Game Trumps Looks

File under: “Give me five minutes to talk away my ugly face and I can bed a hard 10.” -Voltaire. A reader (kept anonymous for obvious reasons) emails:

I started reading your blog about a week ago after my girlfriend chewed me up and spit me out like the beta I am. I knew about Game before but figured there was no reason to apply it on her. Obviously a mistake. No one would believe the shit she put me through…except the readers of your blog. That’s not why I’m writing, though. You’ve heard it a thousand times.

I wanted to relate this:

Today I am meeting with a girl on my group for a group project. I’m leading this thing but, christ, no real alpha would lower himself to leading a group project. They never do, in my experience. It’s a low status activity, so I just try to keep everyone on task and make sure we show up in class with something worth half a shit.

Anyway, through dint of scheduling I have to meet with this girl alone instead of with the four other people. I figure I might as well start practicing high status behavior so, when I noticed I was going to be early, I decided to hang around the quad until I was a couple minutes late. When I walk through the door I notice, potentially for the first time, that she is a fucking ten if there ever was one. 19 yrs, tight, flawless skin with just enough tan, full c breasts, beautiful symmetrical exotic features that sing, and the kind of wavy brunette hair that any girl outside of a pantene spot would literally kill for. Me: short, freckles, red hair, glasses, slim but doughy and pale, and 28 years of betadom to back it all up. Not terribly disciplined. Socially shy, but like most betas dominant when there is real work to do. I run and physically I’m a…4-5? On a good day. In the interests of full disclosure, I have some small scabs on my arms from skin picking, a lovely anxiety habit. Just a few but it’s the most unattractive thing ever. It’s harder to quit than smoking. On the plus side, I recently grew a beard to hide my weak chin. So let’s say that today I’m a 4.

But in spite of all this I said to myself: I am not scared of this girl. When she started talking about her many ‘accomplishments’ like her job, or her high status family (prof dad), or her many ap credits… I refused to compliment her. I actually pitied her, since it seems likely that she’s high achieving and will become a professional lady or something similar that makes her unhappy and prices her out of the marriage market.

She started twisting her hair. It was a little anxiety habit–kind of like my skin picking, except cute and girly and not destructive. In the past I would have just said to myself: hair twisting is nothing compared to the shit you do to yourself. But…I thought maybe it might be fun to neg her. “I should grow out my hair,” I said, “so I can twist it.” She apologized about her hair twisting. She started apologizing about all kinds of stuff, actually. She drank too much coffee and was really jittery. She had a ‘long day’ filled with her many accomplishments in life and her brain was ‘fried’. I told her she only had to keep it together for another hour and a half. She cracked her joints and I smiled and looked at her. She demured and I chuckled and mentioned that, when I was young, someone told me that would ruin my joints. But that ‘probably isn’t true. People tell kids lots of things.” Plenty of eye contact. Didn’t cross my legs in a girly way like I always do.

I wasn’t exactly making no mistakes here. I didn’t touch her. I accidentally spoke frankly about my chances for grad school. I asked about her wavy hair, figuring it HAD to be a perm or something. “Is your hair naturally curly?” I asked. It was, in fact, naturally curly and beautiful like Aphrodite’s might be if she were a brunette. “Not as curly as mine.” I responded, trying to ameliorate a body-directed compliment but accidentally calling attention to my curly red hair, a bit of a deficiency. Double mistake. I told her that I found her spanish fluency impressive–which I did, having struggled to learn a language myself. I thought that was bad at the time, but in retrospect complimenting beautiful women on their intellectual achievements isn’t as bad as complimenting them on their hair.

We did some practice runs of the presentation. I was a much, much better speaker than she was. By the time we were ready to leave she was giggling and falling all over herself. All bubbly smiles and eye contact and apologies.  Was she trying to DHV…to ME? Did she really just forget how impressive she was on every level: her perfect body, her high class, her raw intelligence? Could she not see that I am a bit of a classical loser, which is practically an image I’ve embraced and cultivated like she has being beautiful and smart? I was just…dumbfounded. I am awful at is reading female body language–you can’t understand a language without studying it or being immersed–so I don’t know if she was attracted to me or merely not repulsed by me, but I don’t believe I’ve ever been alone in a room with a ten for that long without it ending in cool businesslike contempt. I’ll ask her out to coffee and we’ll find out, I guess.

So thanks for saving my confidence and helping me start to heal my terrible breakup. Keep up the good work. It’s been eye opening.

The biggest difference between men and women in the dating market? A man can talk away his ugly face. A woman cannot. The reader is learning this valuable lesson, and like others before him who have trod the same path of game knowledge, he almost cannot believe the girl’s reaction he sees with his own eyes.

All the negs and teasing employed by this emailer were excellent: not too obviously insulting, with just the right amount of sting. I especially liked when he told her to “try to keep it together for an hour and a half”. Commanding, insouciant, fearless, funny. Chick crack, iow.

Pitying a woman, or lamenting her childishness and naivete, are actually very good frames to have when dealing with hot chicks. This frame is supercilious without being spiteful or hateful. A haughty disdain leavened with bemusement is a character trait that women find irresistible in men. It is the hallmark of alpha males. You could almost call it charisma.

But, unfortunately, I predict this emailer will not ask her out for coffee. (And, helpful tip, you should be taking a girl out for alcoholic beverages if possible, instead of coffee. You don’t want coffee to mentally stimulate her recall of her 463 bullet point checklist.) That “I guess” toward the end of his missive is a dead giveaway of untamed betatude. You guess? No, sir, you don’t guess. You reach down, cradle your gargantuan balls with lovingkindness, and gently coo to them “Thing 1? Thing 2? I’m letting you out of your cage again. Try not to get me in too much trouble.”

Footnote: “Not as curly as mine” was not a mistake. It was, in fact, quite an effective compliment-neutering counterattack. Remember, when you call attention to a possible flaw in a woman’s appearance or style that inadvertently highlights one of your own flaws, she’ll be too busy vaingloriously fretting to even notice what the hell flaw of yours you were concerned about. Or if she does notice and shit tests you over it, it will only serve as convenient conversational springboard to demonstrate your cool-as-fuck bona fides.

Anyhow, glad this blog is helping your dating life. Now you can stop bolding the words loser and glasses. It’s killing your inner resolve. A bolded word is a window to the id.





Comments


  1. Well put.

    The thing to always avoid is appearing in any way too eager after negging and getting IOI’s.

    I made that mistake the other day.

    After months of alpha and negging, a girl I was gaming wrote me:

    Her: I’m looking for a partner to practice salsa with

    Me: sure, when?

    She waffled about getting the thing booked at a convenient time.

    I reframed immediately and began chatting about something else.

    Don’t be so overcome with your own success that you forget you’re gaming.

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  2. I wish I knew this shit 15 years ago. I’d have cleaned up in college. Instead of a couple of handfuls and a wife who later divorced me, I’d have been able spend an extra 10 years enjoying my time with women instead of twisting in the wind for reasons I couldn’t begin to understand.

    Damnit.

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    • You’re more than making up for it now, I’d say. Probably like the rest of us that took the red pill in early/mid 30’s.

      But I know what you mean. I wouldda cut a wide swath through my University; I already had the looks and a bit of the alpha swagger, but I usually fucked it up with some beta bullshit I learned from school; chivalry and all that.

      I’d venture to say those 10 years you spent twisting in the wind occurred as some sort of teachable moment, from whichever Deus ex machina, be it deity or DNA, that controls our dating destiny. Now you get to pass your knowledge on to the young Jedis, and help restore balance in the Force. Ditto with the hostiste with the mostest.

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      • I didnt hear about this stuff until early 40’s.Im now 45. Been married for 20 years. Same here. I could have really done some damage back in my 20s. I usually let girls approach me , then if I liked them I would escalate and go for the bang right away. But was always a coward to initially approach. I still look good at 45 and recently have had girls and older women tell me that Im very good looking. I think it is because Im now looking women in the eye when I talk to them,and now give off a vibe that “I dont care attitude”. I notice things that I havent noticed before like IOIs. Im still a bit unsure of that. If a chick doesnt come right out and tell me she likes my appearance I dont know for sure.Also since Im 45 I may be deluding myself to believe that I am more attractive now than I was in my 20s and 30s.But with game I feel much more attractive than ever.

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      • I’m in your age group as well, and I find that I have women from 20 to 60 checking me out more and more often. I stay in shape with running and weightlifting, and this along with a conscious effort, especially since reading this site, to adopt an attitude of confidence and alpha bearing has improved my marriage and interactions with women in general.

        Also, I think at a certain age you automatically leave behind much of that self-concsiousness you might have had when younger. I think maybe one really begins to internalize this idea that “Hey you’re no better than me. You eat and shit just like everyone else on the planet.”

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    • on September 30, 2011 at 11:04 pm feet on the ground

      Hey Gorbachev,

      We had a good exchange on this site maybe a few months ago or longer, but I’ve been ‘away’ for awhile. Just wondering how it’s going for you with PCG. ?
      I hope it is still going well.

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  3. The fuck, curly red hair is not a deficiency. Kill the ginger self loathing, gingers are so rare in the world in general and ginger women can be hot.

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  4. Amazing read. Though I would not call my self as a 4 or a 5. I too used to place women on a pedestal, being in Pakistan one of the toughest countries to game maybe after Saudia and Afghanistan. The Game helped a lot, so did CH’s Sixteen Commandment of Poon. Would just like to let people know that if game works in Pakistan where in some places even talking to a girl can make cops, take you to the police-station and call your parents. Females living alone on their own is an alien concept. Even mostly after marriage they live with their Husbands in a joint family system. Getting to make girls succumb to their gina tingles and meet a guy, with having the fear of being caught by police and public shaming to it’s extreme is a herculean task. It happens because game works.

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  5. Yeah, a critical, critical point for developing inner game: looks are not destiny; the exact features and build bestowed upon a man by his creator are but a single factor that can be almost totally eclipsed via social skill and dominance.

    Fixating on the inadequacy of one’s physical appearance is a DEAD giveaway of beta-tude.

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  6. Well, in fact, better not to try to get her for a drink. In my opinion, he wasn’t gaming her, but being normal. You need much more to game a girl like the one he depicted.

