Alpha Or Beta Male?

Sandals. White tube socks. Is that a fanny pack? His fashion sense is clearly beta.

But then there’s his body language. Leg up, the fulcrum of his maleness insolently displayed under her nose. If this were a gif I bet we’d see him swinging his pelvis into her. A fat nerd in the distance looks on, horror-stricken.

Alpha or beta male? Let me put it this way: If I wanted a solid wingman, and my choices were 1. a dapper fellow stylishly appointed and subtly accoutered to catch the inquisitive female eye, but shy and liable to spend the night leaning against the wall for support, or 2. tube sock guy fearlessly projecting his male sexual entitlement, I’m taking tube sock guy, every time.

Boldness beats style, and it’s no contest. Why? Because a nerd with a ZEROFUCKSGIVEN attitude can be molded into something great. But a retiring fop who waits for women to approach him has to make an attitude adjustment before he can be great. The ALPHA ATTITUDE is the bedrock of tight game. It’s a lot easier to improve a man’s wardrobe than it is to improve his attitude, so rock out with your socks and cock out, Package Delivery Man, you’ve got that special something chicks dig.





Comments


  1. She is framing her face, animated, legs pressed together. She isn’t going anywhere.

    The nerd looks like he doesn’t even have the wherewithal to pay attention to the lesson at hand.

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    • I’d say based on her conflicting body langauge…she is feeling uncomfortable. Now if it is because of his projecting body language, what he’s saying, or his fanny pack who knows.

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      • One thing I’ve learned in life and had to unlearn as well, is that “girls feeling comfortable” and “girls being attracted to you” are nearly opposites. I’ve had to unlearn or rather redirect my strong emotional intuitiveness and natural desire to make myself and people around me comfortable.

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      • She could just be shy about being on the spot in public.

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      • In Bluetropolisville, that ridiculously self-parodying clownsuit outfit which he is wearing might actually be a DHV to the MLS grad student librarian spinster chick who lives in an apartment filled with 7 cats named after characters from some BBC soap opera that she watches on PBS. At least it proves to her that he doesn’t always shop at Walmart [even if he buys that crap for pennies on the dollar at the Thrift Store].

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      • She’s flattered by the attention. That’s the foremost emotion from a woman’s perspective. She isn’t ugly, just plain, and probably not used to blatant male attention for any reason. Plus, he’s really tall and, whether consciously or not to either, in a sexually forward stance. She may be uncomfortable, but not 100% sure why. If he made a non-creeptastic move, done deal. He’s got to allow something for the public perspective of awkwardness of his gear, even if he’s comfy with it. No room to totally creep out.

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      • Agreed, Mr. Roach. The red pill medicine has helped me in that regard.

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      • “One thing I’ve learned in life and had to unlearn as well, is that “girls feeling comfortable” and “girls being attracted to you” are nearly opposites.”

        That’s true. There has to be some tension in attraction…but tension and feeling uncomfortable are two different things. Does it look like she’s feeling tension or feeling uncomfortable?

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      • on November 18, 2014 at 8:58 pm sheerforceofwilliam

        agreed…. her feet are directed toward him, preening gestures, framing her face, parted lips…looks like mr tube socks picked up some cues and turned it up a notch

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      • on November 18, 2014 at 11:14 pm The Spirit Within

        Attraction and comfort have a zero-sum relationship. When you gain one, you lose the other.

        It’s also responsible for the destruction of many, many marriages.

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    • Reminds me of the Southern Comfort ad with the older swarthy gent, substantial gut, in the banana hammock swaggering down the beach with a glass of SC on the rocks, sporting 70’s vintage sunglasses. I know a lot of women who think he’s pretty hot

      Attitude always wins.

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      • LOL, why would Heartiste take Tube Socks for a wingman over a quiet dapper wingman???

        Dapper quiet wingman is male arm candy/social proof for the chicks, while Tube Socks is the typical PUA wingman brimming with more false confidence than actual skills — the kind of guy that jumps in and says something stupid & skeeves your chicks away in a manner that only someone with tube socks & a fanny pack can.

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    • Yep, the fat bloke is creaming ’em in open-mouthed wheezy adoration of some new sort of netbook or something. Girl what girl?

      The tall guy? Arrant spergelord. What with the dress sense and ridiculous posture. And being in a computer shop and all. Pipecleaner arms and legs, even for a tall guy or a runner. Of course he comes across as unconcerned, outcome independent and all that jazz.
      But he’s not thinking of her musty librarian’s V. He’s really, really concerned that she doesn’t grok Open Source, and is determined to damn’ well make her.

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  2. This:

    Is that a fanny pack?

    LOLZ I wear a fanny pack, it’s the BEST way to conceal large weapons (I carry a Glock 34 + extra cmag) and no one gives it a second glance.

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    • HATE to reply to my own post, but here is some math:

      Sandals + Socks = Insecurity

      Meaning for some unknown psychological reason he does not like showing his feet. This is a socially awkward beta.

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      • Jackass: Calvin Coolidge Jr.

        Rock the socks.

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      • barefoot = alpha

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      • Socks and sandals is common in swpl enclaves from the Rockies west. Socks for warmth.

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      • And dryness, in the northwest. If you don’t like socks there’s always boat shoes.

        PF, wouldn’t an IWB holster with untucked shirt be easier in case you actually need to get it out? 🙂

        Given the angles that woman’s feet are pointing at, I suspect she’s trying desperately to keep from pissing herself.

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      • Another reason for socks in sandals is that your feet won’t get all funky and stinky because the socks gives some room for your bottom of your feet to breathe.

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      • This:

        PF, wouldn’t an IWB holster with untucked shirt be easier in case you actually need to get it out?

        There are fanny packs are made for CCW, there is a hidden opening and you can reach right in and get the gun quickly.

        I am in Florida so concealment is a problem. Small of back IWB carry is ok for winter, but spring / summer / fall it’s a little hot and the fanny pack protects the gun from sweat, sand, etc.

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  3. Look man, if it’s good enough of a look for the Hulkster, it’s good enough for our boy in the pic, brother:

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  4. I have a friend whose fashion sense is much worse than this guy, has crooked front teeth, sits with his legs crossed like the biggest fag, lives with his mom and collects toys. He picks up more chicks than anyone I know. Why? Because he can aproach a 10 completely free of fear or anxiety, or a 3 completely free of shame or mockery. He just doesn’t give a shit. Attitude >> looks and fashion.

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  5. “But a retiring fop who waits for women to approach him has to make an attitude adjustment before he can be great.”

    With that said, is it right to wait for IOIs before approaching? Or just caveman it out and approach absent IOIs?

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    • approach invitations make a man’s job easier, but relying on them will rule out all the shy or socially awkward cuties who don’t give AIs. plus, the AI crutch is like welfare: gimmedats are fun but over time they destroy a man’s character.

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  6. Blocking her in like that seems like just another form of mate-guarding.

    [CH: he’s not blocking her in. his body language is very open. it’s just open in a way that maximizes the display of his procreative impudence.]

    A real player

    [whenever i read the word “a real player” by a commenter, i know the odds are high that i’m dealing with a game-denialist troll.]

    wouldn’t do it because he doesn’t care if she leaves (outcome independence) but knows she won’t because he is a catch (overconfidence).

    Her body language shows this too (front foot pointed away from him, arms high up blocking chest and hands covering neck)

    Verdict: over gaming

    [verdict: over trolling.]

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    • A real player wouldn’t even leave his house – women would just pick up his super manly aura and go to him.

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      • A real player wouldn’t even leave his house – women would just pick up his super manly aura and go to him.

        Fun fact: one guy actually wrote in a forum that a real player should do nothing except take a shower and then go out and walk around, not approach anyone. Apparently his complete lack of interest would show that he is SO valuable, and therefore women would flock to him.

        These people have latched on to a single idea – that showing disinterest is a sign of high value – and then take that and run with it, using it to trump every other idea. They think this makes them sound so aloof and cool that they’ll “win” the thread, because every other possible action can be declared a sign of neediness.

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      • He’s blocking her in. She works there, it’s a store. Being a potential customer isn’t even enough to keep her, he has to physically block her from leaving.

        This toad is as beta as his socks.

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  7. classic cock thrust pose. more effective when the woman is sitting.

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  8. Remember peacocking? The outfit weakness is a strength iff the man can demonstrate prowess with the handicap. The woman’s leg turned like only a chinese contortionist could on purpose, that sayz beta all the way. The fact that he blocked all exits shows the emotional neediness not jerkboy charisma. I am not disagreeing with presence of alpha boldness, but he lacks the wild alphaman’s emotional detachment to all women: either the key or at least one of them. I have fun displaying emotional detachment now, not a contradiction if you understand the female mind.

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  9. He rock climbs, perphaps even a mountain. He triatheletes, or at least a marathon. He kayaks. He …

    He’s the outdoorsy type, this is his wardrobe and in some places is the appropriate or at least acceptable attire. Ski area off season or any smaller mountain town. He’s clothing signify he isn’t a local redneck but still may drive a 4-wheel drive.

    If he’s been smart he’s pumped some lola granolas before their arm pit hair turned gray.

    However, I suspect he’s a card carrying liberal. And if this is so he deserves no respect, only certain demise.

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  10. The joint looks like Berkeley’s Apple emporium.

    In which case, his attire is mainstream — for Berkeley.

    As for the gal, her crossed legs may conceal a dripper. Speaking from experience, extremely aroused women are wet enough to fear leakage.

    This situation may cause them to gyrate their hips in an extreme form as muscle control is degraded… as they head straight to bed… and any bed will do.

