Sext Game

Ready to analyze some text game for make benefit of your glorious alpha training? This sample of the genre is a little different, though. It’s sexting game, a subcategory of generic text game. Commenter walawala writes:

Here is a transcript of text game I was running on a Taiwanese girl I met on a flight to hin where she lives. My game was tight and I number closed. She dropped the I have a bf. I ignored. Then I began text game ahead of an upcoming trip back to her city…

I’ll pick it up where it’s relevant

Her: You’re such a player

Me: You bet. and what is it abt players u like so much?

Her: I don’t conclude that I like players, do I?

Me: Player? No way. I’m the coach. Players come to me for advice

Her: The I’m not a player…it’s you that come to me

Her: No offense…….

Me: Guilty as charged

Her: Ha ha

Me: I may need to spank you if yuou dun behave

Her: Now you are sexually harrassing me, uncle

Me: hmmm, interesting where ur mind is…

Me: What is it about spanking u that u find sexual?

Her: Any physical contacts that I find uncomfortable

Me: My spanking woud make u feel…

Her: Feel what?

Me: Do you like the sound of it?

Her: Now I’m pondering if you are the SM type…and pondering where ur mind is

Me: Many girls like a dominant man who knows to to lead…how about you?

Her: And spare your efforts on gett me hooked. Go find other Asian girls…exclusing me to satisfy your masculine needs

Me: WHo said I was interested in hooking you? Big ego

Her: Don’t know,,,just my bold assumption

Me: …

Her: Assumption comes before conclusion right?

Me: I find most girls like a dominat guy

Her: hmmmm maybe

Me: That’s why their favorite position is doggie style. Maybe ur different

Her: …..hmmm maybe i can try it with my boyfriend…thank you for your advice

Ends

Next morning she texts me:

Her: Found a new term for you….”sexpat”

Me: I prefer ‘sexpert’

She babbled on a bit more and I stopped. I’m set to come back to her city in a few weeks and will contact her.

She’s clearly a drama queen and loves the attention. Despite claiming to have a boyfriend she is lapping up my text game….

Text game for self-centred girls is cat nip….

My first reaction to reading this was… lots of smoke, but where’s the fire? Or, concept was good, but execution lagged. It struck me as a pastiche of good text game techniques stitched together haphazardly.

She doesn’t sound like she’s biting. Her flirting, if it can be called that, is cold and accusatory. She clearly bristled at the insinuation, intended or not, that Asian girls are naturally submissive. Now maybe Asian girls demonstrate their growing interest differently than white girls do, (a distinct possibility, as I have written before that very broad, but shallow, racial differences in receptiveness to game may exist), in which case my constructive criticism of this text exchange would be off-base. I’d like to know what happened between walawala and this girl since this text convo took place. What were the text convos like in the following days/weeks? Did he unlock difficulty level bang?

We’ll break down my initial impression, line by line.

Her: You’re such a player

Me: You bet. and what is it abt players u like so much?

He’s avoiding defensiveness, assuming the sale and eliciting her values. Three core game concepts. The question is whether it was too early in the interaction to do this. You can spook a girl with loaded sexualized questions if you ask them before her interest has been piqued.

Her: I don’t conclude that I like players, do I?

Me: Player? No way. I’m the coach. Players come to me for advice

Maybe this reply is good, but the fact remains he’s playing into her frame. She’s been leading this conversation so far. Plus, he’s backpedaled here, even if it was done in a cocky way. The DHV is too obvious.

Her: The I’m not a player…it’s you that come to me

Her: No offense…….

Me: Guilty as charged

The ‘guilty as charged’ line worked here, but in this exchange it falls flat. I want you pickup experts in the studio audience to explain why. The difference in context is your first clue.

Me: I may need to spank you if yuou dun behave

Her: Now you are sexually harrassing me, uncle

Sexual innuendo in text can backfire if attraction hasn’t been built, or rapport is weak. Sometimes a girl will shut down. Often, when she’s open to playful flirting, you can get caught in an endless loop of innuendo that eventually crumbles under its own weight. In this instance, she seems up for flirting, so no harm no foul.

Me: hmmm, interesting where ur mind is…

A good line. Puts her in chaser mode.

Me: What is it about spanking u that u find sexual?

But the reframe is subverted by returning to this arid sexual well. I think it would have been better to play a little more hard-to-get, than to continue pressing her for info about her sexual proclivities. Particularly since this is over text and, as far as I know, very little physical contact has happened yet.

Her: Any physical contacts that I find uncomfortable

This is not a playful response. Now he has a clue that continuing to pursue this dirty talk avenue will be less than fruitful.

Her: Now I’m pondering if you are the SM type…and pondering where ur mind is

Woops. There goes that initial great reframe by walawala. It’s just been turned around again. She is very good (read: very Asian) at retaining control of courtship hand.

Me: Many girls like a dominant man who knows to to lead…how about you?

Girls do like dominant men. But they don’t like being told aloud that they like dominant men. I’ve never really found it all that useful to remind girls of the inner workings of their hamsters in the course of a pickup attempt. Still, sociosexual themes can act as a good springboard for getting girls to open up about their values.

Her: And spare your efforts on gett me hooked. Go find other Asian girls…exclusing me to satisfy your masculine needs

Here’s that part where her ‘yellow fever’ alert just triggered. She’s pigeonholing walawala, and I don’t see him effectively countering it.

Me: WHo said I was interested in hooking you? Big ego

The problem with this second reframe attempt is that it flies in the face of textual evidence suggesting the contrary. Thus, the impression is one of defensiveness rather than amused correction.

Her: Assumption comes before conclusion right?

The fact that she’s asking a question, however obtuse, is proof that she’s still invested in this convo and wants to see where it leads.

Me: I find most girls like a dominat guy

Beating a dead horse.

Her: hmmmm maybe

She just got bored.

Me: That’s why their favorite position is doggie style. Maybe ur different

Her: …..hmmm maybe i can try it with my boyfriend…thank you for your advice

This is the second IHAB she unloaded on walawala. Not a good sign. The sexual tone he took, in my opinion, was premature, and probably contributed to shutting her down, which is evident in her terse “thank you for your advice” send-off. Talking about doggie style over text with a girl you number closed on a plane a while back (how long ago?) is precipitously close to entering cloying, horny beta territory.

The next morning, the text exchange resumes:

Her: Found a new term for you….”sexpat”

This is good news. She reinitiated contact, so that means she’s been thinking about him all night. The substance of her text is irrelevant.

Me: I prefer ‘sexpert’

Meh. Again with the self-boosting sexual innuendo. Too much sex talk, especially the boastful variety, can make a man just as dull as the beta who drones on about work and weather, especially if she’s gotten used to it and now finds it predictable. Better quickie reply: “i’m still dancing thru ur thoughts… that’s cute.”

***

Overall, I give this text pickup attempt a B-. Walawala is a valued contributor to the Chateau, and he has offered up some good stuff over the months. This one, however, misses the mark. First, it’s too long. Text exchanges that go on and on eventually shift the balance of power in the woman’s favor. That is the nature of verbal foreplay that must abide certain technological constraints. Women are vessels of words, men are warriors of action. This may not be as relevant today, as it looks like everyone and his grandma texts all the time, but it’s still something to keep in mind.

Second, the lean on loaded sexual allusions was overwrought, and possibly premature (barring additional information about context). That kind of flirty sexy vibe works better face-to-face, where wry expressions can alleviate or accentuate the tension. Over text, it risks being perceived as overly persistent, or even creepy.

I don’t mean to sound harsh. Walawala has still done better than most betas would do in the same circumstance. Any shortcomings evident in this text exchange are more pro-game problems than anti-game issues. I concede that my judgment could be unfair, but I don’t have enough prior context to conclude otherwise. Perhaps I’m reading her replies in the worst light, and she was way more into it than it seems here on this blog. My assumption is that this pickup attempt is far from a given, but walawala is free to elaborate.





Comments


  1. on June 21, 2012 at 3:20 pm The Fucking Writer

    I shook my head reading that entire text thread. Wow. At some point he had to know he was fighting a losing battle. Texting isn’t like talking in person, you can’t just keep plowing.

    Like


    • tl:dr

      Best text game is preferably no more than 2 texts per exchange & no more than 2 texting sessions before meeting up. Keep it short, sweet & irreverent.

      Better yet, don’t ever respond to her texts.

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      • Totally. I also pre-qualify the subject of texting:

        Me: Here, put your fucking number in my phone, bitch.
        Girl: God … you’re mean …
        Me: What the fuck did you just say?
        Girl: There.
        Me: Good. Now, don’t fucking text me. I will call you, and you will answer, then we’ll set up a time and place, or we are done. Understand?
        Girl: Yes sir.

        Is life so very long that one should sacrifice hours of mentation to this garbage?

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      • @UhUh,

        You were going fine there till you said:
        “we’ll set up a time and place”

        That’s incongruent and approval seeking 😉

        You need to say:
        “I’ll let you know the time and place”

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      • on June 22, 2012 at 3:54 pm The Real Vince

        Fucking pussy. What are you, an Obama voter?

        If she’s hot enough, I’ll command her to drop to her knees and suck me off. I finish her mouth — I don’t care if she starts gagging: “Swallow, bitch. There are children starving in Africa.”

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    • on June 21, 2012 at 6:13 pm collapseofman

      Yep. I was wincing. When you banter, there’s a big difference between evading her objections and flatout ignoring them because you don’t have a leg to stand on. (ie “player? No way”. That ain’t stacking threads, son. It’s called conceding to her point by not addressing it at all).

      One of the harder things for aspergoid cyber-pua’s to learn is that, contrary to popular belief, women actually have individual personality types. It should have taken two sentences to figure out this chick was slower to warm up than most and taking a “by the way, you’re a slut from now on” approach isn’t going to convince her. I’d give this kid a D.

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  2. Not bad. We would need to know delays between replies to get a much better feel of what’s going on here and better guage her interest. It would also help to know what their pickup convo looked like.

    However, based only on what I see here, I estimate chance of close at 20% (unlikely):

    Main mistakes IMO:
    -Too much wordinesss from walawala, answers should be shorter.
    -He is not leading the conversation. She is.
    -Also, why is he contacting a few weeks ahead and exchanging so much bla bla. It is one thing to keep contact it is another to overdo it in an aimless convo which can only bore her and discredit him…

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  3. here’s where it really went irretrievably sideways in my opinion. i haven’t read your take on it yet so if i’m off, or exact same, apologies.

    Me: Guilty as charged
    Her: Ha ha
    Me: I may need to spank you if yuou dun behave
    Her: Now you are sexually harrassing me, uncle
    Me: hmmm, interesting where ur mind is…
    Me: What is it about spanking u that u find sexual?
    Her: Any physical contacts that I find uncomfortable
    Me: My spanking woud make u feel…
    Her: Feel what?
    Me: Do you like the sound of it?

    he’s too invested, gives her too much, then is needy for a response. brad pitt sitting watching tv with this chick texting– he responds to her initial text with a ‘lol’, maybe, and has nothing more to say to her. doesn’t have to prove anything to her.

    the content isn’t bad but the execution seems incongruent. behind the ‘player’ is a guy asking for her to say he’s doing well. doesn’t mesh.