    Probably she was just being nice, surprised by the fact that her classmate wasn’t a psychopath.

    Yes, maybe she felt a little embarrased because her lack of speech habilities, but in the real world, out of the campus, he is still a freak and she is still a 19-year-old-hottie.

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  7. I really wish there was more material on how a 9 or a 10 as a guy should act arround 10’s to 7’s. Really it’s no fair that so much attention is called to when the women starts out perceiving you as lower than her compared to having to live up to how high she starts out perceiving you

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    • Well, here are a few things…
      1) Set very high standards for yourself. Make it clear you have high standards and be sure to reject women when they aren’t beautiful enough. If you really are a 10 then 8s or 9s should be your minimum standard. 7s just don’t cut it.
      2) Go easy on the negs, when you are better looking or as good looking as she is you don’t need to do it and it is often counter productive.
      3) Be proud of your body to the point of narcissism, one time at the beginning of a conversation the girl told me we had to talk about something important, I eagerly agreed and then immediately acted disappointed when she wanted to talk about a problem she was having. I interrupted with, “Oh, I thought we were going to talk about my beautiful body.” When she finally stopped laughing she thanked me for lifting her spirits.

      Good-looking or not, for guys the most important things are the confidence, the air of indifference and the bemusement.

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    • You poor bastard.

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  8. “Not as curly as mine”

    B===============D

    “It’s not a bug, it’s a feature.”

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  9. The biggest mistake a young man can make is to decide that he doesn’t want to spoil a good experience with a woman, a good ego boost, by actually following up and going for sex, which could result in the ego boost being lost and “reality” settling in. I made that mistake. I wanted to “build my confidence” by having lots of great experiences with women who liked me, but I didn’t want to ruin all that built confidence by trying to go further and possibly getting rejected.

    You should have built your confidence in your childhood. After age 16 there should be no need for a male to get any ego boosts out of non-sexual interactions. It should be a given that women will like you personally and want to be around you.

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  10. “Unbelievably long praise of the woman”

    Take the pussy of the pedestal. It’ll dry out up there.

    Remember Commandment #10.

    “The man who trains his mind to subdue the reward centers of his brain when reflecting upon a beautiful female face will magically transform his interactions with women. His apprehension and self-consciousness will melt away, paving the path for more honest and self-possessed interactions with the objects of his desire. It will help you acquire the right frame of mind to stop using the words hot, cute, gorgeous, or beautiful to describe girls who turn you on. Instead, say to yourself “she’s interesting” or “she might be worth getting to know”. Never compliment a girl on her looks, especially not a girl you aren’t fucking. Turn off that part of your brain that wants to put them on pedestals.”

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    • You don’t have to turn off your feeling of reward when seeing beauty or sexiness. You just have to turn off feeling undeserved of it.

      Appreciation is acceptable, you know.

      Appreciation IS game.

      You can play to a girls vanity, believe it or not. I guess people will try to shush me that such a maneuver is game 501 and not helpful for betas, but you need this theory.

      Her beauty is not a problem. Being attracted and showing it is not a problem. Feeling underserving is the problem.

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  11. “(C)omplimenting beautiful women on their intellectual achievements isn’t as bad as complimenting them on their hair.”

    Advice from the real Casanova of the 18th century:

    If a woman is beautiful, compliment her on her intelligence.

    If a woman is intelligent, compliment her on her beauty.

    If a woman is both intelligent and beautiful, talk about anything except her.

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  12. I think it is important to note that there are likely limits on how much one can overcome your rank or mate value through game. I remember the scene in “Shes Out of my League” in which Stainer remarks that you cannot date someone more than 2 levels away from you, either plus or minus. I think this is probably accurate for dating; perhaps not for flirting, hanging out or possibly a fling, but for LTR it is most likely the case. I think game could perhaps make LTRs more secure in a situation where the man is somewhat lower than the woman, but it cannot bridge a huge gap.

    Think about it. A male 4 and a female 10 in a stable, healthy (key word here), long-term relationship? I think there are definite limits to what game can accomplish…

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    • Yep. I don’t think you would want to do any better than 2 points above your own, though. I think I’m probably in the 6.5-7 range, and I would not be comfortable with an 8.5-9 girlfriend. Would I love to hook up with an 8.5-9? Sure thing. But as the editor so often notes, even marriage is no refuge from the sexual marketplace. An 8.5 – 9 girl has near limitless options and while I’m confident with where i’m at status-wise, there are a lot of higher status men that would be interested in such a girl, as well as a number of better looking men. Maybe its self-handicapping, I don’t know, but a pretty 7.5-8 girl with a personality from a good family would be ideal.

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      • Aren’t you forgetting that an 8.5 girl will probably be a 7.5 woman in another two years? Men should stop worrying about being able to keep someone long term whose SMV will be falling while his rises.

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      • Bingo. And in this context, LTRs just don’t make sense for any man. The longer you are in a relationship, the more strong the pull toward comfortable betatude becomes. The girl tries all kinds of dirty tricks to cultivate your inner beta, so that she can then reject you.

        As your relationship progresses, you need stronger and stronger forms of game, and need to be constantly vigilant about her hamster. Meanwhile, she continually becomes less and less valuable as a mate because her SMV plummets with each passing year.

        So the result is that you are investing more and more, into something that brings steadily diminishing returns, until finally one day you are left with an untenable situation.

        It’s as if your house payment increased by 5% each month, while the value of the house decreased by 5% each month. You end up underwater.

        If women understood anything about this stuff, or about human nature in general, they would know that they need to become nicer, more accommodating, more supplicating, more in shape, more of a good cook, more kinky, with each passing year to counteract their inevitable decline in looks and vivaciousness.

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      • Our grandmothers used to know this stuff.

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      • Maybe Chastity belts need to make a comeback.

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    • on September 30, 2011 at 2:35 pm No One is Out of Your League

      exhibit A:

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      • Quite a discrepancy to the male eye, yes, but women don’t perceive men like Flavio Briatore nearly as physically ugly as they objectively “should.” For women, a man’s status plays directly into his attractiveness, although they can’t put their finger on it. Briatore is unflinchingly confident and he’s loaded. Also, he’s a complete asshole. What more could a girl want?

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      • Salman Rushdie was married to Salman Rushdie.

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      • LOL … edit .. make that, married to Padma Lakshmi

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    • He said 4 for looks. Which, according to our host, doesn’t mean much for guys. Not 4 overall.

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      • Right. I’m a 3 or a 4 and I have several times had love relationships with girls from 7 up to 10.

        A man can absolutely date girls completely out of his league and get them to fall completely in love. Two points is not out of your league. Four is where you begin to stretch yourself. But even 5 and even 6 can be done.

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      • Right. But remember the golden rule: looks is to women as status is to men. And the other golden rule: relationships work best when the woman has better looks and the man has higher status.

        A 4 can date a 10, but he’d damn well better have really high status (as in No One Is Out Of Your League’s photo above — I don’t know who the guy is, but I assume he’s important). A difficulty about being a student is that *no* student has all that much status. You’re still just a student.

        Game? Game enhances perceived status (just like good clothes and makeup enhance perceived beauty). It has limits.

        So in conclusion, I think it’d be very difficult for a male college student with below average looks to have a workable relationship with a female 10.

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      • Right. I’m a 3 or a 4 and I have several times had love relationships with girls from 7 up to 10.

        Yeah, but are not the women your with mostly all South East Asians.

        You being a White guy xsplat automatically gives you a few SMV points over an Asian, especially a South Asian, right off the bat.

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      • I’ve dated some hot chicks in the west as well, but back then I had more trouble keeping them. Was it for lack of game, or because they weren’t Asian? I don’t know – but I do know that I lacked game.

        Yes, it’s true, status is part of dating, and you get a status boost in SE Asia. But you don’t get an infinite boost. If the girls friends are telling her she is crazy and SHOULD be dating better, then you know you are doing it right and stretching.

        If the girls friends are happy with you, it’s because your perceived SMV is “correct” for the girl.

        Dating is more of an international market now, even in road-less coconut villages. Everyone is on a dating website, and everyone has serious western suitors. The hotter chicks also have very rich local suitors. And by rich I don’t mean relative to the locals, I mean relative to global marketplace.

        Girls know what their assets are worth, and her friends know it. But you can get a girl to not know why she loves you, and you can get her to stop listening to her friends. I’ve done exactly that many times.

        People can be shocked at the SMV disparity. You don’t get that just be being white. You very rarely see it. In fact, I’ve never seen it – outside of my own examples.

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      • yeah, but he’s 28 y/o and in college. that’s pretty low on the value scale.

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  13. There are still betas to save and rehabilitate. Do your part! Donate to the Chateau!

    Brought to you by the Shameless Plugs division of Patton and Meeks.

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  14. It’s status über alles. I know that the cad/dad theory dictates that women are attracted to tall-good-looking-muscular-masculine hunks when they’re ovulating, and that they are more likely at any moment to have spine shattering orgasms with them.

    But I suspect that good looks are only a proxy for status. In the beach or in the mall, women have no criteria other than looks to rank the males in their field of view. Therefore the good looking guys score the highest tinglometers.

    In any other social setting, looks are secondary, males compete through other ways. The oustanding males are those who display social intelligence and psychosocial dominance. Looks can help, but it’s status über alles.

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  15. Game does indeed trump looks. What so often confounds the issue is that so many of the good looking guys end up developing a rudimentary form of game and high self esteem from the immediate bright reactions they get from females. A positive feedback loop results, while among the less physically fortunate, they have to get in their practice and become alpha, so to speak, through the school of hard knocks.

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    • Indeed. Though quick success is not without its dangers.

      I have a buddy who looks like he belongs on the cover of the latest pulp romance novel. As you would expect, he cleans up with the ladies and had great success with women early on, further increasing his confidence, etc…

      However, the initial ease with which he scored means he never had to develop tight game. He once advised to make text messages as long as possible so that “she has no room to misinterpret”.

      He was never put through the wringer like many here were. He was never forced to take the red pill and learn the true nature of the beast.

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  16. This one of your best posts. More like this please.

