From Kitten to Cougar

It’s depressing to see drunk older women at nightclubs vainly trying to hold onto their former glory.  It’s a study in contrasts when these aging beauties go to clubs full of kittens.  They aggressively flirt with every guy because when they haven’t been hotly pursued by a man under 60 in ten years they turn to the hard sell for male attention.  If the cougar asks you the time and you give it to her she takes that as a signal to stroke your chest provocatively.  They rationalize this pathetic behavior as maturing into a confidently assertive woman who is done playing games like they did when they were “silly girls”.  There are so many self-help books now I think a person could positively spin just about any shitty life predicament.


I can think of quite a few girls I frequently see haunting the nightlife scene who’ve gone from kitten to cougar in just a few years.  Many women in the socialite crowd have crossed the cougar rubicon, yet stubbornly refuse to give up their lifestyle.  When all you’ve ever known is the inside of a club, 37 varieties of martinis, and dancing on raised platforms as horny guys give you your attention fix, it’s understandable you’d find it hard to accept your demotion to has-been hottie.

Cougarness in strangers is not hard to identify.  Friends are another matter.  When you see a person every day you don’t notice their physical changes from aging so much, but someone you see once every six months can shock you with their age-related deterioration.  The precise changes are hard to pinpoint but taken as a whole it’s obvious when the bloom of youth is gone.


The statuesque woman on the left is on the cusp of cougarhood.  Even though she has admirably stayed in shape, her upper arms betray her age, especially around the armpit, as do her sinewy hands.  You know her flesh would not bounce back from a firm squeeze, like a quarter off a Marine’s bed.  If she is still single, her time is short to find a life partner before she has to begin lowering her standards.

After marriage and kids, most women surrender the willpower to fight the ravages of time and let themselves go, content to become matronly and raise their children.  This is the normal progression of life.  But with career-delayed marriages and perpetual dating where she is waiting around forever to find a man who will meet all 463 bullet points in her mental checklist, the clubs are beginning to fill with women who have missed the boat yet won’t admit it to themselves.

Desperation causes them to do just about anything to cling to their fading looks.  You will see women over 30 suddenly lose a lot of weight because they are under the impression that being skinny will shave the years off.  Celebrities like Angelina Jolie and Renee Zellweger do this.  While it beats being obese, most simply look like bony older women with sunken eye sockets and loose skin.  Tom Wolfe, in his prophetic opus ‘Bonfire of the Vanities’, called these women “social X-rays”.  It was an excellent description, as it highlighted their physical emaciation along with their superficiality.

This is an unwanted chest-stroking waiting to happen:


Eventually, the cougar who is sufficiently self-deluded about her ability to attract men becomes a brothel madam.

This woman is a fixture at the eurotrash clubs around town:


She is pretty, but it is only a matter of a few years until a roaring cougar emerges.  She looks Russian, which means that she will hit the wall sooner and harder than most women her age.  She has done the smart thing here by hooking up with an older man.  She will look hot to him for a longer time than she would to a younger man.  Not surprisingly, he displays the body language of a former player.  I suspect he is an artist of some sort.  Older male artists, as opposed to older male investment bankers or lawyers, are especially gifted at banging Lolitas.

As a man and an aesthete, watching women grow old and their beauty disappear forever is the greatest tragedy of life.  If I could magically prevent every woman from aging and thus increase the aggregate beauty in the world, I would do it.


  1. How magnanimous.


  2. The last girl is indeed Russian and married to that guy, who is a photographer. I saw her at a few russian parties before I stopped going to them.


  3. Ok a few questions.

    I wonder about girls like me that are 28 but still look 20. Do we get to beat out cougarhood for a few more years?

    Or does it not matter if you LOOK young because you are not actually 20 (which honestly is something I am happy about, I love being a bit older than that) Is that weird too? That I am happy to be over that period of life?

    Do you have to be single to be a cougar or is it strictly an age thing?

    Give me the rules.

    You keep saying over 30 but I’ve heard that cougarhood doesn’t start till 35.

    Hmmm. Explain please. I find this fascinating and disgusting all at the same time.


  4. This post really made me feel sadness and pity. Two emotions I really try not to acknowledge and generally detest.
    I’ve seen the cougars frequently, as they all tend to stick out like a sour thumb. I try to ignore them, but their desperation usually makes everyone in the bar notice them. The site of them makes me sad because I know they’re either divorced or were never able to land a nice husband.
    Once you reach a certain age, it’s extremely hard for a woman to get a significant other. Their strategy of overt sexuality will only grab them a bottom-feeding asshole.

    As for the age cut-off, I’d go more with the 35-40 range. 30 is the new 20.


  5. MM,

    Comment of the month!!!

    Keep on that’s all, post was word up


  6. On the brighter side, the presence of cougars in nightclubs sometimes can make it possible for non-Alpha nerdy men to score.


