Women Want You To Cheat

Here’s a quote from a female commenter to an article about emotionally unavailable men that was posted over at one of those loser feminist sites that rhymes with Jizzabel:

This is me, I love my husband but every once in awhile I wish he weren’t so into me. I think I’m still emotionally unavailable but pretending not to be, because I know that deep down I do care about him, I’m just not really into caring yet.

The verdict is in: Women want men to cheat on them. Oh sure, they don’t *consciously* want their men to cheat, but unbeknownst to all but the most self aware women, their ginas tingle uncontrollably for men who can — and do — score some poon on the side.

Whenever a wife says she “cares about” her husband, you can bet her pussy has turned drier than Death Valley. Female “caring” is the anhedonic guilt blurt of the higher brain rationalizing the disgust of the hindbrain. This commenter’s marriage is doomed. Her husband is a romantic beta with visions of pedestals dancing in his head. He needs to pull back fast if there is any hope of avoiding divorce rape. Going to a hooker won’t cut it; the wifey needs to know her husband can win over women with his natural charms. Going to marriage counseling won’t cut it; tag teaming with a pseudoquack to berate her husband mercilessly while he sits there taking it like a dutiful herb schlub is no way to excite ginas. Doing more domestic chores won’t cut it; contrary to popular belief women aren’t aroused by men acting like women.

Here is my five point plan for saving faltering marriages:

  1. Stop giving compliments, flattery, and gifts.
  2. Come home from work late every night.
  3. Buy yourself new, stylish clothes.
  4. Cheat. If she asks, deny. No need to confess to the wife. She’ll be able to smell the competitor vaj juice on you.
  5. After three months of executing the above four points, unexpectedly tell your wife her ass looks great.

I challenge any multiple credentialed psychotherapists to prove me wrong. My simple five point system based in a clearheaded understanding of male-female biosocial differences VERSUS the peer reviewed, academically accredited expertise practiced by the husband-shaming marriage counseling industry. Mano a mangino.

Care to bet whose solution saves more marriages?





Comments


  1. I don’t think we want you to cheat – we just want you to be able to.

    Liked by 1 person


  2. on October 14, 2009 at 11:43 am Usually Lurking

    I don’t think we want you to cheat – we just want you to be able to.

    Which means that you want your husband to flirt with other girls.

    Liked by 1 person


  3. I concur w/ the 5 pt plan.

    Keeping long domesticated men and their heifer wives happy at home – and out of my sight – is good.

    Liked by 1 person


  4. on October 14, 2009 at 11:47 am Fijian in Portland

    You want us to cheat, but you don’t want us to leave you for like the starter wives that you typically are. You want us to be sexually desirable, desired by others… and fucked by other women.

    Its good, until we bang your closest bffs and your girl friends. Thats when your jealousy kicks in and you start worrying that your one of your own has intentions on your man.

    I, Bau have spoken.

    Liked by 1 person


  5. Some of the signs of a domesticated herb husbands I observe in public:

    – in the passenger seat of the car when sober *
    – pushes the stroller
    – wearing a papoose
    – wears khakis and has a frontal paunch
    – his wife makes innocent littel jokes abou thim at parties and he takes it
    – calls his wife “honey.”
    – she’s fat and he isn’t
    – other men talk directly to his wife, and not via him **

    (* PA sits in the passenger seat only when coming home from a party)

    ( ** even in casual situations like buying coffee at Starbucks, it is inappropriate to have one’s wife directly addressed by a male stranger; the man speaks for the family)

    Liked by 2 people


  6. “Which means that you want your husband to flirt with other girls.”

    No it means we want him to be attractive to other girls – there is a difference.

    Like


  7. on October 14, 2009 at 12:01 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””’Doing more domestic chores won’t cut it; contrary to popular belief women aren’t aroused by men acting like women.”””””””’

    lol

    ”””””’Its good, until we bang your closest bffs and your girl friends. Thats when your jealousy kicks in and you start worrying that your one of your own has intentions on your man.””””

    The secret to stopping the girlfriends from going after your man is not talking about the intimate details of sex with your man to them or bragging about how great he is. Of course its hard not to brag he he he

    Yea intermitantly had a soap opera on yesterday. Yea guys should prob force themselves to watch that shit in ten minute increments (so as not to go insane) to see what they may be dealing with.

    Constant scene change and talking. Intrigue and lies and some chick that is pregnant waiting for an ambulance to arrive saying shut up over and over to the men coming up with plans on what to do in the situation. That is when I said I’m not watching that shit turn it the fuck off.

    Like


  8. on October 14, 2009 at 12:03 pm Usually Lurking

    his wife makes innocent littel jokes abou thim at parties and he takes it

    This is a new thing and you see it in sitcoms all the time. But I can’t tell if popular culture is reflecting real life or the other way around.

    And, PA, don’t discount the fat wife that doesn’t make wholesome meals for her family, so you ultimately see fat husbands and fat children.

    Christ, it still amazes me how many women think that a home made meal comes from a can opener or a microwave.

    Like


  9. on October 14, 2009 at 12:05 pm Usually Lurking

    No it means we want him to be attractive to other girls – there is a difference.

    You did not say that you want him to be attractive…plenty of guys who are attractive to women are not able to cheat. And plenty of average looking guys and straight up assholes are.

    If you are a man, and you are not flirting, then you will never know if some girl wants you to fuck her.

    Like


  10. This was the most absurd post yet – I speak as a happily married man in my 60s. Roissy knows a lot about how to get laid. He knows pretty much nothing about what successful long-term marriages are like. Follow his advice here, particularly on cheating, and you will almost certainly end up divorced and paying alimony. Not a happy outcome. My suggestion to those husbands who sense boredom in their wives is to get out of the couch and out of the house with them, and relaunch some dating behaviors -new and different places and activities on the outside, and new sexual positions and acts at home. One wonders if Roissy knows any middle-aged couples at all and has asked them about their life experience.

    While I’m on the subject, I might as well add this: There’s another huge thing Roissy gets wrong, big time – that one’s attraction to one’s wife diminishes as she ages. Actually, in a good marriage, almost the opposite takes place. It will be hard for Roissy and most of the readers of his blog to believe this, but over time, the sexual attraction is based less on the presence or absence of wrinkles than on a lifetime of the most deeply shared experiences, values, and close friendship. It doesn’t mean that you’re oblivious to the appeal of a 20-year-old – beauty, like art, attracts. But if you think that the penis of a grownup responds only to firm breasts and not to a lifetime of love, you are quite wrong. Ask around.

    Liked by 1 person


  11. And, PA, don’t discount the fat wife that doesn’t make wholesome meals for her family, so you ultimately see fat husbands and fat children.

    Thre are two kinds of fat wives, one couls say: (1) the kind who grew a disgusting ass and thighs when still young because she’s a slovenly hog and stopped caring about being beautiful for her man, and (2) the older, matronly good wives whose also older alpha husbands don’t treally care about her weight gain, in light of her other virtues.

    In scenario 1 above, the fatness typically has a repellent, unhealthy quality to it.

    Scenario 2 makes you think of old-school older women you respect, like a favorite auntie, and they don’t normally impress you as unhealthy.

    Like


  12. on October 14, 2009 at 12:12 pm It's My First Day

    Basically, be Don Draper.

    Like


  13. Truth will out.

    Always flirt if you’re a man. Always. Flirt. If you want everyone to love you.

    Like


  14. aoefe–

    No it means we want him to be attractive to other girls – there is a difference.

    You’re wrong. Or at any rate your hindbrain WILL respond to your witnessing him successfully flirting with attractive other women by making you feel more attracted to him. A lot more especially if your attraction was waning.

    You will also feel at least tinges of insecurity/jealousy, and perhaps raging amounts of it, depending on many things.

    You may well deal with this conflict, especially considering the feminist messages of our culture, with indignation or outrage, and marshal that culture to clamp down on that activity of his as “not respecting you” and so on.

    Like


  15. Winston

    …Follow his [roissy’s] advice here, particularly on cheating, and you will almost certainly end up divorced and paying alimony.

    Then, ultimately
    complaining about it in
    The Spearhead

    Like


  16. Basically, be Don Draper.

    there’s a reason he has so many female fans.
    and no, it isn’t just his looks.

    Like


  17. on October 14, 2009 at 12:18 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””It’s My First Day
    Basically, be Don Draper.
    ””””
    Allright the one millionth don draper comment. What channel and when is it on I got to see it once.

    Like


  18. Women clearly get very upset when cheated on. They don’t even like it when a guy watches porn.

    I agree with aeofe, most women only want a guy who could cheat, not a guy who does cheat. They tend to become rather upset upon discovering affairs.

    Like


  19. I know a better way to ‘save’ marriages: DON’T GET MARRIED IN THE FIRST PLACE!

    For any man, the first step to beta-tization is signing a contract, putting your balls on the legal guillotine, and promising to assent/adhere to the ‘one man-one woman’ monogamy doctrine.

    Then when things aren’t that rosy anymore you resort to tips, tricks and tactics to bring the spice back into your marital life. And for what? To get wifey’s approval so you can use more of that same legal, rapidly deteriorating vagi-hole again.

    Ugh. Don’t do it, please.

    If your marriage falters, let it die, initiate divorce with minimized losses, THEN DON’T EVER DO IT AGAIN. If a woman asks you for a ring, give her a Dirty Sanchez. If she asks for gifts, give her your trash. Ask bread = give stone. Ask fish = give snake. Use the Biblical wisdom.

    Like


  20. Wow, I’ve been there. Now divorced and middle aged, this advice would have helped two years ago when my STBX was saying things like “I love you but I’m not in love with you” and “I love you, I just don’t want to be married to you any more.” I know it sounds cliche but yes, she said those things to my beta face. Before she cheated on me. Even after separation and she’d been dating another guy for months, she told me “I never stopped loving you.” Hmm. Whatever.

    Points #1 and #3 are part of being willing to leave your relationship, which is key. When my STBX wanted the separation and I didn’t, she gained all power and my betatude shot off the charts. Big mistake.

    I especially agree about marriage counseling. All it did was give her the courage and justification to tell me she wanted a separation. And when I was visibly upset, the counselor said “I can see you getting angry.” Like I wasn’t allowed to be upset. And damn, I was *paying* her. Welcome to the American divorce machine.

    However I disagree about cheating. That’s part of my traditional upbringing and my perhaps outdated faith that a strong loving partnership can be maintained between husband and wife if he is alpha and picks the right woman. The last part is tricky. At middle age we’re all damaged one way or the other – divorced, with or without kids, or never married. Fortunately my GF is a Midwestern farmer’s daughter with traditional values. When she thinks I’m flirting with other women, she bristles and fights for her turf (me!).

    Like


  21. Winston –

    There’s a difference between attraction and dependency. You cannot be more attracted to your wife more when you’re in your 60s than when you first got married. Impossible.

    The difference is that you’ve been with your wife so long that you can’t possibly imagine what your life would be like if she suddenly wasn’t there.

    Case in point – my parents. Should have probably been divorced years ago but stuck together probably for my sake. Dad’s a typical beta that puts up with Mom’s shit. He actually sleeps in the spare bedroom because he snores and Mom complained about it.

    Now my Dad is over 60, and absolutely requires my Mom’s presence. He dresses in jean shorts, high socks, sneakers and a tucked-in T-Shirt. And has a comb-over. It’s sad too, because Dad could be a really attractive older male if he shaved is head.

    Mom’s probably been cheating on him for years.

    And that’s why I’ve sought out Game. To not end up like Dad.

    Like


  22. @Winston

    Look, I think there is some merit to what you say, and I’ve seen many such marriages from your generation where this occurs. But you’re missing the key to that situation, which is overwhelmingly objective male power. For your generation, males, on average, were simply more socially powerful than were women, in an objective sense, so a man could afford the luxury of engaging in behaviors that Roissy calls beta. But that environment no longer exists for the generation entering marrying age today.

    If I were looking at marrying a woman 35 years my elder I would look to you for advice.

    Like


  23. Women’s attractivenes is passive. She can just stand there and be attractive.

    Men’s attractivenes is active. A men just standing there is a chump.

    Proactiveness and social proof are required for a man to be attractive (you can’t be socially confident / a leader while in isolation). Be it light flirting or more heavy matters. In fact, is best to keep an air of ambiguity all over it, so that she is wondering, “how far can/will he go with this?”

    Keep her on her toes by wondering whether you are just flirty or she might actually lose you…

    Ok, and keep things simple. If you’re worried about paying divorce/alimony, just don’t marry.

    Like


  24. Women want a Man that other men want to be, and other women want to ƒuck.

    Like


  25. Winston professes: “There’s another huge thing Roissy gets wrong, big time – that one’s attraction to one’s wife diminishes as she ages. Actually, in a good marriage, almost the opposite takes place. It will be hard for Roissy and most of the readers of his blog to believe this, but over time, the sexual attraction is based less on the presence or absence of wrinkles than on a lifetime of the most deeply shared experiences, values, and close friendship. It doesn’t mean that you’re oblivious to the appeal of a 20-year-old – beauty, like art, attracts. But if you think that the penis of a grownup responds only to firm breasts and not to a lifetime of love, you are quite wrong. Ask around.”

    I LIKE this guy!

    Like


  26. I LIKE this guy!

    that is because he told you, and himself, the pretty lies everyone craves.

    ps would you fuck him?

    Like


  27. Roissy said – ps would you fuck him?

    Nope he’s married. 😉

    Like


  28. @Winston, aoefe

    Yes, agreed, when you see that sort of thing it is quite touching. My take is that in order for that to happen you have to marry early, and it’s probably exclusively for people who’re devoutly religious. A part of me would still like to find that in a woman.

    Like


  29. the cited comment is incoherent and confused – she may have meant to write “available” instead of “unavailable”, which would make marginally more sense.

    i think aeofe is mainly right – it’s knowing their men are desired that helps generate/sustain female attraction. as long as he has female attention and the option to cheat, she will stay on her toes. complementary to that, if he’s “too into her,” it signals that he has few or no options.

    cheating crosses into an area that amplifies this but is more dangerous. there aren’t many Western women, certainly (non-Mormon) married women, that tolerate polygamy from average men. Maybe if the guy is an apex Alpha like a movie star or sports celebrity. But otherwise, women who stay with cheating husbands are those with no other options, for whatever reason (unattractiveness/age, kids, etc.) . Don’t forget infidelity is still viewed as grounds for divorce and all the legal ass-raping that entails, even in the no-fault age.

    with that in mind, i’d do everything on the checklist *except* #4, unless the marriage is miserable and/or already doomed.

    that said, this –

    Female “caring” is the anhedonic guilt blurt of the higher brain rationalizing the disgust of the hindbrain

    is a great insight. “caring” is affection without passion or love – you don’t “care” for a mate, you “care” for a pet.

    Like


  30. Nope he’s married.

    what if he was single?

    Like


  31. You know where I like my cheating? In my bedroom with my guy. There’s something really sexy/hot about him (or you) describing what he’d do to another woman.

    Like


  32. Here’s my five point plan for faltering marriages:

    –tape that big bonus check next to your groin and ask your wife to play “find the bonus”
    –after 3 kids, 20+ years of marriage, and mountains of laundry, tell her, “you’re nothin’ but a sex object to me.”
    –after 3 kids, 20+ years of marriage, and mountains of laundry, tell her, “thanks for doing my laundry, I appreciate it.”
    –maintain interesting friendships outside of the marriage. Don’t rely on her to generate and maintain your social life.
    –ensure that she is secure in your trust

    Like


  33. on October 14, 2009 at 12:45 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””’and mountains of laundry””””

    How sad it is for a life to consist of mountains of laundry. A tear almost forms there is def a moist spot. Maybe if it was hand washed would be something.

    Like


  34. Roissy asked “What if he were single?”

    He has character and I find that very attractive in a man. I’d have to meet him to know anything else – he could have alpha characteristics and still be a man of character. I don’t believe all alpha’s are assholes (my dad was a clear example of this).

    Like


  35. There’s something really sexy/hot about him (or you) describing what he’d do to another woman.

    fantasy is manifestation of our deepest real desires. the difference between coveting and committing is threadbare.

    Like


  36. Just avoid marriage. It is more work then it’s worth. You are essentially walking into slavery voluntarily.

    Like


  37. aoefe–

    I don’t think we want you to cheat – we just want you to be able to.

    North American women get far more upset and nuclear about it than just about any other women on the planet. That came in with first wave feminism actually, at the end of the 19th century as part of the campaign for easier divorce (which was VERY MUCH a female pushed issue and always has been in America). That’s when the notion that cheating BY EITHER spouse was automatically justified a divorce, and one where if the man was the cheater the woman ought to do well financially (live in the style to which she had become accustomed, was popularized in the culture though a real campaign. It’s also when prostitution, which used to be legal in many American states, was outlawed throught the country. Campaigns of the Women’s Christian Temperance Union.

    Discrete and reasonably limited male cheating never had been before and generally wasn’t considered such in other countries, so long as it wasn’t associated with the man abandoning his fatherly and husbandly duties. Now flagrant cheating or completely neglecting a wife is another matter and has always been a high female grievance, leaving aside some particularly decadent times and places.

    Like


  38. Asher’s dead on.

    look back 30 years, all the romantic movies were about poorer women overcoming social factors to find love with a superior man.
    Eg. pride and prejudice

    Now they’re about introverted men winning over a girl with much better options.
    Eg. everything.

    Like


  39. feminstx

    I agree with aeofe, most women only want a guy who could cheat, not a guy who does cheat. They tend to become rather upset upon discovering affairs.

    It’s preached endless in our feminist culture, going back to the earliest days of first wave American feminism, that they should be. In fact it’s preached that they can’t maintain any self respect at all or respect from the female friends, if they don’t go nuclear.

    Many other cultures are FAR more accomodating.

    Of course there’s going to be jealousy. And doing things in a humilitating way is never good.

    However American feminist culture essential requires women to automatically be humiliated no matter what.

    Like


  40. This inability to feel any attraction to women over 35 is an idiosyncrasy unique to Roissy. Every non Sub Saharan society has endorsed the concept of lifelong marriage for thousands of years. This would not be possible if men couldn’t be expected to remain mostly faithful to their wives as they aged. The divorce rate in male dominated societies is mostly about 2%. Most of those men can’t afford second wives or concubines either. They prefer to stay with an aging wife over getting a divorce.

    Like


  41. Roissy: “fantasy is manifestation of our deepest real desires. the difference between coveting and committing is threadbare.”

    I agree however unless we are pure hedonists we’ll recognize that it’s in our better interests to keep things on the fantasy level.

    Like


  42. desperado:
    Here’s my five point plan for faltering marriages:

    –tape that big bonus check next to your groin and ask your wife to play “find the bonus”

    so your solution to saving marriages is to treat the wife like a whore?

    –after 3 kids, 20+ years of marriage, and mountains of laundry, tell her, “you’re nothin’ but a sex object to me.”

    do you think lying is a sign of good character?

    –after 3 kids, 20+ years of marriage, and mountains of laundry, tell her, “thanks for doing my laundry, I appreciate it.”

    is a thank you enough to buy a wife’s satisfaction?

    –maintain interesting friendships outside of the marriage. Don’t rely on her to generate and maintain your social life.

    i.e. flirt with other women.

    –ensure that she is secure in your trust

    trust no one with the power of the state on their side.

    Like


  43. “Many other cultures are FAR more accomodating.”

    My other culture is even less accomodating than this one when it comes to affairs. My father was largely shut out of the Indian community after having an affair. Children get black listed from consideration for arranged marriages if a father is known to be unfaithful.

    Like


  44. she who i have hurt:
    This inability to feel any attraction to women over 35 is an idiosyncrasy unique to Roissy.

    oh, there are a few 35+ women that are attractive to men.
    just not nearly as many as <25 women.

