read many studies that explain how birth control switches the pheromone preference of women.

    This article explains it well.
    http://www.livescience.com/2781-pill-women-pick-bad-mates.html

    Basically off the Pill women look for dissimilar pheromones in men which leads to healthier kids and also a greater likely hood that the men and women will remain faithful. On the Pill women look for men that have similar pheromones. This leads to less healthy immune systems in children and a greater likely hood that both partners will stray.

    Once women go off the Pill they no longer like the pheromones of their husband. Explaining why many divorced women often say they could no longer stand the way their husband smelled.

    Also “the pill puts a woman’s body into a post-mating state, even though she might be still in the game.”

    I think this effect of birth control on pheromones helps explain the increase in divorce and also the increase in immune disease in younger children today.

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  11. Unfortunately the whole discussion and any analysis of data centers around whether or not the girls are ACTUALLY taking the pills responsibly (VS just saying they are or actually BELIEVING they are even though they’re not (“oh I missed a few days but that doesn’t matter”).

    The amount of women out there “on the pill” who miss a few days here and there is scary. Especially when you get into the 25+ year olds who have the baby timer going. Any guy trusting a random chick to actually be “on the pill” when she says she’s “on the pill” in the heat of the moment, and who DOESN’T want a baby with that chick, is playing a seriously retarded game of Russian Roulette.

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    • Any guy who blasts inside a pussy and doesn’t want a baby is a retard.
      At least, pull out for fuck sake. And take a piss before a second (or even first) round, because of that precum shit.
      If you absolutely wanna creampie, female buttholes exist for that particular reason (because we all know that women are princesses who never take a shit).

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      • Dude I’m so adamant about not wanting kids from an obvious slut, or even agood girl, I’ve dug back inside the snatch with toilet tissue to retrieve my man juice so the little wench couldn’t process my natural protein shake. Real talk, real story bitches! Said in Dave Chappelle voice. As students of the crimson arts,it would be wise for one to consider the physiological and psychological effects the pill has on a women’s attraction triggers, and over all the pill will make an imbalance between her natural estrogen level’s and the rising testosterone levels within her.

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      • on October 12, 2011 at 1:56 am greatbooksformen GBFM

        “If you absolutely wanna creampie, female buttholes exist for that particular reason (because we all know that women are princesses who never take a shit).”

        lzozozl ben ebenenekake checikcing in tonight zlozozoz

        Like


  12. Let’s not forget about the documented effects of secondary metabolites derived from estrogen analogs in male’s physiology. According to my endocrinologist, there’s been a spike of kids who hit puberty at a later date and develop gynecomasty.

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  13. In addition to the pheromone issue discussed above, there is the woman’s body thinking its pregnant issue causing women to seek more beta (i.e. warm, nurturing, feminine) men. Neither of these men are the man the woman really wants, which causes family instability as she seeks different types of men to satisfy her needs, hence the 70% (or whatever) of all divorces being initiated by women statistic.

    This why so many beta pussies (in my opinion) are able to find women at all. Look around at all the couples you see – are the guys all alpha or are at least half of them pussies, i.e. betas? This blog and others like it would have us all believe that only alphas get women. But plenty of beta fags are porking 5s and 6s and sometimes lesser 7s. A little game on a beta and he’s able to close a 6 on the pill who doesn’t know she should really be looking for a 6 foot plus, heavy browed alpha to inseminate her with superior genes. This causes a weaker generation.

    Look at England and any other European country with socialized medicine resulting in free Pill for all causing a generation of pussies to result. Not good.

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    • Yet they DO look for the 6+ ft hunk, the catch is that most of the plain Janes can’t get one and have to settle for what they can get. It’s been pretty well-established in this blog that women have a dynamic sexual strategy: get pregnant with an alpha, find a beta to take care of her and the kid, and the pill hasn’t changed that.

      BTW, the notion of “superior genes” is laughable at best from a purely biological standpoint.

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  14. Chicks dig jerks…some chicks dig even worse…

    http://girl-mom.com/node/5227

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  15. Yes, the Pill kills sexual excitement.