  7. sometimes life just doesn’t work out the way you want it to…



  8. 30 is the new 20….for men. Sadly, women don’t have that luxury.


  9. I wonder about girls like me that are 28 but still look 20.

    No offense, but almost all women really believe they look ten years younger than their age. It’s very rarely true. The fact that men tell you this means nothing, only a man who really didn’t give a damn about you would be honest with you about how you look.

    You often run across people who look a *good* version of their age, but it’s very unusual to see someone who truly looks considerably younger.


  10. Very well-reasoned and written post. Here are a few related thoughts:

    Although you don’t need to act your age, wisdom requires that you at least acknowledge it.

    Self-delusion about your attractiveness is the worst kind of lying because you’re doing it unconsciously.

    Once you squander your youth, nothing you can do will ever bring it back.

    Neither women nor men can “have it all”, but men are able to have more than women (whatever “it all” actually is).

    Self-development is far more attractive than career success, a closet full of designer clothes, a pound of caked on make-up or fake breasts.

    Eating right, getting plenty of sleep and working out can slow the effects of time significantly.

    Love is an emotion that should be ruled by your mind, not the other way around.

    Love is only one part of the relationship equation; and it’s not even the most important part.


  11. At least cougars are cool animals.

    Dirty old men are just dirty old men. The only way to cover it up is with money and you better have a lot. Young Hottie will expect you to pay for everything and she still won’t stick around for only you. Even if she marries you (like hot Russian chick with creepy photographer dude) she most likely will get some lovin’ from younger, hotter dude on the side. Money may make her cum, but there’s nothing like young, hard dick to make her scream!!


  12. Devil’s Advocate

    Me thinks only a fat twatwafffle would use the term “me thinks”. I mean if you’re over 35 stop using that term.

    Cougars laughing, isn’t that hard to do with so much Botox.

    If cougars were so fucking happy with their lives why the hell are they in the clubs with the so called 20 something’s they laugh at? Let me guess they go there to laugh at them right? Why are they also trying to bang younger men? I guess they want to secretly laugh at them on the inside while their bending over? Sure that makes sense. They can take all those wonderful vacations but their at fucking Wonderland on a Friday night dancing to the new Justice remix.

    Yeah fucking right.,,,, so happy…. So delusional

    Drop the fucking Chipotle and get real


  13. on July 23, 2007 at 9:02 pm muffinhater

    Some of the “kittens” should at least take the cougar’s lead and leave the muffin tops behind. A muffin top is no one’s friend. And, sadly, you only see them on the kittens. Nothing says “i have self esteem issues, please fuck me” like nasty sidefat cheese oozing over jeans 3 sizes too small on girls that are too damn young to be that squishy.


  14. Virgle Kent,

    Google “me thinks though doth protest too much.” Ever heard of Shakespeare? To everyone else, case in point lies right here. Are women supposed to want these younger guys? They think they are insulting me, and really, they are insulting Shakespeare. Funny. Also, I think you wanted to use the word “they’re” instead of “their.” It does take some time to learn.

    You can’t look in someone else’s yard and determine that they are happy or not. Looks are very deceiving, in many directions. I look at the 20 something guys talking about all the chicks they bang and I wonder if they are really searching for something more meaningful. Probably. But they are too shallow to know when they find it. I also look at the 20-something girls who are goo goo over their weddings and I think, “Here’s my friend who is a divorce lawyer. Hang on to this card.”

    These kind of ladies, cougars, probably don’t really want companionship. It isn’t for everyone. They probably just want sex. I say, good for them. Being married is far from everything.

    I hope that little 23 year old “MM” hurries and marries before she loses her looks! Now that she’s out of her mama’s house, she has a very small window in which to find a husband. Hurry!


  15. Devil’s Advocate, you should be proud of yourself. You have actually done more harm to the perception of cougars in your rant than any of us could have possible done in post or commentary. I hope you’re happy.

    Now drop some coin at your favorite plastic surgeon and go be somebody!


  16. I agree that it’s embarrassing to see people (men or women) who aren’t comfortable with their age and dress inappropriately or are the oldest people in a club.

    If I’m lucky, I’ll live long enough to grow old, but it seems like, based on these comments, I don’t have too many options– if I keep working out and dressing well but let myself age naturally with no cosmetic surgery, some will rip on me for (gasp!) aging, and if I get a bunch of Botox and Restylane and whatever the next best thing is, some will rip on me for trying too hard to be young and not aging gracefully (or accuse me of being a “cougar” for “cheating” by trying to maintain youthful features). What are we supposed to do? Are you only a “cougar” if you aren’t comfortable with your age? I hope that’s the case, because otherwise, eventually every woman would either be a cougar or an old hag (both of whom are mocked and viewed as worthless), and I like to think that there’s a more positive position for a woman to hold once she’s older. All of us will, after all, one day be older.