    Every non Sub Saharan society has endorsed the concept of lifelong marriage for thousands of years.

    marriage does not necessarily equal attraction.
    or: attraction is not a choice, but marriage is.

    This would not be possible if men couldn’t be expected to remain mostly faithful to their wives as they aged.

    how many of those subsaharan hubbies are screwing around?

    The divorce rate in male dominated societies is mostly about 2%.

    male dominated societies can go too far in the testosteroney direction. see: all of arabia.

    Most of those men can’t afford second wives or concubines either. They prefer to stay with an aging wife over getting a divorce.

    the stamp of the state’s boot ensures that men in loveless sexless marriages with aging wives don’t have much of a choice.

    Like


  45. What was that novel I read that had a great scene on this point? Hemingway? It was set in WWI. A bunch of French soldiers in a trench or fort or hideout or something. One younger one had been cuckholded and crying and going on and on about it. “How could she do this to me?! I would never cheat on her….” He kept pounding that theme: how he loved her so much, loved her above all women, never even thought of other women, _would never cheat on her_… Until, finally, one of the older, rougher regular guys told him to shut up and stop crying.

    Don’t you get it, the older guy said. She cheated on you BECAUSE you would never cheat on her.

    Now there’s a non-Roissy way to look at it; that she cheated to break him out of this lame, adoring, spell. Like, if you would never cheat on her because you’re a man of your word and have sworn it off –like the vow and your manhood is holding you back and you’ll be damned if you let _yourself_ down before God and Man, that’s one thing. But if it’s because your under the spell of some sort of overwhelming mommy-love for your wife, that’s another thing. I think the latter type of restraint is the kind that turns off women; it’s too much; it’s weird; it’s creepy.

    Like


  46. Children get black listed from consideration for arranged marriages if a father is known to be unfaithful.

    As well they should. Kids of broken/unhappy homes tend to be retarded and unstable themselves. See: you.

    Like


  47. feministx

    Every non Sub Saharan society has endorsed the concept of lifelong marriage for thousands of years.

    Yes but every culture has also understood that elite men of various kinds (as well as rascals) will also have dalliances outside of their marriage at least after awhile and that that by itself is no good enough reason for divorce – until feminism in it’s more virulent Anglosaxon versions particularly.

    Like


  48. roissy, gang, a question. I saw this out at a bar the other night:

    Guy and moderate girl–a 6. They come in, and they clearly know the bartender—a chick who’s a 7. They stay for a while, and all three do a bunch of shots.

    Girlfriend of the guy, after making otu with him, leans over the bar and starts deep tonguing with the bartender chick. For a full on few minutes.

    Is the guy alpha or beta? I couldn’t decide. On one hand, she’s doing the drunk-lesbian thing that he might enjoy. On the other, his girl just cheated on him right in front of him.

    His face betrayed little but a smile. But it wasn’t encouraging either. Mona Lisa smile.

    Like


  49. feministx

    My other culture is even less accomodating than this one when it comes to affairs.

    Hindu Indian culture then, or at any rate your corner of it, is an outlier then. It also doesn’t seem to have been remotely the case classically in Hindu culture. E.g. at the time of the Kama Sutra, when concubines were common, as were temple and other prostitutes.

    Like


  50. on October 14, 2009 at 1:04 pm Gunslingergregi

    Yea lifelong marriage to multiple woman. Guy expected to provide for em woman expected to be faithfull.

    ””””Don’t you get it, the older guy said. She cheated on you BECAUSE you would never cheat on her.””””’

    May have hit nail on head.

    Like


  51. the stamp of the state’s boot ensures that men in loveless sexless marriages with aging wives don’t have much of a choice.>>>

    That stamp, though, went the backs of both parties. Women couldn’t leave either, which is one of the reasons why some argue beta males shouldn’t marry, that they’ll only end up being the retirement fund for some wench as she fucks whatever mud-turtle fucking alpha will have her.

    Like


  52. Chris

    Dad’s a typical beta that puts up with Mom’s shit.

    …[he] is over 60, and absolutely requires my Mom’s presence. He dresses in jean shorts, high socks, sneakers and a tucked-in T-Shirt. And has a comb-over.

    Dude, quit luring lilgrl, stilletto and femx back over here with descrips of your dad – we just got rid of them

    Like


  53. on October 14, 2009 at 1:04 pm Stud Dynamite

    roissy, two counter-points:

    1) you still have to engage, lead, wear pants, be alpha, whatever. Otherwise, if you stay distant, you might end up like Clooney’s character in Burn after reading. Kind of what happened to me, except she still wants to be with me.

    2) the whole concept of LTR game is flawed. You have to become this type of person, internalize it and want to be it. For some people it’s easy (hell I was cheating before I knew about any game). If you’re some kind of “traditional type”, I don’t think it just worth it for you. Especially gaming a bitch you don’t really love so she doesn’t take you to cleaners in divorce – would be just revolting.

    But besides that, yes, it absolutely works. If not at “saving marriage” (see my points above), but at creating and elevating the tingle for sure.

    Like


  54. on October 14, 2009 at 1:06 pm Gunslingergregi

    Lurker if he tongued both of them alpha. I never really felt the media inspired coolness of having your woman messing with other woman to your exclusion. I mean if they are both messing with you cool. I may want to see it once but for your chick to have a girlfriend fuck all that.

    Like


  55. Aoefe! I missed you my dear woman. Where have you been…

    Like


  56. There really is a difference between thinking your man *could* have someone, or many others, and *choosing* to be with you than thinking he has no other options, or, that he is availing himself of all the others. How much it matters to each woman varies, but the insistence that women don’t mind and get extra turned on by actual cheating is just as much a rank over-simplification as the party line that all cheating is horrific, disrespectful, and should lead to castration.

    To deny that by focusing only on biomechanics-is-god or hindbrains-rule-all is to engage in pretty (for men at least) lying.

    Like


  57. The wrong/beta kind of cheating that will kill a wife’s love is the kind where you fall in love with your mistress and become her beta supplicant.

    Mark Sanford appeared to have tiptoed close to that line when he started calling his Argentine mistress a “soulmate” in public.

    Like


  58. Correction: no contradiction. It’s not non-Roissy to the extent, like Roosh talks about too, having a mission and having the mission be paramount is the thing.

    Like


  59. on October 14, 2009 at 1:11 pm kevin de bruxelles

    I don’t think we want you to cheat – we just want you to be able to.

    You are basically describing mimetic desire. Rene Girard, a French anthropological philosopher, developed the theory that desire is not autonomous; that, for example, a wife’s desire can only be provoked by someone else desiring her lover/husband. This means the relationship of desire is not direct between the husband and wife; it is always triangular; there must always be a theoretical other who also desires her husband for the wife’s desire to not die away. As soon as the wife (or husband, it works both ways) realizes their partner is no longer desirable to others, they lose their desire as well. This means that no desires are authentic, only mimetic.

    Like


  60. PA, Right on.

    Like


  61. on October 14, 2009 at 1:13 pm Stud Dynamite

    lurker – it’s a question of who calls the shots. If he prompted the chicks to make out with each other that’s cool. If not and he’s rather ignored – well, wouldn’t call it cheating, but not an alpha move.

    Like


  62. Dude, quit luring lilgrl, stilletto and femx back over here with descrips of your dad – we just got rid of them

    I wonder if Mom is posting here under those names.

    Like


  63. LTR game boils down to this:

    Both parents dutifully sacrificing most of their needs (including sexual) for the benefit of children incapable of meeting their own.

    Sex becomes rutting
    to satisfy the physiological need
    to clear the pipes – like taking a shit.

    Just close your eyes. Pretend she’s Megan Fox or he’s Brad Pitt. Stir until orgasm. Need met: get up and change another diaper

    Got it?

    Like


  64. on October 14, 2009 at 1:17 pm Rollo Tomassi

    Guys who tell you how much better, meaningful, etc. sex is after marriage are simply making their necessity a virtue.

    Like


  65. also, amoral beings like women want their men to pump and dump the mistress.

    women find some sadistic pleasure in knowing their husbands are simply using the mistress

    Like


  66. PA–

    Good insight.

    Like


  67. Chris, as I implied but now say explicitly, you just don’t get it. Not only isn’t it “impossible” that I’m more attracted to my wife now than when she was young, that is precisely what I am. There are many reasons one gets married, and physical attraction is not nearly the major part – not in an age of sexual liberation. My wife has aged beautifully, and to me she is at least as attractive as she was decades ago – sure, not if you go by PICTURES of her side by side. But in all the ways that really matter. By the way, she feels the same way. Roissy is right, but only up to a point: the purely physical part of lust is, well, purely physical. But other elements come into play over time, in a sustained relationship. You only have the view you do because you don’t know any better.

    Roissy, why question my veracity – because what I’m telling you doesn’t comply with YOUR life view?

    As for a few of the other comments: We’re not religious in any way. And on the assumption that my views are characteristic of men in my generation, and don’t apply to young men and women today, that may well be true. But from what I see in my own children and their friends, the differences AFTER MARRIAGE are not as great as you suggest. In any case, if you want to test one of my fundamentals, vs. Roissy’s, and cheat on your wife, try it and see who’s right. Good luck – believe me, you will need it.

    Like


  68. The Truth greeted me -“I missed you my dear woman. Where have you been…”

    It is very nice to be missed. 🙂

    Like


  69. I’m not totally on board with this post. I have had several meaningful conversations about this with my old lady (who is South American, which definitely colors her perception of male infidelity). She agrees that a few outside adventures here and there are not deal-breakers for the marriage, but her fear is that I will fall in love with another (younger) woman and leave her. She knows that my physical needs are barely satisfied by her (although we have hot sex 5-7 times per week, sometimes up to 10 times), and that I have a lot of opportunities with other women. She claims to understand that the occasional indiscretion is acceptable, as long as it is purely physicial and meaningless. I have had situations which lead me to believe that she does, indeed, tolerate a bit of tomcatting, but she also rightly understands that she is my main woman, and that we are in it for the long haul. Emotional and economic betrayal are her big concerns….not whether I tup some dull girl.

    And I would feel the same way about her….a lot of the posters here obsess about female infidelity, but I don’t really understand why. I have no reason to believe she has cheated on me, but if she has, so what? I still get the extraordinary loving and affection of my woman everyday. If that were to decline, I might have reason to be concerned. Likewise, if my straying were to affect the way I treated her, her alarms would go off. As long as everybody is happy at home, who cares about some trivial needs that are being met outside the home?

    I wouldn’t be so hard on Winston. He makes some important points.

    Like


  70. Firepower advised – “Just close your eyes. Pretend she’s Megan Fox or he’s Brad Pitt. Stir until orgasm. Need met: get up and change another diaper”

    I’ve heard the early years of child rearing described as the long-short years. For those who’ve past them they seem like they flew by and for those still in them they seem endless.

    Like


  71. for those still in them they seem endless.

    ugh. kids are a fun suck.

    Like


  72. aoefe

    Firepower advised – “Just close your eyes. Pretend she’s Megan Fox or he’s Brad Pitt. Stir until orgasm. Need met: get up and change another diaper”

    I’ve heard the early years of child rearing described as the long-short years. For those who’ve past them they seem like they flew by and for those still in them they seem endless.

    Yep. Once the biological urge to reproduce has succeeded the scenario changes.

    The little tykes go off to successive Obama Re-education Camps, then fly the nest on their own to become little independent thinkers who all like the same band, club and reality show.

    The rents, their DNA spent like a flopping salmon or a dried out Cicada husk, curl up and die in the end that awaits us all:

    incontinent
    Senior
    Sex

    Like


  73. While women are on average more tolerant of cheating, most absolutely loathe it. There are plenty of women who will divorce you just for cheating.

    Doug is wrong about the history of cheating. It was much more tolerated among both men and women in Continental Europe, but mainly because the custom there was something close to arranged marriage. Once love matches started to be the norm, particularly in the Anglosphere, tolerance for cheating by either sex went way down.

    Like


  74. @backdoor man – “I have no reason to believe she has cheated on me, but if she has, so what? I still get the extraordinary loving and affection of my woman everyday.”

    If she were cheating you wouldn’t get that. Women are NOT capable of compartmentalizing like men are. The majority of women need to get emotionally attached in order to have sex. Roissy’s game strategy helps women get there quickly by breaking down thier ASD etc etc. We can not easily screw another man and then come home and be loving to hubby, not for the long term. She’ll leave you for the other man sooner rather than later if he’s single.

    I take comfort in the fact that if my man cheated he’d be able to separate the two far more easily. The only reason I’d want my man to cheat is for sexual pleasure/variety not for emotional connection – that would be my job. I gotta admit I want to be numero uno and I’m theorizing, it would not make it any easier to accept it.

    Like


  75. Winston is right. A long shared history can deepen love and make a man prefer sex with his older wife to a young hottie. However, that history had better include some hot sex while she was in her salad days.

    Like


  76. “Cheat. If she asks, deny.”

    I was under the impression that alphas never deny,they’re unapologetic.

    Like


  77. Winston is right. A long shared history can deepen love and make a man prefer sex with his older wife to a young hottie.

    that’s just something older married guys tell themselves.

    However, that history had better include some hot sex while she was in her salad days.

    all these memories
    lost
    like tears in rain.

    Like


  78. Women dont’ like cheating not because of feminist influence but because it cuts to the core of our worth. It hurts like a bugger (had it happen and forgave) and takes a huge chunk of our own perceived value as a person.

    Was I turned on by the fact he could get another woman? No, I already had no doubt about it.

    Did we ever use his experience with her in bed as fantasy? No, it cut way to close to home.

    For him it remains the number 1 regret about our lengthy relationship, I cut him way more slack than he cut himself. And yes he was an alpha and yes he was a man of character.

    Like


  79. I was under the impression that alphas never deny,they’re unapologetic.

    alphas know when discretion is the better part of self-interest.

    Like


  80. Hmm that five point system sounds about right. I would also go a little further to tell the beta husband to start giving his wife a hard time about things… busting her balls. “Sweetheart, what did I say about this type of behavior? Looks like you’ll be sleeping on the couch tonight” said in a tone that she can’t tell if he’s joking or not.

    Like


  81. “- pushes the stroller
    – wearing a papoose”

    Taking care of your offspring should be priority one. If you godda push a stroller now and again, who the f cares? There are many non gay ways to sport a child and not lose your bll sack in the process. Think “There Will Be Blood.” though try not to make your son deaf, lay off the alcohol and dial down the a-hole by 25%.

    Plus, ”baby game” is so easy the govt will probably tax and regulate it. Caveat: your child has to be cute. Universally cute, not just baby cute.

    If you don’t want to care for your kid(s) directly, then pay to have it done and/or make sure the sperm dumpster you dribbled your spunk in is doing a decent job.

    If everyone, both men and woman would properly care for their offspring, we would have a lot less beta POS and less soul sucking whores.

    I have also noticed that dealing with toddlers is disturbingly similar to dealing with most woman. If you can deal with a difficult toddler your 75% on your way to handling any crazy lady. Toddlers and most woman are yanked around by their primitive sides. If Supernanny dropped 100 pounds, lost most of the pop psyche crap and turned into a man, she would be alpha supreme.

    Side note:

    Dealing with bitter beta bosses is the same. I learned the hard way to treat my boss with the same subtle style that I use with my wife and kid and the results are astounding.

    Depressing, but if that’s the way some people work, that’s the way you have to work them. Or your going to get your ass handed to you.

    Like


  82. Was I turned on by the fact he could get another woman? No, I already had no doubt about it.

    this suggests you were batting out of your league with him. in such scenarios, it is more likely that a higher value cheating man will cause more pain with his infidelity than a similarly ranked cheating man would.

    Like


  83. I have to second the question already asked, who are the ones telling themselves pretty lies here?

    Like


  84. @aoefe,

    “We can not easily screw another man and then come home and be loving to hubby, not for the long term. She’ll leave you for the other man sooner rather than later if he’s single.”

    I agree with you. Which is why I have no reason to believe my woman is cheating or even entertaining the thought of doing so. My comment was mostly directed toward the guys are crazed with anger at the idea of their woman cheating on them. If you treat your woman right, and your relationship is solid, you don’t have to worry about her straying. And the more you worry about it, the more likely it will happen.

    Like


  85. on October 14, 2009 at 1:57 pm sadaboutgirls

    I think it might be good advice to actually start having an affair when the woman becomes a harpy, but to pretend you’re having an affair is lame. I say, either forget the bitch and have an affair, if she comes around, fine; or try to salvage it in some way like by going on a nice vacation or showing her a good time in other ways/surprising her somehow.

    Like


  86. al

    but the insistence that women don’t mind and get extra turned on by actual cheating is just as much a rank over-simplification as the party line that all cheating is horrific, disrespectful, and should lead to castration.

    Who’s said women don’t mind? They’re almost always made both jealous and insecure by it. How much so though will depend upon a lot of things.

    One of those things though, and a very strong force, is our feminist culture. The feminist media culture insists loudly, clearly, unambiguously, and basically brooking no dissent to women that they 1) cannot be self respecting if they allow it to continue and don’t at a minimum punish their husband very seriously, and that that has to involve at least implicitly threatening divorce; 2) that it’s a betrayal of other women and even the most basic feminism if they aren’t fully on board with this; and 3) it’s fundamentally an utter betrayal of the marriage by him and always unforgivable (even if e.g. she lost all interest in sex no matter what he did for a prolonged period after giving birth or for some other reason, etc.).

    The truth is that male cheating is inherently FAR less threatening to a relationship than female cheating usually or nearly always is. Men are FAR less likely to really strongly bond due to a just sex, or almost just sex limited affair than women are. Particularly alpha or alphaish men are vastly less likely to. Even when the woman doesn’t strongly bond with her lover she will usually UNBOND with her husband if she has an affair that goes on. What makes male cheating so threatening to marriages is the feminist ideology that it must not ever be tolerated whatsoever. It’s ideology. And also women misreading that men will respond to cheating in the same way they likely would, or there’s great danger they would.

    This is another way of getting to PA’s insight. The most threatening kind of affair to a wife or other LTR (who’s willing to make distinctions at all rather than just going into a culturally inspired rage) is with a much younger woman the wife sees as a gold digger and whom she’s convinced has her husband completely wrapped around her finger, beta style.

    Limited open arrangements with rules including veto rights are much better than cheating though, with it’s betrayal of trust. Backdoor man gives his own example. If trust is betrayed in a limited and not genuinely very threatening way with one person there’s always the feeling that the spouse might not in actual fact put ANY limits on the betrayal in another more tempting situation.

    Aoefe’s just above is right about the sex differences though, and how much more threatening it is when a woman play’s outside marriage.

    The exception ironically might be certain kinds of real sluts married to a real alpha. But how often is that the case? As well how likely is it that the real slut isn’t going to be humiliating and notorious about her activities once she gets going, as she likely will. Finally there’s just the message in our culture that if she isn’t feeling it any more she doesn’t have to stay in the relationship, whereas we tell men that they do even when they aren’t, and that they need to “work through their issues” when they aren’t feeling it much anymore. THe man has to have serious grievances for our culture to ever tell him it’s ok to leave the marriage; not so for women. Thank you American mainstream media feminism.

    Like


  87. this suggests you were batting out of your league with him. in such scenarios, it is more likely that a higher value cheating man will cause more pain with his infidelity than a similarly ranked cheating man would.

    Below is so basic and inherent in, imho, most women of reasonable sensibility:

    Women don’t like cheating not because of feminist influence but because it cuts to the core of our worth. It hurts like a bugger . . . and takes a huge chunk of our own perceived value as a person.

    that it can’t be dismissed as specific to limited circumstances. (also, how often do women really bat out of their league in LTR? Not so much, imho.)