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    • Yes, it was a punt and a chance to field test some of this stuff…all these comments and discussion go towards advancing understanding of game techniques.

      In another situation involving a flight attendant I met who passes through here occassionally, I used the short texts to set things up and gamed her through push-pull when we met.

      On our first proposed meet-up she flaked 3 hours before. I kept it light, followed the flake-advice given here.

      Then I ignored her, kept everything short to the point she even said “Wow, your texts are so short”.

      That built up the mystery and had her chasing me.

      Then one day she passed through on a flight, called me up, came over and I banged her.

      You can’t get good at this stuff unless you’re prepared to fail…or experiment.

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  4. CH, can I send you my phone number and you will then be sending me sext game lines? Please

    [heartiste: i would, but i have a feeling you’d start counting the letters like rainman OCDing over a pile of toothpicks. definitely trolled, definitely.]

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  5. on June 21, 2012 at 3:35 pm Dr. Murray F. Rottencrotch

    Cannot fucking understand how you keep bringing the news so hard, multiple times a day, at such length and at such detail. Only the Maya types of the world could possibly fail to grasp what’s up with all this laid about before them. How do you do it, boss? How do you do it?

    We all should be off the internet and in the streets, fighting like the fight scene from Anchorman.

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    • Dr. Murray F. Rottencrotch implies that you form the intelligentsia . Let Mr Dick Stink bring force to your ideas.

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  6. my 2 cents…

    i’ve been doing a lot of texting/messaging lately and i’ve got a lot of experience screwing it up as well as doing it perfectly. bottom line, treat it like everything else on this blog – don’t dance around, get to the point. if you’ve got decent rapport with a girl, and you’ve established that you’re not a perv, when it gets sexual text her some good, raunchy shit. like if she asks you what you’d do to her right now, tell her you’d bend her over your office desk (if you’re at work), hike up her skirt, pull her hair….aaaand you get the point. this cat and mouse game, trying to feel out how receptive she is…forget it. either she’s gonna be down or she isn’t. make it good, make it dirty, and she’ll love it. and if she doesn’t or she’s if she’s offended, then why are you wasting your time?

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  7. My take is that she likes Walawala’s boldness, but not his sexualizing. She wishes she could be seduced more expertly. She likes his looks or she wouldn’t waste her time with him, but he is definitely try-hard, starting with the player bit.

    My approach with this girl would be short, hard teasing (non-sexual) to spike her emotions followed by uncomfortably long pauses.

    [heartiste: that would be my approach as well.]

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    • ^^Agreed^^

      Also

      “hmmm, interesting where ur mind is…”

      should have waited for her to text back instead of adding a follow up text.

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  8. I don’t know. The first line of the quoted text was an opportunity for comfort-building, or at least deflection and reframing. A missed opportunity.

    I generally hate that “player” terminology and associated bravado crap. I understand how permission to exhibit sexual confidence is like ambrosia to guys who have been told to supplicate and be polite their whole lives, but TALKING about being a player comes across as desperation and approval-seeking, just a different kind.

    If you want to think of yourself as a player, fine. Just don’t talk about it. Live it.

    It’s called “DHV” for a reason. Emphasis on the D. It’s not THV (talk about your high value).

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    • How about “womanizer” as a descriptor?

      “Hey girl, wanna get womanized?”

      Yea, that’ll work!

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    • Nah. The “I’m the coach” line was hilarious.

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      • It doesn’t matter if it’s hilarious. What matters is whether it’s effective.

        Talking about your positive traits is self-defeating. If you really had those traits, you wouldn’t need to talk about them. Telling people about all of your good qualities only convinces them that you are unsure about whether you actually have those qualities.

        Maxim # 1: Show, don’t tell.

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      • Sure it matters if it’s hilarious. The humor is the demonstration you’re looking for. (That line was probably the only DHV in the whole rambling, tryhard SMS exchange.) In that way it is “effective.”

        Text is nearly all “tell” and no “show.” That’s the problem, innit? Messaging is to be avoided unless it can be turned into demonstration rather than simple testimony, as you say. But a medium of words, especially abbreviated ones, limits our ability to show while tempting us to tell. The “show” parts of texting/twitter are: silence, humor, responsiveness, abruptness, information, subject switching, grammar and spelling, emoticons. Hard to master, as it is easier to give in to the natural tendency to narrate and describe rather than lead.

        If we “really had those traits,” and those traits are invisible over the given medium, we will be tempted to go with the strengths of the limited communication and try to “talk about” our virtues. Agreed, better to eschew the medium altogether if you can’t discipline yourself and use the tool intelligently.

        But avoiding text is passing up a huge opportunity. Women have a false sense of security there, and they therefore greatly prefer it. There is at once an appearance of great distance and great intimacy in the text, all the safety of detachment and all the benefit of closeness without risk. Or so she thinks.

        The truth is, well-done text game is an incredible opportunity to ambush her id, a sneak-attack underneath her defenses, an end-run around her bitch-shield Maginot Line. The drawback, of course, is the severely limited feedback. It’s impossible to gauge how effective your tactics were unless she volunteers it with a text-back, which she will be disposed against. Usually you have to wait for the next face-to-face for the flirting to bear fruit.

        Matt

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      • What matter is if it’s hilarious TO HER, not to you. It may be funny to men observing the conversation, but we have a different perspective than she does, and different women find different types of humor to be funny. So, the only way we know if a line like “I’m the coach” was effective is if it helped cause her to be attracted to him. I don’t see a whole lot of attraction here. Her immediate reaction was defensive:

        Her: The I’m not a player…it’s you that come to me

        Her: No offense…….

        I’m not even sure what that meant. It doesn’t ring with the sound of wet panties, though.

        Text is as much “showing” as any other form of verbal communication is (talking, or writing in longer forms that a text allows). If you want her to think you’re attractive to other women, for example, the one thing you should not say is, “I’m attractive to other women.” If you want her to think you’re a “player” (not sure why you would, but let’s say you do), then you should not say “I’m a player” or “I’m the coach.” It actively undermines your attempt to get her to think these things for herself.

        I think it’s best to avoid talking about yourself and your personal traits at all, as a subject of conversation. It’s inherently a display of self-doubt and insecurity, since focusing on yourself signals that you are interested in what she (or others) thinks about you, when the really important question ought to be what you think about her (and the world).

        Focusing your attention outward is a much better way to go.

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      • @Phinn,

        Right!

        You want her to be qualifying herself to you… not the other way around.

        Wala should be thinking as he texts, “Is she exciting me enough”, “Is she putting in enough effort here”, and NOT “I wonder how I’m doing”, “I wonder did I go too far”, “I wonder if she likes me”…

        Years ago, I went on some dates with a Chinese girl, and she immediately asks me for my blood group – which I thought bizarre, but seemingly it’s not in East Asia. So when I reply “O+”, she says:

        ChinaGirl: “Wow, that means you are a warrior spirit, an entrepreneur, an adventurer… am I right?”
        Me: “That’s pretty accurate…”

        My only advice to Wala on Chinese girls is to compare them to Japanese girls – as it seems to drive them bat shit crazy – as I found out with the one I dated. The key is to make it seem that you see all East Asians as interchangeable, or else you greatly admire something about Japanese girls – then Chinese girls will go to great lengths to dispel this notion.

        Works the same with Polish vs German girls, which I’ve much experience with…

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  9. on June 21, 2012 at 4:04 pm Newly Aloof

    The dude is out there sexting girls so that right there is a win for a future super-hero. But, he’s acting more like Robin here instead of Batman. Don’t be Robin! Be cool like Batman!

    Her: You’re such a player

    Me (Read this line in your best Robin impersonation): You bet! and what is it abt players u like so much?

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    • Any girl who texts “You’re such a player” to a real player should hear nothing but crickets chirping.

      What player has time for gameplaying via text?

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      • That’s taking the whole “alpha male, dismissive of girls” philosophy too far in my opinion. You’re not going to turn down a girl who shows interest (what girl who’s interested in you says, “You’re such a player”? NONE!), that’s just retarded. It’s a shit-test, but at its core, it comes from her thinking to herself, “This guy has lots of sex with women. I want a piece.”

        As others have mentioned, there are many ways to deal with this.

        My response would probably be something like:

        “yeah but u like it ;)”

        I like to be playful via text when I’m not face-to-face with women. It keeps them thinking about me while we’re away from each other. You just gotta remember to ramp it up in real life if you go by this, else she’ll see you as a deadbeat guy who won’t go in for the kill.

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      • Any girl who texts “You’re such a player” to a real player should hear nothing but crickets chirping.

        No way, jefe. She’s offering an opportunity to be teased. If she didn’t think “player” was an attractive quality, and wasn’t explicitly and grudgingly admitting as much, she either wouldn’t say anything or use a genuine putdown like, “creepy” or “weird.”

        That’s why walawala’s response “I’m the coach” was excellent. At once it is agreeing with her implication while exaggerating for effect. It is a perfect alpha boast, mildly self-deprecating in its absurdity but without denying the underlying truth of it.

        On the other hand the role-play aspect is super tricky (“I may need to spank you”) and can easily backfire as creepy. It is better left to hinting to preserve deniability and to later flip it back onto her perverse mind (“uncle”! Loads can be done with that TMI). Clearly striking the right balance takes some artistry, but so do all effective methods. It’s better to keep it grounded in the real. Imma spank ya is too fantasy-based too soon. It’s better to imply the future — “When’s the last time you’ve been spanked?” — and string her along, let her do the escalating.

        In text there are none of the massively important tells of face-to-face interaction against which you can gauge the proper pace of temperature raising. Leaving it to her is not so passive as it seems. You’re better at smooth hinting than she is, and her replies will be more blunt than she intends, if there is true interest in escalation. Face it, women just aren’t as practiced in the subtleties of rhetoric (which is why they suck at humor); they are too used to their appearance speaking for them. That gives you all the latitude you need for wink-wink mock-shock at her “inappropriate forwardness,” which makes even bad girls blush when you call them out on it.

        Matt

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      • Yep, being accused of being a player is usually a sign that you’ve demonstrated higher value. She’s admitting you’ve had an affect on her and thinks you’ve worked your magic on women before her.

        In person, I sometimes challenge the moral judgment – “Do you mean to say that having a woman being sexually attracted to me is a bad thing?” That acknowledges her attraction to me and legitimizes it. Of course I’m sexy…and you know it! Duh.
        If texyiinh, I’ll misdirect in a witty way.

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  10. The good thing about Wala is that he tries, and wants to learn – so surely will.

    The bad thing is that he still comes across as seeking approval – he should never try and qualify himself, just make short “Take it or leave it” statements/texts.

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  11. on June 21, 2012 at 4:29 pm The Shocker

    via deadspin

    One of my former MLB clients used to have me keep a phone for him. Part of my job was to respond to the women who texted. His only instructions were to “see how dirty they get.” Which turned out to be much easier than I expected.

    A few of the women were married. One was a newlywed who swore at the start she just wanted to be friends. She loved her new husband and would never consider such a thing. Two texts later—one of which was “but my cock is so hard for you”—I had a picture of her tits. She was making plans to come see “me” in a city close to her. I asked her if she would just come in, fuck “me,” and leave without saying a single word. Her response is one I’ll never forget: “I’ll do whatever you want. I want to be your cum slut.” My client just laughed when I showed it to him.

