More Porn Means Less Rape

Back in August 2007, I wrote in my seminal post on sexbots:

Some of the changes [with the introduction of sexbots] I foresee:

Omegas (geeks, nerds, dweebs, trolls, dregs, dullards, bums, street filth, etc.) – will finally have a satisfying release for their pent-up horniness.  Crime will likely drop as a result.  So will rape.  Widely available sexbots are analogous to cheap, legal prostitution, minus the STDs and needle tracks.  On the whole I think it is a social good to distract the losers from their grinding misery.

Then, in August 2008, I wrote the following in my “Universal Truths” post:

Legalizing prostitution will reduce the incidence of rape.

Well, once again science has vindicated the Chateau worldview. Widespread availability of porn (where porn is similar to prostitutes and hypothetical sexbots in that it provides men a sexual outlet) has reduced the prevalence of rape:

TABLE 3. COMBINED PER CAPITA PERCENTAGE CHANGE IN INCIDENCE OF RAPE.

Aggregate per capita increase or decline in rape.

Four states with lowest internet access Increase in rape of 53%

Four states with highest internet access Decrease in rape of 27%

I find these results to be statistically significant beyond the .95 confidence interval.

[Reporter: That is measuring the changes in rape from 1980 (very definitely pre-internet) to 2000.]

Just as I surmised. Of course, this is all common sense to those with the eyes to see and without an ideological axe to grind. Yes, Jezebel-ers, rape really is about sex. The boner doesn’t lie.

The dark, dreary, ugly landscape of human nature that I drive like a stake through every happy heart holds dominion over us all, forever and ever, amen.





Comments


  1. on July 5, 2009 at 12:12 pm Ari Hinkelberger

    Thank god for pornhub.com and youporn.com huh?

    God has a way of working these things out.

    Shalom.

    Like


  2. Why do these states have lower internet access, is perhaps the question to ask? Lower socioeconomic level?

    Does lower socioeconomic level act as a risk factor for rape?

    Seems a bit more complex than porn = less rape. Would increasing internet access actually work?

    But just to be on the safe side…!

    Like


  3. on July 5, 2009 at 12:36 pm M with the dot

    Read the comments to the article on examiner.com. This is bad research.

    [editor: there are only 8 comments, and they are a mix of pro and con. correlation is not causation, but the correlation in this study is very strong.]

    Like


  4. Rape definitely has a component of sexual frustration, but maybe not about sex per se. One factor of many, I’d think. Of course, that doesn’t mean you’re wrong about the statistics.

    Like


  5. Agnostic posted some stats a while back on ?gnxp where he described how rape in the US is highly correlated to the fertility and youth of the victim. Essentially if you’re a woman older than 30, your odds of getting raped are close to zero.

    This accords directly with Roissy’s commonsense thesis.

    Anyone have a link to these stats? I’ve been unsuccessful in digging them up.

    Like


  6. Steven Pinker has pretty solidly debunked the feminist slogan that rape is about power rather than sex.

    Thornhill and Palmer released a study in 2001 called “The Natural History of Rape”.

    Of course the feminist establishment loathes this, because it violates the “rape is about power not sex” religious dogma. Thornhill and Palmer point out that a male psychology which included a capacity to rape would not have been selected against, in evolutionary terms, because rape can lead to procreation of the rapists DNA. They note that this “rape strategy” would not be a typical one, due to the risk of being punished, but that it would be a more opportunistic one in situations either where (1) the risk of punishment is lower (wartime, riots, etc.) or (2) the opportunity cost of not resorting to rape is too high (men who are outcasts, alienated from society and women and having no other sexual access). It may very well be that a propensity to rape has been selected for in a relatively small number of men, or simply that it happens as a result of the confluence of the male drive for sex with the male ability to impose that drive using his physical strength. But either way, sex is a huge, central element to rape.

    Camille Paglia said it this way:

    “For a decade, feminists have drilled their disciples to say, ‘Rape is a crime of violence but not sex.” This sugar coated Shirley Temple nonsense has exposed young women to disaster. …

    These girls say, “Well, I should be able to get drunk at a fraternity party and go upstairs to a guy’s room without anything happening.” And I say, “Oh, really? And when you drive your car to New York City, do you leave your keys on the hood?” My point is that if your car is stolen after you do something like that, yes, the police should pursue the thief and he should be punished. But at the same time, the police — and I — have the right to say to you, “You stupid idiot, what the hell were you thinking?””

    Rape is a sex crime, plain and simple.

    Like


  7. There are a few interesting parallels between rape and consensual sexual desire.

    For one thing, rape victims are very disproportionately women between the ages of 16 and 32 — the exact same group which is subject to extra consunsual sexual desire.

    For another, there is a huge black/white disparity in both rape rates and marriage rates. Both disparities are in the same direction.

    Thus, far more black men rape white women than white men rape black women. Similarly, far more black men marry white women than white men marry black women.

    The obvious and common sense inference is that sexual desire plays a role in the urge to rape. Thus, people are less interested in raping women who have passed their child-bearing years. Similarly, white men are not particularly interested in sexual relations — consensual or nonconsensual — with black women.

    So yes, “it’s about sex.”

    Duh.

    Like


  8. LR

    Rape is about control, not sex.

    It’s complete feminist crap to say that rape isn’t about sex, but rather violence or control.

    Rape does involve a certain kind of sex, yes. Controlling sex.

    Controlling sex can be very, very hot sex LR. As lots of women know, but a smaller number admit, especially at feminist meetings. To deny this is to lie fundamentally about the nature of sex.

    That’s right lie.

    The frustrated rapist may not even prefer controlling or violent sex. It may just be the only kind he can get or thinks it is, or with a particular woman, etc. In fact sometimes this leads to erection failure when some rapists actually try to carry out their imagined deeds.

    Like


  9. It’s a feminist lie to say that rape is about power and not sex. One of those overused cliches . . .

    Fact is, a guy isn’t thinking of the subjugation of women when he’s forcefully ramming his stick in her when she’s non-compliant . . . he’s thinking he wants to blow a load, when your break it down to it’s essential elements.

    I work in Iraq. And I’ve often thought that if there was more boozing and fucking her, the place would be less violent. If more men were being satisfied sexually, in the world, there would be less rape.

    The internet, which consists to a huge degree of porn, is what the bullet was to the common man . . . the great leveler, or in this case, the great release . . . I’ve often thought why bother getting a whore or going out and gaming when I can just stay at home and beat off to Red Tube?

    FYI: This porno is amazing . . . Audrey Bitoni in “The Good, The Bad, The Slutty #2, and real up and comer . . .

    http://www.eskimotube.com/68349-Audrey-Bitoni-The-Good-The-Bad-And-The-Slutty-2.html?th=2

    Like


  10. on July 5, 2009 at 1:26 pm Colin Bowel

    I always thought rape was about sex and getting off. If it was only about control then you’d have guys breaking into houses and forcing the women to do pushups or jumping jacks at gunpoint. Now that’s dominance.

    Like


  11. Come on, Roissy. While your premise regarding a correlation (or in this case, negative correlation) between porn and rape may have merit, you’re a smart enough guy and you’ve been in Washington long enough to recognize that these are cherry picked statistics.

    If there truly are statistics one way or the other regarding any connections between porn and rape (and I’m sure there are,) then there have gotta be better studies than “the top and bottom four states with internet access.”

    These are the kinds of stats Rush Limbaugh might use to prove Clinton getting a blowjob caused the economy to tank. Or what Al Sharpton might use to prove 100% of black men are victims of police abuse. Cherry pick the right stats and explain them the right way and you can “prove” anything you want.

    Like


  12. No man alive would fall for the feminist assertion that “rape is not about sex but control.” Guys all know how their own penises think and act, or don’t act.
    I once got into an argument with a lesbian colleague -a Med Student – who tried to claim that men actually had conscious control over their erections. I can see why she needed to believe that. I cannot see how she could block out the real facts from her awareness.

    Like


  13. novaseeker–

    the risk of punishment is lower (wartime, riots, etc.)

    Yes, there have been wartime situations where a large proportion of the victorious combatants have indulged in rape.

    There have been times when the view was that it was a natural right of the victors, in some circumstances.

    For instance, besieging walled cities was at certain stages and developments of warfare, given the balance at certain times between the arts of fortification versus those of breaking walls with moats etc., very difficult and time consuming. Starving out was the main strategm sometimes, but there was also great risk of the besiegers staving themselves and suffering plagues from malnutrition. So if the walled city didn’t surrender there was something of a convention that it could be just savaged. Including mass rape. This also served to make the holding out endlessly option against really determined besiegers less attractive.

    Like


  14. is there any reason whatsoever to believe the “rape is about control” hypothesis? Can somebody cite something in its favor? Anything at all, really.

    Like


  15. By the way, off-topic but I was wondering — Does Roissy have herpes? Is it possible to be a “player” without getting herpes eventually?

    [editor: there’s nothing more retarded than a broken record. you have asked this question in exactly this form on nearly every post you comment on. are you obsessed with my package? my sexual history? have you not heard of a condom?]

    Like


  16. aoefe wades in with a question:

    Am I correct in assuming there’s a big difference between men’s use of rape in war than rape in other circumstances? I thought rape in war was used to degrade women in the eyes of their own men folk and also used to plant their own dna in their enemies wombs. Are there any thoughts on this?

    Also I should say that I believe regardless of circumstances the act has to have a sexual nature to it, or as Roissy says the rapist couldn’t get it up.

    @doug

    There are a (large) number of women who fantasize about rape. In fact I’ve read women are going to sites like Craig’s List to set up the scenarios with strangers. *Note to men – make sure you get a verbal tape recording of the discussion prior to filling her/your fantasy. She could easily cry rape and guess who would go to jail?

    Like


  17. @dreamin

    “By the way, off-topic but I was wondering — Does Roissy have herpes? Is it possible to be a “player” without getting herpes eventually?”

    Obsess much? You ask the same question in every thread.

    Like


  18. An interesting post on women and rape fantasies . . .

    http://edstrong.blog-city.com/do_women_have_rape_fantasies.htm

    Like


  19. @dreamin

    Ooops didn’t realize Roissy had addressed it with you.

    Like


  20. Only an idiot would say rape is not a sex crime primarily.

    Note who makes these claims. See, it is easy to tell who the idiots are. They identify themselves to you.

    Now, there are crimes which involve rape which are not primarily about sex. I am thinking of these ethnic wars in Africa where they rape the woman and then kill her.

    Seriously disturbed shit.

    Or, they rape her with their rifles or bayonents, then kill her, or just leave her with a ruined body. Those seem to be somewhat different crimes from what we call rape in the USA.

    Anyway, I am not so sure that porn reduces the rape incidence. A friend who investigated rape crimes said that rape usually occurs:
    1. At night.
    2. Alcohol is involved.
    3. The woman often sets herself up. That is, she gets drunk with men.

    Like


  21. is there any reason whatsoever to believe the “rape is about control” hypothesis? Can somebody cite something in its favor? Anything at all, really.

    Much of women’s power over men is ultimately dependent on a woman’s control over access to their sexual organs. If a guy rapes them, it takes their power away from them.

    Like


  22. Samuel,

    Excellent point. It is women who see sex as power. Not men. Men see sex as pleasure and procreation.

    Now that is an insight. I guess the girls are guilty of projection.

    Like


  23. Yes Pinker makes that exact point as well. Women experience rape as a violation of their own power over whom they have sex with. For the rapist, though, it’s not about power, but sex.

    Like


  24. Samuel is an idiot. When a man rapes a woman, he isn’t thinking of “stripping her power” over her sexual organs from her. He’s thinking about jizzing. That’s it. And women’s so-called “power over men” isn’t ultimately dependent on their control of their own bodies. If women have any power over men, it’s that they’ve created a structurally advantageous power structure in the divorce industry complex to fuck over betas.

    Like


  25. on July 5, 2009 at 2:13 pm Cliff Arroyo

    Is rape about sex or power?
    Talk about a fools dichotomy, of course it’s both; sex for men is _always_ about power.

    Like


  26. “have you not heard of a condom?”

    You deliberately imply that you haven’t had herpes without actually stating you haven’t.

    [editor: another creepy weirdo obssesed in a ghey way with the goings-on of my package. nice JOOORB keith.]

    Maxim: If the truth is flattering to Roissy, he comes out and states it.

    [actually, you only read the truths about my life i choose to reveal, flattering or not.]

    If the truth is unflattering, he tries to imply the lie without actually stating it.

    [logic is not your strong suit. i believe you have just implied that you fondle your scrotum imagining it is a vulva while you masturbate.]

    Conclusion: Of course Roissy’s had herpes.

    [conclusion: of course keith shapes his scrotum into labia when pleasuring himself.]

    Like


  27. I think Samuel is a chick.

    Like


  28. Dreamin is a chick who gave Roissy herpes. That’s what I conclude.

    Like


  29. When the Russian Army was rolling into Germany at the end of the 2nd WW, its soldiers were told more or less officially to “break the racial pride” of German women. And so they did. Even grandmothers were not spared. In this case, rape was revenge plus sex plus political statement plus the fact that guys testosterone levels skyrocket right after winning a literal fight to the death.
    But this has little to do with garden variety rape.

    Like


  30. I suppose if you define “power” as broadly as it is being used here, everything is always about “power”. Hence, Cliffs statement is completely meaningless.
    Most people have no idea whether they have herpes or not.

    Like


  31. on July 5, 2009 at 2:41 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””””””””””Colin Bowel
    I always thought rape was about sex and getting off. If it was only about control then you’d have guys breaking into houses and forcing the women to do pushups or jumping jacks at gunpoint. Now that’s dominance.”””””””””””””””””

    This proves it right here.

    Like


  32. sex for men is _always_ about power.

    Maybe in prison between men, but not in a normal hetero relationship.

    Like


  33. on July 5, 2009 at 2:45 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””””””””””’Joel,
    Anyway, I am not so sure that porn reduces the rape incidence. A friend who investigated rape crimes said that rape usually occurs:
    1. At night.
    2. Alcohol is involved.
    3. The woman often sets herself up. That is, she gets drunk with men.””””””””””

    Most people would prob call that having sex. Woman want sex too. Feminists think everything is rape if they are the beaver.

    Like


  34. on July 5, 2009 at 2:46 pm Kick a Bitch

    lmao @ Lady Fuckstick getting owned. LOVE it. Keep up the good work Roissy!

    Like


  35. “sex for men is _always_ about power.”

    Misandrist much, Cliff?

    Like


  36. My friend who investigated rapes said that women lie and exaggerate a lot, too.

    One story he told:

    A 13 year old girl claimed she was raped on the school ground by a boy in her class. When he talked to her, he asked her:
    1. Did the hit you? No.
    2. Did he grab you? No.
    3 Did he threaten you? No.,
    4. What did he do? He said let’s have sex.

    Or the girl who said someone broke into her house and raped her and knocked her unconscious, and she woke up three days later, none the worse for wear. Hint: Being knocked out for three days usually means you are in a coma or dead.

    Not all women lie, but many, many do. When is the last time you heard of a women getting prosecuted for a false accusation of rape?

    What happens to a middle class men accused of rape, with charges dropped? A ruined marriage and career?

    Feminists think this sort of thing is fine. Now you know what I think of feminists.

    Like


  37. novaseeker

    For the rapist, though, it’s not about power, but sex.

    No novaseeker, here YOU ARE BLOWING IT. This is just the dichotomy that feminists want you to swallow, and then they’ll produce evidence that rape very often does involved control and dominance and what not.

    There IS NO CONTRADICTION at all between power and sex. They are INTIMATELY connected.

    Rape is always or almost always about sex for the rapist. It is probably usually ALSO about power, control, and dominance, but not always.

    I won’t go to say that all sex is about power exchange in one direction or the other or both simultaneously. But it would be one hell of a lot closer to say it’s always about that than that true sex is never about power exchange. It damn well is.

    Especially if it’s any good.

    Like


  38. Rape is always or almost always about sex for the rapist. It is probably usually ALSO about power, control, and dominance, but not always.

    For a rapist, it’s a crime of power since he’s using his strength and ability to dominate to have sex with women who’d generally say no. It’s also a crime of sex as he’s using the opportunity to have sex.

    Like


  39. joel–

    Not all women lie, but many, many do. When is the last time you heard of a women getting prosecuted for a false accusation of rape?

    What happens to a middle class men accused of rape, with charges dropped? A ruined marriage and career?

    Feminists think this sort of thing is fine. Now you know what I think of feminists.

    Excellent points.

    It’s especially likely women will lie about rape in circumstances where they’re embarrassed later on by someone else’s otherwise judgmentalism about their lack of self control.

    I think women lie about rape all the time in these kinds of situations, esp. these days, when there’s the feminist memes about that “women never lie about rape”.

    What complete ball faced feminist lying. Of course women lie about rape. Particular date or acquaintance rape. They lie all the time and now more than ever in this feminist lying and no consequences for women in doing it environment.

    Like


  40. My take..

    Rape is about someone not giving a damn. It happens when normal mechanisms of obtaining a necessity break down.

    Think of it as robbing a convenience store.. might appear stupid, but it is really an act of desperation.

    Like


  41. In fact it wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest if most date rape accusations were lies, especially in university (feminist saturated and cowed) environments.

    Any time you have a situation where the girl in question would be embarrassed if it were known the circumstances under which she had sex with the man she accuses of date rape, and /or she stands to gain a lot of extortion money from him, I’m suspicious.

    Feminists have done their utmost to utterly subvert the “beyond a reasonable doubt” standards when it comes to all rape issues.

    For that matter all alleged “gender crimes”, such as e.g. domestic violence. The standards for e.g. a woman getting an order of protection that may force a man to move out of his home for months, at least, are shockingly low. Really, it’s just her say so often. Incredible. But true.

    I hesitate to even say these things because many women don’t know how easy it is in many jurisdictions to do these things.

    Like


  42. on July 5, 2009 at 3:15 pm Dreamer (not the herpes obsessed "dreamin")

    @Doug

    Interesting — “There IS NO CONTRADICTION at all between power and sex. ”

    Intense sex and truly deep, emotional love is typically a power exchange on some level. Maybe rape is on the far extreme of this exchange, wherein one partner is totally unwilling. Sexual relations have a sort of power exchange balance, the power must fall on one side or the other, or perhaps for some it slides to and fro.

    Ah, hating to quote silly pop songs, but as Lady Gaga says, “When it’s lovin’/ if it’s rough it isn’t fun,”
    People who sing and write about sex/love express some sort of suffering. Sort of what game does – a little psychological torture.

    @aoefe
    Yes, the rape fantasy. It is well alive.

    I tend to believe that one person cannot truly love or experience strong feelings for another without some sense of longing or suffering.

    @Bhetti
    And this direct correlation between internet access and decrease in rape conclusion seems a bit hasty to me, too. Examination of underlying socioeconomic factors are in order.

    Like


  43. @Joel

    Or the girl who said someone broke into her house and raped her and knocked her unconscious, and she woke up three days later, none the worse for wear. Hint: Being knocked out for three days usually means you are in a coma or dead.

    Not all women lie, but many, many do. When is the last time you heard of a women getting prosecuted for a false accusation of rape?

    What happens to a middle class men accused of rape, with charges dropped? A ruined marriage and career?

    Feminists think this sort of thing is fine. Now you know what I think of feminists.

    Not that I endorse this standard, but you can start to understand why Islam requires four witnesses in an accusation of rape.

    Like


  44. on July 5, 2009 at 3:27 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””””””Doug1,
    I think women lie about rape all the time in these kinds of situations, esp. these days, when there’s the feminist memes about that “women never lie about rape”.

    What complete ball faced feminist lying. Of course women lie about rape. Particular date or acquaintance rape. They lie all the time and now more than ever in this feminist lying and no consequences for women in doing it environment.”””””””””””””””””””””””””’

    And a lot of guys know woman will lie about pregnancy.

    Which is a pretty big deal too.

    Just was talking to my buddy about it yesterday and it happened to him.

    If rape is in the same league as lieing about pregnancy it would be pretty bad. Probably below. But yea my buddy was accused of raping a chick while another buddy and me in the living room along with one of her friends. Total bs shit. But yea people auto assume the guy is guilty. Because no one can imagine someone lieing about something so serious.

    Yet lieing about pregnancy is pretty serious isn’t it. I mean we are talking just monetarily about 18 to 21 years of child support payments. If we just talk cash. Which in this world is what it always seems to come down too. The prettiest lie of all. Money isn’t the most important thing.

    Maybe for future Poll:

    How many men have been lied to about a woman being pregnant?

    I have had two.

    Like


  45. OK, tell me of anything that humans do to or with each other that does not involve “power” or its transfer?

    Like


  46. Dreamer, Bhetti-

    And this direct correlation between internet access and decrease in rape conclusion seems a bit hasty to me, too. Examination of underlying socioeconomic factors are in order.

    I agree. I don’t think much of the study either. Seen / heard about it before.

    @dreamer–

    (not the herpes obsessed “dreamin”)

    Oh I know who your are darlin’.

    Your the dreamy dreamer.

    One of the fun feminine girls around here.

    Like


  47. Rum: Watching TV!

    No. That involves fighting over the remote and whose channel preferences dominate.

    Having a meal!

    No. That involves someone making the meal, setting the table and seating arrangements as well as washing up later. Who’s the one in charge of the conversation?

    Buying a ticket!

    No. That involves gaining power over services via exchange of cash.

    Perhaps you were taken too literally. You need to phrase your question with less dominance next time 😉

    Like


  48. On the larger subject of women lying…remember the girl with 56 stars (or was it the politician that said there are 57 states?) tattooed on her face. She was going to sue the tattoo artist, alleging that he did it while she was asleep, only to finally admit that she lied because her dad was upset with her. She was willing to lie about that, and sue the guy, and maybe even press charges, in order to avoid her own social stigma.

    Anecdotal evidence. but still.

    Like


  49. OK, tell me of anything that humans do to or with each other that does not involve “power” or its transfer?

    Sleeping and masturbating.

    Like


  50. i agree that the study data are squirrely and the proxy (internet access = porn consumption) highly questionable. but i think the phenomenon is real – in the terms of the author, rape and porn are very clearly substitutes, not complements.

    a few other thoughts – doug is right that rape involves power and sex both, because it’s forced sex. almost a tautology.

    and although female rape *fanstasies* might be quite common, i think it’s obvious that that doesn’t translate into a desire to be raped. women enjoy the submission fantasies only when they feel safe.

    and i wonder how this data would look in other parts of the world, especially in the third world where internet access is nonexistent or lowband. i think a lot of attitudes toward porn consumption are culturally dependent. for example, i’ve read that something like 80% of Internet traffic from the West to the Arab word is porn. that’s because the sexes are more strictly segregarted there.

    the one question that article raises in my mind that noone has commented on is – the remarkable 85% drop in rape since 1980. that appears to be a real statussic, not a crude proxy. what other causes might there be? feminist-inspried “awareness” indoctrination? fear of false accusations and ruin, a la Kobe Bryant? young women being notably sluttier since 1980 across the board? or is porn access the best explanatory variable?

