No Such Thing As Unconditional Love

As I wrote in one of my “Ugly Truths” posts, unconditional love is a happy fantasy sentimental people want desperately to believe because they think it sullies love to have it debased by the reality of conditions placed upon it, as if love, oh wondrous exalted love, could be just another business transaction in the sprawling biological bazaar of human mating. I helpfully cleared up the issue for them:

There is no such thing as unconditional love. If a girl gains 50 pounds her boyfriend will fall out of love with her. If a guy loses his job and drifts into months of unemployed depression his girlfriend will fall out of love with him. Thinking clearly on this will give you the best chance to find real love.

I used to think that the only example of what could conventionally be regarded as “unconditional love” in the natural state was a mother’s love for her child. Well, piss all over another pretty lie, because yet again one of my maxims has been further buttressed by the imprimatur of science: Women More Likely Than Men to Reject Unattractive Babies.

The differences between men and women in motivational effort to extend or shorten the viewing time of abnormal-looking babies “may reflect an evolutionary-derived need for diversion of limited resources to the nurturance of healthy offspring,” the paper concludes.

The findings question the concept of unconditional parental love, at least among women. “What our results suggest is that this is determined by facial attractiveness,” said Rinah Yamamoto, first author and a research fellow in psychiatry. “Women may be more sensitized to aesthetic defects and may be more prone to reject unattractive kids. Men do not appear to be as motivated. They didn’t expend the same effort.”

Do mothers love their babies unconditionally? Not if the kid isn’t cute. Throw another wrench into the gears of the platitude spouting mental machinery of the mediocre masses. It’s grimy Dirt and DNA all the way down.





Comments


  1. “Do mothers love their babies unconditionally? Not if the kid isn’t cute.”

    This explains the large number of girls I know (unfortunately) that say they’d rather have an autistic child than an ugly child.

    Only one said that she’d rather have the ugly child, “because maybe the kid will grow into it.”

    Fail.

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  2. “Dammit, I knew I shouldn’t have given that beta access to my box! Oh well, I’ll pull the plug on this unattractive brat and try again with an alpha.”

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  3. This is obvious. Why do you think natural selection has resulted in nearly all babies looking cute? I bet pre-historic moms shucked the fugly ones.

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  4. @Abe:

    Didn’t the Spartans and Athenians practice eugenics through infanticide?

    Deformed children would not survive in those societies, end of.

    Even Plato advocated that reproduction should be controlled by the state to create the healthiest offspring.

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  5. An ex initiated the dreaded “Where Is Our Relationship Heading” convo with me. The gist was, she wanted me to declare unconditional love for her, as she did me. This, coincidentally, after the Past Relationship Score in which I gleefully recalled my notches of strippers.

    I told her I believed in no such thing.

    She pouted and sulked as she did so well.

    We had hot pair-bonding renewal sex many times that night.

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  6. Again, tru dat. Only the young, naive, or perniciously disengenuous attempts to argue otherwise.

    I believe this may have some bearing on the drawing and quartering Sarah Palin received by quite a number of prominent Women during the campaign-as we all know, she chose to go through w/a Down’s Syndrome pregnancy, which produces, well, less than attractive babies. I am given to understand that Women are much more likely to abort if the baby is proven to have deformities (ie, will be ugly). Hmm.

    Anyway, once again I find myself agreeing w/Roissy-and once again I note w/bemused interest, the irony between his Godless worldview, and the obvious theological implications of same.

    Deep.

    O

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  7. As far as in-family dynamics go, for some reason nothing rivals the hate between a mother and an adult daughter who don’t see eye to eye.

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  8. on August 3, 2009 at 12:58 pm DCDistraction

    We can still try.

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  9. on August 3, 2009 at 1:00 pm Backdoor Man

    Years ago, I read “Death Without Weeping,” by Nancy Scheper-Hughes, a prominent anthropologist. She showed that because of high rates of infant mortality in northeast Brazil, poor mothers did not form strong attachments to their children until the latter had reached a certain age.

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  10. Wow, that makes the expression “a face only a mother could love” even more depressing. What do you do if you’re so ugly even your mom runs screaming?

    Another thing I hate is “I will love you forever.” An ex used to say this to me, and all I could think was: Even if I get a sex change? Even if I cheat with your best friend? Even if I gain 100kg and stop bathing? It’s a phrase that needs to be retired, since it’s a naive assumption at best and a bold faced lie at worst.

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  11. kalli0pe pondered:

    What do you do if you’re so ugly even your mom runs screaming?

    Run for a New York Senate seat

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  12. This study doesn’t address unconditional love at all, as it has men and women looking at photos of children they don’t know. To study unconditional love, you’d have to examine women’s feelings toward their own children.

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  13. Kalliope,
    You might want to read up on your Greek mythology. One of the most famed Centaurs was abandoned by his mother at birth because of what she considered his grotesque form. It’s certainly nothing new.

    The simple truth of the matter, going to your other point wrt your ex boyfriend, is that love takes work-and most people don’t want to work that hard. It is a conscious and courageous choice, and requires a tremendous degree of maturity, sacrifice and selflessness that sad to say, most of us don’t have.

    O

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  14. I think “unconditional love,” conventionally understood, allows that one actor may have to first live up to some preliminary conditions, after which that actor will be granted “unconditional love” from the sought after counterpart. Which is to say that, granted you meet the condition of not being born hideous, your mother will love you no matter how low you sink afterwards—-even if you become hideous or deformed later in life.

    This is the nature of the concept in male-female romantic relationships, or same sex friendships too, I think. You prove your worth/demonstrate your value to a person in various ways, and through this “earn” the promise from them that they will thereafter love you even if you completely contradict the value you had previously established.

    Now, while I strongly believe that unconditional love can’t exist in romance or friendship, I do believe it is possible between parent and offspring. And, even though it is somewhat paradoxical that “unconditional love” requires the passing of preliminary conditions, I still think the concept is coherent, and thus, the study you’ve cited doesn’t completely rule it out as a realistic possibility.

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  15. Interesting you post this now. Just yesterday I was telling my younger cousin that if he wants to marry his girlfriend he’d better learn to start thinking of marriage as a business contract, because “love” comes and goes like the weather.

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  16. First, off I agree with your main idea here. But I don’t think the study you cite in this post really says much. I don’t trust these types of studies to begin…you really can get them to say anything…and also there is too much confusion between appearance and parental love here. Considering parents (hopefully) are not really sexually attracted to their children, parental opinions on appearance can be all sorts of skewed. There is just way too much room for confusion in this date to really make any sort of conclusion at all.

    HOWEVER, one gem I want to point out: “… If a guy loses his job and drifts into months of unemployed depression his girlfriend will fall out of love with him.” You NAIL IT, NAIL IT, NAIL IT by including “depression.” What so many bitchy-I’m-superficial-and-proud-wanna-be-gold-diggers do not get is attitude is everything. An unemployed dude can swoop some good action and certainly maintian his current girls…IF AND ONLY IF he has the right attitude and KNOWS WHEN TO LIE!!!

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  17. Unfortunately, beta males and women desperately WANT to believe in true love. Beta males want to believe because they can’t confront the reality that they could be dropped in a New York minute for the bigger, better deal. Women want to believe in true love because need the reassurance that they didn’t waste their youth and beauty on: (1) alpha males who had no intention of marrying them, or (2) beta males when they could have had alpha males if their game was better.

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  18. Madras – you’re right about the unemployed dude being able to operate, as long as he characterizes his unemployment in a POSITIVE light (just look at Roosh). He can be on a quest to “find” himself, pursue more meaningful work, etc…. All of which offer much deeper meaning than the average paper-pusher job most women seem to have these days.

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  19. @JGatz- well said. “true love” is often a cover, a powerful justifier for behaviors and an emotional salve for illusions that will ultimately fall away.

    i still think it’s possible for well-matched people who grow together, share life’s expereinces, and stick with each other through ups and downs, to have something like unconditional love.

    i’m reminded of the devlin link tha roissy posted a few weeks ago, to the long, crabby and somewhat brilliant article about female cosmo-style behavior. there was a bit in there about an old woman who came every day to a nursing home to care for her 80-something WWII vet husband who couldn’t feed himself. *that’s* love, he asserted. not the shallower things that get tossed around as such in the pop culture; infatuation, lust, companionship, diversion, etc.

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  20. Take it one step further and say that there is no such as love. It is just a word attached to a chemical reaction. Only mortals believe in emotional bs. Sadness, happiness, fear and love everything is just chemical reaction there is no magic or mystery behind it.

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  21. SD is 100% right. Rather surprised that proponents of the almighty “giney-tingle” would ignore the element that post-natal hormones play in getting women to bond with their children. The women in the study are looking at pictures of children to whom they have zero emotional attachment. Many people would have to think quite hard before getting into a relationship with someone physically disabled, whereas committed partners often choose to stay with and support a significant other who has been felled by infirmity or accident.

    This is not to say that unconditional love rules the day in every case (unconditional crazy can be a very powerful force, for instance), but the conclusions they’re trying to draw overreach the structure of the experiment. Especially considering that the sample size seems quite small, “including” only 14 healthy women. I’d imagine that some of you swoop more ladies than than in a given fortnight.

    [editor: it is a widely observed phenomenon that mothers of multiple children love one child more than the others. if a mother’s love for her children is unconditional, then she would love all equally. but instead we often see that one child is loved less because that child meets fewer conditions for inspiring the mother’s fullness of her love. in evolutionary terms, mommy is putting her capital seed money where it can return the most on investment.]

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  22. on August 3, 2009 at 2:28 pm russell rodriguez

    hi roissy, i have a question, what do you do when your girlfriend wants holds my hand when outside? it doesnt really feel much alpha to me and i dont really want to, but she gets mad whenever i dont because it makes her feel that i dont like her, so please help roissy, thanks friend.

    [editor: there’s nothing beta about holding your girl’s hand in public, as long as you do it the right way. one, always keep your hand in front of hers. two, drop her hand when walking through crowded sidewalk areas. no one likes that guy who can’t let go of his girl’s hand for two seconds to navigate a crowd. three, if you do navigate a crowd while holding her hand, the best way to do it is by pulling her along behind you, leading her through the obstacles. now, if you don’t like holding hands, you have two options: you can hold her hand for brief half minute intervals, followed by dropping her hand and walking side by side for much longer periods of time. these short intervals will satisfy her need for hand holding. your other option is to substitute arm over her shoulder, or arm around her waist, for hand holding. this has the advantage of being a more dominant alpha intimacy gesture than handholding.]

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  23. Sorry Roissy,

    You know how I like scientific studies and I’ve gotta say the conclusion doesn’t follow from the facts.

    Its long been known women would rather look at more attractive people. All this study proves is that principle applies to babes as well.

    A selling point of game is looks aren’t the most important thing, if you’ve other things to offer. Similarly women will love their own children despite deformities.

    Now that article cites another study which would appear to better support your thesis, but I can’t access it without a subscription.
    The validity of such choice is supported by a prospective survey of 1,450 children born with defects that revealed the decisive role played by esthetic appearance in motivation to care for children [10]. In that study, almost 70% of abandoned children carried a conspicuous appearance flaw that was neither life threatening nor did it affect intellectual development: only 7% of the abandoned children had a serious internal organ (e.g., heart and kidneys) disease. Additionally, the non-abandoned babies with an appearance flaw were commonly abused and isolated from their siblings by the caregivers

    So cite that study and not the one you linked.

    You’re supposed to have the raven-vision that pierces the veils of lies around subjects like these.

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  24. Weiss M (1994) Conditional love: parents’ attitudes toward handicapped children. Westport, CT: Bergin & Garvey.

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  25. this is very true . i tell people this constantly .. unconditional does not exist . it can exist as an emotion to some extent .
    but it is never the real truth . you may get carried away and think i will love this person deeply forever no matter what but that’s a lie,
    the sooner we all embrace it we can be on our way to having the most romantic love that we CAN have.

    i agree completely

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  26. it is a widely observed phenomenon that mothers of multiple children love one child more than the others.

    As she was being led away, the little girl in Sophie’s Choice cried, “Mom always liked you best!”

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  27. Russel – it’s OK to hold hands unless maybe it’s seen as Beta in your Latin American culture.

    If you hold hands, remember two things: (1) let your palm and wrist be in front of hers and (2) she will test you by pulling you in some direction, for example as you approach a lamp post and you need to walk around it; make sure you lead the way rather than being pulled by her.

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  28. I knew a guy who was sick of his clingy girlfriend and didn’t want to hold hands with her. One time they were walking through the mall and she tried to take his hand. So he made a fist and she kept holding his fist as they walked.

    Being with them, I thought it was the funniest thing I had ever seen.

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  29. Also, when the article brings up the study’s supposed relationship to unconditional love, that relationship is apparently the reporter’s opinion, not the scientist’s. This study doesn’t seem to even attempt to draw conclusions about unconditional love.

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  30. editor: it is a widely observed phenomenon that mothers of multiple children love one child more than the others. if a mother’s love for her children is unconditional, then she would love all equally. but instead we often see that one child is loved less because that child meets fewer conditions for inspiring the mother’s fullness of her love. in evolutionary terms, mommy is putting her capital seed money where it can return the most on investment.

    Is that “nature” (evolutionary), or “nurture” (cultural/specific to that familial unit), though? It’s easy to imagine that some individuals are more likely to “click” than others — some children may feel that Mommy or Daddy loves their brother or sister best simply because their sibling has more in common with that parent, or because the parent had more resources at that point to be able to connect with that child. (I’m thinking of the common birth order tropes, in which the eldest child often develops more confidence and verbal facility because of that time spent one-on-one with the parents.)

    In any case, it’s entirely possible for a parent to have different relationships with different children, while still *loving* them all.

    Also — interesting that you correlate evolutionary fitness to love and attention. Most siblings of sick children, whether something life-threatening like leukemia or an ongoing issue like Asperger’s, work through jealousy related to the disparity in attention that their ill sib got from the parents. The time, resources, and attention spent there have little to do with evolutionary fitness, nor would the parents likely say that they *loved* the sick kid more than its well siblings.

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  31. Are there any studies that show that “women are good communicators” is false?

    It is a commonly held belief, but I have never met a woman that is a good communicator.

    They are good at manipulating and lying, but not say, telling someone what they actually think.

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  32. on August 3, 2009 at 3:02 pm mandy been here a while

    lovelace

    “Is that “nature” (evolutionary), or “nurture” (cultural/specific to that familial unit), though? “

    Nature.

    Each child is uniquely different from their siblings in many ways(well to parents though strangers may not notice.) It is simply not humanly possible to feel exactly the same way about them nor treat them exactly the same. Unequal means some will be loved more or less regardless of a desire for ultimate fairness on the part of the parents.

    This has nothing to do with conditioning or culture. Human beings are each unique so our responses to one another are unique.

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  33. Women are more likely to reject ugly babies? Did they compare the attractiveness of babies in hospital drop off bins with that of babies in prams?

    Reading the article, I have some doubts about how the study was conducted; the sample size is only 13 men and 14 women. How varied were these samples? Since the research hospital is affiliated to Harvard, its probably near the university — what manner of men and women do you think such a facility is likely to attract?

    One might argue that women are more aesthetically-critical than men (not saying if I disagree or agree), but I do not think the results of this study could be extrapolated to the degree you are presenting, Roissy. If a woman rejects a baby on looks, it really speaks more about her as a person and/or a mother than it does about her as a female.

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  34. Close to every single thing in life is bullshit/a distraction from the ultimate demise (death).

    The only thing i would have to say is true, would have to be what people call “true love.”

    as far as unconditional love is concerned, its not too true. where i used to work at. this guys mother never cared for him. the guy was even homeless for a while until his aunt took him in, in some house she had as rent. she never even bothered to speak to him ever again. its a pretty long story, but that’ll do. since commenters will start to revolt on long posts.

    nonetheless thought provoking shit right here.

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  35. on August 3, 2009 at 3:13 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    It is a commonly held belief, but I have never met a woman that is a good communicator.

    They are good at manipulating and lying, but not say, telling someone what they actually think.

    This is true, but it’s only true in the “shouting on different planes” sense.

    Women, for the most part, aren’t good at communicating in a male style (“telling someone what they actually think”).

    Men, for the most part, aren’t good at communicating in a female style, either.

    The latter is why Game was formalized into the scientific discipline that it is currently becoming.

    In any case, you should realize that MOST women who are good at “telling someone what they actually think” are high-T type-A corporate type chicks. Not the type with whom you’d really want a relationship.

    On the other hand, nerdy girls are a nice exception. Nerdy girls are the ONLY girls who can communicate effectively on a male level without being too driven, bossy, or non-stop-shit-testing-wannabe-dominant-but-not-really.

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  36. There may not be such a thing as unconditional love, but there is definitely such a thing as insanely persistent love.

    As Chief said, it’s a chemical reaction…but what a wonderful one it is. Once it has happened under certain conditions, it can last for life, and even through terror, rejection, betrayal, and all manner of tragedy.

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  37. mandy with tenure:

    Each child is uniquely different from their siblings in many ways (well to parents though strangers may not notice.) It is simply not humanly possible to feel exactly the same way about them nor treat them exactly the same.

    Co-signed!

    Unequal means some will be loved more or less regardless of a desire for ultimate fairness on the part of the parents.

    This loving “more” or “less” is where things become quite strange though. Is the ne’er-do-well daughter whose parents *always* bail her ass out of the fire financially and agonize over their tumultuous relationship loved “more” or “less” than the daughter who really gets to have a meaningful adult relationship with Mom and Dad? Does Dad love his youngest son more because he was the kid’s primary caregiver during a period of unemployment and therefore was more hands-on with the kid?

    Parents will love their kids in different ways; this is unquestionable. But I think it’s rather difficult in most cases to quantify who loves who “more.”

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  38. on August 3, 2009 at 3:22 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    Speaking of scientific disciplines, this is off-topic but will be of immense interest to the crowd here. I’m sure at least Doug has seen it and has plenty to say.

    The clock is ticking for American science, because the PC establishment’s next mandate will be to apply Title IX to math and science.
    See here.

    For anyone who doesn’t know what Title IX is, this basically means that it’s a very real possibility that university math and science departments (and other areas in which groundbreaking science is done) will soon be FORCED to be 50% female.

    Anyone who has ever actually met any scientists, and is thus familiar with the HUGE disparity between the numbers of men and women inclined to scientific pursuits, knows exactly what this will mean.

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  39. on August 3, 2009 at 3:25 pm mandy been here a while

    I suppose it depends on how you want to define love, lovelace. Is it the internal feeling or the outward expression or a combination?

    I personally believe the outward expression since that is all kids experience of their parents love. SO, in that case some get more and some get less.

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  40. Why do we all keep taking advice from this guy? I mean have any of you seen Roissy in person? The image of an Icelandic dwarf comes to my mind. I think we’ve all been conned.

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  41. Roissy,

    while I do agree with you on the conditionality of love, I think you believe “scientists” too much. They are also human and willing to lie, cheat and scam.

    Belief in evo-psych is the 21st century equivalent of believing in eugenics. Just like evo-psych, eugenics looked like a good idea and had a lot of “research” and “famous scientists” behind it. Reality had different plans.

    Eugenics believed that-

    Jews were mentally inferior (this particular belief is quite funny, because it is obvious who the inferior uncreative types are)

    Asians were mentally inferior cowards (somehow the American experience in ww2 changed that one real fast)

    Blacks were not capable of competing with whites in intellectually demanding sports such as heavy weight boxing and basketball (this one is funny on so many levels)

    Just like evo-psych today “scientists” produced reams of “data” to justify their widely accepted conclusions.

    How did that work out?

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  42. on August 3, 2009 at 3:41 pm Willard Libby

    PA

    I knew a guy who was sick of his clingy girlfriend and didn’t want to hold hands with her. One time they were walking through the mall and she tried to take his hand. So he made a fist and she kept holding his fist as they walked.

    Come on, it was Mother’s Day. She gave birth to you. The least you can do is let her hold your hand when you take her to the mall.

    Stop trying to act all tough and independent.

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  43. @epoxy- terrifying. obama’s base is paleolib, who seem to think nothing of wrecking academic science and engineering to make a social-engineering point. the military resisted this successfully in teh cliton years – i don’t think academicians have the stones to resist, though, because they think the same way and are indeed the source of the wrongheaded thinking.

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  44. On women and ratings:
    I have never ever had a women ask me where she or one of her friends falls on the scale.

    Most women know that the scale exists- yet none have asked me for a rating on even their worst enemies.

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  45. on August 3, 2009 at 3:46 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    Belief in evo-psych is the 21st century equivalent of believing in eugenics

    As the proponent of this analogy, you can surely come up with a list of patently false evo-psych claims. A list of similar length to that list of eugenicists’ claims.
    Right? Can’t you?

    Go ahead please.

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  46. on August 3, 2009 at 3:47 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    That last one is @lucifer

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  47. on August 3, 2009 at 3:48 pm Willard Libby

    Lucifer

    Belief in evo-psych is the 21st century equivalent of believing in eugenics.

    You really are unrelentingly stupid.

    Eugenics believed that-

    Jews were mentally inferior (this particular belief is quite funny, because it is obvious who the inferior uncreative types are)

    Jews have always been sympathetic to eugenics in one form or another.

    Asians were mentally inferior cowards (somehow the American experience in ww2 changed that one real fast)

    WWII? You mean when the US crushed the entire Japanese military and became the first and only foreign power to occupy and control their entire country

    Blacks were not capable of competing with whites in intellectually demanding sports such as heavy weight boxing and basketball (this one is funny on so many levels)

    Boxing and basketball as “intellectually demanding”? Chess maybe. Whole lot of black chess champions, right?

    How did that work out?

    The science of human nature is working out pretty well despite obscurantist lies from the religious right and the political left.

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  48. @lucifer – evo-psych is nothing like the eugenics of the 1920s. as a discipline it’s in its infancy. and i agree that it superfically may be subject to same flaws, placing a veneer of pseudoscience over racial or social prejudices. but if you look deeper, there’s a lot more behind it, and evolutionary science and psychology themselves are both immeasurably more advanced than they were in the heyday of eugenics.

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  49. Happy as peaches that you found this post and reported on it.

    Roissy, you have a doctorate at my 1 man University of Self.

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  50. on August 3, 2009 at 3:49 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ game in bk

    I have never ever had a women ask me where she or one of her friends falls on the scale.

    Because they don’t have to.

    You can tell that women have a very deep implicit understanding of The Scale, just by noting which women they feel a threat from or a rivalry with, and which they don’t.

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  51. Look at the sample size of the study that roissy refers to.

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  52. on August 3, 2009 at 3:55 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    i agree that it superfically may be subject to same flaws, placing a veneer of pseudoscience over racial or social prejudices.

    Well, sure. But the problem is that our establishment thinks that “pointing out legitimately objective differences” and “justifying prejudice” are the same thing.

    Look at what happened to Larry Summers.
    And, contrary to what most people think – probably even what most people on this board think – Summers didn’t even state [the obvious fact] that men simply outnumber women at the right hand of the STEM bell curve. All he said is that we should be able to have the discussion about whether they do. That’s all he said.

    This is why it is extremely unlikely that evo-psych, evo-bio, or evo-anything will gain much traction in today’s universities (ground 0 for PC nonsense). Unless the relevant findings are buried by clever iconoclasts as footnotes in seemingly innocuous papers about seemingly innocuous subjects.

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  53. rand on “unconditional” or “selfless” modern love:

    “To love is to value. The man who tells you that it is possible to value without values, to love those whom you appraise as worthless, is the man who tells you that it is possible to grow rich by consuming without producing and that paper money is as valuable as gold . . . . When it comes to love, the highest of emotions, you permit them to shriek at you accusingly that you are a moral delinquent if you’re incapable of feeling causeless love. When a man feels fear without reason, you call him to the attention of a psychiatrist; you are not so careful to protect the meaning, the nature and the dignity of love.

    Love is the expression of one’s values, the greatest reward you can earn for the moral qualities you have achieved in your character and person, the emotional price paid by one man for the joy he receives from the virtues of another. Your morality demands that you divorce your love from values and hand it down to any vagrant, not as response to his worth, but as response to his need, not as reward, but as alms, not as a payment for virtues, but as a blank check on vices. Your morality tells you that the purpose of love is to set you free of the bonds of morality, that love is superior to moral judgment, that true love transcends, forgives and survives every manner of evil in its object, and the greater the love the greater the depravity it permits to the loved. To love a man for his virtues is paltry and human, it tells you; to love him for his flaws is divine. To love those who are worthy of it is self-interest; to love the unworthy is sacrifice. You owe your love to those who don’t deserve it, and the less they deserve it, the more love you owe them—the more loathsome the object, the nobler your love—the more unfastidious your love, the greater your virtue—and if you can bring your soul to the state of a dump heap that welcomes anything on equal terms, if you can cease to value moral values, you have achieved the state of moral perfection.”

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  54. @epoxy, willard- a simutaneous triple-team. awesome.

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  55. on August 3, 2009 at 3:59 pm mandy been here a while

    “Unless the relevant findings are buried by clever iconoclasts as footnotes in seemingly innocuous papers about seemingly innocuous subjects.”

    Interesting. Just like Diderot’s Encylopedie?

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  56. Willard,
    Actually, there’s a reason why they call Boxing *The Sweet Science*, and only one who is ignorant about Basketball would suggest there is nothing intellectual about it.

    Sailer has written about African American strengths in these areas, and has even cited Thomas Sowell (btw, still waiting for your reply about your claim that most Black Men who are successful are lighter skinned-I offered an extensive listing of very dark and African featured Black Men, Sowell and Clarence Thomas among them, to counter your claim-your reply?) who spoke about the necessity to make a series of decisions very quickly and often in random combinations, let alone the ability to improvise, something else African Americans have a clear knack for (Hip Hop, Jazz, for example).

    This lends itself to boxing, where again, the ability to throw combinations of punches becomes very important. It is no accident that Blacks have dominated the sport since Jack Johnson.

    All of this, btw, lends creedance to the basic premise of Evolutionary theory and by extension, Human Bio-Diversity, aka HBD. That human beings, as a result of thousands of years of interacting with the differing locales on the Earth, developed a series of adaptations to contend w/said varied environments. Clearly, African Americans have evo-adaptations that lend themselves to improvisation, quick, on the fly decision making, and numerous physical gifts as well. Among other things.

    Lastly, while there are no national chess champions who are Black that I can recount off the top of my head, I can tell you that here in Philly, one of the best chess teams comes out of a North Philly public school called Vaux, and among other things they specialize in “Speed Chess”, using the clock to make moves. The team is composed of nearly all young junior-high aged Black boys. Speed, improvisation, quick decision making.

    Hmm.

    Holla back

    O

    Like


  57. on August 3, 2009 at 4:05 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    “Unless the relevant findings are buried by clever iconoclasts as footnotes in seemingly innocuous papers about seemingly innocuous subjects.”

    Interesting. Just like Diderot’s Encylopedie?

    Something along those lines. The Encyclopédie was compiled by a collection of editors, some of whom no doubt had revolutionary tendencies but some of whom probably didn’t (but whose work was to some extent co-opted by those who did).

    As a case in point, there have been a number of findings of strong correlations between certain genes and IQ, and equally strong correlations between those genes and certain races. These are, obviously, groundbreaking findings – but ALL of them were originally buried among myriad other gene-sequencing data at the time of their original publication, since they would violate all sorts of unwritten (and written, too) rules if they’d been headlines.

    Like


  58. on August 3, 2009 at 4:13 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    I can tell you that here in Philly, one of the best chess teams comes out of a North Philly public school called Vaux, and among other things they specialize in “Speed Chess”, using the clock to make moves. The team is composed of nearly all young junior-high aged Black boys. Speed, improvisation, quick decision making.

    This correlates exactly with what I’ve seen in cities like Boston where chess is played in public squares. There are games of speed chess with 3-5 minute clocks, and they are absolutely dominated by black men, essentially all of whom strut, dress, primp, and jive like old school pimps.

    If I had to guess, I’d guess that none of those guys would hack it against good players in traditional chess. One reason that can’t be overlooked, obviously, is training (speed chess is all they do, so they’ve gotten really good at … speed chess), but it seems reasonable to conclude that there are inherent mental differences (quick instinct vs. carefully reasoned long term planning) at work as well.

    Thought experiment:

    I wonder whether black boys would outperform their brothers-from-other-mothers (and whether the black community’s attitude toward academics would change at all) if INSANELY FAST oral arithmetic tests were instituted in school. Like Johnny gets called on to multiply 7 x 5, but he only gets 0.5 second to do it.

    Like


  59. @epoxy-agreed and agreed. that’s why i wrote “supreficially” the same. it may be destined to remain an “underground” discipline (whatever that means) for a generation or more.

    @dana- yeah, that rand, so warm, tender and inviting on the subject of love. 🙂

    @obs – i’ll agree that the best boxers combine brains with brawn, and that speed chess is a variant of chess which uses different attributes that blacks *may* be better at. (but again, we also may be treading on the ground of stereotype, a mirror image of the kind that got you pissed off at dana over the weekend.) but in general, those examples don’t stand against the generalities that willard was talking about.

    Like


  60. on August 3, 2009 at 4:14 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    I can tell you that here in Philly, one of the best chess teams comes out of a North Philly public school called Vaux, and among other things they specialize in “Speed Chess”, using the clock to make moves. The team is composed of nearly all young junior-high aged Black boys. Speed, improvisation, quick decision making.

    This correlates exactly with what I’ve seen in cities like Boston where chess is played in public squares. There are games of speed chess with 3-5 minute clocks, and they are absolutely dominated by black men, essentially all of whom strut, dress, primp, and jive like old school pimps.

    If I had to guess, I’d guess that none of those guys would hack it against good players in traditional chess. One reason that can’t be overlooked, obviously, is training (speed chess is all they do, so they’ve gotten really good at … speed chess), but it seems reasonable to conclude that there are inherent mental differences (quick instinct vs. carefully reasoned long term planning) at work as well.

    Thought experiment:

    I wonder whether black boys would outperform their brothers-from-other-mothers (and whether the black community’s attitude toward academics would change at all) if INSANELY FAST oral arithmetic tests were instituted in school. Like Johnny gets called on to multiply 7 x 5, but he only gets 0.5 second to do it.

    Like


  61. E87 makes a good point about the Larry Summers controversey: while all the attention was paid to the right end of Male achievers, no attention was paid at all to the left end of non-achievers. This greatly skews the debate, because often Women only see the (few) guys at the top, but never see the (many) guys at the bottom. Women as a rule tend to lump in the middle of the bell curve, and as we’ve seen recently, this is true wrt their physical attraction. Most Women out there tend to run in the 4-7 range; few Women are flatout 1s or 10s.

    O

    Like


  62. IQ = how good you are at solving culturally specific puzzles.

    Ok.. Have you heard about the Haber-Bosch process? It is a method of fixing atmospheric nitrogen to make ammonia. Haber was Jewish.. btw. This process made ww1, ww2 and every pretty much every other war possible. But then again, it also helps feed a lot of the earths population.

    Nobody argues that haber was not a very intelligent guy, but why was he involved with it’s discovery. Surely there were people with the same IQ around him and in other countries, who had tried doing that unsucessfully. Why is his impact on human civilization so disproportionatly greater than all his equally smart competitors?

    IQ measures cleverness, not intelligence. I doubt you would know the difference.

