Alpha Assessment Monday: Downlow Edition

For the previous Alpha Assessment Monday, see here. All submissions go here.

Case #1

Submitted by Stone:

Here are excerpts from my interactions with women, for the judging. As a married man – and don’t start busting my balls, as I live in a foreign country with very egalitarian divorce laws, plus I picked my bride wisely – anyway, as a married man I have to adjust my game accordingly.

I only go after women when my wife is away, or when I am out of town. I don’t give out my number, and I don’t call girls I’ve picked up, because I wouldn’t like them returning my call some night when I’m at the family dinner table.

So for me, there is no number close, no kiss close, no other kind of close other than the real one. Which is hard, it only happens one out of twenty times or so. I could have a better close ratio if I focused on milfs/cougars, but as my wife is 24 and hot, I don’t want anything I get on the side to be too much of a compromise – otherwise I might as well stick with her. So anyway, after all this background, here are a few lines that I have adapted to fit my situation, and found they work fairly well:

Her: But you’re married!
Me: Of course I am, I’d have to be gay otherwise.
Her: ?
Me: Well, women always say “all the good ones are either gay or taken” – I’d be gay if I wasn’t taken, ’cause I’m good!

Her: But how could you cheat to your wife?
Me: Oh, so you’ve never cheated to your boyfriend?
Her: But that’s different, since I’m not married.
Me: I don’t see the difference. You break a promise and yeah, that’s bad, so you gotta make sure what you break it for is worth it.

Her: So what does you wife think about you being out to the club tonight, perhaps talking to other women?
Me: Oh, that’s fine, I can talk to other women. Actually, I can do anything to other women, as long as I don’t sleep with them. But, everything else is fine. Like, I could kiss you.
Her: I ain’t kissing you.
Me: I didn’t say you could. I just said I could if I wanted to.

And so on. Of course, not being able and willing to collect a number and follow thru with a couple of days hurts your success rate a lot, but I still do fairly well – actually, better than most of my single friends.

I like the idea of pressure cooker pickup. You either fuck close, or you hit the bricks. Gina’s for closers! Smart move not calling girls. As a married man exercising his options, you’ll want to minimize the paper trail. And an even better move steering clear of cougars. Too much time spent banging them out, however transient and insubstantial, will leave you feeling depressed. Stick to the young hotties.

Your first convo was good up until the last line. Too much explanation and self-promotion. When she tossed you the quizzical look, I’d have said “Only inexperienced and gay men stay on the market for long.”

Your second convo is too argumentative. You’re sparring with her about the definition of cheating. A total reframe was in order.

HER: But how could you cheat on your wife?
YOU: Who said anything about cheating?

If she presses, you tell her cheating implies lying, and you are completely honest in your relationships. This improved convo also serves the dual purpose of disqualifying yourself.

Your third convo is fine, though I’d question the wisdom of throwing out such a huge disqualifier like “as long as I don’t sleep with them” late in the pickup. I’m assuming this was said during early game.

A question I often get (not sure why I get it, since I’m not married and never been married) is whether it’s better for married men on the sly to be up front about their marriages or to hide the fact from their targets. While I don’t advocate lying for practical reasons, I’m utterly agnostic on the ethicality of using lies as a tool of seduction, particularly when the seduction in question is specifically for a quickie, no muss no fuss fling. The fact is, a certain non-trivial percentage of women are turned on by the thought of poaching a taken man, and will act on it. “All the taken men are good.” Proudly displaying your wedding ring will attract these types like vaj to horse saddles. But a significant number, perhaps a bare majority, won’t have anything to do with a married man. It’s up to you to decide whether the increase in attraction intensity from a sizeable minority of poachers is worth the decrease in overall numbers of targets if you’re up front about your marital status.

Case #2

Submitted by Marrk:

I’m younger then most of the guys here, but I figure its best to get this shit straight early.

This is just the back story to my relationship with the first girl.

I met this girl (shes about a 7.5, 8 on a good day) when I was a Junior in High school ( I graduated last year) but back then I was pretty shy and didn’t really know how to approach girls.

I was introduced to her at a party and didn’t talk to her for another year I’d see her around and we’d make eye contact, but i was too shy to make a move. Around my senior year I see her outside of class and I was pretty stoned and decided to talk to her. She was straight up eye fucking me and normally I would have avoided eye contact or somthing and made small talk, but this time I just looked her straight in the eye and started talking to her. I don’t remember exactly what I said because I wasn’t exactly sober, but it ended up with my getting my dick sucked in the car.

GSS be damned. Chicks are getting sluttier. They just learn to skirt the spirit of the questionnaire by not counting blowjobs.

The problem started when I met this other girl. I would have tried to juggle both but all three of us going to the same school ,it just wouldn’t have worked so I told girl number 1 that I didn’t want to see her any more. What happened with girl number 2 is a different story, but lets just say I was Waaay too fucking nice.

Now that nice block of text brings me to the current situation. I’m back home and I haven’t seen the First girl in a year or so. She sees my status on Myspace and asks me how I been and what not. I didn’t know what 2 say because After I told her that i didn’t want to be close to any women at the time when we were in school together, She saw me making out with girl number 2 the next day.

So i just decided to hit her back and see how she was, It started with simple convo, like catching up or what ever VIA myspace ( I hate the shit) but eventually she asks for my number again. So we’re texting and shit and she’s like ” I miss you and the way you made me feel”.

Beta bait. Don’t take it!

After she sends me that, I almost replied right away with ” I missed you too” but i decided to kill some time and wait a couple of hours.

I replied with ” Well what do you miss about the way I make you feel”.

Damn, you took it.

And she makes me wait like 3 fucking hours and replies with some bullshit “good answer” at 4am.

Women are like finely crafted Swiss watches. Totally predictable.

So I’m like Fuck it, I’m not going to reply, and shes going to have to Call or text me again if she wants to talk to me.

Good save. When in doubt, DON’T REPLY.

Lo and behold, later the next day she texts me asking wassup. I don’t know if I made a mistake here because I was still pissed from last night and was giving her clipped, one worded responses.

Anger is hard to conceal and is often a dead giveaway that she has gotten to you. This was a golden opportunity to act aloof and indifferent, as if nothing was out of sorts between you two.

Then she’s like she wants to see me so I tell her I’m only going to be free this Sat. She tells me the following tuesday and I just told her I have a date on tuesday. She didn’t reply, or text me for like two days after that and then today shes like, Do you still want to see me on Saturday?. I told her I’ll see if I can make the time but don’t hold your breath.

Well played, mostly. But you should’ve eased off on the asshole game. She’s going back on her word (essentially, indicting herself as a liar) by agreeing to meet you on Saturday like you originally wanted, so you come out with the upper hand. The time to be magnanimous is when you have hand. A simple “Cool” should have been your reply to her capitulation.

I’m probably going to go and see her, but I’m not sure yet. Today is that saturday so I’ll probably have to make a decision soon, and when I do I’ll post up what happens.

Sorry about the block of text lol but i felt the need to be as thourough as possible to get the best feedback. What do you guys/gals think?

The asshole is strong in you, but your journey to the alpha side is not yet complete. Not every interaction with a girl is a challenge to prove your player prowess. As an alpha padawan you will come to understand the power of forbearance and vulnerability game.

Let us know what happened.





Comments


  1. on September 28, 2009 at 12:28 pm ironrailsironweights

    “Stone” is a douche bag.

    Peter

    Like


  2. Cheating on ones own children is beyond comprehension. He values his own hedonism above his children’s sense of family security, trust, and well-being. Perhaps this man’s mother or father cheated on him.

    Like


  3. ” I miss you and the way you made me feel”.

    Beta bait. Don’t take it!

    recognizing and properly responding to more sophisticated beta bait like this is definitely a sticking point of mine (and probably for many–it’s a fairly subtle concept that I would imagine only people at an advanced level can master).

    How would you properly respond to something like this? One word–“Cool.”; “Cool + [change of subject]”; or some C&F variation, like, “wow, don’t tell me you’re about to propose via text”/”wow, I’ve heard of breaking up via text…but are you about to propose with one?”

    Or none of the above?