    Apple emporiums are pretty LOUD. So I would not be shocked to discover she has her hands up in an attempt to direct her hearing to Mr. Alpha. From the angle of the shot, it’s unclear.

    Certainly she’s evidencing ringless fingers around a pretty plain face. In my experience, gals are extremely aware of ring etiquette. A ring finger is raised like garlic to a vampire — or flashed to evidence availability. This tic comes largely from the subconscious.

    In a similar vein, lots of cheap rings and bangles indicate a babe on the hunt. Only one finger will be flamingly naked.

    Everything about the gal indicates that she’s an introvert, plain jane, who is not calling for a rescue party from a life spend too long in front of a Macbook Pro.

    Both look like they’re killing time, waiting for an Apple ‘genius.’

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    • “A ring finger is raised like garlic to a vampire — or flashed to evidence availability.”

      Reminds me of last year: I was at a bar, waiting for a former co-worker to join me up to shoot the shit. I had seen two gals walk in; one was a hard 7 and the other, not so much; maybe a 4. Well, they had circled the bar, having walked behind me, to check out an open spot. They found one directly across from where I was sitting.

      I had made eye contact with the 7 and held my stare long enough to let her know what was what. Then, she did some arm/finger stretch, making sure to flash her ringless left hand in my direction. I took that as a sign. I figured with my buddy showing up shortly, I could make my way on over, chat up the girls, and when he arrived, he’d wingman for her friend (he having just been recently engaged at the time) and also could playful chide me as well.

      Just as I was to make my way to the girls, he calls me up, says he’s on his way, but that a former female co-worker would be joining us as well. This was a surprise and a let down, as she’s some annoying gal who thinks she can be wingman for guys and I knew she had a thing for me. That ruined it as I knew she’d let her immaturity spoil my endeavor.

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    • It is Apple at Berkeley:

      http://tinyurl.com/Apple-Berkeley

      You can see the furniture and stools, off to the left in the rear is the merchandize seen in the original post photo.

      For Berkeley, he is Alpha.

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  11. Hey Yareally,HABD, Walawala, here is an interesting one. Not only is this a potential fail to learn from but also the greatest illustration I have seen to date of the woman’s conflict between the forebrain and hindbrain. So I meet this chick online 38 Columbian native lived in the US for quite a while. English is still not strong. She is hot close to an 8 at 38YO rocking body. We have a nice chat about 6 weeks ago she is ready to meet right away. But I am going out of town for a week. So we stay in touch with light chatting and flirting online and phone while I am away planning to meet when I get back. On the day of my return she sends me a nice text saying she met someone else and how much she liked our conversations, blah blah. No big deal. Water off a ducks back. I know this shit does not always work out so I will contact her in a month. Month rolls around I contact her with a high energy Christian McQueen style text with curse words. She responded but did say she did not like it, and wasn’t so sure about meeting up. Then I was reading about how to game latina’s is a lot more physical and a lot milder verbal. So I changed my tactic midstream. And realized that I needed to kind of mellow out a little which I did. More beta flirty texts , and after a few days of this told her to meet me for drinks and she agreed and mentioned my telling her what to do. I did not apologize just proceded as normal.

    We meet up. And she is a bit cold. Colder than our initial interactions a month ago. But I usually do pretty well on dates with conversation and flirting. We start having fun and having drinks. She warms up considerably. She asks me a lot of questions. I answer and evade and tease. She tells me how confident I am. She is divorced and her husband cheated on her three times, (ha he probably cheated on her dozens of times). Date goes really well push to go to her place up the street but she refuses. Small makeout not easy to do in front of the car valet and all the people waiting to get their car. Lol By this time she is all amped up.

    She is sending me cute little flirty texts all the way home. Next morning same thing. We had agreed to go out the next night because that would fit both of our schedules well. I know I should have waited but she seemed like she was on a strong escalation path to fuck town. So next morning nice flirty text she is receptive still. Then later I send her text telling her where to meet. She makes a big deal out of me telling her what to do and complains. Then she wants to talk on the phone when we do she mentions it again. I act like it is no big deal. Knowing she is from Columbia It should not be an issue traditional society and all. In addition my making plans are affirmative and fun. I am not being mean or bossy or nasty. But the conversation is ok she is laughing and she agrees to meet.

    I get to her apartment and we walk to the bar for a drink. Now she is really cold. Very little conversation body language is bad. Its like something happened. Some kind of outside force other than the two of us. She is cordial but cold. We actually get into a discussion at the bar about me telling her instead of me asking. I just shrugged and smiled and said that’s who I am. Then she tells me right out, “I don’t like it”, then the next words out of her mouth were “it makes me feel good”!!! Yes that’s exactly how this dingbat said it. I pointed this out to her and she got a worried look on her face and then said yes “it felt like when I was a little girl and my father would tell me what to do” she then smiled and then frowned and went back to digging her heels in. I knew I was not going to win an argument and get the pussy. So I just said. “Don’t you want to be happy?” She said yes, but would not relent. Discussion ended without it being really a fight. But I could tell this was not going anywhere. I held my frame.

    I continue to game her. DHV, smiling body language, a few takeways, lots of touching which she never resisted. But her body language was bad. Walked her home kissed her. Bad kiss. And I figured this is a lost cause. My take is that her idiot American friends got to her and pushed her with their you go girl attitude. They are all white entitled cunts with fucked up lives all in their 20’s. So I am thinking I am not going to change that shit. I Did not call her again. It has been exactly two weeks to the day no contact, and today I get call and a hangup from her. No message just the hangup.

    I know there was attraction there. I know she is thinking about me. Question is what do I do about this? I don’t think I have the patience to deal with her bullshit and her friends feeding her bullshit. But I sure would like to knock the bottom out of this one. Lol What do you guys think? Is this worth pursuing? Would it take too much to pull her into my frame? She has the whole Columbian upbringing which is so good. I love Columbian women they are so sexy and fun and flirty and easy going. I have dated them before and they are awesome. But she has only her American friends in this country and they are her primary influence I am sure.

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    • Well, I think you nailed it. She is conflicted at a very deep level. No matter what you do (or don’t do), one of those two voices will be unhappy, and therefore, so will she. Move on?

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    • Reco, if she’s anything like my 23 yo Latina (foreign family too), you could be for a long haul. Stay the course, if I learned anything in 3 years of fucking her on and off, its that she will balk at most anything you say, tell you she doesn’t like or agree to your assertiveness, but her actions will betray her. You gotta be persistent and maintain that strong frame to bag upper echelon Latina chicks, they eat betas alive. She gets hit on CONSTANTLY, and has in a sense has abilities to sniff out pussies like no other girl I’ve been with. It’s been worth the trouble, if not for just the wild sex, the preselection I get wherever I take her. Good luck and continue to escalate physically when with her til ya nail it down.

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      • Are you going to marry her and have kids? If not, you are contributing to the decline of western civilization.

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      • “Are you going to marry her and have kids? If not, you are contributing to the decline of western civilization.”

        This is a very valid point. So many guys are quick to judge society around them, then run with the, “watch it burn” attitude.

        I’d you aren’t part of the solution, you are part of the problem. Having “game” or being “alpha” have nothing to do with a man’s character. Being another cog in the carousel only contributes to the decline of civilization.

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    • Reco, I think you’re giving off an aggressive player vibe. I’ve noticed it in other posts. I think your game is too hard-edged. I’ve been approached by guys like this, and I back away like she did. Some men here will tell you to keep going full-asshole but I don’t think it’s going to work. I think you need more comfort.

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      • Amy your reply completely confuses me…
        He hits it off with the Latina. Latina flirts for a week while he’s away. BUT THEN just as he is coming back into town Reco’s “Hard Edge Game” (in absentia apparently) was too much for Latina to see him with some lame “found someone else”. Oh you say he needs to provide more comfort building also in absentia. Same with later date…

        Hows about another alternate way of looking at this m’kay?
        Reco is talking instead of doing.

        Reco listen to an XY, you were _IN_ her apartment. Read Roosh’s book called BANG. He will explain this to you. Getting in a lady’s home is 90% there. In fact it IS the goal. You should have found a way to keep the action there. (a gift of vino does wonders on entry… she’s got to be a good hostess and open it… right?)

        The coldness is probably her preemptive ASD kicking in. She is old enough to know how weak she is for dominant men (the daddy thing is a tip off). So she’s doing the late 30’s “not again” routine. (say it with me “I will always date younger women who don’t have this baggage… _I_ will be the girls future baggage”).

        Reco this is why we have rules like 3 dates sex or NEXT.

        Iron Rule of Tomassi #3
        Any woman who makes you wait for sex, or by her actions implies she is making you wait for sex; the sex is NEVER worth the wait.

        Angry’s Corollary to #3
        The quality of sex is inversely related to the time a man pursues sex.

        Slutty’s Maxim to #3
        The reason why some women make men wait for sex is because those women know they are lousy f*cks.

        Oh, and I didn’t see much venue changing during dates… you need to work on that.

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      • The first thing (& Reco probably already knows is):
        Never take advice from a woman..EVER.

        What are you doing here anyway “Amy”? Shouldn’t you be changing diapers or putting kids to bed or something right now? If not..WHY not? What is wrong with you that you can’t get a decent guy to marry you and make you pregnant? You’re obviously way past your fertile prime (18-19) and you’re definitely not getting any younger..

        Second thing is: What the guy in the picture is doing is called Big D1ck game.