    Like


  51. on July 5, 2009 at 3:44 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    NO ROIISY TIHS IS RONG MAH SOCIOLOGI/WOMEN’S STUDIES PROFESER SED TAHT RAPE WAS ABOUT POWER AND A DESIRE OF MEN TO CONTROL, SUBJUGATE, AND OPRESS WOMYN. UR AN IDIOT!111111!!!64SIXFOUR RAPE HAS NUTHING TO DO WITH SEX DRIVE

    There, I just summed up the counterargument which will be regurgitated endlessly by morons in the comments section of this blog.

    Like


  52. on July 5, 2009 at 3:49 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    Hah… this reminds me. Back a few years ago when I was in a psychology 101 class in college, the professor made a remark that rape was an evolutionary strategy which helped one pass on one’s genes. He didn’t condone it, and also specifically said that many successful evolutionary strategies, such as rape and violence, are why society and laws were created in the first place. While this should be common sense to anyone with an IQ over 100, the 400 student lecture hall flipped a bitch and reported him to the psychology department. He gave a formal apology the next day and continued teaching the class, he didn’t return the next semester.

    Like


  53. maurice —

    and although female rape *fanstasies* might be quite common, i think it’s obvious that that doesn’t translate into a desire to be raped. women enjoy the submission fantasies only when they feel safe

    Well that’s how it’s usually explained and differentiated. And sure, women don’t have fanatasies that could end in their being killed or injured.

    The main issue and differentiator though is that they have to sexually desire the rapist. They have to think he’s hot rather than creepy. This generally involves someone who doesn’t have to rape, not remotely, to get sex.

    He just might have to rape her to get sex from her, due to some social rules or conventions, etc. (She’s married. She’s a chaste daughter. He’s the wrong class but HOT. Etc.)

    Like


  54. Maurice – the one question that article raises in my mind that noone has commented on is – the remarkable 85% drop in rape since 1980.

    Something about that doesn’t add up. How can there be an 85% drop overall when the four “star states” only had decreases of only 27%? And his bottom four states had a 53% increase? Even if there’s an apples/oranges effect going on with “per capita” versus raw numbers, there’s still something squirrelly here.

    Still an excellent question, though. I have a feeling the answer is “All of the Above.” And I’ll add one more reason of “More awareness about what happens to rapists in prison.” Not that I’ve been contemplating raping anyone, but if I were, that fact would give me second thoughts. 😉

    Like


  55. on July 5, 2009 at 4:14 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    “Am I correct in assuming there’s a big difference between men’s use of rape in war than rape in other circumstances? I thought rape in war was used to degrade women in the eyes of their own men folk and also used to plant their own dna in their enemies wombs. Are there any thoughts on this?”

    This one is easy to explain. Soldier’s testosterone levels are going to be surging assuming it’s an intense active conflict. They won’t have women around because women, except Israeli women, almost universally let men handle the burden of military service. If there are women around, there are still strict rules for not having sex with them, women who serve in the military alongside males are more frequently raped. These men have absolutely no outlet and may not even see an attractive woman for weeks or months at a time. They’re also aware of the fact that they might die, making their testosterone levels surge ever higher. All this testosterone combined with sexual frustration and easy victims, it’s not surprising men “use” rape in war. A better word would be “resort to”. Penis gets hard and something must be done about it. It’s not a weapon that soldiers consciously use to degrade conquered populations or some complete bullshit like that, it’s because they have ridiculously high levels of horniness from strenuous physical activity, danger, and violence.

    Just use common sense, if there were fewer brothels in Vietnam during the conflict, what would have happened to the rate of rape?

    Like


  56. Or…maybe since 1980, voters have elected politicians that ran on tough on crime platforms. Even Giuliani managed to calm down the “wilding” NYC before Internet porn got good. I wonder how much NYC drives that chart…there were so many urban legends of how insane some cities were back in the 70’s and early 80’s.

    Like


  57. on July 5, 2009 at 4:19 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    Rape fantasies stem from the female desire to submit to a WORTHY man, nobody has rape fantasies involving DA. Obviously this doesn’t translate into a desire to be raped, even by a super alpha bodybuilder with 3 doctorates and 6 mansions, but then again this fellow is highly unlikely to resort to rape.

    Like


  58. @riffdog, askjoe – yeah, the period since 1980 corresponds with greater feminist-indoctrinated *awareness* of rape as a crime, including down through the lower classes via the education system, social workers, etc. howver, i think that could result in a *greater* number of reported rapes, as opposed to attempts. would that make attempts fall? probably.

    i didn’t look too hard at the data in the article, because i assumed it would be pretty easy to collect. if he screwed that up, then yeah, it casts the whole piece in a worse light. (what the hell is the examiner, anyway?) but i still think the phenom is real.

    Like


  59. . . . he didn’t return the next semester.

    And now, ladies, you know why the “studies” always seem to get the “right” answer.

    Like


  60. on July 5, 2009 at 4:29 pm Gunslingergregi

    HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    Yea I actually think that is why whiskey, sex, and drugs are removed from this war. So they have perfect male killing machines who don’t give a fuck about very much all that shit inside them stays bottled up till they have to pull the trigger or drop that bomb. Except for the select few who get to fuck a soldier but seriously these chick majoorriittyyy are ugly as fuck and that is even with 8 months of no sex.

    Like


  61. on July 5, 2009 at 4:35 pm Gunslingergregi

    Guys on other hand are alpha looking so if you are a decent looking chick you can definetly shoot way out of your league. The good looking ones stick out like a walking ray of sunshine.

    Like


  62. on July 5, 2009 at 4:43 pm Gunslingergregi

    Your not supposed to kill woman after you sleep with them??

    Wait What.

    Like


  63. Hungry Hungry Hippos Yo

    It’s not a weapon that soldiers consciously use to degrade conquered populations or some complete bullshit like that, it’s because they have ridiculously high levels of horniness from strenuous physical activity, danger, and violence.

    I think there’s more to it than that.

    Men who aren’t sociopaths have been taught in every human society that it’s wrong to rape and have internalized that. Further for most men rape takes awhile up close and personal. It’s not over in a split second, like pulling the trigger of a gun nor even as fast as stabbing or slitting a throat. It involves violating something very valuable from another human being that she very much doesn’t want to give you. That requires some placing of her in “the other” category. That’s not nearly as hard to do with the women of your enemy that you’ve been propagandized against for the duration of the war and probably before it as well, as with those of your own city and from your own group, etc.

    What Arpagus (or something like that) does is decide that all or most women of Norway are feminists, feminists are the enemy, and therefore they are fair rape game. (If he restricted that to women that aren’t being faithful to a husband or boyfriend, but are rather sluts or known hard core feminists, he’d have much more luck in getting some other betas (who hope someday to have a gf or wife, or did once have a gf) to not think he was totally in left field and obviously abhorrent in his thinking. It’s basic human psychology.)

    Like


  64. Perhaps Marion Barry would benefit from some porn:

    D.C. Councilmember Marion Barry Arrested for Stalking
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/05/AR2009070501056.html

    Like


  65. on July 5, 2009 at 4:56 pm Cliff Arroyo

    “Misandrist much, Cliff?”

    No. and how on earth is the statement that sex for men is about power (in a way that it isn’t for women) a controversial statement here? All Roissy writes about is about the male desire to dominate and own women (and how much he likes anal – probably because it means less pleasure for the woman involved).

    I can be just as misongynistic as misandristic (if that’s a word) but what’s the point of that here? I generally enjoy swimming upstream more than going with the flow.

    Like


  66. on July 5, 2009 at 5:01 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””””””””””””D.C. Council member Marion Barry was arrested last night and charged with stalking a woman after the woman reported that Barry was “bothering her” as the two traveled in separate vehicles in Anacostia Park, police said this morning. ”””””””””””””

    Yup Lucifer was right save your pennies so you can just pay for sex if you feel yourself not getting any for a while. I wreckin.

    And they said the devil was a bad guy.

    Little Jealous of Roosh in columbia right now got to say. Wonder how many rapes happen there when it is 10 dollars to have sex.

    Like


  67. on July 5, 2009 at 5:02 pm Gunslingergregi

    10 dollars or spit game

    10 dollars or spit game

    10 dollars and spit game

    This could be the perfect place to practice where every interaction ends in a lay. Talk about building some confidence.

    Like


  68. on July 5, 2009 at 5:05 pm Gunslingergregi

    Plus my 63 year old buddy with two households who is my hero said columbia had the best whorehouse in the world that he had been to and this dude even worked in antarctica he has been around.

    Like


  69. on July 5, 2009 at 5:07 pm Cliff Arroyo

    Who staffs a whorehouse in Antarctica? Penguins or seals?

    Like


  70. Hungry Hungry Hippos–

    Obviously this doesn’t translate into a desire to be raped, even by a super alpha bodybuilder with 3 doctorates and 6 mansions

    Wrong. It does sometimes.

    It’s just that how is a man supposed to be sure what the specific woman’s desires are without coming to an understanding with her.

    Well one could develop scenarios. And people have.

    aoefe’s advice about getta a tape recording of a request is a good one. Of and it had better specify the man in question, rather than a category.

    Like


  71. I am a victim of adverse publicity.

    //And they said the devil was a bad guy.//

    Like


  72. gunny

    columbia had the best whorehouse in the world that he had been to

    Makes perfect sense. Right kind of country to anyway.

    Hot women. Poor country. Big madonna / whore dichotomy. (Once a woman is fallen, she is FALLEN. But that doesn’t mean she can’t have tons of fun at her work, depending on her and her clientelle.)

    Like


  73. Enough about my need to tuck my junk between my legs; onto the paper.

    Here’s a link to the actual paper:

    http://anthonydamato.law.northwestern.edu/Adobefiles/porn.pdf

    I have no problem with the hypothesis that porn reduces rape, but the paper is incredibly weak.

    The author compares eight states. There are no controls for demographic, economic, or any other changes, including demographic changes that would affect the tendency to report rape even when it happens.

    And why look at the change in rape starting in 1980? We didn’t start to see mass internet until the mid 1990s. So the author is confounding his results with all the possible changes in rape between 1980 and 1995.

    The author should do a panel or differences-in differences with all 50 states. The author should start the panel during 1993-1995, somewhere in there. The author should adjust for demographic and economic changes in each state. Then we’ll see if

    The results would be closer to being convincing.

    More granular data, like county-level, would help, too.

    Like


  74. That guy’s post is wrong. I left the real data in Half Sigma’s post on this topic.

    Forcible rape rates shot up from 1964 to 1992, and declined from then through 2006.

    If porn availability and rape rates go against each other, then there should have been an increasing clampdown on porn from 1964 to 1992 — causing the observed skyrocketing of rape rates.

    But that’s wrong — Playboy, Hustler, X-rated movies, etc., all shot up during the ’60s and ’70s (maybe ’80s too, can’t remember).

    The opposite argument is also wrong — rape rates have been plummeting since 1992, while porn has become more available via the internet since the mid-late ’90s.

    Basically, there’s no real relation between porn availability and rape rates.

    Like


  75. on July 5, 2009 at 5:27 pm Gunslingergregi

    Cliff Arryo,

    Yea he said they pretty much make up jobs for pretty ladies there he he he

    Like


  76. on July 5, 2009 at 5:29 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    “. . . he didn’t return the next semester.

    And now, ladies, you know why the “studies” always seem to get the “right” answer.”

    I can just see the freshman LUG talking to the psychology dean right now.

    “Rape didn’t develop as an evolutionary strategy to spread men’s genes! Rape is purely a social construct men invented to oppress women!”

    Like


  77. on July 5, 2009 at 5:32 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    “refusing to recognize the fact that women share some responsibility for refraining from doing stupid things that would increase their chances of becoming a victim.”

    But women like doing these stupid things like getting drunk and doing lots of drugs with men around! How else will they trick alpha into sex with them? If beta has sex with them, that’s his fault for thinking so lowly of her, she should be allowed to destroy him with a rape accusation. She only deserves the best! It’s simply a crime to suggest otherwise.

    Like


  78. There are hidden variables, too.

    Ability to afford computers
    Educational level (very important)
    Libido after sitting by computer for long hours

    New York crime rate decreased a lot from 1980s to 1990s. Was this also due to the internet? Maybe partly, but come on. There is hardly a clear cause and effect.

    Although I do agree that porn helps provide the “instant gratification” and I can see how it could transpire that porn prevents rape. I can also theorize at length though on how the media (magazines, movies, TV shows) has severely influenced our understanding of who’s hot and who’s not, leading a lot of people to follow the pleasure principle and therefore promiscuity and lack of family values. Which increases consentual sex but also can increase rape as well.

    Like


  79. on July 5, 2009 at 5:36 pm Cliff Arroyo

    “rape is about male desire …. for getting his rocks off”

    Except that nothing is easier for a man than to get his rocks off (except for the poor guy who lost both arms and has to try to use his feet).

    [editor: DA’s plaintive contrarianism to the contrary notwithstanding, there is a huge qualitative difference between self-administered gratification, and pussy penetrating gratification.]

    But while the physical need to ejaculate is easy to meet, it’s not very psychologically satisfying. The psychological need to exert power

    [you’re flailing. are you even a man? if you are a woman you might have an excuse for your strained feminist theorizing. there is no psychological need to “exert power through ejaculation”. there is only a physical need to feel the good feelings through ejaculation, and those good feelings are intensified when the penis is wrapped in the soft folds of a vagina.]

    through ejaculation is a harder itch to scratch and for some men whores can’t scratch it since she’s being paid and doesn’t have any emotional engagement in the act. Rape is a desire for a certain kind of orgasm.

    The real problem with feminism is that it infantalizes women as helpless beings unable to harm, only able to be harmed.

    Like


  80. on July 5, 2009 at 5:39 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””””Gunslingergregi
    Plus my 63 year old buddy with two households who is my hero said columbia had the best whorehouse in the world that he had been to and this dude even worked in antarctica he has been around.””””””””

    Oh shit remember when we talked about how a man doesn’t run out of game till death. Yea that is this guy. Has two woman in two long term relationships.

    Like


  81. on July 5, 2009 at 5:40 pm Cliff Arroyo

    As far as rape as a method of spreading DNA is concerned, I think the most moral thing a woman who’s pregnant as a result of (real) rape can do is abort. To have the kid is to genetically reward the rapist.

    Like


  82. on July 5, 2009 at 5:43 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    I agree with Greg’s post. There’s lots of things on the internet which likely reduce rape. Just being sedentary more often means lower testosterone levels. World of Warcraft probably makes less rape less frequent among sexually frustrated males. Online dating for omegas definitely reduces the frequency of rape. Porn is probably the biggest one though, yeah.

    And of course people who can afford internet are in a higher ses class and less likely to rape. The genes that have been selected in the underclass, pointing to the British White Underclass and Black American Ghetto, are also different from the ones being selected for in middle and upper class America. Where violence and thuggery are VERY successful evolutionary strategies, there are more violent thugs who are, shockingly, more prone to raping somebody. Those things are successful evolutionary strategies which will get a man unlimited access to vaginas the lower you go in the socio-economic ladder.

    Like


  83. on July 5, 2009 at 5:49 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    “. . . he didn’t return the next semester.

    And now, ladies, you know why the “studies” always seem to get the “right” answer.”

    I can just see the freshman LUG talking to the psychology dean right now.

    “Rape didn’t develop as an evolutionary strategy to spread men’s genes! Rape is purely a social construct men invented to oppress women!”

    This is the 100,000th comment on roissy.wordpress.com.

    HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO should win a prize.

    Like


  84. agnostic:
    If porn availability and rape rates go against each other, then there should have been an increasing clampdown on porn from 1964 to 1992 — causing the observed skyrocketing of rape rates.

    could it be that playboy et al. did have an effect on reducing rape during that period but that it’s effect was swamped by larger cultural forces pushing rape up?

    But that’s wrong — Playboy, Hustler, X-rated movies, etc., all shot up during the ’60s and ’70s (maybe ’80s too, can’t remember).

    i don’t remember porn being anywhere near as easily accessible in the 80s and early 90s as it is now. there were skin mags, sure, but that stuff was sleazy and usually sold in out of the way stores with the windows covered up by brown paper. you had to work to get your hands on the stuff. today it’s as easy as a click away.
    and playboy can’t compete with internet porn for sheer erection inducing power. artsy poses with legs closed has got nothing on ATM.

    Like


  85. At the same time that Russians were raping every warm orifice in their half of Berlin, Allied soldiers were getting all the tang they wanted for a pack of cigarettes in their half. It was lost to science whether the fuck-rate was higher on one side or the other, but there were virtually no rapes committed by allied soldiers.
    There is a clue to the puzzle hidden in this scenario.

    Like


  86. on July 5, 2009 at 5:56 pm Gunslingergregi

    And amazingly appropoe.

    Like


  87. on July 5, 2009 at 5:58 pm Gunslingergregi

    The allies fucked the same ten percent of woman who were super sluts and loved pulling trains all day.

    Like


  88. on July 5, 2009 at 5:59 pm Cliff Arroyo

    “there is a huge qualitative difference”

    That’s what I said. Glad you agree.

    [editor: not quite. you attempted to impute a psychological power mechanism to rape when a simpler explanation that vaginal sex feels better than masturbation would have sufficed to meet occam’s razor.]

    “you’re flailing”

    I’m flailing? You’re the one who’s argued himself into an untenable absolutist corner.

    [go back and re-read what you wrote.]

    Like


  89. rum:
    At the same time that Russians were raping every warm orifice in their half of Berlin, Allied soldiers were getting all the tang they wanted for a pack of cigarettes in their half. It was lost to science whether the fuck-rate was higher on one side or the other, but there were virtually no rapes committed by allied soldiers.
    There is a clue to the puzzle hidden in this scenario.

    sex is more fun when the woman wants it.

    Like


  90. Historically, rape tends to occur when soldiers or militia occupy another land, and use their power to rape/impregnate other men’s women. It was quite prevalent in the Thirty Years War, WWII (on the Eastern Front, and the Balkans), the Balkan Wars, and in the Sudan and Congo.

    Of course now, if a woman does not want a rapists child, she has many options, making that a new Darwinian selection, and useless. As long as the technology stays around, the “good news” is that any genetic component will be selected against (since the result of rape would be no children). Rape in my gut sense probably occurs where there is little chance of punishment. I.E. war-torn territories with no law and less order. The ability of modern nations to have DNA analysis, and DNA dragnets and databases, will probably vast reduce that as well. While pr0n is probably a factor, so is fear of punishment too I would imagine. Technology has pushed both to new levels (substitution, fear of punishment).

    Rape was generally uncommon in the frontier towns. Despite huge concentrations of high-T men, and not very many women. Because punishment was swift and severe, as it also was in the South. Conclusion: male counter-violence against Rape is the only proven historical remedy, but requires huge male investment in women and consequently, lots of restrictions on female sexuality.

    Rape levels higher than they otherwise would be, given that no bad human behavior can ever be eliminated entirely, is probably the price women pay for unlimited sexual freedom. Nothing comes for free.

    Like


  91. on July 5, 2009 at 6:19 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    “Rape levels higher than they otherwise would be, given that no bad human behavior can ever be eliminated entirely, is probably the price women pay for unlimited sexual freedom. Nothing comes for free.”

    I hate to keep spamming the comment section of today’s blog, but this is just incredibly obvious to any rational person. Yet if you suggested it in a social sciences department at any university across America, shit would hit the fan. Feminism dominates academia so tyrannically that even rational observations like this one are rejected the moment they hold women accountable for any social pathology that occurs in human societies. This holds true for many things beyond rape.

    Like


  92. Equally “good news”: according to some of the people posting here and their research, women over the age of 30 are safe from rape. Thank goodness there’s a silver lining–I’ve been meticulously searching for it in this thread.

    Like


  93. Yeah, I understand that part about men investing in the concept of “womanhood” and feeling the need to protect them. Thus, severely punishing rape. They were also worried about who would raise the child.

    Today, I don’t give a hoot about the concept of womanhood. They are just people, playing games and climbing ladders and watching out for number one, just like me.

    If bad comes their way, that’s just too bad. They likely set themselves up for it. Bad choices, bad outcomes.

    I wonder how many women will feel real sorry that McNair got murdered? None? 1%? They will mainly say the bum got what he had coming. Too bad he’s dead. He could explain, with sobs, how his wife wasn’t meeting his emotional needs, how they had grown apart, how he didn’t feel loved or appreciated, and she (the 20 yo) treated him so well.

    I bet that most women will blame McNair for the death of that girl, and will pour out their sympathy for her.

    Like


  94. could it be that playboy et al. did have an effect on reducing rape during that period but that it’s effect was swamped by larger cultural forces pushing rape up?

    Well, it could be, but the data is far from clear, so Roissy’s hypothesis remains pure speculation at this point.

    Two further points:

    1. Porn may be substitute for sex, but it’s a pretty poor one.

    2. Exposure to sexually explicity material may well increase the desire for the real thing.

    Like


  95. on July 5, 2009 at 6:32 pm Gunslingergregi

    Yea Amazon at work has the real boss of everything calling her boss. This shit is out of control. I am serious when I say she is not that good looking the 8 months of lack did make her look good. Now without the hair yea ugly. Body is still looking ok. Still though guys are acting like schoolgirls around her and she is growing the biggest head in the world. Then she treats my boss that just left for vacation like a hen pecked beta. Before I left she was a normal chick. I leave for 21 days and the change is unreal. Soon to be treating the boss overall as a hen pecked beta. The suplication and belly showing is grotesque.

    Like


  96. on July 5, 2009 at 6:36 pm Gunslingergregi

    That is the problem joel you may feel that way. The majority of men do not. The laws have drastically changed and yet men have remained the same. Putting them at a major dissadvantage in the workplace.

    Like


  97. on July 5, 2009 at 6:39 pm Gunslingergregi

    Chicks don’t need to follow chain of command. They consistantly are able to talk to other men three levels above them. Like the amazon said. Her relationship with the boss at three levels up was more of a friendship instead of a business relationship. Shit is off the chain. Woman do not need any help with laws to move or do anything. They naturally seek higher men to either fuck or be ‘friends’ with that in turn help with their ‘careers’

    Like


  98. While I agree that rape is mostly about sex, one can’t say that it has absolutely nothing to do with power. Lots of men get off on being able to control women and rape is in some ways the ultimate form of control.

    It’s kind of like the desire to have sex with a super hot woman. It’s mostly about the pleasure in itself, but the status boost from being the kind of guy who sleeps with super hot women is it’s own kind of pleasure.

    Like


  99. Lady inSaine parroted…
    “Rape is about control, not sex”

    The self-parody and depths of stupidity just gets better and better. cf. “Where pretty lies perish”

    Like


  100. on July 5, 2009 at 6:43 pm Carolus Reconditus

    For your infotainment, here’s the definition of rape provided by the US Department of justice:

    “Rape – Forced sexual intercourse including both psychological coercion as well as physical force. Forced sexual intercourse means penetration by the offender(s). Includes attempted rapes, male as well as female victims, and both heterosexual and homosexual rape. Attempted rape includes verbal threats of rape.

    http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/rape.htm

    Psychological coercion: If you don’t fuck me right now I’m gonna pay a trip to the local whorehouse to relieve my sexual tension.