    Like


  4. I admit I’m confused how Marrk’s response–“Well what do you miss about me”–constituted “taking” the beta bait.

    Like


  5. Charon, women use those kind of lines as a kind of subtle power play to see if you will comply. The best way to handle this is not play into this BS.

    Like


  6. I’m still not sure I’m getting it. Is it a “power play” because it’s clear to you she’s not being sincere?

    Like


  7. tAnd she makes me wait like 3 fucking hours and replies with some bullshit “good answer” at 4am.

    I hated when bitches did that to me.

    The Typical responses where: “lol” “hah” “?”

    I really hated the “?”

    its like…bitch…whats don’t you understand?

    Like


  8. A simple, good response to the “I miss you text” is just “oh?” By asking what she misses about him etc. it’s saying that he needs his ego stroked. It’s better than “I miss you too” or whatever, that’s for sure, but still, if a guy said to a girl “I miss you” and she said “What do you miss about me” he’d think her a total bitch, and be right. Just saying “oh?” leaves much to be interpreted on her end, “does he care? does he believe me? maybe he’s happy I wrote that, and wants me to continue.” etc. etc.

    Like


  9. “If she presses, you tell her cheating implies lying, and you are completely honest in your relationships. This improved convo also serves the dual purpose of disqualifying yourself.”

    I’m not sure what you mean by disqualifying in this context.

    Like


  10. Kevin, it means making yourself unavailable, which of course makes you more attractive. “Gay game” also has this effect.

    Like


  11. Her: I miss you and the way you made me feel

    Him: I know

    Like


  12. Stone makes sure we ALL know he has a hottie young wife. Ya ya we got it you’re super alpha.

    Like


  13. “aoefe

    Her: I miss you and the way you made me feel

    Him: I know”

    Han Solo Game.

    Like


  14. Sorry I didn’t get around to posting what happened but here we go.

    I ended up going to see her that Saturday, I picked her up from her place and she was a little angry that I was such an ass about seeing her. She said something along the lines of ” You didn’t have to pick me up if you didn’t want to see me” and I replied with, ” Well I didn’t have to come and get you if I didn’t want to see you”.

    We get to my place and order some food, Just catching up with the lost times. She seems a little shy so I break out the bong and we take a couple of hits, After that she’s giving off body language that tells me she wants it so I go for the kiss. She was pretty into it then when things get to real hot and heavy shes like ” I don’t want to put out on the first date, after what you did to me last time, I respect myself a bit more’ and kinda gives me a little attitude.

    I’m just sitting in my bed, with all kinds of What the Fucks going through my mind, but I didn’t go out with a loaded gun so I’m thinking a bit clearly and I make an effort to check the time on my phone, and I told her to get dressed because ” I’m having some people over later tonight” which was true.

    She was a little upset that I wouldn’t let her stay to meet my friends, asking ” Am i not good enough to meet your friends?”, I told her “I only bring the girl that I’m dating around my friends.” Which isn’t true at all, i just wanted her the fuck out. She takes the bait and gets her shit together and I drop her off.

    She calls me later that night and shes like, ” Just because we stopped doesn’t mean I don’t like you because I do and I just don’t want to be used by men for my body”Or some dumb shit like that.. I was a bit confused at the time, because her body language at the time told me something complete different, she wanted it as bad as I did.

    So we make plans to see each other the following weekend ( which just passed). Throughout the week shes hinting that she wants to wait for sex and that it should be special. I didn’t acknowledge it, I just knew in the back of my mind that I’m fucking the shit out of this tramp on Friday. Friday rolls around and I go to her house, This time she decides to have her annoying ass friend thats a dude third wheel for a bit.

    Now this guy must have had a crush on her because me and her were cuddling up pretty close and hes just sitting there with a stupid look on his face, trying desperately to get her away from me. ” Oh lets go get a cig”, and ” Do you want to get something to eat”. He directly addressed her and not me So i just pulled her a little closer and while hes pleaded with her to leave me and do some platonic gay best friend shit, I’m playing and teasing her body.

    She wanted to make out with me in front of the guy and one point, and when he asks for a cig she throws him the box and tell him ” take your time”. I didn’t feel the need to deal with this guy, She invited him over without telling me, she can get rid of him, I would have fucked her with him watching for all I care.

    Right after he closes the door, I Attack her, She doesn’t stop time, Had her naked in 2 minutes and begging for the cock in 4. After we finished she was trying to get me to sleep over and was said, ” Now that we’ve done it, do you think sex changes things?”. I looked her straight in the face and told her “only for the better” She then asked me “what do you mean for the better” and I just replied with ” I think my time in your company is better spent this way”. She took that at face value, I think she assumed the closeness because we were kinda cuddling when I said it, but I just meant the sex. I cleaned up, and took off, before she got all emotional on me.

    I sleep through 2 of her phone calls the next day, and eat through another. When I do pick up, shes acting like a clingy bitch. I told her I was hanging out with some friends and she asks me can she come. I told her, Nah because we aren’t dating. Then she asked me ” Why aren’t we dating” and I told her I’m not sure if your the dating type. She went silent and started to ask me ” why not? and what did she do wrong” I told her I needed to get ready and I’ll talk to her later.

    Today, Shes texting me all day in class, asking me why she isn’t the dating type.

    I’ll reply in a little bit, when i feel like dealing with her shit.

    Like


  15. I don’t understand why is “I miss you and the way you made me feel” beta bait???

    Like


  16. Don’t know where to put this but check out David Letterman from 20+ years ago handling a Yuppie interior decorator.

    It happens off and on throughout this clip.

    Like


  17. Aoefe my sweet I want your TLC…

    Like


  18. So markk she was a born again virgin. Did she have the operation too?

    Like


  19. “Text Game” makes my head spin (I will admit, and have before, if there is a weakness in my Game it is text Game.)

    If you are anything like me, just use texting to set a meeting.

    Sell the meeting.

    Then you can work you magic over a glass of red and some smokes.

    Which happens to be more my area of interest.

    – MPM

    Like


  20. [email protected] she was a slut draped in a born again Virgins coat.

    @Manifesto Don’t really like wine, and too young to buy it anyway, when i get someone to buy liquor for me. Its the hard stuff.

    The smokes sound good though.

    Liked by 1 person


  21. Marrk

    “@Manifesto Don’t really like wine, and too young to buy it anyway, when i get someone to buy liquor for me. Its the hard stuff.”

    Invest in a good fake ID.

    And keep the weed burning (good prototype-G Game) young player.

    Side note:

    You have to love America. Easier to get drugs than booze.

    – MPM

    Like


  22. Seeking feedback:

    I’m a guy and I’m often asked, “You’re attractive and tall. How come you’re single?” What’s the “alpha” answer to this question?

    the truthful answer is that I have no problem retaining 2 or 3 girls at any given time to “see” but never commit to and dont really see the need to commit to one girl. Subsequently I have very high standards when it comes to annointing any one girl as “girlfriend”. however this is neither an eloquent nor effective answer.

    A gay man who knew I am straight recently asked me this question and I shrugged and stumbled through an answer to the effect of “Im just keeping my options open”. I dont think its cool to say, “because im a player who likes a variety of women” (which is somewhat truthful, but taboo) or “because Im looking for the right girl” (which is also somewhat truthful, but sounds lame)

    would appreciate thoughts..

    Like


  23. Hahaha I know I was thinking the same thing. I live in California, I can legally go buy pot from a dispensary, because a doctor says I have “anxiety” issues. I love America.

    Like


  24. goldenseed

    “I’m a guy and I’m often asked, “You’re attractive and tall. How come you’re single? What’s the “alpha” answer to this question?”

    Don’t respond.

    “A gay man who knew I am straight recently asked me this question”

    Wait, is it gay guys asking you this or girls?

    – MPM

    Like


  25. Next time, with a girl like this that you obviously have no respect for (and from the sounds of it, this particular girl doesn’t deserve any), a real alpha thing to do would be to NOT bone her when you KNOW you can.

    But I can’t blame you too much. The power of T cursing through your veins at a young age means it would have been hard to resist.

    Like


  26. Pupu wonders whether it is much easier and more natural to run the a-hole game when the guy is not that into the girl.

    Like


  27. I was pretty stoned and decided to talk to her.

    Stoned game is good stuff. You’re calm, unaffected, uninhibited, far less reactive, and you speak far far slower. (As long as your eyes aren’t glassy and red, but that shouldn’t be a big deal in a nighttime environment.)