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    • meanwhile, the latest issue of men’s journal has poll of MLB players for best city for groupies…it’s Chicago. But what’s interesting is the number of players who responded that there ain’t no such thing as groupies anymore. Which would be sad.

      [heartiste: first rule of secret society…]

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      • i took “ain’t no such thing as groupies anymore” to mean that all women are now interested in casual sex with a celebrity, jock, actor, whatever.

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    • I have a weird boner everytime I hear stories about dirty wives. wtf?

      Gotta start chasing married chicks.

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    • I saw the Deadspin article from another more mainstream source (I forget) and was surprised it hadn’t made the rounds here:

      http://deadspin.com/5914355/how-women-throw-themselves-at-pro-athletes-and-vice-versa-a-publicist-explains

      Then again, maybe it’s been posted a dozen times and I missed it. It’s a sextbook example of hypergamy in action. The husband was cuckolded the minute he stepped into a place like that with his whorewife. The fact that his spidey senses weren’t tingling well before he placed his wife in that position indicates he is Classic Beta, if not an out-and-out interracial cuckold fetishist. If you can’t be the NBA player in that scenario, you’d best inoculate your ho with extreme measures against it. But to naively think her virtue would save both of them is the worst situation of all.

      Women like that deserve to be punched in the face at the very first, most minute sign of her potential for hypergamous treachery. After getting balled by a baller? She is less than trash. She ceases to exist. It is sexual annihilation. She has to be more deathly fearful of the consequences of following her inclinations than enticed by the excitement of her tingles at their most intense. The way girls have been brought up today? No chance of that. They are sexual-disasters-to-be, walking clusterfucks waiting to happen. Until women are reined in and trained from puberty against their natural inclinations again, the only practical choice for men in the meantime is to be the bigger baller.

      Matt

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  12. To me the creepy part wasn’t the sexual stuff (it was, as described, beating a dead horse however) but the shit about a woman liking a “dominant man.” That’s the kind of shit a girl can make fun of with her friends. While it’s true it’s just spergy to say it out loud to her. You might as well take a copy of the Mystery Method along to a date at that point.

    That’s not to say there’s no way to raise the subject though. Talk about the sexual dynamics between others – people you know, anecdotes – but don’t refer to those between you and her. (There are cases where it might be appropriate but as a general rule it’s probably best not to.)

    Like


    • Aaron (@Arronski)
      You might as well take a copy of the Mystery Method along to a date at that point.

      Hey, it worked
      purty good…
      for Mystery

      Like


  13. Walawala

    ” hmmm, interesting where ur mind is…”

    Was good, you should of just left it at that and not of did the follow up text

    “What is it about spanking u that u find sexual?”

    If you left it at the first one you would of seemed more aloof.

    Like


  14. When she says:

    Her: Now I’m pondering if you are the SM type…and pondering where ur mind is

    I’d cut her off here and finish the convo with something like:

    Me: “Well you’ll find out soon enough… b-bye…”

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  15. on June 21, 2012 at 4:52 pm Amanjaw Marcuntte

    “The ‘guilty as charged’ line worked here, but in this exchange it falls flat. I want you pickup experts in the studio audience to explain why. The difference in context is your first clue.”

    Simple: that’s a post-bang line.

    [heartiste: yup.]

    And yes, the convo is way too long. But then, anything wordier than “bring the movies” is unnecessary.

    [the other problem with the context here is that “guilty as charged” is continuing her frame. in the other post, it was an unexpected bomb that inverted the girl’s frame, because she was expecting the guy to say something else.]

    Like


  16. too sexy too soon, too much obv self-puffery. I think girls like building up guy’s awesomeness (oh you’re so sexy, honey) when they’re digging you but otherwise, erm…

    Suggested response, Srsly tho, yur yello pussy rocks.*

    *I’ve noticed some asian girls seem to dislike white guy yellow fever fanatics. Would avoid discussing sushi, dominance, internment camps etc. until you establish non-perv credentials.

    Like


  17. You can’t hump your cell phone….

    Remember, it has one of the most narrow of communication bandwidths. Use it to get to face-to-face ASAP. Only then will you ever get belly-to-belly.

    This whole thing went on much too long.

    Like


    • ^This.^

      Multiple text messages seems like progress. It can seem like you’re getting somewhere.

      You’re not.

      DHV by not engaging other than to specify time and place for meeting, and bring your game to that meeting. Real DHVs should be demonstrated, not related, and should be done in person or by a third party relaying this information to the target.

      Sexting with someone you’re not sexing is a DLV.

      Like


  18. on June 21, 2012 at 5:03 pm Days of Broken Arrows

    When I found out how much women like texting I went to Verizon and switched my cell plan to a limited number of minutes and now only use it for emergencies. I refuse all texts, even from my parents.

    There are many problems with texting, but here are my top three:

    1). You’re playing on her terms. When she says “Let me text you,” the answer should be that she should “woman-up” and call you or meet. It’s effeminate for a man to be punching little keys anyway and she’s going to be picturing you doing this girly activity, which she associated with gal pals and her mom.

    2). When you speak to a woman, you use the cadence of your voice to seduce. Intonation matters. Laughter matters. Humorous asides matters. Since women have the upper hand in seduction (they’re sought-after, not seekers), their intonation doesn’t really matter, but YOURS DOES. Plus, a sexy voice will get you far, esp. if you do the late nite phone convo thing (so I’ve been told — hehe).

    3). When you fuck up while talking to someone and they call you on it you can deny, sidestep, backpeddle, spin, or change the subject. When you fuck up texting, your stupidity is there in print for her to see forever. And ever. And to show to her friends. And to laugh at. This alone is reason to avoid texting.

    Like


    • @DBA

      Right, the best reply to a girl’s txt message is:

      “Call me” or
      “Gotta run, I’ll call you”

      [heartiste: when all else fails and you can’t think of anything to text, go with calculated gibberish. it’s mysterious! frex:

      ” ss ole wa ti g 4 my c ck. ne t tim”]

      Like


  19. “Her: The I’m not a player…it’s you that come to me

    Her: No offense…….

    Me: Guilty as charged”

    Translation: Yes, I came to you. I am doing the chasing, not you. I may be desperate.

    Like


  20. How does the golden ratio of 2/3 (from the 16 commandments of poon) play into this? This is pretty much a tit for tat (hehe) text exchange.

    [heartiste: yep, it is tit for tat. that’s why it struck me as try-hard. the golden ratio should apply to texting too.]

    Like


    • I always think I’m behind the curve when I send the first text. I guess I need to send each text with the motive of making her respond 3 times to my 2 texts. That wll take more time, but day game should. Actually, from the perspective of a hypergamy seeking hamster, that sounds like something a high value male would do. Totally fucking brilliant. 8======>

      Like


  21. on June 21, 2012 at 5:25 pm (R)Evoluzione

    Great breakdown of some decent text game.

    These breakdowns are very useful because text is the hardest medium to master. There’s no vocal subtext, no intonation or other cues, just cold, hard verbage.

    Text game is easy to fuck up, hard to master. Thus, better go with more minimalist communications, and let her hamster parse the meanings. I have to keep reminding myself of this, I can be verbose.

    The Chateau recommends more hard, nonsexual teasing with long pauses. I would concur, but also focus on actually creating some kind of emotional connection. This might better be accomplished over the phone, rather than textually, because one can then use his manly, sensual voice as a tool, not just the words communicated, as in text.

    Like


    • How can you build a connection over text? Attraction. Walawala’s mission is to spike her interest enough to want to meet him. If she’s thinking “Who is this guy? ” then he’s doing it right.

      Like


    • Texting is for pragmatism or frivolity, not long conversation.

      Like


  22. The thought of white men chasing after and possibly reproducing with asian chicks makes me sick to my stomach.

    Sorry.

    – Arturo

    [heartiste: nah. you know what’s gross? doing it with an australian aboriginal. that brow ridge!]

    Like


    • Interracial relationships are okay until there’s too many of a certain type. It’s an unspoken belief, an unacknowledged assumption that underlies the most fervent disapproval of certain interracial pairings.

      The right to be involved with and married to someone from another race was something that was fought for in many societies. Today, interracial marriage is usually celebrated as a civil right, a symbol of our common humanity. Not many people in the circles I’ve lived in would publicly speak against intermarriage, even amongst friends. It’s just not PC.

      And why are they in the wrong, anyway? Who decided that for interracial relationships to be celebrated and accepted and respected, there has to be a quota on certain pairings? That there is a correct ratio? That there has to be 100 white female/Asian male couples for every 100 Asian female/white male couples?

      http://shanghaishiok.com/2011/11/12/the-invisible-quota-on-interracial-relationships/

      Like


    • “The thought of white men chasing after and possibly reproducing with asian chicks makes me sick to my stomach.” Arturo

      Which asian hooker gave you an STD?

      Like


      • LOL at these guys getting sick over whites breeding with non-whites.

        How many white chicks have these guys knocked up? Zero? If they’re so afraid of the white race getting erased, why aren’t they doing their part and trying to impregnate every white chick?

        Think about how much whiter America would be if every white guy who dislikes interracial relationships did their part and knocked up as many white chicks as possible.

        OTOH, I think he might be gay because he’s pissed off at all the white MALES taken off the market.

        Like


    • “heartiste: nah. you know what’s gross? doing it with an australian aboriginal. that brow ridge!”

      See to it that her lover is from Thailand and you will become more famous than Henry Heimlich.

      Like


  23. I agree, call instead of texting if you want to get laid fast. But, if you’re juggling a number of women but meeting only one tonight, texting holds the others at bay and keeps them warmed up for tomorrow and the next day. I also agree that there was no need at all to admit being a player or say “you know you want a dominant man” more than once.

    But that is not why I am commenting now.

    What blew me away about this post and that exchange is that I didn’t know that Taiwanese women could parrot American feminism like that.

    There were ideology driven lines in there that would have disqualified her immediately from any more serious consideration from me.

    I certainly hope she wasn’t someone under 23 parroting US feminists. Too much familiarity with American dating terminology would be a turn off for me.

    If she was in her mid to late 20’s and been around the block including a few years in the US, then fine, no problem. She’d already be over the hill anyway and I wouldn’t be interested in pursuing.

    Like


  24. Sexting: DON’T DO IT
    Ever
    Unless you’ve already fucked her.

    The End

    Like


    • Nah I do it all the time. Spend a couple months turning every txt convo sexual as fast as possible and you’ll burn a bunch of #s but you’ll learn the calibration of where the line is and which personality types will respond to it.

      My natural buddy and I both go for titty pics or dirty talk in our first conversations with new girls. Probably 80-90% go for it. But we’re good at it and don’t make aspergy “i find girls like a dominant man” and “my spanking would make you feel…..” comments lol

      Like


      • @Ya,

        You make it seem like you and your bro are txting the same chick, what gives? Or is he sharing his chick txts with you?

        Like


      • ya we share txts, pics, vids etc. with eachother. On nights out we’ll pre-drink and play videogames and just pause every time one of us gets a txt from a girl and share a lot of the txts and brainstorm what to write back. It takes us forever to play the games, some nights we have to pause it every 30 seconds or so lol

        He’s a natural (one of the best I’ve met) so he doesn’t consciously do PUA game like I do but we both come up with probably 90% of the exact same responses lol It’s interesting to see that he’d respond to certain messages the exact same way I would.