    Like


  101. Steve Sailer has some earlier comments on this subject here.

    Like


  102. on July 5, 2009 at 6:48 pm totalesturns

    Saying that rape is about power and not sex is like saying that bank robbery is about power and not money.

    …re: rape and war, there’s a new book out by Jonathan Gottschall called The Rape of Troy that looks at the Iliad and Odyssey from an evo psych perspective — which makes perfect sense if you think about it. I haven’t read it yet, but it looks fascinating.

    Like


  103. thursday:
    While I agree that rape is mostly about sex, one can’t say that it has absolutely nothing to do with power.

    you can say the same thing about consensual sex. after all, it’s natural and pleasurable for men to dominate and women to submit in the bedroom. both sexes prefer it that way, on average. so using power as an explanation for rape as the feminists do is merely indicting all sexual interaction, coercive or consensual.
    certainly male power plays a role in rape, but it’s facilitative. rapists use their physical power as a tool to extract what they really want — the pleasureable sexual sensations of intercourse.

    carolus:
    Psychological coercion: If you don’t fuck me right now I’m gonna pay a trip to the local whorehouse to relieve my sexual tension.

    no sane person would accept that as a legitimate definition of rape.

    Like


  104. on July 5, 2009 at 7:02 pm Gunslingergregi

    Fucked up part is woman are not sane especially when they decide to themselves to leave you then have to somehow come up with a way to make you into a complete asshole.

    When lie detector tests become perfect then woman and men will be equal.

    Like


  105. on July 5, 2009 at 7:03 pm Carolus Reconditus

    Thursday,

    Thanks for the reference to Steve Sailer’s article (I’m a fan of his but somehow I missed that one out). I think he is right in stating that the jury is still out as to whether
    the profileration of access to virtual pussy fosters or reduces the rate of rape.

    Ideally, what we need is a longitudinal case-control study.

    Take a stratified sample of 100 000 twelve year old boys. Allow 50% access to free Internet smut over a ten-year period. Prevent the other 50% (but how?) from doing so.

    Measure the rate of conviction for sexual offences for both the case and the control group after 30 years.

    Shouldn’t cost more than $10 million dollars. The pursuit of knowledhe has its price.

    Like


  106. on July 5, 2009 at 7:10 pm Carolus Reconditus

    Oh shit the sarcasm tags vanished.

    I try again:

    [sarcasm on]Psychological coercion: If you don’t fuck me right now I’m gonna pay a trip to the local whorehouse to relieve my sexual tension. [sarcasm off]

    [ok, got it.]

    Like


  107. Big problem Roissy,

    Omegas aren’t the ones raping girls, alphas are. Rape (in 2009) is a legal fiction and certain alpha actions are (usually randomly) considered rape. Really, it isn’t nerds and loners raping people. It’s roided up atheletes and army guys.

    [editor: i’ve seen those studies posted by jason malloy. i would not argue that nerds and loners are the ones raping, because rape requires criminal propensity and high T. rapists seem to divide into two categories — the opportunistic amoral alphas and the desperate omega thugs. nerds don’t have the sack to rape.]

    Like


  108. What about the increased incarceration rates during the late 80’s-early 90’s? I saw nothing about the study taking that into account.

    Like


  109. on July 5, 2009 at 7:19 pm Agent Apple

    Not sure I like the new moderation.

    [editor: there is no moderation. any comments that are held up have to do with wordpress’ automatic filters.]

    Like


  110. on July 5, 2009 at 7:26 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    oh great so now wordpress is going thoughtpolice on us.

    Rape! Raped! Raping!

    Like


  111. on July 5, 2009 at 7:26 pm Gunslingergregi

    It might seem like sarcasm carolus but it is closer to the truth sadely. friend eat bitch out. Put the dick in while fucking she says stop. He stops then she accuses of rape. He has to go to police station. I have to go to testify. He gets off. Still though yea guilty by everyone except until proven innocent then of course after too. He was the one that went gay.

    Like


  112. WordPress filters seem to flag arbitrary words. Ones I am aware of are:

    m e g a
    d e l e t e

    Like


  113. Thursday —

    Lots of men get off on being able to control women and rape is in some ways the ultimate form of control.

    Yes they do.

    And a lot of women do too.

    The question is how it’s done and to what ends and whether there’s mutuality about it and so on.

    Any man who doesn’t want to control his woman in part is a pussy and will never be an alpha. Well maybe there’s a tiny niche of alphadom that allows that but it’s small.

    Like


  114. PA

    WordPress loves me.

    I never get delayed.

    I do get warned about “comment moderation”, then it puts me through anyway.

    Like a receptionist that’s hot for me, but warns according to company policy about whatever.

    Like


  115. I recently took a work-related trip to a major city on the South.

    It must still be legal to hire hot young receptionists and admins down there.

    Like


  116. on July 5, 2009 at 7:37 pm Gunslingergregi

    there where two guys and her friend in the next room. She could have easily called out. Anyway what about this dudes destroyed life. What about his anguish he had to go through thinking he might be going to jail for years just because some chick wanted to say he raped her but only by the definition of beaver he put it in the pussy.

    Did any backlash occur to this woman no.

    Hopefully during her life she thinks back on it after gaining a little experience in the world and is like omg I destroyed someone.

    Maybe Maybe not.

    Again lie detector tests need to be perfected and admissable.

    Like


  117. I don’t think there is any causality between the availability of porn and incidence of rape.

    Rape is basically intercourse forced upon its victim in a non-sexual situation. And this kind of thing is more a function of the state of order/lawlesness in a society, not availability of wanking material.

    Like


  118. I certainly have no patience for the feminist theories of rape (or anything else, for that matter), but this paper is nevertheless just run-of-the-mill junk social science with zero scientific or logical validity. I can easily think of at least a dozen confounding variables, each of which would by itself be enough to invalidate the whole reasoning. This doesn’t mean that the author’s conclusion is false, but it does mean that he might as well have proved it by reading from a crystal ball.

    Probably the most important confounding variables are: (1) the development of forensic techniques that make the identification of perpetrators much easier and more accurate, thus making the crime much more dangerous and risky, and (2) the overall drop in violent crime in the U.S. thanks to tougher enforcement and penalties. Forensic DNA analysis techniques became widespread in the late 1980s and early 1990s, and the downward crime trend in America also started around the same time — which is exactly when the rape rates started plummeting according to the graph in the paper. These two factors are certainly enough to invalidate the entire reasoning in the paper.

    Like


  119. By the way, any time you’re tempted to believe a paper like this one, remember the immortal words of Richard Feynman:


    Like


  120. “Rape is about control, not sex.”

    let’s assume some rape is about control and some is about getting your nut off.

    pr0n helps decrease cases in which it *is* about sex. one forgone rape, because of access to pr0n, benefits society.

    Like


  121. It must still be legal to hire hot young receptionists and admins down there.

    All the so-so looking, above average girls with hopes and dreams came to the North to make the best use of their intellect. Their prettier, average IQ counterparts stayed home where the cost of living is lower.

    Like


  122. on July 5, 2009 at 7:49 pm The Older Man

    Gunslinger Maybe for future Poll:

    How many men have been lied to about a woman being pregnant?

    I have had two.

    Four Here

    2 pre-kids
    2 real-kids
    2 post my Vasectomy

    Each of the 4 HB’s knew how much money I had and earned a lot less than me… Solution get the V or only date HB’s who are not a financial burden on you


    Maurice – the one question that article raises in my mind that noone has commented on is – the remarkable 85% drop in rape since 1980.

    perhaps an 85% increase in HB shamelessness

    Roissy

    parroting feminist shibboleths

    Can anyone surmise why feminists promote this shibboleth???

    [editor: yes, i wrote about the reasons here:

    http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/07/05/more-porn-means-less-rape/#comment-99995%5D

    Like


  123. I have my doubts about porn being a net-plus for society. It’s produced too many David Alexander who would rather watch a pixelated 10 get reamed than have sex with a 4.

    Like


  124. on July 5, 2009 at 8:01 pm The Older Man

    roissy
    cliff the upstream beta:
    I generally enjoy swimming upstream

    the reason stridently stupid feminists….women in general HATE the immutable aspects of human nature

    This is completely brilliant thanks – I have been waiting for 15 years for someone to explain the Chibolteh

    Like


  125. All the so-so looking, above average girls with hopes and dreams came to the North to make the best use of their intellect.

    There is something to this. I worked at a very successful company in Boston in during the late 90s and the place was TEEMING with hot girls, all of whom were from Nowhereville Flyover.

    All of them worked in admin/support positions, though, not in professional ones. I slept with one 🙂

    Like


  126. [editor: i’ve seen those studies posted by jason malloy. i would not argue that nerds and loners are the ones raping, because rape requires criminal propensity and high T. rapists seem to divide into two categories — the opportunistic amoral alphas and the desperate omega thugs. nerds don’t have the sack to rape.]

    But I think simply by having the T to be able to pull off a rape, the desperate omega thugs are not really omega but rather some form of beta.

    I think by the very fact they are able to pull off a rape, some women would like them. I’m sure some desperate 1 to 4 females would be willing to go for a male simply because he rapes. The rapist will be a lot more masculine than the average male a 1 to 4 female gets.

    Like


  127. Is anyone else here completely bored with the Rainy Lady’s inane rantings? I just skip over them.

    Like


  128. “1. Porn may be substitute for sex, but it’s a pretty poor one.”

    One advantage to porn is that you don’t need to worry about getting herpes.

    Like


  129. XRay:

    Is anyone else here completely bored with the Rainy Lady’s inane rantings? I just skip over them.

    Yes, she is probably the worst troll I’ve ever seen on this blog. The worst thing is that she’s getting the attention she craves, even from Roissy himself, and this results in a deluge of nonsense that often completely drowns the comment sections. I’ve seen several posts where a number of excellent comments were hopelessly buried in hundreds of ludicrous exchanges initiated by her. If only people would simply start ignoring her!

    Also, I find it nauseatingly pathetic to see someone who is supposed to be a grown woman, and a mother at that, engaged in internet quarrels akin to something that could be expected from 13 year old kids. She probably thinks that she is displaying great wit and cool resilience in face of hostility, but in reality, she is just an utterly uninteresting troll — and I truly pity the kid who will one day be reading this, saddened and disgusted at the sight of his own mother making a clown out of herself and throwing away her dignity this way.

    Like


  130. The general academic consensus about rape is that it is in fact, about sex. Most feminist academics who posit that porn actually increases sexual violence are talking about violence in a really abstracted way. i.e. That the category of sexual violence includes mere objectification of women. However, this is completely ridiculous. If we were to abstract everything to the same degree sex would fundamentally be about objectification, since the “erotic” factor is really mutual desire.

    “Sex” and “power” aren’t mutually exclusive categories either. The mere mechanics of sex imply dynamics of power. You can’t thrust a pussy like you can thrust a penis.

    There are obvious geo-political factors to consider… In Africa, rape is commonly used as a political tool, but when we’re talking about North America, you can’t argue along the same lines. The argument is on an entirely different plane. Africa is actually the anomaly.

    And, I think it’s pretty evident that sexual perversion and violence in other countries result from sexual oppression. I had a political science prof. who argued that violence in the Middle East stemmed partially from the dearth of women, and therefore the lack of access to sex. This sexual frustration is sublimated in violent acts.

    Like


  131. @Aoefe

    Thanks for pointing that out. That was hilarious. LR completely contradicted her own argument. I’ll have to start reading her again just for the comedy value.

    Like


  132. “I thought rape in war was used to degrade women in the eyes of their own men folk and also used to plant their own dna in their enemies wombs. Are there any thoughts on this?”

    Usually, it’s because soldiers don’t have sex for A LONG TIME.
    How do you think the Brazilian and Mexican population was made? The men who arrived there did not had any women since they left the beaches of Europe. That is, if they had women or money back then.
    So, when they conquered the New Land, they also conquered women and they had to… well, free themselves somehow.

    Another case is when you get a quality of women you can only attain through rape. See for instance blacks raping white women from the United States to Angola, Zimbabwe or South Africa. See the non whites in Europe, etc.

    See the beta boy to whom the little princess in highschool gave to much attention one day and the boy could not stop when she was yelling to him “Please, please, leave me alone”, etc.

    I think its mainly it.

    Like


  133. And of course rape is about sex and control has nothing to due with it.

    Anyone who believes rape is about control is just a deranged feminist revelling her secret desire to be “controlled” or held by force and simultaneously a way to responsabilise man for being bad (as if raping was not bad enough) and wanting to control women. Doing everything to control them. This, when all men want is to really fuck them.

    Lady Rain, you’re really clueless, are you not? And I thought I would be the one who’s clueless here…

    Like


  134. XRay

    Is anyone else here completely bored with the Rainy Lady’s inane rantings? I just skip over them.

    Oh yeah.

    Me too for a long time. As I’ve said several times before.

    I only read her if someone else says something interestingly ridiculing about her, and then I sometimes go to the source material.

    Like


  135. @Vladimir

    Yes, thats the problem. Too often the worthwhile comments get lost in a huge mass of playground-style name calling. Who has time to read all that?

    Like


  136. “sex for men is _always_ about power.”

    Some people never learn…

    But now that I am started to see that sex is no more than “power sharing” to women, it really is telling a lot.

    I AM SHOCKED FOR NOT HAVING UNDERSTOOD THIS EARLIER as it is so palpable and his always punching my mouth.

    Also, this explained why “my ten” (who does not care a fuck about me if you’re not acostumed to my beta rants, and to whom I don’t speak to for a month and don’t see for two and a half…) would think of me as a pervert when I’d rest my hand in her leg (without previous kino, I now know I’m stupid), when I started with “sexually aroused” conversations from scratch and looked to her with *that* creepy look.

    It now makes sense.
    Women will fuck only those who they think can give them power.

    … and this leaves me in a fucked up situation 😦

    Like


  137. “When the Russian Army was rolling into Germany at the end of the 2nd WW, its soldiers were told more or less officially to “break the racial pride” of German women. And so they did. Even grandmothers were not spared. In this case, rape was revenge plus sex plus political statement plus the fact that guys testosterone levels skyrocket right after winning a literal fight to the death.
    But this has little to do with garden variety rape”

    Actually had the Germans not killed a lot of Slavs and Jews in Eastern Europe, Eastern Europeans would possibly not feel a need to de-humanise the Germans.

    Also, do you think the Russians (Russians!) had a steady supply of pussy during the war? Of course not, so they had to free themselves…

    And the front lines of the WWII Red Army was not composed of Russians but of ethnic minorities (many from Asia) who had never have a chance to have sex with quality women as they found in Europe.

    So, it’s all the three factors I mentioned:

    1) Too much time without sex.
    2) Too much quality pussy one would otherwise never possess.
    3) A justification to rape. Teasing; De-humanisation; having suffered violence at the hands of the group to which the women belong.

    Like


  138. “but women pencil in the beta geek because they hate him and his lack of testosterone”

    Yes Whyskey, you are right when you profile the majority of the rapists.

    But you forget, for instance, that the mass-killings in schools and colleges are done by needy beta guys.

    If they dream they are close to have sex with a women and she then retreats (to what they believe was something close to have sex) they probibily will response with extreme violence, like when they do the shootings.

    You speak of White Knight complexes, me too suffer from it.

    But, and the feeling that she is not compliying to what she should do due to yours “White Knightism”?

    Like


  139. [email protected]:
    “I AM SHOCKED FOR NOT HAVING UNDERSTOOD THIS EARLIER ”

    The reason you didn’t understand it earlier is because the mainstream media, the educational establishment, basically the whole society, have been telling you lies. They push feminist propaganda which is so widespread that most people don’t even recognize it as propaganda. They want you to remain ignorant, because that gives them power.

    Like


  140. “My friend who investigated rapes said that women lie and exaggerate a lot, too.

    One story he told:”

    Fuck you, Joel.

    And of course Roissy, you know that your statistics are bullshit but the relation porn/rape may be a true one.

    Like


  141. on July 5, 2009 at 9:54 pm Dreamer (not the herpes obsessed "dreamin")

    @doug1
    glad to see that im not getting confused w/ another poster on your end 😉

    “Any man who doesn’t want to control his woman in part is a pussy”

    Harsh but true. Ugh, a tough pill to swallow. And most modern women might not know it, will deny it to themselves, or refuse to admit it.

    This topic is a little too brutal for me, too many harsh realities going on around here. Definitely a subject for men.

    Like


  142. You talk about “feminist propaganda” as if “feminism” is even a cohesive body of thought. The only underlying principle uniting all the different, and convenient brands of feminism is purported equality, but the statement is rendered ineffective when you consider how vague that really is. Your real target is probably “liberalism”…

    Like


  143. “The reason you didn’t understand it earlier is because the mainstream media, the educational establishment, basically the whole society, have been telling you lies. They push feminist propaganda which is so widespread that most people don’t even recognize it as propaganda. They want you to remain ignorant, because that gives them power.”

    Exactly X Ray, it’s deep shit. And it get’s the fuck into you so deeply that you simply can not wash it away with water. Nor fire for that matter.
    Specially when one has a tendence to treat (all) women better than man (even the old grandmas…) and put beautifull women in an emaculated pedestal if they are not whores or the like.

    Like


  144. xRay–

    Yes, thats the problem. Too often the worthwhile comments get lost in a huge mass of playground-style name calling. Who has time to read all that?

    After a while you learn who to read and who to ignore.

    If you’re short for time you only look for your all stars / most reliables.

    If you have more time, you start with the reliable gooduns, and then see who they reference, and expand from there.

    Like


  145. Even grandmothers were not spared. In this case, rape was revenge plus sex plus political statement plus the fact that guys testosterone levels skyrocket right after winning a literal fight to the death.

    The other part of it was rape as part of an ethnic cleansing campaign – the Soviets wanted to expel the German population from the eastern third of Germany (East Prussia, Pomerania, Silesia) and one of the ways they incentivized the German population to flee was to turn the troops loose on the local women.

    Cliff Arroyo

    As far as rape as a method of spreading DNA is concerned, I think the most moral thing a woman who’s pregnant as a result of (real) rape can do is abort. To have the kid is to genetically reward the rapist.

    Killing an innocent baby is the most moral thing to do?

    Go back far enough in your family tree and you will find an ancestor who is the product of rape. If that child had been aborted, you wouldn’t be here.

    Like


  146. Dreamer —

    This topic is a little too brutal for me, too many harsh realities going on around here. Definitely a subject for men.

    But Dreamer, don’t ignore the rest of that post of mine.

    Sweethearts like you should be cherished, not abused.

    Maybe he get’s some advantages some might not think right, but he should give back to you big too. Or else he’s not worth it.

    Alpha isn’t enough. There has to be loving empathy to, for him to be a GOOD MAN.

    Like


  147. on July 5, 2009 at 10:07 pm Gunslingergregi

    And lots of cash helps too right doug he he he

    Just reality.

    Not what we wish was reality.

    Like


  148. People often state that rape is about control. But then again, couldn’t sex be in some instances?

    So when you think about it, rape is about sex, which can be about control.

    I often thought rape was about control, until a conversation with someone revealed otherwise. (This is more for the benefit of the ladies on this site than the men).

    A male friend, who I guess wanted to let off some steam, started talking to me about how lonely he felt. He then continued (copy and pasted from an aim convo, sn removed for privacy),” I went to a party last saturday.
    Well, 2 days ago.
    I was bored, but I could have mingled, and most of the girls were wasted enough that I could have taken them by the hand, led them to the room I was sleeping in, and fucked them.
    But I didn’t, because that’s just not really my thing.
    I was really lonely though. =/”

    I told him,”Are you crazy? Next morning, she goes to the police, they make a rape kit, get your DNA, and you’re screwed.”

    He said,”Oh, I wouldn’t have been dumb enough to cum inside. Also, no one there really knew me anyway.”

    He had it planned. After I told him what kind of psychological effect that could have on someone, he regretted even having thought it. But he did say,”It’s just that, I felt so lonely…”

    Tell me that’s about power. Ladies, I’m not saying that,”zomg EVERY MAN IS A RAPIST.” But seriously, think about it. Be careful when you go out. If you lock your door when you leave the house, if you don’t leave your purse unattended, don’t leave yourself vulnerable.

    It doesn’t mean that your chance of getting raped will become 0, but if you can reduce them, well then, do it.

    Like


  149. If I understand from a brief, brief, skim of that paper …
    it’s not convictions per se that are down, but police reports, etc., also.

    Yet, as we read regularly here, women have begun to accuse males with impunity of various “crimes” such as date rape in recent decades. Women lie when they’re ashamed of their sexual activity, and cry rape.

    Presumably this leads to police reports, even if not trials/convictions.

    And yet the statistical instances of rape is going down?

    On the one hand, women are free to call anything they regret as rape, to the large detriment of men, and yet we have rape reports going down, suggesting … not so much detriment to men?

    And I’m not even being sarcastic, I’m just saying, I don’t understand.

    Like


  150. Re: PA

    Some would argue that less attractive women can’t coast off their looks for employment, so they have no other choice than to work hard and become careerists on the coasts. I suspect that in pre-feminist times, these women were the ones who tended to be frustrated about their options since they weren’t pretty enough to get the alphas, and thus ended up with humdrum beta providers*, and a few of them ended up stuck with David Alexander types. Plus, there wasn’t much of an outlet for their intellectual capabilities, so staying at home with kids was bound to become frustrating in the medium to long term.

    Mind you, from my experience, the twenty something girls that I meet in the suburbs tend to be better looking than the girls in the city. The city girls tend to be beautiful, but the suburban girls tend to have a bit more sex appeal.

    *Side Theory: Barack Obama ended up with Michelle since his options were basically limited to ugly, yet not hot girls like her or white women. Otherwise, he’s forced to date and marry downward.

    I have my doubts about porn being a net-plus for society. It’s produced too many David Alexander who would rather watch a pixelated 10 get reamed than have sex with a 4.

    Why is that bad? The 4s don’t have to degrade their vaginas with my presence, and I get an orgasm whenever I want to the sight of a woman that meets my sexual fetishes.

    Like


  151. Mandy! XD: Sex is fundamentally about power. Not necessarily in an overt way, i.e. women feeling in control by holding sex over a man, but in a multitude of subtle ways. As I mentioned, the mere mechanics of sex is a power-play. A penis is an organ with a purpose; it’s directive. Vaginas are passive by nature.

    In an emotional way too… I would say most women feel like having sex with a man relinquishes an element of control, and that’s what makes sex so great. You’re “giving yourself up” to someone, so to speak. And of course, an actual shift of power dynamics during sex (e.g. restraint) contributes to the erotic tension.

    Like


  152. S

    In Africa, rape is commonly used as a political tool, but when we’re talking about North America, you can’t argue along the same lines.

    Well it was in Europe too before the modern period. That besieged fortified city warfare I talked about above took place in late Medieval and Renaissance Europe, and was from the dean of military historians, the Brit for some time now employed in America Thomas Keegan, in his highly acclaimed “History of Warfare”. Similar things have happened throughout the history of warfare, really until to some extent Europe after the religious wars of the Reformation, and the more highly developed world after WWII, due largely to American influence trying to prove ourselves more morally exemplary than the Communists.