    Like


  63. ””””””””””on August 3, 2009 at 3:22 pm Epoxytocin No. 87
    Speaking of scientific disciplines, this is off-topic but will be of immense interest to the crowd here. I’m sure at least Doug has seen it and has plenty to say.

    The clock is ticking for American science, because the PC establishment’s next mandate will be to apply Title IX to math and science.
    See here.

    For anyone who doesn’t know what Title IX is, this basically means that it’s a very real possibility that university math and science departments (and other areas in which groundbreaking science is done) will soon be FORCED to be 50% female.

    Anyone who has ever actually met any scientists, and is thus familiar with the HUGE disparity between the numbers of men and women inclined to scientific pursuits, knows exactly what this will mean.”””””””””

    Wow when the fuck is it gonna be mandatory for infantry to be 50/50?

    Dam the scientists won’t be able to get shit done lol to busy kissing the bitches asses.

    Like


  64. I have unconditional love for my woman.

    Next question?

    Like


  65. Smart and clever is not creative and intelligent.

    Like


  66. E87,
    I think the answer to your query lies in the fact that in more recent years, Hip Hop has garnered serious academic attention and focus. Please note that w/the very notable exception of Eminem, a White rapper, virtually ALL rappers are Black and Male-even the best Black Female rappers can’t come close (Lauryn Hill would be a notable exception-rare).

    The ability to put together a string of words and phrases and to say them over a beat in a certain way, is a true art indeed. For those who poo poo it, I suggest they try it-especially what is known as Freestylin’, rhyming off the top of your head, on the spot, usually done within the context of “battling” another rapper, a kind of competition to see who’s the best rapper on the fly.

    This brings to attention the very real question of differing learning styles, and, whether there are ways to assess intellectual proficiency beyond the Stanford-Binet or SAT. Few who are familiar w/Hip Hop would say little intellectual rigor is demanded, just like few would argue the same wrt Jazz music (ever tried to understand the musical arrangements of Monk?!).

    By the way, here in Philly its very common to see precocious young’uns and dapper oldheads duking it out over three or four chessboards, all on the clock. It aint nothing to see a Brotha shutdown four or fiveother Brothas (checkmate) all at the same time, moving right down the line, chessboard to chessboard.

    Holla back

    O

    Like


  67. on August 3, 2009 at 4:30 pm russell rodriguez

    thank you a lot roissy and pa friends for the advice!

    pa in mexico if i were to walk around holding my girlfriend hand i would make jokes about me for acting too much like a woman, especially from my friends haha. i am just not used to be with woman that likes to hold hands instead of letting me put my arm around her shoulder like i like to do i guess.

    Like


  68. Or another example.

    Lisa Meitner- a rare example of an extremely good woman physicist, who will willing to tinker around in fairly innovative ways to discover controllable nuclear fission. She was succcesful where others failed and left.

    Why? Were they not as clever as her? Think about that one.

    And yes she was Jewish.Since many on this blog like to live in an imaginary world where only north european christian men are intelligent, it is worth remembering that they are a footnote in the history of big innovations. A footnote..

    Like


  69. on August 3, 2009 at 4:33 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ lucifer

    Ok.. Have you heard about the Haber-Bosch process? It is a method of fixing atmospheric nitrogen to make ammonia. Haber was Jewish.. btw. This process made ww1, ww2 and every pretty much every other war possible. But then again, it also helps feed a lot of the earths population.

    Nobody argues that haber was not a very intelligent guy, but why was he involved with it’s discovery. Surely there were people with the same IQ around him and in other countries, who had tried doing that unsucessfully. Why is his impact on human civilization so disproportionatly greater than all his equally smart competitors?

    You seem to be implying that WWI and WWII would not have happened without the exact chemicals that happened to be used, an assertion that is laughable on its face.

    Beyond that, what point are you trying to make here? I can’t figure it out.

    [NOTE:
    Like all scientists who have made massive contributions, Haber was really, really fucking lucky. The same way that Alexander Fleming was really lucky when he discovered penicillin. The same way that pretty much any scientist X was really lucky when he discovered process Y.

    For every 1 scientist whose name is known and recognized, such as Haber, there are hundreds of scientists who have chronicled the things that didn’t work and don’t happen – scientists whose names have since been lost to obscurity, but whose negative results are just as important as the lucky guys’ positive results.

    end NOTE]

    Also, yes, I understand that IQ is not a perfect measure of intelligence. In fact, it completely neglects certain aspects of intelligence that are absolutely essential to normal human functioning (such as “social intelligence”).

    But damned if IQ isn’t (a) closely correlated to the vast majority of what’s commonly recognized as “intelligence”, and (b) THE BEST metric we’ve got in this regard.

    You’re a broken record, Lucifer.

    – “Evo psych is bullshit” blah blah blah, with NO examples.

    – “IQ is flawed”. Well, duh. It’s a simple fucking scale to measure an immeasurably complex trait. Why don’t you give me a better metric or just go away.

    – Finally, aren’t you the guy who thinks that sex with a high class escort is equivalent to, or better than, sex with a woman who actually loves you?
    Worthless loser o m e g a troll.

    Like


  70. on August 3, 2009 at 4:39 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    Since many on this blog like to live in an imaginary world where only north european christian men are intelligent, it is worth remembering that they are a footnote in the history of big innovations.

    Lucifer, idiot, why don’t you go ahead and cite ONE COMMENT to this effect, from one of this blog’s regular posters (not from one of the “mark in ark”-esque flame posters).

    The high average intelligence of Jews, at the very least Jews of the Ashkenazi variety, is a point of 100% consensus here.

    Like


  71. on August 3, 2009 at 4:39 pm Carolus Reconditus

    Lucifer writes:

    Eugenics believed that-

    Jews were mentally inferior (this particular belief is quite funny, because it is obvious who the inferior uncreative types are)

    Not even the Nazis believed that the Jews were ‘mentally inferior’.

    Besides, Jews have been practicing eugenics for approx. 3000 years — as reflected in their intellectual achievements throughout the ages.

    Like


  72. Right… is everyone an idiot on this board? Jews have one of the lowest average SATs. You are all brainwashed to think they are smart… Jews control the media so I don’t blame you fools.

    The smartest race are Asians (China, Japan, India and Korea/ Exclude others.) followed by Europeans or Caucasians. The only people who practice eugenics is royalty… which the effects trickle down the social hierarchy.

    Like


  73. on August 3, 2009 at 4:47 pm Seeking Alpha

    If anyone caught the latest episode of Entourage… I don’t know if I’m just noticing it more now that we’ve been discussing it or if it’s getting worse, but the pro-feminist, beta behavior of the male characters was worse than ever.

    Like


  74. on August 3, 2009 at 4:47 pm Carolus Reconditus

    Is Lucifer an attention-seeking troll, or is he just uninformed? If the latter, Steve Sailer’s blog might help him overcome his endarkenment:

    http://isteve.blogspot.com/

    Like


  75. The big problem I have w/the HBD movement as is currently “popularly” defined in the blogosphere, is that they focus on a very narrow aspect of HBD, which is IQ. The main proponents don’t seem to care all that much about any other measures of HBD, about how various groups can get the most out of their specific “niches”. And it seems that this very narror measure, IQ, has a political edge to it-many in the HBDsphere seem to want to use this to advance a political agenda. OneSTDV is one such blogger that immediately comes to mind, and it is very interesting that he doesn’t consider any other aspects of HBD.

    O

    Like


  76. With regard to people misusing data and evo-psych concepts: yes, it happens all the time. Evo-psych draws a lot of wackos who would love to have their theories validated by science. But that doesn’t mean the solid stuff isn’t solid. As far as I can tell, there are some very strongly supported core claims that evo-psych makes.

    Eliezer Yudkowsky likes to quote a great line: “Just because the world’s dumbest person says the sun is shining doesn’t mean it’s dark out.”

    It’s the same with global warming. Just because liberal dipshits like to moralize and whinge and get their panties all dry and twisted about global warming, and just because they tend to propose exactly the wrong solutions, doesn’t mean that 99% of climate scientists are wrong. AGW is a fact. There’s no conspiracy behind the science. People are just being retarded and holier-than-thou as usual, which gives other people who like to cherry pick which science they listen to an excuse to keep their heads up their asses.

    Or to put it another way: If you haven’t changed your mind about a single serious topic in the last five years, you are almost certainly holding false beliefs. The chance that any single human has everything right is vanishingly small, and so you must constantly reexamine what you think.

    Unless you are me. I’m always right.

    Like


  77. http://www.christianparty.net/jewsiq.htm

    No I am not Christian or Antisemitic. I read the same data from another source, but don’t have the time or drive to waste my energy to prove you idiots. So this source is out of convenience… it still has all the points and has further sources on the bottom. Read it and change your ignorant views.

    Like


  78. on August 3, 2009 at 4:52 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian

    Willard,
    Actually, there’s a reason why they call Boxing *The Sweet Science*, and only one who is ignorant about Basketball would suggest there is nothing intellectual about it.

    There is NOTHING intellectual about boxing and basketball except writing about it.

    Sailer has written about African American strengths in these areas, and has even cited Thomas Sowell (btw, still waiting for your reply about your claim that most Black Men who are successful are lighter skinned-I offered an extensive listing of very dark and African featured Black Men, Sowell and Clarence Thomas among them, to counter your claim-your reply?)

    You attempted to counter a claim I didn’t make.

    This lends itself to boxing, where again, the ability to throw combinations of punches becomes very important. It is no accident that Blacks have dominated the sport since Jack Johnson.

    Boxing gives advantage generally to people with better fast twitch muscle in relation to body weight. It’s a bio-mechanical variation on short distance sprinting.

    Lastly, while there are no national chess champions who are Black that I can recount off the top of my head, I can tell you that here in Philly, one of the best chess teams comes out of a North Philly public school called Vaux,

    Philly public schools are not exactly the proving grounds for great minds. Being the best there is like being king of a small, meaningless tribe.

    and among other things they specialize in “Speed Chess”, using the clock to make moves. The team is composed of nearly all young junior-high aged Black boys. Speed, improvisation, quick decision making.

    And they would get destroyed by average top chess players SIMULTANEOUSLY.

    They are proving themselves to be better than other mediocre black players.

    And there is almost no improvisation possible in chess.

    Like


  79. on August 3, 2009 at 4:53 pm Seeking Alpha

    Jews have one of the lowest average SATs.

    You going to provide some statistics or just spout nonsense?

    Like


  80. E87,

    I think you should read a bit more about the history of the eugenic movement in America- it certainly propogated that idea.

    Before the HB process, all nitrates and nitro compunds that make everything from explosives to fertilizers were obtained by extracting nitrates from mineral deposits and processing them. Since much of this nitrate trade was done by ships, Britain controlled it. No nitrates= no explosives. That is why Britain thought Germany would never be able to fight a prolonged war against it. Once the HB process was discovered, you could extract all the nitrogen you wanted from the air. It was a game changer.

    Haber was succesful because he was more creative, not smarter.

    Like


  81. on August 3, 2009 at 4:55 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    @the king (with no clothes)

    Jews have one of the lowest average SATs.

    Um, right. In other news, West Africans have the slowest sprint times.

    Dumbass.
    See here.

    Also, the more nuanced of posters here realize that Ashkenazi Jews are not all Jews, just as Brahmins/Jatts are not all Indians.

    The only people who practice eugenics is royalty

    Anyone who is selective is “practicing eugenics”.

    Eugenics per se, in the formal sense of the word – i.e., eliminating bona fide genetic defects – is not a bad idea, of course.
    The problem is that there is no hard line between “bona fide genetic defects” and “traits that are undesirable to the powers that be”, and that eugenics thus can and will be abused by all but the most conscientious of people.

    Like


  82. Obsidian,


    E87,
    I think the answer to your query lies in the fact that in more recent years, teen-girl pop has garnered serious academic attention and focus. Please note that w/the very notable exception of beyoncea black singer, virtually ALL pop singers are white and metrosexual-even the best masculine singer can’t come close (is there even one? would be a notable exception-rare).

    The ability to put together a string of words and phrases and to say them over a beat in a certain way, is a true art indeed. For those who poo poo it, I suggest they try it-especially what is known as lipsyncing, rhyming off a memorized script for ignorant youths, on the spot, usually done within the context of Disney TV specials, a kind of competition to see who’s the best teen-girl-pop wonder.

    This brings to attention the very real question of differing learning styles, and, whether there are ways to assess intellectual proficiency beyond the Stanford-Binet or SAT. Few who are familiar w/Pop would say little intellectual rigor is demanded, just like few would argue the same wrt Jazz music (ever tried to understand the musical arrangements of Monk?!).

    Holla back
    Holla

    O

    Like


  83. on August 3, 2009 at 4:56 pm Seeking Alpha

    @ The_King

    http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0883611.html

    This doesn’t have Jews. However, your source put average Jewish math SAT at 230 points. White is 530 and black is 429. Your facts are obviously nonsense.

    Like


  84. Willard,
    Wrt your boxing points-WRONG. Different weight classes emphasize different things. Few heavyweight boxers are world class sprinters. Few lighter weight boxers are world class bodybuilders or weight lifters. And again, only those with no experience or understanding of Boxing or Basketball would attempt to argue that neither has a demanding mental component.

    Unless, you’ve boxed Golden Gloves and played on an All-Public B-Ball squad, Willard?

    Over on one of the previous threads over the weekend, I think it was the Shady Game thread, you attempted to argue that most Black Men who are successful in our time tend to look more like Obama, who is biracial having a White Mother, than say, Clarence Thomas, who clearly has African features. I ran off a long list of successful Black Men who were clearly darkskinned (one of the Men I mentioned was Thomas Sowell, himself darkskinned as I recall). I have yet to hear back from you on this point, nor have I heard back from you on the point that Justice Thomas also has a White wife-what do you make of this fact?

    As for Philly public schools, I would like to note the fact that Vaux Middle School has successfully competed against both Black AND White schools, and won many matches. As E87 has noted, few have the game of speed chess mastered like the Brothas do.

    So, you were saying?

    O

    Like


  85. on August 3, 2009 at 5:05 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    However, your source put average Jewish math SAT at 230 points.

    Ha. Nice.

    For those of you who don’t know SAT math scores, if you just GUESS the answer to EVERY SINGLE QUESTION, you will usually get a score somewhere from 220 to 250. (The absolute rock bottom score of 200 requires a performance worse than random guessing.)

    Speaking of standardized tests, and our beloved title ix, did you folks know that any standardized test on which boys outscore girls could be made illegal?
    Title IX requires that tests must be valid predictors of success in the areas being tested and that they measure what they say they measure. If a test doesn’t meet this standard, and if it results in a lower score for a significant number of members of one sex, it may be unlawful.

    Not coincidentally, the “new” SAT (circa 2005) is now 2/3 verbal and 1/3 math, while the pre-2005 SAT was half and half.
    My inner cynic supposes that the next generation of the SAT will be 2/3 verbal and 1/3 hormonal.

    Like


  86. Unconditional Love
    You can say it
    You can live it
    You can do it
    You can prove it

    ”””””””April 13 2008
    Level 1
    Well got to level one. Last 40 days have made 25 percent on the stock market day trading. Life should almost too easy but it is not. You can plan everything except your wife developing two egg size tumors in the uterous shit is out of control. Achieve goals live in one of the toughest environments on the planet for three years plan achieve goals and then this shit. She was included in every plan I had for the future and now it is like wtf why? The woman I have loved the most in my life and the chance she could be gone. I planned on till death do we part but not this soon for god’s sake. Hopefully I have the guts to commit Sepucu if anything happens. I’d rather go out Romeo and Juliet style and chill with her in the afterlife.
    Saving the loot was still the best thing though because i have the ability to pay for the operation and be there with her when it happens. I have Ritz Carlton reservations and have told them to put 20 bouquets of flowers in the room with a heart shape of rose petals on the bed. They are opening the resteraunt early so that we can sit down with her famility and eat some good food and relax. I also have the ability to be with her to the end (if it turns out bad) without worrying about little bullshit that doesn’t matter, just worrying about Love.”””””””””””””’

    Like


  87. on August 3, 2009 at 5:15 pm Carolus Reconditus

    E 87,

    I clicked on the Title IX link. Excerpt:

    Fewer females than males receive valuable awards, such as the National Merit Scholarship, because test scores are still used as qualifying criteria.

    Satire? No, it’s Rosa Klebb again.

    Jesus H. Christ — time to hand your country over to the Islamists and get some of this stuff sorted out.

    Like


  88. E87,
    It’ll be very interesting to see if any of the current anti-affirmative action activists, like say, Ward Connerlly, will take on the blatant “disparate impact” of Title IX, etc.

    Sailer, too.

    Hmm…

    O

    Like


  89. on August 3, 2009 at 5:24 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian

    Willard,
    Wrt your boxing points-WRONG. Different weight classes emphasize different things.

    No, all weight divisions will give an advantage to athletes with more fast twitch muscle fiber in relation to body weight.

    Few heavyweight boxers are world class sprinters.

    That’s not what I said. Obviously none are. I said boxing is a bio mechanical variation on a short distance sprint.

    Few lighter weight boxers are world class bodybuilders or weight lifters.

    You simple don’t understand bio-mechanics and sports physiology

    And again, only those with no experience or understanding of Boxing or Basketball would attempt to argue that neither has a demanding mental component.

    Mental component and “intellectual” are two different things.

    Over on one of the previous threads over the weekend, I think it was the Shady Game thread, you attempted to argue that most Black Men who are successful in our time tend to look more like Obama, who is biracial having a White Mother, than say, Clarence Thomas, who clearly has African features.

    I don’t recall saying that. Your reading comprehension is flawed.

    I ran off a long list of successful Black Men who were clearly darkskinned (one of the Men I mentioned was Thomas Sowell, himself darkskinned as I recall). I have yet to hear back from you on this point,

    Wonderful, I could have mentioned Eric Holder and Colin Powell but I didn’t. Again you are arguing against a point I didn’t make.

    nor have I heard back from you on the point that Justice Thomas also has a White wife-what do you make of this fact?

    Well, it’s been said by some that he’s a traitor to “his people” in more ways than one.

    As for Philly public schools, I would like to note the fact that Vaux Middle School has successfully competed against both Black AND White schools, and won many matches. As E87 has noted, few have the game of speed chess mastered like the Brothas do.

    These brothas are simply competing at a low level against mediocre competition. They would be systematically destroyed by top chess players,

    So, you were saying?

    That these black folk heroes of yours couldn’t handle competition from any average top chess player.

    Like


  90. Love exists Roissy.

    I don’t think I can quite define it. I think St. Thomas Aquinas has a better grasp than me of what it is:

    love is the first movement of the will and of every appetitive faculty. …Hence love is naturally the first act of the will and appetite; for which reason all the other appetite movements presuppose love, as their root and origin. For nobody desires anything nor rejoices in anything, except as a good that is loved: nor is anything an object of hate except as opposed to the object of love….”
    ~Summa 20

    Love is something I can see when my mother chose to love me as a child. Love is something I feel when my love and I are together. Love is in the presence of the Lord.

    If you say love does not than you have intellectually missed the essence of being.

    Like


  91. on August 3, 2009 at 5:27 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    Love is something I can see when my mother chose to love me as a child

    Love is many things, but one thing love is most definitely not is a “choice”.

    Like


  92. Just because liberal dipshits like to moralize and whinge and get their panties all dry and twisted about global warming, and just because they tend to propose exactly the wrong solutions, doesn’t mean that 99% of climate scientists are wrong. AGW is a fact.

    A – No where near 99% of climate scientists agree with AGW theory. In all honesty I suspect the majority, by a small but growing margin, are now critical of it. You need to spend less time watching Al Gore movies and more time actually listening to the scientists and looking at the surveys of scientists.

    B – A scientific model which has failed to predict real phenomenon time and time again is not a fact. Indeed, a theory which fails to predict the real world is scientifically falsified. AGW theory completely failed to predict the observed climate behavior of this decade. The theory and the climate models used to predict warming over the 21st century are all falsified, and therefore the predictions are useless. We were supposed to believe their 100 year projections and “do something now”, yet the projections failed miserably within the first 10 years.

    Now that doesn’t mean that the basic idea is proven to be impossible. And a modified climate model which incorporates the idea may in fact prove valid. But the models we have and their predictions are scientifically worthless. CO2 is almost certainly not the force in climate it was thought to be when those models were programmed, if its signature is even discernible against other climate system variables.

    AGW theory is a classic example of an idea being passed off as “science” or “fact” among the masses when the theory has completely failed to meet the rigors of the scientific method. It’s also a classic example of bias, greed, censorship, and propaganda coming from people who are supposed to show indifference and strictly adhere to the scientific method. Just because a “scientist” says something doesn’t mean it’s “scientific”, a “fact”, or “proven” in any way.

    Like


  93. Epoxytocin,

    I’m not the most studied in philosophy so please excuse me if I err but this is how I currently understand it.

    Love involves both the appetite and the will. You can not choose your appetites but your will, by definition, is your ability to choose.

    Like


  94. Willard,
    I never said these chess players were heroes of mine. Who’s having trouble comprehending now?

    There are slow moving boxers who can nevertheless be highly effective. And you still haven’t answered my question: have you ever boxed Golden Gloves? Yes or no?

    Also, at what level have you played basketball? Aside from my own experience of playing the game, just about every other player I know, including those in D-1, would agree w/the general proposition that basketball definitely has a mental/intellectual component to it. In fact, you are the first to argue against that basic point.

    As for Thomas, Sowell, etc, as I said, you were responding to my point about Black Women and their playing the role of being the canary in the American social mine. It’s over on the Shady Game thread. You were saying how Black Men simply couldn’t get away from Black Women fast enough, and then made the remark that more and more successful Black Men were looking like Obama. Hence my retort that numerous Black Men who were successful clearly didn’t look like Obama at all, Thomas and Sowell among them.

    I mentioned Thomas’ having a White wife because I wanted to know if your views about Black Men in this regard held true for him as well.

    Lastly, please understand what I said: Vaux Chess Team played both Black AND WHITE teams, and generally beat them BOTH.

    O

    Like


  95. on August 3, 2009 at 5:36 pm Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ Willard Libby

    I said boxing is a bio mechanical variation on a short distance sprint.

    Yes and no. You clearly don’t have a lot of experience with boxing. And probably not with sprinting, either.

    Boxing obviously has sprint-like components, but it’s much more akin to fartlek training than to sprinting. (Boxers aren’t built like mid-distance runners, who do actual fartlek training, but that’s an artifact of the fact that boxers need strength and a certain amount of size, to hit stuff, while size is nothing but a liability to runners.)

    Don’t forget that individual boxing rounds are three minutes long, and that there are up to 12 rounds (formerly 15). Given that the anaerobic/vo2max threshold is about 20 seconds – up to thirty seconds for elite, highly trained athletes – your sprinting analogy is not apt.

    Short version:
    Boxers jump rope all the time.
    If a sprinter jumped rope (for more than 20-30 seconds), he’d be undermining his training.
    True sprinters wouldn’t last more than a round or two into a boxing match, although 400m guys (who train above the lactate threshold) could hold their own.

    Like


  96. Willard also made a curious remark over on the Shady Game thread, that suggested that Black Men were inherently lazy, based on ancestral norms in primarily West Africa. If this was true, why did White Slavers continue to import Black Men, and instead simply import Black Women? Surely, for stud purposes so many Black Men weren’t needed.

    Holla back

    O

    Like


  97. Oh yes, one of the first clues that a “proven scientific fact” my not be proven or even scientific is the appeal to a consensus. Consensus has nothing to do with science or the scientific method. Scientists do not form a consensus over theories which have proven true when observing the real world. It would be silly to even think of a validated theory as needing a consensus.

    A consensus is mentioned only when a theory has not yet been validated, or worse has failed to predict real world observations and therefore been falsified, but the people involved have an ulterior motive in seeing the theory accepted.

    Like


  98. DT, you make a very powerful point. I believe someone seeking to undermine a valid theory via “consensus” is engaging in a form of Ad Hominem, yes?

    O

    Like


  99. I’ve been out of work for over a year and still get my dick sucked on command. My woman is trained too well to leave me/fall out of love. She pays for my 2 cars, my herb, gas, food ETC. Maybe I’m so alpha the rules don’t apply to me? lol

    Like


  100. I forgot to mention that she caught me cheating once as well!

    Like


  101. [email protected] 230 SAT math score–on what planet?

    Like


  102. on August 3, 2009 at 5:53 pm Seeking Alpha

    Obs

    DT, you make a very powerful point. I believe someone seeking to undermine a valid theory via “consensus” is engaging in a form of Ad Hominem, yes?

    Absolutely right. ‘But everyone agrees with this. What is wrong with you?’

    Like


  103. Obsidian, I wouldn’t call it an ad hominem, I would call it an appeal to authority fallacy.

    According to some random website:
    http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

    Ad Homniem
    (Toward the Human?)
    1. Person A makes claim X.
    2. Person B makes an attack on person A.
    3. Therefore A’s claim is false.

    Appeal to Authority
    1. Person A is (claimed to be) an authority on subject S.
    2. Person A makes claim C about subject S.
    3. Therefore, C is true.

    An ad hominem would be, “You can’t believe the world is solid because A. believed that and he was a racist, therefore the world is not solid.”

    An appeal to authority would be, “You must believe the world is filled with Elmer’s glue because Professor B. believes that, and since he is a professor he knows more than you, therefore the world must be composed of Elmer’s glue.”

    Like


  104. DT:

    I’ll ignore the Al Gore comment. Check out my blog to get a better idea of who I am; I’m sure you won’t make that mistake again.

    As for the rest: well, yes. You just took about 4 times as many words to say the same thing as me.

    To satisfy your critique I will modify my phrasing. “GW” is a fact, at least in recent decades and indeed much further back. Whether it’s “A” or not is in dispute, though there’s a lot of evidence that it is and it would be pretty thickheaded to ignore the rather plausible explanations for why it could be.

    But whether it’s anthropogenic or not is beside the point. Thirty year and ten year trends have unquestionably gone up. The question is whether or what we should do about it. The reason the “A” attached to “GW” attracts so much muddy “science” is because for lockstep liberals it means we should all repent and live in huts or kill ourselves and leave the earth to nature, maaaaaan. And for people on the other side the absence of the “A” means we don’t have to think about the “GW” part. If there were a sudden change in, say, tectonic activity, it wouldn’t matter that it was not “our fault”… all that would matter would be figuring what we should do about it. Same with climate change.

    Whereas a sane person who isn’t interested in moralizing or validating their own rigid belief system can just look at the evidence, make his best guess as to what is going on, decide what the best course of action is, and then follow through.

    I’m fully prepared to find that the current accepted predictions will have to be modified when more data and better analysis comes to light. If it turns out to have been all a case of massive, simultaneous scientific hallucination, I’ll be happy about it, unlike many fuckazoid libs who will probably be disappointed if shit doesn’t fly apart at the seams. On the other hand, even if the most severe predictions are correct, and even if it’s all anthropogenic, I still think economic growth and techical innovation will be far more effective in mitigating any negative effects.

    Like


  105. I have already explained to obsidian that he is using “ad hominem” wrong with specific examples–he doesn’t care

    Like


  106. @ Epoxytocin No. 87, el chief

    It is a commonly held belief, but I have never met a woman that is a good communicator.

    They are good at manipulating and lying, but not say, telling someone what they actually think.

    This is true, but it’s only true in the “shouting on different planes” sense.

    Women, for the most part, aren’t good at communicating in a male style (”telling someone what they actually think”).

    Men, for the most part, aren’t good at communicating in a female style, either.

    The latter is why Game was formalized into the scientific discipline that it is currently becoming.

    I think this is the first time someone has explicitly pointed this out.

    It seems that a lot of people here don’t understand the “shouting on different planes” differences between the sexes — or, at least, they only understand said differences when it’s convenient for them.

    For example, most people on here get that feminism is basically women wanting to be men. Most strongly believe that the sexes should embrace their differences and work together, instead of trying to be each other. Obviously. I do not disagree with this.

    However, a lot of you also turn right around and get frustrated over game-type things where women and men are different, such as communication. To say that women are bad at communication because they don’t usually communicate in a straightforward, male-type way, is to say that women should strive to improve said “bad” communication and, well, be like men. Oh!

    SRSLY, imagine what allure the softer sex would lose to all of you (alpha, beta, and o m e g a) males, were they to be maddeningly direct and to-the-point.

    Like


  107. Obsidian,

    You are trying to argue with people who do not care about the truth. Paradoxically, the more “educated” a person is, the less likely he/she is to search for the truth.

    Like


  108. Shazzam,
    Excellent point. One of the interesting characters on The Wire is Dennis “Cutty” Wise, a former enforcer or “muscle” for Avon Barksdale. After he comes home from a 14 year bid at Jessup prison, he realizes that he doesn’t have the will to go back to the game anymore. But he does have another skill-boxing.

    W/Avon’s help, Cutty’s able to open a boxing gym w/the aim of reaching out to the boys in the hood and getting them off the streets. Soon the boys’ mothers start to thank Cutty, and he winds up bedding quite a few, at least three or four as I recall. Keep in mind, Cutty is an ex-con and is at best marginally employed outside of his gym.

    My point is that Shazzam’s right, money has little to do w/Game, and as I recall, Roissy said as much himself. In my own experience, “Wallet Game” is the WORST kind of Game a Man can have, and the WORST time for a Man to learn Game is when he’s rolling in dough. Because Men have a very bad habit of being lazy and going back into bad habits. And one of the worst of them is reaching into his pocket.

    When you got tight Game you really don’t need any money at all, trust me on this. In fact, since Women are doing so well in this economy, why not they ante up for once? Mine does all the time.

    😉

    O

    Like


  109. on August 3, 2009 at 5:59 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    Jesus fucking christ mandy you’re fucking retarded. A scientific study is entirely discounted because you can think of a few theoretical counterexamples about what women say in your person life?

    Are you autistic?

    Like


  110. on August 3, 2009 at 6:01 pm Seeking Alpha

    @ Dogen

    But if it’s not anthropogenic – meaning we can do nothing to stop it, only do things to prepare for it – what conclusion does that lead you to?

    The in-vogue phrase has shifted recently from global warming to climate change because temperatures haven’t risen over the past decade. Scientists have been unable to offer accurate predictions of the effects of climate change (they can predict that in 30 years, X terrible thing will happen, but not in 5 years or 10).

    So where does that leave us? Prepare for every possible natural disaster? Wouldn’t it be better to ignore the issue until it becomes a problem. If nothing else, we’ll have faster economic growth until that point, and therefore greater resources to call upon to solve whatever problem does arise.

    Like


  111. on August 3, 2009 at 6:01 pm Cannon's Canon

    Obsidian: “Please note that w/the very notable exception of Eminem, a White rapper, virtually ALL rappers are Black and Male-even the best Black Female rappers can’t come close (Lauryn Hill would be a notable exception-rare).”

    I do not care to get involved in your speed chess vs. traditional chess debate, but I need to point out that your defense of your point with rap music, or illustration of this reasoning, is wrong.

    In short:

    Rap music is made for men and by men. It’s by and large a testosterone showcase. You can find anecdotal counterexamples, but even “eclectic” rappers like ATCQ commonly advertise their style, promiscuity, and even physical dominance.

    Whites (and asians) are becoming increasingly prominent (though far from proportionately dominant) in emceeing and dj’ing. The world’s top freestyle rapper is currently “The Saurus” (look him up for some impressive victories), and the DMC’s have been dominated by whites/asians since 1995.