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  17. Re ugliness and attitude

    Serge Gainsbourg, a French musician, was arguably one of the ugliest persons to have ever inhabited the northern hemisphere. Yet he banged Brigitte Bardot, married Jane Birkin and must have fucked french groupies by the millions.
    His secret? Look at these videos (not speaking french will be a problem to realize to what extent his attitude and game were superbly ugliness-trumping, but I will try to give you the gist of the songs in English):

    Here he sings about a woman he could *not* seduce. And still, look at his face and body language. It looks as he doesn´t give a shit, or even as though he was the one who rejected her.
    Another song is the superb “Je suis venu te dire que je m´en vais” = “I came to tell you that I am quitting you” (this should be nº 1 in the list of alpha songs). How often do you find a song about a man quitting a woman and announcing it to her with indifferenca and a whiff of cruelty, like a complete asshole? He also tells her that “tes larmes n´y pourront rien changer” = “your tears won´t change a thing” and says “tu te souviens des jours anciens et tu pleures” = “you remember the old days and you cry”. Watch it here.

    Obviously, his being famous also helped. Other alpha traits were:
    low-pitch voice, used to speak in a laconic fashin, and transgression of all social conventions while being perfectly unapologetic about it. Here is the video where, in a totally drunken state, he tells whitney houston that he “wants to fuck her” in a tv programm (the important parts are in English). The tv-presenter first translates for WH and tells her (lying) that he says she is very beautiful. He hears that and intervenes to make clear that what he really wants is to fuck her, and that he needs no translation. Just look at it and enjoy.

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  18. Please respond

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  19. This makes me wonder:
    What do you think of “Game without seduction”? That is, flirting with and turning chicks on, with no intention of following through and dating/bedding them?
    I think it might be a good thing for beta males: the more women believe that their world is full of eligible alpha males, the less of an advantage any one alpha has.

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    • If your purpose is to help other men, you won’t raise your T.

      Being alpha causes you to raise your T which causes you to become selfish. Being selfish causes you to raise your T.

      A social project of helping betas won’t be attractive.

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    • unless the girl is fat or ugly, i always have my game on. it keeps the sword sharpened, and you never know how that contact might work out for you in the future.

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    • forgot to address the second part of your post:

      no, i don’t game women to help other guys can get laid, i game them for myself. why would i want to give my competition a hand?

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  20. on September 30, 2011 at 9:34 am Wang Dong Young

    As dark and depressing as this blog can be, sometimes it’s posts like this one that will remind you why read this outpost of drear and doom. Here we have a guy that has probably never seen a woman of this caliber naked outside of strip club. He is a guy that is using the spoils of this blog to rescue him from a life of gloom. God Bless Him and God Bless this Blog.

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  21. I actually pitied her, since it seems likely that she’s high achieving and will become a professional lady or something similar that makes her unhappy and prices her out of the marriage market

    Are you serious you can say this straight-faced to a hot 19 year old girl and not loose her? In my experience until the end of college approaches, hot girls remain absolutely certain that they won’t age

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    • I don’t get the impression that he said this to her, but just held this attitude in his mind. Frame control, if you will.

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  22. I’ve repeated this for…15 years: looks don’t matter as much as confidence and having an air of mystery, plus an air of not giving a fuck.

    I was an ugly kid and teenager — I knew this, hell even Dearest Mom knew it. I still dated, and knew pretty early on that I wasn’t going to fall in love with a gal when I was a teenager, so I consider myself lucky. I had zero game, but I also didn’t give a fuck, I just wanted to have fun, plus get my rocks off. During my teen years I dated some of the prettiest gals around, mostly because the better looking guys were either too afraid of pretty broads, or they were so focused on their SATs or whatever.

    In my 20s, it hit me: I’m not a great looking guy. Broken nose, scars, missing 3 teeth from fighting and extreme sports; plus I gained 60# over my high school weight. Guess what I did? I got married. To a real hot piece of ass. Of course that went south, taking my self-esteem along with it.

    Thankfully, I made the decision to not marry again. Once I took on a new frame of reference, the entire “I don’t give a fuck” attitude came back. I lost all the weight, grew my hair out longer, and it all came back.

    I’ve had close guy friends wonder how a guy like me can date the women I date — they’re all significantly more “handsome” than me. They’re tall, they’re rich, they’ve got good genes, etc, but they’re dating (or worse, are married to) fat, bloated, bitchy, Sex & the City watching femme cunts.

    It’s attitude, attitude, attitude. Women want the challenge of what they can’t have or what appears to be above them. Let her frame herself BELOW you, don’t frame yourself ABOVE her.

    Also, my brother ended up on a “Top 11 Hot Chicago Bachelors you need to know” list last week: http://www.refinery29.com/11-hot-chicago-bachelors-you-need-to-meet-now/slideshow?page=10#slide-10 It’s amazing: we have similar features, but he’s the handsome one, plus he’s got 6″ of height on me. Genes CAN matter (he gets way more pussy than I do, but he’s an international touring musician), but in his case, it’s still ATTITUDE. Yeah, women approach him constantly because he’s tall and pretty, but it doesn’t matter if you’re a gorgeous beta schlub.

    Good looks might open more doors, but women won’t walk through if you’re not strong in attitude.

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    • AB–I saw some research somewhere about chicks digging dudes with scars on the face.

      After I read that article, I realized how often chicks had commented on my 2 obvious facial scars. I told the stories about them–truthful ones about how I got them in childhood, so I simply reframed them, emphasising the more masculine aspects of the story.

      As you said, all about attitude.

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      • Let’s see that research. I’ve often considered slashing a line right down my fucking face, maybe over the left eye, as a way to catch the saucier specimens. I mean the angels fear me anyway and I’d tread all over their pristine fucking “diversity”-worshiping selves, so I might as well augment what the rest do find attractive. Killer tattoos and scars may be the one thing to save this “beta schlub”. I’m a total sucker but as an ex-skinhead I retain some “bad boy” appeal. Scumbag chic here I come!!! lolzozozlzlzlzzz

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      • Fuck yea bro. I tell them I was in the Foreign Legion. Then I speak some French to prove myself, talk about armaments and Djibouti (never been! lozlzozlz), and generally fail to close, but I get those numbers!!

        Like


    • I’d like to add to this that some ugly men can find success with a beta opening. The beta bait and switch.

      You don’t have to come across as the short guy with the big attitude.

      There are many flavors of Baskin and Robbins.

      Like


    • Heh. I like Maps & Atlases. You irooni?

      Like


  23. Hell yeah. I have 2 friends that score women like chicks owe their asses to them. They are both ugly as fuck. I kid you not, one of them is almost disgusting. But this ugly guy scores vags like a rockstar, I kid you not.

    Their framework: they can’t even begin to imagine how a girl would NOT want their cocks inside of her. Really, it’s like their brains have been reprogrammed.

    And in truth, they have. Once you start practicing the dark arts, and noticing just how fun it is to claim victory after victory, seeing girls drool over you and commenting, to others, while drunk, how they want to bed you… this shit reprograms your mind, alright.

    Like


  24. The opposite is also true — a good looking guy with bad word game can completely fuck up a situation where a girl was already down for him based on looks and vibe alone. I’ve been in this situation so many times. Girls have told me straight up that if I basically learned to just shut the fuck up when appropriate and not say stupid shit I would be perfect.

    Like


  25. on September 30, 2011 at 10:17 am greatbooksformen GBFM

    lzozozozlzl

    roissysys i mean heartiste hearttistsettsts!!!!!

    you gottas wirte a post on this book which made me go lzozlzlzo

    http://www.amazon.com/Erotic-Capital-Attraction-Boardroom-ebook/dp/B005I58WAW/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1317392164&sr=8-2

    Erotic Capital: The Power of Attraction in the Boardroom and the Bedroom

    Product Description
    In 2010, pioneering sociologist Catherine Hakim shocked the world with a provocative new theory: In addition to the three recognized personal assets (economic, cultural, and social capital), each individual has a fourth asset—erotic capital—that he or she can, and should, use to advance within society.
    In this bold and controversial book, Hakim explores the applications and significance of erotic capital, challenging the disapproval meted out to women and men who use sex appeal to get ahead in life. Social scientists have paid little serious attention to these modes of personal empowerment, despite overwhelming evidence of their importance. In Erotic Capital, Hakim marshals a trove of research to show that rather than degrading those who employ it, erotic capital represents a powerful and potentially equalizing tool—one that we scorn only to our own detriment.

    See all Editorial Reviews

    IMAGINE THAT!!!

    imagine women sucking and fiucking their way on up the corproater laders lzozllz

    who woulda thunk!!!??!?!

    thakk gods for brillaiants womenz at the london shcool of eocnomsiscs lzozlzl

    Like


  26. He’ll never bang her.

    And how’s he gonna ask her out to drinks if she’s 19?

    Like


    • An alpha, of course, would know a bar that would let her breeze by.

      lolzozlozzozlzllzzlzz

      I say this as a beta with even paltrier EROTIC KAPITAL than “red”.

      This is a NO-BANGER. klozlzlzlz

      Like


  27. Man, I have this same skin picking problem. It’s terrible. I’m getting rid of it by taking Accutane. If you don’t want to go so far, at least do a search for “skin picking” on google, there are some interesting advice.

    Like


  28. You’re doing fine, anonymous reader.

    “an image I’ve embraced and cultivated like she has being beautiful and smart”

    …not so sure about this one. She shows clear signs of lacking confidence in herself. Push those buttons!

    Like


  29. I’m not questioning the value of game here, but I think looks still trump. Let me be more specific: looks on average equal social status moreso than a man’s personality characteristics. Certainly unattractive famous men are going to pull top shelf women. Even locally popular men of average looks are going to punch above their weight class (local tv weather man or high school sports coach).

    But for the 98% of non-celebrity men out there looking to make a good impression on women, base looks go a LONG way. Height, degree of physical shape, good hair/skin. A good looking man gets a number of “second chances” with women that an average looking man does not.

    I live in a college town with a lot of young couples, and its amazing how many good looking young women are around. But ehy almost always have good looking male companions with them, and when you actually talk to these guys, they are really beta. But because he fits the socially-accepted bill as far as height, weight, looks, the cute girl still drags him around with her.

    Like


    • The ones they marry are often different from the ones they screw. Particularly the ones they screw while married.