    Condoms kill the male satisfaction AND the woman’s absorption of seminal fluids.

    By far the best birth control method is the IUD.

    However, I knocked up a woman even though she had one in. She was THAT eager for a baby.

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  16. OT, but germane to much of our conversation on men, T levels, and game: Healthy, older men do NOT experience declines in Testosterone. Stay fit, eat paleo, and chase young pussy. The three keys to health.

    http://medicalxpress.com/news/2011-06-older-age-testosterone-decline-healthy.html

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  17. I have been in many LTR’s with women who have voluntarily, without goading from, started to take the pill early in our relationship. I have had a vasectomy (decided a long time ago I did not want to breed) so it matters little to me. I do not tell them this because it is of no consequence in the end as far as it is concerns them.

    From my experience, pre-pill and post-pill, it changes women significantly. Whereas some seem to think since it removes the barrier of pregnancy they seek more alpha males, I have found the opposite. By taking the pill, voluntarily at least, they are “investing” in the relationship and then you add the huge hormonal barrage of motherly feelings, they tend to grasp upon men like they would a baby. If anything it makes them more committed to an LTR.

    Feral single women on the pill may be another breed of animal, one that I have not really experience due to my age. But, if you catch one not on the pill, then they take the pill, it will only increase the odds of a successful LTR. If that is what you are into, then encourage it through subtle means.

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  18. The optimal mating strategy hard-wired into the female brain is to find a stepford boyfriend/husband to adore and support her in exchange for no sex/respect but at least he gets the entire culture off his back, with an alpha to provide genes for sexy sons on the side in exchange for the sex, affection, and respect she withholds from her boyfriend/husband.

    The key thing is that the first must be so far below her value that he never dreams of leaving her (the entire culture tells him how lucky he is to have her), so he doesn’t have to meet the 467-bullet points, but the bullet-points still allow her to justify treating him like shit for making her settle for the likes of him.

    The thing little understood is that she wants no commitment from the second. He’s there for the genes then needs to leave. You’ve heard the old saying about why top men hire prostitutes? They don’t pay them for the sex, they pay them to leave after. Likewise the woman will make sure to choose a man shallow enough/enough above her level to reliably leave. If he starts showing any redeeming qualities,or if she starts developing feelings for him, she’ll tell him he’s too good for her and he’ll be expected to leave.

    You’ll notice who is missing from the whole picture – the good men who have supposedly disappeared. Well, he disappeared for a reason – he’s got a modern civilization to maintain and wouldn’t be very happy with a woman pursuing a mating strategy from the stone age, no matter empowered it makes her feel. She’s empowered alright – like Genghis Khan, leaving a trail of corpses in her wake.

    The only way a good man with many redeeming qualities can win the game is to power through her (recent – there is the chink) cultural programming and dominate her frame. But he can only do this if he is aware of what is happening, hence the importance of the Ro’s and people like Dalrock, Badger, and Susan Walsh in getting the word out.

    Cross-posted at Susan’s site where she just got a mention in the latest Atlantic.

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    • Either that or he must be a VERY submissive man unaware of his own potential. Culture helps to bludgeon pretenders into submission.

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  19. My main observations about the pill have been that women off the pill almost always get noticeably wetter and often seem to enjoy sex more.

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  20. Here is a good article on this very subject that I just stumbled across: Are Birth Control Pills Changing Evolution? by Gary Vey http://www.viewzone.com/estrogen.html

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    • This article is a good summary of the issues and suggestive of a negative outcome.

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    • Interesting. If one were smart, one would only consider bitches not on the pill for LTR’s if you’re wanting to procreate one day.

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  21. http://medicalxpress.com/news/2011-10-women-pill-dud-bed-dude.html

    So it’s all about the inmunohistocompatibility complex after all, if we’re to believe this article. Women look for mates who have different genetic backgrounds when NOT on the pill, while it’s the opposite when ON the pill.

    Gee, no wonder my second cousin made a pass on me last year.