    To market aural testosterone to 18-34 year old males, black male rappers are the most suitable vehicle because of their primal, masculine, even “savage” stereotypes. On a slight tangent, this assures that black men will “dominate” rap music via album sales, likely forever.

    Blacks remaining the most common rappers is not a question of some particular skill set, but rather of their marketing power for machismo.

    Like


  112. DT,

    Consensus = An act of politics, not science.

    Like


  113. And there is almost no improvisation possible in chess.

    The truth. The moment you start shooting from the hip in chess is the moment you get crushed.

    Like


  114. Loserfer is the lamest, most toothless hater this blog has ever seen.

    Like


  115. PA,

    Why would I care about what you think? What is in it for me?

    Like


  116. michael crichton, the case for skepticism over global warming

    http://www.crichton-official.com/speech-ourenvironmentalfuture.html

    Like


  117. on August 3, 2009 at 6:08 pm Cannon's Canon

    Oh my god, another behavioral science debate stamped shut by your favorite tv show that proves that the earth is round and the sky is blue. Does the intro to ‘The Wire’ show an apple falling on young Newton’s head?

    Like


  118. AGW = a scare tactic to convince people to hand over their lives to the same ivy league cocksuckers who destroyed the economy and stifled innovation.

    The new priests (ivy leaguers) are not any better than the old ones (traditional religions).

    Like


  119. on August 3, 2009 at 6:11 pm Cannon's Canon

    PA, I thanked you for the vocab word yesterday. Lo and behold, my evening Hoellebecq reading blessed me with a second appearance for “hirsute” not four hours later!

    Like


  120. Cannon,
    Yes, I am quite familiar w/the great popularity of Hip Hop among Asians and quite a few Whites. It reminds me of the same wrt Jazz in the 50s, 60s and 70s.

    We’ll just agree to disagree w/your bottomline analysis, though I do see and to some extent even grant your points.

    Dana,
    Yes, I am familiar w/the more formal terms for such things as Logical Fallacies, but again, I focus on the forrest, you on the pine needles, as is a Woman’s way. In the popular lexicon, “Ad Hominem” is often taken to encompass ANY FORM of logical fallacy. Not just those “against the Man” or, in this case, “an appeal to authority”.

    Learn to take a step back and see the big picture, hmm?

    😉

    O

    Like


  121. Lucifer,

    Most people consider Jews white, including Jews themselves.

    Jewish political-leanings are very much part of the “SWPL” phenomenon.

    Let me define that SWPL phenomenon for you: Whites at the current top of the status hierarchy attempting to handicap the whites JUST BELOW THEMSELVES with all their might.

    The “exclusive” whites despise the lower-middle, middle, and upper-middle class whites more than they even think about all the minorities put together Lucifer. In a way its just human nature. These people cannot imagine that they will ever truly be displaced, and dont regard any minority as a serious rival for their positions as the major shareholders of our largest corporations and owners of long-term securities. The “exclusive” whites literally almost dont “see” minorities and only use them as pawns in the never-ending status competition with the whites below them, who they genuinely fear because of the genetic competition with them.

    Let me give you an example Lucifer: If you somehow got into an exclusive Ivy-league affair and Roissy and Zeets were there, who do you think the George Bush clones in that room would resent? I promise you, it would be the nice-looking white PUA duo who were working the room and getting the female attention. Thats who the elite would hate. The more laughter and titillated tones of the female voices that they elite preppy-Bush-clones heard, the madder they would get. Elites everywhere on earth are probably the same way, and it makes them quite shortsighted. They fear who is just right beneath themselves, and they look to keep this bunch down every way they can. They have found a way, through massive outsourcing and massive insourcing, to actually financially harm “the rest of us”, and are indulging it to the hilt.

    Whats really a shame, is that they are ending up hurting aspiring black men who would be great dads and husbands, the most. Every time you see a Mexican crew out there cutting yards and working on houses, you should see a potential black small-businessman being put out of work. Every time you see a boatload of illegals earning $7.25-an-hour in a corrugated metal building off the side of a state highway out in bumfuck, you could be seeing young black and white working class men who would be making $11 bucks an hour (especially in the meat slaughtering business, where this has literally happened). It ends up hurting black males by default, which is a shame. We used to have a much healthier lower-middle class-working-class than what we do now, but we are heading toward a place where we will have rich, fairly-well-off, and working poor, and then the absolute government-dependent underclass. I think thats a bad thing.

    Like


  122. obs

    uh, no it isn’t–anywhere

    maybe i’d understand the world better if i watched “The Wire”

    Like


  123. on August 3, 2009 at 6:16 pm Cannon's Canon

    Seeking Alpha, I am trying to write a comprehensive blog post demolishing Entourage as an alpha-hating feminist orgy. However, every new episode gives me extra paragraphs of fodder. It has proven difficult to finish.

    Don’t tell this to Maurice, who has a bit of Ari Gold in him.

    Like


  124. PA,

    I think chess is the supreme “future-time-orientation” practice game for the mind. I haven’t played it in many years, but remember that, like checkers to a lesser extent, that one had to think out several moves ahead at what your opponet would do and what you yourself would do in response.

    I wonder if we had chess/checkers teams in elementary schools if we’d see higher scores on tests eventually, and see boys get enthusiastic about really “thinking out” problems.

    I for one, think we are “MIS-educating” the living shit out of our kids.

    Like


  125. Z,
    Well said. Here, here.

    O

    Like


  126. z,

    If jews were considered by whites to be white, then how do you explain history (all the pogroms, inquisitions, mass killings, discrimination etc). In many cases, these were done to people who had been living in the same area for over a thousand years.

    So spare that crap.. You only started categorizing them as ‘real’ whites in the last 60-70 years. wonder why?

    Like


  127. on August 3, 2009 at 6:20 pm Seeking Alpha

    CC

    Yes, but an often entertaining alpha-hating feminist orgy with the best dressed man on a (contemporary – can’t mess with Draper) TV.

    Like


  128. Lucifer certainly seems to be in foul mood. One would have thought that the regular purchase of sexual affirmation would have made a guy more cheerful.
    Besides, I really don’t get why he argues so angrily about which group or the other deserves cosmic “credit” for innovation. For one thing, the game is not over yet.(At least I hope not) There is plenty of time for Indian Chappies to forge decisively ahead in the next few innings.
    IOWs, do it. Show us. No one cares what you merely say about it.

    Like


  129. Actually Dana, I think you taking a day or two out, sitting down on your bum and watching The Wire would indeed be highly instructive for you, given your recent comments made.

    As for Appeal to Authority, please read the following, from Wikipedia:

    Ad hominem

    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Look up ad hominem in Wiktionary , the free dictionary.

    An ad hominem argument , also known as argumentum ad hominem ( Latin : “argument to the man”, “argument against the man”) consists of replying to an argument or factual claim by attacking or appealing to a characteristic or belief of the person making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim.

    The process of proving or disproving the claim is thereby subverted, and the argumentum ad hominem works to change the subject.

    Contents [ hide ]

    1 Background
    2 Ad hominem as informal fallacy
    3 Usage

    3.1 In logic
    3.2 Colloquially
    4 Types of ad hominems

    4.1 Ad hominem abusive
    4.2 Ad hominem circumstantial
    4.3 Ad hominem tu quoque
    4.4 Guilt by association
    5 Inverse ad hominem
    6 See also
    7 References
    8 Sources
    9 Further reading
    10 External links

    [ edit ] Background

    Ad hominem argument is most commonly used to refer specifically to the ad hominem abusive , or argumentum ad personam , which consists of criticizing or attacking the person who proposed the argument ( personal attack ) in an attempt to discredit the argument. It is also used when an opponent is unable to find fault with an argument, yet for various reasons, the opponent disagrees with it.

    Other common subtypes of the ad hominem include the ad hominem circumstantial , or ad hominem circumstantiae , an attack which is directed at the circumstances or situation of the arguer; and the ad hominem tu quoque , which objects to an argument by characterizing the arguer as acting or arguing in accordance with the view that he is arguing against.

    Ad hominem arguments are always invalid in syllogistic logic, since the truth value of premises is taken as given, and the validity of a logical inference is independent of the source making the inference. However, ad hominem arguments are rarely presented as formal syllogisms, and their assessment lies in the domain of informal logic and the theory of evidence. [ 1 ] The theory of evidence depends to a large degree on assessments of the credibility of witnesses , including eyewitness evidence and expert witness evidence. Evidence that a purported eyewitness is unreliable, or has a motive for lying, or that a purported expert witness lacks the claimed expertise can play a major role in making judgements from evidence.

    Argumentum ad hominem is the inverse of argumentum ad verecundiam , in which the arguer bases the truth value of an assertion on the authority of the source asserting it. Hence, while an ad hominem argument may make an assertion less compelling, by showing that the source making the assertion does not have the authority it claims, or has made mistaken assertions on similar topics in the past, it cannot provide an infallible counterargument.

    An ad hominem fallacy is a genetic fallacy and red herring , and is most often (but not always) an appeal to emotion .

    It does not include arguments posed by a source that contradict the source’s actions.

    [ edit ] Ad hominem as informal fallacy

    A (fallacious) ad hominem argument has the basic form:

    Person A makes claim X

    There is something objectionable about Person A

    Therefore claim X is false

    Ad hominem is one of the best known of the logical and systematic fallacies usually enumerated in introductory logic and critical thinking textbooks. Both the fallacy itself, and accusations of having committed it, are often brandished in actual discourse (see also Argument from fallacy ). As a technique of rhetoric , it is powerful and used often because of the natural inclination of the human brain to recognize patterns .

    The first premise is called a ‘factual claim’ and is the pivot point of much debate. The contention is referred to as an ‘inferential claim’ and represents the reasoning process. There are two types of inferential claim, explicit and implicit. The fallacy does not represent a valid form of reasoning because even if you accept both co-premises, that does not guarantee the truthfulness of the contention. This can also be thought of as the argument having an un-stated co-premise .

    In this example, the un-stated co-premise ” everything that A claims is false ” has been included, and the argument is therefore now a valid one. However in the ad hominem fallacy the un-stated co-premise is always false, thereby maintaining the fallacy. Note that this does not imply that the contention ” eugenics is a bad idea ” is false, merely un-supported by the pattern of reasoning below it.

    [ edit ] Usage

    [ edit ] In logic

    An ad hominem fallacy consists of asserting that an argument is wrong and/or the source is wrong to argue at all purely because of something discreditable/not-authoritative about the source or those sources cited by it rather than addressing the soundness of the argument itself. The implication is that the source’s argument and/or ability to argue correctly lacks authority. Merely insulting a source in the middle of otherwise rational discourse does not necessarily constitute an ad hominem fallacy (though it is not usually regarded as acceptable). It must be clear that the purpose of the characterization is to discredit the source offering the argument, and, specifically, to invite others to discount its arguments. In the past, the term ad hominem was sometimes used more literally, to describe an argument that was based on an individual, or to describe any personal attack. However, this is not how the meaning of the term is typically introduced in modern logic and rhetoric textbooks, and logicians and rhetoricians are in agreement that this use is incorrect. [ 2 ]

    Example :

    “You claim that this man is innocent, but you cannot be trusted since you are a criminal as well.”

    This argument would generally be accepted as reasonable, as regards personal evidence, on the premise that criminals are likely to lie to protect each other. On the other hand, it is a valid example of ad hominem if the source making the claim is doing so on the basis of evidence independent of its own credibility.

    In general, ad hominem criticism of evidence cannot prove the negative of the proposition being claimed:

    Example :

    “Paula says the umpire made the correct call, but this can’t be true, because Paula is a stupid idiot.”

    Assuming the premise is correct, Paula’s evidence is valueless, but the umpire may nonetheless have made the right call.

    [ edit ] Colloquially

    In common language, any personal attack, regardless of whether it is part of an argument, is often referred to as ad hominem . [ 3 ]

    [ edit ] Types of ad hominems

    Three traditionally identified varieties are ad hominem abusive (or ad personam ), ad hominem circumstantial , and ad hominem tu quoque .

    [ edit ] Ad hominem abusive

    Ad hominem abusive (also called argumentum ad personam ) usually and most notoriously involves insulting or belittling one’s opponent, but can also involve pointing out factual but ostensible character flaws or actions which are irrelevant to the opponent’s argument. This tactic is logically fallacious because insults and even true negative facts about the opponent’s personal character have nothing to do with the logical merits of the opponent’s arguments or assertions.

    This tactic is frequently employed as a propaganda tool among politicians who are attempting to influence the voter base in their favor through an appeal to emotion rather than by logical means, especially when their own position is logically weaker than their opponent’s.

    Examples:

    “You can’t believe Jack when he says God exists because he doesn’t even have a job.”
    “Candidate Jane Jones’s proposal X is ridiculous. She was caught cheating on her taxes in 2003.”

    [ edit ] Ad hominem circumstantial

    Ad hominem circumstantial involves pointing out that someone is in circumstances such that he is disposed to take a particular position. Essentially, ad hominem circumstantial constitutes an attack on the bias of a source. The reason that this is fallacious in syllogistic logic is that pointing out that one’s opponent is disposed to make a certain argument does not make the argument, from a logical point of view, any less credible; this overlaps with the genetic fallacy (an argument that a claim is incorrect due to its source).

    On the other hand, where the source taking a position seeks to convince us by a claim of authority, or personal observation, observation of their circumstances may reduce the evidentiary weight of the claims, sometimes to zero. [ 4 ]

    Examples :

    “Tobacco company representatives should not be believed when they say smoking doesn’t seriously affect your health, because they’re just defending their own multi-million-dollar financial interests.”

    “He’s physically addicted to nicotine. Of course he defends smoking!”

    “What do you know about politics? You’re too young to vote!”

    Mandy Rice-Davies ‘s famous testimony, during the Profumo Affair , “Well, he would [say that], wouldn’t he?”, is an example of a valid circumstantial argument. Her point is that since a man in a prominent position, accused of an affair with a callgirl, would deny the claim whether it was true or false, his denial, in itself, carries little evidential weight against the claim of an affair. Note, however, that this argument is valid only insofar as it devalues the denial; it does not bolster the original claim. To construe evidentiary invalidation of the denial as evidentiary validation of the original claim is fallacious (on several different bases, including that of argumentum ad hominem ); however likely the man in question would be to deny an affair that did in fact happen, he could only be more likely to deny an affair that never did.

    [ edit ] Ad hominem tu quoque

    Main article: tu quoque

    Ad hominem tu quoque (lit: “You too!”) refers to a claim that the source making the argument has spoken or acted in a way inconsistent with the argument. In particular, if Source A criticizes the actions of Source B, a tu quoque response is that Source A has acted in the same way.

    Examples :

    “You say that stealing is wrong, but you do it as well.”

    “He says we shouldn’t enslave people, yet he himself owns slaves”

    [ edit ] Guilt by association

    Main article: Association fallacy

    Guilt by association can sometimes also be a type of ad hominem fallacy, if the argument attacks a source because of the similarity between the views of someone making an argument and other proponents of the argument.

    This form of the argument is as follows:

    Source A makes claim P.

    Group B also make claim P.

    Therefore, source A is a member of group B.

    Example:

    “You say the gap between the rich and poor is unacceptable, but communists also say this, therefore you are a communist”

    This fallacy can also take another form:

    Source A makes claim P.

    Group B make claims P and Q

    Therefore, Source A makes claim Q.

    Examples:

    “You say the gap between the rich and poor is unacceptable, but communists also say this, and they believe in revolution. Thus, you believe in revolution.”

    A similar tactic may be employed to encourage someone to renounce an opinion, or force them to choose between renouncing an opinion or admitting membership in a group. For example:

    ” You say the gap between the rich and poor is unacceptable. You don’t really mean that, do you? Communists say the same thing. You’re not a communist, are you ?”

    Guilt by association may be combined with ad hominem abusive. For example:

    ” You say the gap between the rich and poor is unacceptable, but communists also say this, and therefore you are a communist. Communists are unlikeable, and therefore everything they say is false, and therefore everything you say is false. ”

    A reductio ad Hitlerum argument can be seen as an example of a “guilt by association” fallacy, since it attacks a viewpoint simply because it was supposedly espoused by Adolf Hitler , as if it is impossible that such a man could have held any viewpoint that is correct.

    [ edit ] Inverse ad hominem

    An inverse ad hominem argument praises a source in order to add support for that source’s argument or claim. A fallacious inverse ad hominem argument may go something like this:

    ” That man was smartly-dressed and charming, so I’ll accept his argument that I should vote for him ”

    As with regular ad hominem arguments, not all cases of inverse ad hominem are fallacious. Consider the following:

    ” Elizabeth has never told a lie in her entire life, and she says she saw him take the bag. She must be telling the truth. ”

    Here the arguer is not suggesting we accept Elizabeth’s argument , but her testimony . Her being an honest person is relevant to the truth of the conclusion (that he took the bag), just as her having bad eyesight (a regular case of ad hominem ) would give reason not to believe her. However, the last part of the argument is false even if the premise is true, since having never told a lie before does not mean she isn’t now.

    Appeal to authority is a type of inverse ad hominem argument.

    [ edit ] See also

    Ad feminam
    ” And you are lynching Negroes ”
    Association fallacy
    Fair game (Scientology)
    Fundamental attribution error
    Shooting the messenger

    [ edit ] References

    ^ Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy (1996). ” Example: Ad Hominem “. Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy . Retrieved on September 10 2007 .
    ^ Swift (2007). ” Syvia Browne on the Ropes “. Swift – Weekly Newsletter of the James Randi Educational Foundation . Retrieved on September 10 2007 .
    ^ Bartleby.com (2007). ” ad hominem “. Bartleby.com . Retrieved on September 10 2007 . [ dead link ]
    ^ fallacyfiles.org (2007). ” Argumentum ad Hominem “. fallacyfiles.org . Retrieved on September 10 2007 .

    [ edit ] Sources

    Hurley, Patrick (2000). A Concise Introduction to Logic, Seventh Edition . wadsworth , a division of Thompson Learning . pp. 125–128, 182. ISBN 0534520065 .
    Copi, Irving M. and Cohen, Carl. Introduction to Logic (8th Ed.), p. 97-100.

    [ edit ] Further reading

    Walton, Douglas (1998). Ad Hominem Arguments . Tuscaloosa: University Alabama Press. pp. 240 pp.

    [ edit ] External links

    Nizkor.org: Fallacy: Ad Hominem .
    Nizkor.org: Fallacy: Circumstantial Ad Hominem .
    Argumentum Ad Hominem
    the ad hominem fallacy fallacy
    University of Winnipeg: Argumentation Schemes and Historical Origins of the Circumstantial Ad Hominen Argument PDF  (70.2 KB)
    About.com: Argument Against the Person (Argumentum ad hominem)
    Logical Fallacies: Ad Hominem
    Infidels.org: Logic and Fallacies: Constructing a Logical Argument (Argumentum ad Hominem)
    theness.org: The New England Skeptical Society: How to Argue
    Mission Critical: Introduction to Ad Hominem Fallacies

    Like


  130. Rum,

    I do not suffer fools. If someone is trying to pass off luck and prejudice as merit and truth, they should expect to be called out.

    Like


  131. on August 3, 2009 at 6:30 pm Cannon's Canon

    SA,

    The entertainment value is the flavorless gel cap that lets us swallow the bitter pill. And feminists still like their men dressed well – in fact, as the show demonstrates, they prefer to pick out the clothes themselves!

    Like


  132. Loserfer: a weak, decaffinated version of TokyJesusFist

    Almost makes me miss the original.

    Like


  133. Master Dogan,

    The biggest problem I have with Global Warming proponents is that these are the same people who fight us when we try to build new nuclear plants at every turn. You should see the shitstorm of lawsuits that have already been filed against the TVA because it wants to build a second nuclear reactor at Watts bar.

    The french get 80% of their electricity from nuclear power. Im a big fan of nuclear power. The former blogger Illka Kokkarian, whom I enjoyed reading immensely, pointed out that the greenies will be against any and every method of producing power that actually had a chance of displacing coal and gas, and he certainly has been accurate. Greens are the same people who come out and file suits against wind projects, wave projects, and solar projects and constatntly prattle on about “conservation”. In the future we are going to need more, not less, energy. Nuclear is the cheapest, cleanest, most-out-of-sight energy currently available (unless zero point can really be done, or that Helium 3 jazz the NASA boosters talk about isn’t just an excuse for another moon project), and the Greens fight it tooth and nail.

    That, in a nutshell, is why Im so inclined to really be skeptical and want to wait it out a few more years until its demonstrably warmer even where I live (its been cooler since 98′ in my city in July……………..July of 98′ was 81 degrees as an average temp, it was down to 78-point-something this year, but has never exceeded the 81 degree mark in any year since, getting slightly cooler as a trend since 1998 here). I’d be happy to “do something” about global warming, in the form of building nuclear plants, putting large solar dishes and windmills interspersed high above farmland and along highways, but the greens litigate against this at every turn. I honestly think they’d like to starve us of electricity more than anything else.

    You and 11minutes have a fascinating blog (that I dont always have time to get around to reading) by-the-way. So researched and linked. You two are a quite a thoughtful duo of intelligent men.

    Like


  134. @ seeking alpha:

    “non-anthropogenic” means not human-caused, as I’m sure you know (anthropo = “human”; genic “born from”). But saying we didn’t cause it doesn’t mean we can’t stop it. Maybe it is in our interest to control the climate, maybe it is not. But one can’t make a good call on that question if one refuses to consider it an open question.

    If anything, the mass panic over “climate change” has introduced lots of people to the idea that humans can indeed change the natural environment on a massive scale. Why the possibility of this is even controversial is beyond me. Cloud-seeding works, space flight works, fucking gigantic dams work, watershed-wide irrigation systems work, electricity grids work, air conditioning works, nuclear weapons work. We’ve caused entire species to go extinct and caused entirely new ones to come into being. There’s no reason to think that the weather is magically the one thing in the natural environment we can’t change.

    Once the hysteria over global warming dies down, who knows? Maybe we’ll be left with a bunch of brilliant ideas about manipulating the climate that will make the earth more habitable and life more pleasant for the people on it, a la Freeman Dyson. Once upon a time it would have been insane to think a person could walk on the moon.

    Like


  135. z,

    Greenies want to kill all humans other than themselves. Unless you realize that obvious fact, environmentalist actions do not make sense.

    Like


  136. on August 3, 2009 at 6:35 pm Cannon's Canon

    Thanks Obsidian: I definitely read that whole thing and will absolutely tailor future posts with ALL that in mind. In the future, you should embed some youtube videos to expound a bit further.

    Like


  137. on August 3, 2009 at 6:37 pm Seeking Alpha

    Come on CC, Turtle looked like a jerk-off in that outfit. I don’t think Miss Gold is picking out those suits.

    If a girl shit tests, do you ignore it and enjoy the pussy later or do you denounce the whole gender because of their base motives?

    Just enjoy the hot girls and cool cars and don’t think about it so much.

    But yea, if your buddy says he wants to start acting like Turtle because that got him Jamie-Lynn, then maybe you should get upset and give him one of these

    Like


  138. on August 3, 2009 at 6:40 pm Seeking Alpha

    Heading home… maybe I’ll check for a response later, but…

    @ Master Dogen

    “non-anthropogenic” means not human-caused, as I’m sure you know (anthropo = “human”; genic “born from”). But saying we didn’t cause it doesn’t mean we can’t stop it. Maybe it is in our interest to control the climate, maybe it is not. But one can’t make a good call on that question if one refuses to consider it an open question.

    Well yes, it might mean we can’t stop it. Let’s say – for instance – climate activity is effected 3% by human activity and 97% by, say, solar activity. No matter how much we try and change our own behavior, we’d never be able to change it enough to have an impact.

    Like


  139. Hi Cannon,
    Surely in light of who I was addressing, who has a penchant for nitpicking details, you won’t begrudge me the chance to fully cut and paste an entire fucking Wikipedia entry, so as to make sure that Ms. Dana clearly understands what the fuck she doesn’t know?

    Hmm? 😉

    O

    Like


  140. that showed i didn’t know what an ad hominem was?

    Like


  141. Dana,
    BINGO! Yes! I knew there was hope for you.

    Now…

    Watch The Wire…

    And please give us a 500 word post on what you saw.

    O

    Like


  142. Master Dogen
    Weather systems(and much else) are inherently chaotic. Chaotic systems do not work predictably. They cannot even be reversed predictably. In other words, even if adding CO2 raised average temps, reducing CO2 would by no sure means produce cooling.
    And cloud seeding does NOT work. Rain initiation turns out to be deeply complex. As if it had chaos at the center of it. Billions of dollars have been spent by Governments on cloud seeding. It looked like such a great idea.
    There is a raging drought in much of the American Southwest as we speak. Every day moisture bearing clouds drift above parched landscapes. Why aren’t state governments eagerly seeding the clouds?
    FWIW, China still pretends it works for Maoist reasons. In practice, they “ostentastiously seed in front of active rain storms. Pure PR Bullshit

    Like


  143. i don’t know if anybody pointed it out, but that study is pretty weak. i wouldn’t be surprised to learn that women loved ugly children less than attractive children, but i’ve also seen women who think their little bundle of gross is the cutest thing in the world.

    either way, it doesn’t surprise me at all that this indicates women’s love is more conditional than men’s.

    Like


  144. The dead give-away that promoters of AGW do not even believe it themselves is their ruthless avoidance of the simple question: “What percent of climate change is anthrogenic and what is not?”

    Like


  145. Obsidian:

    you overlooked another black economist, Philly’s own Walter Williams. Personally, i prefer him over Sowell, although Sowell is much more policy oriented. Williams focuses on common-sense approaches to economic issues.

    He’s also a colleague of this blog’s favorite economist, Tyler Cowen.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_E._Williams

    Like


  146. Lucifer,

    On Jews-as-whites. Im going by what Ive read some Jews have written themselves as what they consider themselves and my own personal experience.

    I found out in adulthood that my great grandfather on one side was……………..drum roll please……Jewish. (We have some Chickasaw and Cherokee Indian back there “in the woodpile” also, or so I was informed. I never researched any of that myself, I didn’t care)

    I have an uncle who doesn’t look all that much different than Jewish porn star Ron Jeremy.

    I have a hard time telling Jews apart from everyday whites. They pretty much look the same to me. I also have a time telling those “Irish Traveller” people apart from other “whites” even though they have been ethnically distinct from “other whites” for a long time.

    I do understand about the past however, the forced conversions, the pogroms, et cetera, so obviously the two groups are distinct, even though they oft physically are hard to tell apart.

    BTW—Mark Walhberg, who looks like a typical high-school quarterback or linebacker in Ohio, is of course Jewish. I’d never know he wasn’t yet another average white guy from middle America unless he told me.

    P.S. The gypsies of Europe supposedly have had their DNA traced back to India. I always thought many of these women in particular looked vaugely “Indian”. A bit like that hot chick Ashawria Rai (or however one spells her name). I wasn’t suprised to find that out. Its said the middle age-era Europeans called these people “Gypsies” because they thought they mistakenly came from Egypt, which is of course now proven wrong.

    Like


  147. Chuck,
    Yes, I mentioned Williams in my list of high achieving dark skinned Black Men to Willard over on the Shady Game thread in response to his notion that more and more biracial or otherwise marginally Black Men were on the rise. I still wait for Wilard to speak to my rebuttal.

    Cannon, it never ceases to amaze me how many obstensibly grownassed adults are so easily swayed by a bunch of words on a computer screen that they claim not to like. The answer is simple people-if you don’t like it, don’t freakin’ read it

    And move on.

    See how simple that is?

    O

    Like


  148. Master Dogen

    Thanks for the link. But if cloud seeding REALLY Worked, evidence of its efficacy would not be subtle and only show up with careful and exhaustive study.
    The worthwhile advances in medical science all had one thing in common. When they were tried, no complicated study was needed to discern a benefit.
    Patients given penicillin patients survived almost always infections that had previously been routinely fatal when it was first used in the 1940s.
    This is what “it works” means, imho. And nobody but the Chinese are actually seeding clouds despite horrible drought conditions in many places.

    Like


  149. I ought to occur to us that persecution per se might be a large factor in making the ashkenazim the way they are. I mean, if holding onto an identity is made difficult and challenging, what type of person persists? Repeat for 2000 years and what do you get?
    Check out the history of the Huguenots. They were persecuted for religious reasons in France in the 15th thru the 17th century. Most of the supposed members of that sect gave in to the pressure and accepted the default religion of the French state. A few resisted. Repeat for a few hundred years and what kind of people do you get?
    Eventually, the remnant immigrated to America and some other places. Without exception, they rapidly joined the commercial, intellectual, and political elites in their new countries.
    Nothing about this should be hard to understand.

    Like


  150. Obsidian—

    Women during the campaign-as we all know, she chose to go through w/a Down’s Syndrome pregnancy, which produces, well, less than attractive babies. I am given to understand that Women are much more likely to abort if the baby is proven to have deformities (ie, will be ugly). Hmm.

    Downs syndrome makes kids and adults both ugly and retarded.

    With apologies to those who have deep moral objections to abortions, I think they should all be aborted. Better for the species. And the family. And the health care system/country. It’s cut and dried. They’re a terrible burden. In olden days they’d mostly die off fairly early on if not killed through infanticide. Since it’s incurable, and since propagating the genes for it is evil , since the result is non contributing (except in an ideologically framed way of “returns love”) and a big burden, isn’t it clear?

    Yeah I do believe in limited voluntary individual choice eugenics. So did most progressives in this country and elsewhere until Hitler. What he did was some eugenics against schizophrenics and the retarded but mostly genocide – against if anything the brightest in his and European nations like Poland and Holland and France he was making his (for a moment). I.e. not very much eugenics of the allowed voluntary choice of parents against the unfit and wouldn’t survive outside of the modern world type, nor VOLUNTARY eugenics at all, but rather so called eugenics in order to eliminate his FOLK’s toughest competitors.

    Jewish horror at the Holocaust, totally understandable, lead given their position in American academia and media to national horror at any whiff of eugenics, in any form. That was overreaction. Of course it must be said that some/many religious groups had a lot of trouble with it too, but had at first been overwhelmed by the progressives intellectual firepower n favor.

    I’m just talking about being ok with aborting genetic defect babies and such like. It’s happening a lot today.

    That might get extended with better technology to aborting very low IQ babies voluntarily. Or very high I and low IQ male babys (huge criminal indicators). To try again. Cause you know parents only got 2-3 slots they can afford, usually.

    Like


  151. Clearly, African Americans have evo-adaptations that lend themselves to improvisation, quick, on the fly decision making, and numerous physical gifts as well.

    Yes, and all those talents have lead us to nowhere. Fuck that shit, it’s all IQ and conscientiousness to use it.

    Like


  152. @Doug
    — With apologies to those who have deep moral objections to abortions,

    Abortion is homicide; so is killing a wartime combatant, but I am not a pacificst.

    — I think they should all be aborted. Better for the species.

    No eugenic benefit in aborting Downs. They are infertile.

    — And the family.

    I’ll defer to the more knowledgeable but I understand that many downs syndrome adults make good and loyal caretakers for their aged parents.

    Like


  153. Dave Alex,
    The historical record would disagree. You can start with the Pullman Porters, who played a powerful role in the American labor movement.