  17. Cougars, and most women above a 3, can easily, and unfairly, up their egos online. I think you’ve spoken about this before. This alarming opinion article in the Guardian shows the dangers this poses to men (as women rate their attractiveness far above its objective value):

    “Meetic is the best. And it’s a super ego-booster. Every evening I’m on it, I have at least 30 men wanting to chat with me and meet me,” says a French senior civil servant, a single woman in her early 30s. Before contacting her, the 30 men have clicked on the “flash” icon to let her know that they find her especially attractive. Before condescending to reply, she double-checks their profile: age, picture, education, income and marital status.”

    I would imagine similar results with a cougar, as men just scattergun poke anything with a skirt online, inflating female egos past the point of no return. Maybe these cougars were poked to death online, and rush out on that ego trip.


  18. I think there is a huge difference between a cougar and a HOW (Hot older woman)

    If anyone has been paying attention to anything in this post COUGARS are the delusional women in the clubs who try and PRETEND they’re young. They hit on younger men aggressively and dressed worse than most high school sluts. IF you’re over 35 and you’re not doing this then obviously YOU ARE NOT A COUGAR. Now if you felt this post was an attack on you COUGH Devils Advocate COUGH then you’re probably THAT cougar out in the club that’s a little too old to be there.

    If you’re truly aging gracefully, staying in shape and eating right. If you’re not making a drunk twatwaffle out of yourself by hitting on younger guys trying to prove something to yourself. If you’re behaving like a mature 30 something then YOU ARE NOT a cougar. You’re actually a HOW.

    The main difference is acceptance of ones self. If you’re on blogs feeling the need to talk shit to 20 somethings and bragging about how happy and successful you are then everyone can see through your obvious bullshit and guess chances are you’re a fucking cougar….. roar…. get em grandmah.


  19. shall we get mud? I think VK and DA should wrestle. There’s nothing like seeing a short black dude and an old lady fighting in mud!


  20. Those cougars look better than most of the young twenty something women that I see on a daily basis. If somebody put a gun to my head, I’d probably pick the cougars.


  21. it seems like, based on these comments, I don’t have too many options

    Mysterygirl, the best option you have is to stop giving a shit what anonymous bloggers and their commenters have to say and just go out and live your life. Aging and all.


  22. Devil’s Advocate says:

    “Also, you assume that women actually want to get married. That their only goal in life is to land a husband. Many women don’t want that because they don’t have to have it. When you look around at your life and realize you own a couple houses, a boat, are able to take great vacations, have a fantastic job, and stash the cash regularly, that “need” for a man (which is really just insecurity) that makes so many 20-somethings jump at the first chance to settle down seems empty.”

    Nature, however, selects for those 20-somethings who spawn while their barren cohorts with the multiple houses die alone. Furthermore, societies where too many women have such alternatives are destined for oblivion (as in Europe today), to be succeeded by far more patriarchial arrangements.

    Liked by 1 person

  23. MQ–I agree…I am one of those freaks but see–I don’t care, I can finally appreciate looking considerably younger. My entire life it was a burden–I can appreciate it now. Its pretty much a family thing and entire I was 25 I HATED it.

    But who cares? Most of the hot women I see are older anyway bc they have that “something” sexy.

    Sexiness in a more adult way is something I am drawn to in men and women. I look forward to aging and aging gracefully.


  24. fuggit. cougars were always a good plan-c or -d. can you really put a price on 2 minutes a few hours of happiness bestowed upon a woman in her mid-30s? a woman so needy that she will pretend to think it’s charming when yell at her for no reason and ash in her drink, then eventually go home with you? no. that’s why i never feel bad for not giving homeless people money.


  25. ps: who cares? apparently you do, mizz K. otherwise you wouldn’t run around pretending you don’t. have fun hitting the wall aging gracefully. 😀


  26. You people are really f’ng demented! And I love it!!!


  27. Paully–Of course I care about how I look–who doesn’t?
    But about aging…no I don’t care. My boyfriend loves me for me…a novel idea, I know.


  28. MQ, yes, that’s the best option. You don’t have to worry about me staying at home, worrying whether bloggers will think I’ve become a cougar once I reach my 30s and beyond. 🙂

    VK, if you believe that there is a category of “hot older woman,” then the two of us are actually in agreement.
    My only concern is that if people spend time doing things like looking for negligible signs of aging in the upper-arm area of a pretty, quite young woman (whom one probably wouldn’t even call a near-cougar if she weren’t in a club), then we’re undermining the idea of a hot older woman. And that would be a shame.

    Thanks for the dialogue!


  29. KassyK:

    My reply to Devil’s Advocate is particularly applicable to our own ethnic group, which is almost conducting a controlled experiment. While secular/feminist types like you think you have all the time and all the options in the world, you’re not producing Jewish children. Meanwhile, the Orthodox get married early and have large families.

    Twenty years from now will see a much smaller, but far more conservative and religious Judaism in America.