        This is what us LARGE Northern European men do and is all about making subtle conversation with all the main and real focus in being on showing off the Big D to the ladies. They know it and we know it and the conversation being had is 100% superfluous to what’s really going on. Women find it irresistible in a subconscious way. It always works and that is why you find the same men doing the same routine over and over again., because if it ain’t broke it don’t need fixin!

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      • Thanks for the info. But I am a little slow on the uptake and need more detail. What is Big dick game? lol I am going to need to understand this better.

        @ang I agree with what you are saying and it has crossed my mind that the sex would not be that great. But the Columbian women I have been with have been awesome so far. As far as younger women. I am trying brother it I am 52. So not always that easy. I have had much younger women but not able to consistently pull them.

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      • Ummm, except it’s NOT working. But please, carry on.

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      • Got to go with Amy on this one. More comfort and create a little fantasy for her. Then push-pull her. Get her hamster thinking that you are gonna flake for another bimbo.

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      • Ang:

        Oh, and I didn’t see much venue changing during dates… you need to work on that.

        That builds comfort, which was Amy’s point.

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    • I wouldn’t be so quick to blame the friends… probably have nothing to do with it. Looks like you did attraction but not comfort and rapport, and got into a pissing match with her over your alpha pose.

      Is the goal to hold alpha frame (when no one is watching but you) or score?

      Calibrate, she was upset with the cursing and text, and then your telling her what to do, she rejected your invitation to her place, small makeout, bad kiss… None of that is positive. And her husband cheated on her. So she is wary of the pump and dump and probably unsure of how to deal with life post divorce.

      “she got a worried look on her face and then said yes “it felt like when I was a little girl and my father would tell me what to do” she then smiled and then frowned and went back to digging her heels in. I knew I was not going to win an argument and get the pussy. So I just said. “Don’t you want to be happy?”BR

      On this here, instead of getting into a logical conversation you could have pulled her in close, hugged her, smiled, looked into her eyes and said something like “your not a little girl anymore” or some shit and diffused things that way.

      Anyway, she pinged you with the hang up, so she still has some interest. Freeze her out a week or so and reengage like nothing ever happened. When you tell her again what you will be doing, expect a test and make a joke about it A&A and give her some comfort “Hey we got off on a bad foot last time, and I’ve been busy, so come meet me at XYZ and you can pick out my drink for me… ” sometimes just a glimmer of beta comfort is enough so she can beat back her hamster…

      And lighten up Reco. It’s all a game.

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      • @sentient thanks for the advice. And believe me I do agree with a lot of what you are saying. It makes sense. But when you say lighten up it’s all a game and I got into a pissing match with my alpha pose.

        I get a little frustrated. Damned if I do and damned if I don’t. All I hear about is how I have to maintain my frame, and emotional control is key. Being non reactive. Don’t take a woman seriously, etc.

        Then When I do this I hear it’s all a game. I am not sure what to believe.

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      • It is frustrating. Just test stuff and see what works. It is clear it seems that what you were doing wasn’t working, and you re-calibrated once, with the text. This is just another dimension of that.

        You can not take her seriously and still give her some comfort, but you are giving comfort from your frame, not supplicating to her. Like imagine you squeezed her hand a bit too hard, she goes ouch! what do you do? Do you just “hold frame” or do you emote a bit, engage her, say oh did that hurt? I didn’t mean it etc. Which is a normal reaction that will give comfort and draw her closer and which is an odd reaction that will push her away. You ended the night with a bad kiss, right?

        I do this at times as well, sometimes when you are a hammer everything is a nail. But you get reaction, adjust to the reaction. That’s what I mean it is a game. Service, volley, rush the net, lob etc. The looser you are the looser you will play.

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      • @Reco the key to being nonreactive is get a lot of references (real life experience with women) in a short amount of time. My last 30 day challenge killed a lot of my reactivity.

        The idea is to constantly bombard your brain with scary shit until it’s boring. Then you won’t care anymore.

        Was half-assing it for a whole year going out 3 times a week, approaching and then auto-ejecting + doing slowass daygame and I still felt that I wasn’t changing anywhere near fast enough. 25-days straight of going at night later… let’s just say I’m MUCH less reactive than before.

        You can fake being nonreactive in front of the girl, but you won’t actually feel it on the inside.

        If you’re getting pissed, you care too much about these singular interactions, and is a sign that you should be talking to A LOT more women.

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      • @reco
        Calibration is what makes this an art. You have to constantly calibrate. Like I might be able to tell a girl responds well to dominance, so I show more of my dominant side, but then it crosses some line in her head and her life experiences where it shuts her down. So I read that and can tell it’s a legit emotion, so I back off on the dominance a bit to make her comfortable again and then slide back into dominance but with her more comfortable now, while being aware of that line I crossed before. Then maybe she calls me too dominant and says she hates me but I can read that she doesn’t mean it and this time is just a shit-test and she’s actually just frustrated with herself for being attracted to me so I calibrate to that and keep my dominance or step it up and she loves it.

        Calibrating moment to moment is key. Women change on a dime based on their emotions in the moment so what was amazing to her a few minutes ago is repulsive to her once her emotions have changed. Being able to read that and adjust is important.

        The biggest thing is learning to read when she’s genuinely upset or turned off where you back up and change plans, and when she’s just shit-testing where you keep going full-tilt.

        This comes from just field experience and reading women and learning to notice the little things like her making out with you on the first meet but being ice cold on the day2 means you can’t just resume where you left off from the first meet you have to calibrate and bring her back into the receptive state she was in that night. Or you may meet up for the day2 and she’s super receptive and you can just pick up where you left off and quickly get the lay.

        It’s not that the rules of attraction are inconsistent. It’s that women themselves are inconsistent so you have to learn which rules apply in each moment and adapt to the fluid changes. And how you execute those rules could change your value up or down to where other rules now come into play and you have to calibrate to her new view of you…like your value shot too high so she starts seeing you as unattainable and you have to lower your value with some humility. But then she gets complimented by someone and feels cocky and sees herself as higher value than you so you calibrate to that and tease her to bring your values back in check. If you had teased her when she felt you were too high value you would have lost her. This is calibration.

        Buoyancy is a constant rule, but the design of the ship and how it’s manned may change depending on the state of the ocean it’s sailing in. In poker a pair of aces is a good hand but you calibrate to the game and your opponents and may have to fold them.

        Playing the numbers game where it’s one approach fits all and if the girl doesn’t play along move on is easier to teach and can get results, but the original Mystery Method was a massive art form of calibration. Highly recommend it if you have the free time to consume it lol I can hook you up with some YouTube links for it if you like. The actual book is great, should be able to find it easily posted in PDF form in google. The original MM is way deeper than anything people teach these days and places a huge emphasis in calibration and fluidly adjusting your game.

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      • @YaReally any chance you could critique my text game here? This is a blonde 8 I met through social circle a couple of times, vibe was friendly but she is quite shy so I found it impossible to get any flirting, teasing or banter going on. I’m unlikely to see her again through social circle, so I messaged her on FB. First time was to invite her to a party, she couldn’t make it but was friendly and sounded happy to be asked. We pick up a couple of weeks later:

        Me: Hey how’s it going? Have you had a good weekend?
        Her: Im good how are you? Anything special going on? : ) My weekend was very chill didn’t do much

        Me: I got back yesterday from a work trip to X. It’s a weird place! Have you ever been? I’m glad I got to visit, but wouldn’t want to live there
        [I deliberately started the convo after I’d done something interesting, as an opportunity to DHV and elicit interested questions]

        Her: No but I would really like to go some day : ) is it worth going?
        [I’m thinking: this could easily shape up to be a friendly, logical, asexual convo, not good. I need to get her engaging and talking about herself more so that I can tease her or disqualify her a bit. When she qualifies herself to me, that will be a good opportunity to show my own interest and try to escalate to meeting up in person. I try sending a longer value-offering text telling her some interesting stuff and including some negative and positive emotions. I’m hoping she will reciprocate with a little story or two of her own, it will get her more invested and maybe give me something to tease her about.]

        Me: Haha well it’s interesting to see but I would *not* recommend going out of your way to visit! Most of it is blah blah blah. A lot of the top sights are things like blah blah blah. Of course, if you do happen to love shopping, it’s paradise ; ).
        I did do X, just because it was very funny to me that you can do that in such a seemingly inappropriate place. And getting out of the city and into the Y was pretty cool. But there are a lot of other places in the world where you can see/do better things for much less money!
        Her: You were there for work and you managed to do all of that stuff?! : )
        [not the reply I was hoping for but it sounds pretty positive. Maybe I can tease her about not doing enough cool things]

        Me: Well you’ve gotta take advantage when these opportunities come up! I hope you’ve not been sitting around in Z all the weekends you’ve been here :p
        [she’s only staying in my city for a short time, 6 months I think]

        Her: Pretty much, haha well not all weekends
        [ugh, give me something to work with. You could be qualifying yourself to me at this point and we could already have a date arranged!]
        Me: You need to explore while you still have the chance! Have you at least been to A and B?
        Her: of course!
        [she’s disengaging. My last line is thrown out pretty much at random to keep the convo going]
        Me: Haha that’s good. Which did you like better?
        Her: A
        [one-word answers now. I know when to take a hint.]

        Like


      • @Truman It started out well, but she’s bored because it’s not going anywhere.

        You want to use text game to do one of 3 things: 1) set up a meeting 2) sexualize the interaction 3) build comfort

        You built comfort…then….nothing.

        Look:

        You: Ever been to xyz?