    Like


  28. Pupu – for those like me with their training wheels still on – it definitely is.

    Like


  29. @confused1000
    It’s beta bait because she is leading the conversation if he responds to her attempt at emotional puppet string-pulling. She’s trying to reel him in with a display of smitten vulnerability, when all she really wants is for him to reciprocate with a similar statement. If he does then she has him in her power instead of he being the object of her desire.

    Don’t try to play catch up as she leads the conversation, instead dismiss or redirect to your advantage. She needs to know she’s only one option out of many available to you. If anyone’s going to jump through hoops then it will be her.

    Like


  30. ””””””Wait, is it gay guys asking you this or girls?

    – MPM
    ”””””””””
    Now might be the time to consult a lawyer.

    Like


  31. “The Typical responses where: “lol” “hah” “?”

    I really hated the “?”

    its like…bitch…whats don’t you understand?”

    Lmfao. So true. I hate that retarded shit.

    Like


  32. I am confused about roissy’s definition of alpha male.
    He says it’s women who decide this, not men.
    But he also says that women are worried about who is a “real” alpha male and who is not, which is why they do shit tests, etc. (I’m still not clear on the concept of a shit test and what it is btw). So clearly if there is such a thing as real alpha and women are worried about being fooled, it is not they who decide this, but nature.

    It is also somewhat feminist and giving women your balls to define who is “alpha” based on affection given by women. A real alpha probably is a leader of men who just happens to be successful with women, or who could be, but doesn’t give it too much thought.

    I think roissy disagrees with this because he thinks the point of life is to win women’s love and that a life without love by women is like death, etc.; he’s said this before. He doesn’t understand that men in traditional societies have contempt for men like this and call them soft-handed “women’s men,” etc.; no, it is not a man’s purpose in life to be loved by women. And men don’t do heroic acts in order to win women’s love.

    Roissy is apparently a modernist libertarian who says that the life of all men in the past who didn’t think like him was worthless…knights, scientists, philosophers, artists, kings and conquerors in the past, who did not think it is “death” to be without women, but who didn’t much care one way or another, and who dedicated their time and lives to something higher, they’re all apparently losers. But Roissy who works an office job in DC and measures his worth by how much sex and affection he can get from modern professional sluts, is an alpha and a real man, and much happier than they were.

    Like


  33. ””””””And men don’t do heroic acts in order to win women’s love.””””””’

    The womans love is a side benefit of doing heroic acts.

    Like


  34. Pupu wonders whether it is much easier and more natural to run the a-hole game when the guy is not that into the girl.

    it would follow that a cocky a**hole “is just not that into” a woman. A man with genuine interest will show a bit of controlled nervousness.

    Like


  35. @annony Its not that I’m not into the girls or anything, Its just most of time, I truly do not give a fuck.

    Like


  36. Fuck that came out weird now that I’ve read it lol. I mean I know I’m an asshole. Its my default mode. I can pretend to be otherwise but Even if I like a girl and shes giving me shit, I’m going to default into a don’t give a fuck mode most of the time.

    Like


  37. Gunslinger—
    Yes, I agree, that’s my point. If the point in life was just to score pussy, then why wouldn’t men have just learned “game” instead of building cathedrals, going to the moon, writing symphonies, etc.? In fact why wouldn’t we have just lived in grass huts like niggers and become bonobo-humans?

    Women’s affection can be a side effect of doing great things, and that’s what it should be, any man who goes through life trying to win women’s affection is stunted somehow.

    Like


  38. I really didn’t do that great a job with my two word come back, I admit. I was going to asshole tone and it didn’t come off.

    Her: I miss you and the way you made me feel

    Him: No shit sherlock.

    or

    Him: Sorry I lost my contact list. Who are you?

    Like


  39. @The truth

    Have we met before? 🙂

    Like


  40. Marrk,

    Pupu believes you. Before legal drinking age, it is an anomaly for a guy to really care about *the* girl, not just any girl. Alcohol has little to do with it. A-hole games run by young lads usually come across as natural.

    Like


  41. G –

    I get this question from girls or sometimes older adults such as friends parents. The most recent instance was at a party where a gay mutual acquantaince I met for the first time asked this. Teally its an irrelevant detail that he was gay. I’m in my late twenties so I’m guessing the expectation is that I should be a steady, serious relationship…hence the question I guess. Clearly the answer is dependant upon who is asking. If its an attractive girl (or a gay man for that matter) I suppose the question seeking digging for information. When its a platonic stranger or colleague its probably ask out of curiousity. In either case, I’m somewhat unsure of the answer. I feel I should mask the truth to prevent the appearance of arrogance. With girls I usually say I havent met a whose worth it yet. With “adults” I say Im just playing the field and looking for the right one or something like that.

    Like


  42. I’m still not clear on the concept of a shit test and what it is btw

    Shit testing (or congruence testing) is in reality emotional or psychological abuse (and many guides on how to properly conduct an abusive relationship exist in popular dating advice books and magazine columns directed at women).

    It’s a relational aggression tactic to get compliance out of a victim, and get as much out of them (especially loyalty) while not actually deserving it and putting as little as possible into the process.

    Most girls learn it by manipulating each other from the earliest ages. This is the characteristic catty young girl behavior, with liberal amounts of gossip, betrayal and lies for the purposes of eliciting desirable responses out of their peer group (and eventually men in relationships) through humiliation, jealousy, shaming, isolation, et cetera. The ultimate goal being to inflict love upon the victim (love is clinically known as Stockholm Syndrome).

    Of course, when women inflict love upon men successfully they are no longer sexually attracted to them. Men must be successful in both recognizing, disarming and redeploying these relational aggression tactics upon women to inflict love upon them, gaining undeserved loyalty and trust in return.

    Like


  43. Re Case 2
    can someone explain why that is beta bait ?

    @mark
    also .. if i agree with roissy keep the aloof thing going … this is almost sure to interest her .. i dont know a single girl including me who doesn’t dig a guy who acts aloof .

    but what are you trying to accomplish with this girl?

    over all i think this case 2 is pretty ok game for a guy of your age .which is about 20 ?

    Like


  44. “It is also somewhat feminist and giving women your balls to define who is “alpha” based on affection given by women.”

    I don’t think the essence of who is “alpha” is defined based on AFFECTION given by women.

    It is defined based on SUBMISSION given by women.

    Whether it is “affection”, cooking your dinner or offering love that dare not speak its name, the essence of alpha is the power to tame.

    Like


  45. @nadia

    I’m 18, and I’ve already got what I wanted, Question is do i want to even go back for more.

    Like


  46. aoefe —

    Him: Sorry I lost my contact list. Who are you?

    Hahahahahahaha I used to do this all the time if a guy hadn’t called/texted in awhile and I was annoyed.

    Like


  47. K—

    Yes, but like WHAT…for example…would be a “shit test”? Roissy and others talk about them but I never see many examples and I can’t understand…what’s an example of a beta “shit test”?

    Like


  48. JB–
    Whatever…women are not the ones who determine the status and worth of a man. If you believe that, then you’ve given your balls to women.

    Like


  49. Update:
    Everyone will pay for the new healthcare or they will go to jail and or pay a fine.

    aww look another way for someone to be put in jail for not paying for something.
    And the bitch on the news was like her next door neighbor didn’t get health insurance and now he has cancer. She has to pay for that when it trickles down. So everyone must be paying money for health care or go to jail. She is like it is a law and you have to have a punishment when the law is broken. The commentator was like it is not a law yet and if people knew they where gonna go to jail for not getting healthcare they wouldn’t have went along with it.

    Seems like this will be the nail in the coffin in the us. If you have to get health care then you must pay just to be alive. Lack of freedom will be reaching critical levels.

    Like


  50. “Her: I miss you and the way you made me feel”

    In escalating asshole mode:

    “Aw shucks.”

    “Cute.”

    “I get that a lot.”

    “You are so weird.”

    “So don’t screw it up this time!”

    “Take a number.”

    “Oh, that’s original….”

    “Heel, bitch!”