    Like


  153. on July 5, 2009 at 10:16 pm Gunslingergregi

    Dang lurker was right about mandy

    She thinks it is rape if a woman is drunk?

    What about the dude?

    Like


  154. S —

    I would say most women feel like having sex with a man relinquishes an element of control, and that’s what makes sex so great. You’re “giving yourself up” to someone, so to speak. And of course, an actual shift of power dynamics during sex (e.g. restraint) contributes to the erotic tension.

    Oh.

    Another good one!!!

    Yuuum.

    Like


  155. on July 5, 2009 at 10:18 pm herpes rocks

    all the girls like herpes. it increases sensation resulting in pleasure/pain dichotomy. mostly pain. yay.

    herpes is alpha. ’cause no matter how badly you try to control it with medication, it keeps on breaking out.

    to be american is to have herpes.without herpes and love, there would be jihadist sex-starved war.To love is to love herpes. To oppose war is to support herpes.

    Herpes is your saviour. Herpes is the rare gift of your breaking condom. Herpes beats pregnancy. Herpes and pregnancy together…

    maybe not.

    My favourite song is I’m Not A Sore, Not Yet An Ulcer by Britney ‘Herpes’ Spears.

    Do you have herpes? It’s so much cooler than passé chlamydia. Everyone’s got chlamydia, dahhling.

    I will be seeing you at Herpes Pride!! Those non-herpessexuals are so ew. don’t bring your herpes hag, dreamin, ok? she’s lookin for someone to give it to her but she’s not good enough for the herpessexuals.

    Like


  156. The majority of women that are raped are between the ages of 18-30. They are usually semi-attractive. Both of these reasons are biological proof that men rape for sexual gratification. They are physcially attracted (and most likely have been shunned) and rape to fill a sexual void.

    Rape rates plummet after age 35 to almost nil when women hit the worn our ragged 40s and 50s. Rapists can’t get a boner for fat, wrinkled women.

    One of the best books written on this subject is called The Dark Side of Man. It uses science and evolutionary biology (not emotion or feminist claptrap) to refute that rape is or ever was about power.

    Link:

    http://www.amazon.ca/Dark-Side-Man-Michael-Ghiglieri/dp/0738203157/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1246846584&sr=8-1

    Like


  157. doug1: I was talking about rape in the modern world. Historical warfare often involved rape because war usually meant national or ethnic conflict in the pre-modern era (Africa is the standing anomaly; most major wars in the past century were ideological). Miscegenation was important when it wasn’t feasible to exterminate or enslave an entire peoples.

    Like


  158. Mandy–

    A male friend, who I guess wanted to let off some steam, started talking to me about how lonely he felt. He then continued (copy and pasted from an aim convo, sn removed for privacy),” I went to a party last saturday.
    Well, 2 days ago.
    I was bored, but I could have mingled, and most of the girls were wasted enough that I could have taken them by the hand, led them to the room I was sleeping in, and fucked them.
    But I didn’t, because that’s just not really my thing.
    I was really lonely though. =/”

    I told him,”Are you crazy? Next morning, she goes to the police, they make a rape kit, get your DNA, and you’re screwed.”

    Yeah?

    Well I agree with gunny above.

    If she could walk and talk, tough shit on her.

    If she didn’t want to cause a five car pillup that killed a five year old kid and sent her to jail, she shouldn’t have driven while able to walk and talk, but not function near responsibly.

    Her reponsibility in both cases.

    Walk one side of this line or the other Mandy.

    You’re either my friend or my enemy.

    This is a line like no other.

    I don’t do this often.

    I’m doing this here.

    One side or the other Mandy.

    You can make the argument that a real gentlemen wouldn’t take advantage of those stupid slut bitches but I don’t.

    I say fuck them all.

    Put me on that jury and try to convict Mandy.

    Impossible. You think 12 others plus 4 alternates can SWAY ME?

    Good luck Mandy.

    Good luck with most US jurys outside uni and other feminist la la land.

    One way or the other Mandy.

    Assumption of risk. Her fault. Too fucking bad.

    Like


  159. wow: Of course, the argument could be used for the reverse, not that the reverse is true. Typically lower class men rape upper class (usually white) women as a means of gaining proximal control, or feeling empowered. Of course, outside of that specific citation, I don’t think rape is about “control” at all, insofar as control has nothing to do with sex.

    Like


  160. Doug — Rape was a tool against enemy cities and populations well into the Early Modern Era. Magdeburg Quarter was the phrase coined in the Thirty Years War. Count Tilly used it against the Protestants, to great and counter-galvanizing effect.

    Military commanders don’t like rape and pillage. Not because they are fine, upstanding moral men, but because it erodes discipline, and critically gives soldiers good reasons to desert (with plunder women or money-wise). Desertion after plunder was the principal weakness of the Free Companies of mercenaries, and the bane of their captains. It’s why both rape and plunder are often capital courts martial offenses in most Armies. Not out of morality but control.

    You saw these incidents decline as armies became more nationalized, and not ad-hoc affairs cobbled together hastily, with little leadership and less discipline.

    This was one of the reasons why Kagame’s RPF was so powerful in the Congo Wars. While his opponents were busy in rape/looting campaigns, his men would march incredible distances and immediately attack. Focusing on killing their enemy and with very strict discipline.

    Any time you see widespread rape, it’s a marker that the society does not have much control over men. No ruler or leader who had real power would tolerate that — not the least of which is the threat to his own patronage and control.

    Like


  161. on July 5, 2009 at 10:31 pm Gunslingergregi

    Doug1

    I like the comparison with drunk driving because imagine if that where reversed and the government had to pay back all the billions of dollars back to the people because they where not responsible when they where drunk driving.

    Like


  162. on July 5, 2009 at 10:42 pm Gunslingergregi

    S. that is why you teach your wife how to use a handgun because that is about the only way a woman can actually defend herself from a man trying to rape her. If it is real rape of course it justifies killing the fucker.

    Feminists just don’t understand so many things.

    I guess lacking guns her being like a circus show with knives could help also.

    Like


  163. Rape, war and the first woman ever to be charged with rape as a crime against humanity:

    A Woman’s Work
    http://www.racematters.org/nyiramasuhuko.htm

    Like


  164. @doug:

    Ok, maybe a jury won’t convict him. But that’s not something he wants on his record. It isn’t. He’s someone with a bad family history, his father has records in court, a lawyer could take him down.

    You’re the one talking about feminists taking over the USA and this becoming a matriarchy. I’m not saying that it’s necessarily rape, but she could call rape, and it could be a lot of hassle he DOESN’T want to face.

    End of story.

    I’m not siding with her, I’m saying what could happen.

    Sweet Jesus. ;-;

    Like


  165. “If it was only about control then you’d have guys breaking into houses and forcing the women to do pushups or jumping jacks at gunpoint. Now that’s dominance.”

    I agree. Not only that, but the amount of jail time you would get if caught would be a lot less. And there would be no risk of getting herpes.

    Like


  166. @Gunslinger:

    “Dang lurker was right about mandy”
    uh…no.

    “She thinks it is rape if a woman is drunk?”
    Not if she’s conscious.

    “What about the dude?”
    If they’re both drunk?

    See, that’s what I don’t understand about the “drunk=rape” business. If they’re both drunk, then…they’re raping eachother?

    I think not.

    And if he’s drunk, well…he’s getting some! haha. >.>’

    Like


  167. @dreamin of herpes

    Okay, okay what gives? Tell us the damned story about the herpes fixation and be done with it. Jeesh.

    Like


  168. Mandy–

    Why don’t your slut reckless girlfriends take responsibility for themselves, instead of expecting everyone in the known universe to protect them from their slut selves when drunk, or else go to jail?

    That’s what I’d like to know.

    In hyper feminist, beyond all historical precedent, America.

    Like


  169. @LR

    Have you ever considered enlisting? You seem like you’d enjoy the male dominated culture of the army. You’ve said before you feel your more like a man than a woman (or words to that effect), you are obviously comfortable with weapons too. The armed forces have fantastic opportunities well if its anything like Canada’s forces. Raised as an airforce brat I have huge respect for those who serve. Just wondering if you’ve ever thought about it.

    Like


  170. Desperately horny young men have been known to have sex with sheep and goats etc. Is that about “controlling” the dumb animals or just wanting a brutish, instinctual release of tension?
    If young guys are horny enough to boink a she-goat it is not out of the realm of possibility that somebodies grandmother might do as well, especially right after the City Walls were broken thru.

    Like


  171. on July 5, 2009 at 11:15 pm Gunslingergregi

    You just agreed with what I said?

    Like


  172. On Drunken Sex
    “[I]f drink takes away the ability to consent, why does it not also take away the ability to determine whether consent has been given? And why – if it is the case – should the burden of sobriety – and thereby ensuring “real” consent – fall on the man?”
    http://blog.talkingphilosophy.com/?p=875

    Like


  173. on July 5, 2009 at 11:16 pm Gunslingergregi

    Mandy
    but that is not what you where saying.

    But yea a false accusation can hurt a lot. But if you have sex while drunk does not make it rape.

    Like


  174. @doug and mandy

    I don’t think Mandy is condoning women calling rape on men who screw them while they’re drunk, I read it as she was telling the guy not be stupid and risk faulty charges. Am I right Mandy?

    Doug if girls place themselves in risky situations they run the danger of being hurt and hurt badly and it is ENTIRELY their fault for not avoiding the risk. Isn’t it surprising considering the number of drunk chicks on every single college campus that rapes aren’t reported more frequently? No – because they realize what stupid situation they placed themselves in. Not only that they usually have encouraged the man’s attention prior and decide maybe at last minute they’re not feeling like it so much. Many men stop, the one’s who don’t…well if you don’t want to get burned don’t play with damned fire.

    I have a friend who was raped by an Aboriginal drunk man while driving home and stopping to assist him when he crossed in front of her car. She was sober, he was much bigger, there was no provocation on her part, she was trying to help, he hurt. He went to jail and he deserved to.

    Like


  175. Doug
    Sober up.

    Like


  176. @doug:

    “Why don’t your slut reckless girlfriends take responsibility for themselves, instead of expecting everyone in the known universe to protect them from their slut selves when drunk, or else go to jail?”

    I don’t know. My friends and I are responsible people, so we don’t drink. You might want to ask people who do. They might understand the situation better than I.

    All I was saying, was how things are. I didn’t want my friend to risk going to jail or being treated like a criminal in the eyes of society. I don’t know all the same girls he knows or all the same parties he goes to. I mean, really, what should I have said,”OMG FUCK THEM FUCK THEM?” That’s weird. And crude.

    Like


  177. on July 5, 2009 at 11:20 pm Gunslingergregi

    Anonymous that was one of the most freakish things I have read.

    Did rain not read what I wrote that shit is funny. I mean She agreed while tsk tsking.

    I said train your wife on how to use a gun to protect herself.

    She said she carries a weapon.

    Like


  178. @aoefe:

    Yes, that is what I was trying to say.

    Like


  179. @mandy

    Thought so. 🙂

    Like


  180. on July 5, 2009 at 11:24 pm Dreamer (not the herpes obsessed "dreamin")

    @mandy/doug

    interesting debate.

    a woman has to be responsible for herself (and to some extent her girlfriends) when she’s out. which means not getting drunk. tipsy or buzzed, a little giggly, yes. sloppy, pass out, drunk, no. the idea goes against our whole party culture, but it kind of sad when women get completely shitfaced when they’re out. what’s sexy or feminine about that?

    if a man wakes up in a strange woman’s room, i don’t believe he could be taken seriously if crying rape. so why should it somehow be different in a woman’s case?

    on the contrary, any man who sees a woman in this state and then decides to have sex with her? i say that’s non-consensual, and he’s taking advantage. it’s just plain wrong. a real gentleman will protect her or help her… but not all men are that way. just the reality… ugh.

    im not saying a drunk woman is fair game – but women should have more control over their own bodies. an empowered woman has control over at least her sobriety.

    Like


  181. Haven’t read all the posts yet but the ones I have read compel me to jump in and offer my opinion – which is that in this case, you fellows are doing men, and their ordinary sexual desires and frustrations, a great injustice, in your eagerness to attack feminist orthodoxy.

    I agree that rape is about seeking sexual gratification. That doesn’t mean, however, that there isn’t something else involved – for the rapists – that isn’t quite like the sexual desire of ordinary men. It’s not uncommon for rapists to be sexually attractive and active men with girlfriends, even multiple girlfriends. Robert Chambers, the “preppy murderer” wasn’t that unusual a case. Such men don’t “need” to rape in order to achieve sexual satisfaction; something else is at work.

    And there are also, of course, those outlier cases in which an elderly woman is raped, often when the rapist is in the process of committing some other crime. These cases are indeed rare, but the fact that they exist at all suggests, not that there are a few rapists who are strangely attracted to elderly women, but that some rapists “get off” on hurting women.

    So I’m going to suggest that rape is “about” sexual desire, but that it’s also about anger – anger against women in general, against our control of men’s access to sex – and that while these feelings are not unknown among ordinary, non-rapist men, most men don’t act on them unless they are also criminals in other ways, or very drunk, or some other factors that produce a particular combination of arousal, fury, and disregard for consequences.

    Millions of men are indeed sexually frustrated, and even, perhaps, angry with the female sex for imposing this on them – and yet most of you don’t commit rape, even when the temptation might be strong. (A strange woman in a bar is very drunk, comes on to you, and passes out in your car after you’ve offered to drive her to her place in the expectation of sex. You could have sex with her – but most of you don’t…) Fear of the law is no doubt part of your reason for not acting; after all, that’s why we have laws. But – I don’t know, I still think it’s more than that.

    Men are afraid of women en masse, and one of your big fears is that we will falsely accuse you of rape: that’s why men so often seem weirdly sympathetic to rapists. Now, it’s true that there are many nutty women out there – and more now than there once were, I suspect – but still, such women aren’t that much more common than rapists themselves. In those cases where some real misunderstanding regarding consent is at work, and this does happen, most non-nutty women will give men the benefit of the doubt, and handle it not by going to the police, but simply by deciding never to be alone with a particular man again.

    Clio

    p.s. One last point: it’s more difficult than men seem to realise to determine whether a man might have sinister designs on you. It’s also hard to tell when to register a protest against a man’s sexual advances (too soon, too late?) without looking like an hysterical loon.

    Here’s an example (not involving rape): I was out at a function with my father in Italy some years ago, walking a few paces behind him. A man began to bother me, grabbing my hand, asking for my number. I dodged him for about 15 minutes, as his advances continued. I caught up with my father and said “are you ready to go?” He said yes, and we left quickly. As we left, I sighed with relief and told him what had happened. He was indignant, first with the harasser, and then with me. He said I should have screamed in protest when the man tried to grab my hand. I didn’t try to argue the point (this was my dad after all). Still I wondered – what would he think if he heard about some woman who wasn’t his daughter who screamed aloud in public just because a strange man tried to grab her hand? Would he think she was being prudent or think it was just another example of how silly women are, always assuming the worst about men? This worry often keeps women silent in doubtful situations that then deteriorate into dangerous ones.

    What do you fellows think?

    Like


  182. -it’s

    Like


  183. Dreamer; Mandy; others

    im not saying a drunk woman is fair game

    I actually kind of am saying that. She’s fair game. Or should be legally. Her fault. If she can walk or talk.

    Now don’t misunderstand. I’d never do that. No, I really, really wouldn’t. Never have. Never would.

    I’d lose respect for any man that did.

    I wouldn’t throw him in jail.

    It’s her fault.

    She should be held responsible.

    He should not be respected.

    End of my story.

    Like


  184. […] I digress.  How can Roissy get away with totally making up relationships in order to support his theories?  Answer: he’s SO FUCKING ALPHA. […]

    Like


  185. @Dreamer:

    ” a real gentleman will protect her or help her… but not all men are that way. just the reality… ugh.”

    Some men do help. Even young ones. Two years ago, a friend of mine came to school (also male; yes, I have quite a few d00d friends) and asked me for help on a situation. The night before a female friend of his had a few drinks, didn’t know her limits, and passed out. A man ten years her senior saw the opprotunity to get some, and took it. Of course, my male friend and his friends pulled him off her and fought him. They got her out of the situation, but of course, there were some issues, like if she was pregnant, if she had STD’s, etc.

    He basically wanted a female perspective on what to do, and I was in a state of shock after hearing that. I feel like I’m in such a bubble sometimes.

    “im not saying a drunk woman is fair game – but women should have more control over their own bodies. an empowered woman has control over at least her sobriety.”
    I don’t think drunkeness is acceptable behavior on EITHER side.

    But I agree that women should be aware of how increasingly vulnerable they become when drunk.

    You could say men become vulnerable as well, but to their own emotions. I mean, what about those men who go from Dr. Jekyll to Mr. Hyde when they drink? They are responsible for their actions as well.

    In short, alcohol is terrible. It smells bad, it tastes bad, and it makes people do bad things.

    Like


  186. aliasclio: I largely agree with your points. Sexual satisfaction is not only about the physical sensation, but the exchange of desire that occurs. Sex isn’t very sexy when your partner doesn’t desire you. Arousal is self-reinforced at the sight of another person’s arousal. Rape, particularly, does suggest a certain hostility toward women, in part because of the non-occurring mutual attraction.

    You also raise a good point with your story. I was on a crowded subway car once, seated beside a man whose body was pressing against mine. I dismissed it on the basis that it was a crowded car, and he must have been leaning into me to make room for someone. But, the pressure of his body seemed to increase, and in spite of me moving away as far as possible, he always seemed to inch closer. I didn’t say anything until he slipped his hand underneath my skirt.

    Like


  187. I think mandy and lady rain are one and the same.

    Look at the postings- the odd times. Look to when they both go mia- look at their blogs and the comments on them.

    The 17 year old posts her life away almost as if it were a job.

    Like


  188. Clio

    Don’t be too worried about what might seem weird. Just be clearly understood. Go ahead and yell at the fucker.
    See, guys can have the same kind of problem. Guys can come on way too strong to other guys wanting all sorts of things, like bending the rules in their favor in sports. (I was an umpire once )Just let it fly. Don’t hold back.

    Like


  189. doug1, shame on you, again.

    A drunk who drives a car and causes the deaths of innocent victims is guilty of manslaughte, despite lack of “intent”, because of “assumption of risk”. Yes. But that only speaks of his/her assumption of risk regarding what he/she might do to other people, not what other people might do to him/her.

    If you were to get drunk, and fall asleep in a public place, and I came along and picked your pocket for your carkeys, and stole your car, I would be guilty of theft, plain and simple. I’d still [probably] be guilty of theft etc. even if I tried to cover my b*** by asking you “hey buddy can I borrow your carkeys?” and you in your drunken state mumbled “sure”.

    Public drunkenness is a misdemeanour at worst. Rape is a crime. You can’t entirely absolve yourself of responsibility for your own criminal actions when you’re drunk, yes. Neither can anyone else be absolved for the crimes they commit against you in that state.

    Like


  190. I agree with aliasclio and S on both points they made.

    I had a similar situation two months ago when someone who I had repeatedly rejected decided to pin me against a wall (after an afternoon of uncomfortable advances) and tried to force me to kiss him at a friend’s birthday party. I managed to squirm away from him and decided to leave because I felt so uncomfortable around him, and I felt as though if I stayed any longer he would hurt me.

    To an extent, like aliasclio said, he was angry. He was angry at me for rejecting him. I could sense his anger. It was probably mixed in with sexual frustration. I don’t know if he would have taken it as far as rape, but I wasn’t taking any chances.

    Like


  191. I actually kind of am saying that. She’s fair game. Or should be legally. Her fault. If she can walk or talk.

    How is this different than if she’s sober? Drunk, assuming you can walk and talk and express disinterest, can be done sober, and yet one is unacceptable and the other isn’t?

    Or is either situations not ok because the woman put herself in a vulnerable situation?

    The other side of the modern reality of sexual liberation/breakdown of family/reduced protection of women is the blurred lines of acceptability and when women can cry foul, sort of how aliasclio is discussing.

    Also, aliasclio, I agree with a lot of what you’re saying.

    Like


  192. @Game in BK:

    We have different writing styles. I would say we are different people. And I’m sure Roissy could check our IP addresses.

    That being said, I don’t agree with everything she says.

    I know you hate me because I choose not to sleep around. I’m sorry.

    Like


  193. @al:

    “How is this different than if she’s sober? Drunk, assuming you can walk and talk and express disinterest, can be done sober, and yet one is unacceptable and the other isn’t?”
    Wait, I think you’re on to something.

    Isn’t there a law that has to deal with anesthesia and consent? As in, there’s a certain number of hours before a person, after an operation that involves general anesthesia, can sign forms, drive, etc. ?

    I’m trying to find the specific law right now…
    “Or is either situations not ok because the woman put herself in a vulnerable situation?”
    Well, that could kill my anesthesia argument, unless you say that they did put themselves in the situation by agreeing to a surgery.
    But either way, it is very different than getting drunk, and there are situations in which anesthesia is necessary and the patient may not be able to give consent (emergency situations).

    Like


  194. If a girl is drunk and she says yes to sex- it isn’t rape.
    If a girl is sober and she says yes to sex-it isn’t rape.

    If a girl is sober and she says no- it is rape.
    If a girl is drunk and she says no- it is rape.

    That’s pretty much it. Nothing else that needs to be said here.

    Like


  195. That just ended that argument.

    You know you’re alpha when…

    you end a discussion in four sentences.

    Like


  196. alias clio–

    Public drunkenness is a misdemeanour at worst. Rape is a crime. You can’t entirely absolve yourself of responsibility for your own criminal actions when you’re drunk, yes. Neither can anyone else be absolved for the crimes they commit against you in that state.

    Who’s rape is a crime? Feminist defined rape at Oberlin College. Not my crime. I say go at that rape men.

    By rape is a crime you mean, “and should be respected as such, universally”. Or that’s the sentiment you’re appealing to.

    Of course there is that sentiment, for core, clear, rape, in almost all circumstances. (We’ve talked about war rape in less universalist times or parts of our current world culture.)

    Sex is not like stealing a drunk’s wallet in a public place. Sex is about signals of consent or acquiescence. No one assumes that someone wants you to take their wallet. Women often want you to take their poonani, but are reluctant to out and out say so, and really want men to take the initiative, and force the issue, without FORCING the issue.

    You follow Alias Clio? You follow others?

    Your analogy was extraordinarily inapt.

    You fail. Unusually badly for you, Alias Clio.

    Like


  197. Mandy
    Sober up.

    Like


  198. @Vlad
    “but this paper is nevertheless just run-of-the-mill junk social science with zero scientific or logical validity. ”

    Actually, social science is pretty good at scientific and logical validity in complex environments. That’s the whole point of the enterprise. This paper’s by a law professor, not a trained social scientist, and it shows.

    “(1) the development of forensic techniques that make the identification of perpetrators much easier and more accurate, thus making the crime much more dangerous and risky, and (2) the overall drop in violent crime in the U.S. thanks to tougher enforcement and penalties.”