        Her: No

        You: I picture you sitting there, sipping a mojito, wearing one of those big floppy hats like Lady Astor…

        Her: get out.. you have an active imagination blah blah blah

        Here’s how I keep it sexual with a girl “friend” I banged and want to bang again. We chit chat a lot:

        Her; When is that boat trip?

        Me: Fuck, am I your personal assistant? It’s the 1st

        her: I am dealing with a tax issue

        Me: hahah are you going to jail?

        Her; it is ridiculously complicated. yes I might im serious

        Me: they have conjugal visits. I’ll bring scotch

        That… is how you do it.

        Another…a girl I haven’t banged, who I have gamed, has a fiancé, suddenly texts me at 10pm :

        Her: Gonna be in your town next week! Let’s do lunch or dancing

        Me: Miss me already? What day? am in town all week

        logistics.

        Me: What brings you here this time?

        her: Long story–let’s just say it’s a leisure trip.

        DUH….TROUBLE WITH BF

        Me: Perfect NOTICE HOW I DON”T PRY, I JUST CONFIRM

        Her; If you have time lets grab lunch on a weekday

        AGAIN HER TRYING TO FIND TIME TO SPEND OR FILL WITH ME..

        In both these cases I’ve immediately made it more than chit chat. In one case I have banged the girl. In the second case I have wanted to…and will escalate this time if I get that IOI and sexual vibe. I’ve been amping it up each time we meet but we both know we want to it’s just not been spoken.

        Keep the texts around her. Tease her more. Set something up.

        Like


      • @walawala thanks for your input.

        “You: I picture you sitting there, sipping a mojito, wearing one of those big floppy hats like Lady Astor…”

        Hmm yeah I like that as it shows a little intent but is still very mild and friendly. Don’t you ever scare girls off by sexualising the interaction too soon? That’s what I’m worried about with this one because of her being shy.

        Like


      • @Truman You have to calibrate and as you would in real life, escalate the sexualizing.

        Let’s play a little game…you like games don’t you?

        her: yah, sure I guess

        Ok, simple choices: Chocolate or strawberries?

        her: answer

        You: +5

        Her: points?

        You: yah, there’s a prize….

        A simple way is: “Heels or flats?”

        her: Huh?

        you: Heels or flats? preference

        her: heels/flats

        you: +5 heels are sexier

        Her: blah blah blah

        Take it from there.

        If she gets like 10 points tell her she gets any two questions to ask…

        “But make them interesting, not, what colour is your favorite dinosaur?”

        Remember, your fucking with a girl’s imagination. She’s on a bus, or if it’s late, in bed and you’re playing with her mind.

        Krauser calls this the Questions Game in person.. It works in text if you keep it at this level.

        I’d suggest you buy Krauser’s DayGame Mastery, there’s a whole chapter on proper text game. This is just my approach to it.

        They won’t get mad if 1) you slowly escalate 2) you hold your frame

        Her: “That’s weird…

        You: Wow…so serious…

        Like


      • “@Truman It started out well, but she’s bored because it’s not going anywhere.

        You want to use text game to do one of 3 things: 1) set up a meeting 2) sexualize the interaction 3) build comfort”

        This.

        walawala is dead on. You went “sideways” as I call it instead of going forward…just fluffing and filling time, not progressing anything toward a meetup/lay/sexual interaction. She can read a website about tourism if she wants to know about that shit lol

        Some ways to turn things sexual (in your case you’re super asexual to her so you would have to use very light indirect type sexual stuff instead of hard direct sexual stuff (like “you stayed in to flirt on Tinder all night” vs “you stayed in to flick your bean to animal porn” lol):

        1) misinterpret that she’s flirting with you or into you (“I would really like to go someday :)” “woah, inviting yourself on my next trip already? you move fast. Stage 5 clinger alert.” (gay but I’m in a rush right now lol))

        2) roleplay (“my weekend was chill” “that’s no good, let’s run off to Vegas and do XXX (skinny dipping in fountains or getting drunk and married at a chapel or she can fold your dollar bills for you to stuff in the g-strings at the rippers, something very lightly sexually themed, like clearly a joke, since your tone is super asexual at this point so you gotta’ warm up to it slow or it’ll come off too incongruent to her)

        3) cold read (“you know what they say about girls who stay inside all the time…” (insert some kind of lightly sexual cold read here) Or “I bet a lot of people think you’re boring when you say you stayed in all weekend, but *I* know that what you were REALLY doing was–” (again something lightly sexual, like flirting with Tinder boys or something))

        “Don’t you ever scare girls off by sexualising the interaction too soon?”

        Better than boring her off by being asexual. 😉

        “That’s what I’m worried about with this one because of her being shy.”

        Like walawala says: calibrate. If you go too far, read that and pull back, blow it off as no big deal if it wasn’t too far over the line, or full out apologize if it crossed way too far. You may blow it entirely and creep her out, but that’s why we don’t shit where we eat when we’re learning to calibrate lol

        Like


      • @yareally thanks for the info. I get it just have to be able to do the calibration on the spot. I also see what Hunter said. If you are getting mad then you are too affected. BY her bullshit. And I must admit that I was a little annoyed inside.

        And yes if you know of some videos or good reading material I would really like to see it. Also what do you suggest I do moving forward. Wait about a week and ping her? Or should I just ping her now? And how would you calibrate to her negative attitude on me telling her where we go on dates? Just ask her next time? Lol

        Finally I pinged the little Texas honey with Walawala’s ping of Oy! And she responded back with one word. I am kind of surprised. But then I sent her a long text inviting her out with a week timeframe. What do you think?

        Like


      • @Reco

        You: oy

        Her: hey

        You: Drinks

        her: ….you get the idea….

        It’s not:

        You: Oy

        her: Hey

        YOu: hey let’s go to the museum, there’s a great photo exhibit with Andy Warhol’s retrospective, he’s hilarious

        No…

        you: Warhol museum…cool

        her: What?

        Then work it out…

        Warhol, let’s go.

        Like


      • @Reco
        “Also what do you suggest I do moving forward. Wait about a week and ping her?””

        http://www.pua-zone.com/showthread.php?5492-How-To-Soft-Next-Step-by-step-instructions-and-answers-to-questions

        She’s 38 and you’re a cool attractive dude, she loses on more than you do if you stop contacting her and she knows it deep down because most guys are lame, but she also knows that most guys will crack especially older guys. The phone call is like when a cat won’t play with the string so you dangle it in front of it to try to entice it to chase.

        “And how would you calibrate to her negative attitude on me telling her where we go on dates?”

        I’m a dick so I would text her like normal and be flirty and charming but just not push to meet up at all and when she gets frustrated and says “when are we going to go on another date??”, say “I’d love to, but you don’t like when I tell you what to do.” and then ignore everything she texts for a few days so she can contemplate whether her new-found feminist values are worth losing my attention and her friends can call me a jerk while she just gets more attracted that I’m disciplining her, then a few days later tell her to meet me somewhere AND what to wear lol

        You don’t have to do that, but don’t stop what you’re doing. If she actually didn’t like it she wouldn’t say it makes her feel good and she wouldn’t be dialing you. She’s just frustrated that she likes the alpha daddy shit because it goes against being a strong independent woman. Her former boyfriends/husband were probably huge pussies so she’s not used to giving up control and hates that she likes it because she has X number of years of that not being how relationships are.

        “Just ask her next time? Lol”

        God no. Fuck what she says she wants. Don’t get into logical debates with her, just lol and shrug and if she harps on and on about it walk away. Drop a “I’m not sure we’ll get along. I love the chemistry we have together, but you don’t like men who lead you, and that’s the type of man I am. I think you would be happier with someone else. But thank-you for a lovely evening.” and then walk away and don’t look back (or attempt to settle up the tab or call her a cab etc.).

        Or stare her down with a slight half-grin doing laser-eyes on her while she yaps about how she hates it, and slowly cut the space to get up in her fac, then when she’s flustered just wordlessly go for the kiss.

        She likes what you’re doing, that’s why she’s still around you and smiling through her frowns and shit. She doesn’t WANT you to cave and supplicate.

        This is one of those things I was talking about where some “I don’t like that” statements rae legit and some are a shit-test. This “I don’t like being bossed around” is just a shit-test, because she’s still giving you ioi’s through it (smiling, meeting up with you, calling you after 2 weeks of silence, etc.). You haven’t ACTUALLY offended her. But her cold shoulder when you met up with her wasn’t a shit-test, she needed to be warmed up there and brought back into a receptive mood.

        The difference is subtle but important, and again it comes from just field experience, fucking up a bunch by going too far and by not going far enough and then learning to guage that middle ground and adapting it with each girl in each moment of the interaction. This is why I tell guys they can’t learn this shit through just reading online from their computer chair, you have to go out and build the reference experiences (good and bad, succeeding and fucking up) in your brain to be able to do this all on the fly.

        For me, I don’t even think about 90% of this stuff when I’m actually in the interaction. It’s all just feeling the vibe and flowing for me…but that’s because I already went through the stage you’re going through and I’m on the other side of it where my brain is just making a million little calculations at once subconsciously while you’re having to calculate those things one by one consciously right now. It’ll get easier over time, I promise, just like you probably don’t think much when you’re driving a car now VS when you were a teenager.

        Like


      • @wala i get that and I am doing that. But I am trying to get her to get on a plane and come out here from halfway across the country. We have talked about her coming out here. Just trying to get her to reengage or agree to come out. Would you still keep it that brief?

        Like


      • “And how would you calibrate to her negative attitude on me telling her where we go on dates? Just ask her next time?”