    C’mon Dave, get some new material. Ya slippin’.

    O

    Like


  154. on August 3, 2009 at 8:15 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian

    Willard,
    I never said these chess players were heroes of mine. Who’s having trouble comprehending now?

    All blacks who in any way are “beating Whitey” are folk heroes to you whether you want to admit it or not.

    There are slow moving boxers who can nevertheless be highly effective.

    You are confused. Fast twitch muscle and sprinting bio-mechanics are not just about foot speed in the ring. It’s about hand speed and the ability to throw combinations and the use of upper body movement to avoid being hit.

    …would agree w/the general proposition that basketball definitely has a mental/intellectual component to it. In fact, you are the first to argue against that basic point.

    There is nothing intellectual about playing sports.

    As for Thomas, Sowell, etc, as I said, you were responding to my point about Black Women and their playing the role of being the canary in the American social mine.

    They are not. White Americans are the canary in the American coal mine. Specifically poor and working class White Americans.

    It’s over on the Shady Game thread. You were saying how Black Men simply couldn’t get away from Black Women fast enough, and then made the remark that more and more successful Black Men were looking like Obama. Hence my retort that numerous Black Men who were successful clearly didn’t look like Obama at all, Thomas and Sowell among them.

    I mentioned Thomas’ having a White wife because I wanted to know if your views about Black Men in this regard held true for him as well.

    I wrote:

    Notice that Woods and Obama are not black males in the full sense. Both were born of and raised by women who are not the least bit like black American females.

    Increasing numbers of black males are not only rejecting black women, ultimately for racial/genetic and evolutionary reasons, but increasingly successful “black males” don’t even have black mothers.

    This is a double wammy on the ole black mammy.

    You then responded with your usual misrepresentations and “holla back” bullshit.

    Lastly, please understand what I said: Vaux Chess Team played both Black AND WHITE teams, and generally beat them BOTH.

    It was mediocre competition regardless of the race of the opponents.

    If they moved up to the chess “major leagues” they would be crushed.

    Like


  155. Nowadays, a large majority of Downs fetuses are detected and aborted. It is kind of a shame because they made good pets.

    Like


  156. Obsidian —

    Basketball as it’s now played is a test of what guy can play one-on-one the best while the other four guys on each side stand around. It’s a dunking contest, with some running. That’s it. There’s no more strategy than there is soccer (whoever is in best shape at the end of the match wins).

    Blacks used to dominate Boxing, but relative levels of wealth, and the decline of institutions like Kronk’s Gymn and the unwillingness of Blacks as a group to get hit in the head for a living means Mexicans (in the lighter divisions) and Eastern Europeans (in the heavier ones) dominate, while in the UFC it’s all over the map, including Dark and light Brazilians, and so on — most of them from working/middle class backgrounds with enough wealth to train in three styles — Muy Thai, Wrestling, and Ju-Jitsu. Blacks used to be quite prominent in Baseball and now that’ left to Caribbean players and US Whites. Blacks used to be the dominant audience and musicians/composers for Jazz, which is now a predominantly White audience and composer/performer genre.

    Jazz musicians who wrote on the subject noted that improvisation required a thorough backgrounding not only on the melodies and songs that were improvised, but extensive musical theory, wether it was formally obtained through a classical education (Monk, Hampton, Ellington and Davis etc.) or through apprentice-ship (Bird). It’s not something a guy can just “do” — it requires knowing how, why, and when to do it, i.e. a very highly G/IQ loaded measure. There’s just as much evidence to suggest that improv is cultural, and stems from a cultural group producing enough High-IQ/G people with enough free wealth to study fundamentals of an activity and improvise (by “bending” rules just enough) to produce on-the-fly mastery. Along with an innate desire to show subject mastery by doing such on the fly.

    The ebb-flow of improv (Blacks and Whites at different times are better at it) suggests strongly a sexual selection component that must be “just right” as well as enough “free wealth” to support it: relatively High IQ people or at least “enough” of them, enough wealth, and a desire to display mastery of difficult subject matter rather than dominance displays (i.e. shooting someone). IMHO a hard-wired genetic component does not explain variance over time of improv among various populations.

    Like


  157. This is a double wammy on the ole black mammy.

    Is there a more abased segment of humanity than the black woman? by their own men?

    Like during Katrina, when emergency services recorded scores of black women with their babies drowning in thier attics as water rose? The 9-1-1 operators who talked these women until water overcame their heads or shorted out their cell phones no doubt will have nightmares to the day they die.

    Were the black men rowing boats and cutting holes in roofs, like white men of any social class would have done? Naah, they were looting the Walmart.

    Like


  158. The historical record would disagree.

    I want a black society that’s truly equal to it’s white and Northeast Asian counterpart. While the Pullman Porters were hard-working men who stood their ground and fought for their rights, for the purpose of this conversation, they don’t count. Until we get IQ parity with whites, we will never be equal, and we can never compete with whites and Asians.

    Like


  159. on August 3, 2009 at 8:28 pm Willard Libby

    Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ Willard Libby

    I said boxing is a bio mechanical variation on a short distance sprint.

    Yes and no. You clearly don’t have a lot of experience with boxing. And probably not with sprinting, either.

    Actual I have experience in both and I have been a follower of boxing and track and field history since I was a kid.

    Boxing obviously has sprint-like components, but it’s much more akin to fartlek training than to sprinting. (Boxers aren’t built like mid-distance runners, who do actual fartlek training, but that’s an artifact of the fact that boxers need strength and a certain amount of size, to hit stuff, while size is nothing but a liability to runners.)

    My point was not that boxers make great sprinters or vice verse. My point was that the rise of the black boxers in the 20th century was due to the advantages of greater fast twitch muscle in relation to body weight and sprinting biomechanics. I said it was an advantage not the be all and end all.

    West African descended blacks are the population from which a huge percentage of top sprinters, football speed players and boxers come from. The bio-mechanical demands of many major sports advantage those athletes with fast twitch muscle and sprinter bio-mechanics.

    True sprinters wouldn’t last more than a round or two into a boxing match, although 400m guys (who train above the lactate threshold) could hold their own.

    Jermaine Taylor was the Arkansas state 400 meter champion yet he is notorious for his lack of late round stamina.

    If you think fast twitch muscle fiber/sprinter biomechanics don’t contribute to the hand and foot speed advantages of boxers then so be it.

    It is a major advantage, I never said it was everything.

    If you want to believe that Muhammad Ali, Ray Robinson, Ray Leonard, Floyd Mayweather, Mike Tyson, Roy Jones and others didn’t start off the huge advantages simple based on the genetics of speed you are living in a fantasy land.

    Like


  160. on August 3, 2009 at 8:32 pm Mu'Min seeks FAT WuMin

    Obese-dian,

    Picking up where we left off, we have agreed that :

    1) A black man will essentially fuck ANY woman who is willing. You have said this yourself.

    2) A non-black man usually will not. There is a certain floor that these men will not go below, even if celibacy is the alternative.

    This is the key difference between black and non-black men. Do you agree?

    Like


  161. on August 3, 2009 at 8:34 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian

    Willard also made a curious remark over on the Shady Game thread, that suggested that Black Men were inherently lazy, based on ancestral norms in primarily West Africa. If this was true, why did White Slavers continue to import Black Men, and instead simply import Black Women?

    African power structures ran the African side of the triangle trade. They exported black males disproportionately because they were a surplus population to the polygamous and female agricultural labor based economies of west Africa.

    Like


  162. on August 3, 2009 at 8:36 pm Willard Libby

    z

    BTW—Mark Walhberg, who looks like a typical high-school quarterback or linebacker in Ohio, is of course Jewish. I’d never know he wasn’t yet another average white guy from middle America unless he told me.

    Wahlberg has a Swedish father and Irish mother. He was raised Roman Catholic.

    Like


  163. on August 3, 2009 at 8:38 pm Mu'Min seeks FAT WuMin

    African power structures ran the African side of the triangle trade. They exported black males disproportionately because they were a surplus

    Yes. That AND the fact that they needed labor immediately, not after 16 years of raising the offspring of a black woman.

    Plus, as slaves, there was no wage to be paid for black male labor. Once slavery ended, the free market saw that a fair portion of black men could not do work that justified a significant wage. They were only worth having if they were free of charge.

    Like


  164. @ Epoxytocin No. 87

    I think that women are bad at communicating at any level.

    I am not saying that men are great communicators. I am saying that women are not good communicators.

    I mean, are the best marketers or ad copywriters women? Comedians? Do women write the best songs and movies? No

    Do they make the best speech writers? I don’t know. Some DC types must know.

    Do they have vastly better friendships than men? Their friendships are shallow.

    What are some good tests for this?

    You can argue that women are somehow held back and that men have an unnatural advantage. Maybe 25 years ago, but not since then.

    It’s a myth. I say it is false. I want to see evidence that it is not false.

    Like


  165. Roissy should really run an over/under on how many comments it will take for a given post to turn into a race thread and, maybe, odds on who will be the first commenter to take Obsidian’s endless bait for it.

    Like


  166. @HungryHungryHippos:

    “Jesus fucking christ mandy you’re fucking retarded. A scientific study is entirely discounted because you can think of a few theoretical counterexamples about what women say in your person life?”

    Was this supposed to be directed at me? I didn’t provide any counterexamples. In fact, I provided personal examples, some that involved women from my “person” life (“I’d rather have an autistic child than an ugly one!”) and others that actually come from history.

    Maybe you should take some lessons in reading comprehension.

    [I checked to see if mandybeenhereawhile had done any such thing before posting this, and it seems as though she hasn’t either. I really don’t understand this person, but hey]

    Like


  167. Wahlberg has a Swedish father and Irish mother. He was raised Roman Catholic.

    He also should be the hero of a few commenters here:

    “As a teenager, Wahlberg was implicated in several acts of violence and vandalism. At fifteen, he was amongst a group who threw rocks at a group of African American school children on a field trip while shouting racial epithets; the rocks hit their targets and caused several injuries.[2] The following year, Wahlberg robbed a pharmacy while he was under the influence of PCP. During the commission of the crime, he again used racial epithets. He knocked one middle aged Vietnamese man unconscious and permanently blinded another in one eye before he was arrested by the police.[3][4] Wahlberg was tried as an adult and charged for attempted murder. Pleading guilty to the lesser charge of assault, he was sentenced to two years in jail at Boston’s Deer Island House of Correction, of which he served 45 days.[5] In yet another incident, the 21-year-old Wahlberg fractured the jaw of a neighbor in an unprovoked attack.[6]”

    Like


  168. Monkey Man,
    I would kindly suggest you actually ask around among Black Men, some I don’t know, 10MIL plus of them? From what I’ve seen at the local Walmart, quite a few White Men are willing to fuck anything.

    O

    Like


  169. Dang…I can’t look at Wahlberg the same way ever again.

    And that’s not in a good way.

    Like


  170. I do believe in unconditional love.

    As I type this, my mother is dying. Her head is shaved, her body is shriveled, she can’t go to the bathroom by herself and she can’t form a complete sentence. The beautiful woman she was is gone, replaced by a ravaged husk. My dad is a fierce warrior of a man. There is nothing beta about him. After 30 years of marriage he has to change her, bathe her and take her to the bathroom. He does this every day, day in and day out. He looks at her with absolute love in his eyes.

    All the one night stands and bar chicks in the world can’t compete with the love I see in front of me every day. Those who don’t believe in unconditional love haven’t witnessed it, and don’t have 1/10 of the character or courage it takes to live it. I know what it means. I think Gunslinger does too.

    One of these days we will all be shitting our little putrid souls away into a bedpan. We will be lucky to have someone beside us whose idea of love is a tiny bit more expansive than the sexual market allows.

    [editor: your father’s devotion to your mother is admirable. and i say this sincerely. but this is more an example of “unconditional” commitment than it is of unconditional love. i put unconditional in quotes because commitment by its very nature is a sacrifice.]

    Like


  171. It is ironic that so many idiots obsess over race when their future is being destroyed by the greed and hubris of ivy league priests.

    Do you think they really give a fuck about your beliefs on race? They are in it for short term gains, and the only color they care about is green.

    Like


  172. Willard,
    W/all due respect you still haven’t answered my question; all you’ve done is explain the nature of African society and the motivations of certain African tribal leaders to export their putatively surplus Male population (of course, this doesn’t explain why so many Women were also “exported” since they were clearly more valuable in African society for the reasons Willard suggests).

    This isn’t a supply side question but a demand side one. WHY did White Slavers continue to import African Males if they knew they were poor workers? What benefit did that serve? Please explain?

    O

    Like


  173. Roissy,

    I just got diagnosed with bipolar disorder.

    What finally brought me to seek medical attention was G-A-M-E.

    I love women.

    I understand em cuz I’m intelligent or whatever.

    Point is, live in your emotions and you’ll get laid like crazy.

    Also, if you’re interested, we can talk more.

    Jables

    (p.s. recognize this style of writing?)
    (p.s.s. do you like puzzles?)

    jeez I could talk about “do you like puzzles?” forever

    Like


  174. @kalli0pe:

    I’d rather not get into details about my life, but my parents are in a somewhat similar situation, and I do see some beautiful acts of love amongst us each day.

    It’s best to remember that even though this blog is about the worst of people, people are capable of doing great, great things out of love.

    Like


  175. Kalliope,
    Tru dat, sis. Tru dat.

    O

    Like


  176. on August 3, 2009 at 9:00 pm to do with the theme of unconditional love

    Roissy – read “one” by Richard Bach. It deals with unconditional love, and how it does not exist. Takes a while, but about 1/2 or 3/4 through the book (it’s been years since I read it) there is some thoughts on the topic I know you will enjoy.

    Like


  177. Non-feminists ‘more hostile’ towards men than feminists, study finds

    http://www.thefword.org.uk/blog/2009/07/non-feminist_mo

    Like


  178. Were the black men rowing boats and cutting holes in roofs, like white men of any social class would have done? Naah, they were looting the Walmart.

    Mean-Spirited Statement: Why would black men want to save ugly women?

    Theoretical Statement: Given that the men and women left in New Orleans were its poorest residents, one could presume that there is low investment in general in both sexes in each other in that demographic segment. Besides, given the opportunity costs, it makes more sense to loot than to risk dying for a woman you don’t know.

    Like


  179. Were the black men rowing boats and cutting holes in roofs, like white men of any social class would have done? Naah, they were looting the Walmart.

    That isn’t true at all. I lived in New Orleans at the time and there were PLENTY of black men doing just that, quietly getting food and water to their neighbors and trying to help their families. The fucking media just preferred to show the looters because it was better TV.

    Like


  180. PA, Obsidian–

    Like during Katrina, when emergency services recorded scores of black women with their babies drowning in thier attics as water rose? The 9-1-1 operators who talked these women until water overcame their heads or shorted out their cell phones no doubt will have nightmares to the day they die.

    Were the black men rowing boats and cutting holes in roofs, like white men of any social class would have done? Naah, they were looting the Walmart.

    I think there is a lot of truth to this and I’d like to hear from Obsidian on it.

    Where where the LOCAL black men helping out in that crisis on a voluntary basis? Where? Unlike tons of white men including local ones. Only a few outside black volunteers. You’ve already told us that 3/4 of blacks are middle class or above. So why? (I haven’t checked; may be exaggerated; but a whole lot are today.)

    What about the huge ineffectiveness of New Orleans’ own black lead and heavily black populated government, including police and fire/rescue forces? Don’t tell me whites are also corrupt and ineffectual. Yeah, true. But’s not a dichotomy, and either or. It’s a how much. And what happens when the shitte hits the fan? Are they there for the community then? So many of New Orleans mostly black cops we’re. So many. Looting themselves. And scurring away. Altruism even for their own kind, NOT.

    The media made endless excuses in a transparent attempt to shield New Orleans black leaders and government from more than “their fair share of blame”, which of course, and uniquely in the early days of a massive local disaster, was placed at the Republican President”s feet, Bush2.

    I was shocked by New Orleans. Not at Bush. But at Black lack of help their own kind altruism, or even basic survival skills, in that city. Yes shocked. I had no idea.

    Like


  181. First off Dave Alex, *build the society you claim to want*. Ain’t nothin’ stopping you. Partner up w/people of like mind, and go from there. Its been done before, many times. You’re clearly a smart Man-why not?

    Second, you really need to study the Pullman Porters, an irony given your passion for rail history. Many of them were highly educated Men coming out of places like Morehouse. Read up on them, there’s an entire book devoted to them.

    I’ve said earlier that there are more than one way to assess intelligence. IQ is one of many ways to assess this.

    You also are operating under a false assumption if you think that the White, Asian and Black races in America all started out at the same place socially, politically etc. They didn’t. African Americans were deliberately kept from competing for centuries. This isn’t true of Whites, and while Asians have certainly seen their fair share of discrimination, they haven’t born the brunt of what Black folks had to deal with.

    Think things through Dave.

    O

    Like


  182. Kalliope–

    I do believe in unconditional love.

    As I type this, my mother is dying. Her head is shaved, her body is shriveled, she can’t go to the bathroom by herself and she can’t form a complete sentence.

    That’s not unconditional love.

    But it’s beautiful Kalli0pe.

    Your mother has earned it.

    Men used to believe, and many of the feminist/chivalrous fools still do believe that women have it in their nature/are schooled to give and keep giving unconditional love once they truly feel love themselves and commit.

    If that was ever true, as opposed to partly with a lot of economic incentive to act that way, and big time disincentive to act another way, it seems to not be true today. Not for most AMERICAN feminist influenced women. Not by a long shot.

    Like


  183. on August 3, 2009 at 9:20 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian

    Willard,

    This isn’t a supply side question but a demand side one.

    You are the one choosing to make it a demand side issue. Why deny African agency in the running of the Atlantic slave trade? Without the supply the demand is meaningless.

    Obviously, the importation of female slaves was necessary to create a breeding population on the west side of the Atlantic.

    WHY did White Slavers continue to import African Males if they knew they were poor workers?

    I don’t think they knew they were poor workers and it was the predominantly available labor force.

    What benefit did that serve?

    African sellers, European buyers.

    Mandy! XD

    Dang…I can’t look at Wahlberg the same way ever again.

    So true. Now I realize the guy wasn’t a complete fucking fag.

    kalli0pe

    I do believe in unconditional love.

    As I type this, my mother is dying. Her head is shaved, her body is shriveled, she can’t go to the bathroom by herself and she can’t form a complete sentence. The beautiful woman she was is gone, replaced by a ravaged husk. My dad is a fierce warrior of a man. There is nothing beta about him. After 30 years of marriage he has to change her, bathe her and take her to the bathroom. He does this every day, day in and day out. He looks at her with absolute love in his eyes………….

    Thanks for that Lifetime movie of the week.

    Well, he’s a better man than I’ll ever be. I give him that.

    Like


  184. I was shocked by New Orleans. Not at Bush. But at Black lack of help their own kind altruism, or even basic survival skills, in that city. Yes shocked. I had no idea.

    But on the other hand, Black Men can dance and clap and have more natural game, on average.

    Like


  185. I’ll ignore the Al Gore comment. Check out my blog to get a better idea of who I am; I’m sure you won’t make that mistake again.

    You got the Al Gore comment because of your “99% agree” statement, a myth regardless of your blog.

    To satisfy your critique I will modify my phrasing. “GW” is a fact, at least in recent decades and indeed much further back.

    Global temperature has been flat for most of this decade, and rapidly falling in the past couple of years. (At least according to three of the four published data sets, but I wouldn’t trust the constantly-revised GISS data as far as I could throw Hansen.) As for “much further back”, from the time we started taking ground measurements the climate has moved in a pretty obvious, roughly 30 year cycle. The 20th century as a whole saw warming because it contained two warm cycles versus one cool one. We’re now starting the 21st century with a cooling cycle, pretty much on the dot btw.

    Want to go further back? You could say the 20th century was warm compared to the past few centuries based on proxy data, but then one would expect that given the natural recovery from the Little Ice Age. What you can’t reasonably say is that the 20th century was any warmer than the Medieval or Roman climate optimums which had nothing to do with anthropogenic CO2.

    Whether it’s “A” or not is in dispute, though there’s a lot of evidence that it is

    What evidence? Correlation is not causation, and the arguments offered as proof that man was the cause of 20th century warming all boil down to this: the 20th century happened to be on the balance a warmer one, and also happened to be a century of rising CO2 output.

    But a closer look reveals the cycle I mentioned above. CO2 ramped up significantly post WWII, yet the best ground data shows a cooling trend from the 1940’s to the 1970’s. CO2 output for this decade was higher than projected in the 1990’s, yet temperature has been flat and is now falling. So there’s not even a strong correlation.

    For the record I’m of the opinion that CO2 has its expected impact, but that none of the positive feedback mechanisms presumed to exist in climate models actually exist, or exist to the extent that they overwhelm negative feedbacks. CO2 cannot by itself force the warming predicted by the AGW crowd. It’s actually a weak influence. The only way the AGW crowd can predict temperature increases worthy of note is by assuming overwhelming positive feedback. Minus those presumed feedbacks CO2’s signature probably can’t even be detected, only modeled based on what we know of physics.

    But whether it’s anthropogenic or not is beside the point. Thirty year and ten year trends have unquestionably gone up.

    You better check the last 10 years.

    If it turns out to have been all a case of massive, simultaneous scientific hallucination, I’ll be happy about it,

    Again with the myth that everyone is in agreement. The entire climate community was never in agreement on this. There has always been a solid body of skeptics, mainly because there has always been a complete lack of real scientific proof from the AGW crowd. If anything disagreement has grown over the past decade. AGW is a theory pushed by a subset of the community. Consensus, which isn’t science any way, is a myth in this case, not a fact.

    On the other hand, even if the most severe predictions are correct, and even if it’s all anthropogenic, I still think economic growth and techical innovation will be far more effective in mitigating any negative effects.

    Agreed. I’ll go one step further: it is impossible to move humanity off carbon based fuels in less than 100 years. Assuming the AGW crowd is right, rather than panicking and passing economy killing laws which don’t put a dent in global CO2 output, we should be taking the long view and developing the technology necessary to move away from fossil fuels over a 100 year transition period.

    Like


  186. Greenies want to kill all humans other than themselves. Unless you realize that obvious fact, environmentalist actions do not make sense.

    Quoted for truth. Half Sigma calls environmentalism the religion of Gaia worship, and I’m inclined to agree. They think humans are a plague on Earth and fight at every turn to limit and reverse population. They don’t want to see nuclear replace coal because in their moral view AGW is just a symptom of the REAL problem: human beings. Their goal is to limit energy and thereby limit human lifespan and reproduction, not find carbon free sources of energy.

    Like


  187. Doug1, with all due respect (and you know I respect you tons), unless you were in New Orleans at the time you have NO IDEA of what really went down there. What was reported in the national media was a sick cartoon. It was in the best interest of the government and its mouthpiece to portray civilians as a bunch of idiotic looters in order to justify its abysmal relief response. And I worked on this from both sides, as both a refugee and a federal agent. I know the PR spin because we helped spin it.

    The truth is, there was a HUGE amount of local grassroots and community effort, it just wasn’t nearly enough – especially with a civilian population so lacking in resources, and with so little federal support, and just the sheer fucking amount of damage and destruction. Katrina is not a good example of the point being made here.

    Sorry, not trying to be a bitch here, this is just a massive sore spot for me.

    Like


  188. on August 3, 2009 at 9:34 pm Tupac Chopra

    Obs:

    Yes, I am familiar w/the more formal terms for such things as Logical Fallacies, but again, I focus on the forrest, you on the pine needles, as is a Woman’s way. In the popular lexicon, “Ad Hominem” is often taken to encompass ANY FORM of logical fallacy. Not just those “against the Man” or, in this case, “an appeal to authority”.

    Learn to take a step back and see the big picture, hmm?

    Stop being dense, O. You were schooled on the proper use of “ad hominem” a long time ago, yet you refused to take the lesson to heart and continued to persist in your inanity.

    Terms have meanings.

    You’re clearly educated, why hurt your image.

    You’re starting to come across like Oswald Bates.

    Like


  189. I am reminded of this quote, that is not really relevant

    “Delusions are often functional. A mother’s opinions about her children’s beauty, intelligence, goodness, et cetera ad nauseam, keep her from drowning them at birth.”

    – Robert A Heinlein (The notebooks of Lazarus Long).

    Like


  190. the importation of female slaves was necessary

    blah blah blah

    I have developed a sophisticated and refined theory about why black women went to slavery willingly. If I wasn´t an internet neandertal unable to link one of my posts, I´d link it here

    He looks at her with absolute love in his eyes

    I smoke cigars, I drink EVERY DAY, I have a moto and I tend to provoke fights. I do my part for an early death but not so early that I don´t leave my children an inheritance

    Like


  191. there was a HUGE amount of local grassroots and community effort, it just wasn’t nearly enough – especially with a civilian population so lacking in resources

    you are not describing Katrina, you are describing India and Sri Lanka after the tsunami. I know that because “so lacking in resources” is a phrase that could never be applied to black Americans, who live better lifes than, say, 80% of the Human race.

    Like


  192. gig: How much do you drink every day? Building evidence seems to be showing that a modest amount is healthy.

    Like


  193. I’ve always disliked Mark Wahlberg. Thanks for reminding me why. A cheap punk all round. I doubt he’s changed. People seldom do.

    No wonder women are all over the guy.

    Like


  194. on August 3, 2009 at 9:52 pm Tupac Chopra

    gig:

    there was a HUGE amount of local grassroots and community effort, it just wasn’t nearly enough – especially with a civilian population so lacking in resources

    you are not describing Katrina, you are describing India and Sri Lanka after the tsunami. I know that because “so lacking in resources” is a phrase that could never be applied to black Americans, who live better lifes than, say, 80% of the Human race.

    QFT

    No fucking excuse.

    Like


  195. I see your point gig, but flood water is flood water. If you don’t have a car or other means of escape, you’re screwed regardless. Especially if roads are blocked and the national guard won’t let you cross the toll bridge, for example. I agree American blacks got a better break than the tsunami victims, hence the much lower death toll.

    And your plan for an early death may be counterproductive – didn’t the oldest living man just attribute his longevity to cigarettes, whiskey and wild women? You might be kicking around drinking, smoking and carousing longer than you think!

    Like


  196. having more than one child, any parent will tend to choose one as the first option.

    but parents, both men and women, are genetically programedto ignore defects in their children, and unless there is an Aphrodite or an Apollo as offspring, parents won´t despise the “lesser” children.

    The amount of self-denial of parents towards their children´s problems is probably the greatest a human being can sustain for long periods.

    parents will despise children only if there is too much status difference or if the children is an omega or a 1-3 (if female)

    Like


  197. @doug1:

    “If that was ever true, as opposed to partly with a lot of economic incentive to act that way, and big time disincentive to act another way, it seems to not be true today. Not for most AMERICAN feminist influenced women. Not by a long shot.”

    I think one of the movies that reminded me of the difference between American mothers and Hispanic mothers was “Spanglish.” The only thing was that the Hispanic mother was a single mother, but you could see the love and dedication she had to her daughter. The American mother abandoned her daughter and family by having an affair and practically trying to steal the Hispanic mother’s daughter because she was so much prettier and smarter than her own.

    It was interesting.

    Like


  198. I drink one or two doses of whisky -Jack daniels is my choice usually – every day once I arrive at home.

    then a dose of Port Wine before sleeping. In weekends I drink heavily. And in happy hours during the week, usually one or two times from monday till thursady, I don´t drink whisky/port but I do drink lots of beer.

    I am technically alcoholic

    Like


  199. If you don’t have a car

    if you havent noticed, you just made my point about the wealthy lifes of black Americans.

    if I don´t die early, at least I do my part for a sudden death.

    Like


  200. well, I don´t drink more than 3or 4 “pints” (the unit of measurement here is different) of beer in happy hours, so it cannot be described as “heavily”

    Like


  201. you know you are an anti-semite when someone describes the criminal life of a superstar and the only question popping in your mind is “is he jewish?”

    Like


  202. Tupac, you heard what the fuck I said, I did not stutter. I used Ad Hominem in the way it is commonly understood, as laidout in the Wikipedia entry that I posted in its entirety. YOU stop trying to be Capt. Sav-A-Obstuse Broad.

    O

    Like


  203. Um, Jewish men are really sexy. I’m not referring to Mark Wahlberg, because he isn’t my type, but mmmm, Jeff Goldblum, Jerry Seinfeld, Woody Allen..!

    Like


  204. on August 3, 2009 at 10:17 pm Cannon's Canon

    Like


  205. Obs:

    Tupac, you heard what the fuck I said, I did not stutter. I used Ad Hominem in the way it is commonly understood

    From your Wiki quote:

    Ad hominem argument is most commonly used to refer specifically to the ad hominem abusive , or argumentum ad personam , which consists of criticizing or attacking the person who proposed the argument ( personal attack ) in an attempt to discredit the argument.

    This distinguishes ad hominem as being a distinct from of logical fallacy, and not a catch-all term for logical fallacies.

    Did

    I

    Stutter

    Punk?

    Like


  206. Willard,
    Again, w/all due respect you’re dodging the questions, based on your own comments. If indeed Black Men are inherently lazy due to the nature of African society, why would White Slavers continue to purchase large numbers of said slave labor, for decades, if not centuries? Surely, they would have caught on eventually. How do you explain this?

    O

    Like


  207. …Jon Stewart, Paul Reiser, David Duchovny…

    Like


  208. TuChump,
    You missed

    The part

    Where

    An Appeal to Authority

    Was also considered

    An Ad Hominem attack

    Aka “inverted Ad Hominem”

    Tu Comprende Cabron?

    O

    Like


  209. obs:

    TuChump,
    You missed

    The part

    Where

    An Appeal to Authority

    Was also considered

    An Ad Hominem attack

    Aka “inverted Ad Hominem”

    I missed that part.

    But I didn’t miss your original claim, which was:

    In the popular lexicon, “Ad Hominem” is often taken to encompass ANY FORM of logical fallacy.

    Try again. Thx for playing.

    Like


  210. tupac, were you in the philly hardcore scene circa 1984-87?

    Like


  211. I was but a wee boy during that time.

    Like


  212. Doug,
    You wanted my view on Hurricane Katrina.

    My view is that there was plenty of blame to go around, starting at the local level city and state gov’t, both of whom I considered to be grossly inept.

    Wrt looting and the like, if one considers other disasters in American history they will quickly find that Black folk hardly have the lock on looting and the like. That said, it doesn’t excuse in any way said actions.

    As for single Black mothers not being aided by Black Men, I am not aware of this. Perhaps Kalliope is better able to speak to this, as she seems to have been closer to the action so to speak.

    Yes, middle class Blacks are at least as large as their underclass brethren and according to many studies done considerably larger. When it comes to New Orleans, most of its middle class Black population had long been evacuated. What was left were those primarily from the Lower Ninth Ward.

    I fail to see the point in bringing up Katrina, other than to once again, hate on Black folk. The floods of Galveston TX decades earlier, the tornadoes out in the Heartland in the 50s and more, were far and away worse both in numbers of casualties and in scope, than Katrina on balance, and they involved yup, you guessed it, White folks. But only Katrina gets mentioned and only Black folk get singled out.

    Hmm.

    O

    Like


  213. DT: Thanks for the input. I’ll read more.

    Rum: If something works dramatically or subtly, it still works. Tons and tons of science operates on those “6-10%” margins. Tiny margins are what enable massive feats like the moon landing.