    The effects you’re talking about would affect all states roughly simultaneously. This would not confound a paper that compared changes in rape rates over time across different states as a function of many variables, including internet penetration (heh).

    If rape declines in two different jurisdictions because forensic techniques make rape riskier, that would just show up as a common effect across both jurisdictions. The two jurisdictions could still show different effects from each other for other reasons.

    I would also want to look at other crimes as a function of internet penetration. The internet could just substitute for going out, which would drive down a lot of different crimes, including assault, DWI, rape, etc.

    I’d need to see a significant decrease in rape as a function of internet penetration (with other control variables), and it would have to be much larger than the decreases in assault and DWI and other crimes that are just a hazard of people going out.

    Like


  199. For a change of subject…..

    Oil has spent more than a month with little price change. To much time has passed for a ‘surprise’ moon-shot upward. Of course, a moon-shot in oil at this time would also finish the stall out of the US Economy and I don’t think that’s part of the Wall Street/Washington game plan. The above, combined with the lunatic personality of the person in charge of day-to-day price moves convinces me that the next major move is down. However, for the very short term, I think the manipulators are putting the valley in the the ‘double-top’ right now.

    And boy am I going to be embarrassed if I’m wrong. Cause I dumped 50% of my expendable fund in AUGUST calls that expire in 11 days..

    Surprisingly, it is the crazy stuff like this that usually pays off. The well-thought out plans are foiled by massive market manipulation by government-backed entities. The drop in oil from 150 to 30 really hurt.

    Like


  200. Clio “[the typical thoughtful commentary]”
    ==== I sure can sympathize with females’ plight in such situations. Damned if you do or don’t. I remember you mentioning when a cab driver pressured you for your number, and you were afraid to rebuff him too strongly for fear that he (who was literally in the driver’s seat) might lose it. It’s got to be tough to make good decisions under that pressure.

    I was going to mention the documented cases of geriatric rape by young men, but you beat me to it. Obviously, for most rapists, rape is a combination of both sexual desire and sadism.

    The Older Man “get the V or only date HB’s who are not a financial burden on you”
    ===== If one was sterile and the woman didn’t know, seems like it could be downright fun:

    “It’s yours.”

    “How do you know? You’ve been with at least one other guy besides me, right?

    “No, I haven’t.”

    “Are you certain?”

    “How dare you question me on this! Do you think I’d not remember sleeping with another man??”

    “I had a V five years ago.”

    “Uh,umm… You’re trying to trick me.”

    [produces large manilla envelope] “Here’s an X-ray I got last year after I was in that car wreck. The clamps in my scrotum stand out brilliantly. Wanna see?”

    “That’s…that is, just…LOW! You think you’re SO slick, don’t you? I’m in this crisis, and you’re (sniff, sob) rubbing it IN!”

    Whiskey “Beta guys generally are more low testosterone, but also higher IQ.”
    ==== Generally lower T, OK, but how could they be largely high-IQ? Betas are the non-alphas who aren’t omega. If 10% are alpha and 10% omega, betas are 80%, neatly bisecting the IQ curve. What you said would apply to a small subset of betas (aka nerds), not betas in general.

    “Most rapists are generally low IQ” ==== Duh. High-IQ non-alphas are smart enough to get laid without resorting to nasty behavior. Violent criminals are almost all idiots.

    Tarl “Killing an innocent baby is the most moral thing to do?”
    === I just love it when people call zygotes and fetuses “babies.” Makes an emotional impact.

    Imagine prosecuting a woman for aborting the spawn of a rapist. Sick shit.

    “The majority of women that are raped are between the ages of 18-30.”
    === Yep. Also: “The majority of rapists rape females who are sexually desirable.” And: “Bears seldom defecate in shopping malls.”
    The revelations are flying here, heh.

    Like


  201. Game in BK; Mandy; AliasClio

    Cute but inapposite.

    Girls rarely say yes, fuck me, the first time. Oh it happens, but it’s rare.

    I could go on but right now I won’t.

    Like


  202. @Rum:

    “Mandy
    Sober up.”

    I found that statement ironic, considering your username.

    @Comment_Whatever:
    What does that have to do with anything?

    Like


  203. Rum

    sniff some chloroform.

    Like


  204. on July 6, 2009 at 12:07 am Gunslingergregi

    ”””””””””””””””on July 5, 2009 at 11:43 pm aliasclio
    doug1, shame on you, again.

    A drunk who drives a car and causes the deaths of innocent victims is guilty of manslaughte, despite lack of “intent”, because of “assumption of risk”. Yes. But that only speaks of his/her assumption of risk regarding what he/she might do to other people, not what other people might do to him/her.

    If you were to get drunk, and fall asleep in a public place, and I came along and picked your pocket for your carkeys, and stole your car, I would be guilty of theft, plain and simple. I’d still [probably] be guilty of theft etc. even if I tried to cover my b*** by asking you “hey buddy can I borrow your carkeys?” and you in your drunken state mumbled “sure”.

    Public drunkenness is a misdemeanour at worst. Rape is a crime. You can’t entirely absolve yourself of responsibility for your own criminal actions when you’re drunk, yes. Neither can anyone else be absolved for the crimes they commit against you in that state.
    ””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””’

    So sometimes fate intervenes even against are most inner wants. Tupac has been saved.

    So the drunk that smashes into the other car and the state puts him into jail. That is not doing something to him. Should the state be then held accountable for a crime.

    See it is ok it seems when it is a man being held responsable for any action even going to jail for years for manslaughter, losing money, license and it is fine.

    Like


  205. @comment_whatever

    Ya…how’s that…errr…oil these days? Looks like it might rain eh? 😉

    Like


  206. @doug1:

    I think the point GameinBK was trying to make is that if they say no, don’t pass go, don’t collect $200.

    I wouldn’t know from experience, but I’d think it be pretty strange my first time if my boyfriend were asking me,”IS THIS OK IS THIS OK IS THIS OK?” every three seconds. I don’t think that’s what GameinBK was saying men should do.

    I think we’ve already discussed how, in some cases, the line is blurred, and how some nutty women will cry rape. I don’t think this is the case for everyone, though.

    Like


  207. on July 6, 2009 at 12:12 am Gunslingergregi

    May start changeing my adivice to lucifer version of life. A lot less messy.

    Wierd that the lifestyle of the devil protects you from dealing with insane woman.

    Like


  208. Don’t even joke about that, gunslinger.

    Like


  209. Mandy is as much a 17 year old virgin as I am.

    Like


  210. on July 6, 2009 at 12:16 am Gunslingergregi

    Well comment that is the inherent danger in the options for sure.

    I am gearing up mentally at this point to go get my 20 screeens if I am let go from my job and start day trading for the next year but totally focussed on it only and no margin.
    Looking for only 2 second swings down buy then go for 4 cent moved on 10 dollar stocks or so. Having the sell execute auto after the buy. Maybe work with the if it goes down 4 more cents sell.

    Like


  211. Rum

    Mandy is as much a 17 year old virgin as I am.

    I believe she is.

    But has an IQ at 145 or a bit up. Not too far up. Around there.

    Like


  212. on July 6, 2009 at 12:26 am mandy been here a while

    aoefe

    Am I correct in assuming there’s a big difference between men’s use of rape in war than rape in other circumstances? I thought rape in war was used to degrade women in the eyes of their own men folk and also used to plant their own dna in their enemies wombs. Are there any thoughts on this?

    The Roman soldiers also used rape for political reason for example the daughters of Boudicca (who were pretty teenagers.) the intent was to make them unmarriageable and cut of the Royal Icene line. it back fired but this was not the only time Romans used it as a form of control (although sexual attraction is naturally required.)

    About the “power” angle, feminists want all sex between men and women to be prostitution.

    I can’t really articulate why now but if you sort through all of their sloganeering (particularly Dworkin) you see that affection is removed from the equation (perhaps because they are generally incapable of experiencing it.) Then it would,/i> be about power since money = power.

    In this scenario, rape would be power because men would be denying the woman (all whores) thier salary.

    Like


  213. Then doug, why don’t you show her the soft spot you have for 17 year old virgins? We all have soft spots for 17 year old virgins most especially if the are Red Heads.

    Like


  214. @doug1:

    Yeah, I don’t know my exact IQ, but I would say it’s around there.

    I know it’s at least 130.

    Like


  215. AliasClio

    Ok, I didn’t really read through this of yours uptread before.

    Shame the fuck on you for this. Throw your whole gender in jail for this.

    No, just overthrow your asses at the point of machine guns, tanks and fighter jets. YOu think you could stop us, if we got anything CLOSE to unified against you????

    Men are afraid of women en masse, and one of your big fears is that we will falsely accuse you of rape: that’s why men so often seem weirdly sympathetic to rapists. Now, it’s true that there are many nutty women out there – and more now than there once were, I suspect – but still, such women aren’t that much more common than rapists themselves. In those cases where some real misunderstanding regarding consent is at work, and this does happen, most non-nutty women will give men the benefit of the doubt, and handle it not by going to the police, but simply by deciding never to be alone with a particular man again.

    Put you back in servitude.

    Why the hell not? The way you’re sounding, aliasclio

    Think WE can’t if WE get pissed?????????

    Like


  216. on July 6, 2009 at 12:35 am Gunslingergregi

    James I think the revelations are coming from the woman on this one.

    Like


  217. @doug:

    Please don’t be mean, Doug. You’re scary when you’re angry. I don’t think she meant it in a bad way.

    Like


  218. @Rum:

    I’m brunette.

    Like


  219. on July 6, 2009 at 12:44 am Markus Uh Relius

    “I believe she is. But has an IQ at 145 or a bit up. Not too far up. Around there.”

    And probably extremely overweight. A future cockblocker, preventing her hot friends from having any sort of fun, most definitely.

    Like


  220. @mandy been here a while

    “About the “power” angle, feminists want all sex between men and women to be prostitution.

    I can’t really articulate why now but if you sort through all of their sloganeering (particularly Dworkin) you see that affection is removed from the equation (perhaps because they are generally incapable of experiencing it.) ”

    Thanks for taking a look at my earlier question.

    Interesting perspective on feminists believing sex to be prositution. I read an article on Nova’s blog the other day which backs up this claim. It was a study on feminist type women who’d been paid whores. Some of the women/whores were angry at the wives of men/johns for providing ‘free’ servicing to their husbands. They were thrilled they could remove dollars from the household to punish these women. So yes they viewed sex as prostitution and something that should demand high payment. I find that sick thinking.

    Like


  221. @Markus:

    “And probably extremely overweight. A future cockblocker, preventing her hot friends from having any sort of fun, most definitely.”

    There’s already a picture of me somewhere on here, and I’m not overweight.

    Like


  222. Gunslinger’s comment: I can’t make out what you’re trying to say. Please re-phrase.

    Doug’s comment: “Sex is not like stealing a drunk’s wallet in a public place. Sex is about signals of consent or acquiescence. No one assumes that someone wants you to take their wallet. Women often want you to take their poonani, but are reluctant to out and out say so, and really want men to take the initiative, and force the issue, without FORCING the issue.

    You follow Alias Clio? You follow others?

    Your analogy was extraordinarily inapt.

    You fail. Unusually badly for you, Alias Clio.”

    ********************************

    Doug, I think what you’re saying is nonsense. The idea that a drunk woman cannot be assumed to have given consent to sexual contat is not a particularly feminist one. Long before feminism in its current form came along, a movie like *Philadelphia Story*, which Roissy recently praised for its portrayal of Carey Grant’s character and his alpha-dom, could have Jimmy Stewart’s character say “you were a little the worse – or better – for wine, and there are rules about that” when the Katharine Hepburn character asks him how far their flirtation had gone, after a drunken revel.

    That was only a movie, of course. But movies are a popular art and they tend to give a good idea of the cultural assumptions and tendencies of their time. So – it’s not that unusual if today we assume that drunkenness in a woman precludes the possibility of consent, though things get more complicated when the man concerned is also drunk.

    My example wasn’t a bad one. I merely wanted to point out that there are situations in which a person may appear to give consent, but in which the law acknowledges that their consent is not valid because it was extracted under pressure or when the consentor was not “of sound mind”.

    If a woman seduced a man into signing over his rights to his property to her while he was drunk, would you say that the law should uphold her case, or his?

    The fact that sexual relations between men and women are full of confusion and ambiguity, and that women sometimes want to be persuaded/pushed into accepting a man’s advances, does not let a man off the hook automatically, whether a woman is drunk or sober. To suggest that it does would open the way to all kinds of abuses by unscrupulous men. These matters need to be considered on a case by case basis.

    Tell me, doug1, in what circumstances would you agree that a particular sexual act involving a man and an unconsenting woman is a crime?

    Like


  223. alias clio

    Tell me, doug1, in what circumstances would you agree that a particular sexual act involving a man and an unconsenting woman is a crime?

    Oh for christ’s sake, in countless cases. Anytime she said no, and didn’t immediately reverse herself.

    Like


  224. aoefe & mandy been here a while: I was talking earlier about there not being a cohesive feminist body of thought. You’re citing the “radical feminist” perspective in terms of turning all sexual relations into a power dichotomy akin to prostitution. This is one brand of feminism out of a huge host of different feminisms. I’m not defending feminism, just trying to explain it’s meaningless to discuss something in those terms?!

    Like


  225. on July 6, 2009 at 1:12 am Usual suspect

    aliasclio wrote
    =======================================
    Doug, I think what you’re saying is nonsense. The idea that a drunk woman cannot be assumed to have given consent to sexual contat is not a particularly feminist one
    =======================================

    That’s a bogus idea. A lot of sex happens after parties, when most of the people are drunk

    =======================================
    If a woman seduced a man into signing over his rights to his property to her while he was drunk, would you say that the law should uphold her case, or his?
    =======================================

    In this case a man cannot accuse a woman of a crime which will lead to her incarceration for a long time. So the example is invalid

    =================
    To suggest that it does would open the way to all kinds of abuses by unscrupulous men. These matters need to be considered on a case by case basis.
    =================
    What about abuses by women? What is “abuse” here anyway? Matters which can lead to long jail times should have clear-cut definitions, otherwise we have a lawless society when people cannot know the legality of what they are doing

    Like


  226. @mandy

    Is feminism then really a cover for lesbian agenda?

    Like


  227. @S.

    “I’m not defending feminism, just trying to explain it’s meaningless to discuss something in those terms?!”

    I think the discussion remains worthwhile but you bring up an interesting point in regards to not over generalizing schools of thought on feminism. It’s often the radicals who are heard first and loudest. Look at the Middle East.

    Like


  228. @S:

    I think I mentioned that here before. As in, I considered myself a feminist, but the kind of feminist that said,”Yes! women should vote!” and “Yes! Women should be able to pursue careers and go to college!”

    Except novaseeker said that most people agree that women should be able to get jobs and vote.

    I do agree with you, though. There’s a lot of Valenti bashing on here, and this isn’t the only website that criticizes her. Another major feminist website did a review of one of her books and gave it one star (on amazon, I think). So there’s a lot of different kinds of feminism than just Valenti feminism, or any other kind you might stumble across. Heck, Sarah Palin is a feminist. It’s not an organized movement, although you can’t argue its impact on our society.

    Like


  229. Correction: I meant (in my last post)

    “you can’t deny its impact on our society.”

    I think this is a sign that I should stop posting for tonight and get some sleep.

    Like


  230. on July 6, 2009 at 1:21 am Gunslingergregi

    Come on it is treating woman like they are children they are not. My two sisters can decide for themselves whether or not they will have sex.

    If they come to me talking about they where raped they need to have some skin under the fingernails. Maybe some torn clothes. Maybe a distraught look on there face. Not just talking about the weather and then oh and I got raped by getting drunk and having sex with a guy. They need to have put up a fight of some sort. I need to see some evidense or my white hot anger will not ignite.

    Like


  231. aliasclio:

    I was out at a function with my father in Italy some years ago, walking a few paces behind him. A man began to bother me, grabbing my hand, asking for my number. I dodged him for about 15 minutes, as his advances continued. I caught up with my father and said “are you ready to go?” He said yes, and we left quickly. As we left, I sighed with relief and told him what had happened. He was indignant, first with the harasser, and then with me. He said I should have screamed in protest when the man tried to grab my hand. I didn’t try to argue the point (this was my dad after all). Still I wondered – what would he think if he heard about some woman who wasn’t his daughter who screamed aloud in public just because a strange man tried to grab her hand? Would he think she was being prudent or think it was just another example of how silly women are, always assuming the worst about men? This worry often keeps women silent in doubtful situations that then deteriorate into dangerous ones.

    Your story is an excellent illustration of why human societies typically have strictly defined norms for interactions between the sexes, where even a slight faux pas, which might be completely harmless by itself, can be perceived as a severe transgression that invites scorn and hostility, let alone more serious infractions. These norms can be more or less restrictive — for example, they were certainly very different in traditional Western and Islamic societies — but they have to be well defined, or otherwise there is a fatal confusion in signaling.

    Indeed, does unsolicited grabbing of a woman’s hand signal a sexually aggressive intent? In many places and times, the answer would definitely be yes, and such an act might provoke a violent response by her family or husband. This would follow not because the act is particularly significant by itself — it would probably be OK to grab her hand, say, to prevent her from falling if she slips — but because of what it signals. Nowadays, however, as with many other things, we’ve replaced the traditional norms with vague and contradictory liberal principles that can’t give definite answers to questions like this one. So indeed, a woman can be unable to tell when the red flag should be raised, because there is no established signaling protocol that would say when exactly a man’s behavior becomes unacceptable.

    The same confusion leads to the disputes over gray-area rapes. What happens in debates about such cases is that both sides assume different signaling conventions for what constitutes consent, and both derive their conventions from their ideology. Yet, these conventions are ultimately arbitrary, and it’s delusional to think that they can be derived from some general ethical, ideological, or other abstract principles. (Attempts at such derivation sometimes result in absurd conclusions that could never work in practice even if everyone subscribed to them; hence the absurdity of many feminist positions on these issues.)

    Like


  232. on July 6, 2009 at 1:30 am Tupac Chopra

    I was out at a function with my father in Italy some years ago, walking a few paces behind him. A man began to bother me, grabbing my hand, asking for my number. I dodged him for about 15 minutes, as his advances continued. I caught up with my father and said “are you ready to go?” He said yes, and we left quickly.

    I had a strange sense of deja vu as I read this.

    Like


  233. @Vladimir:

    “What happens in debates about such cases is that both sides assume different signaling conventions for what constitutes consent, and both derive their conventions from their ideology.”

    This reminds me of that rape case in Italy.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/277263.stm

    “Italy’s highest court has ruled that a woman wearing jeans cannot be raped.
    The Supreme Court of Appeal in Rome on Wednesday overturned a rape conviction, saying that the supposed victim must have agreed to sex because her jeans could not have been removed without her consent.”

    Like


  234. on July 6, 2009 at 1:48 am Tupac Chopra

    aoefe:

    Is feminism then really a cover for lesbian agenda?

    That reminds me:

    What came first, the lesbianism or the feminism?

    Like


  235. on July 6, 2009 at 1:54 am mandy been here a while

    Aeofe,

    basicaly yes. But is is not just lesbians as you can seen gay men would be empowered by this order as men would be sex starved and (in their minds ) look to other men for fulfillment.

    s

    This is one brand of feminism out of a huge host of different feminisms. I’m not defending feminism, just trying to explain it’s meaningless to discuss something in those terms?!

    No it isn’t meaningless. This is the nucleus of the atom of feminism. All other “types of feminism” are like electrons buzzing around the nucleus. They are just meaningless flitting of silly women. Like your post. If feminism has no fixed definition then it is feminism that is meaningless.

    Like


  236. Mandy! XD:

    This reminds me of that rape case in Italy.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/277263.stm

    “Italy’s highest court has ruled that a woman wearing jeans cannot be raped.
    The Supreme Court of Appeal in Rome on Wednesday overturned a rape conviction, saying that the supposed victim must have agreed to sex because her jeans could not have been removed without her consent.”

    Yes, I remember reading about this case in the news. I would bet that the jeans argument was in fact grossly misrepresented by journalists as decisive. According to the stated facts, this is one of those he said/she said cases where there isn’t sufficient proof of guilt to satisfy the criminal trial standard. And anyway, it’s possible that the jeans argument wouldn’t sound as preposterous as the reporters presented it if we knew more about the concrete details of the case. It might well be that some crucial part of the accuser’s story was contradicted by the fact that her pants couldn’t be taken off easily.

    In any case, this isn’t what I was talking about. I had in mind cases where the facts are known and undisputed, and the only issue is what should be interpreted as consent.

    Like


  237. @mandy been here a while

    “But is is not just lesbians as you can seen gay men would be empowered by this order as men would be sex starved and (in their minds ) look to other men for fulfillment”

    Huh. Who knew. Makes a lot of sense when I think of it that way, I never could get why most women would want the whole equality dealioso anyways. Now I see it’s not about equality afterall, it’s about disempowering men. I like your answer to S. too, makes sense to get to the root of the cause and then understand it’s sub groups afterwards.

    Like


  238. on July 6, 2009 at 2:09 am The Older Man

    James O
    The Older Man “get the V or only date HB’s who are not a financial burden on you”
    ===== If one was sterile and the woman didn’t know, seems like it could be downright fun:

    1) both times it was fun – – I cant tell you how sweet it is to breath that sigh of relief knowing that its not you who is up for 18 years of extortionate CS payments.

    The only problem is that I live on an Holiday Island and I had to drive them a long way home after 2 of those conversations. (Luckily the ferry boat driver was still operating both times)

    Like


  239. on July 6, 2009 at 2:17 am Cliff Arroyo

    “there is a huge qualitative difference between self-administered gratification, and pussy penetrating gratification …. there is only a physical need to feel the good feelings through ejaculation, and those good feelings are intensified when the penis is wrapped in the soft folds of a vagina”

    Then why on earth would masturbating to porn (with no real vaginas involved) reduce the rate of rape?
    Are you really sure you’ve thought this through?

    If you’re posititon is that rape equals desire for an orgasm then you’d have to try to prove that:

    1. porn helps guys get laid (not an easy sell)

    2. porn-inspired masturbation is qualitatively different from other kinds.

    I’m actually more willing to believe this, and it could well be that for many particular guys masturbating while watching porn in which their fantasies are acted out in explicit detail (again and again and again) is more psychologically satisfying than non-porn inspired masturbation. But you haven’t made that case.

    Like


  240. on July 6, 2009 at 2:22 am mandy been here a while

    Vladimir

    So indeed, a woman can be unable to tell when the red flag should be raised, because there is no established signaling protocol that would say when exactly a man’s behavior becomes unacceptable.

    This could apply to blighted courtship rituals as well. Western Civ used to have a protocol to follow if a man wanted to marry a woman and a protocol for the woman to follow if she was interested.

    Deconstructionsim has this all up in the air so women resort to manipulation to try to get men to marry them and men develop game to get sex without being manipulated.

    Like


  241. mandy been here a while:

    “If feminism has no fixed definition then it is feminism that is meaningless.”