    We really can genuinely feel and experience outside of our hindbrains or base genetic coding. (and at that level too, obvs.)

    Like


  88. I have to second the question already asked, who are the ones telling themselves pretty lies here?

    as you are a traditionalist, thursday, i would expect you to moan and groan about the unsavory calculations and machinations that animate marriage.

    thought experiment:

    put winston’s old wife naked on all fours on one bed with her droopy ass facing outward in one room.

    put a young hottie naked on all fours on another bed with her taut ass facing outward in another room.

    escort winston to the rooms, where he will enter by himself one after the other to view the spectacle arranged for him, then have him come out of the rooms to decide which of the two he will fuck. he can only choose one for the night.

    tell him there will be no repercussions for any sexual act he chooses to commit in either room. both women have heartily given the greenlight to whatever he wants, so guilt and shame are rendered irrelevant. the spurned woman will not know if winston fucked the other woman, for she has been told winston is free to choose to abstain from any sex, though winston has been told otherwise.

    in your idealistic heart of hearts, thurs, which woman do you think winston chooses?
    whcih woman do 99% of winstons choose?

    Like


  89. alfred:
    also, how often do women really bat out of their league in LTR?

    more now than ever.

    Like


  90. Doug I don’t necessarily disagree with most of your points, but there is a disconnect as to matter of degree, and, to some extent, what I see as a dismissal of part of the wife’s above experience by over focusing on *one* particular aspect of her experience.

    Like


  91. more now than ever.

    See virtually any lower middle class or blue collar couple: ruggedly handsome guy, FAAAAAT wife with an attitude.

    Like


  92. Roissy’s writing out his ass here (not for the first time).

    Women are more tolerant of cheating (as long as their material security or that of their children aren’t threatened) than men are. That doesn’t mean they like it.

    Women are turned on by the idea that their mates are desirable to other women but that they have too much self-control and respect for the wives to do so. Once the guy proves he’s just another horndog who stops thinking when his dick gets hard, that dream dies as does a chunk of her emotional attachment and a big part of whatever kind of respect she had for the guy (though she may continue to pay him courtesy respect out of consideration for the fragile male ego).

    Sometimes chronic cheating can provoke maternal instinct fantasies, where she’s a wise, virtuous influence on her misbehaving little boy husband (see Clintons).

    Like


  93. on October 14, 2009 at 2:11 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    Ideology might trump biology in some cases on this one. Women definitely want a man who’s capable of cheating and the gina will tingle if he does, but that doesn’t mean she isn’t going to leave you over it if she’s a really wholesome/religious type. It depends on the woman in most cases, chances are though cheating or even giving the illusion of doing so is going to produce good results.

    Like


  94. @Roissy,

    by your “thought experiment” for Thursday, you give birth to the lie that men chose asses for sex. A LIE. Men chose women. Even in brothels, men choose women, not asses.

    Like


  95. on October 14, 2009 at 2:13 pm Stud Dynamite

    aoefe: Was I turned on by the fact he could get another woman? No, I already had no doubt about it.

    But were you in love with him at the time? What “5-step” is about is rekindling a relationship in the rut, reversing the beta-izing.

    Like


  96. In that case, Aoefe, I’ve missed you too.

    Aoefe’s right about women wanting men to be able to cheat, rather than actually carrying it out. I haven’t watched this season yet, so I’m shooting a little blind here, but we all know that in real life, Don Draper would be likely looking at a divorce. Whether their ginas are tingling or not, women tend to be more pragmatic than men.

    Don’t get me wrong, I agree completely with (and live by) the premise that the “dangerous” guy is going to spark a wife’s lust much more than the beta. And even those little doubts she may have of Is he?” can play perfectly into the guy’s hand . . . to a point. But a woman wants to believe that although her man can have any girl he wants, he still somehow stays faithful to her. It’s the ultimate stroke to her ego.

    Women love Don Draper, cheating and all. But I guarantee that every one of those women fantasizes that if they were with him, he’d miraculously have eyes for only them. Taming the wild horse, as it were. (There’s a reason girls love horses.)

    Like


  97. My dad was the quintessential Alpha male (great physical specimen – multi-decorated war hero – successful in business – natural leader of men) – and a fairly successful ladies man before he married.

    He adored my mother – and she him – throughout their marriage. I fully believe he was faithful to her. I would not doubt that he loved her more as time went on, certainly no less.

    Like


  98. “she who i have hurt:”

    This made me smile. thank you.

    “oh, there are a few 35+ women that are attractive to men.
    just not nearly as many as <25 women."

    I know, but when we are talking about a man's wife, she might be unattractive to most men, but she could still be attractive to her husband. You can say that's because married men tell themselves a pretty lie, but if it's something they really believe, it becomes the truth.

    "marriage does not necessarily equal attraction.
    or: attraction is not a choice, but marriage is.

    I do not think the concept of marriage would have been upheld for this long in societies that men run if males were unable to remain attracted enough to their wives to fuck them instead of a series of young women.

    "how many of those subsaharan hubbies are screwing around?"

    What does it matter what they do if you are not of African descent?

    "male dominated societies can go too far in the testosteroney direction. see: all of arabia."

    Yes, I know. Hence I prefer the feminist world. In my book, the world can't be too rich or too thin or too feminist.

    "the stamp of the state’s boot ensures that men in loveless sexless marriages with aging wives don’t have much of a choice."

    Most men are beta and can stand to live without that choice.

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  99. desperado:
    by your “thought experiment” for Thursday, you give birth to the lie that men chose asses for sex. A LIE. Men chose women. Even in brothels, men choose women, not asses.

    don’t be a dumbass, though i know i’m asking too much of you. the taut ass description was shorthand for an all-around hotter younger woman.

    christ you are a desperate aging cunt.

    Like


  100. Roissy:

    Winston is right. A long shared history can deepen love and make a man prefer sex with his older wife to a young hottie. However, that history had better include some hot sex while she was in her salad days.

    Can. Never said most women were good enough partners to make it so.

    P.S. al just caught you making up implausible ad hoc explanations.

    Like


  101. If you do cheat on your pregnant girlfriend, hitting her in the head with a hammer while she’s asleep and then pretending ‘burglars’ did it is not a way to rekindle her interest in you (in any positive sense).

    dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1220357/Father-tried-beat-heavily-pregnant-girlfriend-death-hammer-cash-run-new-love.html

    Like


  102. in a past LTR, my then-girlfriend would explicitly tell me that she’d wish i would at least cheat on her rather than remain “emotionally distant”. i didn’t, but i should have.

    Like


  103. on October 14, 2009 at 2:18 pm Gen'l Butt Naked

    Winston: This was the most absurd post yet – I speak as a happily married man in my 60s.

    And this is most of what we need to know about Winston. Many of the older generations simply have no clue. They were raised during a time when the current standards of conduct were unthinkable.

    Like


  104. more now than ever.

    See virtually any lower middle class or blue collar couple: ruggedly handsome guy, FAAAAAT wife with an attitude.

    Isn’t one of the points of this and similar sites that men these days have been hamstrung, or hamstrung themselves, such that they’re not at their full potential? That the man, above, is allowing his fat bitch wife to be so? And has his own value lowered?

    That said, I can only go off personal experience; out of my many gfs I don’t think any have scored out of their league.

    alfred:

    Sweet! I’m learning to write like a man! (don’t count the number of “I”s dana.)

    Like


  105. clifford the small red dog:
    Women are turned on by the idea that their mates are desirable to other women but that they have too much self-control and respect for the wives to do so. Once the guy proves he’s just another horndog who stops thinking when his dick gets hard, that dream dies as does a chunk of her emotional attachment and a big part of whatever kind of respect she had for the guy

    a man’s natural sexual desire is not given virtue by a woman’s respect for it.

    Like


  106. “Hindu Indian culture then, or at any rate your corner of it, is an outlier then. It also doesn’t seem to have been remotely the case classically in Hindu culture. E.g. at the time of the Kama Sutra, when concubines were common, as were temple and other prostitutes.”

    Doug, even serial axe murdering wouldn’t be considered a good reason for divorce in Indian society. But a man havning an affair does have social consequences. People stop inviting you to important functions like weddings and religious ceremonies. Once we had a guest in our house, and she heard through the grapevine that my dad was having an affair. She went totally apeshit. She packed her bags in a frenzy and started swearing that there was a demon in our house and that she needed to get out immediately or else bad fate would come to her family as well. She ran out of the house in about 10 minutes and found somewhere else to stay. Years later, she sent me a giant jade necklace as a means of condolence. Either she was sorry for throwing the fit in front of me or she felt bad that my parents eventually divorced.

    I thought her fit was kind of hysterical.

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  107. out of my many gfs I don’t think any have scored out of their league.

    Right, alphas tend to be really picky about their LTRs.

    Like


  108. feministx.blogspot.com

    …I thought her fit was kind of hysterical

    And you immediately returned
    that jade necklace

    Like


  109. Anony is cheating on her husband by virtue of spending time on this blog for about the past year, and continuing to argue with a blogger who keeps insulting her.

    It’s not really all that different than flirting with some guy online.

    Anony, what would your hubby do if he found out some guy — a flesh and blood author behind the virtual blog persona — keeps calling you a c*nt and you keep coming back to him for more?

    He’d probably break into song:

    How long has this been goin’ on ?
    How long has this been goin’ on ?

    Like


  110. Can. Never said most women were good enough partners to make it so.

    well, as no woman is immune from the slow decay of aging, that “most women” would pretty much include all of them.

    P.S. al just caught you making up implausible ad hoc explanations.

    comfort in allies.

    Like


  111. the taut ass description was shorthand for an all-around hotter younger woman

    then why did you not state, “all-around hotter younger woman?'”

    ………..because Winston would pick his wife. Sex with wife he loves is more satisfying than sex with a body. Casual sex is minimally satisfying for men, and disappointing for women. Women like being desired, not the sex per se.

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  112. Thursday I’m a girl, and “my many gfs” refer to my female friends; sorry for lack of clarity. (I’m over the age of death, so I been through heaps of wedding celebrations.)

    But hey! I don’t think I’ve ever scored out of my league either! I have tried what I thought, even at the time, was dating down and it suuuuuucked. Clingy = death to tingle.

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  113. @ Roissy,

    , as no woman is immune from the slow decay of aging, that “most women” would pretty much include all of them.

    shall we review the effects of aging on men, ………..on their aging erections?

    Like


  114. on October 14, 2009 at 2:30 pm Stud Dynamite

    Riff Dog – we all know that in real life, Don Draper would be likely looking at a divorce. Whether their ginas are tingling or not, women tend to be more pragmatic than men.

    so don’t cheat on your wife because you’re afraid she’ll leave you for pragmatic reasons, or you have to cheat on her because you afraid she’ll lose attraction and leave.. why the fuck marry someone you’re afraid of?

    Like


  115. kevin:

    Rene Girard, a French anthropological philosopher, developed the theory that desire is not autonomous; that, for example, a wife’s desire can only be provoked by someone else desiring her lover/husband. This means the relationship of desire is not direct between the husband and wife; it is always triangular; there must always be a theoretical other who also desires her husband for the wife’s desire to not die away. As soon as the wife (or husband, it works both ways) realizes their partner is no longer desirable to others, they lose their desire as well. This means that no desires are authentic, only mimetic.

    Nice.

    Women can’t judge quality objectively.

    They are fundamentally sheep.

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  116. roissy you understand the difference btw your point and winston‘s, so insisting on a test that doesn’t directly address his point is attempting to diminish it without meeting it on its merits.

    – You’re asking him to be honest and judge on what he finds most lust-inducing; he’s already admitted to lust at youth.
    – He’s asking you to consider that at some point the experience with his wife is difference than merely lust-inducing, but somehow encapsulates and expands beyond it. (or so I’m translating.)

    That doesn’t mean he wouldn’t want/enjoy having a random, one-off, lust filled night with someone consequences free, nor does the fact that he might it invalidate his point about the experience with his wife.

    And all of you need to remember that at 60 he is still a baby boomer, and lots of baby boomers are as castrated as men today. He is not of WWII gen.

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  117. alfred:
    Isn’t one of the points of this and similar sites that men these days have been hamstrung, or hamstrung themselves, such that they’re not at their full potential?

    mmm, i dunno if potential is the word i’d use. anyhow, it’s less about men hamstringing themselves than it is about women capitalizing on the favorable cultural, legal, and biological climate to date up higher than they used to be able to. and, consequently, leaving men in a state of delusion.

    That the man, above, is allowing his fat bitch wife to be so? And has his own value lowered?

    i was talking about aeofe’s hurt over her cheating bf. i suggested, rather impertinently but honestly, that women who date out of their league are more hurt “to the core” by infidelity than women who have been cheated on by more reasonably paired partners. this is so because the lower value man can get more gina tingle mileage from cheating or hinting at cheating than can a relatively higher value man who already has the gina tingle on lockdown.

    That said, I can only go off personal experience; out of my many gfs I don’t think any have scored out of their league.

    i wouldn’t expect you to say anything else.

    Sweet! I’m learning to write like a man! (don’t count the number of “I”s dana.)

    well, you do write kind of like a dood. not that there’s anything wrong with it.

    Like


  118. desperado:
    shall we review the effects of aging on men, ………..on their aging erections?

    i’m with PA. what does your loving hubby think of your yearlong desperate ploys for my kickass attention?

    Like


  119. desperado:
    then why did you not state, “all-around hotter younger woman?’”

    because i figured the studio audience was smart enough to understand the creative license.
    clearly, i figured wrong. you must’ve slipped my mind.

    Like


  120. @R

    “your yearlong desperate ploys for my kickass attention.”

    Why do you give attention to my comments?
    if you ignored them , I’d be less likely to return.
    you attend to my comments because they bare truth

    Like


  121. i was talking about aeofe’s hurt over her cheating bf. i suggested, rather impertinently but honestly, that women who date out of their league are more hurt “to the core” by infidelity than women who have been cheated on by more reasonably paired partners. this is so because the lower value man can get more gina tingle mileage from cheating or hinting at cheating than can a relatively higher value man who already has the gina tingle on lockdown.

    I did not pick up on this distinction.
    I withdraw my comments pending some pondering, once I get over my knee-jerk emotional reaction.

    Like


  122. Confirming Roissy’s point of view.

    Cheated on my girlfriend of 7 months last week. Didn’t tell her. For some reason, this week she’s particularly into me. She’s told me so, and we’ve been having marathon sex.

    I don’t know how women sense such things, but they do.

    Like


  123. Its kind of funny reading women comments on here.
    The lies they tell to themselves.

    Yeah..whatever helps you sleep at night mah.

    Like


  124. roissy the emotional cripple:

    “a man’s natural sexual desire is not given virtue by a woman’s respect for it.”

    Women don’t respect natural sexual desire (in anyone) they respect character. The fantasy is a man who’s able to cheat, maybe even tempted, but who has too much character to give in.

    That fantasy dies when the man cheats and some of her respect for him is inevitable collateral damage.

    Like


  125. The fantasy is a man who’s able to cheat, maybe even tempted, but who has too much character to give in.

    That fantasy dies when the man cheats and some of her respect for him is inevitable collateral damage.

    Bingo to Cliff for the win. Women lose respect for cheating men. no respect————–> no desire.

    Like


  126. alfred:
    roissy you understand the difference btw your point and winston’s, so insisting on a test that doesn’t directly address his point is attempting to diminish it without meeting it on its merits.

    let’s review what winston wrote, shall we lawyer-girl?:

    There’s another huge thing Roissy gets wrong, big time – that one’s attraction to one’s wife diminishes as she ages. Actually, in a good marriage, almost the opposite takes place. It will be hard for Roissy and most of the readers of his blog to believe this, but over time, the sexual attraction is based less on the presence or absence of wrinkles than on a lifetime of the most deeply shared experiences, values, and close friendship. It doesn’t mean that you’re oblivious to the appeal of a 20-year-old – beauty, like art, attracts. But if you think that the penis of a grownup responds only to firm breasts and not to a lifetime of love, you are quite wrong.

    my leetle experiment (which, btw, could be repeated over and over and over with pretty much the same results for nearly every man who isn’t a brainwashed religious nut) proved quite conclusively and deliciously that winston and winston-like simulacras would invariably choose the younger, tauter hottie over the aged wife for all-night sex romps, given zero repercussions, guilt or shame. this choice would reflect a deep seated SEXUAL ATTRACTION for the hottie over the nottie, DESPITE the years of shared experiences, values, and close friendship proffered by winston as reasons for his claimed increasing sexual attraction to his old wife.
    a simple side by side compar-ass-on, as it were, was all it took to put the lie to that oh so typical self-delusion.

    Like


  127. There are some problems with Roissy’s post here.

    1. If he is giving advice to betas/herbs…then how can they cheat? According to “THE ROISSY WORLD VIEW” aren’t they powerless/sexless?

    2. Women ARE attracted to cheaters, BUT that doesn’t mean they don’t leave cheaters. Believe it or not, women do leave men they are attracted to.

    Sure, the sting of divorce may not be so bad when she is leaving because you cheated vs. leaving becuase she lost attraction, but it still happens…every day.

    3. As mentioned in a previous post…women are always looking for incomptibility issues. Housework and “talking more” are generally avoidable (and certainly not to be done all of the time), YET not doing these things starts making her hampster wheel of incompatability turn.

    If you piss all over the toilet every day, she may not see you as a beta but she may start to convince herself that you two aren’t “meant to be together.”

    My main point being…women leave men for other reasons than loss of attraction/beta behavior. Roissy all out misses that here… to the point of it becoming a piss poor post.

    Like


  128. @collegeboy: I agree, half the fun here is reading what women write and the stupid shit they say. It’s almost like they *want* to be deluded. It’s no wonder that everything great in the modern world was accomplished by men. Women are just so friggin’ stupid.

    It’s too bady Wendy Schwartz is gone. She was the best at self-delusion.

    Like


  129. desperado:
    Why do you give attention to my comments?

    why does a cat bat around his prey?

    if you ignored them , I’d be less likely to return.

    you often return unprompted. nice try.

    you attend to my comments because they bare truth

    i attend to your comments because they serve as a great example of stupidity and self-deceit.

    Like


  130. @ roissy
    I have to second the question already asked, who are the ones telling themselves pretty lies here?
    as you are a traditionalist, thursday, i would expect you to moan and groan about the unsavory calculations and machinations that animate marriage.
    thought experiment:
    put winston’s old wife naked on all fours on one bed with her droopy ass facing outward in one room…………………

    though experiment

    remove all consequences of reality and he goes for the hot young ass 99% of the time.

    Wow. That’s enlightening. No friggn shit.

    Remove all consequences and most would be on drugs all the time.

    Remove all consequences and most would kill anyone who even slightly annoys them.

    Remove all consequences and most would drive drunk 50 miles per over the limit, texting, with 15 year old wenches in the trunk.

    The consequences exist and we make the best life within the context of them.

    Your insight is top notch, though how you choose to use it and some of the advice you give falls under the, “great work if you can get it” category,

    thought excrement

    Like


  131. The woman will only lose respect for the man if he apologizes, begs and pleads for her to take him back; or if he begs for her forgiveness.

    If the man is unapologetic- and he tells the woman:
    It happened- take me or leave me- the past is the past- your choice to stay or go- she will love him even more, IF she voluntarily chooses to remain.

    Like


  132. on October 14, 2009 at 2:54 pm ironrailsironweights

    Here is my five point plan for saving faltering marriages:

    Stop giving compliments, flattery, and gifts.
    Come home from work late every night.
    Buy yourself new, stylish clothes.
    Cheat. If she asks, deny. No need to confess to the wife. She’ll be able to smell the competitor vaj juice on you.
    After three months of executing the above four points, unexpectedly tell your wife her ass looks great.