        Our goals on Fri/Sat nights are always to try to get the girls to come out to whatever bar we’re going to, or if they’re going out with their girlfriends to hook the other guy up with one of their girlfriends (only if she’s hot, we make them send pics lol), or if they’re just clearly horny but we want to go do our own “bro” thing (ie – get drunk and hit on new girls) and not hang with them all night then we try to get them to come over at last call or pick us up so we don’t have to pay for a cab ride home lol

        So when I say we “brainstorm what to write back” I mean we’re both thinking “what’s the best response to send that will get this girl over here with a hot friend so we can both get laid” or whatever our goal is.

        We have actually had heated debates on whether to put a winky-face at the end of a txt or not lol

        We don’t share chicks, neither of us is into that. Altho we have had situs where an online chick is txting both of us, and then we just see who can get titty pics first and show the other guy lol

        Like


  25. You don’t have to respond to every txt and every thread she starts.

    You’re having fun being witty and clever doing the dancing monkey back and forth tango, but it’s not getting you closer to the lay. I talk about this in one of my comments on another article but I’m blanking right now on which one.

    Lead the conversation. If she says anything, throws any insults, asks any questions, etc that WON’T directly lead you closer to your goal, ignore them as if she didn’t say them and/or change the subject.

    Also quit asking so many questions. Make statements. You jump on every one of her threads/questions trying to be witty (qualifying yourself) and she ignores every thread you try to start or turn into sexting. Who has higher value in this interaction? Who’s reacting more to whom?

    It’s easy for her to “dodge” your threads because you seek her approval for them. “would you like that?” “what do you think of that?” “how does that sound?”. Look how she makes statements. “you’re a sexpat” instead of “are you a sexpat?” and “It’s you that comes to me” instead of “you want me don’t you?” and “Go find other Asian girls” instead of “do you just like me because I’m Asian?”

    Smoke with no fire is avoid way of putting it. You have done absolutely awesome at having a long conversation with a girl. But you’re no closer to the lay, the two are not equivalent. 😉 it’s like the guy who knows a bunch of hot girls. “look at all these girls I know!! They all txt me!” “have you banged any of them?” “well no…” “then STFU till you have results.”

    Like


    • @Really,

      OT, but you got to change that avatar – it looks like you have a beer can stuck in your asscrack…

      Like


    • Lead the conversation. If she says anything, throws any insults, asks any questions, etc that WON’T directly lead you closer to your goal, ignore them as if she didn’t say them and/or change the subject.

      Great advice. Choose the threads of the conversation and learn when to snip a thread. Hint: learn to feel when the energy/emotion is about to diminish in a thread and snip it there. Frame control. Applies to text, chat, and face-to-face.

      Like


      • @Flahute,

        NO, no, no – you don’t snip/end the convo when the energy/emotion is LOW, you do so when the energy/emotion is HIGH… you want to leave her craving for more, and obsessing over you when you’re not there…

        Like


      • Yes, I thought that was what I was saying. Snip when it is high, at the point when you feel the energy/emotion has peaked and can only diminish from there.

        Like


      • Basically anything that isn’t directly helping to get me to my goal is a waste of my time. I’m not talking to her trying to figure out what my goal is. My goal is to fuck her, I already know that, that’s WHY I’m talking to her in the first place.

        If what she wants to talk about will help me achieve that goal, cool. If it won’t then why the fuck would I even acknowledge it let alone spend a bunch of txts in a witty back and forth tennis match? Sure I can win that tennis match but I’M STILL PLAYING TENNIS INSTEAD OF FUCKING HER.

        lol

        Like


  26. Wow, this was brutal. Far too much. far too quickly. Too excited. Too pushy. However (and quite ironically), this would have been a great dialogue had the girl shown interest.

    For a girl who hasn’t shown interest, a direct approach can kill any attraction. It’s best to be playful, mysterious, and genuinely interested in knowing who she is. She’ll want to know more and become more attracted to you, then she’ll come looking for you.

    Remember the knob/switch analogy. Females are like the former. You have to gradually turn up the volume. You cannot flip attraction like a switch.

    “Me: Guilty as charged”

    Doesn’t work because she hasn’t shown any interest. If she is, it makes her feel attractive and receptive. Otherwise, it’s an empty, ego-boost.

    “Her: Found a new term for you….”sexpat”
    Glad she is a reader of Roosh.

    Last [type]: Stop Caring What other people think about you

    Like


    • “Doesn’t work because she hasn’t shown any interest. If she is, it makes her feel attractive and receptive. Otherwise, it’s an empty, ego-boost.”

      Yup. An important point. The big issue is just miscalibration. She’s not where he thinks or hopes she is in terms of attraction. Someone commented above that saying “guilty as charged” is too desperate but no that’s actually a great reply and it’s how i’d reply, but the difference is I wouldn’t respond that way until she was attracted enough. You can’t push/pull a girl who isn’t attracted…you’ll push and she’ll go “(shrug) okay…” and go along with the push and you can’t pull because she’ll resist the pull (ie – this whole text exchange)

      Doesn’t mean the OP sucks. If I had to guess what was going on I’d say it was a classic mistake that a LOT of guys learning game run into:

      Where you leave a pickup is NOT where it resumes.

      I suspect the reason the op thinks his txting was so badass catnip was that on the plane he really did have her attracted. In that moment she was into him boyfriend or no boyfriend so in his mind he’s thinking he’s like 80% done the pickup and probably legit WAS.

      But then the environment changes and time passes and their interaction method changes etc etc. so when they txt he expects to hit the ground running from 80% to the end but the reality is the pickup has reset itself right the fuck back to like 10-20%. She’s into him enough to keep the convo going and give him a few chances (sexpat comment) but she is nowhere near where she was attraction-wise when he last saw her. Thus all the shitty responses he was getting and he just didn’t calibrate to those and pick up that “oh fuck I’ve started over here”

      This is a really important concept that fucks with intermediates. New guys are still working on talking to girls and learning to close at all so they don’t run into this yet or at least it isn’t frustrating yet. Any contact they get is a win. But guys starting to get laid are like “wtf this chick is supposed be jumping on my cock now!!” lol

      This is a big part of flaking. When you met in the club she LOVED you and you guys made out (she initiated it even!) and everything. Then you txt or call her and she doesn’t even respond or pick up and it’s like wtf. Or she does and you fight tooth and nail to get her to meet up again (frustrated because why is she making it so difficult now, doesn’t she remember how much she liked you???) and then she shows up on the Day2 and she’s 100% cold as if she was a total stranger and you were like “wtf she was at 90% before”. Or you try to get her to just come over instead of going out on a “date” since she obviously was ready to bang that night you met but she wants to go to dinner or just hang out in public for a while instead of coming over in lingerie.

      It’s annoying because it’s not logical lol but once you realize that that radio knob of attraction, when not being turned up, will rotate backwards back to 0, you learn how to, when you re-initiate contact:

      1) feel FAST for exactly where she is still. I usually drop some light innuendo and see if she plays along…if she does I’m still in the 50%+ range, if she ignores or the vibe seems off from it (this is why I do LIGHT innuendo I don’t want to stomp the vibe out if she’s not there) then she’s way down at 10% again and I know I have work to do.

      2) if her radio knob dropped low, calibrate and play it cool and slowly ramp it up again or if her knob is still 50%+ just rapidly ramp it up SUPER fast and push for the lay (vs playing it cool and letting that radio dial die down)

      There’s other factors in flaking and the radio dial dying of course, like triggering ASD and escalating too far when you can’t close and all that shit but going by what the Op wrote and his attitude to how his pickup was going conflicting with the “ouch dude that was a painful read” vibe we’re all seeing, this is the big cause.

      Like


      • This post is way too fucking long. The same thing could have been said in one paragraph.

        Like


      • on June 22, 2012 at 12:30 am manofthetimes

        Seduction, like a game of chess, can often be won in 5 moves. However, there are times when 100 moves will be necessary to win – if you so choose. He’s (briefly) describing scenarios relative to a certain point in a seduction.

        Like


      • ya ALL my posts are like that. You must be new here lol

        Like


      • @Tartarus
        Shut the fuck up.

        @YR
        Your fans are still waiting for your “I’m allowed to fuck around but you’re not” frame setting.

        Like


      • on June 22, 2012 at 12:20 am alightreading

        Represent to all the YR fans out there.

        Like


      • ❤

        Here ya go:

        k so here's why 1) letting a girl fuck other guys doesn't pan out the way people instinctively think it logically would, and 2) girls don't have as much of an issue with the "I can fuck other girls but you can't fuck other guys" frame as people instinctively think they would:

        Word Of Warning:
        This isn't amateur shit. This isn't "oh I just read The Game and I negged a girl once and got laid!!" level game. And it's not "I've been reading the manosphere blogs for 5 years and have successfully talked to at LEAST 10 girls!!!" level game. And you'll probably fuck it up the first couple times and lose some awesome girls in the process because you're working with dynamics that most guys don't even see let alone jump in and start juggling. And you have to set this frame EARLY…if you're trapped in a monogamous marriage and looking to turn it around, shit, sorry man, you're pretty fucked, this'll all just cause massive chaos and drama for you because you're changing the frame on your girl…it can be done but it's a fuck-ton of work with waaaay higher and more varied risks and consequences if it blows up in your face. I feel bad for you if you didn't know about game when you fell for the societal "marriage and a white pickett fence" thing and promised monogamy but you're on your own.

        Pre-Reqs
        So first up you gotta' be secure as phuck for this one. No jealousy.

        The Rules
        1) Your girl comes first. Consider it a Hugh Hefner arrangement…he has a Primary girl and then the rest of them. Your girl is your Primary. That means if you have plans with her, you don't break them to fuck some other girl. That means that all your watching DVDs, cuddling, grocery shopping, holding hands, etc. shit is reserved for your Primary (you don't HAVE to follow this, you just need her to believe that this is how you feel/act…but you should follow it or you'll end up giving yourself drama down the road when you start to get attached to one of your FBs lol). If you run into your Primary and one of your FB's when you're out at the bar, your Primary gets your full attention and your FB can fuck off (you don't play the two off eachother or anything…ironically your FB will respect you more for ignoring her for your Primary because that's some high-value shit to her). If you're flirting with your FB at a bar and your Primary walks in, you ditch your FB ASAP and go spend the rest of the night with your Primary.

        "but yareally that sounds beta and supplicating wahh wahhh"

        No shit. What would be alpha is not having a Primary girlfriend to BEGIN with. But this guide isn't for guys who are just juggling fuckbuddies, this guide is for guys who want a long-term girlfriend they can have an actual relationship with but who want to fuck around on the side. So ya, there are some fucking rules to make it work.