    Yes, that is exactly what I’m arguing. Feminism is NOT a cohesive body of thought, and shouldn’t be granted any merit. Your real target is liberalism, which is the route I think you were trying to take when you brought up “deconstructionism”… Which wasn’t really sensical in your context, in that there wasn’t a direct or clear link between deconstructionism and the point you were making.

    Like


  242. Whew…it’s nice to know in the horrors of aging, at least I can look forward to being less at risk for rape. I don’t know how “rape isn’t about sex” can even be said with a straight face. Saying “it’s about power and control” doesn’t preclude the sex angle either, since sex IS about power and control.

    As for rape fantasies…fantasizing about being raped, even going on Craigslist to set up a scenario, doesn’t equate to secretly wanting to be raped. The funny paradox about female rape fantasies is that it’s ultimately the person fantasizing who is completely in control, from the appearance of the ‘attacker’ to his every word and action. Even in the roughest rape play scenarios, it’s still consensual and usually highly scripted. To me it boils down to consent vs non-consent. That’s all.

    People should be asked to take an oath before reporting a rape so that if they’re lying, they can be indicted for perjury and fully prosecuted. No mercy for false accusers. I also have noticed tons of Take Back the Night “rape awareness” propaganda on university campuses warning college women that all men are potential rapists, but very little sane, grounded advice about the stupidity of getting falling-down drunk at frat parties. Most of the rapes reported on my campus seemed so tragically preventable, but nobody wanted to mention that for fear of being publicly censured for “blaming the victims.”

    @ doug1-

    Is everything ok? You usually seem so chill, but you sound upset tonight.

    Like


  243. Keith:

    Actually, social science is pretty good at scientific and logical validity in complex environments.

    Maybe in some other universe. In ours, its results usually vary between bad arguments for what the authors’ ideology has already firmly convinced them of and just ordinary nonsense. (I also count pompous statements of the obvious in the latter category.)

    Again, I don’t think the conclusion of this paper is necessarily false; I’d say that it even sounds somewhat plausible, although the effect is nowhere as potent as the author would like us to think. What I’m attacking is the idea that he has “proved” something with these number games.

    The effects you’re talking about would affect all states roughly simultaneously. This would not confound a paper that compared changes in rape rates over time across different states as a function of many variables, including internet penetration (heh).

    If rape declines in two different jurisdictions because forensic techniques make rape riskier, that would just show up as a common effect across both jurisdictions. The two jurisdictions could still show different effects from each other for other reasons.

    Um, yes, but what would the signal to noise ratio be in such a case? The whole thing just doesn’t make any sense.

    On the one hand, porn is supposed to be such a potent factor that its effect on the rape rate is on the same order of magnitude as the effects of much improved forensics and tougher enforcement and sentencing. But then, it has to be confounded by some mysterious factors that are sometimes even more powerful, because apparently, a 35-40% internet access rate fails to stop the increasing rape rates in the four least-wired states — but it did stop and reverse them in the four most-wired states when it was at the same level a few years ago. (Just look at the raw data, to which the paper gives a link. Some of the numbers look suspicious to me, by the way — I can hardly believe that the number of rapes in Alaska jumped from 250 to 421, a 68% increase, in a single year between 1980 and 1981.)

    Or do better forensics and tougher enforcement and sentencing perhaps correlate with higher internet access for some reason? But then the whole argument collapses completely.

    I would also want to look at other crimes as a function of internet penetration. The internet could just substitute for going out, which would drive down a lot of different crimes, including assault, DWI, rape, etc.

    I’d need to see a significant decrease in rape as a function of internet penetration (with other control variables), and it would have to be much larger than the decreases in assault and DWI and other crimes that are just a hazard of people going out.

    And you still wouldn’t prove anything at all. Off the top of my head, here’s a competing hypothesis. Those places where feminist influences have caused the greatest changes in attitudes in the last 20-30 years, causing the greatest increases in both reporting and conviction rates for rape — regardless of the actual offense rate — are the same ones where the internet is least widespread. These are simply places that have been both socially reactionary and economically underdeveloped; it’s just that the practical effects of feminism are making greater relative advances than the internet infrastructure (which I don’t find implausible at all, given how social and cultural trends often travel well ahead of economic development). I wouldn’t be surprised if the same places, being relatively poor, backward, and all, still have the highest rates of DWI, bar fights, and other “hazards of going out.” And there you go — an entirely different theory fitting the same data.

    This explanation is, of course, contrived to fit the data. But is it more implausible than the porn theory? I wouldn’t say so, given the above facts. And this is just the first alternative explanation that occurred to me. It might be true, or it might be false. The difference is that I’m not pretending to be doing “science” when I’m wasting my time with armchair philosophizing.

    Like


  244. on July 6, 2009 at 3:27 am mandy been here a while

    I apologize S

    I misunderstood your earlier comment then

    Like


  245. I just remembered that there was another study of this sort touted a few years ago on Slate by Steven Landsburg (why am I not surprised?). Unsurprisingly, on closer inspection it turned out to be complete garbage:
    http://www.volokh.com/posts/1162276977.shtml

    Like


  246. Feminism is the creationism of the left.

    Like


  247. Mandy XD is a cuntrag.

    Like


  248. “the one question that article raises in my mind that noone has commented on is – the remarkable 85% drop in rape since 1980. that appears to be a real statussic, not a crude proxy. what other causes might there be?”

    Drop?
    Care to present any data? Otherwise, I’ll not believe you.

    Like


  249. on July 6, 2009 at 4:45 am Gunslingergregi

    The call goes out to men everywhere please develop the lie detector that is 100 percent accurate.

    Like


  250. “there were virtually no rapes committed by allied soldiers.”

    Rum, fuck you. Fuck you and suck my dick.

    Like


  251. on July 6, 2009 at 4:47 am Gunslingergregi

    Did you get raped?

    Yes

    BZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!!!!!!!

    Wrong answer.

    Next case.

    Throw her to the lions

    Did you rape her?

    No

    Ding Ding Ding we have a winner.

    Ok you can go watch her get eaten if you would like.

    Like


  252. on July 6, 2009 at 4:51 am Gunslingergregi

    Of course I would also apply it in reverse. I really do believe in equality. Lie detecter test will help insure that it is not just the better actor that gets justice but the person who did not do wrong.

    Like


  253. ” Despite huge concentrations of high-T men, and not very many women. Because punishment was swift and severe, as it also was in the South. Conclusion: male counter-violence against Rape is the only proven historical remedy, but requires huge male investment in women and consequently, lots of restrictions on female sexuality.”

    Well said Whiskey.

    But, do the women deserve such an investment?

    (Look who’s speaking, I(‘ll) always act as if they do even if they do not…)

    Like


  254. “Killing an innocent baby is the most moral thing to do?”

    Definetly.

    “Go back far enough in your family tree and you will find an ancestor who is the product of rape. If that child had been aborted, you wouldn’t be here.”

    Perfect we-are-the-world liberal/feminist logic.

    I guess you wouldn’t mind I’d rape your wife and that your daughter would really be the product of my rape, hum?

    You are doomed in part a pussy. And this, at least.

    Like


  255. “My personal sexual preferences (or anyone else’s) have nothing to do at all with actual rape in general so I don’t even see how your statement applies in any way.”

    See Lady Rain, you’re not making much sense.
    THE MEN SEXUAL PERFERENCES ARE PRETTY MUCH EVERYTHING THAT DRIVES HIMSELF TO RAPE. To the men it’s 99% about that.

    In this context, POWER IS A WAY to get “sexual satisfaction”. Power is only a mean to achieve an end:

    THE END IS SEXUAL SATISFACTION TO UNCONSENTING SEX for the men.

    Like


  256. Could it be about BOTH sex AND control???

    Or more about sex in some situations and more about control in others?

    I think to say its all one or nothing is not taking into account many variables.

    Also, porn has different effects on different people, especially people from various cultures. While it may be a sort of “release” to some folk, it may be a sort of “trigger” to others.

    Like


  257. on July 6, 2009 at 6:05 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    Gunslinger

    Lie detecter test will help insure that it is not just the better actor that gets justice but the person who did not do wrong.

    Greg, do you have any idea how lie detector tests work? They aren’t magic. All they do is measure physiological signs that are correlated to arousal: pulse, superficial perspiration, and so on. It’s incredibly easy to “game” them.

    If anything, such tests will ensure that it’s “just the better actor who gets justice”.

    Like


  258. Once the Islamic hegemony takes over, practically nobody is going to be inebriated — the evil of alcohol will be eliminated (using that as a tool to get laid will be replaced with other methods) — and this discussion will be moot. This is precisely the problems Islam predicted and your Western lifestyle with its inferior birth rates will be your downfall.

    [That was a fun way to make some important points. I think]

    Epoxytocin: But are we that far off using fMRIs and similar? Think we could use them much more accurately than your average lie detector test already what with complexity of lie formation triggers vs. simplicity of memory retrieval (this is more me extrapolating from basic neuroscience and some different instances of how fMRIs are applied rather than remembering THAT much evidence). Of course, if the lie is already stored in your memory…

    A quick search on Google seems to indicate that this has already been looked at, mentioning the predicted problem of ‘false’ memory retrieval:
    http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2007/lying.html

    There seems to be potential to the fMRI-style technology unlike the polygraph technique, which can’t be developed.

    I can read your mind…

    If anything, such tests will ensure that it’s “just the better actor who gets justice”.

    Fact of life, isn’t it? Interviews, Jobsearching, Game, Politics, Stardom… suppose you can do all you can to prevent it but that is what it is.

    Good actors finish first.

    Like


  259. “The reason you didn’t understand it earlier is because the mainstream media, the educational establishment, basically the whole society, have been telling you lies. They push feminist propaganda which is so widespread that most people don’t even recognize it as propaganda. They want you to remain ignorant, because that gives them power.”

    True that. I was always afraid to make the first move because of fear of being accused of sexual harassment…which of course is exactly what the feminists wanted, to castrate betas like me.

    I never believed in feminism. I hated them ever since I knew women didn’t have to register for the draft. But I did fear them, and by implication all women.

    Deprogramming takes a while. But I’m getting there.

    Like


  260. AliasClio

    The idea that a drunk woman cannot be assumed to have given consent to sexual contat is not a particularly feminist one. Long before feminism in its current form came along, a movie like *Philadelphia Story*, which Roissy recently praised for its portrayal of Carey Grant’s character and his alpha-dom, could have Jimmy Stewart’s character say “you were a little the worse – or better – for wine, and there are rules about that” when the Katharine Hepburn character asks him how far their flirtation had gone, after a drunken revel.

    That was only a movie, of course. But movies are a popular art and they tend to give a good idea of the cultural assumptions and tendencies of their time.

    Yes, the particularly pernious brand of AngloSphere feminism did grow in part out of Anglosphere’s particularly exaggerated and female privileging chivalry. Which in the context of feminism and modernity I thoroughly reject, certainly as the basis of law as opposed to what might be the most exemplary behavior.

    If she can walk and talk, and she consents to sex, it’s no crime period.

    Men, stand firm on this. Stand firm on juries. And in legislatures.

    Slut bitches don’t get to want the sex when drunk, and then cry rape when sober.

    And send confused men TO JAIL for their behavior.

    Overthrow feminist governments that hold otherwise.

    Like


  261. What about men being raped, is that about control or sex?

    It’s obvious to me as a man that men raping women would be about sex. Perhaps women raping men is about control for them, that’s why they think it’s “obvious” that all rape is about control. Also gay men raping men might be about control too, who knows. Gay ppl anyone?

    Like


  262. Anyone that wants to sarge in Manhattan email me here.
    [email protected]

    Like


  263. aliasclio

    Men are afraid of women en masse, and one of your big fears is that we will falsely accuse you of rape: that’s why men so often seem weirdly sympathetic to rapists. Now, it’s true that there are many nutty women out there – and more now than there once were, I suspect – but still, such women aren’t that much more common than rapists themselves. In those cases where some real misunderstanding regarding consent is at work, and this does happen, most non-nutty women will give men the benefit of the doubt, and handle it not by going to the police, but simply by deciding never to be alone with a particular man again.

    This is a long winded version of the feminist nostrum that “women don’t lie about rape.”

    Bullshit. they don’t clio. That’s right clio. Shit for you note shiite.

    Sell your “trust us ladies” stupidity elsewhere.

    You should be ashamed of showing yourself around here with views like that, rank feminist.

    If she can walk and talk, and she doesn’t say no to sex, it isn’t rape.

    A woman is responsible for what she does behind the wheel of a car when she’s various stages and gradations of inebriated.

    So to when she opens her legs willing when drunk.

    But decides the next day, or a week later when sober, that she wouldn’t have when sober. She’s decided. After shaming. By her mother. Or whatever.

    Like


  264. @doug, just above – i read clio as saying the opposite – most women in those situations of “misunderstanding” will *not* report a rape.

    on this topic in general: i’m mostly with the girls here, even though doug’s position seems to have softened over the course of the thread. i think rape, or any kind of assault, on an unconsenting victim should be disallowed.

    BK’s four-line summary is the simplest, but it leaves out what happens when women change their mind after the fact – or don’t remember, or want to remember, that they actually gave consent – or whatever. on those i’m with doug. there is no standard or possibility of discerning facts, intent, whatever. so society, the courts, whatever, think they have to make a default judgment/assumption. feminists have pushed that default assumption too far one way, and most men think it needs to be pushed back. a great example is the rape-accuser shield laws and the corresponding rape-accusee-press-circus-of-shame reality. innocent until proven guilty? uh, not any more.

    what if there doesn’t need to be a default assumption though? what if the smartest thing to do is treat each case individually and without hype or ideology? and without assuming automatically that the women is always telling the truth and the man is always lying? a long way to go til there, though.

    speaking of default – where is Default User these days…?

    Like


  265. Don’t worry Mandy XD; Nobama wills ave us all from the evils of drunken rape!

    Except the Cubans, who obviously didn;t vote for him because they’re racists.

    Like


  266. on July 6, 2009 at 11:09 am mandy been here a while

    maurice

    what if the smartest thing to do is treat each case individually and without hype or ideology?

    Yes, that would be good. Investigate the claims properly and thoroughly before charging men (or before announcing to the public who the suspect is ala Duke Lacrosse.)

    The rape accuser shield laws are unconstitutional.

    Of course you understand in the 60s a lot of activists intentional flooded law schools and now they are enshrined as DAs, judges, and victims’ activists. They’ve got a lot to lose financially and politically by reducing the number of “rapes.”

    I think it will be pushed back, one way or another. And these activists and lawyers will be in for a rude awakening.

    Like


  267. aliasclio, lol.

    In the pre-feminist days, and even still true to an extent nowadays, prosecutors working on a rape case always wanted men, and abhorred women, on the jury.

    Why?

    Men (or at least American Men) have entirely chivalrous idea about women (perhaps beta is a better term). A woman sobbing on the stand is a very powerful image to a man; a woman’s tears are better than alcohol at removing logic from a man. So an all-male were much more likely to convict a rapist on flimsy evidence.

    not so women. A majority female jury—especially of women who were married—were much more likely to acquit. Women had no illusions about other’s women’s tears, and were much more shrewd at determining a tart trying to drag a man down for her own sins, and the married ones/ones with sons understood that men’s actions weren’t as “big bad rapists” but easily manipulated-by-women beasts.

    Farners do not romanticize farm animals; city folk do.

    Of course, feminism ruined that clear logic on many women. Take back the night is the best example; go to any, and 1/3 are true rape stories, and 2/3 are fake rape stories—they brought a guy home, slept with him, and passed out, and called it rape. These are designed to convince women that somehow acting like a whore is ok, and you can call rape on anything.

    Still, even in places liek Berkeley and NYC, you can find women who don’t buy women’s bullshit. This is why feminists often try to claim that their greatest enemies are other women—which si true, since a logical woman can rip apart feminism simply by existing (see Palin, Sarah).

    Like


  268. What did I do to you, Lurker?

    Seriously, what?

    and maurice- well said.

    Technology isn’t too far off, we already have FMRI imaging, which should be able to read intentions in a few years. Eliminates the he said/she said but also eliminates the right for people to keep their own thoughts in their heads. haha. Not exactly ethical.

    Like


  269. on July 6, 2009 at 11:12 am mandy been here a while

    lurker

    Women had no illusions about other’s women’s tears, and were much more shrewd at determining a tart trying to drag a man down for her own sins, and the married ones/ones with sons understood that men’s actions weren’t as “big bad rapists” but easily manipulated-by-women beasts.

    Exactly

    Like


  270. @lurker:

    Sarah Palin calls herself a feminist.

    “A majority female jury—especially of women who were married—were much more likely to acquit. Women had no illusions about other’s women’s tears, and were much more shrewd at determining a tart trying to drag a man down for her own sins, and the married ones/ones with sons understood that men’s actions weren’t as “big bad rapists” but easily manipulated-by-women beasts.”
    Women are also bitches to one another for no reason, or maybe even for jealousy.

    Hell, if the rape victim were pretty, that would be the end of it. Fat, pasty, aging American cows were probably angry at her for being better looking than them.

    You can’t just say,”Women know other women!”

    I mean, yes, this is the truth in a lot of cases, but women are also really shitty to one another for something as little as jealousy, or just to watch the other woman suffer. That’s what they do.

    I know from firsthand experience.

    Like


  271. So we have increased belief in women’s honesty/faith/viewpoint/whatnot in the legal system, presumably making women more comfortable alleging rape. We have arguments and claims that women are freely alleging date/acquaintance rape.

    And, according to this post/article, we have a decrease in rape reports and convictions.

    Something is rotten in the state of Denmark.

    Like


  272. Mandy XD:

    “I know from firsthand experience.”

    —this is cuntrag’s counter to every logical assertion and fact-based argument coutnering her: well, I’m an insane delusional bitch, so my personal anecdotes outweigh all evidence and data to to the contrary.

    Heh. Come to think of it, that’s every feminazis argument.

    Feminism is the creationism of the left.

    Like


  273. falsely claiming rape SHOULD be a crime , but sadly its not

    in addition , falsely claiming that a rich man is the father of your child in hopes of scoring big amounts of child support money is the ONLY form of legal fraud in this country

    Like


  274. Women had no illusions about other’s women’s tears

    True. Nicole Simpson’s sister’s tears didn’t exactly help the OJ prosecution.

    Like


  275. What tears, PA? From her corpse?
    /snark off.

    OJ was about the racism defense. It was the crystallization of every dream left wingers have: that a violent, worthless black man could get away with murder solely because of his race.

    Like


  276. “Interesting perspective on feminists believing sex to be prositution. I read an article on Nova’s blog the other day which backs up this claim. It was a study on feminist type women who’d been paid whores. Some of the women/whores were angry at the wives of men/johns for providing ‘free’ servicing to their husbands. They were thrilled they could remove dollars from the household to punish these women. So yes they viewed sex as prostitution and something that should demand high payment. I find that sick thinking.”

    @aoefe —

    It’s the idea that sex is a form of currency running in one direction. As mandy been here a while points out, this is one of the core perspectives of the radical feminist leadership: men want sex from women, and women should be compensated for this –> there should be no “sex for free”, because if women “give” men sex “for free”, then the sexual power that (according to this theory) all women have over all men, as class, is diminished. In other words, in this view (which is all about gender power), women who provide sex “for free” are like scabs violating a union strike –> the sisterhood is the union in this case, and the exhortation is for a kind of sisterly solidarity to *not* give away sex for free, but instead to consistently require specific compensation for sex in order to maximize the natural lynchpin of power that women, as a class, have over men, as a class –> sexual access.

    It’s a very materialistic world-view, of course, but that’s to be expected. The radical feminist leaders were almost all very sympathetic towards Marxism, and its radically materialist worldview. And so that’s how you come across highly educated women (doctors, PhDs and so on) moonlighting as prostitutes and using feminist materialist ideology to back up their ideas about sex as empowerment for women by enforcing specific financial compensation on men as the price for sex.

    Of course it goes without saying that a model of sexuality which is radically materialist is not going to make most *women* happy — but the radicals saw that merely as an issue of a need for “consciousness raising”, so that women would, in fact, realize the wisdom of materializing their sexuality so that women could exercise decisive power over men.

    And, to get back to the core of the thread discussion, this is why we saw the feminist movement focus like a laser-beam on extending rape laws to cover all kinds of situations that had not previously been covered. The point of these extensions was not to protect women, but rather instead to dramatically increase the power of women over sex. The “core rape” crime is not something that has been controversial for a long, long time — it has generally not been considered legitimate for men to use their physical power to “take” sex in that way.

    But by extending the cover of rape laws to things like date rape, and by enacting things like rape shield laws which make it much harder to cross-examine accusers and so on, effectively feminists increased the *scope* of rape, and the ability to falsely accuse, both of which substantially increase female power over sex by increasingly limiting male behavior.

    And this trend is not stopping. People like Valenti are now arguing that the standard of “no means no” is in itself not good enough, and that an affirmative statement of “yes” from the woman needs to be present in order for a sex act not to be a rape. Under this standard, any man who had sex with a woman could be accused of rape, and would need to demonstrate, in order to avoid conviction, that the woman positively and vocally consented to the act before it began. Why do we see insanity like that? Because all of the claptrap about rape is not, and has never been, about protecting women. It has always been about expanding the already substantial control women have over sex, and ever narrowing men’s room for agency and action in this area. The goal — as it was for reproduction (and has been achieved in that area) — is complete totalitarian control of sexuality by women. Rape law is an important means to that end for feminists.

    Like


  277. @lurker:

    Well, actually, I do have an article…

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/women-tougher-on-rape-victims-694508.html

    There’s only one thing I don’t really agree with, which is what we’ve been discussing in circles:

    “nice girls don’t get drunk.”

    I think Doug and aliasclio have talked that to the ground.

    But, what I do see here, is the belief that “nice girls don’t get raped.”

    That’s not true.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27098993/

    In a video interview this girl said that she thought nothing would happen to her because she was a nice girl.

    Like


  278. In college, I knew a feminist who wanted defendants in rape trials to not have the right to cross examine their accusers.

    That’s right: for feminists, the 6th amendment is irrelevant.

    Like


  279. @lurker:

    “OJ was about the racism defense. It was the crystallization of every dream left wingers have: that a violent, worthless black man could get away with murder solely because of his race.”

    Really? Proof of this?

    I thought the trial was debunked because of planted evidence by the police.
    (Even though, from general consensus and a million OJ “kill the wife” pop culture references, I don’t think people seriously thought he was innocent, though maybe the jury did)

    But the planted evidence did ruin the trial.

    I don’t think it’s anyone’s dream for anyone to get away with murder.

    Like


  280. What tears, PA? From her corpse?

    I said Nicole’s sister, who testified as a witness in building a case of OJ having a track-record of abusiveness.

    Like


  281. Aliasclio

    (A strange woman in a bar is very drunk, comes on to you, and passes out in your car after you’ve offered to drive her to her place in the expectation of sex. You could have sex with her – but most of you don’t…) Fear of the law is no doubt part of your reason for not acting; after all, that’s why we have laws. But – I don’t know, I still think it’s more than that.