    Here is my one-point plan for saving faltering marriages:
    Insist she have a GNP. Nothing else matters.

    Peter

    Like


  133. clifford the smallest red dog:
    Women don’t respect natural sexual desire (in anyone) they respect character.

    do you tuck your boner in between your legs when women don’t respect it?

    The fantasy is a man who’s able to cheat, maybe even tempted, but who has too much character to give in.

    why is there even a cheating component to the fantasy? answer that to yourself and you’ll see the scales fall from your eyes.

    That fantasy dies when the man cheats and some of her respect for him is inevitable collateral damage.

    funny how so many women stand by their cheatin’ man.
    more in love than ever.

    Like


  134. For men:

    Marriage = Death.

    Stay single. Avoid the herbdom, the soul-death, the repressive torture that family court will eventually impose during your inevitable divorce.

    Cheating only exists if you are married. ‘Cheating” in it’s true form means being true to yourself (and your children, if you have them), and enjoying the company of as many women as possible.

    Discard your metaphysical neurosis.
    Go forth, and let a thousand flowers bloom.

    Enjoy the benefits of a post-feminist society.

    Like


  135. @r.,

    I return unprompted, but you give attention to my comments. Why not ignore them , as you do most others?

    ignore them and I’ll be less compelled to respond.
    good deal.

    Like


  136. @tonbone

    You are basically right about consequences and reality.

    Taken a step further:

    Even if most women would love to stay with a known cheater, they just dont have the balls too.

    Just like most men might want to leave their olds wives but dont have the balls too.

    Like


  137. remove all consequences of reality and he goes for the hot young ass 99% of the time

    for some very high value men, that IS their reality.

    Like


  138. @mjaybee

    “For men:

    Marriage = Death.”

    That is something we can all agree on!!

    Like


  139. it seems strange and trollish that so many are scoffing at Winston’s seemingly genuine level of contentment. y’all should quit hatin’.

    cheers, Winston. i’m glad you found the right woman.

    Like


  140. on October 14, 2009 at 2:58 pm Marcus Aureliette

    While women are on average more tolerant of cheating, most absolutely loathe it. There are plenty of women who will divorce you just for cheating.

    Truth. I would, for one. And I wouldn’t take a penny of the cheater’s money, either, so let the money-grubbing whore objections die aborning. For some of us, cheating is a deal-breaker, end of story.

    Like


  141. Women don’t respect natural sexual desire (in anyone) they respect character.

    BWAHahaha hahahahahhhhhh!

    Damn, dude. Cut it out. Coffee is painful when it comes out through your nose.

    Like


  142. My main point being…women leave men for other reasons than loss of attraction/beta behavior. Roissy all out misses that here… to the point of it becoming a piss poor post.

    madras re-read the post with more vigor. i was writing about a man who was *already* on the road to betatude and the actions such a man could take to rectify his marital situation.

    i was *not* writing about an alpha husband who already has his wife on lockdown. my five point plan, given enough time (much more time than would be required for a beta to turn off his wife in any event) would slowly corrode a marriage, especially a marriage where the wife had options back on the market.

    Like


  143. Caveman alphas, and most alphas up until a few hundred years ago either had multiple wives- multiple mistresses, or multiple prostitutes, and orgy parties to fuck women other than their wives.

    The wives knew that the men were getting sex elsewhere- but this did not destroy the marriages.
    Why then do you believe in just the last 150 years or so- that woman now can no longer allow or forgive more than one sexual partner for men throughout a multiyear relationship?

    Did women evolve in that last 150 years in their dealings with alpha men?
    Do their pussies get less moist when they encounter an alpha?

    if not- women are equipped to let alpha men fuck other women.

    Of course there is no need to rub it in her face. Discretion Discretion Discretion.

    Like


  144. on October 14, 2009 at 3:01 pm sadaboutgirls

    Game in BK….are you living in Bangkok? And if so, why do you need game there hehe

    Like


  145. on October 14, 2009 at 3:02 pm 54-Year-Old-Virgin

    Interesting story here in Chi-town. A local news anchor,one Judy Hsu (yes,she is) delivered her baby on the side of an expressway.She and her husband–identified in the news reports only as Tracy,no last name given–(Is he–? Yes he is!)were driving to the hospital when the baby began exiting. The husband pulled over and delivered the baby,tying off the umb. cord with his shoelace. That seems like a pretty awesome thing to do! This guy is Da Man,right? Maybe. But I heard this girl being interviewed and she said of hubby,”I’m just glad(or “I am surprised” not sure exactly) he didnt go into shock.” WHOA! They went thru this scarifying experience and she ball-checks him on the radio? This guy needs to start reading Roissy pronto!!

    Like


  146. desperado of very little character:
    I return unprompted, but you give attention to my comments.

    so then you lied when you wrote this:

    if you ignored them, I’d be less likely to return.

    got it.

    Like


  147. “my leetle experiment”

    your ‘leetle experiment’ is pointless.

    First, not being capable of guilt or shame yourself you don’t realize that they are involuntary responses in most people and can’t be magically waved away.

    Second, you’re comparing apples and oysters. Winton’s point (which _was_ too hyperbolically stated) was that a lesser purely sexual attraction plus emotional bonds of shared experience and sympathy is overall more satisfying for a 60 year old man than greater sexual attraction minus any real prospect of emotional investment. You’d probably be able to figure that out if you were capable of emotion or empathy.

    There’s a part in Don’t Stop the Carnival by Herman Wouk where the aging hero (who’s cheated on his wife many times) is at a party and notices signs of interest from a young hottie. He absolutely knows what moves he could take to get her in bed but the prospect just makes him feel and he lets it go as being more effort than it’s worth.

    Like


  148. It will be hard for Roissy and most of the readers of his blog to believe this, but over time, the sexual attraction is based less on the presence or absence of wrinkles than on a lifetime of the most deeply shared experiences, values, and close friendship.

    Notice that he is focusing on attraction which may be composed of various elements.

    this choice would reflect a deep seated SEXUAL ATTRACTION for the hottie over the nottie, DESPITE the years of shared experiences, values, and close friendship proffered by winston as reasons for his claimed increasing sexual attraction to his old wife.

    You’re focusing on SEXUAL ATTRACTION, which appears to be synonymous for you with LUST.

    I don’t doubt you are correct about lust; I just think it’s possible and likely that Winston was thinking of attraction as encompassing more than lust, and subsuming it in one sense. You’re insisting that lust is the fundamental thing here, the most important; he is suggesting something more multidimensional.

    How actually accurate he is, I admittedly can’t say, but my poor shriveled ovaries sure like it.

    lawyer-girl? since I help puppies and kittens for a living it ends up being a wash.

    Like


  149. “winston and winston-like simulacras would invariably choose the younger, tauter hottie over the aged wife for all-night sex romps, given zero repercussions, guilt or shame.”

    Of course, there is no real world scenario in which your experiment could be run. There are no “zero repercussions, guilt or shame” situations.

    Like


  150. 54-Year-Old-Virgin

    Interesting story here in Chi-town. A local news anchor,one Judy Hsu (yes,she is) delivered her baby on the side of an expressway.

    This proves that even the most rampant of creatures can achieve western assimilation; most of them simply plop them out on a pile of swaddling clothes and within 10 minutes, sell them to the sex trade.

    mout

    Like


  151. on October 14, 2009 at 3:11 pm ironrailsironweights

    Hey Roissy,

    There’s an iPhone app that helps men score with different types of chicks.

    Peter

    Like


  152. alfred:
    You’re focusing on SEXUAL ATTRACTION, which appears to be synonymous for you with LUST.

    i’m just using winston’s own words. heh heh heh.

    Like


  153. @Roissy

    “madras re-read the post with more vigor”

    If I took the time to read everything with vigor, I’d have a more important job and as a result wouldnt have time to read you, enjoy my youth or chase tail.

    But I digress…if the argument is that a marriage failing because of betatude can be saved through cheating…well, interesting hypothesis. It might be true.

    Here is a techinical game point that needs to be covered to help with this advice: how to let girl#2 know that you’re otherwise taken. I find there to be a huge difference between subtly letting her know vs. the all out confessional. (Obviously, just not telling is ideal for short term, but if she is to be a repeat girl-on-the-side it helps if she knows about girl#1.)

    Like


  154. Of course, there is no real world scenario in which your experiment could be run. There are no “zero repercussions, guilt or shame” situations.

    oh i dunno, i’ve been in a few such situations. guilt and shame can be inner gamed away, and all the moreso if the person one is cheating on isn’t worth the guilt.
    as for zero repercussion emission — i guess you’d have to be skilled in the art of track-covering.

    Like


  155. On the topic of that Pepsi iPhone thing, Peter, not that you were necessarily endorsing it…

    Kind of a funny little novelty, but any asshole with his head tucked down and his thumbs flicking pages in an iPhone who hopes that that will get him laid is in for disappointment. Dudes need to rely less on their precious Apple gadgets, not more.

    Like


  156. Winston

    …Follow his [roissy’s] advice here, particularly on cheating, and you will almost certainly end up divorced and paying alimony.

    Then, ultimately
    complaining about it in
    The Spearhead

    Hahahahahahahahahaha sorry guys, I like The Spearhead but Firepower for the win.

    Like


  157. “do you tuck your boner in between your legs when women don’t respect it?”

    Sorry, about that, I wasn’t clear enough. Women don’t respect sexual desire (including their own). They may find it wondeful or icky but it’s in a different, emotional sphere away from respect which is in the pragmatic life decision sphere.

    “why is there even a cheating component to the fantasy?”

    There isn’t a cheating component, there’s a strong-willed devotion component.

    “funny how so many women stand by their cheatin’ man. more in love than ever.”

    A woman might still love (or even desire) her tomcat husband and might choose to remain with him. But she’s most likely lost the basis of trust that true respect is built on (in some circumstances he might be able to get it back).

    Like


  158. Aureliette —

    For some of us, cheating is a deal-breaker, end of story.

    SRSLY.

    Like


  159. -roissy
    for some very high value men, that IS their reality.

    >>>>>>>>>>>

    Yes. This is true. They have the looks, the game, the money, the smell, the sucess…all in a positive feedback loop. They exploit the niche the universe has spun onto them.

    But, barring an apocalyptic scenario, they are kept in check by reality. Time, space, disease, accidents, murderous betas.

    We’re a ways out from small hunter gatherer groups.

    Maybe a positive benefit of HIV was to slow or stop the world from devolving into Saudi Arabia. Maybe it is an existential savior? Unless it mutates into the swine aids? Or the super swine aids.

    Like


  160. clifford the infinitely small red dog:
    your ‘leetle experiment’ is pointless.

    funny how you respond so indignantly to pointlessness.

    First, not being capable of guilt or shame yourself you don’t realize that they are involuntary responses in most people and can’t be magically waved away.

    guiltnshame clearly aren’t enough to prevent 100% of temptations. guiltnshame often is the ad hoc justification herbs tell themselves for comfort in their approaching years of sexual obsolescence and invisilibility to younger women.

    Winton’s point (which _was_ too hyperbolically stated) was that a lesser purely sexual attraction plus emotional bonds of shared experience and sympathy is overall more satisfying for a 60 year old man than greater sexual attraction minus any real prospect of emotional investment.

    that would be true of a man at any age, 30, 60, 90. of course, the corollary to my leetle thought experiment is that a hot young mistress who had a strong emotional bond with winston would be his lay and love of choice over an old emotionally bonded wife.

    He absolutely knows what moves he could take to get her in bed but the prospect just makes him feel and he lets it go as being more effort than it’s worth.

    no guts no glory.

    Like


  161. Thursday–

    Doug is wrong about the history of cheating. It was much more tolerated among both men and women in Continental Europe, but mainly because the custom there was something close to arranged marriage. Once love matches started to be the norm, particularly in the Anglosphere, tolerance for cheating by either sex went way down.

    It was sometimes tolerated particularly during decadent ages among aristocratic women, particularly if they were the principal ones bringing wealth to the union, or a similar amount of it. Generally though it only was once her child bearing duties/years were behind her, or if her affair was with a much more powerful man who’d do the family favors. It was far less often tolerated at all among the bourgeoise and other middle classes.

    It’s still much more tolerated on the continent. It was first wave feminism which started getting strong in the middle and late 19th century in the Angloshere, that first made male infidelity, even when discrete and the husband is otherwise being a good father and husband, something supposedly intolerable, a huge betrayal, and requiring or anyway making perfecting understandable the wife’s divorce accompanied by a continuing duty on the part of the ex husband to support her. That had virtually never been true previously.

    Like


  162. yip!:
    There isn’t a cheating component, there’s a strong-willed devotion component.

    women can have the strong-willed devotion component to their fantasies without the narrative of cheating. and yet they choose the cheating narrative.
    how about that!

    Like


  163. Stud Dynamite
    Riff Dog –
    “we all know that in real life, Don Draper would be likely looking at a divorce. Whether their ginas are tingling or not, women tend to be more pragmatic than men.”

    Stud Dynamite – “so don’t cheat on your wife because you’re afraid she’ll leave you for pragmatic reasons, or you have to cheat on her because you afraid she’ll lose attraction and leave.. why the fuck marry someone you’re afraid of?”
    ________________

    I cheat for neither reason. I cheat because I love fucking new women and . . . well . . . because I can. It’s wired into me. It has nothing to do with me trying to impress anyone, least of all, my wife.

    The fact that my wife sees other women at my kids’ school or on the street giving me the eye is merely a side benefit. My wife believes (or at least, wants to believe) that I wouldn’t actually cross that line. But the obvious possibility does keep her on her toes, and in Roissy’s words, does seem to put a tingle in her gina.

    Like


  164. “funny how you respond so indignantly to pointlessness.”

    Indignant? I thought I was being polite and diplomatic. You wouldn’t like me when I’m indignant.

    Like


  165. lurker

    “Guy and moderate girl–a 6. They come in, and they clearly know the bartender—a chick who’s a 7. They stay for a while, and all three do a bunch of shots.

    Girlfriend of the guy, after making otu with him, leans over the bar and starts deep tonguing with the bartender chick. For a full on few minutes”.

    ~

    Lurker, me old mate, you forgot to tell the bit that while the guy’s girlfriend was deep tounging the bartender, that you decided to join in the fun and proceeded to deep tounge the guy.
    Its ok son, you are amongst friends. We can accept your gayness and won’t hold it against you.

    Like


  166. Is Cliff Aroyyo a male or a female? I thought it was a she, but then someone made a penis reference.

    So confusing.

    Like


  167. I think Roissy’s experiment is a bit too far removed from reality. A better experiment would be if Winston all of a sudden became famous beyond belief and had gorgeous young 20-year-olds trying to fuck him all the time.

    But even then we would be looking at a dramatic change in status between Winston and his wife, a virtual hurricane through their relationship.

    I can say for me personally, I have had some mind-blowing sex with women I hardly knew. But I’ve also been in some relationships where I’ve felt in love with the person and the sex has been mind-blowing in a different way.

    The sex isn’t as crazy and fun anymore. There’s not that desire to film us in bed and fuck her in the stairwell leading up to my apartment. But the sex has intensified in a way due to the comfort, familiarity, trust and mutual love. And no, I wasn’t exclusive with these women.

    Too much comfort, familiarity, trust, and mutual love without the equal and opposite tension of excitement, unpredictability, dominance, etc., can of course poison the attraction just as it can add to it.

    I have never been in a long term relationship where I have been so emotionally bonded and happy with someone that it’s killed ALL my physical attraction for other hot women. But I have been in relationships that have seriously dampened my the pursuit of other options, even though I certainly still had the ability to pursue those other options.

    So in that sense the emotional bond with her did eclipse all other options. Completely extinguish my interest in other options? No. But I think it could be possible.

    Eric

    Like


  168. Riff —

    The fact that my wife sees other women at my kids’ school or on the street giving me the eye is merely a side benefit. My wife believes (or at least, wants to believe) that I wouldn’t actually cross that line. But the obvious possibility does keep her on her toes, and in Roissy’s words, does seem to put a tingle in her gina.

    I can appreciate this — just like, I’ll agree with Doug —

    Or at any rate your hindbrain WILL respond to your witnessing him successfully flirting with attractive other women by making you feel more attracted to him.

    Sure, flirting is fine. Yes, I want to know that my guy is attractive to other women — just like, I’m sure, my guy wants me to be attractive to other men. I don’t mind the line-pushing, but actually crossing the line? This, I’m not okay with. Sure, there ARE WOMEN WHO ARE OKAY with (or, at least, willing to put up with) it. A lot of women will, in fact, look the other way when an Alpha plays. I’m not one of them, and I won’t ever be. If you need that kind of space, how hard is it to find a woman who will allow that? Probably not very hard for many of the guys I’ve dated.

    It’s sexy when you know he could get other women, because he’s with you. It’s not sexy when he’s with other women.

    Like


  169. A couple problems with Roissy’s thought experiment.

    1. It ignores the concept of the need for strange (young or old). In this scenario, Winston (who I’m sure is thrilled with this discussion of his wife on all fours for us to analyze) knows full well he can go back to bangin’ is wife the next night and every other night. The other opportunity is one time only. Heck, with no emotional or other consequences, he might even pick his wife’s older sister (assuming she has one) for the night, but not her mom – that would be weird, and we wouldn’t want that (actually, with no consequences whatsoever, I’d pump my wife’s mom for the night just for the experience, and I’d probably take her over a random hottie who I’ve never met). The boyfriend of the young hottie might even pick Winston’s wife. Heck, after all he’s said about her, I know I would. Come to think of it, Winston, are you up for a swap? I think I’m gonna have to go home and rub one out thinking about Winston’s wife on all fours.

    A more interesting question is who he would pick if he were guaranteed a romp with her every day for the rest of his functioning days, but never again with the other. My guess – his wife (even if he knew and admired the young hottie). Of course, that’s not to say he would have his wife look like the 25 year old version of herself if he could, and I doubt he’d deny that one (except to her).

    2. “oh i dunno, i’ve been in a few such situations. guilt and shame can be inner gamed away, and all the moreso if the person one is cheating on isn’t worth the guilt.”

    Shame perhaps, but I don’t think guilt can be gamed away where there is genuine caring and 30 years (or whatever) of shared experiences and sacrifice. And, we’ve already established in this scenario that she’s worth the guilt.

    As for the rest of you (including winston), you seem to be missing the point in the post. Roissy’s original post here is based on a scenario where she has already lost attraction for him and the marriage is already gone. Cheating may put him divorce court, but in this original scenario he’s heading there anyway (and she’ll probably be cheating on him soon, if she’s not already). Him displaying some high value this way might be enough to rekindle her desire for him, or it might not. But we know all the other supposedly “tried and true” ways are dead bang losers.

    Like


  170. Winston and Winstons of the world have sublimated their sexual desire into monogamous love, just as others have sublimated their libidos into various other projects like work, raising a family, etc. While Winston’s sublimation may be admirable, a boon to his family, and good for society, this is clear: what he feels is not sexual desire or attraction for a luscious object of beauty, as young in-the-game virile men know it. He is lying to himself (no doubt he once knew this kind of desire but has long suppressed it), but I am certain (and I hope for his sake) that he will never realize it. The commenters in support are pure fantasists, o would that it were so! Side note: it is very difficult for men with options and will to sublimate in the same way.

    Like


  171. “Is Cliff Aroyyo a male or a female? I thought it was a she, but then someone made a penis reference.”

    Pupu has always thought Cliff is a man.