    Like


  51. Pretty decent job Marrk.

    I could quibble with you over how you handled the Last Minute Resistance that first night but I won’t. Kicking her out is a good second option and you did well making yourself seem aloof and busy.

    The main problem I have is the way you handled her stupid dating question. You destabilized the rapport you had built the night you banged her by sticking in the knife that she “wasn’t relationship material”.

    A better answer would have been something short and ambiguous like “I’ll see”.

    Like


  52. @ cliff ‘you are so weird’ is hilarious .. im going to use this.

    Like


  53. Aoefe maybe…..maybe…

    Like


  54. Marrk, I don’t know if backtracking is such a good idea. Break new ground. Don’t dig through your trash.

    Like


  55. What is “beta bait?”

    Like


  56. Confused, there is an actual biological/anthropological definition for alpha. The same applies here, just that the “resource” in question is women. The alpha male in a western dating context is the male who has consensual access to the most women.

    Women don’t actually decide who the alpha is. Men and women in a social group do that together. Men defer to those who socially outrank them. Women seek out the highest ranking men.

    The social group most of the guys here represent is urban/suburban White middle class. So most of the tactical information is going to be geared towards taking advantage of “slut culture” in which women seek casual sex based on short-term primal and superficial alpha characteristics.

    While guys who understand this, a minority, are cleaning up and basically monopolozing sex with most of the volunteer sluts, “nice guys” are left out of the loop and being lied to about what is really going on out there. They’re convinced that being “nice” is going to get them laid, and it doesn’t. Furthermore, they’re fed additional b.s. about how to keep a woman’s attention and gain her respect. They believe that becoming capitulating doormats will get them loved.

    This, as you probably know, doesn’t even work for women. It’s absolute sexual and relationship doom for men.

    So on this site, the blogger and many of the commenters are in the process of deprogramming. They have seen the matrix and decided to take the red pill when it comes to romance and the like. So if you stick around, you’ll see a lot that you agree or disagree with, but no matter how harsh it gets, just about everybody here’s heart is in the right place.

    Just don’t panic. Take it in, think about it, opine, and try not to take too much personally.

    Like


  57. Ghost of Nicole,
    You’re a woman your opinion is not wanted, stfu…

    I never said anything about guys being nice, etc., and I’m sure roissy helps some cowards who are afraid to talk to girls with this alpha/beta nonsense.

    That doesn’t mean he has a right to slander Western history and the men who built civilization by claiming that only a man who lives in thrall to a woman’s vagina is happy or “alpha.”

    As for you, you’re a woman and you’re not part of it, you don’t get it.

    Like


  58. I’m just going to comment on Stone’s case since the role of married guy picking up women is sort of my area of expertise. 😉

    My main criticism is with the second conversation. I don’t even like that the “How can you cheat on your wife?” question comes up. Obviously, it’s a thought that she’ll have, but the fact that it’s asked in that way indicates that Stone is letting the girl know way too early that he’s looking to get laid.

    If you’re wearing a wedding ring, then there’s some magic to that that attracts many women, since you’re “spoken for” and “off limits.” You’re the guy they can’t have. You want to milk that.

    So you want to delay as long as possible the revelation that you are indeed “temporarily available.” You want to first build up her fantasy that one day, she’ll meet a great guy of her own, just like you. (Girls in their 20’s actually still believe this fantasy!) You want to keep working her, not to get her to want to have sex with you, but to want to have sex with a guy just like you. A little time and a few drinks later, she’ll become a little more willing to blur that line.

    At that point, the question she’ll be asking isn’t how can you cheat on your wife, but it’s how could she mess around with some other woman’s husband. That’s how women think. Like I said, if she’s asking you how can you cheat on your wife, you made your move way too soon.

    There’s a skill to handling this moral dilemma she’s having, but it’s really just the same basic game techniques you’d use in singles situations where the girl is reluctant.

    Of course, there is still going to be the issue of what kind of guy are you that you would cheat on your wife. There are two ways to handle that. (Definitely NOT the “Debate Team” method Stone used.)

    Option 1, if the girl has a bad girl streak to her, or better yet, likes the bad boys, then the response is an unapologetic, yet thoughtful, “It’s who I am.”

    Option 2, if you’re dealing with a girl who doesn’t seem quiiiiite ready to do this, then the response is, “No you’re right. What was I thinking?” You make yourself unavailable again. You’ll even pick up more “what a great guy” points. Sure, moments ago you were considering cheating, but she knows everyone’s human. And unlike all the dogs out there who would still be trying to get in her pants, you stopped yourself! (Even she won’t really believe this . . . except she WANTS so badly to believe this that she will. Girls this age just can’t let go of that fantasy that great guys exist.) You then continue to have nice conversation with her and of course, make another attempt when the time is right.

    Regarding the first conversation (“straight or gay”,) it’s a little complicated and may be too clever for it’s own good. Any girl hears that will know that you use that same line a lot. I may use it, mind you, but those are my reservations with it.

    I don’t like conversation #3 at all, mostly because I don’t think any woman is going to believe that another woman is going to give her husband permission to kiss other women. It’s a really old and usually desperate ploy. It might work, but personally, I couldn’t do it.

    Like


  59. Confused, my having a vagina doesn’t preclude an ability to read, nor does it somehow take years off my life and experience.

    The belief that women are stupid is part of what gets western guys ass raped in court consistently. So you can drop the Mr. Internet routine. Negging chicks old enough to be your mom is, aside of futile, not going to save you from getting reamed by whatever whore you’re destined to marry, since women who are actually kind and non phony are so abhorrent to you.

    If anything I’m saying is inaccurate, you’re welcome to call me on it. However, I am not out there riding the cock carousel, so you have no call to treat me with the same disrespect that you likely treat your obviously single mother.

    Whatever damaged you and American society, I didn’t do, so don’t take it out on me.

    Like


  60. @Confused

    You sound like an overcompensating beta.

    Nicole gave you a very clean and clear explanation of what the deal is with the discussions on this site. Be civilized.

    You can shout at the top of your lungs that you don’t give a shit about what women think, yet it will cut absolutely no ice on the players in the dating market. As an analogy, you can be an Iraqi and protest the fact that the US messed up your country when it had no right to do so. Yet, there it is, it’s happened. That’s because the US has an immense armada and Iraq doesn’t. That’s how reality works, in case you haven’t noticed. Which planet are you living on?

    And if you’re confused due to “cultural” differences, you’re not the only one. I–someone living in a country thousands of miles away from the US–was as alien to Game and all the discussions around it as you (assuming you’re not an imposter) until about a few months ago, when I first discovered this site. If I disclosed my personal details, the leading characters on this forum would instantly label me a… well, never mind. So I don’t.

    Nor do I posture. Traditional males (assuming you are one) don’t make spectacles of themselves when they are frustrated. I could have said “real men don’t beat their chest,” but that statement itself is a subtle form of chest beating. They deal with their frustration in quiet resolve, with stoicism, so that they can chest-beat subtly.

    So, if you’re so eager to prove that you’re a manly man, then act like one.

    Like


  61. That is SO pathetic that a man is such a sex-addict that even a wife can’t keep him happy. It’s not even about morality, it’s just GLUTTONY. Odds are his wife is fucking other men,and/or using him for his money, since quality women don’t have to tolerate CHEATING (on the marriage, and himself, if not the woman). it’s chest-thumping bullshit that proves nothing, since all the women involved are trash, and he proves it every time he “seduces” one.

    I once caught a guy cheating on his girlfriend and gave him two options:

    1. I tell his girlfriend.

    2. I FUCK his girlfriend (or try to).

    There’s a reason you guys have to HIDE your names. Ever think of that? Talking all alpha and acting like pathetic cowards who can’t even stand behind their actions or words. Yeah, keep TAKLING.

    You’re all being sold a bill of goods, being told to waste your best years chasing sluts for one-night stands, or trying to make girlfriends out of them, instead of doing the so-much-better you’d be capable of if you ever grew beyond the “horny teenager” stage.

    Like


  62. There’s a reason you guys have to HIDE your names

    stop being such a narrow minded bigot. THis is a blog for guys with ridiculous names who want to talk about sex they will never have because of their ridiculous names

    do you think I am a lesser huan being because my mother Christened me “gig”?