    But your point is well taken, that cloud seeding is not a resounding success the way, say, penicillin was.

    Nevertheless, my original point is that if humans are capable of all the above things (nuclear weapons, species extinction, continental electrical grids), I’m baffled as to why people think it’s so crazy that we might be able to deliberately manipulate the environment. And, others, please don’t give me that “inherently unpredictable” argument. The atmosphere in the Pre-Cambrian period was radically different than it is now, and there are specific reasons for this, whether or not we fully understand them. Yes, it’s tricky to model things, but the idea that the climate is somehow some seperate magisterium like angels or vampires that we will never truly understand is just flat out absurd.

    I rest assured that people will continue claiming so anyway.

    Like


  214. tupac my fault, i thought you said on another thread you thought you knew me and did i sew my own clothes for parties and shows

    Like


  215. did you?

    Like


  216. Tupac,
    Yes, what you quoted by me was accurate. And I stand by it, buttressed by the Wikipedia quote I posted on the issue. “Ad Hominem” in common everyday usuage can be applied/taken to mean the whole range of logical fallacies, of which Appeal to Authority is one. Per the Wikipedia entry, again.

    🙂

    O

    Like


  217. Obs:

    Yes, what you quoted by me was accurate. And I stand by it, buttressed by the Wikipedia quote I posted on the issue.

    No, it’s not supported by your Wiki entry.

    But do go on, Mr. Bates

    Like


  218. Nevertheless, my original point is that if humans are capable of all the above things (nuclear weapons, species extinction, continental electrical grids), I’m baffled as to why people think it’s so crazy that we might be able to deliberately manipulate the environment.

    Those things aren’t comparable to climate manipulation. Now I wouldn’t say we can’t influence the climate, or that we will never be able to in a noticeable and directed fashion. But it’s a very large problem currently beyond our abilities in terms of technology and energy. I would guess that we are centuries away from being able to have any significant, predictable, directed impact.

    Right now we can’t figure out how to disrupt hurricanes which represent a small fraction of the total energy driving the atmosphere. Altering the climate is quite a ways off.

    Like


  219. on August 3, 2009 at 11:20 pm Willard Libby

    S.

    Um, Jewish men are really sexy. I’m not referring to Mark Wahlberg, because he isn’t my type, …..

    He’s also not Jewish.

    Like


  220. Hi Willard,
    Since this is getting a bit long in the tooth, allow me to respond point for point:

    on August 3, 2009 at 8:15 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian

    Willard,
    I never said these chess players were heroes of mine. Who’s having trouble comprehending now?

    W: All blacks who in any way are “beating Whitey” are folk heroes to you whether you want to admit it or not.

    O: I suppose we can add “psychic” to your resume, eh?

    O: There are slow moving boxers who can nevertheless be highly effective.

    W: You are confused. Fast twitch muscle and sprinting bio-mechanics are not just about foot speed in the ring. It’s about hand speed and the ability to throw combinations and the use of upper body movement to avoid being hit.

    Mu: I never mentioned anything about foot speed of foot-anything, Willard. You are confused. What I said was that Boxing does indeed have a mental/intellectual component involved. Period. Now unless you can discuss boxing from the standpoint of one who’s done it, like I have, we really should cease and desist this discussion while you’re ahead.

    O: …would agree w/the general proposition that basketball definitely has a mental/intellectual component to it. In fact, you are the first to argue against that basic point.

    W: There is nothing intellectual about playing sports.

    O: Tell that to Tiger Woods, or any of the NFL coaches and quaterbacks who have to study thick playbooks. And holla back.

    O: As for Thomas, Sowell, etc, as I said, you were responding to my point about Black Women and their playing the role of being the canary in the American social mine.

    W: They are not. White Americans are the canary in the American coal mine. Specifically poor and working class White Americans.

    O: Well, I beg to differ, as do quite a number of other folks. Poor Whites simply don’t garner interest for study of social issues in the same way that African Americans do; perhaps you can name me the equivalent of DuBois in terms of studying Poor Whites?

    O: It’s over on the Shady Game thread. You were saying how Black Men simply couldn’t get away from Black Women fast enough, and then made the remark that more and more successful Black Men were looking like Obama. Hence my retort that numerous Black Men who were successful clearly didn’t look like Obama at all, Thomas and Sowell among them.

    O: I mentioned Thomas’ having a White wife because I wanted to know if your views about Black Men in this regard held true for him as well.

    O: You still have not responded to this, sir.

    W: I wrote:
    … Notice that Woods and Obama are not black males in the full sense. Both were born of and raised by women who are not the least bit like black American females.

    O: Wrong. In America, according to people who look a lot closer to you than me, “one drop of Black blood” makes you Black. Adam Clayton Powell was clearly more fair skinned than both Woods and Obama, yet he identified as and was recognized as a Black Man. Same deal w/Malcolm X, and Thurgood Marshall (who was far and away a superior candidate for the Supreme Court, having actually argued many cases before the court AND WON, unlike Thomas who was a clear affirmative action nominee)

    W: Increasing numbers of black males are not only rejecting black women, ultimately for racial/genetic and evolutionary reasons, but increasingly successful “black males” don’t even have black mothers.

    O: Actually, this is factually untrue. The vast majority of Black Men marry and have children with Black Women. Kinda shoots through your “evolutionary/genetic and racial” arguments. *shrug*

    W: This is a double wammy on the ole black mammy.

    O: Didn’t know you were a fan of the Jesse Jackson style of rhyming.

    W: You then responded with your usual misrepresentations and “holla back” bullshit.

    O: And you didn’t actually respond to my questions or points at all…

    O: Lastly, please understand what I said: Vaux Chess Team played both Black AND WHITE teams, and generally beat them BOTH.

    W: It was mediocre competition regardless of the race of the opponents.

    O: Says the Man who’s boxed Golden Gloves and played B-Ball at the All-Public and Division 1 levels…yes?

    W: If they moved up to the chess “major leagues” they would be crushed.

    O: Yup, and *if* elephants had wings, they too could fly. You’re still not getting my point. Which is, that Blacks have gifts when it comes to improvisation, quick decision making and the like, that Sailer has written extensively about. Please review what he said?

    Oh, and holla back

    O

    Like


  221. There were a bunch of Black guys (and also White) from East New Orleans and other places out in boats (everyone hunts and fishes in Louisiana) out rescuing people. No one organized them. They just did it. That was the Black working and middle class. Good people, all in all.

    What was a disaster was the folks in the projects who did nothing, and expected to be taken care of. All initiative just sucked out of them. If anyone thinks this characterized New Orleans, in the past, they are sadly mistaken. New Orleans was ALWAYS rough, just read Louis Armstrong’s autobiography (which he wrote without a ghost writer) or the Library of Congress records of oral history with Jelly Roll Morton (shamefully abused by that no-account hack, August Wilson). BUT … it had a whole host of benevolent societies and New Orleans under Segregation was the capitol of Black America. Jazz Fest has a whole bunch of wealthy Black suburbanites who come back to New Orleans every year and partake of the rich history of self-organized, Booker T. Washington Black America. And then flee the unpleasant reality of welfare dependent Projects-New Orleans for places in Suburban Atlanta, Tyler Perry Home Country.

    I’ve lived in New Orleans. A place I hated and loved (it’s hard to describe it) and still do. Just as I hate and love Southern California. Hard to describe that … you just have to live it. Nostalgia at war with reality every second. Both at times aching physically beautiful places and monumentally ugly too.

    New Orleans is at it’s best when it’s cold, and people are gearing up for Mardis Gras. During August it’s hell on earth. LA is best during October — the autumn light, sound, and smells, particularly at the beach, have to be seen and experienced yourself. I can well understand Louis Armstrong’s description of how he hated and loved New Orleans, and could not wait to leave yet missed it every day.

    Like


  222. Whiskey:

    I’ve lived in New Orleans. A place I hated and loved (it’s hard to describe it) and still do. Just as I hate and love Southern California.

    What do you think of Texas? Austin, specifically?

    I’m seriously thinking of moving.

    Like


  223. Whiskey,
    Thanks for the very good post on the Big Easy. Literally the home of Jazz. Terrance Blanchard, the Marsalis clan, and of course, Louis Armstrong, just to name a few.

    On the other thread you mentioned how Armstrong was vilified in some quarters for being an “Uncle Tom” and I felt that was so unfair. In so many ways he was a true pioneer, and NO ONE could play a horn like him, to this day. Simply put, Louie Armstrong is Da Man.

    Period.

    O

    Like


  224. on August 3, 2009 at 11:59 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian

    O: I suppose we can add “psychic” to your resume, eh?

    You’re into astrology not me.

    Mu: I never mentioned anything about foot speed of foot-anything, Willard. You are confused. What I said was that Boxing does indeed have a mental/intellectual component involved. Period. Now unless you can discuss boxing from the standpoint of one who’s done it, like I have, we really should cease and desist this discussion while you’re ahead.

    Nothing intellectual about boxing except writing about it.

    W: There is nothing intellectual about playing sports.

    O: Tell that to Tiger Woods, or any of the NFL coaches and quaterbacks who have to study thick playbooks. And holla back.

    Golf isn’t a sport and it doesn’t require intellectual skill, NFL coaches don’t play sports and QBs who can memorize play books are not intellectuals.

    W: They are not. White Americans are the canary in the American coal mine. Specifically poor and working class White Americans.

    O: Well, I beg to differ, as do quite a number of other folks. Poor Whites simply don’t garner interest for study of social issues in the same way that African Americans do; perhaps you can name me the equivalent of DuBois in terms of studying Poor Whites?

    White Americans are THE foundation of American culture and history. They have historically made up the majority of the poor, the dispossessed, exploited factory workers, coal miners and frontline troops etc. Whatever bad has happened to Americans generally happens to them first.

    Ignoring them doesn’t make it less true.

    O: It’s over on the Shady Game thread. You were saying how Black Men simply couldn’t get away from Black Women fast enough, and then made the remark that more and more successful Black Men were looking like Obama. Hence my retort that numerous Black Men who were successful clearly didn’t look like Obama at all, Thomas and Sowell among them.

    O: I mentioned Thomas’ having a White wife because I wanted to know if your views about Black Men in this regard held true for him as well.

    O: You still have not responded to this, sir.

    Response was given. You timidly avoided it.

    W: I wrote:
    … Notice that Woods and Obama are not black males in the full sense. Both were born of and raised by women who are not the least bit like black American females.

    O: Wrong. In America, according to people who look a lot closer to you than me, “one drop of Black blood” makes you Black.

    Again, reading comprehension failure on your part. What I wrote is true.

    W: Increasing numbers of black males are not only rejecting black women, ultimately for racial/genetic and evolutionary reasons, but increasingly successful “black males” don’t even have black mothers.

    O: Actually, this is factually untrue. The vast majority of Black Men marry and have children with Black Women. Kinda shoots through your “evolutionary/genetic and racial” arguments. *shrug*

    Again, reading comprehension failure on your part. What I wrote is true.

    W: You then responded with your usual misrepresentations and “holla back” bullshit.

    O: And you didn’t actually respond to my questions or points at all…

    Responded to and refuted.

    O: Lastly, please understand what I said: Vaux Chess Team played both Black AND WHITE teams, and generally beat them BOTH.

    W: It was mediocre competition regardless of the race of the opponents.

    O: Says the Man who’s boxed Golden Gloves and played B-Ball at the All-Public and Division 1 levels…yes?

    My comment about the chess players was true. Your response about playing basketball and boxing is what is known as a non sequitur. That term can go along with your new found love for the term ad hominem.

    W: If they moved up to the chess “major leagues” they would be crushed.

    O: Yup, and *if* elephants had wings, they too could fly.

    Again, non sequitur.

    You’re still not getting my point. Which is, that Blacks have gifts when it comes to improvisation, quick decision making and the like, that Sailer has written extensively about. Please review what he said?

    They weren’t so quick in their decision making when it came to getting their black asses out of New Orleans when the White men, using his technological genius, warned them about the approaching hurricane. Steve Sailer also wrote about that issue. Please review what he said about it.

    Like


  225. O

    The simple truth of the matter, going to your other point wrt your ex boyfriend, is that love takes work-and most people don’t want to work that hard. It is a conscious and courageous choice, and requires a tremendous degree of maturity, sacrifice and selflessness that sad to say, most of us don’t have.

    That all sounds so very noble.

    But how is it better than passionate lust based relationships and serial monogamy?

    Why bother?

    I call bullshit.

    Like


  226. Tupac

    I have lived in Austin. The big problem with Austin, Texas is that a dangerously large percentage of people who spend time there fall hopelessly in love with it. Many people with jobs are grossly over-qualified. There are about twice the numbers of every sort of professional there per capita compared to other cities in the region.
    In the spring-time, that part of the Hill Country is insanely gorgeous. The rest of the year it is just extremely nice.
    Women go topless in Austin City Pools. The underlying culture has always been German/Czech.

    Like


  227. *that’s* love, he asserted. not the shallower things that get tossed around as such in the pop culture; infatuation, lust, companionship, diversion, etc.

    Why lust is shallower than tender care is beyond me. Lust can be at least as empathetic. Hasn’t everyone here had sex while in love? Nothing shallow about it. Lust can be at as profound, because it’s more passionate, more felt.
    And as for companionship – the quiet moments spent when spent from fucking – how is shared silence shallow?
    This notion that love that rides through ups and downs is the only real and meaningful and true and deep way to love is reverse-logic. It’s what old people who no longer feel lust say to justify their lack of sexual hunger. Oh – this is DEEEPER than mere lust.

    Bullshit.

    Like


  228. It’s also a pretty lie that monogamously and family minded men tell themselves to justify spending all their resources on merely one mate. And a tactic women use to get men to commit to the same.

    But what we have is more real! More deep! And think of your future – with me you don’t need a retirement plan – I’m secure, I’ll love you forever!

    Bullshit bullshit bullshit. I don’t need a love retirement plan.

    I’ll switch things up until dead. It doesn’t have to be the same girl 20 years from now.

    For the guys that want security and trade it off for variety – fine. But this notion of deeper is a pretty justification for your lack of brave new world discovery.

    Like


  229. “But how is it better than passionate lust based relationships and serial monogamy?”

    When you’re old and sick, how will you attract another new honey for the next in the series of passionate lust based serial monogamy relationships? Who will there be who will love you enough to read your pill bottle for you and make sure you don’t overdose when you’re 80? — (That sweet young hottie, assuming you can get another one, will more likely MISread your pill bottle so she can inherit your money, already, and go get herself a young stud.)
    — Or turn you so you don’t get bed sores? Or change your Depends?
    Because, remember, with the HUGE numbers of baby boomers, in 20 years, nursing home beds and enough staff to look after you will come very dearly, or possibly be, simply, unavailable at any price.

    Like


  230. Rum:

    What about the chicks? I was there for South By Southwest a couple of years ago and loved it, but that would be like judging Miami based on the Winter Music Conference. I wonder how the locals are, particularly for someone like me who is already out of college.

    Like


  231. Anonymouse

    When you’re old and sick, how will you attract another new honey for the next in the series of passionate lust based serial monogamy relationships?

    If you would just take the time to look at your own argument, you’d see how it falls apart.

    There is no security in relationships. Not in a reality based world. You’ve seen the numbers on divorce, right? And are you aware of the percentage of couples that don’t divorce who remain married for love? I can’t recall that number, but it’s small.

    If I’m too old to get it up, I’ll pay caregiver bills.

    I find this notion of love as a retirement plan abhorrent. And false. Misguided. Fanciful. And worst of all, lacking in imagination.

    I don’t need to compromise my life in order to continue to be in relationship and have love. Love comes easily. Love is easy. Meeting people to love is easy. It’s not something I’ll ever need to struggle to attain. It comes naturally.

    There are old bachelors who have relationships until they die. You don’t need a longterm committed wife to drag with you into your feeble old age. You can just as easily get a new mate when old.

    I can, at least. Of that much I’m certain.

    Like


  232. But I can hear your negative voice, anonymouse, sneering “ya, good luck with that”, while you not-so-secretly hope to see me fail.

    And why is that? Why not be happy for the old bachelors who continue to switch it up until dead?

    I’ll tell you why. Because women want men to devote lifetime resources, that’s why. They feel it’s a breech of contract to offer up a pussy and not get paid to the end of their days for it.

    Fuck that noise. I don’t need your steenking love retirement plan.

    Like


  233. And if that sounds overconfident, it’s based on what I see happen in my life. I can get on a plane and go to a new city, and within one or three months some attractive woman will be in love with me. Or the minimum I’ll be dating several who are infatuated. And I’m already unattractive. Forty three, balding, shortish. Age isn’t going to steal much from the looks department from me. So what’s going to be so different when I’m 80? Except that I’ll have even more life experience with women, and have a hell of lot more wealth and power? And have a hell of lot more girls in my little black book?

    Love is easy. Easy peasy. Simple. You just stroll right into it. It’s everywhere. Nothing to it.

    Like


  234. Austin Girls. It is hard to generalize. Coed students at UT are way above average for their age range because they are walking miles a day and are rarely fat. It is a large campus and the opposite of a commuter school.
    It is a state capitol. There is a large IT industry; Dell among others. Lots of guys and girls work on excuses to hang around after graduation.
    I guess it is a large playing field.
    Real estate is expensive. No-growth policies have done that. Gated communities in the west-side hill country are mostly 7 figures, last I looked.

    Like


  235. “If I’m too old to get it up, I’ll pay caregiver bills.”

    See, that’s where it looks to me YOUR argument falls apart. The vast numbers of boomers who are aging alongside you, large numbers of whom dumped the first one for new honeys, and then divorced / dumped again and again…(and who had no kids or one kid or their kids hate them for divorcing)

    all are planning on YOUR plan.

    Which means paid caregivers, who are willing to change the Depends and spoonfeed and wipe your drool and give you your pills reliably, will be at A PREMIUM. Maybe even more so than the hot young babes you’ve been lusting after for 50 years. The price (as a wage per hour) THEY will demand, and the unreliability, may FAR exceed what you’d have risked by marrying that the bi*** of a wife might have cost ya in the divorce.

    Like


  236. “They feel it’s a breech of contract to offer up a pussy and not get paid to the end of their days for it.”

    Fuck that noise. I don’t need your steenking love retirement plan”

    And why is it NOT a breech of contract? She’s got, as you say, pussy that you want. It’s got a sell-by date, after which it’s lost its value — at least to other men. It’s the only thing she’s really got. If you dump her after she’s 40, she lives alone from then on, likely.

    Xsplat, I’d like to say more power to ya. But I’ve got this one issue re: horny old men who chase young things. If you’re banging a reproductive age chick and she gets knocked up and you die, who’s going to father it? Even if you leave beaucoup bucks, who’s going to be there to do the fathering to raise that boy so he doesn’t grow up to be a thug and break into my house and steal MY stuff?

    Like


  237. Oh. Anonymouse, I hadn’t realized you were looking that far ahead.

    I don’t see myself living in ill health before death. But you never know. I suspect I’ll die before my activity level gets quite that low.

    And there is always the option of suicide. That would suit me fine. I’m not afraid of that, quite so much, I mean, that’ll happen sooner or later.

    I just want a good life. Not a long life.

    Like


  238. anony

    In order to find out whether a guy or girl would be a suitable end-of-life caregiver why not get fat and helpless and pretend to be incontinent – right now? Skip over the irrelevant stuff like sexual good times. Get right to weeding out the un-worthy. Focus straight on what you seem to care about the most in a relationship..

    Like


  239. whiskey:

    “Basketball as it’s now played is a test of what guy can play one-on-one the best while the other four guys on each side stand around. It’s a dunking contest, with some running. That’s it. There’s no more strategy than there is soccer (whoever is in best shape at the end of the match wins).”

    this shows a complete utter lack of basketball knowledge.

    Like


  240. on August 4, 2009 at 2:05 am Cannon's Canon

    chuck and whiskey:

    i almost remarked about that earlier and refuted based on lack of soccer knowledge.

    Like


  241. Xsplat,
    Actually, I have no problem in the least w/how you choose to conduct your life. By all accounts, the Women you get involved with did so of their own free will and seem to be of legal age for the country you’re in, so…more power to ya.

    Nor do I think its impossible to love more than one person at a time. I *do* think that for most people it becomes quite a bit of a hassle to manage such an affair, but yup it certainlyis possible to love more than one person at the same time.

    Lastly, I’m w/you brother-Love and Lust are two distinct things, and I want both from my Women. Because I see each as bringing something to my Table of Life. Game in my view, is very much about inciting lust, deliberately, in a Women you wish to have. Some call that seduction. Whatever its called, lust is very important. But its not love.

    What Kalliope described, and I understand exactly what she meant, THAT’S love. Not lust, there’s a huge difference and distinction that people ought not get twisted. Both are necessary.

    O

    Like


  242. “It is a commonly held belief, but I have never met a woman that is a good communicator.

    They are good at manipulating and lying, but not say, telling someone what they actually think.” – elf chief.

    Communicating means you get your ideas successfully across to someone else. Hence if women are excellent manipulators and liers then they are excellent communicators. Duh!

    Like


  243. I have never been to Austin, so I can’t comment. Some friends from Houston (with their own biases) hated it. Called it the home of pretentious yuppies.

    I liked Dallas/Fort Worth. Nice area. Traffic heavy, nothing like SoCal though. Lots of cheap land. Quite pretty. Hotter than hell and humid during the Summer though. Terrible. Lots of bugs too. Don’t get that much out here thank god.

    Obsidian — Thanks. Armstrong was my Dad’s favorite, so I always love him. Both he and Jelly Roll Morton were called Uncle Toms (a base charge — both took considerable amounts of crap from racist Whites during Jim Crow) and Morton in particular was vilified by August Wilson in “Jelly’s Last Jam.” I have some copies of the Library of Congress recordings he made (oral history) and he never once “passed” in fact he made it a point not to. But he also made it a point that New Orleans had it’s own subculture where Black men and women in a hugely majority Black city could live their own lives not touching Whites for most of the time, and that race was complicated (pre-Civil War New Orleans had Freed Men of Color, who owned … slaves.) It wasn’t unusual (touching on the themes of Black beauty) for wealthy White men to have Black mistresses. And New Orleans culture was, Catholic and Protestant alike, irrevocably “Black” in a way that’s lost now, like Atlantis.

    Chuck: B-Ball is crap. No one passes. It’s Kobe vs. the star on the other side. No one plays a lick of D. It’s street ball to the max. NO teamwork whatsover. Coaches roll out the ball and that’s it. As bad as fricking soccer. I can’t wait for Football season to start — a real team game. Damn we need a spring and summer league again.

    True story — Magic once tried to coach the Lakers for about 17 games pre-Jackson era. He quit because players ignored him and talked on their cellphones. MAGIC! The guy who won something like four championships. Jackson does not let that bother him. He just collects his paycheck and smiles. He does not even try to coach. Just rolls out the ball.

    Like


  244. on August 4, 2009 at 2:35 am Mu'Min seeks FAT WuMin

    Cannon’s Canon wrote :

    In the future, you should embed some youtube videos to expound a bit further.

    Uh oh. You used the unit of weight ‘pound’ as part of a word. This excites Obese-dian.

    At any rate. Obese-dian says that black men will fuck any woman who is willing. Most white men do, however, have a floor below which they would rather be celibate.

    Only black men fuck Cigstache.

    Like


  245. Whiskey, Chuck,
    There’s no doubt the game of basketball has changed in recent years. Why? I think it has to do w/a number of things along w/more atheletic players, fan demand for more action, etc et al. Playing hard D is kinda boring in comparison to a gussied up Rucker Park. Same deal w/set plays, zone defense, etc.

    And none of the other sports are immune to this-football aint what it used to be, neither is baseball. The former had far and away less passes, it was very much a ground game focused more on running backs; the “West Coast Offense” has become the industry standard. In the MLs, if you were hitting 50 homeruns a season you were the Man, nowadays anything under 60 and you’re mediocre; same deal w/pitching. You need to win what, upwards of 30 games-plus to be considered legit?

    Heck, even in hockey, the game’s changed…they been fiddling around the rules so much there that even the fans don’t really know what to expect. Its a dwindling fan base and they’re trying any and everything to try to make the game more interesting. One thing is true, back in the day there were A LOT more fights on the ice, lol.

    Business interests have changed the sports we knew and loved, fellas. For better and in many cases for a lot worse.

    O

    Like


  246. on August 4, 2009 at 2:48 am Why Mandrills Don't Get Laid

    Nope, Baboon-breath, I did NOT say anything of the sort. Please go back into your cage, you just might get a treat.

    O

    Like


  247. Mouse here again

    Xstrata, if you’re willing to off yourself rather than be a burden on the rest of us who don’t love you when you’re old, okay, that’ll work. Do get a vasectomy, though.

    “Skip over the irrelevant stuff like sexual good times.”
    That won’t work. It’s the sexual good times, along with all the other good stuff like shared child-rearing, shared meals, shared fun, shared monetary goal-achievements, that creates the great memories that makes old people WILLING to wipe the other one’s behind / help them ambulate at risk of falling themselves, etc. when they’re old.

    Why would it put me in the lion’s den here if I point to the immorality of people using others and then discarding them? Believe me, I bash feminists and point out their follies to them a LOT.
    Because, fellas, there ARE a FEW good women who look pretty good while young (admittedly, more likely to be 7s or less) and not bad for a crone after menopause, who can be trusted. I think I am one, and I’m doing my best to raise one.

    Guys, I sympathize with the idea behind game. I understand, at least to the extent the feminine mind can understand the masculine, the need for it in order to counter the feminist b.s.

    I just don’t buy the story that you guys want to die alone, and an entire lifetime spent sowing wild oats will reap exactly that.

    Like


  248. on August 4, 2009 at 2:57 am Mu'Min seeks FAT WuMin

    Obese-dian lied :

    Nope, Baboon-breath, I did NOT say anything of the sort.

    You did say exactly that, right here (quickly refuted by non-black men).

    Now I know why you don’t keep a blog of your own. It is because your gaping contradictions will be easily pinned down in that format. It would be impossible for you to say something, only to deny a few hours later that you said it.

    Plus, Mandrills and Baboons are not apes.

    Nor am I an Ape. You, OTOH…..

    Like


  249. on August 4, 2009 at 3:12 am Why Mandrills Don't Get Laid

    Mandrill-Butt,
    Nope, mis-quoted me again, I didn’t say “Black Men will fuck anything” I said MEN will pretty much fuck any Woman who’s willing. And for the most part, its TRUE. Doesn’t matter if I won’t or you can’t, or Doung won’t or Dave Alex can’t. The bottomline is, that most guys out there ain’t hardly as discriminating as you think when it comes to getting his dick wet. Period.

    As for why you can’t get laid, well, who can blame the ladies? Giving it up to a baboon aint necessarily something they’d want to get out…

    Say goodnight, Baboon-breath…

    O

    Like


  250. ahh the anti-black hitler at work again (obsid) on a thread about unconditional live. That really takes some skill. Notice the foaming at the mouth the long posts that reach ten pages. See whites have been showing blacks unconditional love for a long time now. They are all like our little children. God said if you want to enter the kingdom act as these children and blacks are taking that to heart.

    Like


  251. on August 4, 2009 at 3:16 am Mu'Min seeks FAT WuMin

    said MEN will pretty much fuck any Woman who’s willing. And for the most part, its TRUE.

    But as every non-black man here will tell you, it is not. Hence, you again assume that all men think like black men, whereas the ‘Scarlett’ poll showed black men to be outliers, due to their mega-fauna preferences.

    The bottomline is, that most guys out there ain’t hardly as discriminating as you think when it comes to getting his dick wet.

    This is where you continue to assume all men think like black men, again which is disproven by the Scarlett polls.

    As for why you can’t get laid, well, who can blame the ladies?

    I sleep with higher quality women than you. You sleep with higher QUANTITY women than me (in raw tonnage), but quantity is not quality. How many times will you forget this?

    Like


  252. on August 4, 2009 at 3:18 am Mu'Min seeks FAT WuMin

    I said MEN will pretty much fuck any Woman who’s willing. And for the most part, its TRUE.

    But as every non-black man here will tell you, it is not. Hence, you again assume that all men think like black men, whereas the ‘Scarlett’ poll showed black men to be outliers, due to their fauna preferences.

    The bottomline is, that most guys out there ain’t hardly as discriminating as you think when it comes to getting his dick wet.

    This is where you continue to assume all men think like black men, again which is disproven by the Scarlett polls.

    As for why you can’t get laid, well, who can blame the ladies?

    I sleep with higher quality women than you. You sleep with higher QUANTITY women than me (in raw tonnage), but quantity is not quality. How many times will you forget this? Having a fetish for Cape Buffalo is not something to be proud of.

    Like


  253. on August 4, 2009 at 3:18 am Mu'Min seeks FAT WuMin

    I said MEN will pretty much fuck any Woman who’s willing. And for the most part, its TRUE.

    But as every non-black man here will tell you, it is not. Hence, you again assume that all men think like black men, whereas the ‘Scarlett’ poll showed black men to be outliers, due to their fauna preferences.

    The bottomline is, that most guys out there ain’t hardly as discriminating as you think when it comes to getting his dick wet.

    This is where you continue to assume all men think like black men, again which is disproven by the Scarlett polls.

    As for why you can’t get laid, well, who can blame the ladies?

    I sleep with higher quality women than you. You sleep with higher QUANTITY women than me (in raw tonnage), but quantity is not quality. How many times will you forget this? Having a fetish for Cape Buffalo is not something to be proud of.

    Like


  254. Obsidian-
    “Business interests have changed the sports we knew and loved, fellas. For better and in many cases for a lot worse.”

    Only for the better in the case of football. Which is the ultimate, and most popular, team sport in the US.

    There’s a reason why football’s fan base is the largest and growing, while all other sports are declining:

    There’s something for everybody: Teamwork, individual athleticism, strategy, tactics, violence, showmanship.

    WRT Basketball. Never watched it. Don’t play it.

    Like


  255. Obsidian-

    Why do you argue with these fucking trolls.

    They will never be persuaded, no matter how well you make your argument.

    They are here to harass you, nothing more.

    Like


  256. on August 4, 2009 at 3:26 am Why Mandrills Don't Get Laid

    Baboon Boy,
    O: I said MEN will pretty much fuck any Woman who’s willing. And for the most part, its TRUE.

    BB: But as every non-black man here will tell you, it is not. Hence, you again assume that all men think like black men, whereas the ‘Scarlett’ poll showed black men to be outliers, due to their fauna preferences.

    O: (White) Men LIE. And no, actually if Roissy took the time to actually conduct polling in Black and Hispanic areas, he’d find that my reply is pretty much in line with the mainstream in that regard.

    O: The bottomline is, that most guys out there ain’t hardly as discriminating as you think when it comes to getting his dick wet.

    BB: This is where you continue to assume all men think like black men, again which is disproven by the Scarlett polls.

    O: You might recall me asking Roissy to actually conduct polling among Black and Hispanic Men. He never took me up on the offer. Nevertheless, quite a few White Men here reported they tap Scarlett if they could. So would your rawdog monkey ass.

    O: As for why you can’t get laid, well, who can blame the ladies?

    BB: I sleep with higher quality women than you. You sleep with higher QUANTITY women than me (in raw tonnage), but quantity is not quality. How many times will you forget this? Having a fetish for Cape Buffalo is not something to be proud of.