      Like


  30. I guess I have to say this…”first?”

    Anyway, this post is very interesting to me. When I first started reading about game, I always wondered if it was only for “normal” guys. I myself have a body wrecked by childhood cancer, legs stunted and a right arm of a 7 year old stunted by radiation (I’m 40 now.)

    I look like an overgrown dwarf, height 5’7. Yet, I never heard of a “cripple game or game for the deformed. I always thought my inability to form a relationship (I’ve never even had a second date with a woman) was because of my body.Now, learning game has helped me realize that there may be more to this than I’ve always assumed. But, how effective is game for the physically challenged?

    Like


    • Phillyastro,

      Check out this link:

      http://approachanxiety.com/2011/07/the-reason-you-cant-succeed-with-women/

      It’s about a guy who’s a quadriplegic in a wheelchair and does well with women, based on positive attitude, winsome charm, and powerful eye contact.

      Like


    • Don’t get your hopes up, man. Look at the bright side — ‘least your cock appears HUGE when cradled in the baby hand.

      Like


    • Pirate a copy of David D’s cocky comedy series. He brings several speakers on for the second half and most of the time is from a motivational speaker who sounds like a frog (I’ve only heard the audio) who is a cripple in a wheelchair.

      He talks about his good experiences in the club and bedroom. Pretty sure he runs a business using his life as inspiration for others. You might get something out of it.

      You probably need to be friendly and disarming + something else to let people know you don’t want pity.

      Like


    • Lord Byron had a club foot and just didn’t give a fuck. He sailed on seas of pussy juice his whole short life.

      Like


  31. on September 30, 2011 at 12:07 pm Charlesz Martel

    “Like others before him who have trod the same path of game knowledge, he almost cannot believe the girl’s reaction he sees with his own eyes.”

    I have mentioned this before as well when it happened to me. The entire experience seems surreal when it first happens. I remember thinking, ” I can’t believe what I’m seeing/hearing!” And yet there she was, head bowed, looking extremely submissive, apologizing/explaining her actions. Absolutely a female posture of total submission.

    Quite a beautiful thing, actually!

    Like


  32. 28 years is young; you’ve lots of time and opportunity to bag young ones. But how about those of us who are, say, twice that age? So far my approach is what the Master recommends: casual aloofness and DHV – which is actually pretty easy once you get past beta insecurity ’cause we older professional guys are pretty high value. But age is going to be my highest hurdle when angling for mid-twenties / low thirties (my target group). So how much, and what, does it take to compensate for age?

    Like


    • Visit nightclubs in SE Asia. You’ll be treated like you belong there. Even at age segregated clubs, you’ll be welcomed as one of the crowd.

      That will change your mindset.

      Like all brain wiring, it’s all down to habit.

      Like


    • getting in shape is #1. old dudes can still be “hot” to young women (you wouldn’t believe the shit they say), but not if they’re chubby, hunched over and wearing crappy clothes. Don’t try to dress young, but don’t look “stuffy”. Confidence is obviously key, if you can believably act like you often get younger women, then you can get them.

      Like


  33. Man, I wish we could comment on your tweets. That photo of the pregnant 50 year old was as repulsive to me as a photo of two men kissing. A culture cannot survive that is so at odds with biological realities…The uneducated mexican girls that reproduce between the ages of 16-30 are going to overtake us. Its just a matter of time and numbers.

    Like


  34. The letter-sender wrote, “No real alpha would lower himself to leading a group project.” In general, this is true for the jock alphas. But there’s a whole slew of smart alphas – these are the guys who become MDs on Wall Street and Chief of Staff in DC.

    So, while you’re still in school where it’s not cool to be smart, it’s acceptable to lead an class group.

    Self-recognition is half the battle, but don’t discredit your own internal motivations for excelling in school.

    Like


  35. Have you heard about Ashton Kutcher? While supposedly in love with a dried up cougar, he’s been sleeping with a hot young thing.

    Like


  36. Excellent! Those reader emails and your responses really add to the blog.

    The emailer has a good sense of himself. That’s an alpha trait, right there.

    Like


    • I say he’s too smart to retain his beta traits for long.

      Women do value intelligence, and he values getting laid. Life will compel him towards his righteous position.

      Like


    • Good sense of self? If perpetual self loathing is a good sense of self, sure.

      I truely doubt anyone would write about themselves like that. In my experiance in coaching guys, no1 ever rates themselves below a 5, and rarely would someone goto that length to describe thier physical shortcomings.

      thin, but doughy….
      I have some small scabs on my arms
      I recently grew a beard to hide my weak chin.

      most guys in this situation would describe themselves as

      5 lbs to lose
      slight case of eczema
      pretty cool beard

      rarely does a person have that sort of mental acuity to remove themselves from thier situation to observe thier physical shortcomings

      Like


  37. Good luck to the reader on his journey in fucking the hot 10 (even if she was probably more like an 8, and I’m surprised the host didn’t mention to tone down the pedestalization).

    In that an average-looking guy with tight game will do better than a good-looking guy with no game, game does trump looks. Good-looks are something that can help or hurt..

    In game, what does looking good really get you?

    A minute, maybe a minute and a half more audition time when you approach women. Most of the benefits of being good-looking actually occur outside of the sexual market.

    A good-looking guy with game is deadly; a guy that can almost completely skip over trying to get a girl attracted to him (possibly the hardest thing in rudimentary game) is going to fuck a lot of chicks if he knows what to say, how to say it and how to not fuck it up. A good-looking guy that never learned game is just a good-looking guy with no game.

    Like


  38. I got a question for you on looks. What are your thoughts on glasses? Are they a killer for the 90% of glass wearing men who don’t look better with them than without them? This is a big concern for me because I’m not sure how much my glasses are hurting me because I believe I project a nerdy image with them.

    [Heartiste: A stylish pair of glasses can make a man look more attractive. If you think it’s an issue, go contacts.]

    Like


    • Do you have a gay neighborhood in your closest urban town?

      If so, go there and buy a pair of glasses from a gay dude. Then go to the gay barbershop and get your hair cut. Then go to the gay shirt store and have them put you in something that works with your glasses and haircut.

      They’ll know you’re not gay, just that you have good taste about yourself.

      Problem: solved.

      Like


      • That’s what I used to think. Bought a very expensive pair of frames. Then saw a buddy who wears Vietnam War-era military frames (about the nerdest look you can imaging) charming the hell out of women and realized that it just doesn’t matter.

        Now, if you don’t have a good attitude then women may claim superficial reasons why they reject you (I didn’t like his car, I didn’t like his clothes, I didn’t like his glasses, I didn’t like his job, etc.) but in reality those things aren’t the real reason why women make choices.

        Now, if it does bother you then going for contacts may be better. Then you won’t worry about that one item. But chances are if you still have that attitude then even if you “fix” that one item there will be something else you are insecure about and your apprehension about it will become a female repellant.

        Most women turn a man down by his actions. Not by looks.

        Like


      • Years ago I went to a barbershop and the dude pulled out some kind of strap on hand vibrators and massaged my scalp. Disturbing I tell you what. Another time when I was married my wife tole me about some guy who “was really good”. So I went there to get a haircut. Dude was queer as a 3 dollar bill. Was bubbly and excited to work on me. Came out of their looking like a French Poodle. And you’re suggesting going to FudgeTown for fashion consulting? Try “Dress for Success” by John Malloy and “Color for Men”.

        Like


      • After you get the glasses and haircut and shirt,

        Go ot the gay bar and get yourself a gay boyfriend.

        you’ll know your not gay, just that you have a good taste of what semen is like.

        hahaha in all seriousness however, gay men do have a better sense of style than most straight men.

        Like


    • If you worry about them they will be a killer. If you don’t, they won’t. In my experience if you are older they seem to help if anything.

      Like


    • Watch American Psycho. He wears non prescription glasses.

      Like


    • Ditch the fucking glasses. They project a nerdy beta provider vibe. My life changed after lasik. It’s too hard to find stylish ones that won’t hurt your chances. The most attractive chicks are usually turned off by glasses, except if you have a super tight game. Go lasik or contacts.

      Like


    • Is your prescription bad enough that it alters how your eyes look when you have glasses on (eg: makes your eyes look really tiny or really big or two different sizes)? If so, go for contacts. If not, stick with the glasses because projecting that stereotypical “intellectual” look can actually work in your favour.

      But again, as the post says, a man with sufficient game can overcome even the most severe aesthetic handicaps. I’m talking middle-aged, mostly blind, slightly facially disfigured, overweight male who has such a way with words that women can’t help but flutter and blush and giggle whenever they’re around him.

      Like


  39. on September 30, 2011 at 2:12 pm So, Do the Zonk

    This guy just needs to man up and believe that the guy who played that girl is, really, him. He just has to decide to be that guy all the time.

    Red, she is yours. Make it happen.

    Like


  40. Interesting reading.

    One thing that this about-to-become-an-ex-beta has his age. Hypergamously speaking, being older than the girl is a plus.

    Like


    • not particularly. 28 year old in college setting. some girls might be intrigued, others might be creeped out.

      some schools are more open to older students, but in others a guy this old would stick out like a red thumb with scabs on his arms and a weak chin.

      Like


  41. A man can talk away his ugly face. A woman cannot.

    Actually, they can; they “just” have to be feminine (good perfum, smiling, etc).

    It’s not the same as man, obviouly, but there are feminine traits that can make a man overlook a woman’s look if he is looking for LTR or marriage..

    Let me give an example: there are two women where I work who are miles away from being hot. Both are over 30 and aging fast. (One of them, in her prime, was probably something close to a 8.)

    However, because they are so feminine in their ways, they become more atractive than they really are.

    So if aging women can do this, 18-27 girls can too.

    Like


    • A woman’s SMV is her looks +- 1.5.

      For a man, it’s more like looks +-5. Perhaps even more in the case of great wealth or fame.

      Which also explains why hot women can get away with being complete bitches, while even the best looking guys need at least some semblance of social skills.

      Like


      • Sounds fair. But depends if you are weighting for long or short term. Some girls really work it, and can add more than 1.5 to their value.

        There is nothing like a previously fat chick working it hard like an ugly girl. A girl working as hard as she possibly can to gain value can add 2 or 3 points and get a guy to keep her over a smoking hot babe.