        Two ways to do this, offer her a choice A or B? so you are deciding the range of options and she still gets to choose something.

        “Meet me Saturday at 9PM, you feel like whiskey or wine?”

        Or just use the word “let’s” which she can interpret as you asking her.

        “Hey let’s go grab a drink Saturday/grab a bite/see a show whatever at 9pm”

        don’t let “game” stand in the way of lays…

        Like


      • @Reco I’m trying to get a hot girl to get on a plane and come for my event weekend—after meeting her for a few days at a party.

        I gamed her the first night. She came out the second night—when that 23 year old suddenly decided to ignore me…suddenly this hottie showed up and it seamlessly transitioned to spending a great night chatting, drinking and talking to her.

        So the third day she was leaving…I texted her logistics.

        After that I text her: “come for my music weekend”

        That’s a huge ask…she says ‘thanks for the invite but can’t’ make it, let’s meet up when you’re here”.

        I have to go there for a business trip…so it’s on.

        Oh and when I walked her to the train station after spending the morning with her having coffee (she had a beer) I pulled her and kissed her on the lips. She froze up. Me: “That was nice…see you”.

        Later she texted me some flirty stuff. If I took it literally I would have thought she was uninterested and didn’t like me. No. She likes me. She’s just surprised a guy would do that so quickly.

        As for the “Soft next” YaReally describes. yes. you need to follow through with this. I fucked it up with crazy ex gf and it just ended up in a mess.

        I’m now “soft-nexting” the 23 year old I was banging who went cold. She was not happy with my forward texts telling her not to be a “little baby bitch” and reminding her “I’m a man you’re a woman…not a little girl”.

        She’s gone literally “off the grid”—no FB, no posts instead of dozens of re-posts of articles and photos.

        What’s it mean? It means she’s shamed by her behavior, her hamster is spinning, she knows she fucked up and it would be so much easier if I just reached out. yes, it would be easier…for her.

        Stop thinking tactics (what do I say??) and start thinking strategy (What do I really want? ) Then the tactics will make more sense and flow more naturally.

        Like


      • “Stop thinking tactics (what do I say??) and start thinking strategy (What do I really want? ) Then the tactics will make more sense and flow more naturally.”

        Spot on.

        Like


      • @yareally @walawala Thanks very much for the input. This place is the best free game resource on the web that I know of, by far.

        Like


    • “she tells me right out, “I don’t like it”, then the next words out of her mouth were “it makes me feel good”!!! … I knew I was not going to win an argument and get the pussy. So I just said. “Don’t you want to be happy?” She said yes, but would not relent. Discussion ended without it being really a fight. But I could tell this was not going anywhere. I held my frame.”

      maybe i read it wrong but why did you see this as an argument or that there was a need to hold your frame? she said it made her feel good. did you not hear that part?

      she was giving you the opportunity to tell her to stop focusing on the mind trip she was on and to instead focus on how she felt. she wanted you to tell her to stop thinking so much about whether it was right or wrong for her to like you telling her what to do. she wanted you to tell her it was okay to trust you and to go with what she was feeling instead.

      again, maybe i read it wrong but that seems pretty obvious to me.

      Like


      • @blart I basically did this. I said lets just have fun and be happy. But her body language was shut down she was not facing me she was not engaging me. I know she was interested in me but she was trying to resist me.

        I think this is obvious also. What is not obvious is what do I do now. How do I proceed from here.

        Like


      • @ Reco

        gotcha.

        you’ll have to decide if she’s worth another shot. you do have to calibrate and re-calibrate and…re-calibrate with every girl like the other guys said. maybe she’ll come around with a little more comfort but then again, she might not. she might be the kind of girl who needs a lot of comfort and reassurance…all the time.

        she sounds a little like those girls who will storm off after every fight expecting you to chase after them or someone who will play hard to get EVERY time you make a move on her.

        i think if i were you i’d just try to stay cool about it and let her think you’re not losing any sleep over her. don’t be a dick about it or anything. that will just prove to her that she’s got you going. just tell her you understand her hesitation and how confusing feelings can be. tell her she should take all the time she needs to make up her mind about what she wants and that you’ll be around if she wants to start relaxing and having fun but it’s no sweat if she doesn’t. be really upbeat and easy going about it and make sure she gets the impression that it’s cool if you see her again and it’s just as cool if you don’t. the last thing you want to do is let her think you’re butthurt over her brush off.

        then don’t contact her for a little while. when you do re-engage, just open her up like nothing happened

        she’s definitely shit testing to get you to prove you’re as into her as she is into you. don’t fall for it. just focus on taking her for her word. so she’s confused about her feelings? agree and amplify. let her think you’re good with giving her space to sort out her feelings and then give her space. nothing gets to a girl more than being told that you understand her feelings and that you’re okay without her.

        Like


    • @Reco Good description and FR. I’ll weigh in. It’s sometimes easier to see these things as an outsider.

      1) I think you’re overly invested in banging her. I get this. When I started the year I was in FTOW mode. A few I met I could see were coming in hostile and just there because of some obligation and curiousity to meet up. Chill.

      2)The girls’ friends: Hmmm….She’s latina who doesnt’ speak much English—why would she listen to “White” girls? She’s 38. She’s got baggage and history. In my case, the 23 year old I was banging was telling me her friends were asking “about our relationship?” to which I replied “It’s our relationship, none of their business”. In the end the peer pressure, guilt of banging me and the remorse of her ex bf were the “logical” factors that won over her sheer enjoyment of being with me—which was evident in how she voluntarily came out and never raised many questions about my ideas.

      3) You should pull back a bit. Chill out. I just got a text from a girl I’ve been gaming for a year who has a “Fiance”. I see her on business trips. She’s 28 and smoking hot. She came here for a conference and we went out. Every guy and girl’s jaws dropped when the saw us together. I was chill. Kino but no escalation—teasing but no escalation. Why? I can feel the sexual tension but I know her fiancé. Just yesterday she texts—late—to tell me she’s in town. I ask a few questions about why: business, conference? “Long story”…ok bf troubles. She wants to meet up. I propose a few things to get into her head what we can do. She is reaching out to me: let’s meet during the day, let’s go for coffee. I suggest a few things. She pulls back: “let’s see when I get there”. Ok. calibrate. She’s coming. She’s keen. She wants to meet. She has some ideas of when I’m free and it’s on. No need to over-game.

      4) When you went to her apartment, she was nervous. But the subcommunication was clear. You needed to start engaging her in “Do you have any interesting photos, do you cook? Look into her fridge, tease her.. Etc. Sounds like you went there, had a drink…she was naturally in conflict in her head and you didn’t manage that. Game is about managing that.

      5) her telling you she doesn’t like it: I get this all the time. My response is usually: “I’m a man you’re a woman”. This frames the interaction and sexualizes it. If the girl is not comfortable with this and leaves. Ok. This was my response to the girl who suddenly felt we were “too close”.

      6) Regardless of how tight your game is, this is an art not a science. This is a programmer’s code: if you do x you’ll get y. Game is both a set of structures but also a mindset. That’s why having a strong frame and inner game is so vital.

      That’s my inputs from the experiences I’ve learned from.

      Like


    • on November 19, 2014 at 11:22 am having a bad day

      @reco

      “Hey Yareally,HABD, Walawala, here is an interesting one. Not only is this a potential fail to learn from but also the greatest illustration I have seen to date of the woman’s conflict between the forebrain and hindbrain. So I meet this chick online 38 Columbian native lived in the US for quite a while. English is still not strong. She is hot close to an 8 at 38YO rocking body. We have a nice chat about 6 weeks ago she is ready to meet right away. But I am going out of town for a week. So we stay in touch with light chatting and flirting online and phone while I am away planning to meet when I get back. On the day of my return she sends me a nice text saying she met someone else [shit test…] and how much she liked our conversations, blah blah. No big deal. Water off a ducks back. I know this shit does not always work out so I will contact her in a month. [better to spot and handle the shit test right away…lol] Month rolls around I contact her with a high energy Christian McQueen style text with curse words. She responded but did say she did not like it,[shit test…] and wasn’t so sure about meeting up. [shit test…and setting up more shit testing…]Then I was reading about how to game latina’s is a lot more physical and a lot milder verbal. So I changed my tactic midstream. [good calibration] And realized that I needed to kind of mellow out a little which I did. [good calibration] More beta flirty texts [why?…beta is almost always bad…] , and after a few days of this told her to meet me for drinks and she agreed and mentioned my telling her what to do. [shit test…] I did not apologize just proceded as normal. [good…]

      We meet up. And she is a bit cold. [shit test…] Colder than our initial interactions a month ago. But I usually do pretty well on dates with conversation and flirting. We start having fun and having drinks. She warms up considerably. She asks me a lot of questions. I answer and evade and tease. She tells me how confident I am. She is divorced and her husband cheated on her three times,[did this clue you in on the type of guy she is aroused by?…lol…or did you think that she wanted someone different?…] (ha he probably cheated on her dozens of times). Date goes really well push to go to her place up the street but she refuses. [you should have ended the date right there…] Small makeout not easy to do in front of the car valet and all the people waiting to get their car. [so, why did you push for this?…did you intentionally signal your DLV/lack of options/intent to get shit tested harder next date…?…lol…] Lol By this time she is all amped up.