    Like


  63. Confused, if you don’t know what a “shit test” is, I really don’t think you should be telling other people to “STFU” based on their gender when they demonstrate AT LEAST equal knowledge about the subject as you.

    Like


  64. Awww shit, I got beat to the punch

    Like


  65. @ Ray Gordon.

    You’re a punk ass little snitch, Whos jealous of the Vag other guys are getting so you feel the need to White Knight on the chicks getting the short end of the deal. Gtfo.

    Like


  66. @Nicole

    You’ve got a point there. I’m just retreaded this ground to try and keep my game tight, While I’m working on the new ground I’m busy breaking.

    Like


  67. “What is “beta bait?””

    A woman’s attempt to provoke beta behaviors in a man.

    Also see: shit test.

    Like


  68. “Whatever…women are not the ones who determine the status and worth of a man. If you believe that, then you’ve given your balls to women.”

    So you fundamentally disagree with Mystery’s Survival & Replication imperative?

    Because the corollary of that is that the quality of women available to a man define whether he’s an alpha male.

    Perhaps it isn’t “women” who have “my balls”, but Mother Nature?

    Like


  69. Yes, but like WHAT…for example…would be a “shit test”? Roissy and others talk about them but I never see many examples and I can’t understand…what’s an example of a beta “shit test”?

    There are examples in this very post. “I miss you blah blah blah” is a shit test. She is trying to get Marrk to jump through a hoop.

    Any situation where she is seeking a reaction (which means she is leading) is a shit test. Any situation where she is giving you an opportunity to obtain her compliance or stomp on her bad behavior is a shit test. Any situation where she is trying to get something from you (especially compliance) for nothing in return is a shit test.

    Like


  70. I should say quantity (that is the traditional view), but perhaps there’s some kind of equilibrium between quantity and quality.

    Like


  71. A shit test is defined in PU as a woman’s (often unconscious) tactics to ascertain whether a male is alpha/dominant or beta/submissive. Often involves “tooling” the male (soliciting him to serve her in some way) or drawing out emotional behaviors.

    Like


  72. @Marrk
    A heads up; her display was for the other guy, to make him burn with jealousy for not being what she wanted him to be. (Given ages, probably not f**ing her, but older ones will do it to lovers for not proposing soon enough.) By the way, I’ve been that other guy more than once, before I learned not to care. (THEN I found out I’m a natural. I was so cool about losing the last one (as I expected), she broke down.) Happily married now.

    Like


  73. @Abject Man,
    What does this have to do with Iraq? u mad …

    You cowards who are afraid to talk to girls and need to find your balls on roissy’s site, go ahead and use whatever words you want. My point was regarding roissy’s idea that all the men in the past who didn’t think pussy was the culmination of life were losers. He’s slandering our history and civilization. He should go live with niggers in Sierra Leone if he believes that.

    Like


  74. confused1000, you remind me of those guys with Affliction shirt, thinking they’re all bad ass

    Like


  75. JB—
    No I don’t know who Mystery is and I don’t think the point of life is “survival and replication” as we are not bonobos or living a sustenance life in the Central African Republic. If we really believed that we wouldn’t have bothered building cathedrals, going to the moon, or composing symphonies, we’d live in grass huts. See my response to gunslinger above.

    Again, my problem is not with whatever it is any of you have to do to pick up girls, good luck to you, they’re a bunch of cunts and deserve whatever they get. But I don’t know where you go off treating other men like what is often recommended here…Men used to have a response to loud-mouth “PUA” “gamer” types in bars…take them out and give them a good beating. Maybe you can pull this shit in Dupont Circle, you shoot your mouth off like that where I live and you’ll end up in an emergency room.

    Like


  76. Confused go and work 84 hours a week for 5 years or so and build something. Getr done.

    Like


  77. ””””””’See my response to gunslinger above.”””

    I didn’t see any mention of me above. Obviously you need some attention though. So yea go to my site and just copy some shit. So you can rise above “pussy” Of course what the hell else is there but some nice cuddle times with some good “pussy”. After you achieve I mean got to relax too. And some woman can be great facilitators of a relaxing atmosphere.

    ””””””””””” Dupont Circle, you shoot your mouth off like that where I live and you’ll end up in an emergency room.
    ””””””
    Your becoming muddy in your thinking now your saying where you live it is ok to put another guy in the emergency room for grabbing some pussy off the shelf.

    Like


  78. Maybe you can pull this shit in Dupont Circle, you shoot your mouth off like that where I live and you’ll end up in an emergency room.

    Lulz. Chaverific.

    But I don’t know where you go off treating other men like what is often recommended here

    What is recommended here is that involuntarily celibate beta males get some pussy instead of therapy, and go out and socialize instead of playing 30 hours of World of Warcraft every week. Get a clue. The PUA community and this site are performing a fucking service.

    Like


  79. goldenrod:
    I’m a guy and I’m often asked, “You’re attractive and tall. How come you’re single?” What’s the “alpha” answer to this question?

    “just lucky, i guess.”

    Like


  80. gunslinger,
    I was talking about a post above…your internet software has a search feature, if you use it you will see I responded to one of your posts…

    What you just wrote doesn’t make a lot of sense. 84 hours? And women…sure are for relaxation, OK. But roissy’s not saying that. He says that women are the culmination of life, that men do everything else just to score with women, and that men who don’t have women are like “dead.” This is a slander on all of our history. He should stick to giving cowards (“betas”) advice and stop with implying that all our scientific and artistic achievements were “for the sake of pussy.” What a wog.

    And yes, if you shoot your loud mouth off like an asshole to other guys in bars where I live, you’ll end up in an emergency room. And the same is true anywhere outside of Manhattan, San Faggo, or DC probably. I’ve seen such behavior encouraged on this site as a means of “impressing girls.”

    Like


  81. Well yea not having a woman sucks ass. Having one helps free your mind from the basic necessities and move on to other things. Being able to find a good woman because you understand them is priceless in this day and age.

    Like


  82. Him: Sorry I lost my contact list. Who are you?

    Lilgril : “Hahahahahahaha I used to do this all the time if a guy hadn’t called/texted in awhile and I was annoyed.”

    Where do you think I got the idea ? Out of my repertoire. 😉

    Like


  83. “If we really believed that we wouldn’t have bothered building cathedrals, going to the moon, or composing symphonies, we’d live in grass huts.”

    I don’t understand your point. Those achievements were by 1-in-a-million type talents. The rest of huMANity has to chase the muff around so there’s someone to at least preserve those accomplishments.

    Besides, a lot of those artists were fags, bro. It’s easy to turn your head to women when you’re playing Ass Invaders with your buddy.

    Like


  84. The Truth said as to an earlier meeting- “Aoefe maybe…..maybe…”

    Ya, I had a feeling. 🙂

    Like


  85. Plus already found one to open a hair salon in states (when I so desire). If ya can get the woman to run some teamwork shit gets easier.

    Like


  86. confused, not to put too fine a point on it, but did the doctor drop you?

    Like


  87. Her: I miss you and the way you made me feel

    Him: Hold on, I’ve got another call.

    Like


  88. True asshole game is only talking two words per phone call he he he

    Like


  89. Her: I miss you and the way you made me feel

    “Oh, good.”

    Like


  90. Think I will put add in paper taking applications to be in my harem. See what happens.

    Like


  91. i miss you and the way you make me feel

    “yeah, i’m pretty incredible”

    Like


  92. “Too much time spent banging (cougars) out, however transient and insubstantial, will leave you feeling depressed.”

    Amen and Halelluia brother. In addition to the fact that they’re nasty lookin’ they generally are soul rotten as well.

    Like


  93. on September 29, 2009 at 12:42 am gunslingergregi

    Some debunking of global warming,
    ”””””””At the conference in Washington, during the question period, Ehrlich was reminded that after Hiroshima and Nagasaki, scientists were quoted as saying nothing would grow there for 75 years, but in fact melons were growing the next year. So, he was asked, how accurate were these findings now? ””””””””

    http://www.michaelcrichton.net/speech-alienscauseglobalwarming.html

    Like


  94. on September 29, 2009 at 12:46 am gunslingergregi

    ””””””’In 1993, the EPA announced that second-hand smoke was “responsible for approximately 3,000 lung cancer deaths each year in nonsmoking adults,” and that it ” impairs the respiratory health of hundreds of thousands of people.” In a 1994 pamphlet the EPA said that the eleven studies it based its decision on were not by themselves conclusive, and that they collectively assigned second-hand smoke a risk factor of 1.19. (For reference, a risk factor below 3.0 is too small for action by the EPA. or for publication in the New England Journal of Medicine, for example.) Furthermore, since there was no statistical association at the 95% confidence limits, the EPA lowered the limit to 90%. They then classified second hand smoke as a Group A Carcinogen.