        Like


      • Cleopatra was not considered a physically attractive woman at all. Yet she could attract some of the most powerful men in the world. I would give female “game” more like a +/- 3 compared to a man’s +/- 5. Keeping one self in shape and not acting like the stereotypical western female means a LOT to most western men.

        Like


  42. The writer is 28. And he’s talking about “his chances for grad school”? A word of advice: don’t do it. It’s a bad move for just about anyone these days, but even worse when you’re already in your late 20s (unless you’re sitting on a pile of money and you’re just looking for a way to pass the time).

    Here are 100 reasons NOT to go to grad school:
    http://100rsns.blogspot.com/

    For one thing, there is nothing alpha about it. You’ll be a lot better off doing something that raises your value on the market, like getting a job that offers a path to responsibility (and respect).

    Like


    • Yeah. If you want to teach at the university level in a STEM field go to grad school right after college and knock out a doctorate, then avoid the post-doc trap and get a faculty position at a teaching college as soon as you can. Don’t knock it – it’s a good life. And you’re surrounded by young folks all day, which is refreshing even if you consider them off limits (as I do). But it’s definitely not for everyone. Note – if you want to teach in a non-STEM field find a really good friend to beat some sense into you and go do something worthwhile instead.

      Like


  43. Here’s a thing the Chatuea readers might be able to help me fix. I don’t close as much as I should and when it comes to sex I completely back out. Part of the reason being my upper arms and back have a Psoriasis like condition called Keratosis Pilaris. I am just too concerned that women are going to be judging my skin that night or the next day that it prevents me to have an intimate relationship with the girl that I like. Even after consulting with dermatologists I was told that the condition can be minimized and not completely eradicated. Do you guys have any ideas to help me re-program or look at this differently? Any direction is appreciated.

    Like


    • Keratosis Pilaris can be treated long term and even “cured” — don’t listen to dermatologists who are generally a bunch of pill-pushing and cancer-removing assholes.

      http://huntgatherlove.com/content/keratosis-pilaris-cured

      Otherwise, just ignore it. If they ask, tell them it’s a skin disorder and amplify in a different direction.

      I’m missing teeth but it doesn’t affect my dating life one bit. I’ve got a huge nose, a big underbite, scars on my face — I don’t even think about them. One time a gal said “you know, you can get your front tooth replaced” to which I said “Oh, you’re so pretty, aren’t you?” Redirect if you’re uncomfortable into something you are comfortable.

      Like


      • Well shoot, man, if I’ve got a choice between believing a bunch of dermatologists or some guy’s blog on the internet…. I guess I’m going with some guy’s blog!

        On O-face’s original question, I’ve never heard of that particular condition, but I looked it up and… ehh, it doesn’t look that bad. I wouldn’t let it hold me back from doing anything. We all have our imperfections. Be happy you’re not cancer guy upthread with the arm of a seven-year-old.

        Like


      • I noticed that you, like me, live in Chicago. Where abouts? I take all my dates to Viagras triangle or by Damen and North. Women in Chi are so friendly and grounded compared to NYC or So-cal

        Like


      • I have offices all over town and the burbs, but my public address is at Halsted and Cermak on the South Side (Pilsen). I’m probably way older than you, too, and I have a ton of great haunts.

        Like


    • Uhmm…these are ALPHA’S. No,I dont think theyre gonna help. Sorry. heh heh.

      Like


      • Ya, I get it.

        Still, there is something wrong with your motivation in flirting if it is to help OTHER guys get laid.

        I know many say that a man should not project neediness. But I say that a man SHOULD project horniness.

        Your mission is the mission of a man.

        Like


    • I don’t know how helpful this is, but if I were in your position, I’d want what we all want – a woman who looked up to me. If I felt I had low SMP value, I’d find a girl with similar or below value who got my dick hard. Either older, or a butterface, or some socially awkward chick. Someone who I felt was getting a deal being around me.

      Liked by 1 person


      • Trouble there is the low-SMP girl will actually fear dating up and often avoid the prospect. It works both ways.

        Like


      • That’s one reason why most people date within a narrow range near their SMV.

        Game can break through that range.

        But for a guy with low confidence, it’s easier to date down than up. And that’s a start.

        Like


      • I totally see what you are saying, but then I always tend to compare myself with peers/friends who are pulling HBs and so the logical side of my brain is not willing to settle for anything lower. Infact, my game is way tighter than most guys around me, I just don’t want to take my shirt off during sex.

        I went though a phase where I only went for one night stands. Why? Because I knew I wouldn’t see the girl the next time, so I wasn’t concerned about how she perceived my skin. It was a very subconscious move on my part I never realized it til I started putting some thought about my actions, my friends thought I was a player but in truth I crave a relationship and fear how women judge.

        Like


    • Read the comments above about glasses. Women generally use physical issues as an excuse after they’ve made their mind based upon your actions. If they are attracted they will overlook almost anything. If they are not attracted they will look for almost anything to put the blame on you rather than themselves.

      Like


    • This isn’t a big deal. Loads of folks have skin conditions- doesnt condemn them to a life of involuntary celibacy.

      Just game girls. They’ll judge you on your status, not skin

      Like


  44. I think you meant to quote Archimedes, not Voltaire.

    Like


    • “Give me a long enough lever (my salami), and I will move the Earth.”

      We’re moving it, baby. I know you can feel it.

      Like


    • The Voltaire quote is apocryphal, near as I can tell. Does anybody have a source? A google search shows it was made up (or misattributed) by a PUA marketer.

      Like


  45. Can’t date above/below 2 points on the attractiveness scale? Ladies and Gentlemen ,I give you Rick Ocasek. Or perhaps Mick Jagger. Or Lyle Lovett.

    For men, power/status/image can trump looks, on the mate/sex market. For women, not so much.

    What do they say, compliment a pretty woman on her mind and a plain one on her looks? Does that approach actually work?

    Like


    • whiskey,

      “What do they say, compliment a pretty woman on her mind and a plain one on her looks? Does that approach actually work?”

      I’m very average looking but complimenting my looks doesn’t work with me. It’s creepy. However, negs totally work. Complimenting my intellect is repulsive as well. Guys who treat me like I’m stupid are much hotter (if they are not too stupid themselves of course!).

      Like


    • What do they say, compliment a pretty woman on her mind and a plain one on her looks? Does that approach actually work?

      Great question Whiskey.

      Like


    • Dude mick jagger?

      c’mon.

      obviously sexual market value doesn’t have the same caculations for legendary rock stars.

      Like


  46. I have a question. Just how much will game compensate for in terms of race? I’m Asian, so there is obviously a disadvantage there when trying to date outside your race (it doesn’t help that I vehemently refuse to date Asian girls).

    Like


    • it might be a disadvantage, but it’s like any other (e.g. shortness, ugliness)….you make up for it by upping your game.

      a buddy of mine is asian and he gets hot women throwing their pussies at him left and right.

      but the one thing that will fuck up your game is being down on yourself. your lack of confidence will be reflected in your words and your body language. chicks will pick up on this.

      Like


    • Erik,

      Google Asian Playboy and see if you can find some material from him. He’s a short asian dude and has solid game. Actually met him and learned some good shit.

      Like


    • So long as those Asian girls are truly Asian and not westernized bananagrrls, pass ’em on over.

      Like


    • yup, i have a chinese buddy who has a harem of attractive young european chicks around him because he has the qualities talked about often in this blog – good body language, tone, confident, relaxed, enjoying himself and not really giving a fuck. and they love it. he outshines most other guys i know of other races, i wouldn’t say he is particularly handsome but he dresses well, good physique, cool haircut & shoes etc.

      another friend is a very good looking white guy, model-like features and well built. he gets a lot of women checking him out in the street/bars/clubs etc. but as soon as he opens his mouth the pussy drys out like you would not believe, he has trouble scoring fat 4’s even because his frame is always one of frantic persuasion rather than aloof disinterest.

      none of the above makes sense when seen from a male perspective – we’re so preoccupied with a girls looks that we we assume they’re equally preoccupied with a mans looks when in fact she’s attracted to a mans prestige/power/ mystique etc., which is codified in all of his behaviours – game essentially.

      game trumps looks, amen to that

      Like


    • on October 2, 2011 at 12:11 am biffmeatstick

      Why do you refuse to date Asian (Oriental?) girls?

      Like


    • on October 4, 2011 at 1:07 pm The Chrome Microphone

      Check SimplePickup’s YouTube channel

      The lead guy is Vietnamese I think and he has balls of steel

      Johnny Wolf from the ABCs of Attraction is Asian too

      He seems to have rearranged his entire life around getting laid though

      Kinda scary, I wouldn’t want to go that far down the rabbit jole

      Like


  47. Coffee.

    Beta hamster still running in the wrong direction. Might as well ask her for a job interview.

    Booze or nothing.

    Like


    • Funny, I ask all girls if they want to go for coffee first. If I think it goes ok (and I like them), then I’ll ask them out for a drink.

      Althiugh I guess betas who can’t kiss a girl whilst soba should avoid coffee.

      Like


    • Unless neither of them are of legal drinking age.

      Like


    • I doubt the reader is alpha enough to get a 19 year old in a bar. I also doubt he’s alpha enough to fly her to a civilized country where the drinking age is lower than 21.

      Like


  48. I’ll wager the girl was no more than an 8. Me thinks the author got a little bit excited an attractive girl was talking to him.

    But if it was a ten……..pics please!!!!!!

    Like


  49. on September 30, 2011 at 4:54 pm Chris from Dublin

    Superb.

    I’m a fag and I recall ur previous post about how chicks dig fags.

    Last night I was chatting to a 40 woman and her friend appeared, same age, in an expensive looking b&w striped top. I said to the friend, LOVE the outfit.

    She: thanks
    Me: were you planning mingling with the zebras at Dublin Zoo?

    She: this is a very expensive outfit

    Me: yes

    I then blanked her and mattered away with her fat, blowsy friend.
    Mssss Zebra spent the rest of the time staring directly at me.

    CHICKS DIG FAGS and it’s because:
    – we’re aloof and supercilious
    – we have that snappy game they love

    Mr. 28yr old with red curls and glasses is grasping that … !