  30. That “something sexy” KassyK describes is called “confidence.”

    I return to my original question: why does this “cougar” thing keep coming up in posts from the same three bloggers? It is as if it is personal at this point, as though one (or all) of you was blown off or hurt by a woman older than you. This topic has been beaten to death in recent times and the emotion and anger coming from the men speaks volumes.

    For example, I can see obvious anger in Mr. Kent’s response: “Me thinks only a fat twatwafffle would use the term “me thinks”. I mean if you’re over 35 stop using that term.” Then all the f-words. Wow. Angry angry boy. Were you turned down by a Cougar or a Hot Older Woman? You sound bitter.


  31. Sestamibi–You make a great point. I have thought about that many times and its one of the reasons why I have been thinking more about having children…making sure our people don’t just disapear (that and a strong maternal pull) But then again, I am agnostic and for me, being Jewish is more cultural than religious so what does that mean for my kids?

    And I just think 28 is young to have kids…I may change my tune once I hit 33…but for now, its too soon.


  32. lol @ being turned down by a cougar. have you ever seen a work?


  33. roosh – i’m more impressed with myself for calling out the guy as an artist. i bet he takes a lot of pics of her.

    kassyk – count your blessings that you have good genes. but be warned, sometimes it all falls apart overnight. remember, it’s not just the looks that go, but the unseen stuff like vitality and mental energy. this is as true for men as women. rules: cougars are single older women on the prowl. older married women are either completely off the market or MILFs. the average cougar is over 35, but depending on level of structural breakdown cougars can go as young as late 20s.

    peter – true. they perform a valuable service initiating the nerd herds into the secret garden, even when it’s a wilted weedy garden.


  34. “why does this “cougar” thing keep coming up in posts from the same three bloggers?”

    Because it’s funny to see spinsters like you reloading our site all day and writing stupid comments.


  35. I love how “MM” thinks she knows it all. Honey, please. You are barely out of diapers at 23 years old and still living with your mama!

    Couple thoughts.

    The new Roosh = Another version of Virgle Kent.

    All this posting on “Cougars” is so old. Me think thou doth protest too much. It’s all you guys write about anymore. It seems that the problem is that these “cougars” are much too smart to fall for some slight of hand and quick talk to be wooed into your bed. It creates this resentment that forces you to post about it. Again and again and again.

    Also, you assume that women actually want to get married. That their only goal in life is to land a husband. Many women don’t want that because they don’t have to have it. When you look around at your life and realize you own a couple houses, a boat, are able to take great vacations, have a fantastic job, and stash the cash regularly, that “need” for a man (which is really just insecurity) that makes so many 20-somethings jump at the first chance to settle down seems empty.

    While you may laugh at the “cougars,” they are really laughing at the 20-somethings trying to get married before their looks fail them, and then they are laughing all the way to the bank. The young marriages are based on very little and usually end up in divorce. Get yourself ahead of the curve. Do a post now on the girl who gets married at 24 because she’s met the “one,” and then ends up divorced with baggage (debt, kids, a cheating ex) at 35.


  36. Sestamibi–Actually my mom had three kids btwn the ages of 30-38 and so did my S.O.’s.

    For me, having kids is more than just being physically ready. I am not financially or emotionally ready to have children at this age and it would be irresponsible to do so.

    I feel that I have not even really started my adult life yet…Sorry if that bothers you, but its my life. I’m 28 not 50…and I have a lot of life to live before I have kids.


  37. on July 24, 2007 at 3:07 am muffinhater

    mmm…..twatwaffles. Pass the syrup please!


  38. on July 23, 2007 at 9:15 pm neil diamond

    You’re so very polar in your estimation of people. I don’t quite understand how you can make such bizarre generalizations about all women based on a few who are in clubs. I wonder if you could accurately guess the age of ten women in front of you.

    I hope that you are able to remain ageless.

    Oh. You can’t. You’re human.


  39. me thinks some people are awfully conservative in your “liberal” city
    me thinks some people need to figure out that there’s no such thing as a solution and you should focus on your own life and your own problems, not others’.

    -wise 24 year old


  40. KassyK:

    Sorry but you are just plain wrong about this. At 28 you are already PAST your prime reproductive shelf life, as he has already pointed out.

    And whether you are agnostic really doesn’t matter. Either you breed or you don’t. Those that do pass their genes on and those that don’t see their lines end.

    The “frummies” have six or seven kids and start early. Even if you finally settle down at 33 or so odds are you won’t even have two to replace yourself and your spouse/significant other.


  41. KassyK

    You are misinterpreting everything I’ve said. Of course it’s your life and frankly I really don’t care how you live it. All I’m doing is making the same point: that the reality of biology is colliding with the ever-prolonged adolescence of the American middle-class–and in the case of the Jews, with disastrous results for our numbers. Your mom and SO’s mom are both exceptions to the rule.