    This was openly fraudulent science, but it formed the basis for bans on smoking in restaurants, offices, and airports. California banned public smoking in 1995. Soon, no claim was too extreme. By 1998, the Christian Science Monitor was saying that “Second-hand smoke is the nation’s third-leading preventable cause of death.” The American Cancer Society announced that 53,000 people died each year of second-hand smoke. The evidence for this claim is nonexistent.
    ””””””””””’
    From the article. Gonna be tough to be alpha with no freedom.

    Like


  95. I’m sure you all know by now that Roman Polanski, who raped a 13 year old girl in 1977, is finally facing extradition for his crimes (the slimy bastard had fled to France once he realized the judge would be sentencing him to a long prison sentence). He’s a wonderful director and all, but the perverted little fucker definitely needs to finally face his punishment. Nevertheless, I loved this quote from him in Esquire regarding women and feminism:

    “I think the Pill altered female thinking. When you think that millions of women were taking daily hormones, you cannot deny that it must have changed their personalities. I truly don’t think that feminism would reach such absurd proportions if there were no Pill. It must have had an effect.”

    Read more: http://www.esquire.com/features/what-ive-learned/ESQ1299-DEC__WIL#ixzz0ST7Af2SL

    Dirty sexual deviant he may be, but I can respect the fact that he’s fully aware of what a face feminism has become . And Chinatown wasn’t bad either….

    Like


  96. *farce*

    Like


  97. Jill says: I miss you and the way you make me feel.

    Him: Pam?

    Like


  98. Me: I don’t see the difference. You break a promise and yeah, that’s bad, so you gotta make sure what you break it for is worth it.

    Fucking loser!!!

    Like


  99. Aoefe: “Stone makes sure we ALL know he has a hottie young wife. Ya ya we got it you’re super alpha.”

    Naturally. And the other guy was with a 7.5/8, of course. When it comes to e-posturing, the girls are always hot and the fights always end up with the other guy in the ICU.

    I wonder if there will ever be a “I’m torn about whether or not I should continue screwing the bitchy 4.5 or the friendly 3 that I know. What should I do” story?

    Like


  100. Thanks to all who gave me feedback on my game.
    Roissy captured nicely the essence – I have to be on the fast track. Mystery Method shit like 7-hour seduction, comfort zone, etc. may work nicely but for those who got the time – and I don’t, since I only get to play this game when my wife is out of town or I’m on a business trip, which is not too often – I cannot afford to waste a night by going thru the moves that Riff Dog suggested, because a flake is still very likely and it’s 3am – then you bite yourself for not having been more aggresive.
    So I have this drill that I follow – approach with something funny, tell a few interesting stories (DHV), neg 1-2 times, look for IOI, go for the kiss, get a few drinks in her (i’m buying), tell her I got a stick of quality weed back at my place and let’s go share it (borrowed from the G). All the time wearing the wedding ring and defusing objections about it with the lines I quoted (thank for the tips on how to fine-tune them).

    To those who don’t understand how I could cheat when I have a quality woman at home, I can only say wait and see, brothers. You will be in my position some day. The urge to sometimes be out there, be free for a night, do what you want, and bang some hot new girl, is irresistible. HOWEVER, that has not kept me from enjoying my nice family and I would never jeopardize that for some bimbo. I do love my wife and she is the dearest person to me in this world. Gotta be a man, though, and do what men gotta do. I’m sure she’d understand if she found out (hope she never does, though).

    Like


  101. “I wonder if there will ever be a “I’m torn about whether or not I should continue screwing the bitchy 4.5 or the friendly 3 that I know. What should I do” story?”

    An hero?

    Like


  102. on September 29, 2009 at 6:02 am unlearning genius

    @confused,

    You are an absolute moron. Life is really ONLY about survival and replication. Building cathedrals, going to the moon, coming out with M theory and cubist art …and all that male achievement is just a signal to one’s mate value.

    Your confusion comes from thinking that you are somehow special because you are human .. no you are not .. you are just another mammal .. with a bigger visual cortex and some additional cognitive machinery to deal with social cognition AND mating related activities like cuckhold detection, resource accumulation, alliance building and status accumulation.

    Life really has no meaning and life is not really going anywhere. You or me or anybody else does not matter in the end ..

    Like


  103. on September 29, 2009 at 6:14 am unlearning genius

    @Confused,

    It is really a shame when a man has to come by acting all tough and sooner than earlier reveal what a psychological weakling he really is.

    You are obviously missing the crux of the so called “asshole game”. It is dumb to call women irrational .. they have a fundamentally different game-plan in life … What game teaches is one viewpoint about women ..

    I agree that this alpha/beta dichotomy is simplified .. what gamers usually advocate is most certainly .. either high mating effort strategy or sneaky fuckerdom … but the point is .. in the current urban american milleuie this strategy seems to be positive EV! (or so the proponents say).

    This is basic game theory mate .. in a multi-player non-cooperative game (with cooperation possibilities).. many strategies and tactics co-evolve and co-exist …

    Like


  104. @ “genius”

    Listen moron…if it was all about “a signal to one’s mate value” (?) then you wouldn’t need to go to the moon or be a scientist or build cathedrals, you could live like a nigger in Togo and go around in a loin cloth, disembowel your enemies, and live in a pit. As our friends the Hottentots show, you don’t need so much as to float a log on the ocean to “signal to one’s mate value.” Except you don’t have the courage to live according to this, if you even believe it (which you don’t). You’re a moron.

    As for the second post it’s incoherent, get off the lithium, wipe the drool off the keyboard, and have it make sense.

    Like


  105. “I would never jeopardize that for some bimbo”

    What do you think you’re already doing? cheat if you want, but don’t lie to yourself about it not being a threat to your everyday life.

    “I do love my wife and she is the dearest person to me in this world.”

    Trite. Expressing drippy emotions is cheap. But don’t pay attention to what people say, pay attention to what they do. You kind of like your wife (may have talked yourself into thinking you ‘love’ her) but your attraction to bimbos is stronger and more and as time goes on, you’ll be less patient in waiting for opportunities and less discreet.

    “Gotta be a man, though, and do what men gotta do. ”

    More cheap rationalizations. Men do lots of things, you cheat because you like to cheat, admit it. Celebrate it. It’s who you are – an unfaithful husband.

    “I’m sure she’d understand if she found out (hope she never does, though)”

    Famous last words. If she finds out, she might well forgive you, but she’ll never respect you the same way again (though she might do a good job of pretending to spare your feelings).

    Like


  106. reading what stone has to say, it occurs to me that maybe, just maybe, one of the causes of modern female cuntiness was the discovery of men’s true nature and sexual desires.

    i am fairly sure at least middle class women and up were sheltered from the notion that the man who claims to love and honor you desperately wants to stick his weiner into everything he sees and will do it in a heartbeat the second your back is turned.

    now that women are fully aware of every aspect of male sexuality, what incentive do they really have to commit, honor, cherish, admire and be faithful? of course, this is just the converse of the PUAs understanding of unfettered female sexuality.

    maybe knowledge of true human nature precludes pair bonding for life?

    Like


  107. maybe knowledge of true human nature precludes pair bonding for life?

    or maybe it just reveals the adolescant version of love as the combination of naivete and hormonal surging that it really is.

    one of the ideas on this blog that i take umbrage with is the notion that it’s best to marry a younger and inexperienced woman becaue her love for you will be stronger. that will be true at first, but as time goes on and those feelings subside who knows what you’ll be left with.

    it’s true that many woman today seem to become unnecessarily bitter and cynical as they get older, but i’m not convinced they are the majority. and there is something to be said for a woman who has gained a little knowledge of self.