        2) This shit is DISCREET. Keep your hooking up discreet from your girl (unless she's into hearing details, some girls are. Or unless you need to make her jealous to stoke the fires a bit, but in that situ just be super subtle like coming home late or not answering your phone on a night out with the boys etc., you don't have to be like "So I was eating this chick out last night and…" lol). The discretion helps because it means she can imagine whatever she wants, so you might be railing some super hot chick in the ass 3 times in a night and fucking loving it but she'll imagine that the girl was some fat gross bar slut and that you didn't enjoy yourself…if you tell her what went on or show her the girl, you're gonna get drama. It also helps because she doesn't really know if you haven't fucked anyone else in months or if you're banging 10 girls on the side. If she knows who you're hooking up with and you're blatant about going out with those girls etc., when those girls aren't available and you're stuck staying home it'll be obvious to her that you're not getting laid and she'll just start extrapolating that as her winning you over or you being unattractive etc. etc. and you'll get drama.

        The other reason to be discreet is that women fear social judgement. She'll date a player and be fine with it, until her friends see that player out with another girl and then hen-peck her with judgements telling her she has to ditch him etc. and then suddenly she'll have a problem with the arrangement she had no problem with before she had to face social judgement. So she gets to call you her Boyfriend and you call her your Girlfriend, and to her friends, family, etc. you're her man and you don't talk about other girls or about being in an open relationship etc. As far as anyone she knows is concerned, you are a traditional monogamous couple. The second any of them realize what's going on and start to judge her, she'll be forced by the social pressure to give you the "change or I'm outta' here" ultimatum and the relationship is over.

        3) When you DO get into the discussion about why you don't want to promise monogamy and why you like open relationships and that she's allowed to fuck other guys, communicate the rules flat out like a motherfucker. ie – condoms are a must, get tested regularly, no seeing the hook-up person more frequently than your S.O., other people are for sex ONLY no watching movies or cuddling or getting dinner relationshippy stuff, etc. Other people are purely sex toys, there's no emotional commitment allowed. Don't be ambiguous about this shit because it'll bite you in the ass…you want an agreement so that if she DOES fuck around on you, it's more likely that she'll be safe about it and use a condom and not see the other guy frequently and stuff. If you don't set rules she won't have any guilt hanging over her head about letting the football team jizz in her or about going on lovey-dovey dates where she falls in love with another guy and ditches your relationship for a new one.

        I know, I know, some of you guys are cringing right now. "ugh but I don't WANT her fucking other guys!" Shut the fuck up and keep reading, I'll get to why they don't fuck other guys in a minute…you have to understand the setup first.

        Setting The Frame:
        When you're first hooking up and transitioning into making her your girlfriend you want to do it slowly and resist it so she knows the whole "having a girlfriend" thing isn't really your deal. This'll set things up for down the road where you give her a speech along the lines of "but you're the ONE girl who won me over! I can't curb my player ways, I'm too used to having other girls in my life, but they don't mean anything to me the way YOU do."

        The idea is that you don't want a girlfriend but she's somehow winning you over and you can't explain it. But that you're so "broken" that you can't just instantly change for her. Odds are when she met you you were playing the field, so this isn't something that'll come out of the blue. That's why you can't pull this off as easy in a marriage, because then she has years of reference experience of you being a beta monogamous dork and pitching this is incongruent and just makes her assume it's some sort of punishment instead of "the natural way of life" for you.

        The Equality Ruse:
        …but hey, it's okay, SHE'S free to fuck other guys too! See, babe? I'm compromising. I can't help the way I am, but I don't expect you to to be trapped like some slave. If I hook up with other people and expect you to be okay with it then you're allowed to as well. That's only fair!

        Sounds logical, right? Fair's fair and all that. You're not being unreasonable…logically. This is a fair deal.

        "but yareally you can't trust women!! if you let them they'll fuck anything they want and won't use condoms and ahhhh1!11111!!"

        ya I know. But follow me here…what do we know about hypergamy? We know that women always want to fuck the highest status man. Unless they're a certain type of chick they're generally not looking to just rack up a million notches on the belt the way guys are. They're looking to hook up with guys that they perceive to have high value (whether he actually does have high value or not to the rest of the world).

        So think of it like this: You've got this hot supermodel girlfriend but she's gonna let you fuck ANY fat ugly feminist girl you want. ANY of them. As long as the girl is fat, ugly, annoying, smells bad, etc. you can bang as many of them as you want. Hell, she'll even introduce you to them and set you up if you want to fuck them instead of her!! What a deal!!

        …are you gonna' take it? No. Why? Because those girls aren't attractive to you. Ya, you have free reign to fuck them all but you're gonna fuck your supermodel girlfriend because she's the most attractive option.

        Still with me? Okay so flip the genders. Now you're a high status badass alpha male boyfriend/husband (the equivalent of a hot supermodel girlfriend/wife) and you're letting her fuck any of the not-as-high-status guys (the equivalent of the fat ugly chicks) around her that she wants to. She can fuck all of them instead of you if she wants, you'll even introduce her to them, fuck it, sure, why not.

        …is she gonna' take it? No. Why? Because those guys aren't attractive to her. Ya, she has free reign to fuck them all but she's gonna fuck her high status boyfriend because he's the most attractive option.

        So you see, the whole frame is actually kind of a ruse. It's like offering someone part of your ice cream you don't REALLY want to share, just to look like a nice guy, but you know they don't like ice cream so it's a safe offer because they're not going to take it. They go "oh no thanks, it's okay" and you go "okay!" and lick away and enjoy that shit…hey, you offered!

        Why She's Okay With This Frame:
        Read this next line a million times till it's engrained in your head. If I knew how to bold, I'd bold it:

        ***A girl's biggest fear isn't that you'll fuck some other girl. It's that you'll replace her with that other girl.***

        So all you have to do is assure her that any girl you hook up with is just meaningless. Ya, you fool around but you kick the girl out right after and don't sit and watch movies and cuddle and hold hands the way you do with HER (even if that's not true lol). And you'll always come back to her, and she's always going to be your priority…if you're out in public and run into both girls, your girl gets your attention and the other girl can fuck off. If you have plans with your girl and the other girl wants to make plans, too bad. etc. etc.

        This takes some time to convince her of, and she won't like it at first and she'll shit-test the fuck out of your frame. But once you've banged a few girls discreetly on the side and you're still the usual awesome boyfriend you are, she'll start to accept that "oh, okay, he really DOES compartmentalize this stuff, sometimes when he's out some bar slut will jump him but she doesn't mean anything to him the way I do!" As long as you're congruent to this, it becomes acceptable and normal to her.

        If your reason for playing the field is good (I like to go with not wanting to have a mid-life crisis and any regrets so I have to get this out of my system etc.) girls will even tell you they only want you but they understand you have to do what you're doing to get it out of your system. These girls are waiting for you to grow out of it and settle down with them. Odds are you probably will down the road, or at least settle to a point where you just hook up when your office puts you up in a hotel on a business trip and such (VS hitting the bars every weekend looking for more pussy).

        Won't other girls mind?
        Nah. It's up to you whether you want to tell the other girls about your Primary. I like to live pretty honestly just because I don't like guilt or drama and I've been in the PUA community long enough to know that you can get away with being a lot more honest than most of society would believe. I actually have a framed pic of my GF sitting on my nightstand. I don't turn it away or hide it when I have other girl's over. So far none of them has been freaked out and bailed once they saw the pic, but that's because I'm honest from the start and tell them yes, I have a GF, but we have an open relationship and she knows I fool around here and there when I'm on my own time.

        You can lie and pretend not to have a GF though, they won't know lol But I've done that before and I just prefer the open honesty in terms of how I want to live my life as a man (up-front about who I am and my views/beliefs even if it means losing the girl VS scurrying around trying to pretend to be whatever I think the girl wants me to be…abundance VS scarcity).

        Oh, and other girls main worry is actually just that your GF might be psycho and try to kill them lol I actually found that funny the first few times I heard girls say that…they worry about the same thing a guy worries about when he bangs a taken chick "am I gonna get beat up??" lol

        Problems:
        1) She might fuck a couple other guys, especially right at the start, just to shit-test you. You have to be congruent to the frame you set. Once she realizes you don't care and aren't jealous she'll go "oh, fuck, that didn't work at all…okay hamster let's figure out how to land him and focus on him 24/7 instead of other guys!!" If you get pissy then she'll just keep doing it until you cave and promise monogamy (being a beta pussy who promises shit he doesn't want to promise because he's scared to lose the girl…what's next, you going to pretend to like romantic comedies and hate football?).

        2) Her friends and family will fuck it up for you hardcore if they figure out what's going on. The first few months it's no biggie, and way down the road when she's learned to say "it works for us" it's no biggie, but that middle period where it looks like she's landed you and you're finally being won over, that's where the social pressure grenade is gonna' do the most damage.

        Commanding Monogamy:
        Some guys would rather just say "I'm going to fuck what I want, but you're not allowed to fuck anyone but me." This can be done, but 1) it takes a super strong frame, 2) you have to be prepared to lose a lot of girls who aren't down for this, and 3) you're going to need a pretty submissive chick who isn't brainwashed with Feminist mantras about equality.

        There are more girls up for obeying this than you'd think, yes, even in North America…the thing is they're only up for this with guys who are 100% congruent to it, like guys who believe 100% that this is just the way men and women are supposed to be. Guys from foreign countries with strong religious beliefs (picture the stern authoritative brown/latin type guy who doesn't debate with a girl about why she can't wear that slutty dress out he just said "No. Go change." and expects her to obey) can pull this off way easier than a computer nerd from North America who's just learned to bang girls in the past couple years.

        So your pool of girls up for that arrangement is smaller, and the pool of guys who can pull that off (odds are if you're reading this blog you're probably not one of those guys) is even smaller.

        Setting the Open Relationship frame like I described above is a much higher percentage play for most guys.

        Conclusion:
        There ya go, this is all field-tested by lots of PUAs and naturals over the years, including myself. If you're not at a point in game where you believe that this is possible or that it's something you can do consistently, that's cool. Just understand that you've just been socially conditioned your entire life to think that way.

        And if you're someone who's going to reply with "no way because she would think this and this and then this would happen!" and you haven't set this arrangement up with at least a few girls, quit being a keyboard jockey and go talk to some girls lol

        Like


      • Also cuz I forgot to explain it and some guys will need it spelled out, the point of that whole supermodel girlfriend comparison and how all the other guys are like ugly fat chicks, is that a big part of this is being, knowing, and believing that YOU, her boyfriend, are the best that it can get for her.

        She bangs the most high value guy her hypergamy encounters. So you have to be that guy. That means if she runs into a rich tall celebrity she thinks “well he’s okay but he’s no Yareally”

        That’s where knowing game and understanding what’s actually attractive to women comes in. I can bring a girlfriend to a room full of rich good looking tall buff dudes and not worry because I know that to her I’m higher value than they are.

        So naturally you need a shitload of confidence for this. If you’re the kind of guy who read my post and was like “whatever man what if George Clooney hits on her huh??? You just admitted she follows her hypergamy so obviously she’s gonna fuck him!!! How can I prevent that??” then you are nowhere near solid enough in yourself to arrange this competently and guys like me will bang your girls and laugh that you gave them permission to bang us lol

        Like


      • Got it.
        Thanks a lot, man.

        (this needs to be tweeted)

        Like


      • On its way. I tried posting it but it hasn’t shown up. I’ll try again when I get home. It’ll be right here beside this comment.