    O: And THAT’S when you busted a nut all over your latest issue of Monkey Booty Magazine…

    O

    Like


  257. Thanks, AJ, its a tough, tedious job, but somebody’s gotta do it. 😉

    O

    Like


  258. Yup somebody has to convince the world the reason why the blacks should be completely exterminated as if they where roaches. Your doing a good job obsidian of proving why that should and needs to be done.

    Like


  259. Actually obsidian you know what I want to say thank you. Your actually doing more for the cause of white people than white people. Really keep up the good work.

    Like


  260. Anonymouse

    I just don’t buy the story that you guys want to die alone, and an entire lifetime spent sowing wild oats will reap exactly that.

    I disagree with that, and I have empirical anecdotal reality based evidence to back up the hypothesis. Hypothesis Xsplat as dying the life of a lover, in the arms of a woman who adores him.

    I do understand your concept, but the experiences of my life would never lead me to ever formulate such a concept.

    At any time I can simply choose to keep whatever lover I’m with. I can get a new one at 75, and keep her till 95.

    Why drag around someone until 75, unless I’m so inclined?

    Like


  261. I’ve got an anecdotal reality-based bit of evidence, too.

    My uncle. What a ladies’ man. Who happened to have tossed over his latest at 63, assuming he could get a NEW 40-y-old to replace the aged-out one. And was diagnosed with terminal lung cancer within the year, before he’d had a chance to snag his next honey.

    Being a dutiful niece, because he had no children, I went to visit him once every few weeks and accompanied him to some of his appts. to translate what the drs. are saying, and I came often to see him when he went to hospice. He died a horrible, painful twitching death. Alone. Without ANYONE there who really, genuinely loved him. I felt sorry for him, in the end, but I did not love him. I was there mostly to avoid feeling guilty for not coming. No one loved him. That’s what you want? That’s just what you might get.

    Like


  262. He died a horrible, painful twitching death. Alone. Without ANYONE there who really, genuinely loved him. I felt sorry for him, in the end, but I did not love him. I was there mostly to avoid feeling guilty for not coming. No one loved him. That’s what you want?

    As I said, I’d never choose to die that kind of death – with a loved one nearby, or without.

    In my cupboard right now is a way to have a painless easy death.

    I’m always prepared.

    Like


  263. And besides, Mouse, I do things all alone all the time. I like it – I enjoy my company. Why do I need company to enjoy my own death?

    Like


  264. ””””””’Anonymous,
    He died a horrible, painful twitching death. Alone. Without ANYONE there who really, genuinely loved him. I felt sorry for him, in the end, but I did not love him. I was there mostly to avoid feeling guilty for not coming. No one loved him. That’s what you want? That’s just what you might get.”””””’

    Ahh so you where there because you enojoyed watching him in pain and where jealous of all the attention he garnered throughout his life. If you had loved him youd have put a bullet in him.

    Like


  265. ””””””on August 4, 2009 at 4:35 am xsplat
    He died a horrible, painful twitching death. Alone. Without ANYONE there who really, genuinely loved him. I felt sorry for him, in the end, but I did not love him. I was there mostly to avoid feeling guilty for not coming. No one loved him. That’s what you want?

    As I said, I’d never choose to die that kind of death – with a loved one nearby, or without.

    In my cupboard right now is a way to have a painless easy death.

    I’m always prepared.””””””””

    Cool thoughts be prepared. If only the gov would only show unconditional love for its people.

    Like


  266. O, ya, lust and love are distinct, but when you join them they fuse and each becomes stronger.

    One reason I rarely pay for sex.

    Like


  267. Gunny, to get to the Black people in the U.S. would be pretty easy once the necessary social changes had been made. They’re only 8% of the population there, give or take a couple of percentage points for the passing and the historically Black by choice.

    The problem is that well, much like the Germans, it would require a degree of social programming that would convince even intellectuals to get behind the sweep. You’d have to convince enough of everyone to hate Black people so much and be so convinced of their inherent total inferiority, that they wouldn’t mind losing any of them. There could be no such thing as a good or worthy Black person in the minds of most Americans. If anyone thought there was such a thing, they would have to be afraid of people finding out they thought this way.

    Exterminating Black Americans would have to mean exterminating any sniff of freedom for anyone else as well.

    You would also have to be willing to counter opposition from other countries as well. I assure you that it is not in the interest of certain financial powers that be, for Africans the world over to be thoroughly convinced that White people intend their utter extermination. This is not 1790 or even 1930.

    So you’d have to do a lot of lying, have a lot of money, and do a lot more killing of people other than just Black people, to do the job.

    …but I have no doubt, looking at recent events in Europe, that it can ethnic cleansing can be done.

    It’s just that in light of this, I tend to think more in terms of species cleansing. Ethnic cleansing solves nothing. As soon as you get rid of all the roaches, then you have an overabundance of maggots…

    Like


  268. ”””””’Ghost of Nicole
    You’d have to convince enough of everyone to hate Black people so much and be so convinced of their inherent total inferiority, that they wouldn’t mind losing any of them.””””””

    Yea I think obsidian is doing a fine job of doing the convincing on this one.

    ”””””””So you’d have to do a lot of lying, have a lot of money, and do a lot more killing of people other than just Black people, to do the job.””””””””””’

    Lying about what?

    ””””””Exterminating Black Americans would have to mean exterminating any sniff of freedom for anyone else as well.””””””””’

    No it really wouldn’t. It would allow people a lot more freedom. Freedom from black oppression would be a good thing.

    Like


  269. ”””””’Ghost of Nicole
    You’d have to convince enough of everyone to hate Black people so much and be so convinced of their inherent total inferiority, that they wouldn’t mind losing any of them.””””””

    Oh yea you don’t have to convince on inferiority. Just convince they are a thorn in the side that is not worth having around. A total pie that produces more negative then positive. Like if you had cancer in your body you would want to cut it out right.

    Like


  270. ”””It’s just that in light of this, I tend to think more in terms of species cleansing. Ethnic cleansing solves nothing. As soon as you get rid of all the roaches, then you have an overabundance of maggots…””””””’

    What you have left are some cool people. I have worked with quite a few of them. They have their homogeneous groups. They enjoy the company of each other. They get together in groups for coffee and other events. They watch each others backs.

    Like


  271. Even the iraqi’s that have there little shops on the camp I am on seem happy. The americans do not. Any questions?

    Like


  272. on August 4, 2009 at 6:24 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ Ghost of Nicole

    The problem is that well, much like the Germans, it would require a degree of social programming that would convince even intellectuals to get behind the sweep. You’d have to convince enough of everyone to hate Black people so much and be so convinced of their inherent total inferiority, that they wouldn’t mind losing any of them. There could be no such thing as a good or worthy Black person in the minds of most Americans. If anyone thought there was such a thing, they would have to be afraid of people finding out they thought this way.

    Nicole, the good news is that you are more self-aware and more internally consistent than most people (“sheeple”, in your words).
    The bad news is that you are more self-aware and more internally consistent than most people. Meaning that you overestimate, VASTLY overestimate, the difficulty of convincing people of stuff.

    Feminists and the media have already almost succeeded in convincing Americans of the “inherent total inferiority” of ~50% of the population, i.e., men.
    Even in areas where men are clearly, on average, superior.

    If they can do that, then convincing the same people/sheeple of the “inherent total inferiority” of black people, in the right social zeitgeist, would be really REALLY easy. Easy to a scary extent.

    You think a society of people who have largely been convinced that men can’t be left alone with small children, can’t be convinced that there isn’t room in their towns for black people?
    Think again.

    Like


  273. on August 4, 2009 at 6:28 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ xsplat

    One reason I rarely pay for sex.

    Xsplat, the word “rarely” implies that you occasionally do pay for sex. If that’s true – i.e., if you would ever even think about paying directly for sex (vs. being a provider of material goods in some sort of relationship-type arrangement, which is not what i’m talking about), then my understanding of your life and lifestyle has just ramped back down to 0.

    I.e., the type of guy who “walks easily into love”, who can guarantee that a woman will be in love with him within 1-3 mos of landing in a foreign country, etc., would feel active revulsion at the thought of paying actual money for sex, no?

    I walk pretty easily into the love of women myself, and there is no way in sweet hell that I would pay ten cents for a fuck.

    Like


  274. ””””””’Epoxytocin No. 87,
    If they can do that, then convincing the same people/sheeple of the “inherent total inferiority” of black people, in the right social zeitgeist, would be really REALLY easy. Easy to a scary extent.”””””””””’

    Thank You for putting that into more concise words than I seem to be able to. I keep trying to explain to obsidian how his crusade to make and force people to see the black point of view is helping along those lines of convincing against having blacks around with his statements of:
    Where always gonna be in your face. You can’t get rid of us baby. We are gonna be on you like glue. We are like visa anywhere you want to be. We are gonna have black in your face until the day you die and there is no escape other than what?
    What is the logical conclusion if you don’t want blacks constantly in your face?
    He just doesn’t seem to get it.

    Like


  275. on August 4, 2009 at 6:33 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    In my cupboard right now is a way to have a painless easy death.

    I don’t understand people who are overly concerned with “painless” suicide.

    If you’re at the point of wanting to kill yourself, why would you give a fuck whether it hurts?

    If you’re at that point, then the level of pain seems about as relevant as whether the pill/drink/knife is red, blue, or the color of piss.

    Explain.

    @ xsplat

    I do things all alone all the time. I like it – I enjoy my company.

    Yes.

    The single best way to ensure that you’ll have good relationships is to enjoy your OWN company.

    True for both sexes – but especially for men, who, if they’re doing things right, will set the tone for their relationships.

    Like


  276. If you’re at that point, then the level of pain seems about as relevant as whether the pill/drink/knife is red, blue, or the color of piss.

    Explain.

    I don’t like pain. As long as I’m alive, I’m alive. There is no such thing as giving up. I’d suicide as an alive person, not a defeated one. I simply don’t enjoy pain.

    Like


  277. on August 4, 2009 at 6:40 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    I don’t like pain. As long as I’m alive, I’m alive. There is no such thing as giving up. I’d suicide as an alive person, not a defeated one. I simply don’t enjoy pain.

    OK, that makes a certain amount of sense. It clashes somewhat with my own perspective, from which suicide is impossible without “giving up”.

    I guess you believe in the eventual attainment of some state in which life is viewed as some sort of completed cycle, after which you can just off yourself because, well, you beat all the levels of the game.
    I don’t see that, but I may just not be old enough yet.

    Like


  278. Good point, Epoxy. I do still have more to live for and some unfinished business.

    There are those threesomes and orgies I have in mind. The houses and harems and businesses.

    But if it was game over before attaining the higher levels, it’s still not a job bad done. The score is acceptable at this point.

    Like


  279. Epoxy

    I.e., the type of guy who “walks easily into love”, who can guarantee that a woman will be in love with him within 1-3 mos of landing in a foreign country, etc., would feel active revulsion at the thought of paying actual money for sex, no?

    I’ve paid two, or maybe three times, directly. To bargirls – professional “hostesses”.

    It wasn’t worth any of the times.

    But the main reason I shy away from such activity is that I believe that we are creatures of habit, and I don’t want to get bad sex habits. I’m proud of the moods and power I can bring into a bed, and that’s not something to toy with lightly.

    Like


  280. Yea at this point I have proven everything I have wanted to prove. Now it is just a matter of time and every other thing on my list is possible. It is no longer a question of if. Just time whether or not I want to do it. No more mystery to life really.

    Like


  281. on August 4, 2009 at 7:01 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ xsplat

    Contra your experiences, I sometimes need pain to feel 100% alive.

    I think I could do without emotional pain (although I’ve always benefited from it in the long run), but I would go crazy without a certain amount of self-inflicted physical pain.

    I like running up lots and lots of stairs and hills, until no fluids of any sort are left inside me.

    Like


  282. Ya, I like pleasurable pain also. And a little drama.

    I wouldn’t off myself for a toothache.

    Like


  283. Gunny asks, “Lying about what?”

    You would have to start ranking people by ethnicity like hyenas rank by gender: the highest status of their team being lower ranking than the lowest ranking of your team.

    In order to get people to believe this, you would have to have some way of suddenly enforcing it (unlikely) or selling an ideology that promoted this idea well enough for a critical number of people to believe it to fatal ends (very likely).

    Since the average person in the U.S. is not very well educated, this would not be difficult if enough people with badges and white coats said so.

    “Oh yea you don’t have to convince on inferiority. Just convince they are a thorn in the side that is not worth having around. A total pie that produces more negative then positive. Like if you had cancer in your body you would want to cut it out right.”

    If you merely convince people that we’re a political threat, then they will just basically kill all the men and take the women as it suits them….or just kill the leaders and “re educate” the rest. That’s not the same as exterminating like roaches. You have to convince them that we all need killing without exception.

    It can be done, but not with “thorn in the side”. If you want us all gone, you have to aim higher than that.

    “What you have left are some cool people. I have worked with quite a few of them. They have their homogeneous groups. They enjoy the company of each other. They get together in groups for coffee and other events. They watch each others backs.”

    They also have an exponentially higher rate of genetic disorders, among other problems.

    …but from the people of such backgrounds I’ve had the displeasure of meeting, having deformed babies regularly is worth it to preserve the race. So it means having to explain to your child as they begin to crack and wither at 20, that you made it happen almost on purpose, because it was important to you to not marry out. So what? Their sacrifice will be rewarded with 70 virgins as their heart weakens because its cells can’t replicate properly.

    So worth it…

    This kind of idiocy is why it would not surprise me in the least, if we were ever invaded by aliens, that they would decide to wipe this planet of humans. If this is how most people think or can be made to think, then we really are a waste of dirt that could be used feeding worms.

    Like


  284. http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/08/03/no-such-thing-as-unconditional-love/#comment-113905

    Just refer above nicole it is pretty concise. I really don’t want to exterminate the blacks. That is why I moved. Just saying it is gonna happen.

    Like


  285. Epoxytocin, I don’t overestimate the difficulty of convincing people to kill each other for whatever reasons. I’m giving him some guidance on how it works.

    If he goes around screaming like a *typical* White supremacist, he’ll have about as much success as they are. As it is, exterminating Black people in America and perhaps all over the world, will require their being perceived as “other” to a much greater degree than men are now.

    …even to a greater degree than Black people were in the past. We would have to be perceived as Native Americans were in the push west: unsalvageable barbarians who were in the way.

    At this point, we have a Black male president. I don’t think it’s time to start warming up the furnaces just yet.

    Like


  286. That nicole is why I give black men like obsidian a lot of credit for helping warm up the furnaces. And of course the president helped a lot in how he handled the policeman situation.

    Like


  287. Gunny, and if/when it does, you won’t have us to blame for your problems anymore.

    Like


  288. ”””””Ghost of Nicole
    Epoxytocin, I don’t overestimate the difficulty of convincing people to kill each other for whatever reasons. I’m giving him some guidance on how it works.”””””””’

    Unlike the self proclaimed black voices I see. I am not thinking and talking about white and black 24 hours a day. I have other things to think about or even talk about.

    Like


  289. on August 4, 2009 at 7:31 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    If he goes around screaming like a *typical* White supremacist, he’ll have about as much success as they are.

    True, but only because typical white supremacists are found in social classes that are irrelevant to determining l’air du temps.

    At this point, we have a Black male president. I don’t think it’s time to start warming up the furnaces just yet.

    The election of a black president is going to be a big step in stripping blacks of their “victim” mantle, if that happens. Perhaps the biggest step.

    Remember that, ironically, we live in a society in which “victim status” PREVENTS people from actually becoming real victims. Case in point: women. Nuff said.

    Like


  290. Well Gunny, you have to excuse Obsidian and myself for not being docile niggers, or fitting within suitable saggy pantsed, jive talking stereotypes.

    Yes, I’m aware that Black people like us scare the piss out of you.

    We should.

    …and now one of us is the president of the country you live in.

    Damn he require someone employed to protect and serve actually do his job with some accountability. The police should be able to act as they will with impunity, and nobody should question their actions, least of all a nigger, even if he’s the president.

    White presidents have always behaved with the utmost honor.

    Heh.

    Like


  291. ”””””’Ghost of Nicole
    Gunny, and if/when it does, you won’t have us to blame for your problems anymore.”””””””

    Now your getting it. There won’t be the same problems. Hopefully you understand now. I don’t want blacks to be my problem. Why I moved.

    Other than that yea no problems. Shit is easy have you been listening?
    Do you hear me blaming blacks for me being able to retire?
    No it is because I worked hard.
    It is because blacks blame whites for their misfortune that they have a problem with whites. It is not because whites blame blacks for their problems. Blacks just are a problem.

    Like


  292. ”””””’Ghost of Nicole
    Well Gunny, you have to excuse Obsidian and myself for not being docile niggers, or fitting within suitable saggy pantsed, jive talking stereotypes.

    Yes, I’m aware that Black people like us scare the piss out of you.””””””””””””””””’

    See that is the problem. I would just prefer that you were people (not niggers). But as I see by your comment you think you are instilling “scare the piss out of you” in someone. Think about what you just said and then understand why I said that you are both working hard for the extermination of your own race in that context.

    Like


  293. Although nicole I wouldn’t put you in the same league as obsidian you are more of a human being type and not a nigger.

    Like


  294. on August 4, 2009 at 7:45 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    Epoxytocin No. 87 maxim #8:
    People who can’t discuss race, or sex, objectively should not discuss race, or sex, at all.
    Ever.

    That is all.

    Like


  295. Epoxytocin says, “True, but only because typical white supremacists are found in social classes that are irrelevant to determining l’air du temps.”

    As some here like to repeat often, “Feminists are ugly or lesbians.”

    Things don’t always socially stay the same. Outcasts today can be rulers tomorrow with enough money and propaganda backing them.

    It might not be time to fire up the furnaces, but I don’t say it couldn’t happen.

    Like


  296. on August 4, 2009 at 7:50 am Cannon's Canon

    Feminists are ugly or lesbians.

    Like


  297. on August 4, 2009 at 7:53 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    Outcasts today can be rulers tomorrow with enough money and propaganda backing them.

    You’re missing the point re: feminists. The point is that feminists were and are absolute geniuses when it comes to manipulation and recruitment. They were/are willing and able to recruit EVERYONE THEY COULD to their side, including gay men, straight betas (who are too stupid to realize that they’re signing their own death certificate by co-opting feminist causes), and desirable straight women (who are mostly also too stupid to realize that feminism hurts them more than it helps them).
    It wasn’t just money and propaganda, it was money, propaganda, and relentless outreach. To everyone. Including sworn enemies.

    White supremacists don’t reach out to anyone but other white supremacists, thus guaranteeing that their lack of power will persist.

    Like


  298. Gunny says, “Although nicole I wouldn’t put you in the same league as obsidian you are more of a human being type and not a nigger.”

    I am Black…and if that bell is tolling, it’s tolling for him and for me.

    It doesn’t matter what league we’re in if we’re all being exterminated like roaches.

    Like


  299. I am saying he is doing more to bring about the extermination than you. Picture 30,000 obsidians making comments on all the blogs in existance. Would make a hell of a difference for change wouldn’t it.

    Like


  300. Epoxytocin says, “White supremacists don’t reach out to anyone but other white supremacists, thus guaranteeing that their lack of power will persist.”

    If this were true, we wouldn’t have guys here who aren’t White supremacists constantly harping on how ugly Black women are, and attempting to use science to back up their opinions.

    It’s just repackaged old school eugenics. It’s no longer considered okay to just say Black people are inferior. It’s still okay to say that Black women are ugly because being ugly is the worst crime a woman can commit.

    ….partly, thanks to feminists convincing the pussified American male that this, indeed, is the worst crime a woman can commit.

    White supremacists have their social engineers too. Independent thinking people aren’t all trying to work for the common good. Some would like to create a society that serves their purposes, and for them it’s better for White to be considered the ideal kind of person to be.

    It serves the slaughtered’s insecurity and the sheared’s self pity.

    Like


  301. on August 4, 2009 at 8:07 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    Picture 30,000 obsidians making comments on all the blogs in existance. Would make a hell of a difference for change wouldn’t it.

    Obsidian is a race baiter, but he’s really not that bad. He just isn’t.
    I live in an area where there are very few black people, and I work in industries with essentially none of them, and yet I still manage to meet black people all the time whose views are WAY more polarized/inflammatory/irrational than Obsidian’s.

    I mean, if (a) you actually moved to get away from black people, BUT ALSO (b) you think Obsidian is some sick reverse-racist extremist, then you’re a bit on the oversensitive side.

    Also let’s not forget that EVERYTHING comes off as more extreme when it’s written down. Just about everyone on this board, in real life, would be closer to average than their written comments would suggest.

    Like


  302. Ghost guys on here don’t constantly harp on how ugly black woman are. When black is brought up it is brought up maybe. Other than that race is not that talked about. Except you can see that when brought up it is a hot topic. Black woman are not normally in conversation understand that it is not on the radar.

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  303. Gunny, lucky for you, there is only one Obsidian.

    There are however, vast numbers of intelligent Muslim men.

    Most of them aren’t subsaharan African.

    So as the ashes float to the ground, our deaths will change nothing for the emasculated masses who’ve sold their women into visual prostitution, and their children to the state.

    Nothing ever changes for the poor except the faces of the kings they slave and die for.

    Like


  304. on August 4, 2009 at 8:09 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    If this were true, we wouldn’t have guys here who aren’t White supremacists constantly harping on how ugly Black women are, and attempting to use science to back up their opinions.

    Nicole, do you think it’s even possible that Black women are, on average, less objectively attractive than women of other races?

    This is just a question. It is not an implication of my own take on the subject, either way.

    Yes or no.

    Like


  305. ””””’Epoxy,
    I mean, if (a) you actually moved to get away from black people, BUT ALSO (b) you think Obsidian is some sick reverse-racist extremist, then you’re a bit on the oversensitive side.””””””’

    I think he is actually racist against black people. I think he is trying to stir white hatred for blacks. Yea that somes it up. He is surprized that he can’t stir white people to actual anger. He is surprized that whites don’t hate blacks as much as he does.

    Like


  306. ”””””’Ghost of Nicole
    Gunny, lucky for you, there is only one Obsidian.

    There are however, vast numbers of intelligent Muslim men.

    Most of them aren’t subsaharan African.

    So as the ashes float to the ground, our deaths will change nothing for the emasculated masses who’ve sold their women into visual prostitution, and their children to the state.

    Nothing ever changes for the poor except the faces of the kings they slave and die for.”””””””

    Kind of why I am rooting for asian people to exterminate all of the west make sure ya get all the poison.

    Like


  307. @ guns, epoxy, et all
    War with blacks would be non-issue. Whites would win as easily as they won against Indians and as whites won in South Africa .

    But how exactly would you deal with the liberal elites who would keep control of the airforce, unmanned vehicles and missiles?

    Like


  308. ”””””’on August 4, 2009 at 8:08 am Ghost of Nicole
    Gunny, lucky for you, there is only one Obsidian.”””””””’

    Not true. Go look at a lot of websties there is usually an obsid there to make sure that they state what about the black people lol

    Like


  309. Well I am saying what if a new hitler comes to power. Yea game over.

    Like


  310. Epoxytocin asks, “Nicole, do you think it’s even possible that Black women are, on average, less objectively attractive than women of other races?”

    No I don’t.

    Beauty is objective. Attraction is not objective. Attraction is usually related to beauty, but value is given to some features above others.

    If, for instance, you met a very graceful, very strong, large breasted, relatively narrow waisted, wide hipped woman with a perfectly shaped face, eyes, perfectly flawless skin, and lusciously full but not too full lips…but she was 6’5″ tall and technically fat (say a size 12 tall), she may be more objectively beautiful than the petite girl with the straighter body and plainer face, but she will be more attractive to you unless you are a 6’7″ linebacker or amazon fetishist.

    Like


  311. ””””Ghost,
    Nothing ever changes for the poor except the faces of the kings they slave and die for”””””’

    Not true. The poor can be happy and content if they are homogeneous.

    Like


  312. Discontent people equal profits but if you have no threat of war you have not as much need for profits. Just being happy and content is fine.

    Like


  313. Gunny, the “new Hitler” won’t be targetting Blacks. He/She will be pushing mandatory contraception/sterilization of all the “unfit” people, and free and easily accessible abortions for the poor. Exterminating people raises too many alarms. Sterilizing them allows them to live to become “contributing members of society”, but without reproducing.

    They already have a good number of poor and military wives on Depo Provera and implants.

    Like


  314. on August 4, 2009 at 8:33 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    Nicole, let’s try this again, without shifting the goalposts.

    First, your example:

    If, for instance, you met a very graceful, very strong, large breasted, relatively narrow waisted, wide hipped woman with a perfectly shaped face, eyes, perfectly flawless skin, and lusciously full but not too full lips…but she was 6′5″ tall and technically fat (say a size 12 tall), she may be more objectively beautiful than the petite girl with the straighter body and plainer face, but she will be more attractive to you unless you are a 6′7″ linebacker or amazon fetishist.

    First, and most importantly, this example is 100% completely irrelevant to my question. You’re smart enough to know this, so you don’t get the dumb-girl pass.

    Second, watch the declarations of who “will be more attractive”. I’d fuck the freakishly tall girl with the T&A first, any day of the week.
    They’re all the same height on their backs, anyway. And you can do cool shit with tall girls that you can’t with short ones (although the reverse is also true).

    Now, let’s try the question again. I’ll change one word, so that you can’t equivocate on “attractive vs. beautiful” again; instead, I’ll use your exact word from before.

    Nicole, do you think it’s even possible that Black women are, on average, uglier than women of other races?

    This is just a question. It is not an implication of my own take on the subject, either way.

    Yes or no.

    Like


  315. Gunny, the people with no threat of war will be the last ethnic group on earth, and they will cannibalize each other…like most in homogenous societies already do, even with the constant threat of war.

    Like


  316. Question for E87:

    Why do you call me a “race-baiter”? On what basis do you say this? And, how is it possible for you not to notice, or at least speak out on, the very blatant racially charged remarks made in this forum, often unprovoked? Please explain?

    As to your question to Nicole about the supposed “objective” lack of beauty in Black Women, please answer me this:

    Assuming that were true, how do you then explain the fact that MILLIONS of present day African Americans are in fact quite light skinned? That White Men found the kind of Black Women Nicole described (and her description comes close to my baby Brown Sugah, btw-I love it!) so sexually attractive that they couldn’t resisting impregnating them again and again and again? How do you explain this, sir?

    Thank you.

    O

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  317. Well I am saying what if a new hitler comes to power. Yea game over.

    Things didn’t work out so well for the old Hitler you know.

    Like


  318. Yea exactly the last ethnic group on earth with one religion and one purpose to love one another except for outliers those will be the ones whose heads are dashed on the rocks.

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  319. Epoxytocin asks, “Nicole, do you think it’s even possible that Black women are, on average, uglier than women of other races?”

    I don’t think this is so, but I do think it is possible.

    When I get the memo that I have been promoted to God, I can give you a definite answer.

    Then I’ll even be able to tell you why, if it is so, that my predecessor made Black women on average uglier than others.

    It would probably sound something like, “They’re the genetic mothers of humanity. Do you need your mom to only be hot, or to also have genetic traits that will ensure maternal instinct and ability to survive diseases?”

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  320. Yea but joe the new hitler will have access to killing power the old hitler never dreamed of.

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  321. Things didn’t work out so well for the old Hitler you know.

    the armies that defeated him weren´t exactly swarthy

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  322. Yea gig was more like a world civil war.

    Like


  323. Yea but joe the new hitler will have access to killing power the old hitler never dreamed of.

    So will the new masses. You have people in mud huts and desert tribes with no electricity but crates of AK47s. Combine that with guerilla warfare and good luck. It’s not going to be a cakewalk unless the new Hitler puts his energy into the big city liberals around the world, the only group vigorously dedicated to disarming themselves and no one else.

    Like


  324. the armies that defeated him weren´t exactly swarthy

    today’s swarthy masses aren’t exactly yesterday’s swarthy masses. 9/11 anyone? They don’t need a military victory in the traditional sense, nor are they aiming for one. They just need to terrorize and undermine the West’s confidence in itself and its safety to the point the whole thing unravels.

    Like


  325. Gunny, people have never just loved one another, even in homogenous groups. They cannibalize each other, and make outliers of their own people who are merely different, or can think for themselves.

    This is why in the so-called matriarchal utopias in Tibet and the outskirts of China, it’s not even Chinese culture that is turning things over.

    It’s *Christians*. Christians are recruiting the men who don’t want to be husband #4, but also don’t want to be turned into Chinese drones either.

    Shit changes. One has to adapt and survive.

    Like


  326. on August 4, 2009 at 8:50 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    Why do you call me a “race-baiter”? On what basis do you say this?

    On the basis of your injecting race into arguments to which it is at most tangentially related.

    I should say, I think that you have a valid reason, or at least a decent segue, into the race discussion at least 90% of the time. The other 10% is what I’m referring to as baiting.

    Also, while I think you sometimes pontificate excessively about race, I also think that you have produced some of the best single comments on this blog – some as distillations, into a single comment, of the wisdom of hundreds of previous comments, and some genuinely trenchant insights and perspectives that have given me new angles on stuff.

    Finally, although this has nothing to do with race:
    among the three tiers of commenters here with respect to actual Game,
    (1) commenters who clearly and obviously have had experience and success with women;
    (2) commenters who may have had such success, but may just be making shit up;
    (3) commenters whose every word, hell, even the punctuation marks, betray their lack of game and utter lack of success with women;
    it’s obvious that you are in tier 1. We could use a few more of those.
    To me, this is your biggest net positive as a contributor to this forum.
    Especially as pertaining to the notion that Game transcends racial lines (almost all of the other tier 1 posters here are white or semitic, or, at the very least, have given no indication otherwise).

    Hope that helps.

    And, how is it possible for you not to notice, or at least speak out on, the very blatant racially charged remarks made in this forum, often unprovoked? Please explain?

    I notice those, too. But, in the context of this particular thread, I was responding specifically to Gunslinger’s comments about you.

    Like


  327. the armies that defeated him weren´t exactly swarthy

    besides, the armies that would defeat the new hitler in the end wouldn’t be all swarthy either. self-hating whites would get a bulk of the work done. look at the energy and effort america and its media puts into protecting terrorists from discomfort and torture and ill treatment even as terrorists blow up americans abroad. whites can’t wage a true race war because there are just as many whites that would side against you on behalf of the swarthy masses as for your side. and the swarthy masses know and exploit this.

    Like


  328. Yea but joe extermination vs helping.

    Don’t seem to understand difference.

    vietnam if we would have started paving from one side to other and made a parking lot. Would have won war. We were supposedly trying to “help”

    It is hard to comprehend annhilation but yea makes war easy. No guerrilla warfare becasue there are no guerrillas or there families or kids who grow up to hate you.

    Like


  329. on August 4, 2009 at 8:54 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ obsidian

    That White Men found the kind of Black Women Nicole described (and her description comes close to my baby Brown Sugah, btw-I love it!) so sexually attractive that they couldn’t resisting impregnating them again and again and again? How do you explain this, sir?

    You apparently missed or ignored the warning label on that post.
    The “this question is not a reflection of my actual take on the subject” warning label.

    (By the way, your missing/ignoring such labels is part of why I call you a race baiter)

    Ironically (for you), I’m an avowed lover of hot chocolate. Especially when it’s served in a nice long tall glass with contoured hand grips.