    Kassy, I am a lot older than you and live several thousand miles from DC (although I did live there myself in the 80’s). Family came to me a lot later in life than I planned, and my experience supports much of what he said in this post. As I said, nature selects for those girls who DO settle early in life and spawn earlier rather than later, so it came as no surprise to me as I got older that those who were left after this self-selection process were indeed those he described above as having “463 bullet points in her mental checklist”.

    Still, I was lucky to meet someone (at a Jewish Federation Super Sunday, no less) with whom I celebrated our 10th anniversary last month. We have one nine-year old son, the most beautiful little boy in the world, but low-functioning autistic. He will never see his bar mitzvah, and will forever be at Passover the son who knows not how to ask. I grieve for him, because I wonder who will look after him when we’re gone. Yet another reason to have kids early on.

    Again, nature doesn’t care how you “feel”.


  42. on July 24, 2007 at 11:53 am Days of Broken Arrows

    Great post and excellent use of the Tom Wolfe quote — which I remember too. He also called such women “starved to perfection.”

    This tenor of this post and the photos remind me of that old Barry Manilow song that starts: “Her name is Lola, she was a showgirl,” and by the end of the song it’s 30 years later but she’s still in the casino, wearing the same clothes, haggard and drunken.

    However, I will say that as a guy I was better looking at 21 too.


  43. Sestamibi–I am glad you found your one and I am sorry you have a child that is mother works with autistic children and I can imagine the care that takes…

    but honestly, I am not LOOKING for a man or waiting for a man. I think that is what you are forgetting to realize. I found my “one” as well. I’ve had known he was the one since I was 20. We are on the same page with not wanting children for a while.

    Regardless of whether nature is ready or not, I AM STILL NOT. So you can say you don’t care but yet you still manage to push that dig in in your last comment.

    Maybe you don’t realize that your comments are coming out preachy. Who knows?

    I’m just saying…I am don’t have the money or the mental capacity right now to have a child. Period.

    You can push all you want to convince me I should have had 4 of them by now but again it is MY LIFE.

    So before you continute to berate me on losing my ability to have a child so young…reread what you write bc yes you are coming off a certain way and apparently all other comments see it as well.

    So continue to target my choices when in reality your anger should be based towards those women with the BULLET POINTS. not me.


  44. sestamibi–AND…as a decent person and someone that realizes that I may have offended you in my last comment–I didn’t mean I am “sorry” that you have an autisitc boy in that he is any worse than any other beautiful child…I am sure he is a beautiful and special boy…I just can imagine it is more difficult in many ways.


  45. My grandfather (he’s 96 and still active) once said to me “If you wait until you’re “ready” or can “afford” to have kids, you won’t have them.” This isn’t to say that you should start having kids when you’re $10k in credit card debt, have a minimum wage job and crappy benefits. But there does come a time that you need to make a decision whether or not to have kids, and like most decisions, you won’t make such a decision until you give it some serious thought.

    On the subject at hand, it’s undeniable that there comes a time when you’re not entitled to act like you’re still in your 20s. This realization typically sets in around 32-35, and it can be pretty tough to handle. You realize that your time of being an irresponsible youth is over, and now it’s time to be an adult. Rather than accept this fact, many people deny it for as long as possible. Some cougars are like this, while other cougars are divorcees who are back on the market. Divorced cougars aren’t trying to act like they’re still in their 20s; they simply don’t know any other way to attract men, since many married when they were in their early-to-mid-20s and don’t have any dating experience beyond that stage in their lives.


  46. KassyK

    No offense taken. I appreciate your kindness.

    But once again: I don’t know you and I have neither the right nor the desire to make any judgments about your life. All I am saying is that

    1) life means making choices, some of which are made for you by default if you don’t make them yourself

    2) there are societal impacts to the collective sum of individual choices, but I make no judgment about that

    3) there are biological constants that cannot be altered just because you feel differently

    You do know what “opportunity cost” in economics means, don’t you?


  47. I guess it makes me a cougar. I still like hanging at the clubs.


  48. My grandfather (he’s 96 and still active) once said to me “If you wait until you’re “ready” or can “afford” to have kids, you won’t have them.” This isn’t to say that you should start having kids when you’re $10k in credit card debt, have a minimum wage job and crappy benefits. But there does come a time that you need to make a decision whether or not to have kids, and like most decisions, you won’t make such a decision until you give it some serious thought.

    The problem is that despite the fact that many twenty-somethings could technically afford to have children without much trouble, many are waiting for what’s the “right” time. For many, the “right time” means when they’re secure in their careers, live in a four to five family house in the right neighbourhood with luxury cars. The high cost of acquiring these things, plus the desire for Americans to emulate their new rich upper class in their tastes and habits has created a generation of twenty-somethings that are in-debt with nothing to show for it, and an inability to grow-up and have children.