    Like


  172. French married men follow Roissy’s philosophy, more or less. Marriages in France are comparatively successful.

    Like


  173. I’m back after a few hours and after reading some of these posts I have to say you’re way out of your league here, Roissy. IF there will be no repercussions for any sexual act I commit (as opposed to the real-life consequences your original post said would NOT follow), IF my wife has heartily given the greenlight to whatever I want (as opposed to feeling shocked, deeply hurt and betrayed), IF my wife has been lied to about the experiment (so that I am now an active participant in her deception, and thus becoming someone else entirely) – that’s your test? Well, how about after one or two nights, in the ridiculous scenario you’ve outlined, when I’ve had my fling, and discover that quivering beauty and I have absolutely nothing in common? That she knows none of the music I like, the movies I’ve seen or the actors in them, the books I’ve read, has nothing whatever to teach me about life the way my brave cancer-surviving wife has, and won’t know my children and be there with me to share in their upbringing? What then – another young blank slate?

    I enjoy your blog and I think you have some interesting and on occasion even important things to say, particularly for men who are inexperienced or have confidence issues. And I get that for you all of life seems to be reduced to the repeated pursuit of sexual adventure with an endless series of young women. I’m in awe of your singularity of purpose – and it’s not entirely inappropriate for a young single man openly uninterested in long-term relationships, marriage and family. That said, if you really believe what you are saying is true for everyone, you are quite wrong. But you, and other readers of this blog, will have to discover that for yourselves.

    Like


  174. on October 14, 2009 at 4:01 pm Fijian in Portland

    Chris:

    “He actually sleeps in the spare bedroom because he snores and Mom complained about it.”

    I make LTRs crate in my bedroom with a ball gag if they complain about my snoring.

    Also, I have an Ipod with 24 hours of my snoring… Bound+Sense Dep. with my snoring breaks ’em of the irritation within 72 hours.

    Easy enough fix… next!

    @anony (responding to Roissy)

    “shall we review the effects of aging on men, ………..on their aging erections?”

    Shall we review the effects of Viagra, Cialis, Levetra etc on the aged male? Of course, males have attended the hospital ER for Priapism (any longer then 4 hours) due to over dosage.

    Can your cunny handle >4 hours of steel hardness? I will estimate that to be a negative. That being the case, don’t be so flip/dismissive of the old nursing home codgers, or for the matter, young studs either…

    Better living through chemistry.

    @Roissy

    all these memories
    lost
    like tears in rain.

    You have seen Bladerunner: The final cut?
    I enjoyed the additional footage and scenes… but I miss the Harrison Ford narration.

    Please, ell me your take on this one vs. the other cuts.

    I, Bau have spoken.

    “Women should not be enlightened or educated in any way. They should, in fact, be segregated as they are the cause of hideous and involuntary erections in holy men.”

    -Saint Augustine

    Like


  175. If a man is stupid enough to marry, even divine intervention cannot help him.

    For all those who ponder on the death of civilization, I have this to say- Who Cares?

    Seriously, why should someone who does not benefit from a system care about it’s future. If you want to “save” civilization, make it profitable for the vast majority of participants. Otherwise you will end up with a world that makes the stone age seem good- not that I care.

    It is quite clear that the status quo cannot hold.

    Like


  176. Pupu has always thought Cliff is a man.

    if so, it’s to his detriment.
    zing!

    Like


  177. Roissy suggests “this suggests you were batting out of your league with him. in such scenarios, it is more likely that a higher value cheating man will cause more pain with his infidelity than a similarly ranked cheating man would.”

    Food for thought. Looking back I can see that my value was higher than I thought it was. You had a post once about daughters of hot mothers having less confidence – that’s me.

    Like


  178. Mr. Disco:

    Yes, your thought experiment is better than Roissy’s.

    But I think it could be possible.

    Right, but it would take both the right kind of man and the right kind of woman.

    Anon:

    you seem to be missing the point in the post. Roissy’s original post here is based on a scenario where she has already lost attraction for him and the marriage is already gone.

    Point taken. I think a lot of people were reacting to the title. And, yes, Roissy’s strategy might work as a kind of hail mary in an already badly failing marriage.

    Like


  179. Is monogamy the best model for a relationship?
    Many people question this very concept.

    If monogamy is antiquated and an erroneous experiment in sexual relations- how can cheating be a deal breaker?

    Like


  180. on October 14, 2009 at 4:05 pm sadaboutgirls

    Marriages in Japan are stable.

    Like


  181. jkc:
    it seems strange and trollish that so many are scoffing at Winston’s seemingly genuine level of contentment.

    it’s not the commitment i’m scoffing, it’s the claims he makes to explain his commitment.

    y’all should quit hatin’.

    party pooper.

    Like


  182. and just like that, Winston’s become a new Roissy comment board celebrity.

    ahhh, the internet.

    Like


  183. Yes, your thought experiment is better than Roissy’s.

    yeah but mine was more visually evocative. nevertheless, the point was the same.

    Like


  184. Marriages in Japan are stable.

    japan is full of japanese. and their culture isn’t (yet) as feminazied as ours. i believe working jap women make quite a bit less on the dollar than working jap men, though this is probably rapidly changing now.

    Like


  185. on October 14, 2009 at 4:13 pm sadaboutgirls

    Game in BK–
    If you’re in Bangkok why are you worried about game and fidelity.

    Like


  186. 1. I got caught by my ex GF, setting up a date with her hot doctor friend (i didn’t know they were friends, heh)

    Got the best BJ of my life from the ex GF that night

    2. I don’t think the husband should cheat, but he must be capable of cheating, and have standing offers available to him. He should bring up the idea of bringing other women into their bedroom.

    Same as a job. You have more power over your boss if the competition wants to hire you. You don’t have to work for them part time, but your boss should know that you can go there on a moment’s notice. We had a competitor come in and try to buy the company I worked at. The guy said to my boss “that el chief sure is smart”. I got a raise from my boss the next week.

    Like


  187. A woman that is truly in love with an alpha will:
    -Do almost anything he requests
    -Forgive almost anything that he does
    -Obey almost every command that he issues

    No matter how innocent- no matter how shy- no matter how virginal:
    A woman in love will an alpha will become a swinger- take it in the ass- join him in criminal activity- and renounce her family and religion IF he wants it.

    Like


  188. Is monogamy the best model for a relationship?

    it’s the model a civilized modern society should support and aspire to, though that would likely mean less catting around for guys like me.

    Like


  189. Winston says,

    Well, how about after one or two nights, in the ridiculous scenario you’ve outlined, when I’ve had my fling, and discover that quivering beauty and I have absolutely nothing in common? That she knows none of the music I like, the movies I’ve seen or the actors in them, the books I’ve read, has nothing whatever to teach me about life the way my brave cancer-surviving wife has, and won’t know my children and be there with me to share in their upbringing? What then – another young blank slate?

    To all those who rage on and on about how you lie to yourself if you choose an older, more compatible mate instead of a younger, hotter mate, think about this.

    To the guy who really has choice with women, the guy who’s fucked about as many hot, young things as is humanly possible, what then?

    Guys who have true choice with women go beyond just looks.

    Okay, so you’re hot and you take care of yourself. But what else?

    Can you keep up in a conversation with my interesting and intelligent friends?

    Can you challenge me intellectually?

    Am I bored to tears simply hanging out with you?

    This is the whole point of game. THIS is what you are conveying to women when you qualify them.

    “You’re beautiful, but what do you have going for you besides your looks?”

    Is that merely a lie in order to get women into bed?

    If it is, you haven’t internalized the game at all. You are merely mouthing it.

    Eric

    Like


  190. on October 14, 2009 at 4:17 pm sadaboutgirls

    roissy–
    I think marriages in Japan are stable because feminism hasn’t been very successful there, true. Maybe this is a consequence, but it’s also understood that marriage is an institution (it’s also arranged sometimes) and that you don’t marry for personal self-actualization or “to find your everything,” and so on. If you base an institution on things like personal caprice and love eventually it’s bound to fail.

    Men should be working to take back power from women and to change the meaning of marriage. We can’t be expected to marry, essentially give up our freedom and a lot more, and get nothing back for it.

    Like


  191. A woman that is truly in love with an alpha will [list of egregious vices]

    so true, and this is the truth that is ignored by all the women here who breathlessly insist, INSIST, they would never tolerate a cheating man. it’s funny how so very often i hear from women that they would never date a cheating asshole after their experience dating cheating assholes in the past.

    love is the great saboteur of moral dignity.

    Like


  192. Winston has been reprogramned in Room 101.

    1984 reference…

    Like


  193. I stopped watching Mad Men because I couldn’t bear to watch the cheating scenes.

    Like


  194. “No matter how innocent- no matter how shy- no matter how virginal:
    A woman in love will an alpha will become a swinger- take it in the ass- join him in criminal activity- and renounce her family and religion IF he wants it.”

    I’ve been that girl. sigh. Though I only nailed other girls at swingers parties. I did not desire other men, and I wasn’t allowed to pay attention to them anyways.

    Like


  195. I told my f buddy over msn that I had sex with another girl, and the strangest thing happened. At first she was all pissy, but then 2 hours later she was back at my place banging me silly. She also become more possessive and love-dovey with me after that.

    I have like no respect for women.

    Like


  196. Ugh. I can’t believe it (well I sort of can), but I am actually in this situation (and yes there is a child as well). Beta-rot is an insidious disease. I don’t think things are quite as simple as roissy makes it, but I don’t think traditional remedies are likely to be effective. Can’t blame anyone else from sliding down the beta slide.

    I remember in the beginning when I was alpha (which is how I got her in the first place), and acting like a jerk (touch other women in front of her, go over to female friends house weekly to watch TV), sex was great. Now, well, let’s not even talk about it. Can’t blame her entirely for it though.

    With respect to roissy’s recipe:

    1. Done.
    2. Already happening.
    3. Not done, but need to really make effort here, as she has always noted that I stopped caring how I presented myself after we became serious.
    4. Not done.
    5. Can easily be done.

    I guess this recipe is not really meaty enough for my liking, it’s a little bare. My plan is to take some of Dave from Hawaii’s advice, start talking to strange women, bring some excitement into things, do something about step 3. There are other complicating factors, but I think much of the problem comes from being beta.

    Like


  197. I challenge any multiple credentialed psychotherapists to prove me wrong.

    Why would they need to, when you can prove yourself wrong?

    Like


  198. “Pupu has always thought Cliff is a man.”

    Pupu is smarter than Roissy or PA, have a cookie, good Pupu, good Pupu.

    Like


  199. I think more than the cheating man, society hates the woman on the side.

    Like


  200. There are other complicating factors, but I think much of the problem comes from being beta.

    the first step is in recognizing that you have an affliction. and betatude is an affliction; a disease of the manly spirit.

    Like


  201. I don’t know if Roissy is a philosopher, but I am learning how to be a man from this site.

    Reading Roissy, Rollo Tomassi, and Pook on the SS site have changed my outlook and the way I actually live my life.

    Women want to (need to) to be dominated- men need to step up and be men.
    I am not saying you need to beat women down- but men need to be men- only then will women feel free to become truly feminine.

    Since I have begun reading and implementing what I have learned:
    Women relate to me in a new way- I can see it- I can feel it. Even women I have known for years act differently around me.

    I don’t blindly follow everything that I read- I do experiment and alter some methods. I do try and make it a point to try everything I have read at least once.
    As always take what you need and leave the rest behind.

    Like


  202. Game in BK—

    you got it

    Like


  203. Zunder the dunder:

    “Its ok son, you are amongst friends. We can accept your gayness and won’t hold it against you.”
    —apparently, in NZ, fagginess is a punchline, while Zunder’s mating with livestock is ok.

    Tell me about how much you know about Limbaugh and Bush again?

    Like


  204. Hey Zunder…what is it like, the anal cavity of a sheep?

    Like


  205. Zunder….oh zunder….lol bitch.

    Like


  206. on October 14, 2009 at 4:53 pm sadaboutgirls

    Game in BK….given that you live in Bangkok, your insights don’t entirely apply to Western women. Why do you need to learn from the internet how to be a man…in Thailand for fuck sake!!

    Like


  207. Ha! What a great post. Been following the blog for a long time, and for whatever reason, this is one of my favorite posts yet.

    Like


  208. sadaboutgirls —

    I think it’s Brooklyn.

    Like


  209. on October 14, 2009 at 4:58 pm sadaboutgirls

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Hong-Kong-apartment-sells-for-apf-1677068703.html?x=0&.v=4

    ….this kind of story makes me feel like a loser 😦
    can you imagine how many women and things you can’t imagine he’ll have in that place…

    Like


  210. FWIW, It’s been impossible so far for me to find a boyfriend who will sleep around and treat me well consistently. My first two boyfriends refused to sleep around. One was a total alpha, but found sleeping around to be childish and trashy. He said he’d been having threesomes and whatnot since high school and that he was only into monogamy at that point in his life.

    I gave my beta boyfriend the greenlight, and he just didn’t make the effort. We were together every night and that’s all he wanted. Near the end of our relationship, he cheated on me once and immediately decided that such activities were pointless.

    I left beta for a super alpha, and he did plenty of sleeping around, but also wasn’t exactly great to me. He found a second long term girlfriend (strangely with exactly the same height and weight), who had the same fetish. We would together tell him how we liked to believe he had a mistress in every city he made frequent business trips too. Once we spoke on the phone with one of his girlfriends on the other coast. She said she really wanted to join us for a foursome. It would have been one of a few foursomes we’d had if she’d come to town.

    I moved to NYC and got another alpha boyfriend. He had the cheating thing down pretty well, except the amount was inside the territory of sex addiction. It was with him that I only realized how much I liked a guy to sleep around. He would treat me infinitely better than the women he fucked and chucked. We’d spend days on end together, he’d take me out to meet his friends, whereas he’d throw ONS girls out the second after cumming. Sometimes they’d scream and cry.

    For a long time I had this fantasy about being kept in a closet while a boyfriend nailed some random girl. I like the idea of having to give a guy head after he nails some other girl. Or having to make the both of them breakfast in the morning. We did that a few times. It was fun. But the best orgasm I had with him was when he started IMing some OKcupid girl while I was on top of him fucking him. Drove me wild. But he was so into nailing as many girls as humanly possible that he really couldn’t be committed to me.

    Thus, I have never found the right balance. I don’t find a guy who will have meaningless flings on occaision while still being in love with me. It is easiest to find guys that insist on monogamy, and then there are some guys that refuse monogamy to the extent that they are incapable of a decent long term relationship. On rare occaisions, I have met guys that claim they do love their wives though they have affairs. None of those men were having regular sex with their wives though.

    Like


  211. There are other complicating factors, but I think much of the problem comes from being beta.

    the first step is in recognizing that you have an affliction. and betatude is an affliction; a disease of the manly spirit.

    i recently found out that the best place in DC to train in mixed martial arts is called the beta academy. i swear it almost made me not go.

    Like


  212. Allan Schoenborn’s estranged wife says the accused killer of their three children was a model dad, reluctant to ever spank them and eager to build things for them and play games like Lego.

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/schoenborn-was-a-model-dad-former-wife-tells-murder-trial/article1323491/

    Darcie Clarke testified that the accused killer of her three children was never violent toward the kids, but his ‘mental stability’ prevented them from ever reconciling

    Like


  213. Allan Schoenborn’s estranged wife says the accused killer of their three children was a model dad, reluctant to ever spank them and eager to build things for them and play games like Lego.

    Like


  214. on October 14, 2009 at 5:05 pm Cannon's Canon

    There is also an “Omega Institute” for wellness and personal growth. Wouldn’t even click on a link to that place!

    Like


  215. on October 14, 2009 at 5:13 pm Cannon's Canon

    to clarify:

    BK stands for Burger King

    we run “humpty hump game” all day

    Like


  216. Note how Zunder has run away…..what a pussy.

    Like


  217. Lucifer, I would say that there is a particular kind of man who can benefit from marriage: an alpha who’s financially well off.
    If this sort of guy can find a younger woman from a cultural background in which marriage is stressed, the dude can probably find happiness and fulfillment. As it stands, marriage is a raw deal for betas (nevermind their income) and alpha’s who don’t earn much, because for the former will simply disgust the woman and the latter can only keep her with alpha male displays and the women will resent the fact that he isn’t playing the economic “provider” role.

    Like


  218. Back atcha Riff. 😉

    Like


  219. It is possible for a woman to accept or even like the fact that her man has other sexual partners as long as she manages to convince herself she is the most special one in his eyes. This is more likely to happen to women with daddy issues.

    Like


  220. on October 14, 2009 at 5:29 pm Aspiring Alpha

    Since we’re talking about the “betatude being a disease of the manly spirit” –

    What does the group think about David Deida’s stuff?

    Is it safe for an aspiring Alpha to use him as guidance?

    I skimmed through “Way of the Superior Man” and it had some stuff that feels wrong. For instance, “give until it hurts”

    This sounds like “turn the other cheek” Christianity, which, (no offense to any Christians here) is unworkable for a man dealing with women and life in my view.

    Like


  221. Pupu explains, “This is more likely to happen to women with daddy issues.”

    Oh they’re issues? Shucks.

    Like


  222. Betaness is more likely in certain personality types. It’s like having a genetic condition that makes you vulnerable to certain diseases. I’m too easy going, and too indifferent to making choices (which is different from the indifference needed for alphaness). Even though I know I have traits that would put me on the alpha side of things, it is an actual struggle to do so. I do know that I remade myself once, and I can do it again, but it’s like exercise. If you stop working out, you will atrophy and become a girly-man.

    Like


  223. re: the above:

    Clearly proposed in a complete vacuum where family law is concerned.

    If wifey finds out you’ve been cheating, be prepared for false, evidence-free charges of domestic violence followed by ex parte restraining orders keeping you away from your house and bank account.

    Like


  224. on October 14, 2009 at 5:56 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””””’PA
    The wrong/beta kind of cheating that will kill a wife’s love is the kind where you fall in love with your mistress and become her beta supplicant.

    Mark Sanford appeared to have tiptoed close to that line when he started calling his Argentine mistress a “soulmate” in public.
    ””””””

    Most woman will not actually cause this problem. Why I think being able to marry the special ones and never having to disengage from any that you don’t want to is the secret and no I don’t believe for a second the woman will fall out of love just because you love another. She might even grow to enjoy the constant challenge of having another woman to compete with and keep life interesting for them both.

    Like


  225. @”alfred” aka al – u go girl! and yes, @board, she is a girl and a very attractive and feminine one at that.

    @winston – great comments and perspective. i see the point of roissy’s thought experiment – lust dissociated from experience or consequences. in your counter, you talked about the problem of not having anything in common with the hardbody, but that wasn’t envisioned in the experiment. seems to me that roissy was just talking about straight-up physical attraction, nothing more.

    but your point is a good one – attraction, even sexual attraction/lust, has many more elements that just that. (In the immortal expression of Jackie Treehorn: “The brain is the biggest erogenous zone.”) and it is immeasurably enhanced by, well, true love. that’s the only way to describe what you posted.

    so, let me ask you a follow-up from a perspective of respect for your relationship and point of view: is there any jealousy dynamic in your relationship, despite the love, commitment and mutual attraction ? any phenomenon of her noticing girls giving you the eye, or vice-versa? joking about it? if so, does it spice up the attraction or diminish it?

    i think that’s the way to square the circle here, for what that’s worth. Roissy’s clain that cheating generates attraction is probably untrue except for the most apex Alphas or slutty women. But the point about jealousy and mates with other options is universal and sound – it’s just a matter of degree, of keeping that in the mix of other elements of attraction and an LTR.