    Like


  50. I think the e-mailer suffers from a slight case of beginner’s luck. He notices she’s a ten for the first time? So he didn’t notice before? Did he fuck her? No. Did he make out with her? No. They enjoyed each other’s company. Maybe that’s an important step up, but it doesn’t really mean anything. A better test would be to see how he behaves in the presence of the alpha-male (who was out doing better things).

    Not all smart, attractive women are complete, irredeemable bitches, geez. Many go along to get along. Some women have bubbly personalities, and they’re just handsy. Then they wonder why/how guys could possibly get the wrong impression — “I was just being friendly.” Again, it would be instructive how she behaves around other group members.

    For men height matters almost as much as anything. It’s better to be an average 6’2″ than an extremely good looking and fit 5’4″.

    The man’s job is to make her feel secure, and she feels more secure buried in the chest of a taller guy. Shorter guys need to compensate in some other way, and to an extreme degree if the goal is to have a long-term relationship with a 9 or 10. Be famous, rich, or so charming that you become rich and famous.

    Like


    • Man as much as I’d like to agree with your assessment, I can’t.

      I am over 6′ 1″. I have a pretty good looking face.

      In my beta days I was always getting passed over for uglier, shorter dudes with attitude and game.

      In fact the first girl I really fell hard for was stolen away from me by a little fucker a foot shorter than me. He was even shorter than she was!

      Plenty of girls have dumped me even though I was tall and better looking than they were.

      I agree with the others – being tall or good looking will get you more auditions, but you are still toast the instant some beta shit comes out of your mouth or body language.

      Like


  51. It’s interesting that you suggest that he should invite her out for alcoholic beverages, and not coffee, implying that drinking alcohol is a high value trait.

    To my knowledge, nobody in the seduction community has ever examined the effect of choosing whether or not to drink alcohol on attractiveness to women. I wonder if declining to drink alcohol would be a negative trait.

    Like


  52. I wrote this letter. To the people saying that I’m still a beta and probably won’t have the balls to ask her out: I take that as a personal challenge. Thanks for calling me on my hesitant shit; encouragement helps but a good man needs detractors to spur him to action. Did I do so immediately, the next time I saw her? No. But I had a reason.

    So I was on campus the other day and witnessed the following exchange between a beta and a woman he probably wants to fuck: the girl, a slim Asian 6.5, is walking away with the dude’s keys due to some earlier mixup I hadn’t borne witness to. So the guy starts chasing her from 30m away and yelling her name. She doesn’t respond until he actually has hands on her, although she must have heard him calling her name before.

    He chides her for taking his keys and making him run after her. Then comes the shit test: she tells him he could use the exercise. The guy is dumbstruck and holds his gut, ashamed. He’s not a bad looking fellow, but if she were going to pick out a feature of his to target she certainly picked the right one. He starts walking away but, realizing he’s been owned, turns back and tries to patch things up. He whines after her, loud enough for everyone in the quad to hear, “You’re MEAN to me!” Wow. The girl holds him in contempt from what were surely many prior instances of weakness, but I wondered: what did he do wrong in this exact instance? If I got shit tested so incisively, what should I say?

    If we’re being honest I would have failed the shit test if it were directed at me. Learning Game is a slow process, fraught with failure, and I’ve failed most of the shit tests put to me thusfar. But when you know what a shit test is, you become capable of recognizing them. First I realized I was shit tested two hours ago, on reflection. Then I realize ten minutes afterwards that I was tested. Then I realize two minutes later. Then you realize it that very instance, but can’t think of anything to say.

    I decided his first sin was running after her. He wanted his keys back but didn’t think about how weak that made him look. If she had a cellphone he could have called her and demanded she come back to him. Or, worst case, just let the keys go for now and try to make her feel bad about being a ditz.

    So after the presentation in class me and the 10 (if I’m pedastalizing she is a 9.5 at worst–I don’t think I am, since I am at university and see hundreds of attractive young women every day) chatted briefly and started to head out side-by-side. Unfortunately due to the idiotic layout of the classroom I had to take a much longer route out, leaving me significantly behind her. I could catch up to her, but then I remembered the Asian fellow. Catching up to a girl, trying to hail her from behind and stop her…there are probably elegant ways to do it (PUAs seem to have every situation figured out), but I couldn’t think of any at the time. Maybe I could have just called her name and motioned her over to me. Anyway, next time I’ll sit elsewhere and make sure I’m out of the classroom first.

    Oneitis? No. But details matter in any endeavor, right? If we weren’t breaking them down we wouldn’t be men. Anyway, regardless of whether this particular situation resolves itself in a mutually climactic manner, I have another one on the hook. Solid 7, artsy, truly impressive tits. Am I trying to become a pua here? Not really, but I want women to be attracted to me and have a good time when they’re around me. That means I need Game.

    Anyway, you’ve all had lots of great advice, encouragement, and just the right amount of skepticism to really make my day. Keep rocking.

    Like


    • Go for the impressive tits, man. Go for the impressive tits.

      Like


    • Ha. My mind goes straight to ethnic humor, Ace. I’d probably slide into something harsh like, “That’s clever fortune-cookie wisdom you got there. Do you have my lucky numbers too?” “Hey, why are you trying to Pearl Harbor my keys?” It wouldn’t be effective in the slightest, but it would amuse me, and what would I care, I don’t much dig on Oriental sweet-n-sour kung-pow pussy.

      That’s what PC campuses need today anyway, a big fuck-you dose of truth to power. We are so officially sensitive that a top-rate, idol-smashing comedian should be having a field day with this stuff. Universities are so stocked wall-to-wall with whispering light-loafered tiptoeing half-a-fags that a bold declaration of indifference to the prevailing shibboleths might nudge a few of the tighter panties loose.

      Hatred is a powerful tool, and how easy it is to inspire hate these days by just speaking truth. We all know that a woman who gets red-faced and frothy over how much she hates you can slip into a different kind of passion, dangerously easy. The brain doesn’t make a fine distinction between what it hates and what it loves. It’s all gushing energy, outwardly directed.

      If the key thief was someone I was interested in, I’d go without for a few days until I ran into her again. Then the possibilities would be endless. Running after her like a puppy after his master — rather than a cheetah after his dinner — is so undignified he should have been gunned down in the quad by a latter-day Gary Chapman in the tower.

      Like


    • As for your 10 …. PUA’s don’t actually “have every situation figured out,” but you’re right to say they seem to. Seem = is for the PUA’s purposes. Adjust the behavior no matter how awkward you feel about it, and the right feelings will follow. PUA’s have adopted this Catholic theological concept but call it “fake it till you make it.” Or if you prefer it translated into The Wire dogma, “Dress the part, be the part” (Proposition Joe).

      Stop plotting out your escape routes from class or dreaming up contrived meet-cute situations. They all cannot but fail. You are greasing the pooch’s asshole too hard. Eliminate Your Desire (Tao of Steve, Precept One). Once you stop desiring her so much — and one good way is by leveraging your hairy-armed emo seven to the hilt — Lil Miss Ten will begin to circle you, if not outright pursue. To trigger her pursuit requires T of S Precept Two: Be Excellent in Her Presence. You’ve already done that with the speechifying, but you wasted that opportunity. There will be plenty more opportunity in a campus setting.

      You don’t have oneitis so much as you are giving one girl undue attention, even though your attention is private and self-contained. Your chips are all on one roulette square, and it’s a long-shot square at that. She owns too much of your thoughts. This is a hard thing for men to overcome, since we naturally want our thoughts to be dominated by the hottest of women. But by indulging them, rather than mastering them shaolin monk-style, sends off stinky beta signals that will render you invisible again (Yes, even with your ginger hair lighting up the campus like a road flare).

      “But details matter in any endeavor, right? If we weren’t breaking them down we wouldn’t be men.” Hell yes, and it is more encouraging to see a smart, humble After Action Report like this from a college student than an unanalyzed boast-post would have been. Lucking into a score is a temporary and fleeting victory. Executing a long-term strategy makes for a lasting win. You are learning and improving. It won’t be long for you now, once you find out progress is even easier than you think.

      Like


      • Just looked up “oneitis.” Ace employed it correctly and I misunderstood it. I thought it was the girlish fantasy of One Soulmate for everybody. I’m not polished on game lingo. A billion insincere apologies, effendi.

        Like


  53. If you’re a red head you should seriously consider dye — with tinting towards a DEEPER darker red.

    It will still go with your skin tones — but deep dark red pulls poon like you can’t imagine.

    IIRC that color is one of the most requested — by women.

    Deep auburn makes you look much more manly — because red heads darken with age — always.

    As for the glasses — go with soft contacts and perhaps Lasik. Both are getting amazingly cheap.

    As for style: purchase prescription sunglasses. The effect is magic. Just make sure they are cool.

    Like


  54. Wow, noticed a few guys posting here how he’ll “never bang her”, “you cant date that far out of your league”, “game can only help so much”. Some still don’t believe I guess.

    Like


  55. http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Brooklyn-Sex-Attacks-Skirts-Women-NYPD-130863828.html

    NYPD Warns Women About Skirts in Brooklyn Sex Attack Probe

    “I think that women should be able to wear whatever they want,” said Theresa Troupson, a Park Slope resident. “I don’t think that they should be held responsible in any way for the actions of criminals.”

    Like


  56. Leading a group of people is not being the Alpha?

    Ok then.

    Like


    • on October 5, 2011 at 2:24 am The Chrome Microphone

      Exactly…

      You describe yourself as an omega; at least be a situational alpha and practise ordering fuckers around

      Like


  57. Sometimes I like to throw acid on my countenance like Two-Face and test my skills. that, and a large, fake humpback with a set of crutches do wonders to improve your game and prove that looks don’t matter.

    Bonus: no one believes a rape charge against disfigured humpback who can’t walk.

    Like


  58. Heartiste, how does this fit in for an average looking black guy looking to date out of his race? Should I try to ramp up the game? Most advice says to tone down “being black” ie: natural black guy game. But then I listened to a well known black PUA Guru who mentioned that a white chick wants a “black”, if she wanted “white”, she would have dated a white guy.

    Like


    • Depends on the white girl you want.

      If you want a ghetto queen—i.e. some “anti-racist” white girl who’s slutty and tubby and who’s just dating you for excuses to talk ghetto without being laughed at, sure, be the ghetto stereotype. How’s that working for most brothas in the ghetto?