    Of course clio. It’s been the law forever, traditionally, that a passed out woman can’t give consent to sex and therefore it’s rape to have sex with her in that state.

    The standard I’ve repeated is actually tougher on men than that. I have said that if she’s barely conscious but really, really drunk, falling down drunk, that’s not ok either. I.e. she has to be able to “walk and talk”. That precludes falling down drunk or unable to make any sense when trying to talk. That precludes really drunk. Then too it would be rape in other words. But THAT’S IT. No breathalizers required in every male pocket clio.

    So – it’s not that unusual if today we assume that drunkenness in a woman precludes the possibility of consent, though things get more complicated when the man concerned is also drunk.

    You’re talking about sending a man to JAIL and wrecking his life for something the woman consented to at the time. It would be an absolute travesty of justice. I would absolutely refuse to convict as a juror on the basis of any such law. I would vote out anyone who supported such a law.

    If a woman seduced a man into signing over his rights to his property to her while he was drunk, would you say that the law should uphold her case, or his?

    Not remotely analogous. It is not the custom to get drunk prepatory to signing serious legal papers. It is the custom to drink in connection with sexual flirtation, very often. As well the remedy to that drunken signing away of his property is to undo the transaction, i.e. void it. The remedy you propose for a man having sex with a tipsy woman is that she have the option of sending him to jail and ruining the rest of his life with a rape charge. Even though at the time she consented to the sex (and may have had a rip roaring time of it as well, later regretted.)

    To criminalize, that’s MAKE CRIMINAL AND SEND A MAN TO JAIL FOR A VERY SERIOUS CRIME AND THERFORE WRECK HIS LIFE for having consensual sex with a woman who’s just a bit inebriated, or some difficult gradation of drunk enough, would be an absolute travesty of justice. I’m prepared to go to WAR over this Clio.

    If she’s falling down drunk, then ok. The walk and talk standard. Nothing less.

    A large proportion of casual sex happens when both parties have been drinking. Probably a large majority. So in your feminist horror land of male oppression AliasClio, anytime such a woman decides she is embarrassed by the sex she consented to while she’d been drinking, she can throw the man she consented to at the time into jail?

    You propose a feminist abomination.

    Get your sluts when drunk sisters to take some female responsibility for a change and sober up instead Clio. If they’re going to regret having been sluts in the morning, at any rate.

    Like


  282. hey gang!

    just got back!!

    whatd i miss!!!

    Like


  283. OMG Firepower…

    do you eat like…

    five bowls of sugar a day.

    Like


  284. maurice–

    @doug, just above – i read clio as saying the opposite – most women in those situations of “misunderstanding” will *not* report a rape.

    Of course that’s what she’s saying. And of course she’s right.

    It’s also not remotely good enough.

    Men shouldn’t be sent to jail in genuine misunderstanding situations where the woman was hard to read. Women should have the BURDEN OF SAYING NO UNAMBIGUOUSLY AND CLEARLY if they want to be able to press rape charges.

    That is if they were conscious and capable of saying no of course. If they aren’t, then it also is rape. I.e. if she can’t walk and talk, but is falling down drunk, then too it’s rape. That far but no farther.

    Like


  285. sorry, PA, missed that.

    Like


  286. @nova (and lurker before) – great posts.

    @al- good point. i think most agreed the data in the article is crap on both sides. some poster (i forget who) gave a good corrective on rape data, to the effect that it went up from 80 to 92 and decreased steadily from 92 to 06. maybe the answer is that it was a generational bulge: the tail end of the baby boom was around 1962, so those people would have been hitting 30 around 92 and replaced by the much smaller Gen X cohort right behind them. that under-30 demo is, of course, the one in which most rapes happen. excplains the fall-off in numbers after 92. roissy alluded to that as a possible answer earlier: the porn effect being swamped by something else – in this case i think it’s the passing-through of the boomer demographic bulge. (bulge – heh.)

    feminist propagansdizing / “awareness” (= definitional expansion_ of rape played a role too. but let’s not forget that that effect mainly takes place in the upper income/education brackets. it wold be interesting to compare reported rape accusation statistics in, say, wellesley mass to those in rural alabama, or wherever. you’d find a big cleavage between the two. (big cleavage. heh.)

    trying to lighten up the thread a bit – can you blame me?

    Like


  287. Mandy–

    But, what I do see here, is the belief that “nice girls don’t get raped.”

    Not from me you haven’t.

    Of course nice girls are sometimes raped. There are some very bad men out there.

    Like


  288. Hey cuntrag:

    the article doesn’t back up any of your assertions; in fact, it backs up mine: older women/non-feminists judge women much more shrewdly than feminists in rape cases.

    The feminazi just wishes more women would stop paying attention to logic and start putting more fake rapists in jail.

    FAIL.

    Like


  289. cuntrag, when the trial was over, black people celebrated because the “killing while black” imnplication worked.

    Heck, the little shit who runs above the law has admitted he was happy OJ got off because of the implications of racism.

    You racist little left-wingers deserve the crap you’ve created. get bent.

    Like


  290. @lurker:

    It said younger women vs. older women.

    And I already said which part I don’t agree with, and you completely ignored the article.

    @doug1:

    Everything you said has made sense. Except for, you know, when you got angry. That was just scary.

    Like


  291. maurice–

    feminists have pushed that default assumption too far one way, and most men think it needs to be pushed back. a great example is the rape-accuser shield laws and the corresponding rape-accusee-press-circus-of-shame reality. innocent until proven guilty? uh, not any more.

    Exactly.

    Like


  292. Mandy–

    Everything you said has made sense. Except for, you know, when you got angry. That was just scary.

    I do get angry about feminists pushing the limits on rape laws mandy. Yes I do.

    It’s all about thinking about the last iota of protection for women with scant concern about it’s impact on men.

    I like to think I care about both.

    Like


  293. on July 6, 2009 at 12:16 pm Virginia Gentleman

    Prior posters have probably well identified the Soviet motivation for its policies in Eastern Europe during their advance to Berlin. What I’ve never done a lot of research on is whether the Germans did much of the same on the Eastern Front.

    Where the Germans are concerned, you might have to set out the regular army and the SS/Waffen-SS as two separate groups, governed by different rules. The former probably was more well-behaved; they weren’t the elite political formations and may not have been subject to as much political indoctrination as the SS and Waffen-SS. I don’t have particular expertise but I’ve done a bit of reading and the following occurred to me:

    For the SS/Waffen-SS, there would probably be two competing, but not necessarily mutually exclusive, ideals:

    1. The “Slavs”, i.e. anyone from east of pre-war German borders and not falling within Volksdeutsche classification, were sub-human and anything you did to them really didn’t count.

    2. On the other hand, the racial purity of the Waffen-SS formations must be maintained; a roll in the hay with Anna Kournikova is prohibited because no matter how good-looking she is, she’s a Slav and sub-human. It may have been an actual offense under SS regulations to have that roll in the hay, if I remember right.

    Whichever one of those held sway at any one point in any given SS/Waffen-SS formation probably depended upon the whims of the given commander at the time. Theodor Eicke, who ran the infamous Totenkopfdivision, probably would have insisted on number two, for example. Other commanders might have been inclined to look the other way, sort of “Wow, she’s a 10! Of course, we must place this one in protective custody” and then going from there.

    Like


  294. @doug1:

    It seems like you do.

    And as for drinking and substance using goes, that’s something I avoid like the plague. I mean, for two reasons:
    1) You might get raped or engage in something without even remembering if it’s ok or not, and that sort of blurry line is…eh.
    2) Even if you stay sober, you never know how other people might act if they’re drunk.

    fact.

    Like


  295. “In Africa, rape is commonly used as a political tool, but when we’re talking about North America, you can’t argue along the same lines.

    Well it was in Europe too before the modern period.”

    Nothing of the like Doug. Rape is more of a political weapon today in North America than in those periods of European story.

    Think about black males out there to rape white women on purpose just to make a statement. Contrast there with horny soldiers who just saw what they didn’t for months: A vulnerable women at their hands.

    Also, as a political weapon: Rape of blacks and indians in Latin America in order to purposely create a somewhat loyal mixed population.

    Just think about the words of a well known Peruvian ideologue:

    “Tu, mestizo, no eres mas que un indio domesticado á las manos de los blancos”.

    You, mixed race, you’re nothing more than a domesticated indian at the hands of white people.

    Like


  296. the problem with the feminist take on rape is that it attempts to characterize an entire class of activity as rape rather than make judgments on a case-by-case basis. so, to radical feminists anytime sex occurs between an inebriated man and women, rape has occurred. this is obviously bullshit, but it shouldn’t let us forget that some very unseemly things happen in these situations. we have all known those creepy fuckers who are a little too fond of taking liberties with drunk and/or passed out women. my vehement disagreement with feminists doesn’t stop me from condemning those douche bags who really do take advantage of drunk women. and my condemnation of those douche bags doesn’t stop me from calling women out for getting themselves in those situations in the first place.

    also, i hear a lot of ‘why is it the guy’s fault?’. i am sympathetic to that, but it’s problematic to those of us who share a certain world view. if you believe that the number of sexual partners has the opposite effect on women as it does on men, then it should follow that we make the opposite judgment for men and women in these situations. in other words, when an inebriated woman is led into having sex with some guy she might not otherwise have fucked, that guy has detracted from her market value. if a guy wakes up to find a warpig laying next to him, more often then not, it’s a funny story to tell his buddies as he swears he’ll never get that drunk again.

    the question is: should we judge guys who take advantage of drunk girls more harshly than girls who take advantage of drunk guys?

    Like


  297. Also, doug, the reason your stance makes sense is because, well, if the definition of rape becomes more “lenient” and if more people are crying out rape, people who actually are raped won’t ever see justice, because it’s something not taken as seriously.

    Like


  298. Lurker, you don’t appear to have noticed that Mandy was basically agreeing with you, having slightly refined your point by saying that female jealousy could make women harder on each other and distort their vision of the truth.

    Doug1, you’ve made a complete hash of what I said. I don’t believe that women always tell the truth about rape. I said that many men today are in a perpetual state of panic about the possibility that women will not tell the truth about rape.

    The scenario you sketch out – of the drunk woman who consents to sex and then decides two days/however much time later that she didn’t really consent – is one I hear about constantly from men. I have no idea how often it happens, though I expect it’s common. But how often does it lead to actual charges against the man, as opposed to kvetching amongst her friends? How often does it lead to conviction? Back to that in a moment; first I wanted to point out that I didn’t have that kind of drunken consent in mind at all. I was thinking of the kind of woman who passes out at a party in a bedroom alone and wakes up to find herself having sex. Did she really say yes? Is he just saying she said yes? I don’t condone her behaviour but I do think that a man who has sex with a woman in such a condition, esp. if he isn’t drunk himself, is a swine, whether he can realistically be called a rapist or not.

    Back to charges and convictions for rape: From what I understand, the rate of conviction in rape cases is very low in any case. So, too, is the rate at which rape is reported at all. And yes, sometimes the unreported rapes may not really be rapes as you understand them – but then again, they might be. Women often decide not to report rape for any number of reasons, including the fact that they think they would be unlikely to be able to identify the rapist. The rape cases most people agree are the worst and most frigthening – stranger rape – are also the ones most likely to occur in conditions that make identification difficult. You know, at night, in the dark, in a state of terror, etc. Women raped by men they know are also often in an awkward position – what if it’s their sister’s husband, or a former boyfriend? Reporting rape in those conditions, even when it really is a rape as you understand it – she screamed, said no, fought he ignored and overpowered her – carries many problems and humiliations of its own.

    As for the various possibilities involved when women recant rape accusations, see this piece in Amptoons from 2005, http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2005/04/18/false-rape-reports/.

    Feminists who blather on about the ever-present danger of rape for women, and what this says about men, are certainly responsible for spreading a lot of unnecessary paranoia, while disguising the real conditions and circumstances in which women are more likely to be raped (i.e. in poor neighbourhoods, or while drunk – no wait that isn’t rape according to you, or by a black man). But I believe that men who are in a perpetual panic about the possibility of being criminally charged with (false) rape are also reacting to scare stories more than to a statistical likelihood.

    And Doug1, stop trying to use the old bully-and-shame tactics to prevent me from speaking here. I mean things like “How dare you say that on this site?” etc. That’s exactly the kind of talk that you dislike so much in feminist/liberal/politically correct blogs, isn’t it?

    Like


  299. Aliasclio, you dumb bitch.

    cuntrag did not “refine” my point, she refuted it. my point was that non-feminist/older women saw throught the bullshit lies women throw up on the stand against men. cuntrag tried to say it wasn’t women seeing through the lies, it was women “just being mean” and “punishing other women for no reason.

    Reading comprehension=not your strong suit, bitch.

    As for Mandy XD!:

    cuntrag, I read the article. the feminazi bitch hopes that a new generation of women *taught by feminism* will convict more men of illusory rape.

    in other words, the line is older women/non-feminists v. feminist bitches.

    again, FAIL.

    Like


  300. “I was talking about rape in the modern world. Historical warfare often involved rape because war usually meant national or ethnic conflict in the pre-modern era (Africa is the standing anomaly; most major wars in the past century were ideological). Miscegenation was important when it wasn’t feasible to exterminate or enslave an entire peoples.”

    I don’t know if this is feminism or if it’s just the sweet feminine naivety…

    Like


  301. Virginia Gentleman
    What I’ve never done a lot of research on is whether the Germans did much of the same on the Eastern Front.

    Ukrainians at first, misguidedly welcomed the Germans as liberators – many ethnic groups did.

    In many areas of Axis occupation, fraternization was common – for free.

    Local girls also worked brothels for extra cash.

    Russian country girls aren’t the prettiest females – contrary to public belief thru popularized mail-order bride fantasy.

    The hotter ones are almost exclusively from the upper class. Next time a documentary is on, take a look at the background pussy – plenty of fugs. Just like here.

    Blue-eyed blonds from occupied territories were sufficiently ‘aryan” enough

    Like


  302. alaisclio, being a typical dumb woman:

    “But how often does it lead to actual charges against the man, as opposed to kvetching amongst her friends?”
    —you know as wella s any dumb feminazi how much the mere accusation, even socially, of rape stigmatizes a man. Like racism, it is one of our society’s scarlet letters. It thereafter becomes the man’s job to disprove it, which is extremely hard to do.

    Or perhaps you forgot the Duke Rape Case? Probably, since logic doesn’t suit your creationism.

    Like


  303. @lurker

    “This is why feminists often try to claim that their greatest enemies are other women—which si true, since a logical woman can rip apart feminism simply by existing (see Palin, Sarah).”

    Amen!

    Like


  304. on July 6, 2009 at 12:48 pm mandy been here a while

    So, too, is the rate at which rape is reported at all. And yes, sometimes the unreported rapes may not really be rapes as you understand them – but then again, they might be.

    How could you possibly know the rate of unreported rapes if they are unreported?

    When I was a freshman in college, feminists would come to the dorms and talk to us about the new definition of rape then ask questions about whether we had ever been in such and such a situation then write stuff down. Curiously, the rape rate on campus went up. A lot of the women there would probably be surprised to know they’d been counted in rape victim statistics.

    Like


  305. on July 6, 2009 at 12:50 pm mandy been here a while

    Virginia Gentleman

    I believe Russians were an exception to the Nazi’s anti-Slavic stance as they had more Viking anscestors.

    Like


  306. @doug, clio, lurker, others- this is evidently a topic that typically sheds more heat than light. precisely why it’s useful to get into. roissy’s 2nd post today tried to build on BK’s definition earlier. i tried to move the focus onto the false accusations area, i.e., that narrow but crucial bit of the spectrum in which we do not *all* agree.

    @lurker, others – douthat has a decent piece on palin in today’s NYT.

    Like


  307. Blue-eyed blonds from occupied territories were sufficiently ‘aryan” enough

    Yes. Germans had a program called “Lebensborn” in which they examined small children in Slavic occupied areas and abducted ones who exhibited Nordic features, to be adopted by German families or raised as Germans in orphanages.

    Many of these children did not pass a second round of racial screening, and were destroyed.

    There was a TV documentary in which an elderly Polish woman of rural background traced her son, at that point well into his middle age, to a German locality, and traveled to meet him.

    He had no idea that he was one of the Lebesborn children, but agreed to a DNA test and was in fact linked to the old woman.

    But there were many other cases of grown Lebesborn children who were shocked to find out their real background and wanted nothing to do with their birth parents.

    Like


  308. @Mandy XD

    “Hell, if the rape victim were pretty, that would be the end of it. Fat, pasty, aging American cows were probably angry at her for being better looking than them.”

    I totally disagree with this statement. I don’t think a woman will let a rapist get off simply because she feels the woman is too pretty. Gawd. Do you really think women’s judgment comes down to looks alone Mandy? You don’t think human beings including women are able to filter the facts? If this were the case, rape cases would always end in acquittal, unless they’re trials for ugly rape victims and then it would end up with a guilty verdict. That’s ludicrous!

    I believe like others have said that women can see through women’s bullshit better than men can which is why they’re not easily manipulated when they are jurors.

    Mandy said ” I mean, yes, this is the truth in a lot of cases, but women are also really shitty to one another for something as little as jealousy, or just to watch the other woman suffer. That’s what they do. I know from firsthand experience.”

    I feel sorry for you chickie. What a sorry view of women you have. I have been fortunate to have the very best girl friends throughout my life and I’ve lived quite a few years longer than you. I do not believe women will do a woman wrong over looks, money or privilege or just to see a woman suffer. Ugly people might (man or woman), and I’m talking ugly on the inside people. You need to get a new group if this is your experience.

    Like


  309. on July 6, 2009 at 1:04 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””””””””””””Epoxytocin No. 87
    Gunslinger

    Lie detecter test will help insure that it is not just the better actor that gets justice but the person who did not do wrong.

    Greg, do you have any idea how lie detector tests work? They aren’t magic. All they do is measure physiological signs that are correlated to arousal: pulse, superficial perspiration, and so on. It’s incredibly easy to “game” them.

    If anything, such tests will ensure that it’s “just the better actor who gets justice”.””””””””””””””’

    Naa bro not current ones. We need to get a couple hunred million invested in the perfecting of them for the childrens sake of course.

    Like


  310. @aliasclio

    I was thinking of the kind of woman who passes out at a party in a bedroom alone and wakes up to find herself having sex. Did she really say yes? Is he just saying she said yes? I don’t condone her behaviour but I do think that a man who has sex with a woman in such a condition, esp. if he isn’t drunk himself, is a swine, whether he can realistically be called a rapist or not.

    How interesting that you have nothing to say about the woman’s moral / legal / practical obligation in this case. You don’t condone it, but it’s not wrong, and she’s not a swine or an irresponsible fool for putting herself in that situation in the first place?

    @[email protected]

    “Killing an innocent baby is the most moral thing to do?”

    Definetly.

    No, it is the most expedient thing to do.

    “Go back far enough in your family tree and you will find an ancestor who is the product of rape. If that child had been aborted, you wouldn’t be here.”

    Perfect we-are-the-world liberal/feminist logic.

    I guess you wouldn’t mind I’d rape your wife and that your daughter would really be the product of my rape, hum?

    You are doomed in part a pussy. And this, at least.

    Um, what? The argument that abortion is not the most moral thing to do in any circumstance (least of all, rape) is hardly the liberal / feminist position on the matter.

    If you were thinking about what I said instead of just lashing out like a fucking idiot, you might have realized that I don’t regard abortion as a thing that should be legally prohibited or not performed when it is expedient. I disagreed with the contention that it is the “most moral” thing to do in the case of rape. In such a case, or indeed in any case except when the life of the mother is in danger, abortion is not the most moral thing to do, it is the most expedient thing to do. Morally, you are killing a human being because that human life is inconvenient to you. That doesn’t mean I wouldn’t do it, just as it doesn’t mean I wouldn’t take human life in other situations if necessary, it simply means I am calling the act what it is. It is the people who regard abortion as eliminating a “zygote” or a “fetus” who are the pussies, not those who regard it straightforwardly as the killing of an inconvenient baby.

    Like


  311. Desperately horny young men have been known to have sex with sheep and goats etc. Is that about “controlling” the dumb animals or just wanting a brutish, instinctual release of tension?
    If young guys are horny enough to boink a she-goat it is not out of the realm of possibility that somebodies grandmother might do as well, especially right after the City Walls were broken thru.

    LOL

    Well done. Case closed (if it was ever opened).

    Like


  312. aeofe, don’t bother arguing with Mandy the cuntrag; she’s already made up her mind based on one anecdote where an ugly women told her to quit blocking her view, so therefore pretty women will never get a conviction for rape from ugly women based solely on the fact of their beauty. Can’t you understand that Mandy the cuntrag’s one illogical story defeats all data to the contrary?

    Nobama forever!

    Like


  313. can someone buy lurker a thesaurus?

    Like


  314. on July 6, 2009 at 1:30 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””””””””””””””Lance,
    if a guy wakes up to find a warpig laying next to him, more often then not, it’s a funny story to tell his buddies as he swears he’ll never get that drunk again.

    the question is: should we judge guys who take advantage of drunk girls more harshly than girls who take advantage of drunk guys?””””””””””””””””’

    Yea but lance is it true that you don’t remember what you did while drunk. I have been pretty fucking drunk but when I brought the 300 pound chick home it was because I had read the gunslinger by steven king too many times and wanted to try it out. I remember everything I have done while drunk. Isn’t this just a pretty lie that you can say oh I don’t remember what happened can someone tell me how the weekend went. Like the chick in my high school that was fucking everyone said. Then you know what the next week she would say the same dam thing. Hmmm did she really not remember. Caveat I didn’t fuck her. Now I didn’t drink all through high school to get with the woman I got with. They where also not drunk. Except for the college chick she had been drinking. Course I was at a college party.

    Like


  315. Gunslingergregi

    if a guy wakes up to find a warpig laying next to him…should we judge guys who take advantage of drunk girls more harshly than girls who take advantage of drunk guys?

    i agree totally. take the fugs to court – press charges.

    Janeane Garofolo will do hard time for every cock she’s horrified rode.

    Like


  316. on July 6, 2009 at 1:41 pm Gunslingergregi

    Maybe I should sue king for almost getting a hurnea.

    Like


  317. on July 6, 2009 at 1:42 pm Gunslingergregi

    Maybe hernea I am not looking it up

    Like


  318. aoefe/mandy: Some of us are unlucky enough to learn quite early on that human beings are capable of such horrors. I know that, experienced it, blatant betrayal and suffering by the hands of a woman.

    It’s a completely new discovery, then, that they are capable of such wonderful actions as well. That the bad skews the view on the good.

    Even in the same person.

    The vast majority of women in my life — while flawed — have always taken care of me to the best of their ability, with a certain passion that owes its motivations to nothing more than being motherly, really, even to someone that is not their own.

    Balance. There is potential for both, there is also potential for a middle ground.

    Like


  319. “on the contrary, any man who sees a woman in this state and then decides to have sex with her? i say that’s non-consensual, and he’s taking advantage.”

    Don’t know if this post is still alive but f-it.
    To me, you’re right, man.

    A men should not take advantage of a drunk women.