    @board, re FemX and doug’s exchange earlier about India. Actually, I’ve always wondered why it is that India is the most prudish society on earth (at least in its accepted sexual/social norms). I have two broad theories: (1) it was brought and imposed by Victorian Britain in the 19th c., and was adopted and propagated by the Indian ruling class. This is true for *much* more about comtemporary India than its ruling class will ever admit; or (2) it’s the result of an unrelated and automonous evolution of the dominant Hindu culture that is rooted in traditional village morals, arranged marriages, etc. Citing the Kama Sutra is irrelevant, becausd that was written centuries ago. I strongly suspect (2), but that doesn’t quite explain why sex and marriage relations in India are so strict when similar premodern arrangements in, say, Southeast Asia are so much less so. Or why India seems to be uniquely resitant to modern decadence as exported by the West. I mean, RIcahrd Gere gave some movie star chick a peck on the cheek and it was a national scandal. I’ve read a fair amount of political history of India but nothing at all on sex and morals.

    Open to the board, for anyone interested in the topic.

    Like


  226. on October 14, 2009 at 5:57 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””Firepower
    LTR game boils down to this:

    Both parents dutifully sacrificing most of their needs (including sexual) for the benefit of children incapable of meeting their own.

    Sex becomes rutting
    to satisfy the physiological need
    to clear the pipes – like taking a shit.

    Just close your eyes. Pretend she’s Megan Fox or he’s Brad Pitt. Stir until orgasm. Need met: get up and change another diaper

    Got it?
    ””””’
    What happened to finding the one you don’t get tired of?
    lol

    Like


  227. Thus, I have never found the right balance. I don’t find a guy who will have meaningless flings on occaision while still being in love with me.

    Shocking! Why not start with something more doable first, like finding a square circle? Then you can move on to the bigger things.

    As to the original post, cheating is the worst thing you can do, especially if you’re worried about divorce. What any guy should do is develop outside interests, hobbies. I like to fish. Admittedly, it’s something of a lazy man’s sport, but it still gets me out of the house into the sun. It gives some sense of accomplishment and confidence, and it gives my wife a breather and something to compete with.

    Like


  228. “It is possible for a woman to accept or even like the fact that her man has other sexual partners as long as she manages to convince herself she is the most special one in his eyes.”

    Yeah, basically when confronted calmly explain you do not love the other woman. That’ll do the trick.

    Like


  229. Indians adopted the worst elements of muslim ‘morality’.

    Like


  230. on October 14, 2009 at 6:11 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””where she’s a wise, virtuous influence”””’

    Cliff you had some truth in there but why does it have to go negative. If a woman is ok with it whats the big deal other than what we have been told.

    Like


  231. Arrest the heretic!
    ________________
    ‘Nightmare’ Looms in U.K. Employment Policy, Hambro Executive Says

    By Thomas Penny

    Oct. 14 (Bloomberg) — Equality legislation is making it more difficult for women to get a foothold in the U.K.’s financial sector, a fund manager at JO Hambro Capital Ltd. told members of Parliament in London today.

    Like


  232. Sorry to keep going off topic like that this, but it seems that an article featured in “The Spearhead” has hit a nerve:

    http://io9.com/5381793/is-science-fiction-feminized-or-is-it-sexist-both

    Like


  233. Humans wern’t coded to be monogamous it goes against our primitive natures.

    Like


  234. Booty Centric– as much as I agree with most of what Roissy says and the Evo-Psych explanation of human mating, I think that statement of yours is wrong.

    Like


  235. on October 14, 2009 at 6:31 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””””””Gunslingergregi
    ”””””’PA
    The wrong/beta kind of cheating that will kill a wife’s love is the kind where you fall in love with your mistress and become her beta supplicant.

    Mark Sanford appeared to have tiptoed close to that line when he started calling his Argentine mistress a “soulmate” in public.
    ””””””

    Most woman will not actually cause this problem. Why I think being able to marry the special ones and never having to disengage from any that you don’t want to is the secret and no I don’t believe for a second the woman will fall out of love just because you love another. She might even grow to enjoy the constant challenge of having another woman to compete with and keep life interesting for them both.
    ””””””””

    To expound on that. Under the rule of one woman you can marry yea pa’s stuff true. Woman don’t fear so much that you will cheat on them as they fear that you will leave them. If you can convince them that you will love them for life no matter what then their fear of cheating goes away somewhat. They still get pissed and it puts a little fear into them but they know your not going to be leaving them for another woman after a couple occurances they know you love them for more than just sex as most woman like to say they wish a man would want them for more than.

    Like


  236. “If a woman is ok with it whats the big deal other than what we have been told.”

    If a woman is ok with it, fine. Long term relationships are definitely not a one-size-fits-all kind of situation and I’m a whatever-works kind of guy at heart.

    I’m just saying that the odds are against finding a woman who will not mind a consistent pattern of serial cheating (especially when it’s obvious and even more so if the man is expending household material resources on outside poon). It’s a nice fantasy, but in reality there is almost always a price paid in her esteem or affection (or both) for the man though it might take a while to kick in (or she might suddently snap and try to slice his chopper off when he’s asleep).

    It’s much more likely to find a woman who won’t mind occasional discrete flings (of the kind she can ignore if she’s not actively looking for evidence). But the more financially independent women as a class are, the less likely it is to find that woman either.

    Like


  237. Firepower

    Winston

    …Follow his [roissy’s] advice here, particularly on cheating, and you will almost certainly end up divorced and paying alimony.

    Then, ultimately
    complaining about it in
    The Spearhead

    If all the guys in America who got shafted by their wives start reading The Spearhead we’ll be bigger than the NY Times.

    🙂

    Like


  238. on October 14, 2009 at 6:38 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””’If you piss all over the toilet every day, she may not see you as a beta but she may start to convince herself that you two aren’t “meant to be together.”

    My main point being…women leave men for other reasons than loss of attraction/beta behavior. Roissy all out misses that here… to the point of it becoming a piss poor post.
    ””””””””’

    If you have been pissing all over the toilet seat but then stop over concern for her feeling then she might leave you. As long as you are fucking her then their is no problem. Course assuming you have found a woman right for you from beginning.

    Like


  239. Aoefe said:

    “You know where I like my cheating? In my bedroom with my guy. There’s something really sexy/hot about him (or you) describing what he’d do to another woman.”

    How true. During one threesome I had, my girlfriend at the time told me how much of a turn on it was for her to watch me fuck another woman.

    Another girlfriend used to like to describe to me, while I was fucking her, how she would eat out another girl.

    Another girlfriend got so turned on after listening to me talk about blowjobs with a female friend of mine that she immediately gave me one when we got home. She told me she loved it and that hearing me talk about this with another girl made her incredibly wet.

    I would love to describe to you, Aoefe, while my cock is deep inside you, all the things I would do sexually with another woman, or another woman and you at the same time. I love sharing all my filthy little fantasies with an equally filthy and depraved girl.

    Like


  240. on October 14, 2009 at 6:50 pm The Cock of Obama

    How about this though experiment:

    The black cock of Obama tearing Roissy’s mum vagina a new one. Hitting it so hard that it knocks the fontanel of little roissy inside his mother’s womb…..

    *damn, i am getting hard already…need to go jerkoff to the thought of fucking roissy’s mother*. planted some black seeds on roissy’s eyes.

    Like


  241. Roissy, roissy. I’ve got a thought experiment for you.

    Here goes: let’s say you’re with one of those women with whom, by your own admission, you do fall in love from time to time. This time it’s better than ever before: she is beautiful, bold without being brash, charming, witty, and even shares your political views. You have a wonderful sexual relationship and a great deal of laughter together at the absurdity of the world. You discretely cheat on her from time to time, from habit as much as anything else, and perhaps even to remind yourself how great she is. Finally, she finds out. You pull your “never apologise, never explain” alpha routine on her. She leaves you anyway.

    You miss her desperately. You weaken momentarily and contact her to tell her it was only sex. She says she knows that, that’s part of the reason why it was such a betrayal. Then hangs up and refuses to speak to you ever again.

    Now you can have all the casual sex you want. You do. But never again do you find what you had with this girl. The capacity of your young pretties to give you more than pure physical release (the “rutting” described in a post above who was talking about long-term relationships) diminishes. The old thrill of feeling as if Sex is some kind of connection with the life itself seeps away. Every now and then, a still small voice in your head makes you wonder if your habit of chasing p*** was really worth losing the Woman you Loved.

    Clio

    p.s. Perhaps you run into her years later and she looks great. Or perhaps she looks old and haggard (not fat; I’m sure your exes never get fat). Curiously, you take no satisfaction in her decline. In fact, it makes you feel sad, wondering what she’s been through since it happened…

    It’s all unlikely, of course, but it’s rather less unlikely than the one you suggested to Winston, which belonged strictly to the realm of fantasy.

    Like


  242. “Stay single. Avoid the herbdom, the soul-death, the repressive torture that family court will eventually impose during your inevitable divorce.”

    LOL. What? A 50% chance is hardly ‘inevitable’.

    Like


  243. Totally not getting the whole cuckold fantasy from the female perspective. I almost threw up on sight of a picture of BF kissing his ex-GF (he keeps all his pictures of ex-GFs and doesn’t hide them.. is this an alpha trait? They are all beautiful girls, too).

    Like


  244. I mostly agree with this. However, I think it boils down to something more like, women want you to be able to leave them at any moment. It keeps them on their toes, keeps them earning their emotional keep, and keeps their emotional popcorn machine popping in their head. This is how women experience love: affection, spiced with mild cruelty. If it’s just affection, like you say, they start looking at you as a sort of child rather than a man.

    Like


  245. on October 14, 2009 at 7:11 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””mjaybee
    re: the above:

    Clearly proposed in a complete vacuum where family law is concerned.

    If wifey finds out you’ve been cheating, be prepared for false, evidence-free charges of domestic violence followed by ex parte restraining orders keeping you away from your house and bank account.
    ”””””’

    Any domestic violence charge carries an automatic retraining order now. Kind of an omportant change and after watching a soap opera yea ummm’
    She better be pretty fucking special or you better be willing to follow through on gun prenump and she better believe it to get married in states.

    Like


  246. Then there’s always punch-her-in-the-face game. Strangely, it didn’t seem to turn her on.

    dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1220415/Leona-Lewis-tears-punched-face-male-fan-book-signing.html

    Like


  247. Game in BK seems to get it. Good man.

    My opinion:
    The point in what makes her attracted to a man is that he materializes his will. Whether that be fucking a younger hotter woman or achieving some other goal.

    “III. You shall make your mission, not your woman, your priority”

    Indeed this makes the gina tingle, though it is not the only thing. Women want the gina tingle.

    Of course having a happy marriage with an alpha like me (or Roissy) will probably incur extramarital affairs. Our women may attack us with unprecedented vice. We can take it and turn it into lust. No, its not for everyone. In terms of expectations once a woman has ensnared a beta it is more of a shock to her ego for his lumpy ass to cheat than it is an alpha who is beating the chicks away with a stick. Though infidelity does strike at the heart of the commitment beast its worth it to stick around,its not worth it to stick with a beta she settled for.

    See: The look on Don Drapers wife while she is turning away the governor.

    To the married guy:
    Dissimulation is a power women are much better at than men. Hit the gym hard, and work off that hindrance of dissimulation, a man your age needs it most.

    Bio-game. I called it.

    Like


  248. on October 14, 2009 at 8:07 pm Willard Libby

    I don’t think Clinton’s, John Edwards’, Jesse Jackson’s or David Letterman’s wives are thrilled by their husband’s adulterous actions.

    Women want what other women want – handbags, shoes or men. But most don’t want to be humiliated or betrayed by the man in their life.

    A man’s sexual disloyalty disappoints a woman more often than it arouses her.

    Especially if there are children involved.

    Like


  249. Jason

    from your article:

    The problem, however, is that, as I explain in a previous post, mating among all mammalian species (including humans) is a female choice; it happens whenever and with whomever the female wants, not whenever and with whomever the male wants.

    Roissy and other PUA’s say this too. Leaving aside the current situation where the statement is more right than wrong at least in the Anglosphere mainstream urban society, it hasn’t been true through most of human history.

    Both sexes make choices, but even more importantly, their parents and the society does. There was an arranged component to most marriages of most people, with also a consent component on both the female and male side. Sometimes the consent component was very small. The partly arranged component / limited field to choose between rarely was. It’s the rare hunter gather tribe in which girls have totally unfettered choice in who they pick or even choose between. For one thing lots of brides were won as war booty and then parcelled out according to either who grabbed them or the male status hierarchy of the tribe or some combination. Other marriages were between tribes, and arranged for alliance purposes. Even within tribe marriages were often/usually done to cement clan alliances. Again the girl may be able to veto if she puts up enough fuss, and the imperative for the alliance isn’t too great, but those tensions were always there.

    The arrangements were probably overall more male than female determined in most sociietes though they were often female mediated in the details.

    Like


  250. @sadaboutgirls

    And the ChiComs can take it all away in a heartbeat, with a trumped-up “economic crimes” charge or a bullet to the back of the head.

    The West means freedom, which is why its loss to the East or Islam would be such a tragedy.

    Like


  251. on October 14, 2009 at 9:13 pm Fijian in Portland

    feministx.blogspot.com:

    FWIW, It’s been impossible so far for me to find a boyfriend who will sleep around and treat me well consistently.

    Taking you at your word here, Do me a small favor, & clear up something…

    Why are you calling yourself a feminist, if You clearly enjoy a partner who is unfaithful?

    Or explain what you (for your self) personally define a feminist as.

    Your candor is refreshing, but whats in your closet?

    I expect like most american ladies you have some damaged goods…

    I, Bau have questions.

    Like


  252. makes sense

    the chalice of ugly truths hath spilt over into the fabric of daily life.

    Like


  253. As a survivor of the marriage counseling gulag, I can attest to the veracity of Roissy’s comments. My “psuedoquack” was the most effeminate mangina you’d care to meet. Because he also attended a church my ex and I attended, I also got to meet his wife. She was also a marriage counselor. And, she wore the pants. She was one WHALE of an obnoxious bitch! Emphasis on “whale”. Anyway this ass-clown and my ex spent every session of marriage counseling to tell me how I was wrong and my wife was always right, how the man must accept influence from the woman, blah blah blah. I paid $195 an hour in 2003 dollars for this “priviledge”.

    The real answer would have been for me to play the 2 Live Crew song “Get the f*** out my house, bitch” whenever the wife was unhappy (which was all the time).

    God sent you down here with your words of Wisdom, Roissy.

    Like


  254. Bottom line is a lot of women cheat on their men, despite women saying how hurtful cheating is. I don’t know if that means they are going to divorce or break up or not. I think it depends if the other man will accept her as a full time partner and be supportive of her. I doubt most will, especially if kids are involved. She may fantasize differently.

    The idea of being true to each other for life is just not
    workable. People live too long, for one thing.

    Really, not getting married seems like the way to go in our current society. Then you never have to worry about saving your marriage.

    BTW, someday you will be sick of women. Ask around.

    Like


  255. LILGIRL:

    Yes, I want to know that my guy is attractive to other women — just like, I’m sure, my guy wants me to be attractive to other men.

    Men care only a little what other men — particularly their buddies — think of their girlfriends, or of their conquests, for that matter.

    A guy is satisfied with his woman’s standing in his friends’ estimation as long as they’re not making fun of him for his choice; he doesn’t need to believe, as woman need to about their captive significant other, that friends’ envy has been provoked.

    Like


  256. One more way to convince your girl to swallow:

    http://www.nhs.uk/news/2009/10October/Pages/long-life-pill-claim.aspx

    Like


  257. Moralist:

    LILGIRL:

    Yes, I want to know that my guy is attractive to other women — just like, I’m sure, my guy wants me to be attractive to other men.

    Men care only a little what other men — particularly their buddies — think of their girlfriends, or of their conquests, for that matter.

    A guy is satisfied with his woman’s standing in his friends’ estimation as long as they’re not making fun of him for his choice; he doesn’t need to believe, as woman need to about their captive significant other, that friends’ envy has been provoked.

    Yup. I suppose there are insecure dolts out there who want other people to be envious, but as anyone who has dated an 8+ chick can tell you, it’s a pain in the ass going out in public with them. I’d rather keep her chained in my basement as my sex-slave then advertise her to all my horndog friends.

    When LI’LLIAR made that statement about how men think, I suspect there was a wee bit of projection involved.

    Like


  258. Look, I’ll admit I’m a vegan-feminist-heal-the-world socialist, and though I do not necessarily find the basic human nature expressed on these boards implausible (distinguishing normative arguments from observed phenomenon), I gotta say a remarkable number of the postings I see pass off solitary incidents as definitive proof.

    -See for instance the still photo of the Obamas with the Italy’s PM.
    -There was a picture taken of Pitt on the red carpet, and we were told he had clearly lost the “sparkle” in his eyes.
    -In this case the “verdict” is in because the proprietor of this site found something trolling a freakin’ blog.

    There are other postings where the author recounts some experience he had with a girl, he doesn’t even pretend it’s happened more than once, but this solitary moment invariably PROVES X, Y, and Z. These are just such easy arguments.

    Like


  259. Tupac: Women can’t judge quality objectively.

    I didn’t notice initially that you had made the same point.

    For men, the questions “Does she give a boner?” and “Does she embarrass me in public?” do not require peer review.

    Like


  260. @Bonnie:

    Stay single. Avoid the herbdom, the soul-death, the repressive torture that family court will eventually impose during your inevitable divorce.”

    LOL. What? A 50% chance is hardly ‘inevitable’.

    Easy to say when you’re not at risk of losing your kids, house, car, retirement, and serious income for the many years following the split.

    Like


  261. Nothing like a controversial post on LTR game to raise BOTH the comment count AND the blood pressure in some.

    @Winston and others who are hung-up on Roissy’s cheating reference in step #4… You’re missing the point. You’re taking this all too literally.

    Roissy’s five steps are a simple example of something I heard called connection and disconnection. (I can’t take credit for the name and also can’t quite place where I first heard the concept). But Roissy’s steps #1-4 are elements of emotional disconnection. His step #5 is an element of emotional connection. LTR success goes up when you can master the timing of both.

    In brief, every woman in an LTR needs to feel an emotional connection with her man. If she doesn’t feel this emotional connection–or the promise of an emotional connection–she’s not going to be happy. She won’t trust her man; the relationship won’t grow. She won’t let her feelings for her man fully develop. She needs to feel, or have the promise of feeling that her man understands her, cares about her, nurtures her, values her. …And while step #5 and telling your girl her ass looks great might not be the compliment (generate the emotional connection) that will make every woman swoon, it’s still a carrot. It’s an element of the emotional connection part.

    But if emotional connection is ALL she feels, the relationship will get stale real, real fast. If she knows her man is FULLY and ONLY connected to her (dependent on her), in an un-ending and un-challenging way, she’ll lose interest. She’ll get bored with you and start on the pool boy. She’ll be much like the cat that finally catches and kills its mouse. You’re beta.

    So, over against this connection aspect, the man in the LTR needs to show occasional disconnection also. It can be a subtle comment, a question you pose to her, a behavior slight. It may be step #2 or #3 in Roissy’s list. Whatever it is, it needs to send the message that makes the woman wonder if her man really is as emotionally connected to her as she wants him to be. It makes her question your devotion to her. Put in other words, it’s kind of like a neg–but it should also project confidence and mystery in yourself. It should set a positive frame about yourself and your purpose in the world. (It also needs to be calibrated to your wife’s level of self-esteem).

    This disconnection step doesn’t need to be so dramatic as a sexual affair necessarily. (Long story but I personally think extra-marital affairs are, in the long-run, sub-optimal to a well-functioning society.) BUT, there’s nothing wrong with her seeing you’re CAPABLE of starting an affair, that you’re aware of your sexual attractive to other women and that other women find you sexually attractive. But note that if you’ve been beta for a while, if you’ve kept your balls in your wife’s purse for the last 10 years, you’ll likely going to need to do something dramatic to blow-up the frame she has of you.

    Maybe when I’m 60 I’ll feel differently about all the above.

    Maybe I’d feel differently if there were no such thing as feminism and all it’s unintended, negative consequences for western marriage and the family.