      However, the majority of non-black girls don’t like it, because its uncivilized, rude, and violent. Acting like just a normal guy will make the non-black girls more willing to accept you—i.e. if you’re willing to accept the group norms, the group will accept you. If you just have normal game, you’ll get a wider berth of non-black girls who are sufficiently p.c. to have a black boyfriend who acts like a hipster/grunge guy.

      The black guys I know who get non-black women regularly are just guys who happen to be black. If your race defines you—i.e. if you took away your blackness, you’d have absolutely no personality—you’re just a stepin fetchit. And all you’ll get is girls who go for stepin fetchits. Most non-black girls don’t go for it.

      Like


  59. OK, so this guy learned something, good for him, good for game. But here is what bugged me from his piece:

    “When I walk through the door I notice, potentially for the first time, that she is a fucking ten if there ever was one. 19 yrs, tight, flawless skin with just enough tan, full c breasts, beautiful symmetrical exotic features that sing, and the kind of wavy brunette hair that any girl outside of a pantene spot would literally kill for. “

    Yeah, she looks great dressed. But this seems to be a common error among guys who have little experience with females: describing them as a collection of visible body parts. But here’s a question: what kind of physical condition is she in? There are a lot of average looking women who are in great shape with firm bodies; while a lot of “10s” are sagging wrecks underneath the makeup and pushup underwear.

    And then we might get into the nitty gritty. For example: what does she do with her public hair? Is it trim? Well shampooed? Or of the consistency of a front lawn which has not been mowed since last Halley’s Comet?

    And we are not even looking at other things which might make a difference with her: STDs, children, in a recovery program, et alia.

    Like


  60. In high school and college, I was friends with a guy who is 5 foot 5, covered in moles, and cursed with a horseface. He’s horrendous. Yet he’s the kingshit alpha of the group. Before I took on game seriously, he was getting the most ass out of any of us, and I was friends with college athletes, wrestlers, generally accepted good looking guys. He was racking up the best numbers. We had a system where we’d all rate the girl on a scale of 1-10, and add that number to your “score” (bang two 7s, your score is 14). By graduation, he had us all beat by double digits. Right now he’s married to a girl who has at least 3 points on him, and she does everything for him. If he had followed my path and gone for the glory instead of the wife and kids… I’m positive he’d still have me beat.

    Like


  61. Everyone talks about whether a girl is a model or not. No one talks about whether a man is a model or not.

    Male models get girls hitting on them, and only male models get girls hitting on them. Male models get lots more opportunities to make their pitch than regular guys. But five minutes into their pitch, the difference between a male model and some old fat guy is not so very great.

    If they do substantially better than regular guys, it is largely because they get more opportunities to practice chatting up girls than regular guys do. it is easier for them to break the ice, and often the girl will break the ice for them, but then the girl starts throwing additional tests at them same as she would for anyone else.

    Like


  62. I have to put this out there every so often, because it’s the elephant in the room… Roosh is taking in at least a little cash from Bang and DayBang and all his other business… and what are you doing? Working your 9 to 5? No offense to Roosh, I think Bang is a solid work… but I’d much rather have a compendium of your mentalnuggets over his. Fundamentally, I think you’re a writer with game, he’s a player whos writing about it. Get on the fucking boat man, publish some shit so I can stop trying to organize your archives into a paperback I can give to my nephews. I’m sure you get this enough, and I’m sure you know already… I just don’t get why you haven’t gotten down to it. Is it a hipsteresque too-cool-for-school attitude like you don’t care about making bank? Or are you honestly that worried about your real name getting out there? I’m sure you can publish it anon. Get to it man, for real, this blog is ephemeral, it won’t last forever. Once you stop writing, it’ll dissipate into the ether and be gone forever. Every turn of phrase and interesting word usage will be gone, forever. But you publish something, it’s down, forever. That’s your fucking immortality. You deserve it, and humanity deserves your gift. Give us your gift, mang. Do eet.

    Like


  63. “A bolded word is a window to the id.”

    Explains a lot about the Heartiste’s comments on the comments.

    Like


  64. When will I ever get to read some bullshit “story” where the f’ing “10” *doesn’t* have a “full C cup?”

    Phrase drives me crazy, so mix it up fuckers — your fantasy girl has a “shockingly high-slung H” or even a “weirdly enticing fat-nippled A,” anything but these unending “full C’s.”

    Lol.–

    Like


  65. Okay, so how about age. What do you say/do when she says, “but your old enough to be my father/grandfather”?

    When they ask my age (I look about 10-15 years younger than I am), I usually say “old enough to know better, young enough not to care”. But some still push on finding out my age.

    Like


  66. on October 1, 2011 at 1:17 pm Is this how the math works?

    So, a 5 with 9 game beats a 9 with 5 game?

    Does a 2 with 10 game beat a 10 with 2 game?

    Like


    • not true. the community and generally newbs kindof overemphasize the importance of game, IMO it lets you be interesting and date may be 1-2 points up than you generally would. Looks, Wealth still matter

      Like


  67. “Looks don’t matter” is something ugly people like to say to feel better about themselves. Just like poor people like to say that “money doesn’t buy happiness” and fat girls like to talk about how men like “curves.” Game can help, sure. An average looking guy with game will do better than a good looking guy with no game. But, don’t fool yourself into thinking a short, ugly guy can snag a 10 unless he is extremely wealthy and she is a shameless gold digger or has mental problems.

    I really don’t see how this reader submission proves anything. He didn’t bang this girl; he didn’t go out with her; he didn’t even get her number. She just tolerated him for an hour and a half. The girl obviously has some insecurities and this guy made her self-conscious about them, which, in his mind, caused her to exhibit behavior that appeared like she was interested in him. Getting this giddy over an attractive girl talking to you during a school project in which she was assigned to your group is very beta.

    Like


    • This is exactly what I was thinking while reading this. It’s like a girl getting excited about getting catcalled by hot construction workers: if the incident even shows up on your radar then it’s a pretty good sign you don’t have much going for you. Still, it’s clearly like a step forward for this guy so good for him. The next step is getting to the point where you can hold conversations with attractive girls on a regular basis and actually take it for granted.

      Like


    • The reason the idea of game resonates so strongly with men is because we’ve all seen numerous examples of some short ugly toad getting hot broads without having money. We’ve seen how the power of game HOLDS a woman’s interest and BONDS her to him, whereas being good looking or rich merely attracts her on a superficial and temporary level.

      It’s almost like girls PREFER an ugly dude, all other things being equal. They are turned off by guys who are too pretty or metrosexual. They love being the pretty one in the relationship.

      Like


  68. False game / looks dichotomy

    div 1. lacrosse player with investment banking job, modeling gigs and daddy’s trust fund will have much less trouble evincing the requisite ‘tude vis-a-vis balding, middle age, manboobery in parent’s basement. Having the height, physique, money, looks, big swinging dick, makes game infinitely easier since you have the goods to back it up. You can have game without these, but you are a skilled actor.

    Like


  69. CH:

    A link for you. Not so much the article, but the comments disagreeing with the findings: http://current.com/community/91831525_do-women-know-when-theyre-aroused.htm

    Like


  70. O_O
    Holy shit @ the skin picking, I thought it was just me

    brb fixing life

    Like


  71. […] Heartiste posted Game Trumps Looks, a fashionable and excruciating blood-letting of hope from the hearts of deprived men who would piss […]

    Like


  72. Interesting perspective on small group leader. It’s close to assuming the role of boss as long as your leadership isn’t too passive. I kinda get it, only a bitch is THAT concerned with grades but you can reframe with wanting to be an efficient group that doesn’t want to take up too much of your free time. Small group leader game, boom.

    Like


  73. Ps: reader is new. Hopefully has discovered his scale for attractiveness has little to do with his looks… As this entire post recognizes. Exception: skin picking scabs show anxiety show low man status. Long sleeves are his salvation.

    Like


  74. Something tells me that the “tripping over herself” part was just him over reading something that she does as an IOI delusional maybe, or maybe he blew every little chuckle out of proportion. It sometimes happen when we are attracted to a chick and tries to find a glimmer of hope that; yes, we can.

    Like


  75. ch.

    i dont know how you fucking do it.

    your words are power.

    Like


  76. @Erik

    Your race is either a help or a block, it depends on how you game using your exotic nature as “peacocking”….

    If you’re confident with good strong inner game, it’s a boost…

    if you’re self-conscious of it…then yes, it’s a disadvantage.

    There are endemic racial prejudices.

    Indians typically don’t go out with Chinese and vice versa,

    Chinese typically don’t approve of South Asians.

    But look at Singapore. There’s a sense less of “race” being a factor in cross-cultural relationships and more that social-status is the driver.

    So two ethnically diverse street sweepers can hook up. But a male Chinese fishball noodle hawker and a HB 6 Indian or Malay banker…you’d need to have game my friend.

    Like


  77. Folks,

    Cut the letter writer some slack. The Force is strong.

    .

    Like


  78. The fact I’m white is both a help or an obstacle in gaming girls in Hong Kong.

    It helps because I can use game to milk my confidence, mystery, etc even though I’m a little older than girls I’m gaming.

    But it’s also an obstacle if that girl for whatever reason has some strong cultural block against being with non-Chinese….then I need strong inner game and more importantly, an internal switch to know when to walk away.

    Like


  79. As for disadvantages etc. What about heavy facial sweating? Does it put women off? Greater beta who does ok, slowly learning, but in clubs or overheated venues, my face gets frosted with sweat every few minutes. It’s not weight-related.

    I can get 6s and 7s, even with this, but is this knocking me out of contention with the real beauties? Or does it matter at all.

    Like


  80. Long ago, when I was in college, the behavior of women confused me. In grad-school, I learned not to care and use it to my advantage. I did some things that I’m not proud of – mostly to see if I could get away with it. Of course, not only did I get away with it but if anything it seemed to elevate my desirability. I stopped worrying about “why” and just did what I wanted and never looked back.

    I find it interesting that these days some men have categorized women’s behavior and try to teach other men how to be what comes naturally or by experience to other men. But I applaud it. I wish someone had explained things to me during those early years – it would have saved me a lot of confusion.