    But… if the women GETS DRUNK WITH YOU that is pretty much an invitation, no?

    One thing is to go predatorily for drunk women, another thing is to gather some women, invite them in, get drunk with them and then chose one or two of them to have sex.

    Alcohol – The friend of the Betas.

    Like


  320. Gunny: Being inspired by Stephen King, you deserved what was coming to you.

    Take responsibility for your King reading!

    That said, reading him was a violation (read Wizard’s Glass). But I finished the thing. Even though it was.

    And regretted it forever more.

    I did not go to court though.

    That said, I see the similarity: Maybe will be calling you Roland from now on.

    Like


  321. Steven King’s – The Stand – best book of his big bunch.

    Like


  322. Game in BK, do you always ask them before penetrating them,
    what do you say then?

    Exucse me, may I penetrate you and inject my life-generating-fluids inside you?

    Or is it, do you mind if I and my latex friend penetrate you?

    Like


  323. With the same money, can we buy Seeking Alpha a dick?

    Like


  324. [email protected]: There’re LOTS of sexy ways to tell a chick what you’re going to do to her.

    Then she can say no.

    If you did it right, she will be impatient to get on with it.

    It wouldn’t be a bad strategy to do that all the time, even leaving aside consent issues!

    Like


  325. With the same money, can we buy Seeking Alpha a dick?

    I think that might cost more than my idea…

    Like


  326. on July 6, 2009 at 2:33 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””””””””””on July 6, 2009 at 1:48 pm Bhetti
    Gunny: Being inspired by Stephen King, you deserved what was coming to you.

    Take responsibility for your King reading!

    That said, reading him was a violation (read Wizard’s Glass). But I finished the thing. Even though it was.

    And regretted it forever more.

    I did not go to court though.

    That said, I see the similarity: Maybe will be calling you Roland from now on.””””””””””””

    What there is no way I could be held responsible for that it was obviously kings fault he he he

    Like


  327. on July 6, 2009 at 2:34 pm Gunslingergregi

    Yea Bhetti I really can quick draw I have practiced the d man would have lost he he he

    Like


  328. on July 6, 2009 at 2:36 pm Gunslingergregi

    ”””””””””on July 6, 2009 at 1:50 pm aoefe
    Steven King’s – The Stand – best book of his big bunch.”””””””””””””’

    Yea the stand very good book as well.

    I have read them all. I think I grew out of reading though. Read 100’s and 100’s during young adult. Then I stopped reading basically. Maybe will take it up again if I make it to la la time.

    Like


  329. Speaking of Stephen King and rape… his novella “Cycle of the Werewolf” features a lonely spinster who spends her every waking hour on erotic fantasies of being taken by a superalpha.

    When the werewulf breaks into her bedroom to kill her, she surrenders ecstatically.

    By the way, The Stand and many of his other novels are excellent. My all-around favorite is The Dead Zone.

    But unfortunately, political correctness is infused in his writing. That’s no surprise, really. He’s a New England yankee liberal, a direct ideological descendant of the Puritans.

    His early-to-mid 90s novels Dolores Claiborne, Gerald’s Game, and Rose Madder are so insanely feminist, I wondered if he wasn’t actually parodying the ideology. The first two are actually very good books, Rose Madder is awful.

    Like


  330. stephen king is actually

    a really ugly woman
    posing as a
    man

    Like


  331. on July 6, 2009 at 3:04 pm Gunslingergregi

    lol asshole

    I mean Firepower

    Like


  332. Bhetti

    [email protected]: There’re LOTS of sexy ways to tell a chick what you’re going to do to her.

    Then she can say no.

    If you did it right, she will be impatient to get on with it.

    Ah yes. There are, aren’t there darlin’?

    Can’t imagine what you might have in mind.

    Like


  333. Gunslingergregi

    lol asshole

    I mean Firepower

    whenever my Alpha Cred
    is questioned on
    the anonymous
    Interwebz

    I will pull out this quote and say:

    “SEE!”

    Like


  334. Roland Upgraded/PA: I can’t seem to stomach King’s writing style every time I come across it. He’s too good at bringing out the creepiness & gross-out factor with his description. AND his scenarios. That’s what he seems to like to focus on. Or at least that’s how I read him.

    Doug:

    Uhm.

    *blush*

    Virgin @40: ^— refer to the above, er, authority on the subject for, um, specific help with that…

    Like


  335. alaisclio, being a typical dumb woman:

    “But how often does it lead to actual charges against the man, as opposed to kvetching amongst her friends?”
    —you know as wella s any dumb feminazi how much the mere accusation, even socially, of rape stigmatizes a man. Like racism, it is one of our society’s scarlet letters. It thereafter becomes the man’s job to disprove it, which is extremely hard to do.

    Or perhaps you forgot the Duke Rape Case? Probably, since logic doesn’t suit your creationism.

    Stop throwing that feminazi crap around, lurker. It is downright nonsense when you use it on me.

    No, I haven’t forgotten the Duke rape case. The women in that situation did rather more than “kvetch among their friends”; they tried to take legal action against the men, and were assisted in the process by cowardly and venal politicians and college authorities blinded by political correctness. Those women were of low character (yes, I do think that counts, though it’s not an absolute), and I strongly suspect that those men’s lives will not, after all, be ruined, for the simple reason that their accusers could make no remotely credible case against them, and now, everyone knows it.

    In any case, oh logical lurker (@#$%), you must be socially aware enough to realise that, er, no one can control the bad things that other people say about them outside the courtroom, unless the process goes so far as to be slanderous or libellous, in which case they can take legal action but at the risk of spreading the malicious gossip, or whatever it might be, even further.

    And to whoever it was who tried to imply that getting drunk in public is as bad as assaulting someone: nonsense. I think the former is wrong but not on the same scale as the latter.

    Finally, I agree with Roissy’s second post on this subject. Nor do I think I’m shedding more heat than light, Maurice. I don’t feel either rage or sorrow over the comments here; I did hope that I could remind people that they may be panicking for no good reason. I’ve done the same amongst women. And when women friends or colleagues suggest that rape was about power, or that women should be absolved of responsibility for their own provocative behaviour (got into terrible trouble for that one in particular), or that all women’s allegations of rape should be believed without question, I’ve stated plainly that I thought they were wrong and that this kind of approach to the law could destroy any hope of justice for everyone.

    Like


  336. @clio – noted.

    Like


  337. Oh yes aliasclio—-all rumors are created equal, except when they hurt you feminazi bitches too much, then they are bad.

    And in the Duke rape case the media jumped to the conclusion that they were guilty. It was only fortuitous that both the witness was a born liar and the DA was so extreme in his actions—and that the boys got their names cleared in the short time the media still cared about the case—–that they aren’t vilified today (although even your sisters on feministing don’t buy the truth).

    Quite frankly, the lengths they had to go to show innocence should prove to your addled female brain how accusing someone of rape is a scarlet letter.

    So accusing someone of rape–even amongst a community (remember, shithead, the case hadn’t been tried yet, onyl accusations and media attention)—leads to a host of complications for the accused, not in the least of which he must prove innocence.

    Group of 88, anyone?

    You lose, feminazi.

    Like


  338. lurker is hilarious

    Like


  339. …not on purpose, but that’s okay

    Like


  340. Seeking alpha is emasculated

    Like


  341. …not on purpose but that’s ok.

    Like


  342. Out of curiosity, how old are you?

    Like


  343. “Out of curiosity, how old are you?”
    —old enough to know a snarky prick when I see him.

    Like


  344. all rumors are created equal, except when they hurt you feminazi bitches too much, then they are bad.

    This is – crude – snark.

    lurker is hilarious…not on purpose, but that’s okay

    This is – good-natured – ribbing.

    How about you give me a range? less than 20, in your 20s, in your 30s, 40+?

    Like


  345. I see Seeking makes up his own definitions of “crude snark” and “good-natured ribbing.”

    Smell ya later, peon.

    Like


  346. Hopefully you’re not answering your age because it’s less than 20 and you think admitting your youth would lose you credibility.

    It’s the opposite.

    Your writing is so crude and immature that only an admission of youth would spare you (barely) from the unmitigated contempt of most here.

    You can just insult me back if you’d like – it’s hard to be offended by someone who uses ‘FAIL’ or ‘peon’ – but I really am kind of curious.

    Like


  347. @aoefe:

    “I totally disagree with this statement. I don’t think a woman will let a rapist get off simply because she feels the woman is too pretty. Gawd. Do you really think women’s judgment comes down to looks alone Mandy? You don’t think human beings including women are able to filter the facts? If this were the case, rape cases would always end in acquittal, unless they’re trials for ugly rape victims and then it would end up with a guilty verdict. That’s ludicrous!”

    It happens.
    “Results indicated that both dress and causal inference exerted a significant influence on subject’s attribution of victim responsibility. Subjects attributed more responsibility for the rape to victims appearing in the most provocative dress than those victims appearing in provocative or least provocative dress.”
    http://ctr.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/8/1/22
    This is also why good lawyers tell the victims to not wear make up on the stand. Any sign that these women may be pretty and *gasp* wear make up or skirts like most normal people may make it more difficult for them to seek justice.

    Now, I understand, walking around half naked at night alone is a terrible idea. But still, I mean, most women do wear slightly fitted jeans, shirts that fit them well, at least some form of cosmetics. So…I don’t know. And this could also have to do with the old women vs. young women in jury trials; older women may think that today’s fashions are too risque.

    As for women being envious: We all have proof of this. Cockblockers.

    Not all women are, and I was probably being irrational and angry. Yes, people can sort through evidence. Yes, people can make rational decisions during these trials. But a large amount of these cases revolve around manipulating the emotions of the jurors. In cases of murder or abuse, notice how lawyers will place before and after pictures of the victim. This is to evoke anger, sympathy, empathy in the hearts of the jury. Especially in he said/she said cases like rape trials, nothing is going to be fully logical, or ethical. A large amount of emotional tactics will be used, and the prejudices of the jury will be manipulated.

    “I feel sorry for you chickie. What a sorry view of women you have. I have been fortunate to have the very best girl friends throughout my life and I’ve lived quite a few years longer than you. I do not believe women will do a woman wrong over looks, money or privilege or just to see a woman suffer. Ugly people might (man or woman), and I’m talking ugly on the inside people. You need to get a new group if this is your experience.”
    Maybe not everyone. I have a core group of friends that help me make it through the storms, and they’re pretty awesome people. I guess because I was in a program that was high stress (for almost everyone) I saw the ugliness inside a lot of people. You know, high drama, rumors, insults, backstabbing, etc. just to watch someone happy suffering a little. I wasn’t the only target. At least half my friends aren’t from that program, so they’re a lot more chill.

    But, you know, that could also have been high school.

    I like to think people are inherently good, and only turn nasty sometimes because, well, if you leave milk out in the sun, it’ll spoil.

    I like to think, that with people at least, they can turn over a new leaf.

    Like


  348. @Mandy XD,
    The study you referenced was on university students (both genders), not jealous women. A mixed gender group included provocative dress in their opinions. Might you be overreacting?

    Like


  349. Ah Clio, it is so nice to see you on here occasionally. Unfortunately I cannot post as much as I like because I am usually too busy with other, more sensual pursuits, but my desires for you are still as strong as ever.

    Since I can’t add anything to the argument at hand, since everything has already been said in this post about the subject, let me just say that I really want to fuck Clio..over and over and over again.

    Like


  350. @Anony:

    Well, there are university-aged cockblockers. People of all ages can feel jealousy, or experience its effect from another person.

    Although, I do apologize, when I get into discussions I can come across as being angrier than I am.

    Like


  351. on July 6, 2009 at 6:28 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ Seeking_Alpha

    Your writing is so crude and immature that only an admission of youth would spare you (barely) from the unmitigated contempt of most here.

    I’ve thought the same. But lurker also regularly trots out impressive arguments and bits of true wisdom, amidst all this other verbal debris. It’s really weird.
    Reminds me of a 20something online version of an intellectually minded teenager, with a good rational head, who still feels a need to dress and talk like a flatbiller/gangster.

    Or he’s just really pissed off about something. Perhaps rightfully so, perhaps not.

    Or all of the above.

    Like


  352. @mandy xd,
    I am not calling to your attention their ages, I’m calling to your attention the genders.

    Like


  353. on July 6, 2009 at 7:06 pm Tupac Chopra

    Brother In Christ:

    Since I can’t add anything to the argument at hand, since everything has already been said in this post about the subject, let me just say that I really want to fuck Clio..over and over and over again.

    I’m Tupac Chopra and I approve this message.

    Like


  354. @Epoxy:
    “I’ve thought the same. But lurker also regularly trots out impressive arguments and bits of true wisdom, amidst all this other verbal debris. It’s really weird.”

    Exactly. His post on music and trends throughout the decades was amazing; I couldn’t believe it was lurker when I read it.

    He just is a bit more aggressive than other people, is all. I think he said he played football or something somewhere on here.

    It also reminds me of Firepower. Firepower bounces around, making jokes and behaves like a squirrel on caffeine, then suddenly, every now and then, makes a post that is serious and makes sense.

    Like


  355. maurice speaking of default – where is Default User these days…?
    he is no more. My heart weaps.

    Like


  356. Tarl “Go back far enough in your family tree and you will find an ancestor who is the product of rape. If that child had been aborted, you wouldn’t be here.”

    Virgin @40 response Perfect we-are-the-world liberal/feminist logic.

    I’ve never heard a feminist argue that women should carry the babies of rapist to term.

    Mandy xd Hell, if the rape victim were pretty, that would be the end of it. Fat, pasty, aging American cows were probably angry at her for being better looking than them.
    This is very true Mandy xd.

    Aoefe I totally disagree with this statement. I don’t think a woman will let a rapist get off simply because she feels the woman is too pretty. Gawd. Do you really think women’s judgment comes down to looks alone Mandy

    Aoefe, I once read about a case where one of the women on the jury decided not to convict the rapist because the “accuser was so pretty that the accused just couldn’t help himself”. Some women are really nasty and bitter about good looking women. I’ve received crap and had rumours started by other women because of the way that I look. You’re nice looking too, so I’m surprised you’ve been left unscathed.

    Like


  357. @mandy xd

    “I have a core group of friends that help me make it through the storms, and they’re pretty awesome people.”

    Great news! 🙂

    Like


  358. on July 6, 2009 at 8:31 pm Tupac Chopra

    You’re nice looking too, so I’m surprised you’ve been left unscathed.

    After seeing those lips aoefe has, Tupac’s been reaching for his handcuffs and bottle of ether…

    Like


  359. @chic

    “You’re nice looking too, so I’m surprised you’ve been left unscathed.”

    I mentioned earlier that ugly on the inside people do nasty things to hurt others – both men AND women.

    For me I haven’t been targeted specifically by women for my looks, but I think that’s because I’m quite easy to like in person and try hard not to intimidate. Besides looks are superficial – I’ve seen pretty people become ugly within seconds of opening their mouths, and plainer folk transform to beautiful simply by their souls.

    Like


  360. @aoefe:

    “I’ve seen pretty people become ugly within seconds of opening their mouths, and plainer folk transform to beautiful simply by their souls.”
    This.

    When first meeting someone, you might be swayed by their physical appearance, but it’s their personality that will ultimately have the final say, whether it’s for a romantic ltr or a friendship.

    Like


  361. @tupac

    You don’t need the ether. 😉

    Like


  362. on July 6, 2009 at 8:58 pm Tupac Chopra

    aoefe:

    I shall bring the fur-lined handcuffs then.

    Like


  363. Re: aoefe

    I’d remind you that he’s evil, but you’re submissive, so you’ll probably like what he offers.

    When first meeting someone, you might be swayed by their physical appearance, but it’s their personality that will ultimately have the final say, whether it’s for a romantic ltr or a friendship.

    Personality doesn’t matter for fucking and appearance doesn’t matter for platonic friendship. If you’re dumb enough to go for a LTR, then you’ll waste your time trying to look for a nonexistent human that fills the needs of personality and appearance.

    Like


  364. @Vlad:

    “Maybe in some other universe. In ours, its results usually vary between bad arguments for what the authors’ ideology has already firmly convinced them of and just ordinary nonsense. (I also count pompous statements of the obvious in the latter category.)”

    That just shows you don’t know what social science is. Don’t rely on the media. Check out actual journals and online courses.

    [editor: so you’re a social scientist? that explains a lot.]

    Here are power points slides from a very good course, that’s all about methods for untying knotty causal relationships. I went to a seminar by this guy years ago and he really straightened so many things out for me and that helped me do some first-class research later on.

    http://www.nd.edu/~wevans1/econ47950/lecturenotes.htm

    “Um, yes, but what would the signal to noise ratio be in such a case? The whole thing just doesn’t make any sense. ”

    That’s why we have things like statistical estimators statistical significance. We have basic measures that tell us the probability that a relationship is random or not. The whole things is about signal-to-noise. For example, I suggested using county-level data precisely beause more observations raises the signal-to-noise ratio.

    “On the one hand, porn is supposed to be such a potent factor that its effect on the rape rate is on the same order of magnitude as the effects of much improved forensics and tougher enforcement and sentencing.”

    No. It could be much less, but still statistically significant. We execute these techniques to acquire point estimates, of these effects. We’d see that in a properly specified approach, which this researcher does not do.

    “But then, it has to be confounded by some mysterious factors that are sometimes even more powerful, because apparently, a 35-40% internet access rate fails to stop the increasing rape rates in the four least-wired states — but it did stop and reverse them in the four most-wired states when it was at the same level a few years ago. (Just look at the raw data, to which the paper gives a link. Some of the numbers look suspicious to me, by the way — I can hardly believe that the number of rapes in Alaska jumped from 250 to 421, a 68% increase, in a single year between 1980 and 1981.)”

    Yeah, that’s why using eight states with no controls really sucks. This guy obviously doesn’t have the chops that us social scientists have.

    “Or do better forensics and tougher enforcement and sentencing perhaps correlate with higher internet access for some reason? But then the whole argument collapses completely.”

    Good point. You should be thrilled to know that empirical social science revolves around techniques that address this issue of unobserved effects. In economics, it’s called endogeneity:

    Here’s the Wikpedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endogeneity_(econometrics)

    The course I mentioned earlier is all about ways around that problem, so I’ll repeat the link:

    http://www.nd.edu/~wevans1/econ47950/lecturenotes.htm

    “This explanation is, of course, contrived to fit the data. But is it more implausible than the porn theory?”

    Yes, because it’s contrived to fit the data. You can offer a million explanations for any observed relationship. That’s why the scientific method has you develop the hypothesis, and then test it.

    Like


  365. @tupac – “I shall bring the fur-lined handcuffs then.”

    If you choose the fur lined ones you’ll make me feel like a special little snowflake, nice. 🙂

    Like


  366. on July 6, 2009 at 11:05 pm Tupac Chopra

    I assumed you were into submission, not necessarily pain…

    But I’ve played that scene before as well…

    Like


  367. @tupac

    Versatile it seems.

    Like


  368. “Personality doesn’t matter for fucking”
    Well, I don’t know. If they’re into weird things, it might not work out.

    “and appearance doesn’t matter for platonic friendship.”
    I was talking about initial reactions to people. Either way, if you have a friend that doesn’t, say, shower, then you may only communicate them via technology (ie phone and internet)

    ” If you’re dumb enough to go for a LTR, then you’ll waste your time trying to look for a nonexistent human that fills the needs of personality and appearance.”
    nonexistent human?

    I guess my boyfriend doesn’t exist then. :/

    Like


  369. […] rape and the impact that feminism has had upon its definition and prosecution. The debate at times grew rather fierce, but the worst of it is now […]

    Like


  370. The problem with this theory is that men who commit rape are not “omega” nerds. They are extroverted, dominant, psychopathic types.

    Like


  371. […] Privat , seduction community Leave a Comment Tags: average, median, porn More porn means less rape. You can compare porn with prostitutes and sex dolls. Personally, I am not interested in […]

    Like


  372. […] a post on porn and rape that’s making the rounds (among the blogs I read, at Half Sigma and Roissy so far). The author claims to show that a greater availability of pornography is associated with […]

    Like


  373. Keith:

    That just shows you don’t know what social science is. Don’t rely on the media. Check out actual journals and online courses.

    I do, all the time, and I’m familiar with the statistical techniques you mention at least cursorily. My generally negative opinion of social sciences is based on work penned directly by their various luminaries.

    The trouble with social sciences is not only that they typically attempt to tackle impossibly complicated and entangled causal mechanisms and devise objective measurements of things that are hardly quantifiable, although these problems are bad enough by themselves. What’s even worse is that they are decisively influenced by politics and ideology at both conscious and unconscious levels, to the extent that would be sufficient to corrupt even the most precise and exact hard sciences. This is often evident as soon as you see how the issues under research are formulated in the first place.

    Thomas Hobbes said it best:

    [The] doctrine of right and wrong is perpetually disputed, both by the pen and the sword: whereas the doctrine of lines and figures is not so; because men care not, in that subject, what be truth, as a thing that crosses no man’s ambition, profit, or lust. For I doubt not, but if it had been a thing contrary to any man’s right of dominion, or to the interest of men that have dominion, that the three angles of a triangle should be equal to two angles of a square, that doctrine should have been, if not disputed, yet by the burning of all books of geometry suppressed, as far as he whom it concerned was able.

    Obviously, things studied by social scientists, if they’re interesting at all, cross many people’s ambition, profit, and lust, and have huge implications for various rights of dominion. Accordingly, the present state of social sciences wouldn’t surprise Hobbes at all.

    Like


  374. It’s now pretty well known that the feminist/social constructionist idea that “rape is about power, not sex” is complete and utter horseshit, rooted in a fear of juxtaposing something “natural” (sex) and “therefore good” with something as nasty as a cock violently shoved up someone’s ass or pussy.

    Like


  375. Nice info, useful for my job… thanks for share, keep posting… 🙂

    Like


  376. […] A year ago, a study came out that provided evidence for my assertion that legalizing prostitution would reduce the incidence of rape. I wrote about that study here. […]

    Like


  377. Women can’t seem to think that men do things for different reasons.

    Know why feminists think rape is about power? Because women use sex to control men. So if they use sex for power, then clearly men must use it for the same thing.

    I’ve discovered, confirmed, and clarified so much about female behavior by just looking at their accusations/rationalizations of male behavior and just flipping it back on them.

    First and biggest one is obviously sex for power. In the book why women have sex they’ll do it from everything from stealing a man from a competing women to getting a guy to take out the trash. Women CLEARLY use sex to control men. Then they project this behavior onto men and get this “rape is about control” bullshit.

    Other examples: Does a women accuse you of attacking her when you offer constructive criticism? Guess what she’s doing when she offers it to you. Why do women think a guy with catch feelings if she sleeps with him? because that’s what happens to them.

    there’s other examples but I think I’ve made my point. Hopefully a few people out there can elaborate and provide more examples.

    Like


  378. […] Occasionally even a feminist manages a swiping glance at the truth. Naomi Wolf has a track record of immersing herself in a stinking pile of pretty lies, but her contention that widespread porn availability numbs men to the pleasures of “real women”* might have some merit. […]

    Like