    But I’ll tell Winston and others this: I’ve been married for 20 years now. Before I discovered LTR game–and a woman’s need for both emotional connection AND the beneficial challenges of disconnection–my marriage didn’t feel nearly as solid as it does now.

    If you get hung-up on the affair mention in step #4, you’re missing the complete story here.

    Like


  262. “Why are you calling yourself a feminist, if You clearly enjoy a partner who is unfaithful?”

    My desire to exercise my strange fetish does not make me non feminist. My fetish happens to be a form of sexual liberation and it deviates from established norms, which makes it feminist in a way.

    “Or explain what you (for your self) personally define a feminist as.”

    Wikipedia’s definition is fine with me. I’m in the radical feminist category, but I am unique in that I believe in biological determinism to a large degree.

    “Your candor is refreshing, but whats in your closet?”

    as per my fantasy, I am in my closet.

    “I expect like most american ladies you have some damaged goods…”

    such as…

    Like


  263. But if emotional connection is ALL she feels, the relationship will get stale real, real fast. If she knows her man is FULLY and ONLY connected to her (dependent on her), in an un-ending and un-challenging way, she’ll lose interest. She’ll get bored with you and start on the pool boy. She’ll be much like the cat that finally catches and kills its mouse.

    So much for the romantic “true love” women always say they want.

    What a joke.

    Like


  264. FeministX:

    My desire to exercise my strange fetish does not make me non feminist. My fetish happens to be a form of sexual liberation and it deviates from established norms, which makes it feminist in a way.

    Translation: I’m a hypocrite who want to have her cake and eat it too.

    Like


  265. on October 14, 2009 at 10:58 pm msexceptiontotherule

    Gunslingergregi:

    “The secret to stopping the girlfriends from going after your man is not talking about the intimate details of sex with your man to them or bragging about how great he is. Of course its hard not to brag he he he”

    Or there’s always the option of instilling fear into one’s friends. It’s an interesting study of people (read = women) when it’s obvious that an entire group is afraid of the smallest one who is undeniably the leader. It’s either that or forget about having any female friends that one can talk to about anything of substance. Oh wait, you can also (though I’d recommend seriously thinking about it for a while first) finding a guy that women will naturally be afraid of, and not in the way that excites them, more along the lines of thinking about winding up dead in a metal drum somewhere never to be found kind of afraid.

    And I always get the distinct impression that the character Don Draper from ‘Mad Men’ is only having extramarital affairs because 1.) the time period that the series is set in and 2.) His wife has her heart set on denying him for petty reasons at home, despite her growing awareness of what that creates when he’s around other women outside of the home they share. He still seems a little lost and sort of saddened by the choices he sees left for him. Maybe he should man up and have more sex with his wife. January Jones isn’t an unattractive woman to have playing the role of his wife, after all.

    Like


  266. “Translation: I’m a hypocrite who want to have her cake and eat it too.”

    They are not my wants. They are the wants dictated by my creator. I can deny myself or I can indulge in a sickness for which there is no cure.

    Like


  267. on October 14, 2009 at 11:11 pm unlearning genius

    @Roissy,
    Nailed it this time motherfucker! Spot on. This is pure evo-psych. This is validation to the woman that she is with a worthy gene-source. But remember that we live in a society which despises these overt displays. So you have to be subtle about it. Execute this philosophy with some panache.

    @Winston,
    old steamer, you are referring to the oxytocin related joy experienced with a long lived partner. Infact the same oxytocin joy can be had from wearing decade old t-shirts. Sure i will piss away my life for some hormone release. fuck that! Have an intellectual outlet. create something and this creativity and intellectual pursuit will continue giving meaning to your entire life. More than any woman or friend can provide.

    @Cliff -ariyo,
    You are assuming a strong moralist idealist tone. Human beings are neither bad nor good but circumstantial and very diverse in their behaviors. Your writings indicate a dearth of cognitive flexibility, an inability to appreciate the shades of grey that characterize the human condition.

    @Clio,
    Your thought experiment … Most “love” is neurotransmitter induced selective rendering of reality. Any man who can see reality for what it really is will soon see the illusion. This is not to say that one cannot experience the pleasures while they are ongoing .. but the need to cling to an experience .. is always the source of much misery. This also ultimately restricts our ability to enjoy what life will throw ensuing the meeting with some particular woman. For we will see other woman in the light of those we already have seen.

    Like


  268. I can deny myself or I can indulge in a sickness for which there is no cure.

    I could smack you around if you’d like.

    (For a fee)

    Like


  269. PA:

    Is Cliff Aroyyo a male or a female? I thought it was a she, but then someone made a penis reference.

    I’m not sure what it is, but it can be clever at times.

    One thing I know for sure however, is that Cliff is FAR better than that faggot “MQ”.

    Like


  270. “I could smack you around if you’d like.”

    Opportunity of a lifetime. I’m just about ready to get on my knees and empty my life savings.

    Like


  271. @abe… That link you posted was painful, just plain painful to watch. What’s the over/under bet in terms of years that marriage will last? I’ll say four: Two years for the flame to die; another year for that flame to turn to actual disgust; and a fourth year for her growing aloofness to finally dawn on him. However, his response to that realization will simply be to amplify and lay-on more of the same disease. This will make her feel justified (in unquestionably pure female logic) in the affair that she started in year two.

    It reminds me of this one here about a guy, Ben Ryan, who spent two years trying to get his girlfriend back in the following gina-drying manner:

    Don’t watch after eating a full meal. You’ve been warned.

    Like


  272. To an extent, women are the axis of evil bush talked about.
    It is women who inspired and were behind the world worst dictators. Should not they be punished as well.
    Or should men rise up and put the women into labor camps(No pun intended).

    Like


  273. Your real choices are:

    1. Live life as YOU want to. (Whatever makes you happy)

    2. Live life as OTHERS want you to live it. (Be a slave to a wife, rugrats, bad job, social censure etc)

    Marriage, kids and peer acclaim are no guarantee to any kind of happiness. No human can ever give you what you really want, nor can religious-type beliefs.

    If you think about it, the worst thing that will happen to you is death. But since we are all mortal, it is a given. To me, living in a manner that you hate is worse than dying.

    It is just easier to live life as YOU want to..

    Like


  274. Pupu is very touched by Clio’s words.

    Pupu wonders what thoughts come across a man’s mind, or for that matter, a woman’s mind, when he/she sees the old and haggard face of a long lost love. Distance, pity, regret, relief, … or longing for having had spent all those years together?

    Like


  275. Feminist X, :

    I’ll spank you really good for free.
    You deserve it. But I guarantee you’ll be a very sorry looking Indian feminist alpha male and vag chasing girl.

    Like


  276. @Winston and others who are hung-up on Roissy’s cheating reference in step #4… You’re missing the point. You’re taking this all too literally.

    Okay, let’s go with that. For the sake of argument let’s say he didn’t really mean you should cheat on your wife–something I don’t think he’d agree with.

    Even so, it seems to miss the larger problem in the quoted commenter’s relationship. The man was making her responsible for his happiness instead of taking on the job himself*. Who the hell could ever be attracted to someone like that? So if you’re spending your time on figurative infidelities, you’re still messing up because you’re basing your happiness on her reaction.

    *I’m assuming she’s being honest–which is, I know, a dangerous assumption with this sort of thing.

    Like


  277. Winston and his wife’s mental schema of marriage were shaped in an earlier era. Since then, not only the family-laws have changed, but also people’s understanding of how to exploit them.

    Like


  278. @Winston,

    I am not sure you appreciate how things are different for younger people today than they ever have been in your lifetime.

    It’s like me telling an Eskimo how to survive cold weather. Sure, I could tell him some stuff that applied to my experiences and obviously kept me alive so far, but if he actually tried it where he lives he’d be dead inside a week.

    Trusting in any form of long-term monogamy for a man in the US these days is like taking the horn bet proposition on a craps table.

    The odds are terrible, but a lucky few will make it. Only by, the way, if you don’t make it there’s a good chance of getting financially and emotionally shithammered via the law. I mean, seriously, if you do any legal research into how things work it is nuts.

    I don’t make those kinds of bets myself, but plenty of guys do. Sheep get sheared.

    Like


  279. on October 14, 2009 at 11:59 pm Fijian in Portland

    FeministX:

    Wikipedia’s definition is fine with me. I’m in the radical feminist category, but I am unique in that I believe in biological determinism to a large degree.

    Extracted from Wikipedia. o r g:

    Radical feminism considers the male controlled capitalist hierarchy, which it describes as sexist, as the defining feature of women’s oppression.

    Radical feminists believe that women can free themselves only when they have done away with what they consider an inherently oppressive and dominating patriarchal system.

    Radical feminists feel that there is a male-based authority and power structure and that it is responsible for oppression and inequality, and that as long as the system and its values are in place, society will not be able to be reformed in any significant way.

    Some radical feminists see no alternatives other than the total uprooting and reconstruction of society in order to achieve their goals

    Now, normally I would say, this makes us mortal enemies, but you left the door open for further dialog…

    Tell me more on how “biological determinism” mitigates your world view and your relationships towards and with males.

    Also…
    RE:

    “Opportunity of a lifetime. I’m just about ready to get on my knees and empty my life savings.”

    You are allowed to kneel, and I may indulge my sadistical itch & smack you around.

    But invest your funds elseware, I suspect the ROI from Tupac Chopra isn’t going help in your long term financial plans.

    Now let me see… something else you said… Ahh…

    “They are not my wants. They are the wants dictated by my creator. I can deny myself or I can indulge in a sickness for which there is no cure.”

    An interesting fetish, I grant… As for there being no cure… I think you gave up too soon or you rather like your state and cry “I can’t change… because can’t really means wont.

    The only thing I think thats incurable is Pederasty… and even that I suspect will change in the future.

    I, Bau have spoken.

    “If you start a conversation with the assumption that you are right or that you must win, obviously it is difficult to talk.”

    -Wendell Berry

    Like


  280. on October 15, 2009 at 12:00 am unlearning genius

    @pupu
    “Pupu wonders what thoughts come across a man’s mind, or for that matter, a woman’s mind, when he/she sees the old and haggard face of a long lost love. Distance, pity, regret, relief, … or longing for having had spent all those years together?”

    Calm detachment and indifference. I observe the ebb and flow of emotions on the other person’s face ..I also sense the emotions my own mind works through .. though I see they have no strength anymore .. they whizz past me .. as cars do on a busy freeway .. I do not try to ignore or amplify them .. they just are .. It is just another beautiful day on earth for me.

    Like


  281. unlearning genius,

    The emotions and process you described above are very plausible. Why is seeing the toll of age on our parents and grandparents always so saddening?

    Like


  282. Calm detachment and indifference. I observe the ebb and flow of emotions on the other person’s face ..I also sense the emotions my own mind works through .. though I see they have no strength anymore .. they whizz past me .. as cars do on a busy freeway .. I do not try to ignore or amplify them .. they just are .. It is just another beautiful day on earth for me.

    Unlearning genius, set aside your talk about Game or your supposed realism or anything else of that kind for a moment. Your comment strikes me as that of someone who lacks any imagination and doesn’t know the meaning of grief. Your attitude is rather like encountering someone who boasts that he isn’t bothered by the fact that his five-year-old son has just died because he can soon beget another.

    Or – to come down a few rungs in moral seriousness – like someone whose tin ear ensures that he really, really CAN’T hear music when it plays and thinks it’s all just noise – and assumes that those who think otherwise must be putting it on or making a big deal out of nothing.

    People are not interchangeable. Loss is real. Some losses cannot be recovered. You may learn that some day, or not. Meanwhile, though, I’d hate for the impressionable young men who read this blog to think that your views are enlightened or even possible for most people, assuming you really mean what you say here.

    Like


  283. The loss of someone irreplaceable. That is the answer to Pupu’s question.

    Thank you, Clio!

    Like


  284. on October 15, 2009 at 12:53 am unlearning genius

    @aliasclio
    The overbearing “i am so much smarter than you” tone is not lost on me.

    I do comprehend the emotions that you talk about very well indeed. I have experienced this many times. The fact that I understand the neurochemistry of grief never makes it any less real. Grief happens anytime when my organism feels a profound irreplaceable loss. In my case it has been death, separation, bankruptcy and others all through childhood and into my current years… with women, children, relatives, friends and what have you.

    The detachment I talk about is not one of non feeling, just that the feelings take their course and then they subside and go away .. like cars on a freeway. It is just that they have lost their strength to me. I hear the music very well indeed but they do not cause me too much joy or sadness. This has not resulted because I have never been sensitive. Quite the contrary, I am overly sensitive to these and have always been so.. yet over time .. the threshold gets ratcheted upwards.

    Like


  285. on October 15, 2009 at 1:04 am unlearning genius

    @clio,

    Can you write a clearly thought out rational reply instead of a rant? I am not a child and have indeed experienced grief. It is just that I have come to accept that as a part of life and so the emtions do not sway me as much as they used to.

    R

    Like


  286. My marriage got considerably more tolerable once I started scoring some on the side.

    I love coming home from a nice hard fuck with a decent looking woman… passing out on the couch… to be awoken with the smell of bacon and coffee.

    Like


  287. on October 15, 2009 at 1:20 am Fijian in Portland

    So tell me FeministX:

    Do you suffer from multiple personality disorder, or “giving you the benefit” have you developed some measure of a belief in God?

    I see two countervailing expressions from you:

    “They are the wants dictated by my creator.”

    vs.

    {From your conversation with #3-Alpha}

    Me: no. Atheistic basically. And I am not in some great rush about this. I know I have a few years, and I’d like to wait a few years.

    Sure blame God (who’s existence, you’ve denied elsewhere), easy enough to do. But I can’t let this slide. You don’t get to play it both ways.

    Busted much?

    I, Bau have spoken.

    A:
    “Always tell the truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said.”
    -Mark Twain

    B:
    “If you do not tell the truth about yourself you cannot tell it about other people.”
    -Virginia Woolfe

    C:
    “He who permits himself to tell a lie once, finds it much easier to do it a second and third time, till at length it becomes habitual.”
    -Thomas Jefferson

    Like


  288. Unlearning genious has mentioned he has tortured small animals – if this admission is true he has big problems in general.

    Like


  289. One of the things about cheating is that it made me feel like a man again which I hadn’t for a very long time. I became less clingy. I could see things more clearly with my balls properly drained.

    Cheating sex is some of the hottest sex you can ever have. Your mind is usually only really in it the first few times you fuck someone anyway.

    Like


  290. @jerkDogg – “Your mind is usually only really in it the first few times you fuck someone anyway.”

    I feel sorry for you.

    Like


  291. Aoefe, to be fair, Unlearning Genius only said that he killed small animals – i.e., he might be a hunter who shoots foxes and rabbits. That isn’t the same as torturing animals for pleasure, and doesn’t tend to indicate the same kind of [psychopathic] character defects.

    C’mon, Girl, you’re a Canadian and you live/work in a rural area. Surely you don’t think that hunters in general are sadistic monsters, even if you dislike the practise?

    Like


  292. Clio – very good point! I work in the field of troubled people – my mind lept to a place it shouldn’t have. And no to answer the question killing animals as part of hunting is not sadistic practice.

    Like


  293. ”””””””on October 15, 2009 at 12:18 am Pupu
    unlearning genius,

    The emotions and process you described above are very plausible. Why is seeing the toll of age on our parents and grandparents always so saddening?
    ””””””””’

    No shit right. Came back and my mom is fucked up. Like she is trying to say shit but can’t. She is happy to see me but that is all. Little sister said something like she has thoughts or whatever but cannot express them. Just a panged expression on her face a lot of time. She likes watching tv though. I think yea shit would be a service as her son to put her out to pasture. Why live like that. Of course everyone else like no that would be wrong. Shit why?

    Again I think there are worse things than death. Like being a semi vegetable in a nursing home one day.

    Like


  294. ”””””””’A:
    “Always tell the truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said.”
    -Mark Twain

    B:
    “If you do not tell the truth about yourself you cannot tell it about other people.”
    -Virginia Woolfe

    C:
    “He who permits himself to tell a lie once, finds it much easier to do it a second and third time, till at length it becomes habitual.”
    -Thomas Jefferson
    ”””””””’
    nice qoutes.

    Like


  295. Family needs to have some leeway in situations like that. It fucks with your soul for real to see that shit.

    Like


  296. on October 15, 2009 at 2:37 am You Know I'm Right

    roissy:”male dominated societies can go too far in the testosteroney direction. see: all of arabia.”

    Actually, a lot of Middle Eastern/Near Eastern Semitic cultures have men that often act outwardly tough and macho, especially around non-Arab/Semitic foreigners, but many Semitic men are downright effeminate by White/Western standards. They are kind of like Italian and Greek men, who are the most ‘Arabized’ of Europeans and who are also the most feminized White (mostly) Europeans.

    In Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc men commonly walk around in the streets holding hands (like GWB did with that Saudi king remember), and Middle Eastern men often rub all over each other often, very ‘buddy buddy’ by Western standards, even cheek kissing. Arab/Semitic men having very emotional scenes in public like bursting in to emotional tears is somewhat common (especially when they are drunk and naive in Western nations), and homosexual behaviors are more common than you’d think among younger Arab/Semitic men because all the women are uptight and must remain virgins until marriage (at least vaginally).

    I only know some of this because I was forced to learn about various ‘gender norms’ worldwide in some college class I was forced to take at hyperPC SWPL Uni. taught by some anorexic rat-faced feminist professor who I wanted to often pick up and toss out the window but even still she was often flirting with me with her sad beady eyes.

    Also, in the White West, there is also the whole stereotype (usually based in truth) of very wussy, effeminate, nonathletic, combat shunning, and cowardly Semitic Jews. Jewish males are indeed some of the most emotional and femaleish men on Earth, at least the diaspora ones (the Israeli Jews at least try to act more macho and Western, and they like war/killing A-rabs so hey maybe they are improving).

    But yeah, it is clear that even though some urban/suburban men of White/Western/European racial descent have been slipping in to more feminish behaviors in the last few decades of Western liberal suicide and female ascendancy, we are still the most masculine dudes on Earth by far over effeminate sand negroes (Arabs/Jews) and rice inhaling stick figure Asiatics.

    Just look at all the wars we have won and started (even amongst ourselves…they are endless: medieval, overseas, Napoleon, Prussia/France, WWI, WWII, Russia/USSR, USA, etc etc), the vast territories we conquered worldwide, the 3rd world scum we’ve just brushed aside like the worthless eaters they are, and all the weapons we’ve invented and constantly stockpile. We have no problems stomping motherfuckers if they stand in the way of our goals. In fact, White Western populations actually decline if not involved in war, as violence and war keeps a nation active and healthy, it’s the Darwinian spirit of provoking higher vitality and heroic deeds, fighting red of tooth and nail for survival, kill or be killed.

    Like


  297. on October 15, 2009 at 2:55 am You Know I'm Right

    Try to understand the Western cycle of war/violence — we White Westerners go through lulls or ‘hibernation’ periods wherein we are fairly passive, only to have our fury suddenly awakened like a big Northern bear forcibly awakened during its deep winter slumber. Once we truly awake and get angered and feel truly vital that is followed by paroxysms of internal violence/war followed by furious expansion abroad in search of new colonies to seize and inferior peoples to subjugate.

    When the next Western paroxysms hits, watch out. I wouldnt want to be a non-White foreigner living in a Western nation when all that goes down. Better go ahead and let yourselves out while yall still can. But lets all hope the Israelis/Jews, Chinese or some other Asiatic crazies don’t bust out the nukes next wartime, a real possibility that could lead to mass human extinctions unfortunately. Lets keep it to at least a managed land/air war with conventional armaments, can we?