        Like


      • Just wanted to say, I always slow down to read your posts. I’m a girl and I still learn a lot about gender relations from reading what you write. It’s smart and broad ranging without being esoteric. Best of all, you seem to really get women and understand us for what we are rather than treating us with abject worship or irrational hatred. The pooping stuff is kind of weird, but I really like everything else you write.

        Like


      • lol at the pooping bit

        I don’t have any biases like a lot of bitter newbie-PUAs/Manosphere regulars/MRA/MGTOW guys do. I was never bitterly destroyed by a girl or had my life ruined or anything like some of them, I just didn’t understand them or know how to interact with them, so when I describe social dynamics it comes completely from a non-judgmental viewpoint. Men do stupid logically illogical stuff too (I could describe the nuances in the dynamics of male groups for pages), but this place is about discussing women for the sake of helping men understand them so that’s my main focus.

        Even my views on men cheating being pussies aren’t based on any sort of moral viewpoint, they’re based on “an alpha male knows himself and knows what he wants and is up-front about his desires and doesn’t compromise to avoid consequences, and cheating logically goes against that (scurrying around and lying to avoid consequences), so those guys are pussies and I don’t respect them as men.”. Just pure logic.

        Girls will sometimes do things that seem shitty but it’s all very logical to them and makes complete sense when you understand why they’re doing it. I get called a secret white knight or whatever now and then but I just don’t judge them for it the way I don’t judge a baby for crying or an old person for forgetting things. We’re all animals, socially conditioned to ignore and repress our instincts for the “good” of society functioning smoothly.

        That’s why learning PUA shit was fun, there’s no more honest and raw interaction than the resulting fuck of a solid seduction.

        Like


      • i hope you mean the login to your blog. i like your style dude. want to hear more of what you got to say.

        Like


  27. “Her: I don’t conclude that I like players, do I?

    Me: Player? No way. I’m the coach. Players come to me for advice”

    he blew an opportunity here. instead of teasing her, making her the subject, he made himself the subject.

    “Her: The I’m not a player…it’s you that come to me

    Her: No offense…….

    Me: Guilty as charged

    Her: Ha ha”

    ha ha is normally good but not here. she seems to be laughing because she’s relieved that she has the control.

    “Me: I may need to spank you if yuou dun behave

    Her: Now you are sexually harrassing me, uncle”

    very bad blow. uncle probably means “you are way too old for me.”

    from there on it seems that she is carrying on the convo for amusement’s sake only.

    “Her: Found a new term for you….”sexpat””

    not sure this is good news. had she texted anything else in the world the next day it may have been good news, but this seems to be the happily delivered death blow. she sounds young, smart and curious. she didn’t know the term “sexpat” in the beginning but did by the next day. he was a puzzle to be solved in the beginning — he needed to remain a puzzle to keep the game alive — but her clever, resourceful asian mind solved it, at least to her own satisfaction (this guy isn’t a player: he’s a sexpat).

    she should have been made to feel that she was the puzzle he was solving, not the other around.

    at least that’s my interpretation of events here.

    Like


    • Good analysis. Overseas it’s generally not a good idea to let women peg you as a sex tourist. You’ve got to have a better reason to be in her environment, even if it’s just because you’re an international man of mystery. Seriously, being seen as having gone to her region to get easy sex is more than just the kiss of death with the best women. The above texting played into that unfortunately.

      Like


  28. Two thoughts:

    I liked his first line a lot. The “what is it you like about _________” comeback when being accused of being a ___________ is a great reframe. Good job walawala.

    I haven’t read the other comments, but I’m concluding the reason this version of “guilty as charged” failed was because it was admission of being something (a player) he had already countered with something different (a coach). The coach line is still playing to her frame, but only somewhat. Going back to the original frame of player afterwards is totally playing to her frame.

    Like


  29. Thanks all.

    The context to this exchange was that I successfully ran game on her and number closed her while on a flight where I was seated by her. There, my game number closing her was successful. She had shown all IOI’s. So this text was a follow-up when I was about to return and suggested we meet up.

    The follow up to this was I ended up meeting her for a dinner.

    I continued gaming her. It was a struggle. She was holding back. I pulled back the game and ran some vulnerability game.

    Then frankly I started getting bored. So since she was living near where I was staying we shared a taxi.

    When we got back to my hotel, to my surprise, she got out and said “let’s go for drinks”.

    We went for a drink in the hotel bar which had a great view.

    This time I again toned down the game, listened more.

    I again started getting bored so I suggested we wrap it up.

    In short no k-close or f-close.

    A few days later she sent me a “trial text”—some non-sequitor about her day….

    I ignored it and haven’t heard from her since

    My own verdict here is that she was an attention-seeker who responded to my initial game but then got spooked.

    The game I was running as analyzed was more or less an attempt to experiment and see where this would lead.

    Lessons learned.

    [heartiste: thanks for the update wala. she does sound like an attention whore, and a prude to boot. bad combo. you might’ve been able to close if you put the time in. a girl who suggests drinks is still interested and wants to know more about you. but sometimes a man’s gotta cut and run when he senses a broad is putting up too much coy hard-to-get. i do think you overplayed the sexting stuff, and that probably did spook her. she was clearly in “chased” mode, and she was going to milk it for all it was worth. which, thankfully, was not much since you didn’t bite on her chit chat text the next day.]

    Like


    • One part to highlight here where the B- is fair is that my initial game was solid when I sat down beside her on the plane and began gaming.

      In that instance I ran the entire Mystery Method on her.

      I also ran “The Cube” on her. Interestingly learning: she brought upmy very “accurate” Cube read on her. It was alon gthe lines of someone who had been on her own, felt isolated and had creams of a far away lover.

      The diffiulcty with this is that because she lieveds f in another city, this text game is the only way of “reviving” the lead.

      That it didn’t work is neither here nor there…I did learn something from this.

      Like


    • By getting bored, WalaWala, you might have described better just now why that happened. I’m assuming it was because she was over 25 and knew too much about American feminism. That’s a boner killer and I’d see why a guy would just want to wrap things up and go home.

      Like


      • I got bored because it suddenly felt like I was “working” rather than having a free-flowing fun time.

        There was interest there but her ASD was up and I think she wanted to have more time invested.

        When I first met her my game was tighter. I met her on a flight.

        I went through the entire Mystery Method, from Attraction, through to Comfort and number-closed.

        She was keen and “excited” –her words to be talking to me.

        I ran “The Cube” on her…which she was amazed was “accurate”…she was kind of aloner with a desire for a far off stallion. When we went for drinks she brought up my Cube reading several times. I just smiled at tha point.

        Like


      • Wala,

        My suggestion is to use her for social proof. No banging her, she doesn’t deserve your dick. Put her to the friend zone and use her to pick up other girls.

        Good job with ignoring her post-jibberish.

        Like


    • I think she wanted you to keep running sexual game on her. She was responding while you did it over text, then you met her in person and it sounds like you became incongruent to what she was expecting(a “sexpat” IE that is an American guy she can have rough sex with that her asian BF doesn’t give her)

      Like


      • @Lewis,

        I tend to agree. I think that the fact that she txt’ed him the next morning meant that although he made a few mistakes, he was still in the running to bang her.

        When Wala met her again in person – after these txt’s – he shouldn’t have met for dinner, rather should have have kept the mood light and playful, and met for cocktails (heh) instead. Then amped up the sexy/Alpha vibe immediately on meeting her… like kissing/hugging her immediately…

        @Wala,
        If you’re still reading, did you “initiate Kino” immediately on meeting her again?

        Like


      • @That Guy…yes, when we met up for a dinner, it was a super local, casual place I had picked. Yes, I kinoed her when we met and throughout–touch elbow etc.

        From the time I met her to the time we met up there was a 3 week gap.

        In between then, there were text exchanges that were shorter.

        At one point she wrote: “Are you here now?” out of the blue.

        There was attraction but the time and distance cooled off any sense of immediacy.

        I submitted this text exchange because I was keen to understand what works and what doesn’t.

        We’ve seen “Always be escalating” as a rule. But context and timing is everything.

        With other girls I’ve gamed, I have kept the texting short and confined to confirming details of meet ups or location.

        The one big takeaway I get from this is that the exchange wasn’t linked to any immediate goal. The meet-up wasn’t until a week later so there was this space in between. So it was a chat aimed at stoking the fires but apparently only created doubts rather than the right amount of tension and excitement….

        Like


  30. I agree with the B- grade: not great, but better than 80% of the field. It passes the jumbotron test by not having any cringers or embarassing parts.

    Like


  31. […] today, Chateau Heartiste posted one of his reader’s attempts at sexting. If you haven’t read it and the ensuing comments, then get to […]

    Like


  32. Yes, I think the Sexpat thing showed a lot. yellow fever or sexpat, both would have shown she has him categorized, in her mind.
    Living in the San Fran area, I’ve had to deal with shit tests on yellow fever almost as often as the player accusation. Luckily, I had a ready answer that worked if they were serious, or a cocky funny answer that reframed and passed that test.
    The thing is, they don’t mind if you like asian girls because DUH, they are asian. They just want reassurance that it isn’t a fetish thing for you.
    To the fool above who hates asian women, you wouldn’t want to reproduce with Yoko Matsugane or Reon Kadena? what a fag.

    Like


  33. When does texting actually help game?

    It seems like you need to be very acutely aware of fine details and gives guys more chance of fucking up rather than progressing towards the lay..

    Isn’t excessive text banter a DLV? What is wrong with directly asking her out over text or better calling her and setting up a date directly?

    Like


    • “Isn’t excessive text banter a DLV? What is wrong with directly asking her out over text or better calling her and setting up a date directly?”

      I try not to text much, but cold calling (even after #-close) is kind of hard in this age. Women screen calls, especially from people they don’t know. I generally text a little, and try to get her to call me (literally, I text “call me”) as a sort of compliance test.

      My text game is to say less less often.

      Like


    • Text game fucking owns. Guys who say it sucks are guys who suck shit at it. I haven’t phoned a girl in like 5 years lol

      If the vibe is on I’ll sext them and make them send pics/vids as they get off to whatever I’m describing. Long live text game!

      Like


      • on June 22, 2012 at 11:15 am Flom-Flom Flooie

        I’d have to totally agree. I NEVER call a girl before a date, ever. I most recently went about 4 weeks before calling a girl that I was dating/banging. Found out months later that it drove her nuts so bad, she once pulled over while driving & calling her girlfriend, crying, unable to figure out why I never called. LESS …. IS …. MORE.

        Like


      • Turning the assumption of chatty texting on its head and using it for an aloof pathway away from rambling phone conversations, which do not have minute long buffers to check and edit the stupid shit. Smart. Don’t do it in her 3rd trimester though. She’s just too into you already by then.

        Like


      • P.S. I send long wordy txts. Sometimes a full screen worth and multiple txts in a row. But I know what I’m doing and it’s congruent to me because I talk a lot so I can get away with it. I just mention this because a lot of guys think txting has to be short little txts or it’s qualifying/needy.

        Like


    • A fun thing to do is begin with text. If she is responding quickly so its obvious she isn’t busy, wait till she has made a reply, and intead of texting back just call her. If she is into the conversation, it’ll be a pleasant surprise 🙂

      *Also, when you’ve gotten her number, send her a picture of you and tell her to program it into her phone for your number. Then everytime you call, she sees you. Its a nice feature 🙂

      Like


      • @Geisha,

        So if your boy sends you a Dick Pic, do you add it to his phone profile 😉

        Like


      • A collection of them in different states of arousal would be excellent for signal strength or battery life, for the right girl.