      She is sending me cute little flirty texts all the way home. [less investment for her…and standard rolodex page for beta provider/orbiter guys…they eat that up…lol…bc it gives them ‘hope’…] Next morning same thing. [repeat comment…lol] We had agreed to go out the next night because that would fit both of our schedules well. I know I should have waited [why?…did you get the feeling the date didn’t go well for you getting sex? see YaReally’s comments on ‘waiting’…] she seemed like she was on a strong escalation path to fuck town. [really? or was this beta ‘hope’ getting in the way of an accurate read of the situ?…] So next morning nice flirty text she is receptive still. [why wouldn’t she be? did you expect her to bail on you?…if so, why?] Then later I send her text telling her where to meet. She makes a big deal out of me telling her what to do and complains. [shit test…and bigger than last time, right?…] Then she wants to talk on the phone [shit test/hoop to jump thru…did you ignore her demand? or call her…] when we do she mentions it again. [shit test again…she really wants you to pass this particular test…lol…] I act like it is no big deal. [you probably passed the shit test at this point…] Knowing she is from Columbia It should not be an issue traditional society and all. [it’s not…except as a test. it could be this is her personal issue test…if you pass this, she’ll do anything you want, but if you don’t, she won’t sex you up at all…] In addition my making plans are affirmative and fun. I am not being mean or bossy or nasty. But the conversation is ok she is laughing and she agrees to meet.

      I get to her apartment and we walk to the bar for a drink. [why did you leave there without sex first?…serious question…she agreed to isolation with you…did you recognize this…and convert?…] Now she is really cold. [wonder why?…lol…also, shit test…] Very little conversation body language is bad. Its like something happened. [no sex for her…lol…] Some kind of outside force other than the two of us. [no…just you…lol] She is cordial but cold. We actually get into a discussion at the bar about me telling her instead of me asking. [bc you had passed this test, but didn’t sex her up when you had the chance, and now she can’t believe that you really did pass this test…so she has to bring it up again…] I just shrugged and smiled and said that’s who I am. Then she tells me right out, “I don’t like it”, then the next words out of her mouth were “it makes me feel good”!!! Yes that’s exactly how this dingbat said it. [she’s NOT a dingbat, just a girl…lol…and she was giving you an opportunity to convert this to a ‘make her feel good all the time’ issue…lol] I pointed this out to her [= trying to win logical argument about a shit test = beta fail…] and she got a worried look on her face and then said yes “it felt like when I was a little girl and my father would tell me what to do” she then smiled and then frowned and went back to digging her heels in. [see below for analysis] I knew I was not going to win an argument and get the pussy. [bc you didnt realize what was in play, and how to redirect it…or for some other reason…?] I just said. “Don’t you want to be happy?” She said yes, but would not relent. [logic = beta fail…] Discussion ended without it being really a fight. But I could tell this was not going anywhere. I held my frame. [sounds like she held her frame bc you couldn’t get her to move to a new one…yours…]

      I continue to game her. DHV, smiling body language, a few takeways, lots of touching which she never resisted. But her body language was bad. [that’s called ‘resisting’…lol…] Walked her home kissed her. Bad kiss. And I figured this is a lost cause. My take is that her idiot American friends got to her and pushed her with their you go girl attitude. [nah…were they on the date with you two?…lol] They are all white entitled cunts with fucked up lives all in their 20’s. [that’s a good demographic…are they cute? can you game them, too?…lol] So I am thinking I am not going to change that shit. I Did not call her again. It has been exactly two weeks to the day no contact, and today I get call and a hangup from her. No message just the hangup. [that’s a ‘chase me’ rolodex tech…lol…so, she wants you to keep playing, but can’t really tell you straight out…lol…that’s why girls do that ‘pocket dial’ shit…and why YOU should never do that…lol…did you buy her dinner?…how deep are you into the beta provider box already, and can you dig your way out?…]

      I know there was attraction there. [duh…she invited you to an isolated location…alone…by yourself…with her…lol] I know she is thinking about me. Question is what do I do about this? I don’t think I have the patience to deal with her bullshit and her friends feeding her bullshit. [how about an opportunity to work on YOU…and your game…lol…] But I sure would like to knock the bottom out of this one. Lol What do you guys think? Is this worth pursuing? [ya…] Would it take too much to pull her into my frame? She has the whole Columbian upbringing which is so good. I love Columbian women they are so sexy and fun and flirty and easy going. I have dated them before and they are awesome. But she has only her American friends in this country and they are her primary influence I am sure.”

      nah…it’s not her friends…that’s what it looks like when you don’t avoid her beta provider algorithm and ping her alpha stud algorithm at the same time…that’s called incongruence…lol…and it results in shit testing…lol…it started with her rolodex play on the ‘meeting somebody else’ text and went up from there…

      and you went along with her when she’s trying to put you into her ‘default’ box of beta provider (especially given her age…lol…but that is every girl’s default bc alphas avoid the beta box…it’s a filter…) but at the same time you keep throwing out alpha stud cues (taking things sexual and fun), so she needs to shit test you more and more, to try to figure out where you fit…that’s how you spin up that guard dog situ…lol…remember princess prude?…

      at some point, she is so confused that she just shuts down…it’s called sensory overload…and hamsters get it too…lol…

      refresher = spot and pass shit test = pull her into you frame…miss/don’t pass shit test = her frame…
      you deal with her calling out your ‘telling her’ by agree and amplify…same as any shit test…spot the shit test, pass the shit test…lol

      you – meet me here… (alpha frame)
      her – you told me what to do…i don’t like that…(shit test for alpha stud or beta provider, right? can you maintain congruence as alpha, so she’ll feel comfortable sucking your cock in the bathroom?…lol)
      you – [eye contact] well, i gotta be me…hmmm, sit in your chair…[smirk]…wear [whatever she’s wearing]…[smirk]…(then take it sexual…) look sexy…[smirk]…have a kissable mouth…[smirk]…[look her up and down] have great tits/ass/legs…[smirk]…etc.

      if she objects at all…say ‘no, really, you have a kissable mouth [go in for the kiss]…’

      you get the idea…if she objects again, rinse and repeat…just don’t answer with a direct response to her question/testing…keep it fun…lol…every time she brings it up, get more sexual…lol…and make sure she knows that’s what you are doing so she can control how raunchy you get…lol…

      BUT…do NOT argue with her about it = her frame…

      also, that ‘coldness’ is a default shit test. (plus she was pissed that you didn’t sex her up…lol…and that it wouldn’t be her ‘fault’…it just happened…lol…) it’s wired into girls bc they can’t just stay in the ‘i’m horny for you’ state all the time or they’d just get knocked up by a bunch of betas…lol…so, that filter is always turned on. it just gets stronger if you’ve pinged her alpha stud algorithm in the past without getting sex…lol…

      and the more you ping it without sex (converting on your opportunity…lol), the stronger it will be the next time…guard dog situ…lol…that’s why it’s so important to be able to push through to sex when you start to ping that. next time it gets harder…and why it’s relatively easy to get to sex when you can ping it properly in the first place…girls (their hindbrains) want to find those alpha stud genetics…lol…they’re relatively rare in the real world…and if you can’t get to sex right away (by passing her shit testing AND converting on your opportunity…), maybe you really are a beta who just got lucky a couple of times…and really only wants to hold hands…lol. girls really aren’t that good at figuring this stuff out…regardless of how much they seem to think/feel they are…that’s wired in too…

      so, congratulations! you’re getting better!…lol…now, you just have to figure out how to reverse getting slotted into beta provider/orbiter box. plus, i’ll point out that you have ASD to deal with now…lol. As YaReally and the other guys pointed out, it’s just calibration…but that comes after spotting/passing basic shit testing…

      ping her in a week or two, and treat it like a flake…don’t mention it again…and convert on this isolation opportunities…

      good luck!

      Like


      • @HABD wow amazing analysis brother. But I must say I do not feel like I am doing any better. And yes I do need to figure out how to not get slotted into the orbiter/beta provider box.

        I will also say that I missed a lot of shit tests. Never even spotted them until now. I will ping her again next week. You said treat it like a flake? What does that mean? Treat it like nothing?

        Also do I still keep telling her where we are going and what we are going to do? She is looking for this now? Or do I soften it up?

        Also you said I had an opportunity to bang her. I am not so sure about that. Her apartment building is a high rise and it is protected by security. I literally could not get into the front door. LIke the apartments in NY. I tried. On that last makeout bad kiss it was at the front of the building and she was the one being the bad kisser resisting me. And she giggled and told me there were cameras. That is when I gave up. I probably should have picked her up and carried her to the corner out of sight of the front of the building. lol

        But the point is. She was not in a sexual mood at all. She was cold. I do not believe she wanted to have sex. What makes you think she did? We were actually never in an isolated location. And i did not buy her dinner. Next time i invite her out I will make it a place close to a hotel. So then I dont have to deal with her apartment issues. Then venue change another place and then to the hotel.

        Just got flaked on by another plate today. One that I used to fuck about a year ago. SMH this shit seems to be getting harder not easier.

        Right now all three of these women are very strong talentwise all pushing 8. At least I am playing with some cuter girls.

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      • @HABD by the way here is the text exchange when I went to pick her up at her apartment on the 2nd date. This is minutes before she was coming down. I was trying to get inside. Just like Roosh said.