    If we want people to have children at younger ages, we need to make it so that people can afford to grow up at faster ages as well. Either undergrad and graduate school need to become much cheaper, or we need to figure out how to make school much more effective so 6 to 8 years of post-secondary school aren’t needed to go become a paper-pusher in an office. In turn, we might also have to get the baby-boomer grandparents to stop indulging on their magical quests and to help raise their grandchildren similar to earlier eras.


  49. I’ll also add that the big problem is that it’s just simply cheaper and more fun to live the lifestyle of a perpetual adolescent than to live as a boring adult with children and responsibilities. What’s the real incentive to getting married, having kids, and being stable when you can have sex with different beautiful women, when you can engage in all sorts of different activities with the only worry being if you can show up to work on time the next morning? Why spend money on little creatures that really don’t offer any direct payback when you can spend that money on nicer items that offer a direct benefit or get more sex/drinking/etc?

    Liked by 1 person

  50. Excellent posts, David. Only thing I would add is that we need to make blue-collar work respectable again so that a man who works with his hands (many of whom earn quite a good living too) will be considered a good catch. Unfortunately, we seem to think everyone has to go to college today–including large numbers of those who have no business being there, and all too many women who have a Harvard MBA as one of the 463 items on their mental checklist.

    See also


  51. Cougars vs. sugar daddies…I never understand why being a “sugar daddy” is a good thing but being a “cougar” is being desperate—I think both parties are desperate. Male, female—older people trying to relive their youth instead of accepting who they are as older adults is saddening.

    And the name “cougar”—naw. Just sounds gross for some reason.


  52. Men and women desire different traits in the opposite sex. a sugar daddy has power and money which are attractive to women of all ages, while a cougar has…… the prospect of an easy lay.
    so you can see how the desperation label adheres more closely to one than the other archetype.


  53. yeahh, interesting topic. The reality is that we can’t cheat nature. The 30’s are not the new 20’s, specially for women.
    Biologically speaking, the best time for a woman to have kids is between 15 to 27 years of age. After that, fertility rapidly falls and completely dissappears at around 35. Like most biological traits, we are facing a typical Gaus distribution. That means some women will have children until 42, while other will be barren at 30. There are even more bad news: because menarchy now comes earlier for most girls (at around 10-11 years of age and not at 12-13 years of age like it used to be), menopause is also coming two years earlier for women.
    It is true that most women can’t finance children at 18 to 25 years old, the age when they should be marrying. But that is because our society expects girls to meet and men their own age, while they should be dating men 5 to 12 years older who will marry them as soon as they finish HS or college. I have always believed that HS girls should date men in their twenties who should marry them as soon as their finish HS. Our actual society simply ignores basic biology. The economic problem of early motherhood can only be solved by marrying a somewhat older men. I have never seen teenage pregnancy as a problem, tha problem is that these girls are not married.
    And to that 28 year old woman: you are very attractive and goodlooking, but you look like you are in your late twenties: a fine specimen of your age. By the way, in 40 years Europe will be a kaliphat.


  54. Gannon–

    You nailed it! Thanks much for getting what society seems to be having so much trouble.

    However, the idea that women ought to have kids earlier rather than later, is one gaining traction on both the Left:

    AND the Right:


  55. […] From Kitten to Cougar… […]


  56. Adding my $0.02 too late. It’s spelled “Methinks”– “Me thinks” makes you sound like Elmo.

    And honestly, I think that this piece is excellent and I will just add this: Cougardom is more in the state of ruin of the physique with nothing in the mind to recommend the poor ex-kitten, than in the actual physical age.

    Unless you’re like 43 and still trying to fit into a last-season Cavallli dress that is a bit on the small side.


  57. Are we really so superficial? We’re all insecure or we wouldn’t care about any competition. All women in the US are all in uncharted territory with well earned respect and power. Men are scared. We should be supportive of each other regardless, not fearfully judgemental. Get up every day and thank god you are not wearing a berka!


  58. Are we really so superficial?





  60. hi this is a gr8 fan of coygars and would like to have an official membership or a voulentier for your club


  61. Bottom line, if you are over 30 don’t go to the clubs. It’s full of idiots on a good day. Any self respecting woman over 30 should avoid the clubs like a plague.
    The men in the clubs are all losers. A decent 30+ woman can met a man her own age in a more civilized enviroment.


  62. Cougars.. Where would all the,, hhmm not so good looking younger guys get their rocks off if it wern’t for some nice ol cougar.. Better than a right hand even if your left handed..


  63. How original. Would that you bottle your wisdom, while you have it, to drink yourself to death when you turn *gasp!* 30.


  64. Right on Gannon!!! take our society back to the 16th century. Pray tell me, why should women even bother going to HS then since they just really just need to find an older man and reproduce.

    GAWD!!! never have I ever been more disgusted by a post but at the same time couldn’t take my eyes off of it.