        Like


      • @Chi,

        I had more in mind, Geisha’s phone rings and a dick pops up, and she says to her girlfriend,
        “Oh it looks like Frank is calling” 😉

        Like


      • A dick is the most most overt sign that he has come a calling I suppose.
        I just think many babes will be disappointed unless they go with an up skirt profile.

        Like


  34. It was both better than it could have gone and not as good as it felt like it should have been. It was missing that natural flow and felt jarring, like watching different scenes from different movies patched together.

    I agree with advice given and also as said in the comments, she admired the boldness and less the sexualizing. Nothing that would burn her away but a little tweak here and there and you’d have a money interaction.

    Like


  35. on June 21, 2012 at 11:45 pm Musing Alpha

    Recent text message conversation with an LTR:

    Her: You didn’t call me

    (That was the night before. Was out with another girl.)

    Me: (Next morning) I’ll be over on the 6pm train
    Her: Good and I have two great things to tell you. First, I have a parking spot close to the train. Also, wearing sexy dress.
    Me: (about 3 hours later) Sure it will look good on the floor
    Her: (about 1 minute later) Thanks. Now I am going to be wet all day
    Her: (about 1 hour later) You better fuck me the second we get home
    Me: (about 2 hours later) Gotta work late catch ya later
    Her (about 1 minute later) Fuck that tell the doorman to let me in
    Me: (about 30 minutes later) Na I’m good
    Her: (about 1 minute later) Fuck you asshole
    Me: (about 10 minutes later) 🙂

    She came over about 4am and we fucked to kingdom whatever.

    When in doubt err on the side of asshole…or just be an asshole.

    Like


    • yeah.. but it can lead to them going full on retard:

      this is copy/paste from Google Voice. There were also around 25 missed calls. btw “meow” is what she texts me when she wants to fuck.

      Courtney : Meow? 11:07 PM
      Me: Sup 11:29 PM
      Courtney : What are you doing!!!! 11:32 PM
      Me: Heading to [location redacted] in a few. You? 11:43 PM
      Courtney : SAMESIES!!! 11:49 PM
      Courtney : Where 12:24 AM
      Courtney : Gay 12:40 AM
      Courtney : I hate you!!!!!!!!!!! 1:03 AM
      Courtney : What is wrong with you 1:04 AM
      Me: Lol 1:08 AM
      Courtney : Wtf is lol 1:13 AM
      Courtney : There is so much arm fat in [location redacted]1:14 AM
      Courtney : You ate absurd 1:18 AM
      Courtney : Are 1:18 AM
      Courtney : Omgggggggg 1:18 AM
      Courtney : You clearly have priorities and I am not one of them. That’s FUCKING GAY 1:22 AM
      Courtney : Text me back 1:38 AM
      Courtney : Text me back 1:38 AM
      Courtney : Annoyed 1:39 AM
      Courtney : Annoyed 1:39 AM
      Courtney : You need to fuck me right now 1:40 AM
      Courtney : I honestly thought you were a nice person 2:02 AM
      Courtney : Call me:(((( 2:15 AM
      Courtney : ????!!!!!! 2:19 AM
      Courtney : Hello 2:19 AM
      Courtney : :(((((( 2:20 AM
      Courtney : 😉 2:20 AM
      Courtney : 😦 2:20 AM
      Courtney : A 2:20 AM
      Courtney : B 2:20 AM
      Courtney : C 2:21 AM
      Courtney : D 2:21 AM
      Courtney : E 2:21 AM
      Courtney : F 2:21 AM
      Courtney : G 2:21 AM
      Courtney : H 2:21 AM
      Courtney : I 2:21 AM
      Courtney : J 2:21 AM
      Courtney : K 2:21 AM
      Courtney : L 2:21 AM
      Courtney : M 2:21 AM
      Courtney : N 2:21 AM
      Courtney : O 2:21 AM
      Courtney : P 2:22 AM
      Courtney : Q 2:22 AM
      Courtney : R 2:22 AM
      Courtney : S 2:22 AM
      Courtney : T 2:22 AM
      Courtney : U 2:22 AM
      Courtney : V 2:22 AM
      Courtney : W 2:22 AM
      Courtney : X 2:22 AM
      Courtney : Y 2:22 AM
      Courtney : Z 2:22 AM
      Courtney : 1 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 3 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 00ps 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 2 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 4 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 5 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 6 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 7 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 8 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 9 2:26 AM
      Courtney : 10 2:26 AM
      Courtney : Why are you being mean to me 3:27 AM
      Courtney : Answer me!!! Important!!!! 3:29 AM
      Courtney : Well anyways. Something very upsetting happened and I am upset but I guess you do not care. That is also an upsetting thing. I can’t sleep. I do realize 3:50 AM
      Courtney : I sent you the entire alphabet. While that is crazy, it is equally as crazy for you to disregard 26 letters. You know what? I’m a nice person. I don’t de 3:50 AM
      Courtney : serve that. 3:50 AM

      i called her the next morning and left her a voicemail saying that her behavior was unacceptable, that i didnt even know how to process it. i was leaving to hang out with my friends, to not pull that shit again and ruin my day. she called back almost immediately crying hysterically, she was so sorry she doesnt know why she did it.

      cut her loose obviously.

      Like


      • on June 22, 2012 at 5:36 pm Rihanna Deserved It

        You can tell she’s hot because no plain-looking girl would ever dream of getting away with that shit.

        Like


      • Eh, I wish that were true. Had a 6 that got the same way everytime she got drunk. Girls go their whole lives without the need for self-moderation if they’re hot enough, some get away with it even if they’re not.

        Like


      • I also wish that were true. But lots of older broads who got entitlement complexes from watching tv shows will pull this type of psycho number on men. And among the teeny boppers, it can be the least good looking of a group that gets all aggressive like that as a strategy to compete. That’s not to say that this girl probably wasn’t hot. If the OP says her looks were just fine, I believe that.

        Like


      • on June 22, 2012 at 5:37 pm Rihanna Deserved It

        AMOCS = Alpha Male Of the Comment Section

        Like


      • OP is fraudin

        Like


      • lol’ed my fucking ass off

        Like


      • on June 25, 2012 at 7:37 am ThatNorwegianGuy

        One of the most hilarious text exchanges I have read in a long, long time.

        Like


    • @Musing Alpha: I’d say it all boils down to one thing; if you truly are throwing the pipe at a pro level and making girls O, you have the right, and get leniency from woman, to act any part you see fit. Not many are mentioning this aspect of A-hole sexting, or Game in general for that matter.

      Like


    • on June 22, 2012 at 11:33 am Dr. Murray F. Rottencrotch

      Yeah, but if you’re going to be a dishonorable asshole, you still have to screen for fatal attraction psychos.

      Like


  36. AFC/Beta here, but since you focused on the “Guilty as charged” comment, I think it’s interesting that she replied with “ha ha”. Okay, I’m learning, and my experience is that women are rarely actually lol-ing when they lol; and when they genuinely laugh, smile, and are pleased with your text, they rarely actually text this (exception is with exclamations or all caps “LOL!” “rotfl!”). “ha ha” was probably sarcasm, or maybe she thought it was the socially expected response.

    Or am I overthinking this?

    Like


  37. After what happened Tuesday night, my text-buddies will have their own reasons, if not their own ways, to stay alive/

    Like


  38. Ah, sexting. An opportune time for yours truly to seek some advice. I am on the path of alpha in theory, but I need to put it more into practice. Here’s the situation:

    I know this cool chick, about 20 y.o., absolutely banging body, as close to a perfect 10 as one can imagine, but with face maybe a 7 (focus on her defects!), long blond hair. Problem is, she lives about 30 miles away, although her family lives in my town and she sometimes comes up here. In my university town, it’s summer, which means it’s boring as all-get-out, so I don’t really have many options around here.

    I have the necessary rapport. Just today, in fact, after a month or so of nothing, I texted her, “happy thursday” [sic], and she sent back, “Haha happy Thursday” within 10 minutes, so I know that I have at least some rapport with her. I have made halfhearted attempts to meet up with her before, but have always fallen flat, which I attribute to my not knowing how to execute this with a girl living 30 miles away.

    Also, she and I are friends on Facebook, and she recently hooked up with this absolute beta who keeps sending her flowers and shit. I’m not worried about him really, aside from the IHAB defense.

    So, how do I go about this? Do I call her, or text her? Do I go meet her in her town at her place, or wait until she comes to my town? If I do go down there, do I meet her at her workplace, or apartment, or take her out on a “date”?

    Any genuine feedback by alphas will be considered.

    Like


    • Hmm, a whole month of nothing. That’s not a good sign. It means you haven’t gotten her to fall for you yet. Where did your conversation go afterwards?

      I would tell her you’re going to be stopping by her town sometime soon and would like to catch up over a *quick* cup of coffee or a *quick* lunch. You can’t really rely on text game to bag a girl — kino is pivotal in building that sexual tension. I would suggest you game her hard (aim just shy of the cusp that delineates “bold and aggressive” from “creepy and try-hard.” Also pick up on her social cues — you don’t want to keep pressing if she’s giving signals that she’s totally not into you) during coffee or lunch or whatever you two agree on, and let that simmer. Don’t initiate contact with her first after the “date”. Put her in chase mode.

      Like


    • on June 22, 2012 at 1:39 am (R)Evoluzione

      Think about logistics. Get her to your town to do something fun. Going to her town is a DLV, unless you have a genuine reason for being there. So it might be best to say something like “let’s hang out when you’re in town next” as a transitional move, then drop the bait in such a fashion as to communicate “I’m going to be doing this cool thing (event or activity Y) when you just happen to be in town, you should join me.” Then bounce her back to another location–a coffee shop, an ice cream spot, etc. Then back to your spot–“to watch a movie,” etc. Then you can escalate from there.

      Like


    • The “happy thursday” text out of the blue isn’t good. It translates as “Just thinking of you, snugglebear…” The speed and content of her reply (10 minutes) was too long to conclude “rapport.”

      A 20-year-old woman is entering the peak plateau of her powers that lasts to 25 — what little she deteriorates physically over that half-decade she makes up for with experience and wisdom. She is the toughest nut to crack. If you’re up to the challenge, you still might have to lay groundwork for a long-term harvest.

      Game is icing. It alone won’t get you top women unless fortune is smiling one particular night and sets the table for you. That’s why the right text or even the right tactic is difficult to discern at best, counterproductive to your goal at worst (by telegraphing your attack).

      Tricks have to complement a solid trade. Whoever tells you that technique trumps substance with the hottest women is a liar. You have to have plausible stature to draw her toward you. The less status you genuinely have, the better the comprehensive bullshitter you will have to be (masterful con artistry is a kind of status). Game helps you manipulate that stature to ensure a better conversion rate on pick-up. It’s a force-multiplier, not the force itself, no more magical than make-up can be for concealing a woman’s obesity.