        Ligia: Let me know whe n u r close 7:15 PM
        Me: What’s your unit number I will come up and get you 🙂 7:25 PM
        Ligia: U cant 7:28 PM

        You can see she was not exactly working with me. lol

        Like


      • on November 19, 2014 at 3:59 pm having a bad day

        @reco

        you ARE getting better even if you can’t see it in real time. just putting in the effort is beneficial and is changing your perspective…

        no isolation at her apartment = change that part of analysis to straight up beta provider = no sexual response from her…

        sooo, those shit tests are probably part of her well-developed rolodex…lol…and you pinging her alpha stud algorithm just gets you more shit testing…which you haven’t been able to spot and pass…so, she has you lined up as a provider. and given her age, she is looking to consolidate on a beta bux opportunity…so, she will be pushing that angle as much as possible…you might not see her flaws (and it would pay you to look closer…it might change your perception of her being the prize…lol) but she knows where every line is on her face…that wasn’t there when she was 20…

        this is a GREAT opportunity to get in some practice on spotting and passing shit tests…lol…it seems that her whole testing is designed around the ‘chase me’ model…which REALLY works with betas, since they have that scarcity mentality…

        just assume that everything coming out of her mouth is a shit test of some type…until determined otherwise…lol…also, assume that her demeanor/coolness is the same…so, spot the test and pass it…agree and amplify…

        and it’s your job as an alpha stud to guide her emotions to happy and sexual…lol…but no actual physical sexualizing (to defuse the ASD) until at an isolated location (hotel) then escalate…just know going in that it might be a lost cause…and IF you are soooo far into the beta provider box that you can’t get out, SHE is going to shut down before you might be able to turn it around…

        think about it like this. you go out with a hottie (8/10) and you think you’re getting lucky, then during dinner she balloons to a 300 pound fatty…right before your eyes…for no apparent reason…lol…then, throughout dinner and drinks her weight goes up and down randomly…and as she’s trying to get you back to her hotel, she seems to lose the weight and gets back to like a 7.5/10 and only slightly ‘chubby’. ..question is would you do her…? bc she might balloon into a 300 pound fatty right in mid-thrust…lol…do you take the chance?…lol…and since betas are like the male version of a 300 pound fatty… would she?…

        a flake is when the girl just doesn’t show up for your date…if you mention it = beta bc you didn’t have any options/made her feel bad, so just carry on like it never happened…so, just treat her ‘hang up call’ like that.

        keep telling her where you’re going…keep being alpha, even if you make mistakes…lol…just be ready to handle the shit tests…also, when you meet up again, find at least 5 things about her that could be improved about her by her being younger/hotter/tighter…and then comment on one of those things at some time during your date…lol…then observe what happens…and be ready for a shit test/chase me response…lol…

        good luck!

        Like


      • @HABD Awesome analysis.

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      • “she is looking to consolidate on a beta bux opportunity…so, she will be pushing that angle as much as possible…”

        If she is 38 and as attractive as you say, I can almost 100% guarantee she is looking to cash in. Women in their mid-to-late 30’s are a complete waste of time if you have to fight ANY resistance. At that age, they don’t worry about increasing the N count because it gives them confidence and reassurance they are still attractive. I don’t mean to come off as a dick, but you aren’t Alpha Fux in her eyes or she would have sucked your dick by now. She is stringinh you along to see if you are going to be worth, “rewarding” with her vagina. Which will only happen once she knows she’s gonna take you to the bank.

        My advice, take this as a learning experience and NEXT.

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      • @reco
        Response in mod

        Agree with what habd is saying esp about trying to force you into beta bux. It’s not even that you’re necessarily givin off beta bux behavior, it’s more that she’s 38 and knows she’s hitting the wall and needs to lock a guy down ASAP.

        Her frustration with you leading is probably coming from “when he does that, it makes me want to fuck him, but I’m trying to be good and NOT fuck him because I need an LTR guy, so I need him to stop doing that because it’s frustrating me”. Kind of like if you were determined not to fuck a chick and then she shows up in her sexied outfit and rubs her tits in your face and you know you’re going to crack and are annoyed with her for hitting your weakness. Or if you’re on a diet and someone dangles a cookie in front of you. You want that cookie soooo but know you shouldn’t.

        Keep doing what you’re doing. Keep leading. Walk away if she hassles you too much. She needs you more than you need her, understand how high your value is. She’s surrounded by lame guys that DONT make her feel those frustrated sexual feelings.

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      • @Reco
        “@HABD by the way here is the text exchange when I went to pick her up at her apartment on the 2nd date. This is minutes before she was coming down. I was trying to get inside. Just like Roosh said.”

        Try seeding an excuse to come up or bring her up to your place. When you just say “I’ll come up and get you” that’s a high ASD think. When you say “Show me that thing we talked about” it’s like oh okay, he’s just coming up to see that thing and then it “just happens”. Or “come up and you can see that thing I told you about. You can only stay for a few minutes (or one drink) though, I have to work in the morning so I can’t be up all night.” Like that kind of thing is a huge ASD disarm VS “you should come up…….” after a makeout.

        It probably won’t work on her either way cause she’s 38 and trying so hard to not fuck you too soon so she knows to avoid being isolated near a bed with you lol but just in general for the future there’s something to keep in mind with the final pull to a bedroom location.

        You could probably get her with full out dishonesty, promising her the moon and shit. But it’s more satisfying to get the lay on your own terms VS stringing her along. Less guilty conscience too lol

        If she DOES sleep with you she is gonna try hard to lock you down to rationalize it. Like if she cracks and bangs you her brain will go “ok if I make him be my bf then that wasn’t slutty that was okay” and she may go into overdrive batshit crazy mode trying to lock you down lol. So be careful. Don’t let her know anything about you that can be traced to eff up your normal life.

        I’d say you can pull this off still, the attraction is there, but I can’t guarantee it’ll be worth the effort or that there won’t be drama to deal with if you manage to lol

        Like


      • When you say “Show me that thing we talked about”
        @yareally
        What you’re saying would work better on a woman that doesn’t have a seasoned veteran hamster. This woman isn’t giving him the poon unless he plays beta. In which case, she will only be doing it to trap him. I probably would just promise the moon, then pump-n-dump. She sounds spiteful, so fight spite with spite.

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      • YR:

        you were determined not to fuck a chick and then she shows up in her sexied outfit and rubs her tits in your face

        See, there’s this pole dancer who takes dance lessons at my studio and she does this very thing with her 39D’s, heh. It’s like you’re psychotic or someting.

        I can’t guarantee it’ll be worth the effort or that there won’t be drama

        I think that drama is guaranteed with this chick. Pull its teeth beforehand with some preemptive drama on your own terms.

        trying so hard to not fuck you too soon so she knows to avoid being isolated near a bed

        Makeout in the living room and pull off panties there. Let her handle the package, then push-pull. “I really shouldn’t, this is awful soon. I just want you so much.” Back to makeout and start the bang in the LR, then move it to the BR.

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      • Ok, asdgamer, you got my respect…. for now

        Like


      • I’ll probably dance with the dancer again tonight, lol. Wonder if she’ll keep poking me with her massive tracts of land?

        Like


      • @ commenters thanks for the huge wealth of info. I am slowly processing this between work events.

        @HABD I am working on the alpha frame. And the calibration. Yes you are right I think she is trying to put me into a beta provider box. She mentioned to me that her and her ex owned a successful small company and it is all gone now. Him leaving for Columbia and her with not much to show for it. Thanks for the encouragement. It is amazing how you were able to sniff this out when I did not bother to mention it. I think my biggest problem is spotting all of the shit tests in real time and being non-reactive. And I do need practice handling this. So I think I will try and work on her some more. But I am having my doubts about getting down her pants. ASD is high and I have not even gotten that far. Logistics are going to be tough since her apartment building is a highrise fortress where I cannot even get into the front door of the building. Or the other option is a hotel which costs money without a good chance of the bang. Also just to clarify I never got into her apartment, not even into the building.

        @yareally I am kind of leaning towards your ideas of not give her and inch on her shit tests. And soft nexting if she gets to be too much trouble. I think you are right about my value compared to hers. Matter of fact on the 2nd date she was qualifying herself to me hard. She told me how great her body is at her age (it really is) and she does not work out, she told me how normal she is compared to her friends who are always in crisis.

        I like the idea of just pinging her and then text something flirty but not acknowledging any problems in the past. And also not trying to get her out. And just wait until she asks to come out. Then when I get her out tell her what to do, lead, a little comfort, push pull, neg on a little flaw, venue change to 2nd bar, then move her to the hotel. If she acts up too much just walk away. I do want to stress we never were into any kind of a contentious debate or argument. I was smiling and light hear-ted the whole time. I did feel a little annoyed inside but not bad. One issue I had was trying to escalate to the kiss like you were talking about. I had her at the bar to make getting close contact easier but she was not facing me and turned facing the bar. I guess I should have just got right up next to her close even standing up side by side. What do you think about this?

        Also one other mention of body language. There was one time during the 2nd date where I turned my back to her completely looking at the rest of the bar (negative body language). Which was quite empty at the time. And that was one of the moments in the night when she was the most responsive and moved toward me. Body language is powerful. I should have done that more. Even moved around the bar a little to talk to other people. lol

        I will keep you updated in a future post. CH moves fast. lol

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      • Reco:

        I never got into her apartment, not even into the building.

        I turned my back to her completely…she was the most responsive

        You accidentally did a push-pull. Do this a lot more with this chick. Break rapport more often. You want her begging you to come into her apt.

        Like


      • on November 20, 2014 at 12:22 pm having a bad day

        @reco

        ‘Logistics are going to be tough since her apartment building is a highrise fortress where I cannot even get into the front door of the building.’

        i gotta pee!…and no foolin’…lol

        ‘Or the other option is a hotel which costs money without a good chance of the bang.’

        or the bathroom at the bar…

        ‘Also just to clarify I never got into her apartment, not even into the building.’