    While I agree that no one should be dressing or acting ‘much too young’ for their age, I would like to know why the double standard?!! A woman after 35 is a cougar, while a man is a catch!!! RETARDED!!! I have seen equal number of older men in bars as women. Why is it alright for those dirty old men to be able to pick up and marry young hot chicks but not for women.

    Our great grandmothers worked very hard to bring us to an era where we are not being married off to some 50 year old at tender age of 15, or being burned alive with our dead husbands…we certainly don’t need a little fear of the biological clock take us back to the patriarchial set up of dark ages.

    Devil’s Advocate you make very good points but they seem to be falling on deaf retarded ears. Plus if a woman of 45 really wanted to marry and settle down, she would not be checking out the bar scene for younger guys, she would simply find a nice man of her age and be with him. Afterall you only see men (prime example – Trump) shacking up with a much younger and hotter chick, all the while not realizing or caring how stupid they look.


  65. 51. Said “Cougars vs. sugar daddies…I never understand why being a “sugar daddy” is a good thing but being a “cougar” is being desperate—I think both parties are desperate. ”

    Look, in order to be a “sugar daddy’ a man has probably attained a certain status of wealth, power or both that affords him the ability to be a sugar daddy to a younger woman. His wealth and power are signs of his accomplishments. And they are admired by men and women alike.

    What accomplishments does a “cougar” have? Just the fact that he has possibly managed to maintain some vestiges of her former good looks? Please! This is just another one of those tired, worn out arguments put forward by desperate women in their 30s and 40s. Women yield a lot of power in their late teens and early 20s. By the time women hit their 30s those scales of power have tipped in the mens’ favour and stay that way. The only thing you do is to ACCEPT IT! By the time you are of cougar status you are sexually irrelevant to the majority of the male population. And there is not much you can do to change that.


  66. ” A woman after 35 is a cougar, while a man is a catch!!! RETARDED!!! I have seen equal number of older men in bars as women. Why is it alright for those dirty old men to be able to pick up and marry young hot chicks but not for women.”

    The answer is fertility. A woman past the age of 35 is an extremely bad choice for a man if he wants to have children. On the other side, a 35-40 year old man can be an excellent choice for a woman aged 24-28 who wants to start a family and needs a good man to take care of her. The main issue is that women have a very short window for optimal chilbearing, that is around 15-30 years of age, and hence these are a woman’s most desirable and coveted years. For a man making love to a 40 year old is only a substitute prize. His instincts tell him to make love to the fertile 20 year old girl. In an ideal world girls should bond to men around 10 years older when they are around 14-19 and then marry them at around 20-22 years of age to create the next generation.


  67. I was 32 years old when I met my then 22 year old boyfriend. I didn’t look a day over 25, and I always dated younger men because I always looked young and attractive. Also, single men my age always ended up being taken or married.Anyway, we got married in June 1998, and we had two lovely daughters together. We have been together 12 years and married for 10. My husband doesn’t look at my as some “cougar”. That term sounded derogatory and vulgar.


  68. So where may I find the cougars. I love them. They are definitle much more fun than the kittens … hey, different strokes for different folks. So, tell me, tell me.


  69. This post just tells me someone has never had a loving relationship with the opposite sex.

    Older women going out and making fools of themselves are just as pathetic as the younger women or men who do the same. If you are seeing drunk cougars so often, then you are hardly one of the beautiful young people at the best social gatherings.

    I am willing to bet the attractive woman with the so called sinewy hands and upper arms is and will always be out of your league. Maybe if you were not so blinded by your horniness, you would know all young women (even the fit ones) are flawed. I site my experience as a women who has seen more than her fair share of young, fit, and hot naked women. Even the airbrushed pages of Playboy rarely showcases “perfection.”

    I wish shallow, ugly people would just succumb to evolution already.


  70. All this ’30 is the new 20′ bullshit is total nonsense.

    After a woman hits 35, her fertility drops precipitously. The chance of birth defects rises a lot.

    So if a woman wants 2 kids, she has to have both of them before 35. That means the first one should be no later than 32-33, so that the second one is still before 35.

    That means a woman has to marry no later than 31.

    An older woman who marries late can always adopt, of course. In-vitrio fertilization is an option, but even that becomes much harder after 35.

    The rules of biology have not changed.


  71. mmmhmm–

    Even if she marries you (like hot Russian chick with creepy photographer dude) she most likely will get some lovin’ from younger, hotter dude on the side. Money may make her cum, but there’s nothing like young, hard dick to make her scream!!

    Well it’s certain that no older high status and high sexuality alpha should marry you.


  72. Tood: Women’s fertility starts to drop after about 24 and it drops steadily. Ayfter 24 a woman’s chance of a defective birth rises steadily. By 35 the odds are heavily against a woman having a healthy child.

    Also, I have been hit on by cougars. They are up front and will lead sexually.