    I’m on a ginseng tea diet indefinitely, so to speak, but I still like the hot chocolate.

    Like


  330. on August 4, 2009 at 8:55 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ obsidian

    That White Men found the kind of Black Women Nicole described (and her description comes close to my baby Brown Sugah, btw-I love it!) so sexually attractive that they couldn’t resisting impregnating them again and again and again? How do you explain this, sir?

    You apparently missed or ignored the warning label on that post.
    The “this question is not a reflection of my actual take on the subject” warning label.

    (By the way, your missing/ignoring such labels is part of why I call you a race baiter)

    Ironically (for you), I’m an avowed lover of hot chocolate. Especially when it’s served in a nice long tall glass with contoured hand grips.

    I’m on a ginseng tea diet indefinitely, so to speak, but I still like the hot chocolate.

    Like


  331. ”””””””””’on August 4, 2009 at 8:51 am Joe
    the armies that defeated him weren´t exactly swarthy

    besides, the armies that would defeat the new hitler in the end wouldn’t be all swarthy either. self-hating whites would get a bulk of the work done. look at the energy and effort america and its media puts into protecting terrorists from discomfort and torture and ill treatment even as terrorists blow up americans abroad. whites can’t wage a true race war because there are just as many whites that would side against you on behalf of the swarthy masses as for your side. and the swarthy masses know and exploit this.””””””””””’

    Why I don’t think whites will be the last race standing.

    Like


  332. vietnam if we would have started paving from one side to other and made a parking lot. Would have won war. We were supposedly trying to “help”

    It is hard to comprehend annhilation but yea makes war easy. No guerrilla warfare becasue there are no guerrillas or there families or kids who grow up to hate you.

    exactly. but the west has no stomach for this. NONE. their compassion is their weakness. they’re squeamish. they have the means but not the will. the swarthy masses know this. they don’t have the means but they have the will. you can name every possible type of extermination method possible and yes, in theory the west could do them. but we all know they won’t. and the swarthy masses especially know this. and the west’s “useful idiots” are to blame. nancy pelosi, ted kennedy and barney frank would stop it before a single member of the swarthy masses would have to lift a finger.

    Like


  333. Why I don’t think whites will be the last race standing.

    this i can agree with.

    Like


  334. Although if you look at how they are perfectly willing to enslave the men then not so sure how much “compassion” whites really have. Achillies heal is not being able to kill when warranted. Or even kill to put out of misery. Or to kill out of compassion.

    Like


  335. on August 4, 2009 at 9:02 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    the west’s “useful idiots” are to blame. nancy pelosi, ted kennedy and barney frank would stop it before a single member of the swarthy masses would have to lift a finger.

    If the swarthy masses topple other Western countries first, there’s a chance – not a certainty, but at least a chance – that our elites might notice, and right the course, before it’s too late.

    This is why I don’t think we have much to fear from an Islamic takeover: because they’re going to get countries like Sweden and the UK first. After that happens, even pussy idiot liberals will wake up to the threat pretty quickly.

    Like


  336. If the swarthy masses topple other Western countries first, there’s a chance – not a certainty, but at least a chance – that our elites might notice, and right the course, before it’s too late.

    This is why I don’t think we have much to fear from an Islamic takeover: because they’re going to get countries like Sweden and the UK first. After that happens, even pussy idiot liberals will wake up to the threat pretty quickly.

    Depends on if you think of it as war in the traditional sense with borders to defend, countries to invade and armies to conquer. The west still thinks with outdated paradigms. This is more like an infection or an infestation than an invasion. By the time you notice you have a couple dozen mice, there are probably hundreds in your walls already. If your foundation is filled with limitless cracks and holes, too many to patch up, it’s impossible to exterminate at that point. Or like an outbreak of plague, by the time you notice your neighbors dying from advanced stages, there’s a good chance you’re already sick and in early stages yourself and too far gone. Liberals are like the compromised immune system of the west.

    Like


  337. Maybe they are doing the 50/50 shit to slow down progress. Maybe that is the real reason. Once we perfect anti-missle anti-plane capability for conventional numbers will be biggest turning point in history of planet. When the threat of nukes is gone but the players remain.

    Like


  338. Maybe we are at war. Maybe someone paid money to get the divorce laws passed and paid money to make things the way they are. How about that. Maybe money is being paid to make the universities the way they are. Maybe money is being paid to fuck up the us.

    Like


  339. “Yes, I’m aware that Black people like us scare the piss out of you.

    We should.

    …and now one of us is the president of the country you live in.”

    such entitled mau-mauing. such krokodil humor. that really helps the case for racial harmony nicole. basically you are telling whites “blacks are your enemy, kill them on sight”.

    none of this bullshit will survive the death of the baby boomer generation. my generation (teens in 80’s) and younger will reverse the whole “mommy was mean to the black maid in 1962” guilt based racial regime people like my parents fought for. the veneer of racial guilt school and entertainment try to laminate you with continually wears thin after about 19, 21 if you go to college. it won’t last forever and you don’t even have to agitate for it–it’s just going to go bye bye. just as women have to ask themselves what will happen to them when men completely stop caring about their welfare, blacks need to ask themselves what will REALLY happen when whites no longer “officially” care about them.

    Like


  340. on August 4, 2009 at 9:15 am Comment_Whatever

    Anonymous jabbered:

    My uncle. What a ladies’ man. Who happened to have tossed over his latest at 63, assuming he could get a NEW 40-y-old to replace the aged-out one. And was diagnosed with terminal lung cancer within the year, before he’d had a chance to snag his next honey.

    Being a dutiful niece, because he had no children, I went to visit him once every few weeks and accompanied him to some of his appts. to translate what the drs. are saying, and I came often to see him when he went to hospice. He died a horrible, painful twitching death. Alone. Without ANYONE there who really, genuinely loved him. I felt sorry for him, in the end, but I did not love him. I was there mostly to avoid feeling guilty for not coming. No one loved him. That’s what you want? That’s just what you might get.

    I laugh at you, Anonymous. Living to die. And at the same time living in the Eternal Now. Do you actually believe, vulture-girl, that your uncle was thinking about his slowly rotting body during his last days? He had lived, lived for decades. And that was where he was in his last days. Perhaps at times with the bitter ‘ifs’ and ‘might have beens’. Other times with his happiest days, and others just random days that just came into his mind. He had decades of joy and sorrow and boredom and accomplishment to wander in.

    It is true that some old people are cowards. Scared of the death that is now coming for them and they let that fear consume every part of their lives and self. I don’t pity them, I DESPISE them. I’ve known many people who face that final door with a greater or lesser measure of dignity, and I know it is POSSIBLE to do so. Letting fear of death consume you…. especially when such death is inevitable is weak.

    We are all eager to lecture eight year olds on ‘responsibility’ and ‘toughness’, but absolutely refuse to tell the 70+ that maybe they should pretend to be an adult.

    All those who have made even a very modest attempt at actually living will have hundreds of special days to wander in as they await death.

    Like


  341. E87,
    Thanks for the comments. Much appreciated. If you don’t mind, could give an example or two of what you thought I said along racial lines that was impactful for you? Always nice to know what you’re doing is on the money.

    And yup, Game is universal, although various aspects will be different depending on the Men and Women involved in terms of culture and/or race.

    I’ve personally found that much of Mystery’s style of Game is in line w/certain White norms. if you ask The Black PUA, or Assanova, or some of the other Brothas around, they’ll tel you quick that “opening sets” in the way Mystery advocates is highly unlikely to work w/Black Women. Same deal w/Hispanic, read, Puerto Rican Women.

    I’ve found that witty banter and the like, what I call “Seinfeld talk” is something that is highly popular w/White folks, not so much w/Black, at least not that way. To many White Women though, Black or Hispanic guys can come on too strong in a way that is expected, even desired among Black and Hispanic Women.

    Perhaps the biggest difference between the Black and White guys in Game is in the ease w/which most Brothas peacock, and naturally exude ease and calm in dealing w/Women. On the other hand, a really good technical Game White guy can be a killer w/well paced Game along MM lines.

    I’ve personally learned a great deal from the MM, though, but at the same time I’ve found that consideration modifications had to be made in order for me to get the most use out of it. For example, I rarely if ever approach females; they approach me. I do use Negs, but I do it in a way that’s a bit different than described here. On the other hand, stuff like the Seven Hour Rule is definitely nothing to be slept on, nor are other very important aspects of Game, like the Proximity Alert System, Anti-Slut Defense, or Last Minute Resistance. Personally I’ve never encountered the latter, because I was very careful to take the Woman through ALL the steps of Seduction, FIRST. By then, she will be eager to offer up her womb to me.

    That’s a big thing I notice a lot of guys do, *skip steps*. You CAN’T DO THAT with Women, because they are inherently process-oriented, whereas we Men tend to be goal-oriented. This is why the MM is so important, because it stresses the importance of taking your Target through a process-a courtship process. And a good Seduction is NEVER done quickly. It’s done slowly, over time, and I’m never rushed to hit it. In fact, I abhor one night stands, “same night lays” “pump & dumps” and the like. A good fuck can’t be done in 15 minutes, or even one night, I say. I prefer to consume a Woman slowly, say, over the course of a week.

    But that’s just me.

    Anyway, thanks again, and looking forward to your response.

    The Obsidian

    Like


  342. anonymouse.

    my grandmother is 90 and in here astonishingly still large circle of friends there are many many lonely women but not ONE single lonely man. you know why? as soon as a man’s woman dies there are 100 older women jockeying to take care of the alta cocker next. men don’t die alone for the most part, women do. if an old man’s not concerned with sex but is just trying to get a free nurse there will be no lack of gen x cat ladies to care for him in 40 years.

    Like


  343. wrt to white men and black women

    Latin America lacked white women. The first place to have surplus of them was Brazil with mass immigration from Portugal starting in 1700. Thus the absence of white women, and not desire, led white men to black women in the first place.
    A Portuguese sailor who left Europe to trade in Asia, to speak bluntly, would live 2 years without seeing a single beautiful women.
    Once mixing starts, the ugliness of black females decreases but even then whites would consider wealth as a way to acquire a beautiful white women. But now imagine a landlord in Brazil around 1750. Race mixing has been going on for 10 generations.
    there is a pool, small but nonetheless real, of attractive black women. Specially the face, which is the ugliest feature of black women. You marry a Portuguese white women who will grow old.

    now imagine you, lord of men and beasts, tied with a 40 year old Portuguese hag who may have lost her teeth. You may have, or else you will have resources to buy, a pretty slave. And while men who do not get laid may hide their incompetence through unrealistic high standards, they know deep inside that given the chance they will fuck women they say they despise.

    as your trophy wife ages, even the most racist Sugar Baron will lower his standards. Specially because there was no market of slut-whites, white prostitution only started in Latin America in the late 1800 due to the extremely high value of the few white women around

    fast forward another 250 years and see the world through the eyes of the descendants of those men. There are plenty of white women around, even whites as a whole are just over half of the population. There is also a great pool of attractive black females, or at least women with African ancestry. Camila Pitanga and Adriana Lima are proof of this. But those examples don´t deny the reality of black female ugliness, they reinforce the beauty of whites and how blacks only achieve beauty through white admixture.

    Like


  344. E87,
    W/all due respect, I think it is you who have misunderstood what I was asking. Your personal perspective on the matter is irrelevant. I am asking how do you square the simple fact that for centuries, scores of White Men clearly found very Black, very African Women sexually attractive enough to impregnate them to such an extent that today in the USA we have literally millions of lightskinned Black folks? And, we can add Brazil as well, although that was more of a “threeway” racial mixing going on there.

    Again-care to field that question, sir?

    O

    Like


  345. sex with a slave girl means she will do her best to fake orgasms, she´ won´t put any restrictions (“do me in the ass, master”) you can fail you can ejaculate in 30 seconds, you can have a small dick, you can be as bad a lover as it is possible. Slaves are almost sexbots.

    Like


  346. Dana says, “such entitled mau-mauing. such krokodil humor. that really helps the case for racial harmony nicole. basically you are telling whites “blacks are your enemy, kill them on sight”. ”

    Excuse me. Perhaps I wasn’t clear enough.

    I am Black, and I am Native American. In a sense, I am ethnically, your worse nightmare…the combination of your strongest former slave and your strongest target for extermination.

    Consider, for a moment, how I must have been raised…

    I am no big fan of any large government, but the U.S. was built on my land and the blood of my people has been spilled, and the bones of my people buried in that ground since longer than your people knew it existed.

    I am the product of people who survived your encroachment, adapted, believed in what America could become, and helped it to become a place where I can, barring private crime, pretty much live in peace.

    So I’m American. Period.

    The offensively willing White supremacists, radical Muslims, gangsters trying to shoot up and drug up my kids, you’re all the same to me…threats to MY land and MY country.

    …and though many White people may not have as many ancestors whose blood was spilled and whose bones were buried in my country, so long as the uphold the Constitution, it’s their country too. So it’s OUR country, and if you don’t like it, go the fuck back to Europe, Asia, Africa, or wherever you came from.

    Then you can be around only people who look like you, as much as you want, and you can all fuck yourselves and your mothers…which ain’t so far from what actually happens with stupid “homogenous” people.

    It’s your choice if you only want to screw or socialize with people who look like you. When you start waving guns around just because someone doesn’t agree with your opinion of their worth as a human being, then the NavyBitch comes out.

    When someone with more talent and intelligence than you wish you had becomes a “roach” to be “exterminated” because they’re not kissing your ass, you got a fucking problem with America, not with Black people.

    “blacks need to ask themselves what will REALLY happen when whites no longer “officially” care about them.”

    I wasn’t aware that, as a group, they ever did.

    What they cared about was their perception of themselves…most of them anyway. Forgive people for being intelligent, and not into exterminating people like roaches for disagreeing with them.

    Like


  347. on August 4, 2009 at 9:45 am Epoxytocin No. 87

    @ O

    Thanks for the comments. Much appreciated. If you don’t mind, could give an example or two of what you thought I said along racial lines that was impactful for you? Always nice to know what you’re doing is on the money.

    It’s not the racial comments themselves. It’s the validation of Game techniques, especially Mystery’s, from you.

    Since you’re about as similar to Mystery as I am to Bruce Lee, this speaks volumes for the universality of his knowledge.

    And yup, Game is universal, although various aspects will be different depending on the Men and Women involved in terms of culture and/or race.

    Sure.

    Here’s my take on this:

    The basic principles of Game are essentially invariant (just as the basic principles of female attractiveness are essentially invariant, although there are not-that-great differences among races).

    BUT

    Everybody needs help with the aspects of Game on which they’re weakest.

    This, Obsidian, is probably why you got more out of the process-oriented part of MM than any of the other game stuff: Because you don’t need help with the other stuff.

    For example, I rarely if ever approach females; they approach me.

    No, you just have a natural understanding of how to capitalize on IOI’s, which is what “approach” means in most PUA talk. It doesn’t mean you have to physically walk up to them, whether at an angle (a la Mystery) or not.

    if you ask The Black PUA, or Assanova, or some of the other Brothas around, they’ll tel you quick that “opening sets” in the way Mystery advocates is highly unlikely to work w/Black Women. Same deal w/Hispanic, read, Puerto Rican Women

    It’s not just the women. It’s the race of the PUA’s themselves, too.

    Women’s expectations of an approach are fundamentally dependent on the race and image of the man who’s approaching them.

    If you, as a black man, approach a black or brown woman, she will EXPECT a degree of aggressiveness that she simply won’t expect from me (a half white half brown guy).

    But yeah, a lot of PUA stuff is so geared toward white people that it’s not even funny.

    Like “The Apocalypse Opener”?
    A lot of white people in the community don’t even believe that it works.
    Hilarious.
    In places like Gainesville, FL, and Savannah, GA, essentially ALL game run by 14-22 year old black guys is a succession of apocalypse openers. They think nothing of just walking up to girls and opening them with lines like “c’mon baby, you know you wanna hit it”
    …and sometimes it works.

    Like


  348. yes nicole. i understand. i was born in 1969, my parents were civil rights activists and i grew up watching sesame st and “free to be you and me” AND irrespective of a wholesale change in america you and your coethnics will nurse a grudge against me and mine for things that happened before i was born forever.

    it’s ok, i’m always glad to see how people feel honestly and have never been under the illusion that blacks and ludicrous stone age indians don’t view whites as permanent enemies

    it’s all gonna come crashing down though. it will be interesting to watch.

    Like


  349. wrt to white men and black women

    Latin America lacked white women. The first place to have surplus of them was Brazil with mass immigration from Portugal starting in 1700. Thus the absence of white women, and not desire, led white men to black women in the first place.

    Is there documented proof this was their thought process or speculation? I don’t see how we can know definitively what their dicks were thinking.

    Like


  350. Dana, I don’t see people, regardless of their ethnicity, who uphold the Constitution as my enemy.

    I see people who use the Constitution as their personal toilet paper that they tear to fit their self pity as my enemy.

    It’s probably easy for you since it’s also easy for you to ignore the chunk of my post where I said, “…and though many White people may not have as many ancestors whose blood was spilled and whose bones were buried in my country, so long as the uphold the Constitution, it’s their country too. So it’s OUR country, and if you don’t like it, go the fuck back to Europe, Asia, Africa, or wherever you came from.”

    So take your Sesame Street suburban girl rebellion persecution complex elsewhere. I know your game loud and clear.

    You, like many homely White women who are overly feminist influenced, can’t adapt to a world where nobody is giving you special props just for being White anymore. You want White guys to think you are prettier than Jennifer Lopez, and they don’t so you’re pissed.

    Get over it.

    I’m not prettier than Angelina Jolie, but I’m not talking about wiping White people off the earth because I think I’m entitled for Black or Native American men to think I’m pretty just because my skin is brown. That’s just not how shit works.

    Grow up. Nobody’s hating on you for being White…just for being stupid and using your race as if it’s supposed to give you some kind of free pass.

    I hate Black people who constantly whine instead of celebrating their survival and thanking God or nature for not being under the chain anymore…and I hate White people who don’t realize that until folks really did start upholding the Constitution, plenty of you were under the chain too.

    Stupid people love to rewrite history and think just because they are, everybody is. Well I’m not…and I don’t give a fuck what color you are if you’re attacking my country.

    Like


  351. Dana, I’m curious, did you get along with other women growing up? Have issues with mean girl and queen bee cliques as a teen? Ever been diagnosed as being somewhere on spectrum of autism, like being somewhat aspergy?

    Like


  352. I kinda knew Nicole would get a whiff of what Dana was really all about soonr or later.

    The Battle, is Joined.

    *Obsidian fixes up some Jiffypop popcorn, rubs hands*

    O

    Like


  353. @Dana:

    I have close friends of all races, and I’ll be damned if they all hold grudges against whites. It is possible to see someone without thinking,”Black black black black.” I have to really think about it before noticing that someone is this or that or anything else.

    I’m not denying that there are people who hate whites. (Look at Lucifer). And I’m not denying that that’s an attitude held by some blacks. Heck, I’ve been told that I “don’t belong around these parts” by a black man, and I better “get out of here before the sun goes down.”

    Yes, there is a bit of self-segregation. People will locate themselves where they feel most comfortable. Few blacks are in white neighborhoods because some whites hold the same “you don’t belong around these parts” attitudes towards black, sometimes without explicitly saying it.

    It happens. (whether “it” is a full word or not)

    I find whites that assume that all blacks have an axe to grind with them just as bad as blacks who cry,”It’s because I’m black!” and “I hate the white man!”

    It is all the same.

    I’m not saying to assume the best of everyone or everything. But to say that there’s going to be a revolution sometime soon? That things are going to collapse soon?

    Not likely.

    Just take things as they come. Some people are going to feel one way, some will feel another, and some might be neutral. Don’t assume that anyone is going to be one thing or the other based on their skin color.

    That is all.

    Like


  354. See o boy that is what I am talking bout.

    Spread the word baby. Spread the word.

    Preach that shit.

    Like


  355. ””””Ghost,
    So take your Sesame Street suburban girl rebellion persecution complex elsewhere. I know your game loud and clear.””””””””’

    Yea you do tell her how you know exactly what that white woman game is and what you plan to do about it.

    Let out your inner nigger.

    Like


  356. Gunny, fortunately, for the extreme self pitying, they have pre-installed a self destruct mechanism long before I type one word or open my mouth.

    If I said nothing, things would be the same. My saying something is mostly due to my boredom today.

    Like


  357. E87 and Obsidian,

    ‘It’s not just the women. It’s the race of the PUA’s themselves, too.

    Women’s expectations of an approach are fundamentally dependent on the race and image of the man who’s approaching them.

    If you, as a black man, approach a black or brown woman, she will EXPECT a degree of aggressiveness that she simply won’t expect from me (a half white half brown guy).’

    Interesting point . For me (as a black man) I tend to change the way I go about approaching women depending on their race , being more serious and aggressive with black women and more playful and lighthearted towards white women . I’ve realized however that every now and again when receiving IOIs from white women , after approaching there seems to be a loss of attraction on their part , whereas white women that I approach without receiving IOIs are almost always receptive to me being playful . could this perhaps be that the one who showed IOIs expected me – as a black male – to approach in a more serious and aggressive manner and were let down when I didnt ?

    Like


  358. lol ghost yea it fits though right. Unconditional love turns to a race thread. I mean it takes uncondtional love for the white man to tolerate niggers. So yea it does make sense.

    Like


  359. It is because you are different tazzy. It helps with game. Like I said before when I went to all black clubs as a white man. I didn’t approach woman they came up and sat at my table and stared at me in wonder. Then another would come. Then I went ouside and another woman was waiting for me. No game needed.

    Like


  360. xsplat —

    In my cupboard right now is a way to have a painless easy death.

    What is it? I should get it into my cupboard as well.

    Since I share your philosophy on how to “leave this mortal coil” as well.

    Like


  361. on August 4, 2009 at 11:12 am Willard Libby

    Ghost of Nicole

    Well Gunny, you have to excuse Obsidian and myself for not being docile niggers,

    What’s your excuse for being a fat, ugly, stupid one?

    Like


  362. ”””””’on August 4, 2009 at 11:10 am doug1
    xsplat –

    In my cupboard right now is a way to have a painless easy death.

    What is it? I should get it into my cupboard as well.

    Since I share your philosophy on how to “leave this mortal coil” as well.
    ””””””””””””’

    Get that shit from a vet doug. No pain just blistfull sleep.

    Like


  363. It’s like really is it worth it to hang around for the end. Look around if the law actually gets passed on the 50 percent of woman this and 50 percent that shit. I mean really who wants to even see that crap.

    Like


  364. Has it become to the point of ridiculas yet?

    How can people not look at this and say wtf or laugh it out of existance?

    See how bending over just gets worse and never better.

    Like


  365. Jables

    Roissy,

    I just got diagnosed with bipolar disorder.

    Congrats. Now you’re teh same as the other 73.7 million children in the USA

    Like


  366. Wow, another race thread! Know what I like best about these? The freshness of the ideas and the sparkling originality of every point made! I especially like the part where people talk about how “objectively” ugly black women are, or how my friends and family should be gassed and exterminated “like roaches.” Can’t wait to hear everyone’s new and original thoughts on HBD and the IQ bell curve!

    *Sneaks some popcorn from O, watches in rapt attention*

    Like


  367. Anonymouse—

    I just don’t buy the story that you guys want to die alone, and an entire lifetime spent sowing wild oats will reap exactly that.

    Nothing could be more absurd or perverse than to live an entire life based on what the last few months of it will be like. If they get bad enough, without any real chance of improvement, just off yourself. I plan to. Always have.

    Whatever the choices one makes about relationships versus playing, or a number of serial relationships and playing in between versus at some stage one strictly monogamous one that might possibly go the distance, what you cite is the last reason to make them.

    Like


  368. joe–bingo

    Like


  369. on August 4, 2009 at 11:46 am Seeking Alpha

    or how my friends and family should be gassed and exterminated “like roaches.”

    Did someone really say that? Only person I can find mentioning it is Nicole. Sounds like someone blowing someone else’s argument way out of proportion.

    Like


  370. kalli0pe

    or how my friends and family should be gassed and exterminated “like roaches.

    Even as a joke it was in very bad taste.

    Like


  371. nicole, it’s apparent from your response that i am congenitally incapable of understanding what you write and my responses to you are consequently inappropriate. i will cease attempting conversation with you. my fault

    Like


  372. on August 4, 2009 at 11:55 am Black Military Man

    Go easy on Dana, she said she’s an old Jewish woman. Ever hear Jews talk about their mothers? Enough said.

    Like


  373. @doug1:

    “If they get bad enough, without any real chance of improvement, just off yourself. I plan to. Always have.”

    Really doug? Really?

    I’m reading about you and xsplat having (or wanting) that backup to commit suicide, and it shocks me.

    You never seen like the type to even give that a thought, a consideration.

    Would you really do that? Just give up. Give up, not only on yourself, but on those around you? Would you just give up hope, give up on life, because things aren’t going how you planned?

    Please tell me it’s all talk. Please.

    Like


  374. Yea kalliope this might come as a shock to you but your not black.

    Also since you think your black. Can you see how it never changes along racial divides. lol

    *Sneaks some popcorn from O, watches in rapt attention*

    It started with some cool stuff on unconditional love. Yea kind of like yours of blacks. I guess it does fit.

    Like


  375. kalli0pe hyperboled (hey, that rhymes)

    Wow, another race thread!.. .I especially like the part where people talk about how …my friends and family should be gassed and exterminated “like roaches.”

    ouch – i didn’t see where anybody wrote that – but just in case – send me your auntie’s chicken n waffle recipe before the kkk comes for you baby

    Like


  376. on August 4, 2009 at 12:09 pm Willard Libby

    Mandy! XD

    Heck, I’ve been told that I “don’t belong around these parts” by a black man, and I better “get out of here before the sun goes down.”

    Maybe he was just trying to be helpful to you.

    Like


  377. @kalli0pe, from overnight- sorry to read of your family situation. l hope all goes as well as possible for you & yours.

    there wasn’t just race on this one – a lot on mortality, for example. doncha just love how this stuff comes up on a PUA-themed blog? Interesting.

    Like


  378. Willard asks, “What’s your excuse for being a fat, ugly, stupid one?”

    I don’t make excuses. I make money.

    Your opinion takes neither a cent nor a shekel from my account. When you have what I have, you’ll have a similar attitude to whining bitches who think they’re entitled to money and status just for being born. The way to get what I have is to understand that nobody on this earth or life itself owes you a damned thing.

    On that day you’ll care as much about my looks or weight as I do about the size of your cock. It’s irrelevant.

    …and for the record, Gunny was the one who started talking in terms of exterminating us like roaches. If you want to know why that was brought in, ask him.

    I just put the “this is America” Sparta style smackdown on the poor persecuted pity partiers.

    Like


  379. Tazz,
    Yea, I think you nailed it. Like it or not, Racial stereotypes really come to the fore when it plays along sexual lines, hence the keen focus on it here. White Women as a rule, do indeed expect Black Men to be more “manly” than White Men, etc, and can be kinda let down when that doesn’t happen, and keep in mind here, we’re talking about a group of mainly under 30 folk, who don’t have all that much perspective on life and experience, no matter how many toys and distractions they may have.

    O

    Like


  380. Oh right. Because showing someone pics of unhealthy babies is supposed to make that person want to see the baby over and over and over.

    Relax. The conclusion of the study is wrong.

    If it was YOUR baby, and you had it for 9 months and are breast feeding it

    TRUST ME

    You’ll care about it more than other people’s babies.

    What is wrong with this study? Umm how about the fact that it is TESTING THE WRONG THING?

    Women aren’t abandoning THEIR OWN BABIES. They are looking at babies which are not healthy and hoping to distance themselves from that. Same with the men. Give me a break!!

    Like


  381. It wasn’t a joke, doug. It was a reference to a conversation upthread between Gun and Nicole, which dana and others jumped into later. I don’t think anyone outright said it “should” happen, but people were listing the positives and the discussion itself seemed pretty effed up even for this blog.

    “Yea kalliope this might come as a shock to you but your not black.”

    Heh, tell that to my black dad. I’m pretty far removed from your average black American, but close enough they’d probably throw me on the death train too. My family would probably not be the best to come for first though, as the males tend to be heavily armed and aggressive (we are part black, after all.)

    @ xsplat re: suicide.

    Nembutal overdose. Or the Darvon cocktail. Ingredients can be found and ordered easily online, or obtained in Mexico. Probably the only thing guaranteed to be pleasant and painless, although not as quick as your chosen method.

    @ Firepower –

    Are you sure you can HANDLE my auntie’s chicken and waffles? It’s made grown men weep before.

    Like


  382. Did someone really say that? Only person I can find mentioning it is Nicole. Sounds like someone blowing someone else’s argument way out of proportion.

    Why are you acting like such a statement is so improbable around these parts? You haven’t even read the original comment in question and you’ve already started excusing and downplaying it? If someone told you Obsidian said that about white people I suspect your response would be totally different. 🙄

    Like


  383. And by the way I believe in unconditional love.

    I have had something close to it, and even though I am not together with the girl anymore, I still feel like an older brother and would do anything for her that society would allow, if she needed it.

    Like


  384. ””””’, who don’t have all that much perspective on life and experience, no matter how many toys and distractions they may have. ””””””””

    You can do better than that. Come on. You can do better.

    Like


  385. ””””””kalli0pe
    It wasn’t a joke, doug. It was a reference to a conversation upthread between Gun and Nicole, which dana and others jumped into later. I don’t think anyone outright said it “should” happen, but people were listing the positives and the discussion itself seemed pretty effed up even for this blog. ”””””””””””””’

    Trying to figure out how end game is gonna work.

    When ya can’t get away from blacks and there goal is to always be up in your face and making you learn about them.
    What do you suggest be done Kalliope. Do you suggest the bend over and take it method?

    Like


  386. Race is not that big of a deal in my life. Show below where I talked about race. Now the reason I go off on the shit on here is yea don’t want the bullshit to get spouted. I don’t want to be hearing hbd this hbd that or black this black that or white this white that. I want to learn about life or maybe come up with new challenges.

    ””””””””’Gunslingergregi
    Unconditional Love
    You can say it
    You can live it
    You can do it
    You can prove it

    ”””””””April 13 2008
    Level 1
    Well got to level one. Last 40 days have made 25 percent on the stock market day trading. Life should almost too easy but it is not. You can plan everything except your wife developing two egg size tumors in the uterous shit is out of control. Achieve goals live in one of the toughest environments on the planet for three years plan achieve goals and then this shit. She was included in every plan I had for the future and now it is like wtf why? The woman I have loved the most in my life and the chance she could be gone. I planned on till death do we part but not this soon for god’s sake. Hopefully I have the guts to commit Sepucu if anything happens. I’d rather go out Romeo and Juliet style and chill with her in the afterlife.
    Saving the loot was still the best thing though because i have the ability to pay for the operation and be there with her when it happens. I have Ritz Carlton reservations and have told them to put 20 bouquets of flowers in the room with a heart shape of rose petals on the bed. They are opening the resteraunt early so that we can sit down with her famility and eat some good food and relax. I also have the ability to be with her to the end (if it turns out bad) without worrying about little bullshit that doesn’t matter, just worrying about Love.”””””””””””””’