    Like


  108. cheating, for a married man, means actually having one (or more) permanent mistress and actually support her by paying her bills. If a man isn´t sacrificing his ability to generate resources, to fuck his wife or the education of children, casual sex with other women isn´t cheating. His wife will be better fucked because he will have more stamina and his work performance improves by the same reason

    for a married woman, cheating can be simply a longer than necessary eye contact with another man who´s alpha enough.

    Like


  109. JR said “it’s true that many woman today seem to become unnecessarily bitter and cynical as they get older, but i’m not convinced they are the majority. and there is something to be said for a woman who has gained a little knowledge of self.”

    Oh I liiiiike you! 🙂

    Like


  110. @Confused.

    Dude chill the fuck out.

    Listen moron…if it was all about “a signal to one’s mate value” (?) then you wouldn’t need to go to the moon or be a scientist or build cathedrals, you could live like a nigger in Togo and go around in a loin cloth, disembowel your enemies, and live in a pit. As our friends the Hottentots show, you don’t need so much as to float a log on the ocean to “signal to one’s mate value.” Except you don’t have the courage to live according to this, if you even believe it (which you don’t). You’re a moron.

    The theory is that most males (the betas) do not have the “disemboweling” abilities you suggest and therefore had to develop other ways of signalling their survival and replication value : co-operation with other beta males and building western civilisation was the way to go.

    Unfortunately, the skills and commitmemt that made western civilisation great are no longer valued by many women: hence asshole game and a return to “chav game” (like the disemboweling person you described).

    Like


  111. A major collapse will quickly put an end to chav/PUA game.

    In Post-Katrina anarchy, if you were to extend it for many months and with no outside interference… who will get more tail: smart redneck buddies with guns, or a stranded peacock/chav tourist?

    Like


  112. on September 29, 2009 at 10:43 am gunslingergregi

    ””””””’Stone,
    I’m sure she’d understand if she found out (hope she never does, though).””””””

    Over time this will more than likely fuck with your soul. To not be honest to the woman you love is weak. Or your personality can handle it either way I guess.

    Like


  113. It’s more a combination of re-acquired knowledge _and_ increased opportunity.

    Keeping middle/upper-class women ignorant of mens’ true sexual natures was a relatively late and short lived fenom. Probably it didn’t come into being until the industrial revolution and the invention of the child (as a source of parental investment with no expected return as opposed to an investment in increased labor and security in old age). The idea of women as delicate flowers who have to sheltered from life’s harsh realities _and_ the idea of the nuclear family trumping the extended family both are firmly products of the industrial revolution (in different ways).

    What’s different now is that previously women knew what horndogs men are but societal factors kept their nature in check. There’s not a lot of evidence that men have traditionally consciously understood womens’ drives (tho many did unconsciously).

    What’s unique now in the west is both sexes having a better and clearer idea of what the other is about _and_ both sides having chances to give in to their baseline evo-sexual-programming. For men that means as many new orifices penetrated as possible, for women that means access to the men that they’re truly attracted to (with a mealticket being a disposable option).

    Pair bonding is not out of the question, but a lot of comforting lies have to be left behind and the “life” thing might be one of them. There’s a lot of evidence that neither men nor women have ever been selected for lifelong pairbonds.

    Like


  114. on September 29, 2009 at 10:48 am gunslingergregi

    ”””””””””””””””’dana
    reading what stone has to say, it occurs to me that maybe, just maybe, one of the causes of modern female cuntiness was the discovery of men’s true nature and sexual desires.

    i am fairly sure at least middle class women and up were sheltered from the notion that the man who claims to love and honor you desperately wants to stick his weiner into everything he sees and will do it in a heartbeat the second your back is turned.

    now that women are fully aware of every aspect of male sexuality, what incentive do they really have to commit, honor, cherish, admire and be faithful? of course, this is just the converse of the PUAs understanding of unfettered female sexuality.

    maybe knowledge of true human nature precludes pair bonding for life?
    ””””””””””””””””””

    Why honesty is the only way to go in your dealings with people. Then you can have pairbonding for life as you make your own rules on what you life together entails. You get to be above the law with each other. You get to have an us against the world mentality and we will win.

    Like


  115. on September 29, 2009 at 10:49 am gunslingergregi

    Really you move beyond mere bonding and forge a fucking impenetrable wall of cuddly goodness he he he

    Like


  116. on September 29, 2009 at 10:51 am gunslingergregi

    Truth will set you free.

    Like


  117. Gig – I agree with your observation that cheating for men should be defined as something more than casual sex. Yeah, I fuck some random girl once in a while, so what – my family doesn’t suffer, my wife is none the wiser, I don’t blow my paycheck on it, I wear condoms… what’s the big deal?
    And no, it’s not about sticking it into some hole. Where I live it costs $20 to stick it in a hole – I don’t dig that (though I’ve tried it). It’s the seduction, it’s the chase, it’s the novelty… it’s the game, in one word.

    Like


  118. RE: Building cathedrals and being a special snowflake.

    True, none of us are truly special in the aggregate. However, every man can have a mission, he can pursue the things HE wants in life and not subordinate those drives to a woman. On of the central aspects of game is the self-confidence that comes from knowing you *always have something to do* that is beyond what she can offer – be it starting your business, running a marathon or just being the best at hour job. Women are drawn to your passion, just as other men are inspired by it.

    The Choice, as Obsidian says, is the most important thing. Women are transitory but your mission will bring true meaning to your life. I think this is what we’re missing in Stone’s story. If cheating is central to his life, if it is his mission, then yeah that’s pretty empty and sad. If it’s just a distraction, as he says, then it’s outside the mission. His wife should be drawn to the mission that makes him alpha. Everything else is just downtime.

    Like


  119. @JB getting back to you on the BEta bait thing .. so its an attempt to incite beta baheavior in men ?

    well i do that quite often actually … im not saying that its untrue but i usually don’tthink of it that way .. i do it just to get them to open up or tell me how they feel. i mean if i say i miss a guy in this sort of vulnerable way doesnt that make me the equivalent of a beta in a girl way ?
    or why does it have to be that i have the upper hand if im being just as open with him about how i feel ?

    still i never thought about it in this way . it’s pretty interesting

    Like


  120. on September 29, 2009 at 12:16 pm Marcus Aureliette

    cheating, for a married man, means actually having one (or more) permanent mistress and actually support her by paying her bills.

    Cheating, for a traditionally-married person of either sex, means sleeping with someone who isn’t their spouse.

    If you say vows which include the “forsaking all other until death do you part” part, and you sleep with someone else? You’re cheating.

    Now, if you work out some kind of alternate arrangement up front, then of course that’s a different story…but you both have to be on the same page, whatever you decide. If she signed on for monogamy and is under the impression that you did too because you didn’t tell her otherwise, and you go out and get some on the side? You’re a no-good, dirty, rotten cheater.

    Rationalize it all you want, but that’s what you’re doing.

    Like


  121. Pupu

    Pupu wonders whether it is much easier and more natural to run the a-hole game when the guy is not that into the girl.

    while 10’s still can give me a shiver,
    i have no prob assholing 9s and below

    Like


  122. Roman Polanski – Alpha of the month? He has the “culture”ocracy, a gaggle of “feminists” as well as the French and Polish governments out in force defending his basic human right to a little 13-year-old-rape-n’-sodomy. And the victim seems to have been A-ok with the whole thing. If that isn’t alpha, then what is?

    Like


  123. ____________
    I’m sure she’d understand if she found out (hope she never does, though).
    __________________

    Stoned,

    Yeah, you better hope she never does. From a normal female perspective, the only compelling reason for your wife to tolerate such behavior after finding out would be the powerful urge not to break up the family for your children’s sake. I really can think of no other reason. As a sexually conservative female (one partner only-yes that counts blow jobs, hand jobs, fingers (minus the doctors/nurse exams during pregnancy), etc. and no Roissy, you don’t need to double that # either), a cheating spouse would evoke one of two reactions from me: (1) I’d consider prostitution because, hey at least I’d be getting financially compensated for feeling like a used whore or (2) I’d walk on the 18th birthday of youngest, possibly sooner.
    And really,without a drug addiction option 1 wouldn’t really be realistic for me, and then I’d chew up all my profits with my newfound habit. So, I’m left with option 2, no room for negotiating.