      Even a dimwitted 20-year-old 6 has enough options everywhere she goes to carve out a spot for any one man for no reason. You have to supply the reason beneath the charm. And you can’t pursue her except within the context of a party or working relationship or happenstance meeting. She has to be passively persuaded to pursue you, and that happens through social status, DHV, and her knowledge of your many options. Be desireless, be excellent, be gone.

      In other words, no one girl can be taken as a case study in isolation. She has to be a facet of a larger campaign, the 7 among your feelers out to a dozen other options. So whatever advice you get here is limited for lack of knowing your strategic map and broad efforts within which this particular trim might fit. No matter what anyone here tells you, advice is contingent on the successes and failures surrounding any single mark.

      … although her family lives in my town and she sometimes comes up here …

      Worse comes to worst, bang her mom or her aging sister. It’ll warm you up while crossing your main target’s wires.

      Matt

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      • I agree with this, and don’t really have anything to say in reply. I will keep it in mind.

        And last night, as if on cue, I ran into some different girls anyway.

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      • Now play your new cards into a strong hand. A well-timed “accidental” text might get revivify her hamster. Something to let original girl intimate your options. Keep a light touch though.

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  39. That’s the most bs convo I’ve read on this site yet. What’s up with all these dudes trying to impress other dudes with fake stories?

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  40. This “you’re a woman and women love dominant men” line is dumb as fuck. I’m sure I’ve read it many times here and elsewhere.
    It’s spiteful beta try-hard shit that equals saying “you’re a hypergamous slut who loves alpha cock. Don’t you love dominant alpha cock, you dirty dirty little slut *wink* *wink*.
    Never tried it, never will, but I’m sure it triggers mad ASD, and it was about time to warn against it.

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  41. Her: blah blah blah
    Her: blah blah blah
    Her: blah blah blah
    Her: blah blah blah
    Her: blah blah blah
    Me: bring da movies

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  42. on June 22, 2012 at 5:06 am Catherine Omega Jones

    Suggestion from my kid brother:

    Her: you’re such a player
    Reply: no way

    [heartiste: pretty good. this is an example of what i like to call “tonal reframe”. by your glib answer you make it known that the question is dorky.]

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    • Would a reply like “get out of here (with that talk)” be similar? Said in a dismissive yet playful manner, of course. I’m trying to get a gist of the tone of that response.

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    • In person, I’d say “I try” in a disinterested way. Don’t laugh at her comment or act at all flattered. She might start to worry she is boring you, which is a good thing.

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    • you’re such a spectator.

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    • Or, if she knows you well, you could answer, “Nah, I’m a one woman man.” This only works if you aren’t a one woman man.

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      • If she knows you that well you are her brother, sex starved shoulder to cry on, or you know her pretty well already. To carry the metaphor further, its points in garbage time.

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      • True. I like my line, but I think it could only work under a small number of circumstances. “No way” is probably the best reply for most situations.

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      • “No way” is a piecing communication not meant to address the question itself but the presumption of asking it. That is why it works. In short, the answer of “no way” is : “I don’t answer to you”, as is the domain of any power broker. Even answering the question with sarcasm may be like the highest enlisted rank of an answer, but it is an officer that tells you that you have no need to know.

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      • If your reputation as a womanizer precedes you, it might work.

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    • Howabout “I’m bored by video games so don’t play them.”

      Ambiguous, no?

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  43. I’m no pro, but I think her scolding was all a very convincing bluff, rather than the damning series of shit tests it appears to be. Here’s where I think she’s shown her hand:

    Her: And spare your efforts on gett me hooked. Go find other Asian girls…exclusing me to satisfy your masculine needs

    Me: WHo said I was interested in hooking you? Big ego

    Her: Don’t know,,,just my bold assumption

    Notice her first line is poorly spelled and full of Engrish, even though it was verbose and overcomplicated: every overseas Asian I have met is mortified of using poor English. To me, this suggests it was a line spoken in haste and anxiety, though with unusual urgency. In her response to him, she messed up again with incorrect punctuation (,,,), called her assumption bold (when it was actually a very easy, obvious assumption), and though we don’t have timestamps, I’ll bet her response was rapid and unreviewed.

    Me: …

    Her: Assumption comes before conclusion right?

    Here she smacks of defensiveness, even though she had a mountain of evidence in her favor which would have made an American girl cold and certain. Her overarching interest was confirmed when she voluntarily restarted the following morning. Who voluntary restarts with a “creepy sexpat” unless they’re interested? She could have been forever rid of this foreigner if she hadn’t messaged him again.

    Personally, I think Walawala’s instinct and final assessment is correct, whether or not his execution was off.

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  44. @Heartiste

    Poor mothers love their daughters more, because they have a better shot at status climbing through marrying up.

    Very true.

    The flip side of this is that wealthy girls – either inherited or earned – love their sons more, as they hope they will father a myriad of grandchildren. So they are propelled to look for “sexy son” genes – which leads directly to the Lair of the Alpha…

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexy_son_hypothesis

    I’ve personally found that whenever I attend a party of strangers, the wealthier a chic is the more likely she is to approach me, or say something provocative/sexy to me…

    I usually have to beat Jewish girls off with a stick…

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  45. Text game I ran on a girl I had been seeing for a month and was really getting into me.

    Me: We need to talk

    (Her franticaly calling 1 minute later. I ignored her call and sent the second message while my phone was ringing)

    Me: about you coming over tonight
    Her: I hate you
    Her: My heart is racing you scared the shit out of me
    Her: We are still good right?
    Her: I’ll see you at 6

    When she got to my place she was ready to go after all of that worrying and her emotional roller coaster that day. Probably the best sex of the relationship.

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    • “Me: We need to talk

      (Her franticaly calling 1 minute later. I ignored her call and sent the second message while my phone was ringing)

      Me: about you coming over tonight”

      lololol stealing this.

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  46. My two cents: she was never interested. She just liked the idea/feel of being pursued. Either that or you got too smutty too soon.

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  47. @yareally insightful stuff. how do we get access to your blog (and wisdom)?

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  48. Great example of why the Jumbotron test is so important.
    CH was a little too kind, IMO. I used to try to be clever in texting but now just use it for logistics. The more you text the more your value drops and you have more opportunities to mess up.

    Just use it for setting up dates. If you had a strong enough rapport when you met then she’ll meet up with you.

    Walawala’s greatest error was he had no goal and the texting just went nowhere. If his intent was to meet up, then he should have texted that at some point.

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  49. When in doubt say nothing on topic.
    demonstrate your boredom by changing the subject. Ask her an off topic question that redirects the convo.
    This will force her to keep up w/ you or appear as if she is confused thus putting the responsibility on her.

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  50. “I’ve never really found it all that useful to remind girls of the inner workings of their hamsters in the course of a pickup attempt” dammit, sometimes i just can’t resist to do it… i don’t know if it is masochistic instict against myself or a sadistic instict against my “victim”, anyway with some chicks it does work (for a little, and with some discernment)

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  51. Hey, maybe a post on the best way to dump a girl would be worthwhile. I think most guys’ approach, and often mine, is to be an asshole to the point that the girl shows her psycho-bitch side, at which point it’s easy to say “That’s it. This is over.” But is it better to just surprise her by ending it when all might seem like smooth sailing to her? The problem with the latter, in my experience, is that you’ll end up with an even bigger psycho-bitch than if you induce a bit of dread first, allowing her to prepare herself somewhat. Maybe a happy medium is the more obvious best approach?

    This seems to be an aspect of Game that has been under-addressed. Perhaps there are some “best practices” techniques for dumping a girl that could be put together. I’m guessing they’d be a function of the type of girl you are dealing with and the extent of the relationship. Also if it’s a chick that you might want to fuck again in say six months vs some bitch you never, ever want to see again. What if it’s been a long term relationship and the chick got fat? I’m guessing you’ve already failed in some way if that happens, but nevertheless, if it does happen, should you say you want out because you no longer find her attractive – or does speaking the truth in this case risk resulting in the worst psycho-bitch ever?

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    • Just stop calling her. Let her save face and dump you.

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    • Good point. Before meeting my wife, I used to just give ’em a list of reasons. I would write it out for myself first, then literally hand it to the girl the next day. (Recommended time for breakup: 8 am, in person, by surprise. Boom, like a shot to the head.)

      A typical exchange:

      Me: “I know this makes you feel bad, but I’m not in the business of making you feel good right now.”

      Her: “There’s no way, not fair, you’ll regret this, squeaksqueaksqueak.”

      Me: “Listen to me. I am a man with many options.”

      One tried to come slinking over the next morning in her workout clothes (guess what reason #1 was on her list), but too little, too late.

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    • Unless you are married to her or let her move in with you, you don’t have to officially dump her. Just go out with another woman and let her find out about it. Also, stop contacting her. Hopefully her pride will kick in and she will end it.

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      • Disagreed. Maybe this is true for you, but many girls in LTRs need closure. So do many boys (like yrs truly).

        No need for ambiguity when it’s finished. Plus it feels really good to knock a misbehaving bitch down a few pegs, I’ve found, right to her face.

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  52. I know that this post is about texting but aside from the obvious mistakes mentioned already an undertone which kills any interaction between Asian girls and western males (when either is visiting each others country) is 1. having any attitude hinting/ stating that Asian girls are all the same in some way or thinking you have some stereo type idea about them you can apply to them.
    2. thinking that by virtue of the fact that you are different to them they just want to fuck you because you are desirable and different.
    You would want to project an under tone that you want to meet/ connect and ultimately bang them because they are a women and you are a man and you find them attractive as an individual.
    Arriving in a country and gaming a girl on a plane and mentioning a player in texts etc which is essentially – you are just in their country for a short time and looking to fuck them – they know that, they may just want that, but explicitly implying it in some way surely is the wrong approach.
    Having had 2 Asian girl friends (in the country for 1 year then leave) and been out some where with her and some of her expat friends and observed guys approach with the above attitude seeping out from every pore – get shut down pretty quick or get no response and catch snippets of what they thought afterwards. Confidence because you display alpha characteristics to women and have approached her because you find her attractive is one thing. Confidence because you think you are the man and you know all about Asian women and they all want to sleep with you is some thing different again.

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  53. […] – Le Chateau Goes Stand-up, Your Training To Delight Women, Every Man Needs A Harem, Sext-Game, Top Three Qualities That, Fertility, Intelligence, and […]

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  54. Heartiste..
    great post!

    question: Would just text-sexting her your “thoughts” about her seem too “needy” or pushy”? Examples:
    Her: You’re a player
    Him: Does this bother you? (agreeing then continuing..)

    (commenting on her wardrobe, hair, ears, i.e: find her flaws and strengths, then continue…)
    Him: *Damn, cant stop thinking about those( *add attribute) … Lets make out! (add a smiley to the end)
    or (make demands instead of questions)
    Him: When you land, call me. We’ll have drinks.. (keep higher ground)

    IDK maybe I’m oldschool , where subtle / direct is more key. Stay dominant and light.. Texts to me should be used to keep her writing her thoughts.. Stay in her brain.

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  55. I think the wet-assed bitch boys at cracked have let slip glorious nugget of truth, this from same website that told us how male privilege is alive and well in a war against women.
    http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-things-girls-dont-seem-to-understand-about-nice-guys/

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  56. i like the “put your fucking number here bitch”, sweet. i check it out.

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