    Like


  387. @Willard:

    He was, albeit in a creepy way that I can’t exactly “show” over the internet.

    It was like a warning intermingled with a threat.

    Like


  388. At the end of your life it is the truth that race doesn’t matter. When you are close to the point where you will meet your maker. Race is not on your mind.

    Like


  389. kalli0pe promised:

    @ Firepower –

    Are you sure you can HANDLE my auntie’s chicken and waffles? It’s made grown men weep before.

    i can handle my meals baby.
    i can even handle
    your auntie….

    hmm. i notice you didn’t say
    you can cook that
    delectable treasure

    Like


  390. ””””””’maurice
    there wasn’t just race on this one – a lot on mortality, for example. doncha just love how this stuff comes up on a PUA-themed blog? Interesting.
    ”””””””””’

    Yea maurice because unconditional love is supposed to last till at least death right. So it kind of fits.

    Suicide may be unconditional love of yourself.

    Like


  391. on August 4, 2009 at 1:06 pm Black Military Man

    “The way to get what I have is to understand that nobody on this earth or life itself owes you a damned thing.

    On that day you’ll care as much about my looks or weight as I do about the size of your cock. It’s irrelevant.”

    Damn right!

    Nobody owes anybody anything. Not even the government. And God, “the Universe”, or whatever else “force” you think might be out there doesn’t owe you either.

    This sense of entitlement is precisely what holds people back.

    People get this clear; we don’t even have a “right to life”.
    Your mama brought you in, she can take you out!

    Once you get this, like Nicole says, irrelevent sh*t will become irrelevent to you.

    Like


  392. on August 4, 2009 at 1:08 pm Black Military Man

    Kalliope, what are you? Half African and half Greek?

    Kalliope is a Greek name.

    Like


  393. I’m all sorts of things, BMM – black, Greek, French, Dutch etc. My family miscegenates like other families go to church. It worked out well for us though, since we all turned out tall, healthy, athletic and high IQ.

    @ Firepower –

    I can cook everything my aunties can, they made SURE of this from an early age. But they’re different ethnicities, so it’s everything from chicken and waffles to poutine to spanakopita.

    Like


  394. true. there is no such thing as unconditional love.

    a parents love for their child is as close as it gets. that is followed closely by the betas love for the object of his unrequited desires.

    maybe you can throw in a woman’s love for the alpha that makes her gina tingle, so long as he keeps it tingling.

    Like


  395. Mandy XD

    Would you really do that? Just give up. Give up, not only on yourself, but on those around you? Would you just give up hope, give up on life, because things aren’t going how you planned?

    I was talking about the kind of terminal cancer situation that anonymouse described with her uncle. Then I would yes, if I didn’t think that the hospital would come through with assisted suicide, in effect (called “aggressive pain mediation”). Which usually they won’t cause it leaves them exposed, given the religiously based laws.

    Like


  396. i like moussaka and stuffed grape leaves

    Like


  397. Gun

    …except your wife developing two egg size tumors in the uterous shit is out of control.

    Holy shit.

    Like


  398. On some days I could just cut and paste comments from other posters, in appreciation. Epoxy has been on a tear. And I love this one

    a parents love for their child is as close as it gets. that is followed closely by the betas love for the object of his unrequited desires.

    maybe you can throw in a woman’s love for the alpha that makes her gina tingle, so long as he keeps it tingling.

    Is there a better pleasure in life than bringing a woman to a state of near permanent arousal – then routinely bringing her to as high as she can go? God – talk about having a personal slave. Nothing beats that.

    That’s being alive.

    Like


  399. Yea why I say I got to prove unconditional love (in addition as roissy puts it commitment). Plus it verified all my thoughts on life money and such. By saving money I had the ability to do something I may not have otherwise been able to do. If it would have been cancer I could have been with her until the end. Luckily it was not cancer.

    I have been tested and passed.

    Cool thing is she appreciated that.

    Like


  400. “black military man”

    if you’ve seen enough to see i’m an old jewish woman, then you’ve also seen me be very harshly judgmental of “old” “fat”” “women” and “blacks” and many others. i have even had occasion to express my unnatural hatred for canadians and the yanomamo indians of brazil. i can’t imagine what effect you believe jewy jewy old old is going to have on me. the truth doesn’t change because its the truth about something i am.

    i haven’t been harsh to jews yet because it hasn’t come up. but just so you know, i think jews are overrepresented not only in every single thing i hate, but every single thing traditional white males have hated since at least the 30’s if not earlier. i think about 75% of holocaust lore is a cynical myth EVEN though my grandparents met in auschwitz. i think a vast number of jews are cheap neurotic commie homosexualists and in the 50’s about 80% of them should have been deported from the US for treason–EVEN IF THAT MIGHT HAVE EFFECTED ME. truth is truth. a=a. even if you’d prefer otherwise.

    Like


  401. Black Military Man–

    Kalli0pe looks way less than half black in her icon. More like 1/8.

    Hey. You folk don’t get to claim Kalliope as black. We want her too!

    (Some sharing could be ok.)

    Like


  402. “Ahh so you where there because you enojoyed watching him in pain and where jealous of all the attention he garnered throughout his life. If you had loved him youd have put a bullet in him.”

    Well, no, I didn’t enjoy it.

    I actually hadn’t spent a whole lot of time with my uncle, or even really known him that well, until he got sick. But he was, after all, a blood relative who had NOBODY, (all siblings, including my dad, were gone.) so I visited him some. Mainly — and I’m being honest here, because this is unflattering — so I wouldn’t feel guilty and mentally berate myself about being an evil person who can’t even be bothered to visit someone who’s sick and alone.

    And I agree with your point about the bullet. That’s my point. I DIDN’T love him enough to put a bullet in him. Because doing so is still classified murder. I loved my young children too much to deprive them of their mother by being sent to prison for the murder of someone I was only even spending time with out of a sense of duty.

    An old widow, on the other hand, who actually loved the old coot, just MIGHT be willing to off the old guy, and then herself.

    In a sane world, a supermassive dose of morphine would be administered, like putting a dog to sleep.

    Like


  403. on August 4, 2009 at 2:21 pm Black Military Man

    “if you’ve seen enough to see i’m an old jewish woman, then you’ve also seen me be very harshly judgmental of “old” “fat”” “women” and “blacks” and many others. i have even had occasion to express my unnatural hatred for canadians and the yanomamo indians of brazil. i can’t imagine what effect you believe jewy jewy old old is going to have on me. the truth doesn’t change because its the truth about something i am.

    i haven’t been harsh to jews yet because it hasn’t come up. but just so you know, i think jews are overrepresented not only in every single thing i hate, but every single thing traditional white males have hated since at least the 30’s if not earlier. i think about 75% of holocaust lore is a cynical myth EVEN though my grandparents met in auschwitz. i think a vast number of jews are cheap neurotic commie homosexualists and in the 50’s about 80% of them should have been deported from the US for treason–EVEN IF THAT MIGHT HAVE EFFECTED ME. truth is truth. a=a. even if you’d prefer otherwise.”

    Blah. Blah. Blah. Yada. Yada. Yada.

    Like


  404. Dana – I don’t know why I love your hate so much.

    Maybe it’s because it’s something that you do really well. I’m a sucker for skill, I guess.

    Like


  405. ””””””I actually hadn’t spent a whole lot of time with my uncle, or even really known him that well, until he got sick. But he was, after all, a blood relative who had NOBODY, (all siblings, including my dad, were gone.) so I visited him some. Mainly — and I’m being honest here, because this is unflattering — so I wouldn’t feel guilty and mentally berate myself about being an evil person who can’t even be bothered to visit someone who’s sick and alone.”””””””””

    Got to respect understanding situation then following through.

    Like


  406. Xsplat, then you should come to Israel to get a taste of the originals. Dana was short work by comparison.

    Like


  407. nicole

    the founding population of the current nation of israel were of the exact same stock as my family and *includes* the part of my grandfather’s family that didn’t come here–the sepharadim came from arab countries. none of them are “the originals”–stop talking out of your ass for 15 seconds

    Like


  408. Dana, who said anything about the Sephardic? Both Ashkenazi and Sephardic Jews have their share of bitter old broads who are afraid that their mercenary ways and crappy attitudes will drive Jewish men into the arms of shiksas.

    You’re both insecure about your ancestry, and you both claim up and down that you are the “real” Jews. If there was a contest for the stupidest intracultural dispute, I’d nominate Ashkenazi vs. Sephardic Israelis, and it might make the top 10.

    In the U.S. you’ve found people who echo your persecution complex, which persists despite your lipservice to revisionism.

    I am not impressed, sellout. If you don’t like the horrible assortment of brown people in my country, make Aliyah so you can at least try to lord over your own brown people. Israel doesn’t have a constitution, so you’re free to do whatever you can get away with. The U.S. on the other hand, does have one, so you don’t get to decide who lives and dies based on how sorry they are for not being born pale.

    Like


  409. Dana, who said anything about the Sephardic?

    I was wondering the same thing when I read Dana’s comment. I thought I missed something.

    Like


  410. Obsidian slyly smugged:

    [it was]…suggested that Black Men were inherently lazy…If this was true, why did White Slavers continue to import Black Men?

    They needed somebody to support
    The White Man’s Chee-tos
    Industrial Complex

    Like


  411. The women I’ve fallen in love with, tended to be the type that doesn’t gain weight easily or age ungracefully.

    Like


  412. Question for Dana: have you ever visited or lived, in Israel? I am given to understand that Nicole has lived there for some years, and by all accounts sounds rather knowledgeable about its cultural, social, political and historical life.

    Thanks for your response.

    O

    Like


  413. O Love, subject of the mere diurnal grind,
    Forever being pledged to be redeemed,
    Expose yourself for charity; be assured
    The body is but husk and excrement.
    Enter these deaths according to the law,
    O visited women, possessed sons! Foreign lusts
    Infringe our restraints; the changeable
    Soldiery have their goings-out and comings-in
    Dying in abundance. Choicest beasts
    Suffuse the gutters with their colourful blood.
    Our God scatters corruption. Priests, martyrs,
    Parade to this imperious theme: ‘O Love,
    You know what pains succeed; be vigilant; strive
    To recognize the damned among your friends.’

    Like


  414. Dana–

    i think about 75% of holocaust lore is a cynical myth EVEN though my grandparents met in auschwitz.

    What parts do you think is a cynical myth? From what I can tell there are two areas of great exaggeration. Well three: 1) probably only a fairly small minority of jewish H. deaths with in the gas and ovens camps, most were worked to death in slave labor camps or even more, shot summarily on the Eastern front; 2) the numbers seem to be exaggerated and set at the highest plausible number rather than the most reasonable guess, with any conceivably influential questioner or researcher into this getting absolutely persecuted by Jewish networks as a “Holocaust denier” and 3) that there was absolutely no rational reason for the Nazis to want to do it, just irrational scapegoating.

    (Hitler’s basic reasons, in a perfervid mind, were that the Jews tended to be leaders and high level organizers of the communist and other far left movements in Germany, and also were at commanding and vastly disproportionate positions in Germany’s capitalist, intellectual/academic and professional classes, and hence crowding out good Germans. Altogether, on both sides, they were both a major threat to a nationalist and yes racist socialist, and relatively small in number. His reasons were rational, though his solutions were utterly unjustifiable and extreme, obviously.)

    Like


  415. Obsidian–

    Question for Dana: have you ever visited or lived, in Israel?

    There are quite a lot of people who’ve never lived in the Us who know quite a lot more about it’s history than the great majority of Americans do.

    Now if these never been here but book knowledgeable foreigners start opining on the texture of everyday life in America at the moment, that’s another thing.

    Like


  416. obsidian i lived there for nearly 2 years, went to public school there, once spoke hebrew fluently but am now rusty, have family there that goes back to before 1948 and were chalutzim and have visited there several times since living there.

    however–the fact that i lived there is not related to whether what nicole said is true or not. no amount of living in israel would make it true that the CURRENT israeli population are somehow “the original” jews. they are the same jews as me for the most part–or sepharadim from muslim countries who are also 2000 yrs removed from the “original” “jews”. unless nicole is specifically living among a small group of ultra orthodox in sefat of jerusalem and a few other places who go back to practically before the 2nd expulsion, she is likely meeting israelis who have the exact same background as me.

    Like


  417. yeh i mentioned sepharadim because there are two major ethnic groups of jews there and i couldn’t say ” i AM what’s currently occupying israel” accurately without differentiating them out.

    Like


  418. Dana, who said anything about the Sephardic? Both Ashkenazi and Sephardic Jews have their share of bitter old broads who are afraid that their mercenary ways and crappy attitudes will drive Jewish men into the arms of shiksas.

    You’re both insecure about your ancestry, and you both claim up and down that you are the “real” Jews. If there was a contest for the stupidest intracultural dispute, I’d nominate Ashkenazi vs. Sephardic Israelis, and it might make the top 10.

    In the U.S. you’ve found people who echo your persecution complex, which persists despite your lipservice to revisionism.

    I am not impressed, sellout. If you don’t like the horrible assortment of brown people in my country, make Aliyah so you can at least try to lord over your own brown people. Israel doesn’t have a constitution, so you’re free to do whatever you can get away with. The U.S. on the other hand, does have one, so you don’t get to decide who lives and dies based on how sorry they are for not being born pale.

    nicole–what the hell are you talking about? seriously? what does ANY of this have to do with one thing ive ever said? are you having some fight with imaginary israeli women i am not party to? i don’t know what kind of bizarro psychodrama my posts have unleashed in you, but it’s certainly alien to me

    if one person can explain to me what ANY of this has to do with anything i’ve ever said i will listen with rapt attention

    Like


  419. @dana:

    Are Sephardic Jews also from Spain? Where did they originally come from?

    I’m doing google searches on this, but I think you might be able to explain things better.

    Like


  420. @dana:

    “if one person can explain to me what ANY of this has to do with anything i’ve ever said i will listen with rapt attention”

    You “hate” her because she’s black
    She “hates” you because you’re Jewish.

    tada!

    I should get candy for this.

    Like


  421. Can we return to my favourite topic of discussion: irresistable Jewish men?

    Like


  422. @S:
    I generally don’t find Jewish men attractive, but there is this actor popular in Israel named Saleh Bakri. He’s good looking.

    Like


  423. Mandy, I just googled him. He’s definitely very cute, but no Jerry Seinfeld. DROOL.

    Like


  424. @ S.

    Mandy, I just googled him. He’s definitely very cute, but no Jerry Seinfeld. DROOL.

    Are you serious? Hmm.

    I suppose it’ll come as no surprise that I have the hots for (the very non-Jewish) Marky Mark, criminal record and all.

    Like


  425. I’m definitely serious. I find Seinfeld very attractive. Jeff Goldblum is still my number one JewCrush.

    Like


  426. mandy—usually when ppl in the US say “jews” they are refering to european “ashkenazi” jews–german, polish, russian and lithuanian primarily. “sepharad” is spain in hebrew. the jews had a strong presence in moorish spain via muslim north africa, they were expelled from spain after/during the inquisition in the 1490s by the catholics. jews from yemen, morroco, tunis and other muslim countries are still referred to as sephardic jews, they have a different diaspora culture than ashkenazi and a spanish based patois unique to themselves called ladino–like ashkenazi jews have german based yiddish. they aren’t as prominent in the US as ashkenazi so a lot of americans don’t know what they are.

    Like


  427. @S:

    While I don’t find Jeff Goldblum remotely attractive, he vaguely reminds me of Robert Downey Jr., who I do find attractive.

    Like


  428. whiskey:

    Chuck: B-Ball is crap. No one passes. It’s Kobe vs. the star on the other side. No one plays a lick of D. It’s street ball to the max. NO teamwork whatsover. Coaches roll out the ball and that’s it. As bad as fricking soccer. I can’t wait for Football season to start — a real team game. Damn we need a spring and summer league again.

    when was the last time you watched basketball? look at the past several year’s champions….Kobe and the Lakers won the title *because* of more team orientation. Before that, the Celtics assembled a star-studded cast. Each star’s point totals dropped about 5 points apiece, and because of the team orientation they won the title. Before that the San Antonio Spurs had ruled the league. They were as team-oriented as one could get.

    so perhaps there are one-dimensional teams, but that’s no different that in any other sport.

    whiskey, you know nothing about basketball. there are some teams that don’t play D, there are some that don’t follow a team-like strategy, but the ones who are successful – the ones that have led to increased playoff ratings and who people like to watch – *do* incorporate those components.

    Like


  429. Obsidian:

    i posted last year about the decline in excitement level of the NFL. my thesis is that teams have jumped on the “Defense wins championships” meme and loaded up on Defensive minded coaches and picked defensive players high in drafts.

    most of the coaches who have led their teams to titles were defense oriented.

    So lots of resources have been aimed towards beefing up D, which has made for a more boring game and less stellar stats.

    http://chuckross.blogspot.com/2008/11/why-is-nfl-so-boring.html

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  430. Roissy stated:

    “i once did an experiment with a girl where i held her hand such that her’s was in front of mine, and then i asked her what she felt. she said it felt weird, and she didn’t like it.”

    You really have it down to a science. That’s something I would have never thought of. Now that I think about it, every time I hold hands with a certain someone, my hand’s behind his, and if it isn’t, I readjust it so that it is.

    It’s funny how little displays of dominance can be visible through hand holding. And, thinking about it, maybe it’s because it’s just natural. Smaller hands do fit into bigger hands.

    I’m overthinking this now.

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  431. I don’t know about hand holding. Can’t sustain long. Don’t think I much like it. But then again have not done it with anyone I loved.

    I tend to prefer holding on to a man’s arm.

    Seems more masculine to me to simply place her hand in the crook of your arm?

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  432. Bhetti, don’t ya know, hand holding is THIRD BASE.

    Serious business.

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  433. Dana, maybe you’re having trouble relating to what I said because you jump contexts based on your ethnic confusion, but I’m not confused about your ethnicity.

    I’m also not confused about the associated American vs. Jewish-Israeli entitlement or JAP syndrome, which your posts are riddled with. I’ve seen it many, many times before.

    You jumped on that “originals” thing like a pitt bull when what I said had nothing to do with who the “original” Jews are. I was talking about the central hive of shameless Jewish female entitlement and persecution complex. That’s an overall cultural problem that expresses itself in different ways depending on where they’re located.

    Make no mistake, I notice this in women of other ethnicities as well…Black women often develop a persecution/entitlement complex that makes them believe that no matter how women of their own ethnic groups look or behave, the men should take one for the team.

    Native American women usually have less of this because of specific things in the cultures that favor the natural male right of induction, but you see ripples of it here and there in descendents of less mixing prone groups.

    Jewish women on the other hand, have managed to secure official matrilineal inheritance of race. So if a Jewish guy wants to have Jewish kids without their having to convert, he has to have them with a Jewish woman. Though the reasons for that change were sound at that point in history, the tradeoff was that men, the ones who actually enforce the laws in a culture, no longer have the power of choice as to what new stock is brought into their culture, and it’s now all about entitlement, money, and gina tingles.

    The new stock that’s being brought in over here is from Arab guys with cars…but try bringing over a non Jewish woman who can actually cook, and wants to have sex with her man, from Italy or something. Heh.

    It’s the same story over and over. After most of these Jewish girls have screwed half the knuckleheads in their city, many Arab, a Jewish guy is supposed to forget all that and marry her for the sake of the race…and it’s basically the same story in the U.S. just with a different set of guys to slut around with.

    This is why men need to get off the self destructive chivalry bent and regain the right of induction. If the women of their culture want to have the chance to be a part of its future, then they should have to behave like they belong to that culture. If not, the men should have the right to opt out.

    It’s easier for Black men in this way because they have distinctive physical features that last a couple generations, so one’s kids can attract Black people based on visual benefits. For people who can generally pass for the people around them, but want to maintain their culture/subculture the corruption of it happens hard and fast if they either don’t adapt or otherwise try to circumvent nature.

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  434. Bhetti

    I tend to prefer holding on to a man’s arm.

    Seems more masculine to me to simply place her hand in the crook of your arm?

    Ahhh, your body language tells of your attitude very well. You are correct that arm holding is the more submissive, empowering, and feminine stance to take.

    It puts you in a distinct place in relationship to the man. Not egalitarian.

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  435. …and Mandy, I don’t hate her because she’s Jewish. I hate her overblown sense of entitlement.

    She ought to know that time is running out for that. There is still conversion, and despite the drawbacks, substantial numbers of women are being converted in because Jewish guys are starting to feel that it’s worth it to go through all the religious and legal b.s. to get a woman who actually cares for his life.

    I didn’t convert as a matter of principle. I don’t like paperwork attached to my soul unless it’s absolutely necessary, and since it’s not, it’s not worth it. Besides, I already have cultures, so I don’t really need to adopt rather than just incorporate my partner’s, to have stability.

    If (and that’s a big if) we have kids, I’d probably want them to convert when they’re of age. They’ll be raised in Israel with Jewish culture and religious grandparents, so it would be kind of like rejecting their own culture if they don’t convert.

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  436. nicole

    i defy you to please cut and paste ONE thing i said that in ANY way indicates i have the “sense of entitlement” you just mentioned? SPECIFICALLY what sense of entitlement are you speaking of? entitled to marry a jew? that seems to be what you are saying. i was trying to explain to YOU what I think will happen when a generation of young americans are eventually in power who have zero sense of racial guilt in LIGHT of your extremely racially hostile comment to someone else. just because i think something WILL happen doesn’t mean i endorse it. i don’t care if it happens or not, but i think it will.

    as for your weirdo non sequitur rant about jewish women running out of time to get jewish men because they are cunts or something–DUH, isn’t that what lots of us have been talking about? cunty women causing a marriage strike? i don’t care if every jew or jewishness disappears off the face of the earth. in fact, it would probably be better if they did. i am an atheist and an american who happens to be ethnically and culturally jewish–that’s all. i am already married to a man who is half jewish and thinks the exact same way as me. what “time is running out” for what? other jewish women? fuck em, what do i care what happens to them

    i STILL don’t know what imaginary jew you are speaking to, but it ain’t me. you seem to want to have a fight with a type of person and are projecting that person on to me. maybe if you read one word i ACTUALLY typed without making up paragraphs of nonsense i never said or assuming what i think you would see that literally we have been arguing over nothing.

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  437. Danda challenges, “i defy you to please cut and paste ONE thing i said that in ANY way indicates i have the “sense of entitlement” you just mentioned?”

    I don’t need to look far. There are plenty of goodies in this very post.

    “i was trying to explain to YOU what I think will happen when a generation of young americans are eventually in power who have zero sense of racial guilt in LIGHT of your extremely racially hostile comment to someone else.”

    Do you figure what I said was more or less racially hostile than responding to anything anyone ever said here with “this is why some Black people want to exterminate you all like roaches”?

    Entitlement is why topics about different game approaches between cultures, the pros and cons, and how some exchange or different perspective might help all of us, turns into a chorus of “Black people are inherently inferior and should be gotten rid of” one way or another.

    “i don’t care if every jew or jewishness disappears off the face of the earth. in fact, it would probably be better if they did.”

    …because you’re a sell-out. This, you’ve already made clear. However, a sell-out is not assimilated. They kiss the asses of people in the culture they view as the “winners”, and apologize for being what they are. They do this *because* they feel they are entitled to more than they would get by just being okay with who/what they are.

    It’s a pattern. You are not a unique and special snowflake in this.

    If you were, you wouldn’t call your husband “half Jewish”.

    When people say that “half” whatever, I always want to ask which half…the top half or the bottom half?

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  438. ok you are obviously hebephrenic.

    Like


  439. ”””””Ghost of Nicole
    …and Mandy, I don’t hate her because she’s Jewish. I hate her overblown sense of entitlement.”””””

    Yea that hate is a little strong for someone who is just pixels as you said. Yea I don’t hate any of the roaches.

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  440. Gunny, if you don’t hate your “roaches” then it is strictly about entitlement. You feel that they are taking something that you feel that you’re entitled to, just for being born.

    I don’t think that is better. It’s much more sociopathic than hate.

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  441. No your wrong. Trying to figure out a solution to a problem for a country. I have what I need. Thanks though.

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  442. And that is one of the problems they want to be the countries roaches. The country doesn’t need roaches.

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  443. S.

    I’m definitely serious. I find Seinfeld very attractive. Jeff Goldblum is still my number one JewCrush.

    gak. whine-boy and the fucking Fly.

    jewery knows know shame. i thought you had taste.

    fuckity fuck fucking barf

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  444. Gunny, solve the country’s problems when you know what they are.

    If you want to know who’s profitting from a fucked up system, follow the money. The people who don’t have the money are probably not the ones causing the problem.

    Like


  445. But if anyone can save money and become the “elite”

    Again how do you solve problem?

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  446. Firepower, Jeff Goldblum had a really nice body as the Fly. And some schmarmy, charming Jew thing going on.

    Like


  447. Mandy!XD: “Dang…I can’t look at Wahlberg the same way ever again.”

    Willard Libby: “So true. Now I realize the guy wasn’t a complete fucking fag.”

    HaHa! Good stuff, Willard.

    And on the six degrees of separation front, I once banged a chick that claimed Mark Wahlberg hit on her…and she turned him down. The girl was beautiful, she moved in “those circles,” so who knows? It appears that I succeeded where Mark failed. Crazy world. LOL!

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  448. Gunny asks, “But if anyone can save money and become the “elite”

    Again how do you solve problem?”

    Why is it a problem for you that in the U.S. anyone who invents something, starts a business, or gets educated, and makes money doing it can become “elite”?

    Isn’t that what America’s all about?

    Again, you’ve got a problem with the United States and its Constitution, not with Black people.

    Now if you please, take a number and stand behind Osama. There’s a long line of people who have a problem with America, and well, you’ll have to wait your turn.

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  449. on August 5, 2009 at 6:52 pm Willard Libby

    [editor: i once did an experiment with a girl where i held her hand such that her’s was in front of mine, and then i asked her what she felt. she said it felt weird,

    …..maybe she felt it was weird that you asked the question.

    Holding a woman’s hand is never Alpha no matter the direction placing of the hands.

    I’ve never held a woman’s hand.

    I’ve held a woman’s wrists quite a few times.

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  450. Ugh. Nicole is back. Sort of like a bad case of herpes.

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  451. ”””””’Ghost of Nicole
    Gunny, if you don’t hate your “roaches” then it is strictly about entitlement. You feel that they are taking something that you feel that you’re entitled to, just for being born.
    ””””””””””’

    ””””””’Ghost of Nicole
    Gunny, solve the country’s problems when you know what they are.

    If you want to know who’s profitting from a fucked up system, follow the money. The people who don’t have the money are probably not the ones causing the problem.””””””””””””””””’

    ”””””””Ghost of Nicole
    Gunny, solve the country’s problems when you know what they are.

    If you want to know who’s profitting from a fucked up system, follow the money. The people who don’t have the money are probably not the ones causing the problem.””””””’

    ””””””””Ghost of Nicole
    Gunny asks, “But if anyone can save money and become the “elite”

    Again how do you solve problem?”

    Why is it a problem for you that in the U.S. anyone who invents something, starts a business, or gets educated, and makes money doing it can become “elite”?

    Isn’t that what America’s all about?””””””””””’

    I believe that anyone can save money and become “elite”
    Now you just being a moron. In a couple posts you completely change philosophies.

    First you say i am scared someone is taking my shit that I am entitled to.

    Then it is want to know who makes fucked up system follow the money.

    Then you try to act like you invented how everyone can be elite.

    I mean what the fuck are you trying to say.

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  452. Oh yea the problem is not the ability to get rich. I was saying the problem is a certain group who causes high crime and is given free housing next to lower middle class people and causes people to have to work hard to move away from them which actually hurts there ability to get personally rich because they have to take on big mortgages to move the fuck away. Then you have a lack of freedom in life because the same group has to be catered to in all things. Then you have the idea of catering to this group passed on to now woman being catered to in the same way. It is obviously a poison on the system. So like I said what would you recomend to solve the problem?

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  453. Gunny, there are crucial differences between the mind of someone who believes that killing off a large chunk of a nation’s general and poorest population will solve that nation’s problems; and the mind of someone who believes that a nation’s problems are usually caused by that nation’s government and other people in power.

    Some bridges just cannot be crossed.

    I’ve explained it to you in the simplest language that I can manage. If you still don’t understand, then you are most free to believe me a moron.

    I am in no danger from your thoughts, and have no interest in policing them. That rabbit hole is a deep, dark place that only concerns me when it inspires your ilk to pick up a weapon against my country.

    When that happens, the solution is much simpler than trying to reason with you.

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  454. S. moistened:

    Firepower, Jeff Goldblum had a really nice body as the Fly. And some schmarmy, charming Jew thing going on.

    hmm. okay – now i see. when you describe Jews like pets, I can see what you’re trying to say.

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  455. ””””””””I am in no danger from your thoughts, and have no interest in policing them. That rabbit hole is a deep, dark place that only concerns me when it inspires your ilk to pick up a weapon against my country.

    When that happens, the solution is much simpler than trying to reason with you.””””””””””””

    Then by your reasoning they should be exterminated because they are the only group that is bearing arms against our country. When they murder almost 9 times the rate of anyone else in the population then obviosly they are bearing arms against the country so by your own definition they should be killed. Thank You for the clarification. I think we have both come to the same conclusion about the problem.

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  456. ””””’That rabbit hole is a deep, dark place that only concerns me when it inspires your ilk to pick up a weapon against my country.

    When that happens, the solution is much simpler than trying to reason with you.””””””

    And now you can envision also just how resonable white people have been with that group and still it is not enough. When you yourself would of never had so much tolerance.

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  457. Oh and I don’t see you in afganistan so your a fucking liar about defending your country. When I said I would defend my country I fucking meant that shit. I didn’t talk out my fucking ass. I am here helping my country during war.

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  458. How does this study, which is based the reactions men and women had to rapidly flashed pictures of random babies (some deformed), have anything to do with what a woman feels for her own child?

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  459. Gunny, are you defending the country, or everyone in the country except the Black people?

    You don’t get to have it both ways.

    If you want to exterminate a chunk of the population, the vast majority of which has never killed or even assaulted another person in their lives, then you’re only American by paperwork. You’re not really American.

    I have never done a damn thing to you, and you want me dead.

    You’re a sick, sick fucker.

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  460. …and I already did my enlistment in 1990. I was actually active duty. So really, go fuck yourself.

    You, who think Black soldiers and veterans should be rounded up and gassed like roaches, I hope the Black soldiers in Afghanistan know a nazi fucktard is working next to them.

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  461. Do destroying these “pretty lies” make humanity better?

    At least some of what makes humaniy good… no, tolerable… is based entirely in fiction.

    We are more than the dust that comprises us, so long as we value ourselves as such.

    Vonnegut called these things Foma.

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  462. on July 16, 2010 at 9:55 am Death vajra

    Love is just a primitive abstraction our ancestors used to explain away what we now know to be a mere biochemically-induced deluded mode of perception. Men were speaking poetically of ‘love’ around the same time they were worshipping dung beetles.

    Women’s experience of love is much different than man’s in that they ‘love’ something until they hate it. They perceive it as just one of a myriad of trivial ‘feelings’ and they enjoy it as it arises, abhides and ceases.

    We’ve all seen woman at the mall being swept away by a pair of shoes, she’s in ecstasy. She doesn’t need a man to bring about these experiences in her. It’s certainly not of great importance in choosing a husband

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