        = beta provider box security blanket…see YaReally’s comment about her not wanting to be aroused, but not being able to help herself…lol…

        ‘She told me how great her body is at her age (it really is) [NO it’s NOT…she’s 38…lol…it’s NOT great…don’t buy into the hype…from your alpha ‘i could bang that 22 yo hottie over there at the other end of the bar and you’re just lucky i’m giving you some attention’ attitude, it’s only ‘acceptable’…] and she does not work out, she told me how normal she is compared to her friends who are always in crisis.’

        girls will try to tell you all sorts of things (i’ve never done this before, i’m not slutty, i really don’t eat that much, i’m really attracted to nice guys, etc)…lol…especially when they are trying to lock you into beta bux role…the alpha frame is to understand that and to not believe it/buy into the hype…do you believe that drinking pepsi will result in an instant party?…lol…NO?…then don’t buy that other hype either…same thing… this is also a subtle shit test, too…bc if you buy it = her frame = beta…

        ‘I like the idea of just pinging her and then text something flirty but not acknowledging any problems in the past. And also not trying to get her out. And just wait until she asks to come out. Then when I get her out tell her what to do, lead, a little comfort, push pull, neg on a little flaw, venue change to 2nd bar, then move her to the hotel [or bathroom…lol]. If she acts up too much just walk away.’

        good plan…just remember, she’s on the (bio) clock, you’re not…

        ‘I do want to stress we never were into any kind of a contentious debate or argument. I was smiling and light hear-ted the whole time.’

        doesn’t matter… logical debate = trying to negotiate attraction = beta fail…

        ‘I did feel a little annoyed inside but not bad.’

        that’s you getting better at this stuff…lol…now, when you feel that way, stop and figure out where you are messing up…then, change the subject…

        ‘One issue I had was trying to escalate to the kiss like you were talking about. I had her at the bar to make getting close contact easier but she was not facing me and turned facing the bar.’

        that’s ‘chase me’ in play…

        ‘ I guess I should have just got right up next to her close even standing up side by side. What do you think about this?’

        if you are at the bar, you should be touching her somewhere – hand/arm to arm at least…that’s basic escalation…

        ‘Also one other mention of body language. There was one time during the 2nd date where I turned my back to her completely looking at the rest of the bar (negative body language). Which was quite empty at the time. And that was one of the moments in the night when she was the most responsive and moved toward me.’

        that’s called a ‘back turn’ and it works just like you saw. use it to show your displeasure at something she says or does…

        ‘Body language is powerful. I should have done that more.’

        yep…and use it just like a verbal reproach…her hindbrain will see those alpha genetics getting away and make her hamster take action…lol

        ‘Even moved around the bar a little to talk to other people. lol’

        yep (although, i get the feeling that you weren’t really serious…lol…and yes, it will seem very rude) …and use this as an intermittent step when she hassles you too much, before leaving the venue completely…

        good luck!

        Like


  12. I bet the woman did ballet when she was younger or maybe still does some kind of ballet based exercise. That’s why her feet are positioned like that.

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  13. LOLOL Omg. She does not appear to be noticing his socks.

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  14. on November 18, 2014 at 1:52 pm Committee of 300

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  15. You’re confusing autism with alphaness.

    Like


    • Also your tweet: “Darren Wilson supporters (aka “white people”) paid for this #PantsUpDontLoot billboard in St. Louis.”

      This was actually /pol/. Not that we aren’t Darren Wilson supporters, but the claim is entirely unsubstantiated. Just mentioning this to point out how the media can basically create whatever narrative they want .

      Like


  16. anyone who puts their feet on a chair is a douche-bag. many women do it, too.
    it is very inconsiderate of others. who would want to sit there now?

    also, men have resisted following women into the trend of wearing flip-flops. men are very conformist with regards to being a tool. men will bully other men who do not conform, or even get them fired. men who wear flip-flops.are being rebels. socks are a sign of hesitation, but eventually they will go.

    women have it easy. they can wear flip-flops anywhere. women hide in their herds. nothing rebellious about it. and men are cowards about it.

    Like


  17. Alpha yadstops are hard…

    Liked by 1 person


  18. For some reason the Bud Light “Real Men of Genius” music was playing in my head while reading this.

    Like


  19. My gut says dude has no fucks to give and rocks whatever the hell attire he pleases.
    Body language gives it away, IMO

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  20. I’m fine with the attitude…but to really get it down he probably needs to learn context.

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  21. Grown men shouldn’t wear shorts in public. It undermines your dignity.

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  22. CH

    I know this post is the answer to my comment question 3 days ago. Thanks

    Like


  23. Methinks he works in the store, and it is hot in there, thus the outfit. Note that the female customer is wearing a skirt and sandals with no socks, and the fat man in the background is also wearing shorts, so it’s probably a hot summer day.

    Like


    • On the other hand, looking at the picture I imagine the following conversation:

      “Oh my goodness! I can see, like, everything!”

      (calmly chewing gum) “Are you enjoying the show?”

      Like


  24. She’s got her feet crossed and ears covered….projecting “i’m not a slut, please don’t call me one (ASD)”…because she knows this guy is signaling “she swings off my branch” to the whole place.

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  25. on November 18, 2014 at 3:34 pm white european man

    alpha

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  26. Where’s GBFM to say: lotas sockas in the birkenstokas!

    Like


  27. Speaking of alpha and beta details in daily life, I just read an email sent out by a guy to a group for a certain hobby activity. Just a few things about writing text:

    –Limit the use of parentheses. Look at the best writers, they rarely use parentheses. The text looks chopped up into bits when you use them, and it looks like you are whispering, or as if you can’t think of how to fit information into the text in a good flow. (However, there are situations when parentheses should be used, and I use them myself, such as now. They are in fact practical. But alas, when you write to people you know IRL, being practical is not the only thing you have to think of.)

    –Limit smileys severely. There is no reason to write smileys in a text about work, studies or hobbies. The only time you should use them – sparsely – is in texts to a girl when you have to clarify that you are joking. Learn to recognize when that is. Don’t just include them as a habit.

    –Same goes for lol. This is a typical womanly thing, to include lol wherever and whenever. It is a way to say “I’m not trying to stand up for myself, I’m turning my eyes away, yielding to you.” Do you really “laugh out loud” at the drop of a hat? To things you yourself are saying? And twice in the same email? In fact, use LOL only when you are mocking someone, which is a different matter. And write in caps when doing so, don’t be lazy.

    –Limit the use of exclamation points. You don’t want to look like a ferret on a sugar rush.

    –In a hypothetical example, write like we have always written in Western history, and probably in other cultures as well: the hypothetical person is “he”. Definitely not “they”, which means more than one person in case you didn’t know. Feminists have pushed for the use of “they” for a hypothetical person, a typical sign of how they don’t care one bit for language rules or anything else that stands in the way of propaganda. It has gone so far that the unthinking masses now use “they” in situations where they KNOW if the hypothetical person is a he or a she. Even in their own anecdotes, when the person isn’t hypothetical! Real example: “Someone bumped into me hard at the pub, and they made me spill my drink. I got so angry I yelled at them.” Don’t be the feminists’ unthinking sheep.

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  28. picture made me laugh really hard ha

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  29. Oh come on, man, this is too easy.
    The dude’s like basketball player tall, so chicks – including the librarian 2 in the pic – will automatically dig him, regardless if he’s Alpha, Beta, Epsilon Chi Zappa or Elton John’s fucking feather boa.

    [CH: you’re so wrong it’s hard to know where to start. the world is filled with geeky, awkward, socially retarded tall men who get no play from women.]

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  30. If she doesn’t run away – alpha. If she does, the body language is grossly miscalculated and he’s working hard, but still beta. There really isn’t enough info given in the still shot.

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  31. That is sooo GHETTO!

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    • on November 18, 2014 at 9:15 pm sheerforceofwilliam

      the fanny pack, white tube socks with sandles strike me as as blue collar but not ghetto….or is “ghetto” sort of mean the same thing in the parlance of black chick speak?

      Like


      • Lol no. The way he is standing with his foot on a stool like that – a complete lack of disregard for others in the store. It’s just rude to be in a computer store propping your foot on the stool people have to sit on. Like no regard whatsoever for others in the store who may want to use that stool he has his foot on, or ,ay be just the rudeness of not understanding some people may not want to sit down where the bottom of his shoe has been.

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  32. Why would you want a very charismatic wing man? Isn’t the point for a wingman to make you look better, etc.; in that sense why not have a good-looking, well-dressed wingman who is shyer, than one who will try to maybe torpedo you.

    [CH: a good wingman won’t torpedo you. a shy wingman will hold you back.]

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  33. CH I thought you might enjoy this.
    http://www.reddit.com/r/sex/comments/2ltd7d/gf_pregnant_by_another_guy_says_im_responsible/
    Not sure if beta of the month or omega of month candidate. But some of the comment are lol especially the redditors telling him to “take responsibility.”

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  34. I wish everyone would stop judging the merit of whether this beta is winning the day in the picture (analyzing the woman’s response, etc.). The blogger’s point is that the dude has a good starting attitude. Not that the girl is being swayed.

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  35. Body language signals are mixed. His left arm is in a defensive posture. Her pelvis is angled away from him.

    Big takeaway is that he has her cornered.

    Red shirt = sexy

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  36. You know, I actually did this thing with Mrs. Gamer…only she was sitting down in a comfy chair. We’d had a fight, so she was wanting tingles and comfort and validation, so I borrowed CH’s idea here…more effective when the woman is sitting.

    Thanks CH.

    Like