  73. I do understand that older women dressing too young for their age at a club may look desperate and uncool, but what is wrong with an older woman trying to date younger men? This is common. It’s been going on for hundreds of years, it’s just more common for the man to be older. Some men prefer older woman and some older women prefer younger men. It’s just how it is. If you’re not into older women, i can understand that .It’s a personal preference. Is there something about an older woman with a younger man that bothers you? Does it offend you that a woman might get a younger man for some reason? What’s good for the goose is good for the gander, as they say. I think older woman.younger man and older man/younger woman is all fine if that is what they are into. Is this what disgusts you, that a woman can do it too as freely as a man can? Is that something that bothers your male ego? Or is your problem truly only with older women at the bar trying to dress like a 20 year old and act like a 20 year old? Because, this, i can truly understand. I think it looks desperate for a much older woman to be wearing clothes that would be much more appropriate for a club going 20 year old looking for a one night stand.


  74. Oh yeah I commented again so i could get follow up comments emailed lol


  75. Oh and I would like to remark about your fertility information. While I do agree, it is “harder” for a woman over 35 to have children, there are many many that do and all works out fine. True, some women at that age do have a much harder time than they would have had at 25. But anyway, since when has casual sex or just dating been predominantly about fertility? Some people, and in fact many, are not that into the whole having kids thing. Dating is about having fun and if you are a man into older women or a younger woman into an older man, then that’s all good. It’s not all about “biology”. It’s a personal preference. I personally have dated both older and younger men and I like both just fine! It’s about the individual, not their age.


  76. Old saying: men age like wine, women age like milk.


  77. Fortunately…Black don’t crack!


  78. on May 19, 2010 at 1:24 pm Brandon Johns

    I think this post is kind of mean. Age is just a number. With the more modern technology coming out, I see nothing wrong with women and men making themselves look younger and fitting in. This only teens and twenty somethings crap is so medieval. This is 2010. I am pushing the big 3-0 and I would like to think I really wouldn’t have to start worrying until I am around 35. Early 30s is often included in the young adult category. I would like to think by the time I am 35, they have more technology to fix aging. They already have a lot of good stuff already. Ageism needs to stop, it is no different than racism. Age was invented by man, and too many in today’s culture still think you have to follow it. I have never been a club person, but cougars and sugar daddies also don’t have to exist just in the clubs. I see so many men in their early 30s these days who could still pass for 20. That is a good thing, not a bad one. Get over yourselves and stop being sexist and ageist. This is 2010, not 1210.


  79. damn!!


  80. Nothing wrong with cougars, generous cougars.

    Better than student loans.


  81. on June 21, 2010 at 1:31 am lumpenprole

    “Be kind to everyone you meet, for everyone is figting a very hard battle,”

    Philo, around the year zero.

    There is pain at every age, and in every situation.

    I am old, and I know.


  82. on June 24, 2010 at 6:52 pm msexceptiontotherule

    Who needs botox in a dark club? (within reason.)

    And short skirts with high heels that distract men from the “angelina-esque” horseface that some women are prone to get when they’re older and underweight. (underweight defined as being pretty darn close to Karen Carpenter at the end….not just on the skinny side.)


  83. @ Tood and Maxine
    I’d say adoption for an over 35 year old woman would be less likely than a healthy natural pregnancy 70+ % of 35-40 year old women will conceive within a year. There is biology at work in more ways than one, for example there are more (non-identical) twins these days because 30+ women are more likely to release more than one egg at ovulation.

    In terms of birth defects, the main one is Down’s Syndrome the risk is less than 1 in 1000 at 25 and about 1 in 400 at 35. Not so much on other deformities. So whilst there are problems over 30, there aren’t as many as some would think.

    Birth problems are also not a young versus old thing as teenage mothers and older mothers are pretty similar in terms of premature babies et. Obviously overall it’s better healthwise if women have their children in their twenties but it’s not a disaster at older ages, and certainly lots of women in the past had their last children older, particularly before widespread birth control.


  84. @ msexceptiontotherule
    “Who needs botox in a dark club?”
    LOL. I pity the poor man the next morning.

    Though come to think of it, having seen Steve Martin in a film recently, could be pity the poor woman.


  85. on June 26, 2010 at 11:23 pm msexceptiontotherule

    hey, it’s not my problem what they wake up next to, though the best way to avoid that moment would be to have sex at her place and sneak out after before the sun is up.


  86. just stopping by to say hey 🙂


  87. Why’s it so hard for KassyK to understand what everyone’s saying?
    1. “If you think you’re going to be this marketable forever, think again. You don’t have the 10 more years to enjoy adolescence that you think you do.” and,
    2. “Your current boyfriend isn’t in some symbiotic relationship where if he leaves you for a hot 19 year old he dies immediately. He has choices that you don’t.”


  88. My god, you’ve just explained Austin’s warehouse district to me.