    Like


  298. on October 15, 2009 at 3:00 am You Know I'm Right

    “Talk of world peace is heard today only among the white peoples, and not among the much more numerous colored races. This is a perilous state of affairs. When individual thinkers and idealists talk of peace, as they have done since time immemorial, the effect is always negligible. But when whole peoples become pacifistic it is a symptom of senility. Strong and unspent races are not pacifistic. To adopt such a position is to abandon the future, for the pacifist ideal is a static, terminal condition that is contrary to the basic facts of existence.

    As long as man continues to evolve there will be wars. Should the white peoples ever become so tired of war that their governments can no longer incite them to wage it, the earth will inevitably fall a victim to the colored men, just as the Roman Empire succumbed to the Teutons. Pacifism means yielding power to the inveterate nonpacifists. Among the latter there will always be white men — adventurers, conquerors, leader-types — whose following increases with every success. If a revolt against the whites were to occur today in Asia, countless whites would join the rebels simply because they are tired of peaceful living.

    Pacifism will remain an ideal, war a fact. If the white races are resolved never to wage war again, the colored will act differently and be rulers of the world“. – http://www.toqonline.com/2009/07/spengler-on-world-peace/

    Like


  299. ”””””” it’s the Darwinian spirit of provoking higher vitality and heroic deeds, fighting red of tooth and nail for survival, kill or be killed.”””””””

    With no war where do you find meaning other than god but you can’t see god.

    Like


  300. ”””””’msexceptiontotherule
    Gunslingergregi:

    “The secret to stopping the girlfriends from going after your man is not talking about the intimate details of sex with your man to them or bragging about how great he is. Of course its hard not to brag he he he”

    Or there’s always the option of instilling fear into one’s friends. It’s an interesting study of people (read = women) when it’s obvious that an entire group is afraid of the smallest one who is undeniably the leader. It’s either that or forget about having any female friends that one can talk to about anything of substance. Oh wait, you can also (though I’d recommend seriously thinking about it for a while first) finding a guy that women will naturally be afraid of, and not in the way that excites them, more along the lines of thinking about winding up dead in a metal drum somewhere never to be found kind of afraid.

    And I always get the distinct impression that the character Don Draper from ‘Mad Men’ is only having extramarital affairs because 1.) the time period that the series is set in and 2.) His wife has her heart set on denying him for petty reasons at home, despite her growing awareness of what that creates when he’s around other women outside of the home they share. He still seems a little lost and sort of saddened by the choices he sees left for him. Maybe he should man up and have more sex with his wife. January Jones isn’t an unattractive woman to have playing the role of his wife, after all.
    ””””’
    Thanks for synopsis.

    Like


  301. Shut up “You Know I’m Gay”, you nazi shithead.

    Like


  302. Cheating:
    Being maybe more masochistic than most, I can understand cheating as a turn on mixed in with the feeling of being valueless, losing connection and betrayal. It would also make no sense to me if we should be having the kind of partnership where I’d shown the willingness to be open to him wanting other women. It would also not be a dealbreaker for me at all if we had children, although it would make being happy with him very difficult and create a less than ideal environment for them. It is essentially my fault for going for the type of man who thinks there’s nothing wrong with cheating on me especially without my knowledge even if I adore him and do everything I think he wants and that he’s expressed he wants.

    What’s disturbing to me in this thread is the endorsement of cheating. Certainly it shouldn’t lead to automatic divorce: laws and attitudes around this need to be reformed.

    On the other hand, endorsement of cheating by men as ‘nothing wrong with it’ is playing into the hands of an amoral female sexual utopia. It is essentially playing into the hands of the worst type of women who want to break down traditional relationships i.e. mostly sluts who endorse it and who rationalise it perfectly easy to themselves with ‘well, she isn’t doing it for him and he doesn’t love her anyway’. They want their dose of alpha without the work of a relationship and being a good woman. They shouldn’t be rewarded and this slutty behaviour shouldn’t be celeberated at the very least.

    Arab males: Either way they are, they’re simply expressive. They can give each other endearments and kisses on the cheeks without being homosexual or abandoning the male dominance body language. I do that as well, I’m much more demonstrative around women than men. That doesn’t make me a lesbian. The same man who was calling another man ‘darling’ is having an angry, aggressive rant at him the next.

    Homosexual behaviour and attitudes are much more visible and commoner in Western society.

    That said, I don’t think Arab males in general have a higher level of testosterone, even if they might be prone to genetically. Less seem to be gym rats for one thing.

    Like


  303. What the Mad Men is confirming for women who watch it and what I see PAINFULLY the few times I see it is: ‘Don’t be Betty, girls.’

    I see it as ridiculous, inaccurate propaganda. But only most of the time.

    Like


  304. on October 15, 2009 at 7:11 am Enough Already

    Stop Responding to FeministX. I was hoping she’d be gone by now. Everything she writes is about her and her fetishes and I’m sure more than half the people on this site dont care about her so stop satisfying her with your annoying endless arguments.

    Like


  305. I have this theory about fetishes. I don’t actually believe people actually get sexually worked up about shoes, or being asian or whatever. However, if you are going to have sex with an ugly person its best to emphasize a reason other than the person. Therefore, people use fetishes to advertise they have sex (and therefore aren’t celibate losers), but excuse the fact that they have sex with ugly people by claiming a “fetish”.

    So mostly when I hear people say “I have a fetish”, I translate it to mean, “I have sex with ugly people to trick stupid attractive people into liking me more.” Does anyone else do this?

    Like


  306. […] brain says no, your va-jay-jay says “oui”! 11. We’re the generation of women caught between wanting chivalry and […]

    Like


  307. Damn Roissy you’re on a rampage recently… like the YANKEES! Great insight. Having her friends see you in public with hot chicks also works. Taking secret trips and having a cool occupation will also keep marriages together… Ex. Mr. & Mrs. Smith.

    Women want what other women want. Nothing is better than an alpha husband with bad habits that the wife has to “fix” or a tamed alpha that relapse from time to time. Giving them a facade of control is enough… All women need excitement in their life, even the old ones… being an “alpha” or “jerk” or “ahole” accomplishes everything.

    Like


  308. MNL

    ..If you get hung-up on the affair mention in step #4, you’re missing the complete story here.

    Great post MNL. I think you’ve really chewed the pemican of this animal.

    And yet, I think taking the notion of cheating literally is more instructive. To be able to cheat means to be able to cheat. It doesn’t mean to be able to cheat. It means to be able to cheat. To ACTUALLY cheat. Being able means being able – not in theoretical space – but in actually fucking a girl and actually cheating.

    To be truly able to is theoretical unless you do it. Otherwise you are able to, but something is holding you back. So, you are unable.

    To really be able to cheat is a different mindspace. Less moral, more criminal, maybe.

    Less attractive? That’s context dependent, but I’d venture that usually it’s more attractive to be the man who actually cheats than the man who actually doesn’t.

    Like


  309. Vince

    There are other postings where the author recounts some experience he had with a girl, he doesn’t even pretend it’s happened more than once, but this solitary moment invariably PROVES X, Y, and Z. These are just such easy arguments.

    Yes, some postings use anecdotes to make a generalization. Just as you just did. You didn’t provide us with what percentage. You used an anecdote to make a generalization.

    Like


  310. Jason

    The problem, however, is that, as I explain in a previous post, mating among all mammalian species (including humans) is a female choice; it happens whenever and with whomever the female wants, not whenever and with whomever the male wants.

    Sure, you can make the supply and demand argument, but if so you must admit that some alphas are the short supply with the big demand.

    It’s a generalization that women refuse men more than men refuse women. A true generalization, but not a truism.

    The script can be flipped.

    And a point I’ve been trying to make is that while women have an overall advantage, they don’t have a specific one. It may be there are more women succeeding in college, but at the highest levels men completely outcompete women.

    So it is in the sexual marketplace. Sure, women tend to puppet men. But no woman can puppet a man as completely as a man can puppet a woman. Women can be owned more completely.

    They are built to be owned, whereas men are merely built to aquiesce to betahood.

    Like


  311. Willard

    A man’s sexual disloyalty disappoints a woman more often than it arouses her.
    Especially if there are children involved.

    Depends if you are apologetic or not.

    Have you ever had a girl walk in on you during sex?

    Have you ever had pubic hairs found in the shower, or condoms missing?

    Ever had time apart with rumors floating about who you were with?

    It’s being apologetic that hurts a relationship – not actually fucking.

    If you truly and deeply don’t think it matters to the depth of your relationship, that real reality will influence your woman. If you truly and deeply think that you hurt her, that reality will influence.

    Girls follow.

    Like


  312. Booty Centric
    Humans wern’t coded to be monogamous it goes against our primitive natures.

    Not quite, booty. There are a variety of sexual strategies. Some people seem coded to better suited to some than others. I’d agree if you said humans aren’t coded to be sexually satisfied by permanent monogamy. Serial monogamy can be great.

    Like


  313. JB
    “It is possible for a woman to accept or even like the fact that her man has other sexual partners as long as she manages to convince herself she is the most special one in his eyes.”
    Yeah, basically when confronted calmly explain you do not love the other woman. That’ll do the trick.

    I’m going to go out on a limb and flat out disagree.

    Yes, a woman wants to feel special and secure. But is that the #1 attractant/ If you have a security based relationship, it may be.

    But if she is owned by you sexually and emotionally, security is not the reason she will either stay with you or leave you. She’ll stay with you because she can’t stop herself from being in love with you. Even if she tries.

    It may work to simply look her in the eyes and say exactly what is on your mind. No spit, no polish. If your eyes hold an irresistable magnetism to her, she’s still fucked.

    Like


  314. “Therefore, people use fetishes to advertise they have sex (and therefore aren’t celibate losers), but excuse the fact that they have sex with ugly people by claiming a “fetish”.

    ? I assure you that is false. Fetishes are real. Mostly they aren’t problematic since they are merely something people also want some of the time. In my case, it is the only thing I can desire and non D/s heterosexual sex grosses me out.

    Enough Already, fetishes are hardly the only thing I post about. It wasn’t most of what I posted in this thread even.

    Fijian, mother nature is my creator. I sometimes make theological references. A form of dry sarcasm, I guess. Yes, I am quite atheistic.

    And guys, don’t bother eflirting with me. I’m dreadfully humorless in this respect: I’m rarely in the mood for random flirting.

    Like


  315. Game in BK
    Is monogamy the best model for a relationship?
    Many people question this very concept.
    If monogamy is antiquated and an erroneous experiment in sexual relations- how can cheating be a deal breaker

    That assumes that there ever was a monogamy that was anything but a superficial display.

    I doubt it. Because in the most traditional SE Asian societies that I’ve visited, cheating is common.

    People play monogamy. Pretend monogamy. There are always a percentage who cheat, and in any society that percentage is not trivial – it’s a large portion of how monogamy works.

    Cheating is not merely a social construct – it is endemic to the human condition, and, exactly as prostitution, plays a large part in sexual relations in all cultures.

    Like


  316. I agree with Femx.

    The only way I could get turned on by her also is in a severe display of D/m. I’d start by dragging her into the toilet, giving her a slap, and pissing on her.

    Like


  317. You know it’s a good post when all the groveling betas and insufferable feminists come out of the the woodwork to denounce it.

    What most of you morons don’t understand is that for a true alpha, the emotional state of the woman is immaterial to the relationship. She will forgive any slight because of the power imbalance.

    If a woman would leave the man she is currently dating/married to for cheating, she is not in a relationship with an alpha.

    What having game teaches you is how REPLACEABLE all women are.

    It is really that simple.

    Like


  318. MB, at the risk of developing last-word-itis, you’ve made a good point, but overemphasized it.

    Women are replaceable, but by different women. And some women are of higher quality than others.

    Like


  319. on October 15, 2009 at 4:20 pm Huffington Post

    Meghan McCain is a slut

    Like


  320. feminstX.blogspot.com

    fetishes are hardly the only thing I post about. It wasn’t most of what I posted in this thread even.

    The diagnoses is: your primary fetish
    is posting about your fetishes
    on the interwebz
    …hot

    Like


  321. Please [Cliff, Winston]. Women 40 years ago were far different, valuing dependability and good husband/father material. Women today plan on being single mothers anyway, so why would they care about that? Women today want STIMULATION. Excitement. Dominance. They want men that other women want (and have).

    Cheating on a wife when the attraction is already there is probably a dumb move. Cheating on a wife when she’s lost attraction to you, and letting her know a hot or hotter woman than she is wants you and HAS YOU is a better move for a guy who sees his marriage is in trouble.

    Because the wife just got a massive validation that the husband is attractive. Example: if Sandra Tsing Loh’s beta husband had screwed half her friends, she’d have come back to him.

    Women could care less about character. They want domination, excitement, thrills.

    Like


  322. Women 40 years ago were far different

    that´s because you haven´t seen yet how the same woman changes in 40 years. that´s change we can believe in

    Like


  323. I suppose this needs to be said.
    No, women do not like being cheated on.
    Monogamy is hard, maybe especially for men, but infidelity tears a family apart.
    For all you Mad Men fans — does Betty Draper look happy?

    My dad was a ladies’ man before he married, and scrupulously faithful after he married. My parents are still in love after 25 years. And there’s no question my mom would leave him if he cheated.

    There’s so much madness on here I don’t know whether to cry or laugh. “Women are built to be owned.” Quotes from Spengler, for crying out loud!

    I really do tremble for my country now and then. I see more and more of this every day. It may be that the tremendous freedom I’ve grown up with, as a woman, and the assumption that I’ll be listened to and respected, regardless of sex — it often seems that all of that is so fragile and likely to disappear.

    Like


  324. The 5 point plan is very stupid if the divorce is happening because of cheating.

    Ever see that movie of the perfect husband who just starts sleeping around and wants a harem and expects his wife to sit by and take it?

    Classic roissy alpha.

    Makes for a great movie how he gets sentenced to jail

    lol

    Like


  325. on October 18, 2009 at 12:36 pm You Know I'm Right

    “lapin” = jew surname — therefore, commenter lapin = ugly & effeminate male kike

    Like


  326. “Ever see that movie of the perfect husband who just starts sleeping around and wants a harem and expects his wife to sit by and take it?”

    True, it doesn’t happen in romantic comedies that you watch but it happens in real life. Deal with it.

    Like


  327. You people really deserve each other. You should all together into one room and fuck. That would be as hilarious as it would be instructive.

    Like


  328. […] 2009 November 23 tags: boundaries, honesty, love, relationships by Bhetti Some men have expressed puzzlement at the visceral reaction of Great Evil sharing a man elicits, despite it […]

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  329. This would work in an unbalanced relationship. That is, the man is a super-alpha and/or controls the pursestrings completely. It also works better with insecure women and/or woman who do not perceive that they have other options. It is also not desire you are creating in her, it is anxiety. If you create too much anxiety, she can make your life miserable outside of the bedroom even while she tries harder to please you inside the bedroom. Too much, and she goes psycho-bitch or leaves.

    But women who have remained physically attractive, have relatively good self-esteem and have independent economic opportunities would likely not put up with it. This includes even aging wives of super-alphas who happen to have good lawyers.

    Women like to know that their mates are attractive to other women because that is validating to their own attractiveness that he chose them. But if he’s fucking around, that removes that validation because it dilutes her specialness. Some will put up with being the alpha girl in the harem, but only if it comes with substantial perks.

    Lastly, why is a 60yo man who is happily married such a threat to this crowd?

    Like


  330. […] of female moral superiority. A girl will let a man do just about anything to her – beat her, cheat on her, blind her in a fit of jealous rage – so long as his masculine presence calls forth […]

    Like


  331. […] dating this girl while I had a girlfriend.  I had an agreement with my girlfriend that she would turn a blind eye to my philandering, but I could only fuck other girls, not date them, and I could never get emotionally attached.  I […]

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  332. This post is very true… my girlfriend wanted to take a break and I agreed. I started seeing a 21 year old and now my ex wants me back, I even told her that I’m sleeping with the younger girl and her reaction was totally different that what I was expecting. It turned her on. She would never admit it but she is giving up the booty everyday now.

    Like


  333. […] Martynka: No, I acutally… it’s a weird thing… but it turns me on that he’s like shooting 18 year old hot girls. I find it exciting. I don’t get bored of him in that sense, because… I know it sounds weird but I actually thinks it’s cool he’s out, hanging out with like some 18 year old girl in her bedroom, showing him her tits, and um, it keeps things exciting for me, cause that little bit of jealousy makes my obsession last longer. […]

    Like


  334. […] catch != gina tingle. It’s been said here many times, often to the guffaws of the haters and […]

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  335. on August 20, 2010 at 10:28 am Paul Brockton

    American women are too big a risk. I was married to one for 18 years, worked like a dog, and was taken to the cleaners. 3 years later I married a traditional Asian woman. No nonsense. Home cooked meals every day. Great figure. Takes care of herself. Is as loyal as they get. Todays Ameri-woman wants to be treated like a lady, wants to dominate men, wants to have as much pleasure as possible, wants everyone to glamorize her, is a victim of her husband, wants to be taken care of and pampered, but also wants other men to bow down and worship her. In a word, she’s spoiled, confused, and wants a soap opera life. This is the fruit of feminism. Not only would I never marry an American woman again, I would even avoid an affair with an American woman. Aside from unknown diseases, guilt, etc., she might be totally crazy and stalk you or your family. Too much risk. If you want to be happy, find a nice Asian girl from the country. I’ve been married 10 years and have no regrets and a great family.

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  336. […] women want you to cheat Women Want You To Cheat Citizen Renegade […]

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  337. I fully agree with your 5 how-to points.

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  338. “feministx.blogspot.com wrote

    Doug, even serial axe murdering wouldn’t be considered a good reason for divorce in Indian society. But a man havning an affair does have social consequences. People stop inviting you to important functions like weddings and religious ceremonies. Once we had a guest in our house, and she heard through the grapevine that my dad was having an affair. She went totally apeshit. She packed her bags in a frenzy and started swearing that there was a demon in our house and that she needed to get out immediately or else bad fate would come to her family as well. She ran out of the house in about 10 minutes and found somewhere else to stay. Years later, she sent me a giant jade necklace as a means of condolence. Either she was sorry for throwing the fit in front of me or she felt bad that my parents eventually divorced.”

    so?
    cheating was not considered as a grounds for divorce. but “if you did divorce, then something is wrong with you, seriously wrong…”
    that’s the actual social consequence. divorce and not cheating was the consequence. what you have is a ‘minority example’. Happens in egypt, russia, as well as the sexually liberated tribes in india. indian women never saw cheating as any reason to divorce.

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  339. Roissy:
    “guilt and shame can be inner gamed away”

    lmfao. inner game = hamster rationalization.

    [Editor: No. The hamster is post-hoc rationalization. Old and bitchy = “best years and sassy”.
    Inner game is mental training to rid oneself of unnecessarily outsized negative thoughts, such as “what happens if she rejects me?”]

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  340. Tiger was a champ at scoring poon on the side. If this post were true, why didn’t his wife swoon?

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  341. driftwood: Tiger Woods very likely broke protocol in some way. His wife had to have known for a very long time that he was getting it on the side.

    Some things that can set a woman off:

    1) Having a pregnant girl show up at the door
    2) Giving the wife a venereal disease
    3) Letting a girl you’re screwing meet the kids: “We like Daddy’s friend Suzy! She bought us ice cream when we went to Disneyland!”
    4) Bringing a girl you’re screwing somewhere to a restaurant or club where your friends-as-a-couple hang out, or to a social occasion
    5) Getting caught screwing a girl in the wife’s bed

    I find it noteworthy that it’s been reported that part of the divorce/custody agreement was that Tiger’s not allowed to let the kids meet any girl he’s dating unless he’s gonna marry her.

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