    Like


  81. Also, I wouldn’t say it ‘trumps’ looks per se, because looks and game beats only game any day of the week.

    Game + Looks > Game without Looks

    Game is important, but a woman would take someone with both in a heartbeat.

    Like


  82. I’m not sure that letting freckle-faced, 5.5′ red-headed nerds with moulting skin into the secrets of game is helpful to the rest of us. Too many of these types in one’s stomping grounds cramp one’s style. Not to mention their long-term impact on the gene pool. Oh well, at least it helps put me off women. Women will fuck anything spun with a bit of bullshit, eh? No class. I liked it better when like went with like. Picturing moulting skin flaking into a vagina kinda kills my boner.

    Like


  83. All female desire can be simplified into status gradients. Females always desire positive status gradients relative to themselves. Although Game allows one to implement certain behaviours which are predictive of higher status, calculating female intuition will always derive your true status and estimate your potential status over the short and long term relative to her own.

    True masters of game will tell you that a vast majority of females are immune to pure game without markers of status. Thus, most adepts of game target the specific subset of females who value status much less, and game much more. The best example of this subset are young, urban females from wealthy families who will rarely meet men of higher status in their social circles outside their professional lives.

    Like


  84. “Thing 1” “Thing 2”

    Lmfao.

    Like


  85. lzozlozlozozl

    once yupon a time begind every man tehre was a oemnz a good women lozlzlozlozlo

    now, behind every women therie si a neocn tucker max butthexedr rhyems iwth godlam sax assocking her and secretely taping it zlozlozlozozo

    Like


  86. Roiss:

    Here’s this week’s entry of People Who Don’t Get It: http://life.salon.com/2011/10/02/shes_just_not_that_into_dating/singleton/

    Like


  87. I have trouble with looking down on the girl (pitying her, placing her at less than equal value with you, etc) and showing interest at the same time.

    We’ve established the inferiority of women on many levels. So why, again, are we interested in them? Firstly, why do we want them, cant we overcome our biology? Secondly, what reason do we give to them for liking them? The reasons we give when qualifying girls are almost always ridiculous.

    I masturbate when desire overcomes me and I cant read theoretical textbooks without a release from desire. I sometimes wish I could completely overcome that desire and kill my sexual drive. By culling the time I’m investing into making friends and meeting women, I could produce so much in my own personal projects.

    Like


    • So what? Why bother posting that on a game blog? If you are going to go your own way, is it important that you and others like you constantly inform everyone else about it? And if you are going to inform people – why people who have decided to do the exact opposite?

      Like


      • The answer to all of your questions is because we are men who come to places like this blog to discuss higher issues than the quickest way to get into a woman’s pants.

        Like


      • Discuss? Either do gyow, or don’t. Why are you seeking opinions about that? Do you want someone to convince you not to do that?

        Are you trying to convince others to follow the GYOW crowd?

        That’s something you have to figure out for yourself, I should think. This is a how to blog, not a why to blog.

        But if you want a why to, plenty can be written about the pleasures of female company. And then you could turn around and just discount all of that. Some things a man has to decide for himself, on his own.

        Like


      • You misinterpret me. I’m not going to do “mgtow”, I think that is idiocy.

        “That’s something you have to figure out for yourself, I should think.”

        One of the reasons I like this blog is because it strikes out against cultural relativism – the bane of postmodernism – disdaining the idea that there is truth in every value, or value in every idea, in a similar fashion to the beliefs of ANUS.com.

        What I interpret from this blog, and from the wiser heads of the seduction community, is the postuation that there are objective measures of personal worth (including SMV) and objective measures of the value in pursuits (e.g. university degrees) which are more important than the individual’s subjective or personal measures or values. This is very much a reaction against postmodern cultural relativism, and of course, if I’m not implying heavily enough, it is a good thing and a good approach.

        This approach is fundamental to game; a beta male is objectively a loser because he does not get sex, while an alpha male wins because he gets sex. Similarly, a child who gets bullied is objectively less (he is weaker in some value, in some measure) than a child who has the social intelligence to negate bullying.

        You should see now why the question of whether game makes an objectively better man – in the broadest sense of the value of being “better” – naturally arises. I and I think the author of this blog would answer with a yes, not simply because of the sexual benefits of being a male with easy access to sex but the augmented lifestyle which accompanies it.

        Like


      • Alpha and beta is not relative to yourself. It is how you are judged from outside, and specifically by females.

        It is a practical term, not a term of inner worth. It is a term of value that others place on you. How valuable you seem to them.

        The lifestyle of successfully loving women is a lifestyle choice. It’s like choosing to be an electrical engineer or an aviator. It comes with perks, and will change who you are. And it comes with costs.

        For me, I could see no other way to live, and I’m a very happy man. I’ll die satisfied that I lived my life well.

        For you? How can you ask someone ELSE what is the good life?

        Like


      • In other words, you don’t become objectively better when you become alpha. You become objectively better in the eyes of someONE. To an outside observer, they see you as better. Every outside observer is just another subject.

        Hitler was treated as a god by millions. Was he objectively better?

        There is no worth – not really. There is just a good life, and affecting others around you.

        Like


      • Secondly, what reason do we give to them for liking them? The reasons we give when qualifying girls are almost always ridiculous.

        You talk like a man who has never had a beautiful woman in love with you.

        When I wake in the morning, if my girl is not naked beside me, she has arisen and carefully prepared a breakfast she knows that I’ll enjoy. If I sit at the kitchen table to work, her silent company is the sweet companionship of a dear friend. When we fuck, we make all sorts of love – from humorous to laconic to tender to passionate to violent. Feelings of emotion mingle – joy, a love so strong that it is nearly a tearful heartbreak, lusty sex, and ecstatic mingling. When I look in her eyes I see adoration.

        My companion does my bidding throughout the day, with never a question or complaint. At night I fuck her to sleep, she gives me a kiss, and I have her beside my while I work and play on my laptop.

        Tomorrow will be another good day.

        Why deal with women?

        If you don’t know, you don’t want to know.

        Like


      • no see he posted to ask the question he put in the first paragraph (“how can i be aloof and show interest at the same time”). then he tried to bury the shame with high-minded drivel.

        Like


    • If you want to kill your sex drive, SSRI will probably get you there.

      Like


      • You’re right about that! I was on Zoloft for 6 months and the only thing it did was eradicate my libido. Nowadays 2 days without masturbating makes me furious.

        Like


    • Why do we want a nice apartment to live in? Why do we want a decent car to drive around? Why do we buy a warm coat for the winter or a comfortable pair of shoes?

      We do those things to meet our needs. Masturbation works, for awhile, but it’s not the same.

      All humans need self-validation as well as external validation. You could theoretically go mine gold yourself and just sell it to any random gold dealer, or you could do a good job for a customer and get the validation of payment for those services. You’re getting a need filled (productive work, income and the validation from a return customer),

      When it comes to sexual needs, women do it best — we get the self-validation of not having to take care of it ourselves, and we also can utilize a pretty broad on our arms as a form of DHV to customers and social peers. Men are competitive creatures by nature, so having your girl-of-the-month definitely helps in social and business-social situations.

      I see a few problems with what you said, though.

      “showing interest at the same time” — all you need to do, initially, is make a play showing sexual interest without coming off as creepy. Women love men who don’t manipulate to get what they want, so don’t be a manipulative fake “nice guy” beta.

      “what reason do we give for liking them” — we don’t give any reason for it. When a gal asks me why I spend time with her, I tell her pretty bluntly: “You take decent care of what I need from you”. Let her hamster figure the rest out. Sometimes I’ll throw in “And you have a great ass/pair of tits/Hoover-for-a-mouth/etc”. It’s part-superficial and part-maternal.

      “by culling the time I’m investing” — don’t invest much time. Make friends and meet women when you’re not focusing on your own betterment. I like meeting women when I’m running errands — it’s not an investment, it’s just a side project. At the bank, pet food store (this is my new go-to), supermarket, etc.

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      • Seeing as I have no sexual partners, and havent had one this year, if I want one then that will require investment – time to make approaches, get rejected, figure out where I’m going wrong, become more confident, fix my mistakes etc. Unfortunately it is a massive issue for me right now because sexual frustration has caused my grades to fall.

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      • how could it do that? also if it’s affecting your “personal projects”, then you can rationalize investing in it. your success is on the line here.

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      • It’s not like riding a bike — once you lose the confidence, it’s hard to get it back.

        If you lost it, you need to start over. Not having sex should NOT affect your school work, something else is going on. Your self confidence is causing women to shy away from you, so you need to work on that.

        This is the chicken and egg situation that most beta guys have to deal with before they can “alpha up” and get ahead of the pack.

        Start from square 1.

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  88. looks with no game obviously are trumped by average plus game but I don’t agree with “being good looking will only buy you a couple more minutes”

    Back when I had absolutely no clue what I was doing I was for all intents and purposes a “caring asshole” The girl I was banging at the time once told me, after I had said some over the top neg: “You say a lot of stupid shit but I let you get away with it because…you’re so good looking”

    Just sayin.

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    • nah she was just rationalizing why she tolerated you being rude to her. your asshole attitude excited her and she got shit confused

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  89. IHTG,

    What do you think of “Game without seduction”? That is, flirting with and turning chicks on, with no intention of following through and dating/bedding them?
    I think it might be a good thing for beta males: the more women believe that their world is full of eligible alpha males, the less of an advantage any one alpha has.

    This is what I call “Catch-and-Release Game”, but the point is to practice and improve your own alpha traits. That you amuse and intrigue women you are not going to sleep with is just a secondary consequence (though a good one). Knowing from the start you do not want to seduce her gives you the necessary aloofness and avoids the beta pitfalls of appearing needy or taking her seriously. The result will be a big boost to your confidence and “inner game”. Warning: if you are already in a relationship, this is a risky game to play with 10’s (or with 9’s if you’ve never had a 9), you must have the self-control to handle the “release” part.

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  90. Lots of women prefer ugly men.

    Some will even admit it. In fact, I think the hotter a girl is, the less she cares about guys’ looks.

    If they had always had the freedom they have now, there would be NO pretty girls. This strikes me as undeniable.

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  91. What do you think of “Game without seduction”?

    theres a word for this

    MONOGAMY

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