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    • dude i hope you didn’t pass it up!!!

      second-cousin amour is the HOTTEST

      it’s also why pakistan can’t defeat the waziri tribes ozozozlozzzozlzlzlz PAKISTAN ZINDABAD!!

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  22. There have been studies on the effects of levels of birth control hormones in water. The studies had the reptiles (frogs?) living in water which had a concentration lower than that found in most American municipal water supplies. The subsequent generations had a large increase in sexual organ development issues (being born with both types of sex organs, having underdeveloped male gonads, etc).

    Like studies of the effects of MSG, there won’t be much money spent on studies like this because the majority of our nation don’t really want to know the inconvenient truth.

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  23. “Although women on the pill, as far as I have experienced, don’t show some of the specific behaviors (morning sickness, odd food cravings) that pregnant women do. ”

    Ever been around a pregnant woman? Specifically one that you have impregnated? They are fucking crazy, bat-shit crazy. So yes, the pill is obviously making women these days exhibit at least that specific trait of pregnant women.

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  24. May be of relevance somewhere along the inquiry:

    No one knows what causes ovarian cancer. One theory is that the release of an egg each month—a process known as ovulation—results in damage to the ovarian surface. Over time, according to this theory, the ongoing damage can lead to ovarian cancer. If this is true, it would explain why birth control pills protect against ovarian cancer. Birth control pills prevent monthly ovulation. The theory might also explain how ART could lead to cancer. ART may increase the number of ovulations per cycle.

    Newer theories backed by research suggest that multiple ovulations don’t cause ovarian cancer. Still, things that increase how often a woman ovulates—for example, never having babies or not breast feeding—also increase the risk of ovarian cancer. Things that decrease the number of ovulations—for instance, having many children, breast feeding, or using birth control pills—reduce the risk. So it is possible that ART could increase the risk.

    […]

    Having babies is called parity. Not having babies is nulliparity. Parity lowers the risk of ovarian cancer. Nulliparity increases the risk.

    http://www.wcn.org/articles/quality_of_life/fertility/fertility_drugs/cancer_link.html

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  25. From the most recent thread:

    “ATrain
    Unrelated comment, regarding the pill

    Say what you want about the pill, but hear this. A period can be delayed up to a week by deviating from the prescription, but the period that eventually comes is heavy and painful. A sure fire way to know your game is tight is if a girl deliberately alters her pill prescription to avoid having a period while you’re in town. More so if she admits this to you. Even more so if she doesn’t complain about the period later on. Word.”

    Endometriosisburg, coming up. You may oust Nature with a pitchfork-shaped IUD, but she’ll come back at you with THE CANCER. lolozozozozz

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  26. “During ovulation, they unwittingly preferred the smell of men who were genetically dissimilar.
    The evolutionary explanation for this is that babies that are born from genetically dissimilar couples tend to be healthier and have a better chance of survival.”

    uh has another theory:

    “any port in the storm”

    no, really — while not ovulating, the woman is not as concupiscent, thus at leisure to skew the selection criteria; when ovulating, she’s horny and will take whatever cock happens to come around

    this is where ev psych errs slightly, always looking for a hidden genetic rationale in irrational behavior

    reality doesn’t discriminate. variation and selection are immense trial and error experiments over millions of years. an ovulating bitch isn’t after dissimilar genes for optimal offspring, she’s hot for ANY offspring at that point, the “trial” part of nature.

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  27. Hey brother,

    Just browsing your blog and saw this. I’ve done some research on this before; have a very recent blog post up on it now, referencing a trio of studies on attraction and the pill (including one just published by the Royal Society on the 12th).

    The post’s here:

    http://www.girlschase.com/content/whats-best-way-pick-girls-get-ones-looking-you

    If you want to head over to the abstracts yourself, they’re here:

    http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/early/2011/10/10/rspb.2011.1647.abstract

    http://pss.sagepub.com/content/15/3/203.short

    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0018506X05002564

    Fascinating stuff when you dig into it.

    Best,
    Chase

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