    There is no f**k*n way I would allow the irresponsible actions of my life partner make me feel like a cheap whore. If I wanted to feel like a tramp, I could accomplish that task with my own actions, I don’t need someone else to do it for me.

    Hope your wife doesn’t find out, but consider for a second how hurt she’d be if she did find out.

    Like


  124. Firepower,

    Are you
    Supporting
    Pupu’s statement
    Subtlely?

    Like


  125. “Pupu wonders whether it is much easier and more natural to run the a-hole game when the guy is not that into the girl.”

    I find a good technique of dealing with attractive women is to imagine they have done something horrible in their past, like borrowing $10,000 from an ex-boyfriend and not paying it back or giving head to a guy with spray-on tan. Once, I get that image in my head then its much easier to be aloof and assertive. And it has the side effect of occasionally being correct.

    Like


  126. Anon, another way to look at it is that the fact that he could shag 20 women and still come home to you means that you are indeed the wife and not the whore.

    The problem would be that you’re a wifely type who is wasting her life with a sociopath, in the case of the casual as opposed to passionate cheater.

    It’s not wrong to be a sociopath or to date or marry one…just that if you are, you should not think that you’re going to somehow be special. You and everyone else in their lives serve a practical purpose. You fill the wife slot, and the women he cheats with fill the entertainment slot. So long as everybody stays in their place and minds their own business, everything is fine in the mind of the psycho.

    Roissy just basically got tooled into facilitating a psychopath’s bragging. It’s not the end of the world. He should just be careful about that in the future, and consider whether someone who is married to a hot 24 year old, and consistently gaming other hot women for casual sex really needs his advice, or is just looking for someone to laud his sociopathic exploits as heroism.

    Like


  127. Stone – “I cannot afford to waste a night by going thru the moves that Riff Dog suggested, because a flake is still very likely and it’s 3am – then you bite yourself for not having been more aggressive.”

    I hear you on that. I’m generally not in places where I can move on to the next prospect so easily (I’m in my 40’s, so singles bars aren’t really an option.) So I’m more willing to spend some time maximizing my odds with whatever girl I’ve decided looks promising.

    By the way, I love your line, “To those who don’t understand how I could cheat when I have a quality woman at home, I can only say wait and see, brothers.” So true. The people who are judgmental on this are invariably in their teens or twenties.

    Like


  128. Riff, I’m almost 40, and I have had a boyfriend who was technically married (separated) for awhile. I can understand why many married men leave, and why many don’t leave but cheat.

    It’s not the cheating itself that makes a guy a lowlife. It’s the lowlifedness that makes them a lowlife, and cheating is just par for the course.

    A non scumsucker may cheat, but he’s doing it for entirely different reasons than the lowlife. He isn’t thinking like a robot, “Must…shag…9’s and 10’s…mbeep.” A basically decent person engages in bad behavior because at the moment it’s expedient and perhaps staving off the commission of a greater evil.

    They also do it from time to time as a brief walk on the wild side. It often teaches them something…maybe that they don’t need to be in their current commitment, or maybe that there is nothing out there better for them than who they have at home. Non lowlives learn from their experiences, successes, and mistakes.

    Harmful sociopaths who aren’t aware and purposefully channelling their tendencies into something positive, and other brands of evil folk, do not learn…not even from their successes. They are stuck in a kind of destructive autopilot.

    So I’m not overly judgmental of cheaters…any more than I am of thieves anyway. People steal and defraud others for a variety of reasons, and so long as nobody dies from it, everybody has a chance to learn or heal. Just that some people steal because they’re hungry, and some people steal because they enjoy it.

    People who steal, defraud, and cheat others because they enjoy it have no sympathy from me.

    Like


  129. Dana

    That men want, in their hind brains, to wet their dicks in a multitude of warm places is not a new idea or an insuperable problem for monogamy. The guy merely needs to exert enough self control to not do so, at least not every day.
    He still wants to do his wife and will not want to leave her unless she really pisses him off. He still desires his wife, in other words, despite his other nature.
    That women, in their hind brains are wired to never want gina-tingling sex with the type of man they are likely to marry is something newer and much more problematic for monogamy. I mean, very few guys would make a life commitment to a woman they believed was just faking a sexual attraction to him.
    IOWs, in the average marriage scheme, she cannot desire him and never will, because of her nature.
    By self control,she might not fuck around with guys she does desire but that per se does not leave desire for Mr. Average Beta Husband.
    This is truly, maddly, deeply, insuperably incompatible with monogamy. – for most guys these days regardless of how well they might control their own wayward instincts.

    Like


  130. Felix

    However, every man can have a mission, he can pursue the things HE wants in life and not subordinate those drives to a woman

    And what if what a man wants in life is women?

    But that’s not allowed in your philosophy. You call such pleasures and persuits empty. Empty by definition.

    I don’t. I call your philosophy empty.

    Like


  131. Rum, the idea of the beta husband is weird to me. The moment the guy becomes the male head of the basic social grouping that is a family, he is the alpha of that family…if he chooses to be anyway.

    There is no good reason for marriage to beta-ize a guy. It ought to be viewed as a promotion to legal alpha status. What happened to that?

    Like


  132. Yeah, I fuck some random girl once in a while, so what – my family doesn’t suffer, my wife is none the wiser, I don’t blow my paycheck on it, I wear condoms

    perfect

    by the distorted logic of women, the effort to hide plus the appearance that cheating is not happening added with the (male) capability of banging other chicks are all together the equivalent of faithfullness

    ought of respect for your wife every effort should be taken to hide it. Divorces due to male infidelity happen when the wife reached such a low sex market value that the guy stops making an effort to hide the mistress. this is the risk you run, stone,

    Like


  133. @ Rum and Ghost of Nicole

    This is an interesting discussion.

    I think there is nothing inherently beta about a husband in a marriage, so long as he wears the pants and is the primary one to bring home the bacon. In general terms, if a man is going to be married then it’s his obligation to keep his wife happy by being dominant, providing, and being there; just as it’s her obligation to keep him happy by being nurturing, attractive and available sexually. It’s a tall order for either to fill if the other isn’t living up to their responsibilities.

    Some percentage of married alphas/super alphas may stray no matter what, but far less male infidelity would occur if women kept up their end of the bargain as wives. It’s just a fact of life that men need not only sex but affection and validation. If the wife isn’t providing it for whatever reason then a husband will be tempted or driven to find it elsewhere.

    A wife can easily keep her husband’s attention by continuing to behave like a girlfriend throughout the marriage.

    Like


  134. @Ghost of Nicole et.al.

    This is the dilemma modern women face:
    – be a man you really like, and sometimes be hurt by his asshole side, or
    – be with a beta who would never hurt you, and never experience the gina tingle

    Up to you.

    Like


  135. @ stone

    just keep in mind that if you are capable of banging 20 year olds at 30, you will be able to bang 35 year olds at 50, and probably even younger women. As your wife ages and your children pass puberty, the probability of you divorcing will tend to 100%

    Like


  136. tinderbox

    ….far less male infidelity would occur if women kept up their end of the bargain as wives.

    Far less infidelity would occur if people in general decided to be honest about being “unfaithful”. At least if you’re honest you can actually look someone in the EYE. What is that worth? Everything.

    Like


  137. @hypothecary

    But that sort of defeats the purpose of people who want to have affairs, doesn’t it? They want their cake and eat it too. Keep their marriage going for whatever reason, and have the honey quietly on the side to fill whatever is missing from the marriage. They probably wouldn’t want to be with the girlfriend permanently. Being honest about the affair would ruin the marriage instantly and defeat the purpose.

    Like


  138. Tinderbox hyphotheised “A wife can easily keep her husband’s attention by continuing to behave like a girlfriend throughout the marriage.”

    I doubt it.

    People fall out of love. It’s built right into the human condition. It isn’t a matter of fault.

    Like


  139. Once again, Felix, I challenge your notion of meaning.

    Performance art.

    Surfing.

    Bowling.

    A flow moment.

    “Be here now”

    The sun will consume the earth.

    Time itself is finite.

    Your theory of meaning is meaningless.

    Like


  140. That’s true, but acting like a bitchy harpie in a marriage will kill a man’s love a lot faster than being sweet and continuing to act like his girlfriend.

    Like